Transcription
I was asked to speak at the War Room Mastermind, which is a thirty-thousand-dollar-a-year program. I think it's a two or three hundred person program run by Ryan Dice, Perry Belcher, and Roland Fraser. It's a great program, and I was asked to speak on sales.
I have given versions of this sales presentation a handful of times, but this is the best one that I think captured the audio and the visual, and everything kind of put together. It's condensed into a 30-minute video, so I think you guys will absolutely enjoy this.
If you're building your first sales script, if you're scaling a sales team, and you want to make sure that you can onboard new people and get them selling at the same percentage or better than you are right now, which for many people is the biggest bottleneck, especially when you're coming to your first million or first three million per year, scaling the sales team is one of the most difficult tasks.
I've broken this down into three frameworks that I've used very successfully to scale lots of different sales teams. I say that the company I'm referencing in this video has 14 salespeople, and that one company already now has almost 30 sales guys. So this process continued to work past when I made this presentation.
If you're trying to scale sales, you want to close a higher percentage, and you want to get more guys closing at that same percentage or better than yours. If you don't know who I am, my name is Oxford Mozzie on Acquisition.com. We had a portfolio at this moment of six companies doing 85 million a year.
Keep being awesome, love you, and enjoy the video. What I'm going to be breaking down today is the scripting process that we've applied for calls. As the world's worst marketer, I sent my first email this year. I was very excited about it. We've been in business for 10 years—pretty big stuff.
It was because I couldn't get webinars, I couldn't get VSLs, I couldn't get all the fancy stuff that you guys get to work. So I went back in time and just thought, if I can just get them to give my phone number, I'll be able to get them to buy stuff from me. I went and called back all these webinar leads that never showed up or never bought or whatever, and ended up doing like 100,000 in sales in a day. I was like, wow, this is so much easier.
Over time, I've consulted with sales teams. I've trained and owned four high-ticket performance teams. I think we have 12 or 14 sales guys now; it kind of rotates. What I want to do is show you what we've done to consistently replicate the skill of sales in another human being. Would that be cool?
If I can add like 10% to your conversion rate in terms of how you attract better closers, how you script the process out, and how you should close more deals and scale them to incentivize them, would that be valuable for you guys? All right, sweet.
These are the three frameworks that transform losing funnels into cash machines. That was my real life; that was a picture of my actual first funnel, and that's what it became.
So these are the three frameworks:
Number one, the Closer Framework—how to ask questions for prospects to say yes. Adding this to a funnel instantly can make it profitable. This is my personal experience.
Number two is the Conviction Framework—how anyone who believes can outperform a seasoned sales rep by simply learning to control their tone. This is really important; this is one of the biggest things that most salespeople miss.
Number three, the Scaling Framework—how to easily duplicate this process across salespeople in any niche in seven days or less. So seven days from now, we can do this. Would that be cool? All right, let's rock.
So number one, the Closer Framework. After going through hundreds of scripts, I've bought grand stuff for about the Wolf of Wall Street. I bought all that stuff, and going through my own sales processes, I learned that the scripting process was even simpler than it's portrayed.
It's not that it's something to be sold against, but every sales script that has been absolutely gangbusters has been a question-based framework based on this process. This works for B2C sales, works for B2B sales, it works for 500 tickets, it works for 100,000 tickets—the process is the same.
This is the acronym for the Closer Framework. As I said, world's dumbest marketer, so I made it nice and easy to remember.
C—Clarify why they are there. When I look at creating a script, the first thing we ask is, "Why the hell are you here? What made you reach out to us today? What is the goal you're trying to accomplish?"
Two—Label them with a problem. We can't cure cancer unless they admit that they have it. Has anyone had that situation? Like, "I just wanted to find out more information." You ever had that? Well, it's like, "I'm assuming you're not hopping on sales calls all day just running for fine information. Is there a problem you're trying to solve?"
"Oh, you're fat? Got it. Boom, that's a problem we can solve." After that, I'm sure I'm not the first guy you've ever dated, right? So is there anything else that you've had happen in the past that got you here that didn't work? I'd love to know more about it.
S—Once we've gone through the pain, we sell on the vacation. There's a process that I'll walk through.
E—We explain away their concerns because obviously, sane people don't make decisions on the first call unless you're a closer, in which case they do, which I'll talk about.
Finally, and this is something that we actually added in my original framework for my first couple of years, was close, and then we added the R. Because when you do this, it actually transitions into the onboarding process that will get higher LTV per customer, lower churn, lower refunds, or chargebacks, which sales guys will be happy about. Cool? All right, let's rock.
So we'll examine each one more closely.
Clarify why they're there. These are the questions that sound like, "What made you come in today? What made you reach out? What's your goal right now? Why is that important to you? Why that number specifically? What does that resonate for you? Why is that real?"
L—The questions that we're looking at are like, "Okay, so what I'm hearing is XYZ. Usually, does that sound about right?" Really simple, but very important. It's a milestone that has to be hit in the process.
Then we overview. This is where we're gathering all the intel. For some of you guys, my goal is that you can take this to your sales team or your sales director and run your script through this framework, and then see where you can plug it. You probably have some of it, but if you're missing one or two of these questions with milestones, you're losing conversions on the call.
You're closing people who already had those obstacles covered, but everyone who didn't have two of these questions covered, you lose them, and you don't know why. You watch the sales call and you're like, "What the hell happened here?"
So what have you tried so far to accomplish that? How long did you do that for? How long ago had that worked for you? What else have you tried?
We just do that cycle until they're like, "Oh yeah, that's it. Now that you think about it, I've tried everything under the sun. I can't imagine what that's felt like."
Right? It's not your fault; you're so close. You're six inches away. I think you've had this one thing, which I'm about to show in a second, we could be able to help you. Wanna hear about the program? Fantastic! That's when you transition to the sale.
So sell them a vacation. The number one thing that people mess up in our sales pitch on the call is under three minutes—three minutes, 180 seconds. When we talk about, I think someone was asking about what are the bullets on the page, we don't say anything about that because what we're trying to do is get them to understand what they're going to experience, not how they're going to experience it.
When we have a sales pitch, just about every time we sell three things, and it doesn't matter what industry. I was training a mortgage leads team, and they were selling leads. It was like, the leads are exclusive, they're timely, and they're qualified.
So we talked about, "Hey, you've had leads in the past." "Ah, well, the Zillow leads," my real estate people, right? "The Zillow leads are timely, but they're definitely not exclusive. These are people just window shopping."
Right? Our leads are different. Three things you can always find: if you're selling fitness, you're selling fitness, nutrition, accountability.
When we say the three bullets, we get them to understand, "Yes, that takes five seconds." Cool. Fitness-wise, we get the commitment. "This is what I need you to do. Fair enough? Let's be like, and you should work out three days a week. Can you do that?"
Awesome! If we see any hesitation, you have a 30-second story that's memorized. Most of this script, and this is what makes it scalable, is a question-based framework, which means if you get lost, you can find your way back again.
If anybody here has scripts that are like paragraphs and stuff—anyone? Okay, like no one has a script that's paragraphs and pages, please. We all know. But if you have those things, it'll totally mess it up because then the sales guy gets lost, and then he's just free-balling, and he has no idea where he is—hot dog in the hallway, no idea what's going on.
The point is here, little visual anyways, is that when we're telling the story, like with the fitness example, I would say, "Hey, when you failed in the past, like right now, do you have a favorite TV show? Game of Thrones? That's awesome! Do you feel like you got to get motivated to watch Game of Thrones? You're like, 'Oh man, I've been wanting to watch it, but I just can't get up the motivation to watch TV.'"
They're like, "Well, no, I don't have that." It's like, "Right, and so that's exactly how we're going to make your fitness program. So if you look forward to it, you don't need the motivation and the willpower because that's why you failed in the past."
They're like, "Oh, I didn't talk about the workouts, the heart rate, and the calories they're going to burn, and they're going to sweat because all that sounds like work."
But what they do get is exactly what they want, which is, "Wait, so you're telling me that if I actually like something, I'm not going to even have to try, and it's going to feel like watching TV because I look forward to it?"
It's exactly what I'm saying, and if you can deliver, you make tons of money, and that's the point.
So each of those points, your sales guys should know what that anecdotal story is. If I was selling accountability anywhere, do any of you here tell your kids to brush their teeth? We have kids who brush their teeth say they don't want to brush their teeth. Anyone tell their kids, even though they want to brush their teeth, to brush their teeth anyways?
Now you're an adult. Did your parents do that to you? Do you brush your teeth? That's an example of external accountability turning into an internal habit. That's exactly what the accountability we're going to do in this program. Just does that make sense? Great, done.
Next bullet, that's how you transition the pitch. If you think about this process, "Why are you here? I have cancer. I think we might be able to help you out, but I don't want to get into that because I don't know about you. I don't know what your situation is. Tell me what you've done."
"Ah, that sounds great. That makes sense. Okay, I think we might be able to see a little bit about that." All it is, I tell three stories that make complete sense to everything you just told me, and then we transition.
I pretty much just covered this, but we call it selling the vacation, not the plane flight. We're not selling TSA; we're not selling your modules, your meal plan, your macros, your workout, your support team, your URLs, your whatever.
We're selling Maui. We're selling the final destination. It doesn't matter what level of service you are selling; you're always selling the same thing. It's always Maui. It's just how do you want to get there?
Do you want to swim to Maui? Do you want to take a boat to Maui? Do you want to take a normal flight, or do you want to take a private jet to Maui? Right? It's your call. You're getting them out either way because we're a man of our word, and I'm not going to sell you something that's not going to deliver.
But it's going to be a little different, a little bit rockier, but we're going to get you there. All right? So everyone gets to Maui. The variables are the speed and the quality of the journey. The likelihood of arrival is assumed.
Since it's always the same thing, you probably have multiple levels of business, but it's always the same process. Once we have that, they're like, "Got it." Then we just make the ask.
From this point going forward, it's explaining away their concerns like any human being would normally do. I could drill price overcomes with you, but I think it's more valuable to explain the thought process behind price stalls and decision-maker objections.
The first and obvious one is, "I can't afford it." Anyone get this one? A couple of people? Two people have gotten this? You guys have the best leads; give me your leads.
The easy question that I use to explain to our sales team, because it's really about breaking their beliefs, is if we were giving away Ferraris right now for five grand, do you think they'd find a way to get the money? Yes!
So that simply means they do not understand the value you're trying to provide. If you can get your team to believe that, then they understand that it is always their fault if someone cannot afford the program. Does that make sense? Fantastic!
Second, decision-maker closes—one of the hardest things to overcome. "I gotta have my business partner; I gotta have my husband, my spouse, my whatever."
We give a specific process that we go about this. In the very beginning, we just say we circumvent, then we go over past agreements, and then we ask for forgiveness. This is the best way that I've seen to overcome this.
The first thing we say is, "Well, what if they say no?" One out of three times, they'll be like, "I'll probably do it anyway." So we're like, "Let's get started." Boom, it's done.
You'd be amazed how many times that actually works; it's hilarious. If they say, "Well, then I wouldn't do it," then we divert. We say, "Well, what do you think their biggest objection would be about it?"
Because now they're just using a foil, even though the person's not there, and they have no idea what the program is because they're not involved with the call. They're like, "Well, I think this."
At this point, we can attack the actual obstacle even though the decision-maker isn't there. If we still can't overcome it, then we go to past agreements.
We say, "Well, does your business partner know that you guys are struggling on sales?" "Well, yeah." "Does he approve of that?" "Well, no." "Then why would he be against something that he already doesn't approve of? That doesn't make any sense. Why would he be against a business partner solving a problem?"
"What you do? Well, it's great you're being a great partner. Let's go." We try and rely on past agreements that are obvious and use those to project into the present.
Finally, you know, sometimes it's better to ask for forgiveness than permission. We'll tack that on to then you can put that at the end of any of the closes.
When we're dealing with this with price, it's value. With decision-maker, we go on past agreements, and with stalls, we just teach people to make decisions.
People are so afraid of making the wrong decision; they're petrified. So we literally teach them on the call, "Here's how we make a decision. These are the variables you should be considering: X, Y, and Z."
"Can the product meet your needs? Do you think that if you work with us, you have a greater or lower likelihood of losing weight?" "Greater? Fantastic! I think we're halfway there. Do you want to work with us? Do you think it'd be fun to hang out and see me every day? Because believe me, this stash I had, I had to work 12 months to get my wife to say yes to that, so I understand if you're hesitant. Does that make sense? Would you be willing to do that?"
All right, let's rock! Then, do you have access to funds or know someone who does? Because it's not just about you. If it's something that's amazing, we can find other ways to finance this.
So do you have access or know someone who does? "Yes? Well then, great! Let's get started." If for some reason we haven't closed them at this point, we say, "How about this? Let's take a card down; we'll delay the payment to Friday. You go to your husband, go to your business partner."
I love this one: "You go to your husband, and he says, 'Baby, I want you to live a shorter life. I want you to be a terrible example for our kids. I want you to not have generational health in our family to be passed down. I want you to sit in that corner, pull those sweatpants up, take up a bag of Cheetos, rub your fingers on there, and just get comfortable with the fact that you're never going to look better than you are right now.'"
It's like, "If your husband says that to you, you call me back, and I will tear this contract up. Fair enough?" Right? You close them.
We explain away their concerns, and then finally, we get the yes. We reinforce the decision. This is stuff that we started doing; it helped a lot.
So personalized video from the CEO: "Hey, welcome aboard! So happy to have you. Thank you for trusting us with your business. Hey, we're so happy to have you. Thank you for trusting us with your weight loss journey and our personal licenses. We're going to do everything in our power to absolutely amaze you."
Little things like that because the customer is usually deciding whether or not they like your business in the first 48 hours after the sale. I learned this later, so how you hand off from sale to customer experience and activation is where this all happens.
Does that make sense? Is that cool? Was that a nice framework to work through? Okay, so that's the Closer Framework. That is the first thing; that's what you can run your script through.
All right, how to ask the questions to get the prospects to say yes. Check one down, two to go. You with me? You're still good? All right, let's rock.
So, Conviction Framework number two—how anyone who believes can outperform a seasoned sales rep by simply learning to control their tone.
After I reworked all of our scripts using the Closer Framework, some of my guys were really successful, but other ones still blew, and I was like, "Well, this sucks." I was really excited; I had a little acronym and everything. I was like, "That took me a long time to come up with the acronym."
I was like, "What gives?" So I talked to my friends, and they recommended this book, which was awesome. The biggest takeaway from this book is the concept of tone, and this was something that really helped take us and give an extra edge to our sales training, our sales process, and the coaching that we give people.
In the book, he talked about the hidden dialogue, which I just love. I never want to take credit for an idea because I got it from a man, but there are two dialogues that are happening. The words are the logic; what you're actually saying is talking to the logical brain. How you say it is talking to the emotional brain. That's the one making decisions; that's the one running the show.
How you say what you say is what you say. Here's an example: that's my wife. She's going to be here with me soon, but if she were here, if she said, "Alex," right? Or "Alex," right? Or "Alex!" Very different meanings, very different afternoons for me in each of these scenarios based on how she said it because there's so much communicated.
That's just one word. Imagine a 30-minute dialogue where each word can be chosen to have packed with the meaning that you need them to feel. Does that make sense?
Okay, so we need the words for the logical influence; we need the tone for the emotional influence. We need both. Once you become a more seasoned sales rep, you can learn to control your tone on purpose.
You can raise your voice at the end of the statement, make it into a question. "Right? It's a question. This is John, right?" I didn't need to ask him; I'm saying you know to answer that as a question. I didn't ask you that, but you know that based on the tone.
Or I could lower my voice right now. See that? What I'm saying is extremely important. Tone matters, and it takes time to develop this level of unconscious mastery.
There are two ways to develop this, and I believe that you can either trick yourself into it or you can train yourself into it. Since I don't have enough time in 30 minutes to train on the influence of tonalities, here's the trick: conviction will correct your tone.
If you believe in what you sell, you will say it the right way. That's why some of you guys have a sales rep that comes on, crushes it, and then tanks because they did believe, and then they saw your reviews, or they got customer support feedback, or someone called them up after buying and was like, "F*** you! I can't believe you did that!"
And they're done, and then all their tone's off because they feel like out of ethics, right? I'm lowering my tone right now so you know that this is really important.
I'll go upbeat, kiss the boo-boo, bring us back up. Real estate sales team consulting—this is a great story. I was flown out, paid way more money than I should have been paid to fly out and consult with the sales team.
They were selling mortgage leads, the example I was given earlier, and they were really excited. They wanted me to give this ABC—always be closing—chat, like this huge pump-up chat. So I spent the first half of the day on the script, and the second half of the day was supposed to be drilling the sales team.
I get on the sales team; they got a nine-person sales floor, and they're like, "We're having some problems with this guy, John." I was like, "All right, cool." So I was like, "John, how good are the leads?" He was like, "Well, you know, they're kind of..."
And I was like, "I'm good, thank you." I was like, "Because if you f***ing thought the leads were good, you would say, 'Dude, they're unreal! I can't believe it! Right now, I'm getting my mom to pass her real estate certification so I can start sending her leads. I'm studying for mine; I'm a couple months behind, but I'm telling you, as soon as I f***ing get this thing passed, I'm out of here. I'm going to start buying these leads myself because I'll make more than I make right now as a sales guy.'"
That's what you'd say if you believed, right? The way you say and what you'd say would be entirely different. One of the hacks on this, by the way, has anyone ever gotten hot, or has a sales guy gotten hot, started just closing, closing, closing?
Anyone? That becomes the sales training for that person because the way they ask the question, at what point how they closed—that's how it's perfect. They should study the best game footage when they're on a streak, and that's when you can replicate it much more easily because it's like in the wild, you'll witness it, and that's when they're masters, right? In those moments.
These are the actions that we do, so I'm transitioning into tactics for you guys who have teams. Re-read the testimonials out loud daily in front of your sales team. If you got fresh ones, which you should, read them. It makes their day; it makes them feel like they're making an impact.
You're getting the f*** kicked out of them every single day, getting hung up on, getting cussed at, getting f***ed off every day. The best thing you can do is give them a cup of coffee that says, "Hey man, you're f***ing doing good in the world."
So they need it, so do it every day. Number two, fix everything you can about the product. This is obvious, but I want to say it directly: don't blame the customer for a lack of success because it doesn't help anyone.
It doesn't help them; it doesn't help us. If we can take ownership, then we can fix the product. Number three, never stop improving it.
So you always know what's up to date. This is a good one for the sales team. If your sales dip, take your head of customer support, bring them to the sales meeting, and say, "Erica, tell these guys what you do for our customers."
They're like, "Oh, well, the first day what we do is we send this text, and we send them this letter, and then we give them swag, and then we follow up with them, and then we write them a handwritten card, and leave them a back massage and a foot massage, and then we find a wife for them."
It's unbelievable, you know what I mean? And then the sales guys are like, "God, this is f***ing awesome!" I'm like, "I know! Let's go sell it!"
These are the actions that you can do on a daily basis to get your team to be excellent. That's how you can hack conviction and get your team's tone unconsciously correct by just truly believing in the product. Is that cool? You think you'd sell more if you did that? Sweet, thank you!
All right, Conviction Framework number two—check.
All right, number three, Scaling Framework—how to easily duplicate this process across salespeople in any niche in seven days or less.
We've talked about the Closer Framework, we've talked about the Conviction Framework, and this is the—oops, I think I'm going to skip one. I don't know where you're at. Great!
When I showed my sales team this stuff, they didn't do it every time. You're probably going to come back from here all gung-ho; you might show them this video, and they're like, "Yeah!" They go rah-rah for two to three days, and then it's like back to normal.
No one wants that. So piece by piece, we implemented processes to get the same outcome over and over and over again. Because of the 110 million dollars we've sold, which is crazy, it's been 100% over the phone.
No one over the age of 20—no, we got one guy who's 40. But besides him, everyone's younger than 27. These aren't like crazy veterans, right? You just do this process over and over again and get the right thing.
As a total aside, find people and educate them about your prospect, not your product, because that's a big f*** up. They shouldn't even be talking that much about the product; they should be knowing everything about the prospect.
Right now, if your sales training is focused on your product, you're doing it wrong. These are the six C's that I use to scale teams from little guys to lots of guys.
This delta, you know, we used this to build a 3000-person affiliate base in our physical products company. It added 35 million in sales, which is cool, which is awesome.
I'll show you how this works. We've used these sales teams, and this is how we kind of—these are all multi-figure teams, and I'll show you what we did.
The Closer Sequence is the first C, which we went over earlier. The second C is consistent daily training and conviction, and I'll show you how to do each of these.
Call recordings—you got to record them. Communication cycles, cuts, and competition—there are the six C's.
Number one, make sure you have a question-based framework that follows those steps in the script. It should just be questions. It's so much easier to just follow questions because if someone's out in left field, you know, wandering onto the highway, you're like, "Whoa! Hey, come back over here. This is the next question in this process."
So thank you so much for sharing that; that must have been so hard for you. So what do you think that brought you? Right? I think you go right into the next question—the sale.
Number two, consistent daily training. This is the number one thing. If you take one thing away from this besides conviction, because that'll do more for your sales than anything, this is the second biggest thing.
Daily training—our team trains 60 minutes a day, five days a week. We actually do twice-a-day stuff, but that's okay.
Anyways, for right now, if you just do this, you'll already be way better than everyone else in your market. We do talking and listening because the salesperson needs to know how to speak the right tone and how to listen.
So we draw both scales for talking. We have them read the script out loud and the questions with the correct tonality for 25 minutes, and if they f*** up, they start again. Simple!
Five minutes, we drill obstacle overcomes: "I need to think about it; I'm not sure; I don't have the money; can't afford that right now; I gotta talk to my partner; I know what's going to work in my market," or whatever your specific obstacles are.
Because when they're in the red zone, they shouldn't have to think about those. The only two things that someone will ever truly memorize will be those 30-second anecdotal stories I mentioned earlier and your obstacle overcomes.
It makes it much easier to get new people on the team listening. So every day, we'll listen to a 30-minute recording, and we'll go with what went right in this call, what went wrong, what do you do next time—very simple.
You play the call; everyone watches. It's game tape review. We're like, "Man, you got kicked in the balls on this one, but you had great rapport in the first five minutes."
You're like, "What went wrong?" And that was about it. "What are you going to do next time?" "I'm going to transition from the rapport to the question asking without sounding like a douchebag." Fantastic!
All right, next day, and you continue to improve. I know this sounds crazy simple, but it's so simple, no one will do it.
So number three C's is call recordings. If you don't call, like, record your calls. One, you're not compliant, but two, how are you going to study game film?
Everybody's got all their data, and you've got your mouse tracking on all the pages. I'm like, "Where's the mouse tracking on the calls?" Right? That's where you're going to train your team.
This is like every NBA team—they play the game, and they watch the game footage. Why are we not doing that with the sales team? You should have to record it. If you use Zoom, Gong is absolutely the best. Highly recommend it; it's been awesome.
We'll use it for two years. They'll tell you exactly how many minutes people are talking versus someone else. They'll tell you who's talking the most, how many questions were asked—if the AI they have there is unbelievable.
It's expensive, but it's worth it. Four, communication cycles and feedback. I don't know if you guys have heard the story, but if I were trying to fix your golf swing, right?
And I said, "Okay, so I take a swing looking like I do, like an idiot." Right? He's like, "All right, man, well, first off, lose 40 pounds so you can rotate."
"After you do that, change your wrist by two degrees, turn your other hand over, put your thumb underneath, I need you to take your first foot, put it forward, and then point it the other way, and then put this foot back and try again."
I'm like, "No chance of swinging right." But if he just said, "Hey, take another 20 swings and just put one thumb under the other one," I'd have one thing to work on, and I could probably get better.
When you're training, and this is for the sales directors, if you're helping them out with that call, what went right, what went wrong, what am I going to do about it is the one thing. Does that make sense?
In terms of communication cycles, we do weekly with the team. We've got daily training; we've got daily wrap-up at the end, which is really just to pump up and kiss them on the forehead goodnight to make sure they feel okay.
They do get punched in the face all day, so it's worth being like, "Hey, you see Derek's overcome this morning? It's f***ing awesome! He killed it! Let's watch that as highlight footage."
Watch him say he's going to have to talk to his wife, overcome, right? And then they're like, "Dude, you killed it!" And then it just makes them feel like they're part of the team.
That's where we do the feedback and the communication cycles. We do one-on-ones if they're new; we'll do one-on-ones if they're a little bit older. We'll do once every other week.
Does that make sense? Can you use this right now, what I'm giving you for your sales teams? Okay, sweet.
Number five, cut the fat. Cut it fast. Randy probably knows this better than anyone. When you hire salespeople, at least in my experience, it's sink or swim.
If guys can't close in the first week to two weeks, unless it's some sort of crazy complex thing, they ain't closing. Then I've got somebody who now came in neutral; now they feel like they suck.
They're actually worse than someone who's new because now I got to overcome all your beliefs and then bring you back up. In my experience, it's been much easier to take a six and get them to a nine than try and take a two and get him to a five.
It's more work, and it's not good for me or him. Does that make sense? So in most cases, does anyone have a salesperson that you've been waiting for them to turn the corner for the last six months?
They're not going to turn the corner unless they've had a come-to-Jesus moment, which does happen, but it doesn't need to happen on my team. You can do that and come back, right?
All right, number six, competition and career path. It's a big one. Salespeople are competitive, right? As they should be; they are hunters, and they should go hunt.
Having competition on a regular basis, what we have found is that six-week cycles tend to work best. It is long enough that they believe they can accomplish something, but short enough they believe it's going to happen soon.
We run our competitions on six-week cycles. For us, I think what you said, whatever Ryan said about the percentages, 10 to 15 percent actually works pretty well as a group goal.
When we have those as top salesperson, we did like a weekend in Vegas. So we'll split all the guys that way, like four teams of four. You know what I mean? They're all comped, so you get the competitiveness, but you still get the camaraderie.
If it's just one versus everyone, sometimes they can get a little bit too, you know, teethy. Having little mini-teams helps too because then you can kind of make it an adjusted draft. You put the best guy with the worst guy, and then he helps him out, and he speeds him up.
Does that make sense? Then career path—this is one that I probably learned later, but it's really good. You can have minor road milestones, like 50 deals closed, 100 deals closed, 150 deals closed.
They just get a little, just a little, you know, they go from 500 a deal to 525 a deal. They go from 525 to 550 a deal. Just the fact that there's this roadmap of where they're going and there's actual progress, because sales is one of the most repetitive positions in the world.
Just the fact that they're doing this and something is changing on the outside, I think just helps relieve anxiety and helps the guys focus. So that is one of the things that I would recommend doing with the career path.
Then obviously, if you have roles, like depending on how big your team is, manager, etc., you can move up. Something that I don't have on here that I will add is that this seems to be common practice, but remember, dumbest marketer on earth: outbound and inbound, keep them separated.
We also have setters and closers for both of those teams. Outbound setters are different than inbound setters, which go to different enclosures on either side, right? Because the prospects are a little bit different.
If you have lots of different types of leads going to the same person, you're probably losing a lot of efficiency. If you don't have that much lead flow, that's another issue. But as soon as you can separate them out, it will get you a lot higher conversion rates.
All right, so I'll recap this—the six C's for scaling: our Closer Sequence—make sure that's in a question-based framework. Daily trainings and conviction—so you're reading the testimonials every day, you're training them every morning on talking and listening, the most valuable skills that a salesperson can have.
Call recordings to make sure that they're actually doing any of the game tape footage to actually look at. Communication cycles to actually improve on their skills based on the game footage that we just had.
You cut the bottom people who are just dragging the team down, that probably just don't have the makeup for this. Then you keep it competitive, and you give them a career path so they have something to look forward to in the future.
Now you can understand how anyone can sell expensive life paper, even if you don't think you're any good, which is completely normal. Yeah, that sales.