Transcription
What do you think Ripple's agenda is this year at Davos?
That is a good question. It is a unique scenario that Ripple and also Hideera, they're in as the only crypto sponsors for the World Economic Forum's Davos meeting this year.
Ripple has been in multiple meetings with the World Economic Forum. There's several relationships. There's many documentations as well that highlight the XRP ledger and Ripple as a company. So, there are several different connections that can lead you to Ripple and the WF being familiar with each other.
As far as Ripple's agenda at the World Economic Forum, it seems that there's a theme around trust being built between these institutions and the global community at large. And Ripple being a company that earned the trust of central banks over the years. And Davos is a meeting where many central banks are congregating and discussing the future technology, AI, and blockchain technology being integrated into traditional systems. Ripple was certainly being that voice of reason for the crypto ecosystem and paving the way for just that mainstream conversation for crypto adoption into traditional international cross-border rails.
Welcome back everyone to another week on the Cashew Podcast. This week, another very special guest. He has been on before. Smoke with a Q, our man over on X. Uh, the fundamental whiz, the litany of documentation that we receive every single week proving that we are indeed in the greatest asset of all. Uh, Smoke Dog, welcome back to the show.
I'm glad to be back, Nate. Thanks for the invite.
All good, brother. So today, we're we're going to spend some time looking through uh, the World Economic Forum documents, uh, some some content related to that. We're going to go back and forth on, you know, where we think 2026 is going to take us. Um, and potentially what BlackRock's involvement might be with with Ripple and much more. Open flow to this podcast than last time. So, I thought we might just start with a pretty simple question, which is, what do you think Ripple's agenda is this year at at Davos?
That is a good question and um, it is a unique scenario that Ripple and also Hideera um, they're in as the only crypto sponsors for um, the World Economic Forum's Davos meeting this year. And um, one thing that I think people should uh, recognize and actually look into as well is that this is not a first for Ripple. Ripple has um, been in multiple meetings with the World Economic Forum. There's several relationships. There's um, many documentations as well that highlight the XRP ledger and Ripple as a company. So um, there are several different connections that can lead you to um, Ripple and the the WF being familiar with each other. And you can also make um, many deductions that the World Economic Forum is familiar with the XRP ledger and Ripple's technology.
And as far as Ripple's agenda at the World Economic Forum, um, from what I've been listening to lately, it seems that there's a theme around trust being built between um, these institutions and retail investors and or just um, the community, the global community at large. And Ripple being a company that earned the trust of central banks over the years. And Davos is a meeting where many of central banks are are meeting um, where several central banks are congregating and discussing the future technology, AI, and uh, blockchain technology being integrated into the traditional system.
Ripple is certainly being that voice of reason for the the crypto ecosystem, for the um, the innovation side of um, fintech and being a company that has a reputation of having efficient technology, compliant technology, and adhering to regulators um, regulations that has been um, rolling out lately. Ripple is certainly just uh, paving the way for just that mainstream conversation for crypto adoption into um, traditional international cross-border rails.
And I've just I've just brought up here uh, one of your more recent posts. This was late last year on the tokenization opportunity that we've all heard so much about. um, you know, why do you think that the XRPL is positioned quite neatly to capitalize on, you know, this huge difference that needs to be made up in RWAs? You know, you've listed here that only 26 billion um, has been tokenized as of mid-last year and the WF are projecting that we're heading towards a quadrillion. Um, why do you feel XRPL is positioned to really nail it on that front?
I would say the documentations that you're showing um, is a prime example of um, my belief behind XRP being a prime XRP being a prime platform for real-world asset tokenization. And this documentation right here that you currently have up from the Digital Assets Council of Financial Professionals, they were actually discussing who are the prime contenders of blockchain platforms that are set to um, lead the future of RWA asset tokenization. And again, this is a um, organization of digital finance professionals and they clearly cite the XRP ledger right there. As it says that Ripple is positioning the XRP ledger as the blockchain for institutional finance with the focus on global payments. And um, there's another documentation as well that um, shows that Ripple has been creating the XRP ledger as a prime platform for real-world asset tokenization.
And when we think of the XRP ledger, we should um, remember the process of um, just the characteristics of the XRP ledger, being able to move any form of value, whether that's gold, oil, commodities, uh, corn, wheat, any form of um, real-world value, any investable asset can be tokenized on the XRP ledger. Being an efficient, compliant blockchain, being a blockchain that has earned the respect and trust of central banks, financial institutions, and um, just plenty of other influential spaces in this um, in this financial ecosystem like Franklin and Tupelin and even integrations with BlackRock. There is plenty of um, reasons and categories um, categories that the XRP ledger is currently in that places it just um, in that number one contender spot for tokenizing the most um, value on its public blockchain.
One thing I wanted to get your thoughts on, I've had recently a chat with Apex Crypto Insights. I'm not sure if you've seen some of his work, but he's he's quite similar to you in in the regard that he he only espouses bulletproof documentation, but he kind of does it more in video format on YouTube. And one thing I found really interesting is this idea that a lot of the key institutions and amalgams that talk about where we're heading, they use crossover language. So they're linguistic choices for what we probably believe is the XRPL. So for instance, uh, shared ledger, unified ledger, um, regulated fintech, uh, there's a few other ones. I I wanted to get your take on in your research because you're so across it all. Have you noticed some congruence there? But do you feel compelled that across the central banks, for instance, they're all talking about the same thing, but they're using different language to mirage what's going on?
I certainly agree with the sentiments um, shared from Jesse from on Apex Crypto Insights. He's certainly someone I believe who looks at the the bigger picture. And I think um, more content creators who look at research and evidence and um, bring up the the broader scope of what this opportunity is should certainly be highlighted more um, as I believe that's the general direction of what the space is going. A more document-evidence-based approach. And um, as a researcher, as someone that reads many of these reports um, on a daily basis, I would say that there's plenty of consistent themes um, regarding moving value. I would say the internet of value is something that I've seen um, be explained um, describing the Interledger Protocol, which is um, a project Ripple's behind. And also ISO 2022 has been something that has been um, compared to introducing the internet of value, similar to Ripple's Interledger Protocol. So when we think of um, the unified ledger from the BIS, they say the phrase Interledger Protocol is the core of their um, their core application that is the heart of their fintech concept. And um, I would say the it's a pretty expansive list when we think of cross-border payments, alternate rails, crypto-based um, value movement that ledger tends to um, you know, surface in many of these conversations. And typically when you look pretty deeper and look beyond the surface, there's always a relationship between Swift, the Federal Reserve, central banks in Africa, South America, Europe. From my research, I've seen Ripple um, integrated in all corners of the globe. So um, there hasn't really been a place where there's no Ripple presence or no presence that the XRP ledger or the Interledger. So I would say um, yes, there's certainly a um, consistent language. There's a long list of words that have seen um, just indicate crypto-based rails, the movement to um, interoperability, um, utility tokens being integrated into the financial system. There's many different um, phrases and I would say central bank just um, [clears throat] wording that you would have to just read an extensive amount of documentation to understand and recognize these patterns.
And I guess one of the follow-on questions I've been getting a lot lately, probably you yourself as well, is with all the fundamentals seemingly in place, pretty much. I mean, we've had a a very productive last year, even outwardly beyond the the documentation that you talk about, of course, the acquisitions from Ripple, the partnerships from Ripple. When does your instinct tell you things are going to start to move where we're actually seeing the XRPPL used how we want it to be used? Is there a particular catalyst you see? Maybe it's through, you know, these permission domains that are being voted on as we speak. It might, what, what is your read on things as we stand?
That's a good question and I've actually been seeing some um, pretty straightforward revealing um, reports that addresses this exact question of um, when exactly will the investment thesis for XRP holders truly pay off. And I've seen um, there's actually documentation floating around from Amplify ETFs that just released in the last few days and it was actually just a clear breakdown from the investor perspective on why the XRP ledger's value will likely be reflected this year. And that was through Ripple's National Bank Charter being um, accepted into the preliminary round of approval. And that will essentially add um, a federal shield of legitimacy over RDI and XRP ledger, which will enhance its utility and enhance its value over the long term through its integration into the payment um, network.
And I've even seen um, there's also an instant payment network called FedNow that's been launched on a few years ago in the United States. And within that same documentation, it outlined that there's possible um, integration between XRP ledger and FedNow and FedWire, which um, I would say the most interesting fact about FedWire is that it's one of the oldest and largest payment systems in um, in existence and it transacts over a quadrillion dollars in value um, a year. And this is being outlined as a a traditional rail that the XRP ledger can potentially um, absorb some value from or transact just a fraction of that value. And that would be just um, a monumental shift in value to the XRP ledger from just one payment system. And again, that documentation outlined as soon as Q2 or Q3 of this year of um, just Ripple RDI XRP ledger integrations into traditional financial rails.
And um, I would also stress the fact to any viewers of this video that that is just one payment platform. FedWire is the RTGS system for the United States. Every other major economy in the world has their own RTGS system that moves trillions of dollars in value. And Ripple's Interledger Protocol and XRP ledger is um, integrated in many of those um, instant payment systems as well. So I would certainly say this year, which we've been also seeing um, just mentioned by the likes of uh, Caroline Fam, the the former um, CTC chair who's currently um, a part of MOPE, she's even mentioned that this is 2026 of the year of implementation, institutional adoption. I've seen documentation that have shared the same sentiments of 2026 being the year of utility, XRP, the XRP asset being one of the most trusted, efficient, passes um, utility tokens on the market. This is certainly the year where we are likely to see um, some of the utility of XRP um, the XRP asset being reflected through actual um, institutional usage. And um, I certainly wouldn't say full usage, of course, long-term um, we can expect further exponential gains, but this year certainly being the year of institutional adoption after we just passed 2025, the year of regulatory clarity, where a majority of the regulation, regulatory conversation that needed to happen have and we're going in the right direction. So, I would certainly say just based on everything that I've seen um, this year, alongside other utility tokens, XRP will certainly start to show some of its potential um, value-wise and price-wise.
You said last time that the institutional consensus was that the four-year cycle theory is dead and this would be the year. So, it's cool to hear that you you're still consistent on that despite obviously things still bleeding out. Pricewise and retail sentiment being pretty shaken. Um, just wanted to double-tap on one of the points you made there at the top, which was around, I think was it Apex ETF? Did I botch that? What was the name?
Amplify ETFs.
Amplify. Do you have That was really interesting. Do you have an X post or something on that I could bring up?
I can send that to you if you like. I'll put it in post-production.
All good. Uh, moving on.
Yeah, I can send it to you.
Yeah, I'll pop it on screen for the listeners because that was a really good point. Uh, and with this in mind, what do you think the play the likes of BlackRock are waiting for? Like, what, what are their We've got Brad at Brad's sort of not center stage, but he's prominent over there this week at Davos speaking. Also going on the All-In podcast. Larry Fink, temp chair of WEF. What do you think they're waiting for before they announce something or the ETFs drop? Like, what's what's going on there? What's your read?
So, just a few of the findings that I've had over the years. Um, since the SEC case, BlackRock has been watching XRP. They've um, watched the motions of the SEC case. um, SEC versus Ripple case to essentially gauge how they uh, went about launching the Bitcoin ETF. So that was just one of the earliest indicators that um, BlackRock was watching the XRP ledger over the last few years during that um, emboldened federal court case. And outside of that um, Ando and XRP ledger's integration with um, BlackRock, Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan, that's been revealed in a video as well that I've shared on my page. um, in an Ando promotional video. So that's just an actual technical integration that currently exists, which which further confirms that BlackRock is very familiar with the XRP ledger. And I would say even more um, specifically, what the what BlackRock is waiting for as an institution. This is something that I covered as well for something that um, as important as an XRP ETF or just an open Ripple integration announcement. I would say the short-term regulatory uncertainty plays a major factor. As the number one asset manager in the world. um, they are pretty consistent on making the right moves at the right time. And this current moment of I would say regulatory limbo that we're in, while digital assets are on the way of of having full clarity, while not having full clarity because of um, legislation not being finalized. That is something that um, BlackRock would would that's something that would certainly hold BlackRock back from fully revealing their true interest and intent for the crypto asset market and and even something more specific like XRP.
And I would also add that um, coins like Bitcoin and Ethereum have had extensive um, time to build their liquidity within the derivatives market. XRP on the other hand hasn't had the same privilege and regulatory privilege and time to build uh, liquidity in the derivatives market. And that's essentially why um, BlackRock and other financial institutions went 100% in when they were um, applying for Bitcoin ETFs and Ethereum ETFs because there was plenty of liquidity around those ecosystems to for um, ETF products to be built around them. And XRP. Um, not saying that it's it's a um, a system without liquidity, but as far as uh, regulated liquidity, derivatives, the CME, um, there needs to be more liquidity to to be built around the asset within the XRP ledger ecosystem, which is on the way as well as a result of um, ETFs, derivatives, integration, um, tokenization, stablecoin usage. Liquidity on that circuit ledger is building, but regulatory short-term regulatory uncertainty and liquidity building on the XRP ledger has um, just been signs that I've that I would say has been holding BlackRock back from truly diving into um, what their plans are for the XRP ledger.
On that clarity point, that's been very topical the last couple of weeks. Uh, what is your read on where we're going to land with this? Do you see it happening this year, next couple of months, next couple weeks? I know Armstrong's over there this week campaigning again uh, with the banks. It seems like it's a bit of an arm wrestle. How have you gauged that whole fiasco?
Um, I think I have a um, I would say unique perspective as um, I was privileged to be able to go to the the crypto um, task force roundt meetings um, over the last year and they've been extremely revealing um, on how legislators in DC are truly looking at crypto assets, they're what they're familiar with and what they're unfamiliar with. And the attitude in the room has always been encouraging and progressive and looking at the bright side of things instead of looking at the the downside of things. But within those conversations, there's plenty of um, I would say uncomfortable conversations, difficult conversations around just certain topics, what will benefit banks versus retail investors, taking the interests of crypto investors in mind while protecting the traditional uh, financial system system from um, blockchain technology. There's many concerns that regulators have that traditional finance has that crypto investors, people that are familiar with blockchain technology aren't necessarily familiar with and vice versa. There's plenty of interest of crypto investors that traditional finance um, that they're not necessarily aware of. And this friction I would say is certainly necessary to actually create a um, a fair and foundational, you know, level playing field for crypto asset users in traditional finance as this technology um, is truly converging together with traditional finance. And this is creating, you know, this friction that I believe is going to answer more questions um, it's going to lead more answers than questions. And by the end of this, we're going to see just legislation that is working in the favor of crypto asset investors while not giving banks and in larger financial institutions that unfair advantage that they've had for so long.
And uh, that's essentially why um, Brian Armstrong pulled his support is because the Clarity Act was essentially um, extremely prob and just written in the for the interest of banks and not the average individual investor. And that is the whole point of blockchain technology is to just improve the financial capabilities and capacities of the average person through crypto assets and decentralized technology. And if legislation is not um, written with the interests of crypto investors in mind, then there's not really going to be a point of passing this legislation if it's going to just be as restrictive as um, as just old-fashioned traditional finance legislation.
And I would say um, that by the end of this, we will certainly have regulatory clarity this year as regulatory clarity in the number one economy in the world is not um, a light matter. Other economies are watching the United States to shape their legislation and to essentially um, plan out how they're going to develop cross-jurisdictional interoperability regarding these legislations. And that's something that I would say is one of the most complex issues regarding crypto asset technology, cross-border payment technology using blockchain is that regulations in every single country has to be in cohesion. They have to be interoperable and they have to essentially rhyme in a way that allows cross-border payments to um, to just be legal in both jurisdictions. And that's something that is currently causing a lot of fragmentation now is that one country can have um, certain crypto legislations that other countries don't necessarily allow. And when crypto assets cross jurisdictions, you know, there can be plenty of um, friction and that can hold up that transaction. So having that cross-border um, crypto asset harmonization regarding regulatory clarity, that's something that is um, set to happen this year as well. Not just because of the United States, but because the entire world is finally getting on the same page regarding crypto assets.
So your gauge from being at these roundtables is that the media have probably overplayed and overhyped this fracture and it's more just Armstrong's making sure that the posture and the interests of the crypto community are at least upheld and that there's a a mutual agreement that can be met and and are you confident that that they're going to get there, that the banks not been a strong arm us?
I'm very confident that they're going to um, get to a place where crypto retail investors are their interests are I would say majority reflected within the legislation and they have protection and they have more um, federal oversight and federal just um, guarantees that wasn't necessarily there when there was um, regulatory uncertainty. And I would say what we're witnessing is banks' last ditch effort and to try to maintain their monopoly over tokenized deposits, over interest on um, on bank account holdings. These are all things that generate a lot of revenue for banks. But this blockchain technology is here to stay. Wall Street is very familiar with crypto assets and the returns that they will provide regarding DeFi, regarding utility and cost savings and just making their internal systems more efficient. This isn't something that is going to be stopped by one or two institutions as crypto asset technology is being adopted everywhere in real time and at a rapid pace. And um, again, I would say we're just witnessing a last stage effort of these stubborn, you know, incumbents trying to hold on to their monopolistic power, but blockchain technology is a pretty unstoppable force. Tokenization is a mega trend, as we can see spoken by the the likes of Larry Fink. He um, is very confident that this technology is here to stay and that all assets will be tokenized and on-chain. And in that reality um, banks do not have all of the power if all assets are tokenized. And you know um, financial instruments that were not allowed to be used by um, the common investor will finally be in our hands for the first time through um, DeFi protocols and apps that allow us to earn rewards and interest on our holdings, on our uh, monetary value. This is again a reality that is just um, the natural evolution of money that you know um, some lobbying from large banks aren't going to stop.
Yeah. I've I've often said that, you know, worst-case scenario, it doesn't get through. So there's they're still caught in their dogma. The likes of Ripple, who have all the money transmitter licenses. You mentioned that they've got their national trust bank charter. They've applied for a FedNow account, master account. Um, they cross so many different jurisdictions with their money transmitter licenses as well. You know, I feel like either way, they win. And it ends up, if the banks don't come to the party, it ends up being a Netflix versus Blockbuster scenario. Um, now, that probably won't happen, of course, because the banks know that they have to find some sort of middle ground, otherwise they're in big trouble.
I would certainly agree with that. And um, it is interesting seeing a Ripple partner, Bank of America, you know, cause this this hold up with um, just the Clarity Act. And I would say um, when we look at just the the issue at hand regarding stablecoin yield, that is the number one hot topic regarding um, just the the friction and the the tension regarding the Clarity Act passing. And I I've had a conversation with someone recently about this and I would say that this isn't the only issue that banks have regarding the C losing their centralized power over the financial ecosystem. They're going to lose um, they're going to lose money from crypto asset technology like XRP taking away from uh, fees that they generate from cross-border payments, as XRP ledger will allow cross-border payments to be essentially free. Banks make a lot of money off of that. So outside of that, outside of stablecoin yield, they're going to um, lose power from um, remittance fees and go into these fintechs. And even on outside of that, custody is going to go to certain custody um, blockchain-based companies, which will again take away more power from these banks. So there's several different issues that these banks um, currently have and they're not going to be able to uh, fend off all of them, all of these directions that the crypto market is, you know, taking away at their, you know, bottom um, bottom percentages regarding their profits. And I would say that in addition to um, Ripple being a compliant crypto technology provider, there's other compliant crypto technology providers as well that they also have to um, you know, contend with regarding just slowing down progress. And again, there's too many of these utility tokens that are um, currently integrated into the financial system and compliant with current regulations and their, you know, influence of potential cannot be um, held for much longer.
On this topic of stablecoins, one thing [clears throat] I'd like your thoughts on to debunk is this idea that's become very popularized the last couple months in the influencer community. And that is this idea that stablecoins are just going to replace XRP and that Ripple panicked and that's why they launched RLUSD. I've given my thoughts a few times on this. I've done a couple videos. I think it's a very easy answer to be honest, but I would like your articulation on why stablecoins can never replace XRP.
That is a good question and I would certainly agree. There's plenty of um, confusion regarding this topic, but I would say that um, I can show you as many documentations as you like regarding RLUSD complementing XRP. That was the the primary reason for introducing a stablecoin, a stable asset to the XRP ledger, which is um, governed by a currently volatile native asset. And there's those same people would also argue that banks would not use a volatile asset to transact value. And for that same reason, that is why RLUSD, a stable, non-volatile digital representation of value, was introduced to um, to the XRP ledger. So in addition to XRP being used to transact value, the RLUSD is a stable form of value that is powered by XRP. That every usage of RLUSD burns um, the XRP asset. And even RLUSD being issued on the Ethereum blockchain, there's documentation that I read as well that the there's a whole scheme behind that that Ripple um, is currently rolling out. And the idea behind issuing RLUSD on the Ethereum blockchain is to essentially steal the the large amount of liquidity that's been built on the Ethereum blockchain over the years and bring that to the XRP ledger to make the XRP ledger more liquid and enhance the utility of XRP even further. So um, again, there's plenty of documentation that I've seen RLUSD has been introduced to complement um, the XRP asset. And um, you can't necessarily replace the native asset of the XRP ledger of blockchain and um, being an efficient asset, an efficient native asset that is built for transacting value, moving any form of value from one to another um, in, you know, record time. I would say that adding a stablecoin to the utility of um, XRP is is certainly something that um, the average person isn't familiar with. But central banks, financial institutions need a non-volatile store of value to um, to to represent fiat on their end to actually, you know, utilize the infrastructure of the XRP ledger. And that's um, something that financial institutions don't necessarily care about the un the underlying infrastructure, but just the front-facing, you know um, non-volatile asset, which will be stablecoins, which is essentially just the natural evolution of money being um, the next, the next iteration of capital after Apple Pay, after credit cards. Stablecoins is I would say just one of the final forms of uh, money.
I've also just kind of broke it down in a way that espouses, you know, you've got stablecoins, sure, but in a stablecoin, typical stablecoin flow, the institution is going to still have to hold the destination fiat to proceed. That's the same problem that XRP solves once the on-demand liquidity engine is switched on. And the on-demand liquidity engine is only switched on once there is enough liquidity in the system. Um, which then removes the need for the destination fiat. And then you see the interoperability between all of the stablecoins talking to one another through the XRPPL, extracting the the liquidity that's necessary to solve the destination fiat problem. Um, but people don't seem to connect those dots. Uh, you know, JP Morgan, head of digital assets there, you know, they're settling, they're settling like 8 trillion bucks a night. And the market cap of Tether and USDC is only, you know, a few hundred billion. They can't do it for the same problem because that it just just can't handle it. So, that's where I always land with it.
Um, switching gears slightly, I've seen a couple of people hit you up recently with this uh, commodity run that is just continuing. They've been asking, and I've got questions as well, about, you know, the allocation. Should we be allocating more to precious metals and um, you know, should we be focused more on that than our utility tokens? How have you been responding to these questions and how have you just gauged the the general precious metal run?
So, the commodity super cycle, that's something that I've um, seen forecasted since 2024, and that's something that we're we saw play out um, majority of 2025. And that was as a result of global, a direct result of global liquidity, Fed rates, um, Fed rate cuts coming in, international stimulus from China, Japan. These are all um, monetary policies that have increased global liquidity and therefore pumped um, the prices of gold, silver, and other uh, precious metals. And regarding just the approach to investing into precious metals versus utility tokens, what I tell people that ask me about it is that it comes back down to your um, goals in this space, your goals in crypto, and just your long-term wealth um, strategies. um, assets like commodities, gold, they're typically associated with wealth preservation. That's where you invest your capital where you want to um, a non-volatile, I would say safe store of value like gold, like silver, they meet those characteristics. However, this opportunity with utility tokens, with regulatory clarity for digital assets being achieved for the first time, this is the opportunity for massive wealth creation. So capital that you would like to create exponential wealth, create long-term um, massive upside potential on a new technology, a new asset class that has been introduced for the first time in 150 years. That's what this opportunity is regarding utility tokens, cryptocurrencies in general that are going to be um, integrated into the regulated financial ecosystem versus commodities and gold that is um, associated with wealth preservation. So again, this um, question, this topic varies per person, but chasing green candles is not something that I personally, you know, participate in. um, when I first forecasted the commodity super cycle um, over a year and a half ago, that would have been the perfect time to accumulate um, precious metals of your choice and benefit from the commodity super cycle. um, however, if you're considering, you know, jumping into those assets at this point in time, that's not I would not suggest um, investing the last of your capital. I would suggest investing your capital that you plan on um, preserving over the long term versus utility tokens that you're um, investing to for massive upside potential and significant um, percentage returns.
Where do you think it stops or does it stop? Where is gold, silver, platinum? Where's your read at in terms of its duration of its run?
So, I've seen theories regarding the business cycle, the global liquidity cycle. Um, these are the new um, metrics that professional investors are watching now that the four-year cycle is essentially obsolete based on the reality that we're in. And um, include regulatory clarity being on the horizon with the increase of ETFs. I would certainly say that um, we are entering just an institutional adoption super cycle that is driven by global liquidity, driven by institutional accumulation um, international cooperation for crypto asset utilization. These are all t these are all um, I would say factors that are converging simultaneously and this is not something to overlook or underappreciate at all. As it is um, easy to focus on one topic, but I would not um, suggest that as there's again plenty of things happening simultaneously that are bullish catalysts for the crypto asset market. So I would always encourage all listeners, all investors into this space to always take a step back and look at as any um, factors and taking as many um, taking taking as much as consideration as you can regarding different developments in the space because they aren't happening in isolation. They're all happening in a complimentary manner. They're happening um, in relation to each other and they're all set to truly um, influence crypto assets in one direction and that's up and to the right. And that is something that um, uh, I would say a wording that I've seen professional investors use regarding just the long-term direction of this space, the long-term direction of utility tokens. And um, I wouldn't be surprised if this cycle extends into um, 2027, but I would certainly um, expect just massive levels of um, value approval to happen in 2026 because of um, regulatory clarity and other just I would say once-in-a-lifetime um, developments for just any asset class. The crypto asset class is experiencing um, just many bullish catalysts happening at the same time.
So you do you in short, do you think the commodities still keep going up or they near tap out point loosely?
I would I can see commodities continuing um, certainly because global liquidity hasn't topped out yet. Global liquidity has been breaking all-time highs and that is a factor that is I think is being um, severely overlooked and underappreciated as a um, major factor that is um, essentially providing a base floor of a price floor for all asset prices, even the stock market, gold, and soon cryptocurrencies. Cryptocurrencies are simply lagging behind these um, other asset classes. And this is something that I've seen um, just explained as well, that gold, silver could essentially be indicators of what we can expect in the cryptocurrency market. And essentially a catcher trade is is playing out now for institutional investors as they're investing into crypto for the expectation that it's going to essentially break all-time highs alongside other asset classes because of global liquidity. So I would say looking at the performance of the stock market and gold, you certainly have a lot of confidence and motivation to believe that cryptocurrencies will follow in the same direction, if not significantly outperform those other asset classes, because that is what the crypto asset market is notorious for doing. And that's providing um, significant outsized returns and more interesting returns than traditional asset classes.
And a Patreon question from one of my members. What are your thoughts on the Canton protocol? I think they're integrated with the DTCC. Um, any thoughts on that?
This is a conversation that I've had um, plenty as well, as Chainlink has been um, I would say dominating headlines as of late. But my um, commentary on this is um, first and foremost, I would say that as crypto investors, we should be extremely selective on the blockchain networks that we're investing into. Prior cycles, the prior three cycles that the crypto market has experienced, um, you would have been completely safe just buying any crypto token and waiting for the price of Bitcoin to essentially rise your token in a traditional altcoin season. However, we're not in a traditional altcoin season. um, utility tokens with the most potential and the um, the most partnerships and the most long-term potential. These are going to be the tokens that you would uh, preferably like to be in as a crypto investor. And regarding um, networks like the Kent network, the Kenten network is a private blockchain network. And that's essentially where it's um, utility and use case dominate is in private uh, value movement between regulated entities. However, I've seen an abundant amount of reports that indicate that regulated entities, central banks are moving from private blockchains to public blockchain networks. Public blockchain networks, for example, are the XRP ledger, the Stellar blockchain, XDC, IOTA, Hideera. These are all public blockchain networks that currently have plenty of traditional finance integrations, plenty of partnerships with influential organizations from the World Economic Forum to the Federal Reserve to the UK. Um, the list goes on. These public blockchain networks are being selected um, by some of the largest institutions in the world. And I mean, despite the fact that Canton network is being selected and named in plenty of these pilots and um, experimentations and just um, private entity integrations, the overall long-term goal for this space is public, permissionless, I mean, permissioned blockchain networks um, because of their interoperability, because of of their transparency, and because of their scalability. Private blockchain networks like Canton um, just create more siloed wall gardens that don't necessarily promote interoperability and promote harmony within um, among crypto asset networks and traditional networks. So that just goes back to the conversation that I believe crypto investors should be extremely selective this cycle because many tokens are not going to last um, over the long term. So investing into public blockchain networks over private blockchain networks like Canton has been a mindset that I've been sharing um, with people who who've asked about that and that token. And that's not to declare Canton a failure network or that it won't provide returns in the short term. However, at this point in time, you should be um, extremely vigilant on where you're investing your capital, as capital is going to start to congregate around the tokens with the most utility and public blockchain networks with um, regulated entities integrated into them.
This idea of permissioned and moving from private to public, I couldn't agree more with. I've done a lot of content on permissioned domains and permissioned DEXes. I believe they're voting on that as at the moment. Um, do you think that that specific feature because Schwarz, I heard him speak in Singapore, he said his biggest gripe and biggest frustration of all time is that people can't even use the DEX and because there's no permissioned domains live, institutions refuse to come on because they don't know exactly who they're working with or interacting with on the XRPL. Have you done much looking into permissioned domains? And if so, do you think that this permission notion is the ultimate unlock for us?
So, there's plenty of privacy um, solutions being built around public blockchain networks. Having your data, having your transaction and payment data being released as a centralized entity is not in anyone's best interest. Um, that's something that, you know, should be increasingly obvious as time goes on. Banks simply don't want their private information on public blockchains. But that is the reason why private um, solutions, zero-knowledge proof solutions are being built into these public blockchain networks. And even uh, features like that, the Interledger Protocol, which is um, built on top of the XRP, the XRP ledger, that allows privacy and secrecy um, between payments across the internet. So recognizing and understanding that there's people that are developing um, privacy solutions with the interests of banks and um, I would say front-end users in mind. That is something to keep in uh, keep into consideration as we move forward, as um, privacy is a very important subject and topic in the crypto ecosystem. And um, develop, I would say maintaining that privacy through technology, trusting blockchain technology to actually maintain the integrity of information as it was designed to do, is um, that's going to be the general direction that these fintechs and these central banks move towards. And I would certainly say that this concept of privacy, which has been um, rising in significance lately, is um, a major, I would say hurdle for adoption. As centralized, a centralized technology, hybrid approaches with the technology being implemented for retail and institutional clients alike. That is something that needs to be addressed before mainstream adoption. And um, that is something that I've heard um, in these roundt discussions as well. um, and that's how to maintain privacy but promote um, scalability and mainstream adoption in a responsible way. And once that's truly achieved and I would say hammered out in in legislation, that's certainly going to be um, I would say a catalyst in the right direction for crypto to be adopted, for the utility of these tokens to be fully realized, and essentially the valuations to significantly increase over time.
Two more questions. The first one is this privacy notion. We may as well hone in on it. Is we've seen the rise of Zcash. It's now kind of cooled off. Monero, huge run last week. It's now cooling off. Where do you see the privacy coins fitting in post-clarity? Are they always going to be there as a hedge? Like, what's your read on what's going on there?
So, there's certainly been conversations around bans on certain cryptocurrencies. And I would say privacy tokens that, you know, skirt around the size of the financial system would certainly be on the the first on the list to be banned as just tokens that institutions would not prefer um, value to be moved around in an unobserved um, way. And um, of course, there's going to be a c a certain degree of decentralization regarding blockchain technology being implemented. But of there's also going to be an umbrella of centralization that needs to be enforced for everyone's safety. And not just the interest of central banks having, you know, money that's backed by actual fiat currency and backed by actual resources and not just a um, just a digital version of a fiat currency without value. There's going to be plenty of um, reasons why using regulated uh, digital cash will be preferred over other forms of value. And just the conversation around these privacy tokens. This isn't something that necessarily fits the vision of this hybrid approach regarding using blockchain technology to facilitate value. But the future of Zcash and Monero, it most likely, if it's not a ban, it's just going to be um, made difficult via legislation to utilize these tokens. That's an approach that I've seen um, be implemented over the years. Instead of just outright banning certain tokens, you can set up the environment, set up the ecosystem, set up integrations and um, that make it difficult to utilize certain um, technologies and aspects of crypto. So whether they're outlawed outright or simply just regulated out of existence, um, the future doesn't necessarily seem bright for tokens that don't want to um, be friendly with regulators and simply just integrate and follow the rules.
Interesting. And one whirly one is post-clarity. Have you often thought about one of the key prerequisites in there is that no company can hold more than 20% of the supply. What do you think Ripple's game plan is with something like that? I'm aware of the grace period um, that has been awarded to, you know, Tether off the back of the Gemini Act. I think they got like a three-year grace period to get their act in order. I think similar things will apply for clarity, or do you think they've already solved their um, supply issues?
So, something that I've seen documented as a plan, the long-term vision for Ripple and the XRP supply that Ripple holds is that they would like to get their holdings to at least 25%. And with that um, key aspect of the Clarity Act and the holdings of each crypto company only being 20%, that's not a major shift for Ripple. They would only have to adjust their long-term plans by 5% of their holdings. And essentially they would still be able to continue their operations as they normally would. They would just have to make that slight adjustment. And they already are um, compliant with Gemini um, the Gemini Act and the money transmitter licenses that Ripple has. They're, you know, very flexible with accommodating to different regulations and different laws. That's essentially what their um, I would say their biggest value proposition is, their biggest selling point as a company is that they play by the rules and that they can essentially um, integrate to any form of regulations and they essentially facilitate bank um, compliance with existing regulations. So, uh, Ripple and regulations certainly go hand in hand and they won't have a a difficult time adjusting to any form that the Clarity Act comes out in its final form. And I would say stablecoins like Tether um, and even USDC have a much harder time uh, will have a much harder time adjusting to regulations set by the Clarity Act and the Gemini Act over the long term as um, you know, the supply of these tokens aren't necessarily like Tether, for example, the the backing of Tether isn't necessarily known. And the Gemini Act and the Clarity Act create uh.
Strict requirements around the the resources and supply held within the teller company. And um I would I'm saying that to just outline the fact that Rod is positioned already as the most compliant uh blockchain or Ripple as a company, I'm sorry, the most compliant stable coin. Ripple as a company um has positioned itself as a company that is ready to adjust for regulations to get ready for mainstream adoption of his technology. And um other companies like Circle and Tether have a a more difficult journey on their hands regarding uh adjusting to the Clarity Act reserve requirements.
>> And then final, is there any fun 2026 predictions that you have? I know you kind of outline this is the year of the institutional adoption and it looks rosy. Is there any specific cool prediction that you may have made to the private community? By the way, go check out the smoke room um for all listeners. That's uh Smokes private community that it should be linked through his X profile. Anything you've shared in there that you've uh you you think might happen this year that's cool?
>> That's a very good question. And what I'm truly looking forward to just for this market in general um just breaking out um all-time highs as the total market cap for this space seeing the the total market cap of this space hover around three 4 trillion. Um it's just it's something that I believe is um just a lagging indicator for this space to show how undervalued this space truly is. And from just all the value that is set to come into this space through tokenization, through ETFs, through stable coin usage, the list goes on, I would certainly expect um just the market cap of this space to go to 10 to 15 trillion even this year would not surprise me at all just based on all of the massive developments that's been happening.
A market that goes to 10 to 15 trillion while meme coins are dying, speculative projects are dying, and utility tokens are rising to the top and outperforming, um we're certainly going to see some pretty exciting um significant and I would just say incomprehensible gains with these undervalued networks as the cryptocurrency um the value in the cryptocurrency market truly catches up to other asset classes and breaks all-time highs. As as I mentioned before, this is a new asset class and this hasn't happened in the last 150 years. So, this is just a unique opportunity with just massive upside. And just this year alone, we're going to witness a lot of value come into these public blockchain networks and significantly enhance the value of these the native assets of these public blockchain networks and tokens with the most utility tokens that have relationships with central banks, XRP, XLM, XDC, uh Cardano, Quant, Hideera, XDC. These are all tokens that I'm extremely bullish on and they all have extensive documentations on their integration and that's exactly what we discussed in the smoke room. the the long-term potential, the long-term utility of these tokens and how are we going to strategically position based on the information and data that we're using that isn't necessarily public. And um most of the time they're confidential reports that truly outline the moves of smart money and truly outline just the plans and intentions of institutional investors. And I would just say my um exciting prediction for this space is utility tokens like the ones I just mentioned outperform this entire space. and um just the market cap of the total crypto ecosystem just skyrocketing past $10 trillion. That would be, you know, plenty of exciting developments for me to see as a a long-term holder and researcher.
>> Beautiful and couldn't agree more to be honest. Well, thanks Mo. It's just under an hour. Uh it's been a pleasure to have you back on, brother, and we'll definitely do it again uh pretty soon. Hope everyone enjoyed the show. I know I did. And I will see you all in the next one.