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I talked to a couple of seventh-day adventists the other day on the podcast to try to get a feel for how cult-like the group is. One was an ex-seventh-day Adventist and the other is an active seventh-day Adventist. So, where do they sit? Is it a cult or not? Let's get into it.
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Before we get into it, I want to mention a few things. If you like the work I do and you want to see me continue to do it, you can support me in a few ways. First, you can support me through Patreon. With Patreon, it doesn't really matter what YouTube does. It's basically cutting them completely out of the equation. They can demonetize all day and night. YouTube is supposed to get like 55% of what a monetized video brings in. So if I'm not bringing in money, then YouTube isn't bringing in money. Patreon allows me to continue doing what I do without worrying about what YouTube's doing. Also, you can support me on Teespring. I have a bunch of shirts and stickers and whatnot, so give it a look. There are some other good ways of supporting me if you want to get something back, so check the description for some of my other online stores, like my retro games store.
Okay, let's get into it for real this time. A lot of you guys have probably heard of the BITE model, but I'm coming into this assuming that this is your first video, so let me give you a little primer. The BITE model was written by Steven Hassan. It's an acronym that stands for Behavior, Information, Thought, and Emotional control. It's the ways in which cults control people. There are a bunch of different points under each category, so let's go through the list and see how Seventh-day Adventists match up. I have a scoring system that seems kind of complicated at first, but it's not so bad once you get the hang of it. It's basically a 1 to 7 scoring system, but instead of 1 through 7, I use the Fibonacci sequence. I do that because the gap between points grows bigger each time, and it makes it easier to pick between each one. There isn't usually as much debate and fence-riding. I'll put a little graphic on the bottom of the screen so it's easy to follow along with the scoring system. And one more thing, I usually try to be generous with these because if something is a cult, then it'll shine through whether I'm generous or not. That being said, let's give Seventh-day Adventists a look.
The first category on the BITE model is Behavior Control.
1. Promote dependence and obedience. I don't think they promote dependence much, but they're pretty bad about obedience. Just the word obedience is kind of a loaded term. There's a lot of baggage with it. And Jehovah's Witnesses, for example, are really bad about this one. I'm going with 8 on this because they are bad about obedience, and I'd say they're not completely innocent with dependence considering the fact that they have K through 12 Seventh-day Adventist schools and they have Adventist colleges too.
2. Modify behavior with rewards and punishments. They do have a system within the religion. If you break one of the rules, you lose the ability to do certain things. It's kind of like you aren't a full member anymore. Jehovah's Witnesses have something called disfellowshipping. If you break the rules, censures are kind of like that. I'd call it a system of rewards and punishments. I'll give them an 8. I've seen worse. The perfect example of this is probably Catholics with their penance system.
3. Dictate where and with whom you live. I didn't think this one was terrible at first, but on further investigation, they do have a problem with you living with somebody outside of marriage, for example, or living with somebody of the same sex if you're gay. So this ties into restriction or control of sexuality, which is the next point. I'm giving them a 5 on this one.
4. Restrict or control sexuality. This one is actually really bad, but not horrific. Heaven's Gate, for example, would go around the breakfast table and everybody would report their thoughts and feelings as a way to shame each other into not having them anymore. Not to mention the fact that they believed strongly in castration, and some of them actually went through with it. No anesthetic, no doctor's office. They rented a storage unit and did it to each other. So it isn't that extreme. I'd give Heaven's Gate a 21. I give Seventh-day Adventists an 8 because they still have big problems with homosexuality, for example.
5. Control clothing and hairstyle. This one isn't awful, but again, it's there. They believe in modesty like most churches do, but they go a little over the top with it. I'm giving them a 5.
6. Regulate what and how much you eat and drink. I'd give this one a pretty high number because a lot of foods are banned. They follow the kosher diet in a lot of ways, and actually, lots of Seventh-day Adventists are vegetarians just because it's easier. They heavily discourage alcohol and caffeine and basically any other type of drug like that. I really don't know how you get much more extreme with this for a religion that's this big. I'd give them an 8 because I'd call the kosher diet a little bit more extreme, and I'm sure there are more extreme examples of even that.
7. Deprive you of 7 to 9 hours of sleep. This one isn't really a problem within the religion, though they do have lots of activities and stuff to do. So we'll give them a little bit above a baseline one. I'll say there are 2.
8. Exploit you financially. I'd say they're as bad as Mormons on this one, which is to say they're pretty bad. You have to pay 10% to remain a full member of the church, not to mention the other offerings. So give them a 30. I'd say Jonestown is a good example of full exploitation. Jim Jones was communist, so the members would give all of their money to him, and he'd provide what he thought they needed.
9. Restrict leisure time and activities. You're pretty much expected to only consume entertainment that glorifies God. Some R-rated movies are okay as long as they fit with certain guidelines. I'd put this one really high. I'll say 13. They're very similar to Jehovah's Witnesses in this respect.
10. Require you to seek permission for major decisions. They aren't as bad about this, but it is there. I'll give them a 5.
That's it for Behavior Control. They got an average score of 8. As I've said before, 8 or higher is pretty concerning, and actually, their score evens out to about 7.5, so they're right on the line with this. But having 13s or 21s at all raises a lot of red flags for me.
Let's continue on to Information Control.
1. Deliberately withhold and distort information. This one ties in with dividing information into insider versus outsider doctrine. In a lot of ways, I don't think the church did this from the top down at first, but when you consider the Adventist school system, it's actually a real tangible problem. They alter information being given to people from childhood on to adulthood, not necessarily regular members, but definitely for children, and that's really the best time. I'll give them a 13 for this. If you get them from childhood, you've pretty much got them for life.
2. Forbid you from speaking with ex-members and critics. This one really isn't much of a problem at all. You're allowed to talk to ex-members. They don't really shun it all, though talking to critics is a little more iffy. I'll give him a 2 for that reason, though. Full disclosure, I did talk to an active Seventh-day Adventist the other day about all this stuff, and he was perfectly happy to discuss it, so take that for what you will.
3. Discourage access to non-cult sources of information. They do have their own news network and everything. It's a really elaborate system. Jehovah's Witnesses have JW Broadcasting, which is like a monthly program everybody's expected to watch, but these guys have a much more robust system which acts as something of a propaganda network. I don't know that they discourage outside sources of information much, but they certainly encourage inside sources of information. I'll give them a 3 for this.
4. Divided information into insider versus outsider doctrine. They're actually pretty serious about this one too. For my understanding, the members employ thought-stopping techniques when faced with oppositional doctrines from within the church. Debate isn't necessarily discouraged with people outside the church, but when you're debating doctrine from within, it gets iffy. I'd give him an 8.
5. Generate and use propaganda extensively. This one's pretty high based on the fact that they have an entire news network and everything, not to mention the reading materials and everything else. Jehovah's Witnesses started out as a printing company. I gave them a 21 on this one. It really doesn't get more extreme than that. I give Seventh-day Adventists a 13.
6. Use information gained in confession sessions against you. This one basically isn't a problem at all from my understanding. In fact, this is one of those doctrinal things that they think Catholics get wrong. They think confession is something personal and should stay between you and God because only God can judge. However, if they catch you doing something they disapprove of, there will be repercussions, like being in a relationship outside of marriage. For that reason, I'll give them a 3.
7. Gaslight to make you doubt your own memory. I really can't say this one's a problem at all outside of the school system, but since the school system exists, I'll give them above a baseline. We'll go with 2.
8. Require you to report thoughts, feelings, and activities to superiors. Again, this one isn't much of a problem. Like I said, they don't think you should have to report anything to superiors. They think that's where Catholics get it wrong, so we'll go with 2 because they do still keep track of your life.
9. Encourage you to spy and report on others' misconduct. I'll go with 8 on this one, surprisingly, because gossip networks are very real in this religion. If you mess up in some big way in their eyes, then there will be censures.
That's the end of Information Control. The average score for that one was 6. Not too bad, but again, they had a 13 in there. That's a little concerning.
Let's move on to Thought Control.
1. Instill black versus white, us versus them, and good versus evil thinking. I'd say they're bad about this, but not as bad as some groups. They still think they have the truth, they still think they're right, they still think they're gonna be attacked in Armageddon, but it could be worse. They think even if you aren't a Seventh-day Adventist, you could still make it through Armageddon alive. You could still be resurrected. That being said, I have to give him a higher number. They don't do an us-versus-them thing in the same way as other groups, but they have a strong sense of unity. They all work together. It's like a big family in a creepy way, similar to Jehovah's Witnesses or Mormons in that sense. Not to mention the fact that beliefs are all dictated by the church, so I'm going with 13.
2. Overreaching or exaggerated importance placed on events or ideas. I added this one to the BITE model because I see a lot of this from extremist groups. Jehovah's Witnesses separating themselves from a massive cultural event like Christmas over some perceived ties to paganism and going as far as to avoid buying certain snow globes during the holidays because they don't want to contribute to a pagan institution like that. I think they do this with a lot of stuff. A good example would be their emphasis on the Sabbath, what they are and aren't allowed to do on Saturdays, which, by the way, is when they believe that Sabbath should be. They're really intense about this one, dare I say as intense as Jehovah's Witnesses for different things, of course, but still bad about it. They got a 21 for this.
3. Change your identity, possibly even your name. Though they don't change your name, they do change your identity. They still want you to be Owen Morgan, Seventh-day Adventist, not just Owen Morgan. They want you to assume the new personality, similarly to Jehovah's Witnesses in many ways, so I'm actually going with 5 on their face. When they start talking about religion, if they have glassy eyes, it means they probably had their personality modified through control mechanisms.
4. Use loaded language and cliches to stop complex thought. This does apply in many ways. Some examples of this for Jehovah's Witnesses would be referring to everybody as sister or brother, or with Mormons, you've got terms like Heavenly Father. It's a unique language that other people can understand, but has an extra hidden meaning to Mormons or Jehovah's Witnesses or Seventh-day Adventists. I've heard a few examples of this, so I'm going with 8.
5. Induce hypnotic or trance states to indoctrinate. This is one of the ways in which they think a lot of churches get it wrong. For example, they don't really believe in speaking in tongues as a regular worship practice like Pentecostals do. They think speaking in tongues is a real thing, but it's really uncommon. They think missionaries are randomly granted the ability to speak other languages and understand people speaking other languages. I would say this is a low number. I'll give them a 2.
6. Teach thought-stopping techniques to prevent critical thoughts. They do this mainly in the schooling, and from what I understand, they have the tendency to do this about church doctrine or history. They have cookie-cutter answers for stuff, and you weren't supposed to go past that. The founder, Ellen G. White, plagiarized lots of her writings, for example. Researching that subject is heavily discouraged. There are lots of other problems. For example, she claimed to receive prophecies and revelations, but she was hit in the head with a rock when she was younger. Lots of the symptoms she described line up with a traumatic brain injury or epilepsy, but the church explains it away with the standard cookie-cutter answer and discourages members from researching it any further. I give him an 8 for this.
7. Allow only positive thoughts. They do say people should be positive and happy because your mental state is just as important as your physical state, so giving them a reasonably high number for this, I'll say 5.
8. Use excessive meditation, singing, prayer, and chanting to block thoughts. Again, this ties into inducing hypnotic or trance states to indoctrinate. I don't think they're awful about it, but it is there. I'll give them a 5.
9. Reject rational analysis, critical thinking, and doubt. This one's actually pretty bad, especially if you go through the school system. They're young-earth creationists, so they deny evolution and everything. All the standard stuff, of course. They want their colleges to be accredited, which requires they teach evolution, so they teach it, but they'll "quote unquote" debunk it as they teach it. I'll give them a score of 8 for this.
That's the final point for Thought Control. The average for that category was 8, and they had a single 21 in there. I'm surprised it was as low as it is.
Let's hit Emotional Control next.
1. Instill irrational fears or phobias of questioning or leaving the group. I think this is less of a problem than in other groups. Catholics instill this horrific fear of hell if you leave the group or don't confess, a fear that stays with you until the day you die. People need therapy after that, but it does still happen. Doctrinally, they believe that when you die, you're just dead until you're resurrected, very similar to Jehovah's Witnesses, but if you leave the group, you won't be resurrected. So it's bad, but it isn't as bad as Catholics. I'll say 8.
2. Label some emotions as evil, worldly, sinful, or wrong. I'd say the best example of this is probably Heaven's Gate, who were so completely against love or lust that they were cutting their junk off. They would get a 21, but Adventists aren't great about this either. I'll give him a 5.
3. Teaching emotion-stopping techniques to prevent anger, homesickness, or other emotions. The best example of this one would be a Mormon missionary where they send them off to a foreign country, and up until recently, they were only allowed to communicate with a family member twice a year. They try to completely separate you from your family and make you reliant on the church. I wouldn't say Adventists are that bad about it, but it does happen. I'll give them a 5.
4. Promote feelings of guilt, shame, and unworthiness. Catholics are by far the worst about this again. I don't think Adventists are as bad as Catholics. I'll say 8.
5. Shower you with praise and attention or love bomb you. I think this one exists, but I think the sense of family that's created with the church is really the problematic part. They bring you in, and you all work together. It's very intense. Love bombing happens to a lesser extent, but because of the extreme sense of oneness, I'd give them a 13.
6. Threaten your friends and family. This doesn't really happen almost at all. It doesn't have to be physical threats like Scientology. It can be the threat of taking friends or family away from you or the threat of losing your job or something, but even in that context, I don't think it's extreme. I'll go with 2.
7. Shun you if you disobey or disbelieve. This really doesn't happen at all. I mean, it happens a little bit, but as I said before, I had a discussion with an active Seventh-day Adventist and an ex-Seventh-day Adventist in the same chat. They didn't seem to have a problem with each other, so I'll say 2 because I'm sure the cultural element is still there in some churches, it just isn't heavily enforced from the top.
8. Teach it there's no happiness or peace outside the group. When I hear this one, I think about Catholicism or Jehovah's Witnesses or even Mormons, who say people who leave just want to sin, they're really living miserable lives, but they have no other way of coping with the pain but to do immoral things. I don't think it's terribly strong here, but it is there. I'll give them a 5.
So that's the last category, Emotional Control. The average on that one is 6. So the overall average score for this group is 7. As I said, any group that has 8 or higher or a 21 on any point is a concern to me. Thirteens also raise alarm bells. The strong sense of unity, the extreme importance they place on things like the Sabbath or their diet, the fact that they're taught how to shut down when certain subjects are discussed like critical information about their founder, all raise alarm bells. I would be very cautious with this group, but they do have one thing going for them at least: shunning isn't baked into the doctrine, so take that for what you will.
So that's the Seventh-day Adventist scorecard. I think the fact that they're young-earth creationists would be more than enough to rule them out for me, let alone the stuff I mentioned a minute ago. We didn't address their doctrine much, but it gets strange, and it's oddly similar to Jehovah's Witnesses. I've explained the reasons for that before, but I might do a whole video on the history of Seventh-day Adventists and why they're so similar to lots of churches formed in the 1800s, so keep a lookout for that in the future.
Anyways, that's all I've got for you. As I said, if you like the work I do and you want to see me continue to do it, you can support me in a few ways. First, you can support me through Patreon. With Patreon, it doesn't really matter what YouTube does. It's basically cutting them completely out of the equation. They can demonetize all day and night. YouTube's supposed to get like 55% of what a monetized video brings in, so if I'm not bringing in money from YouTube, then YouTube isn't bringing in money. Patreon allows me to continue doing what I do without worrying about what YouTube's doing. Also, you can support me on Teespring. I have a bunch of shirts and stickers and stuff, so give it a look. There are some other good ways of supporting me if you want something back, so check the description for some of my other online stores, like my retro game store. Also, check out my retro game channel. I talk about all kinds of retro game-related stuff on there. I talked about Mario Kart 64 recently. I also reviewed two of the rarest games for one of the rarest Nintendo consoles in history, the Virtual Boy, and soon I'm coming out with a video called "How Nintendo Created Their Biggest Competitor" about how Nintendo totally screwed Sony, which motivated them to push forward in the video game market with the PlayStation 1. I also have a podcast where I talk about all kinds of interesting stuff, including but not limited to gaming, religious, and cult news, so give it a watch. All links are in the description, as always. Okay, thanks for watching, guys.
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