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So, Mondo, I I want to set the record straight here because I've been catching a little bit of flak from some of the things I've been saying and I want to apologize to some of you out there um for, you know, basically stating and we'll get into what I said. Um I'm sort of retracting that.
And the reason why we're talking about this is you actually um were the were the person who pointed me to first Timothy 4 verse one and I just went wow finally we have an answer but there are two camps. >> There are two camps when you look at the scripture and what it can mean. So I will recite 1 Timothy 4:1 because it's now part of my wheelhouse. So the spirit expressly states that in the latter days some will depart from the faith giving heed to seducing spirits and a doctrine of demons. So I took that and ran with it from my perspective and said you know so much for eternal security and some people have freaked out about that. Well, there's two ways of looking at this scripture and I want you to unpack that for us please.
So in the sense of the different perspectives when you come to first Timothy 4 one camp is going to say here's an example of somebody departing from their faith right like and then the other is going to go well well the whole not so fast citizen using your phrase right so the I think the challenge here when you look at the context is is is this speaking about a holistic departure when it says the faith is it talking about the entire embodiment of my personal faith that I have and I'm departing and walking away from it I think and that's just always the battle. So in that particular context, you're going to have different perspectives on that verse for sure. But we do know that it's interesting that um people have walked away from their profession. Why would that be any different in the last days, right? They've talked ever since Jesus in the book of Acts, we have people walking away from their faith. You know, and Jesus says the disciples in John 6, they followed him no more. So you always have people walking away. So I find that a little bit problematic that it would only be in the last days. But nevertheless, there is something interesting happening in the last days. And we can unpack it more if you want. >> Yeah.
Well, when it talks about seducing spirits doctrine of demons, I the late Russ was this is one of his go-to scriptures. What bothers me is because of the um unveiling, if I can use that word, of the whole UFO phenomena, the uh admission by our government that the phenomena is real. I mean, here here are the here are the testimonies. Here are the reports. Here's the grainy photographs. You know, here's the the orbs going in and out. Here's the tic tac. I mean, it the gimbal. All these different UFO events, they're real. So, we are living in an unprecedented moment in history. And I just wonder, this is my question. I just wonder if we're being set up for something where a mile wide craft or several mile wide craft appear over the cities of the world would that in in my opinion it would cause some to depart from the fate where >> Yeah.
Well see so uh I I totally agree with that. I think um the question would be you know in theology oftenimes people say hey brother you have the right theology you just have the wrong verse. Okay. Right. So your theology is correct. And so to me when I put 1 Timothy 4 uh something is happening at the last days and uh it is connected with doctrines of demons. It says it there and it goes on to give a couple examples. But the the fact is that I think by application for sure what you're describing is going to be true because you know again I don't I believe from God's perspective this is my viewpoint of what I see in scripture. If someone is truly saved God says that person I love them. They have I've saved them. They've passed from death into life. John 5:24 5:24 they will always be saved because Jesus is faithful. Jesus said I will lose none. Okay. But what you have though in our world and this is the the especially pastorally speaking every Sunday I pastored for years and years and people are in the church. They come every Sunday and then five years later they end up departing from the faith and they're like me. And you're like >> why and how? And and so but when I look at them I often will be like well did they ever really have faith? I >> we don't know. >> We don't know. And so in one sense this is where when you bring in the wholeness of scripture is in Titus 1:16 Paul says there are those who profess to know God but in their works they deny him. So there's a contradiction there. We see in Matthew 7:21-23 Jesus says many will say to me in that day Lord Lord I did this and they had different works. And Jesus says, "I never knew you. Depart from me." So here again, you have what I think is going to happen going back to this is I think by application of 1 Timothy 4 that there are going to be those many people who profess to be Christians. They're casual Christians, nominal Christians, whatever you see in the South, the Bible. Yes. Exactly. Easter Christmas Easter only. >> Um that when that happened, they're going to go, "You know what? I I I wasn't always sure. I mean, I was kind of a Christian because it was a hedging my bets, but now clearly not. I'm not buying anymore because this is this is in front of me because that's not faith. Faith walks is not by what we see, right? >> But they're going to see potentially ships or whatever and they're going to be like, I guess it's true. And they're going to depart from their profession of faith. That's the way that I would say it. >> Okay. >> For sure. >> Fair enough. Right. >> Yeah.
I just think we're, you know, to to kind of put a cap on this thing, we are in uncharted waters. Yes, >> we really are. I mean, for the first time in in human history, this is it. Yes, they visited before. I get that. But you've got governments now and and film and everybody's admitting that the phenomenon is real. I mean, this is, you know, if Trump stands up on a Friday night, what happens with that and says we're not alone in the universe? Your thoughts on that? What, you know, that's not disclosure, but it kind of puts a bow on where we are. I I think there's going to be um within the church again, you have the again theologically people will talk about the the visible church. That's people showing up on Sunday, believers and unbelievers, right? You know, just because someone claims to be a Christian as Jesus said, doesn't mean they are. Okay? But I don't read people's hearts either. I don't know. But I I do think when that potentially happens, which we think that's where it's going, there are it's going to cause a lot of trouble in the church. >> I agree. and th those that are on the periphery or those that are not solid in their foundation theologically or biblically specifically, they're going to struggle. They're and they're going to go back and forth. But you bring this verse up all the time that during the tribulation period, Jesus said in Matthew 24, if it was possible, >> right, even the elect, >> even the elect. But what he's saying there, according to the way the Greek is written, it's not possible. But the deception is going to be so grand that it's going to sift out those that are elect. Again, elect is from God's perspective. Um, it's going to sift out those whom God knows that are his and those that are not. And those other people are going to allow themselves to be deceived because and the main thing is not look as a as a teacher, as a Bible teacher, you are too. All my doctrine is not 100% true, but what I do have right is Jesus. And so that's what the point is that during the tribulation period they are going to um the deception that's going to happen is going to be about false Christs and false messiahs which is in the context. And so they're going to come these people who not the elect they will never lose their faith in Jesus as being the Messiah. But these other ones they're going to fall hook land and secret to this false messiah this antichrist that's there. So as you see all that happen the deception is going to be huge. People are going to be faltering left and right. They're yeah I was a Christian this and that. But I remember the to me I land at 1 John 21:19. He he says, "Well, there we have people that are with us, but we have people that have departed from us." Well, the reason that they departed is that they were never really of us. >> So, and so that's what I think that what what we're going to see happen is probably before, but I don't think we'll see it in the tribulation because we won't be here necessarily, but we're going to see that that separ separating of those that profess and aren't very deep. There's a phrase I came up with a couple of years ago and it's it's a very comforting phrase. We go up, they come down. When we go up, they show up. And maybe this is the the show where I'm I'm retracting a lot of things. But I mean, I am I'm kind of scratching my head and going, well, what if what if it doesn't work that way? What if they show up and we're here for a period of time and and we're not budging, you know? No, I I get we know who you are. We're not buying this thing even though the whole world is rushing after them. Maybe this sets up the one world government, warm world religious system. We don't know. That's conjecture. Will there be persecution? There could be. But at some point in time, we're going to go up before the tribulation. What are your thoughts on the reverse of that? They come down and then we go up. >> Well, um I think that as and I know you know this that we all hold things loosely, right? >> Very loosely. Um, but I think what that that concept is is worthwhile because but I I think in fact it will elevate it. So let's say that they come down and they stick around for a while while we're around and then of course the church is going to go through it's it's it's eb and flow but we're going to stand strong on the gospel and then imagine that last three months six months and we are going to be become increasingly labeled as fools. >> Exactly. Because >> y >> yeah we're off. We walk by faith not by sight. Again 2 Corinthians 5:7. So the fact of the matter is if it comes to a point where you see it worldwide, the problem is these renegades and then the tension is building and building and building and then they decide, you know what, we're we're going to remove them. And then instead of it happening so quickly, now it happens as at a greater witness and they remove quote quote they remove us. We go up into the clouds um in in the rapture. They and then of course they're going to be here left to take credit for it and to give an explanation for it. So in fact to me it seems that it would be more powerful for their message for for us to be coincide with them >> for a while. And there's a track that we have which act it's channel information and and this is you know this is from an entity coming through this woman you know it's either automatic writing or voice to skull and in that tract this is channelneled information or forbidden to do this but this entity says there is a potential for many people to leave the planet in an afternoon. The people who leave the planet during earth's changes drum roll do not fit here any longer and they are stopping the harmony of the earth. I mean the other side of the aisle has explained the way the rapture of a church. Your thoughts and thanks for joining us. >> Yeah, it's good to be here of course and and I think you and I have talked about this where the most powerful thing that that that I see is the a visible departure, not an instantaneous. We're not disappearing. >> We we go up >> that we go up and it it reminds you of Jesus's ascension. Yeah. >> Reminds me of Elijah's ascension witnessed. And then you come to Revel 11. The key is Revelation 11 because here you have the two witnesses first three and a half years of the tribulation. They die. They're three days enemy their enemies are happy. But it says then God resurrects them and they went up into heaven while their enemies watched. To me >> very telling. >> That is super powerful that you have this this agenda, this idea of from the grays or whatever that they show up as potentially. And they're saying, "See, we're getting rid of them." And they and there we go. and and every eye will look. >> Every eye will see. To me, that's extremely powerful as why? Because of second Thessalonians 2, >> Satan will come with all signs align. >> All power and sign. Yeah. So, to me, it's a matter of deception. Does so to see us be removed visibly would showcase that power. And then, of course, the light is gone. We're the we're the salt and the light of of the world. And we're gone for however long that I mean, we're gone. And then people will be getting saved after darkness to sarness. Yeah. How do people get a hold of you? I know you've got books out, but you're the co-host of Prophecy Watchers. >> Yep. If you just go to prophecywatchers.com, uh from there you can see all of our uh all the stuff that we do, especially on YouTube. We have a a good following there as