Norm Macdonald on The Howard Stern Show 2016

Norm Macdonald has written a memoir that everyone is talking about. Norm, you honor me with the suit and tie. Yeah, look at him. It's Norm. Uh, normal, respectable Norm. Norm, you are so great. I miss you. I do. I, I love you, baby. I miss you. All right, okay. I love when you come on the show. I love when I'm on the show, and I'm, uh, uh, loving to be honest. Can I give you a compliment? Many times when I'm feeling down, what I do is I go on, uh, YouTube and I watch you on various talk shows like Conan. When you, like, bust— No, this is the— I don't [ __ ] anybody believe you. And I watch you on these shows, and I have a good laugh.

Oh, that's nice. You're a very good talk show guest. I believe. Well, you know what happened? You know what's a funny thing about talk shows? Because, you know, I've done them for, uh, 20 years. And 20 years ago, when I went on a talk show, you would talk, and then it would just evaporate into nothingness. And now it's forever. It lives forever. And so when you do a great one, you know, you wouldn't slam somebody, and then you're like, "I know." Yeah. And you know what, Norm? That's what I was just talking about before you came in. I mean, I have a, I have a, uh, you know where I'm saying how Cosby is the greatest guy in the world? You know what I mean? And they don't know what year it's from. Yeah. Or anything like that. That's what my friend said about Cosby. And we were talking about Cosby, you know, because we both love Cosby's comedians, right? Sure. And so he said to me, he said, "I think the worst part of the whole thing was, uh, the, uh, hypocrisy." And I said, "I don't think that was the worst part. I think it was the raping. Him being a raper." Ah, you might have won that argument. You're absolutely right. Gang number two. And then the scheming and the hypocrisy was so down low. Did you ever meet Bill Cosby face to face? Where did you— Let me tell you something. I had the greatest Bill Cosby story ever, and now it's not even in the top thousands. Yeah. They took that away from you. Because I'll be telling people the story, I go, "And then he goes, 'Did he rape you?'" I'm like, "No." Yeah. It worked out. He just didn't lay a hand on me. Going back to your initial premise, when you walked in, Norm, and, uh, by the way, the book is called "A Memoir Based on a Truth," based on a true story. You inverted the title. Yes, I did. But I'm trying to figure out what's true and what isn't. So work with me here, okay? Okay. Because we celebrate your book today. Now, Norm, it sounds like a Paul McCartney song. Well, going to celebrate your book today. You, you, uh, talking about talk shows, it's sort of a major theme. And I didn't realize this about you. Here's things I learned about you in the book. Okay. So, I'm not exactly sure what brought you to being a stand-up comic because you described, like, even in school, you weren't the bad kid. Your mother describes you as an, or like, not, you know, like a really well-behaved kid in school. You weren't the class clown or anything like that. Not at all. No. First of all, I couldn't afford the shoes, right? To be the class clown. And what about the red nose? How much does that cost? There was no money in the family. Yeah. No, but seriously, you, you— All right, you can go now. That was a great line. You can't do better than that. The, the, uh, but you weren't that, you weren't that guy, you know? Yeah. And so how do you become, like, "I was the guy that the class clown would be doing his stuff, and I go, 'That guy's hack.'" Oh, you would? Yeah. You were a creeper. You know, you were better. You knew you were better. "That guy's not that funny." But, but here's the thing. I want to say about talk shows with you. The great story is that you decide to become a comic. You're working at it, and you're working. I guess it was in L.A. at this point. Yes. And you have an agent, and you know, you're doing your career. Yes. A Johnny Carson scout, yes, sees you in a club. That's true. And loves you. Thinks you're ready for The Tonight Show. He calls you up and he says, "Norm Macdonald, I want you on The Tonight Show. You'll be fantastic." They even book you on a stellar night. Who were the guests on The Tonight Show for the night you're coming? You guys were having, I think, Steve Martin and Elton John. Is that true? No, this is a true story. Oh, it's not the whole thing is fake. No, it's based on a true story. What is the truth? Were you actually approached by The Tonight Show when you were a young comic? Yes. Well, the true story was, I went to, uh, uh, Los Angeles, California. And Johnny Carson already announced his, uh, retirement, right? And Johnny Carson, as you know, used to be able to anoint comedians. You became an instant financial successor. Nobody has been able to do that since. Even your friend Seth Meyers, right? If you call somebody over, you still manage that much? No, no, no. Okay, we'll talk about it. So I said, so in my mind, as he only had six months ago, I said, "I'm going to be the last comedian to be anointed by Johnny Carson." Right? And, uh, and, uh, then, so Jim McCauley would come to the show, you know, and see me. He's the talent scout for The Tonight Show. Yeah, yeah. And do you know that he's in the audience when they, uh, come? Oh, yeah, yeah. Oh, they do. They announce it. Yeah, they tell you. Do you get nervous when— Yeah, yeah, sure. Right? Because it's a big deal. And then afterwards, one time he came up, he said, "The first time, he said, 'I didn't like it, but I was really drunk.'" Great. It's my whole life. One time I'm on stage, I look over, he's necking with a girl. Oh, my good God. So then finally, he goes, he goes, "Listen," he goes, "you're a Jay comic." And I go, "Well, what's that?" "Name?" Because Jay Leonard was doing it Monday night. Oh, so he's like, "Yeah, you're the, you're more of a Jay comic than whatever that means." "Jay comic" meaning was nonsense, right? So I go, "No, no, I think I'm a Johnny comic. That's what all my friends say." You know, he's like, "No, Jay." And then he's like, "Oh, besides." And then for some reason, he whispers it, he goes, "Jay will be taken over." You know, I know it was in the paper last year, and we saw that. So I, I don't want to be top-secret info. I don't want to be a Jay economy. So anyways, he said, uh, uh, he said, "If you do good on Jay, Johnny will watch at home." You know, which again, again, an audition. It was a lie. Like, you know, Johnny's at home, "Hey, I wonder how Jay's doing." Yeah. Johnny, Johnny, by the way, wanted time off. He wasn't sitting at home watching The Tonight Show. He was on a yacht with bombastic Bushkin and his his wife and his beautiful life, Alexis. I go on The Tonight Show with Jay Leno. I do my set. I destroy. And then I come over, and during the commercial, Jay goes, "It was all right." Okay. Is that what he said to you? Well, here's the thing with Jay. Jay was always the greatest comic. Yeah, yeah. He used to go see him in clubs. Amazing. It was amazing. So, so, uh, he never like really gave it up for you, uh, personally on air. He would, and stuff, yeah. But off air, because he knew he was— Is that a psych-out? Like boxers, how they psych each other out? Like, is it important to Jay to like knock you down in a sense so you don't get too full of yourself? And it's like, "I know guys, we ought to be the best guys, comedians there are." You know, I remember George Carlin said, like, you know, he'd go to clubs and check guys out and see, you know, how they were. So are you into any of that? Do you ever get like that? Like, are you a gunslinger who like says, you know, "Hey, I go to the clubs and I watch these young kids performing, and I go, 'I still am better than them.'" You don't give a [ __ ] about it, right? Which is, I think, your beauty in a sense. You know what I mean? But not physical beauty. Oh, yes. I look like an old Paul Newman. Yes, yes. Yes. Did you ever get to be on the Carson truck? I never got to meet him. And I mean, I never, by the way, on the show. And then I got to meet him personally in person. But I could never say to another radio guy, "Hey, man, that was okay. Your show." You know what I mean? Like Jay's saying that. It's a very, it's a very mean thing. It was just a little, really passive-aggressive. But, you know, uh, I just took it on faith that Johnny Carson was funny. I, I could never see it, you know? Yeah. To me, it was an old, corny guy. Yeah. So to me, it was always, uh, Dave. Anyway, you wanted, yeah, right. They light it up. I ended up doing my first on Dave, and that, that was bad. Well, there was a real bond. But go back. We're going to get to David in a second. But go back to Johnny. So how did you end up meeting him? Well, I was on Saturday Live. The Saturday Live program. And, uh, uh, um, I've heard you talk about this, but, uh, he used to, uh, uh, Larry King used to a bullet point segment thing, yeah, in USA Today, which is a really old journalism style where it was just little bullet points. Well, Larry, Larry is now doing that on Twitter. Yes, that's right. Yeah, yeah. I'm all charged up with that, yeah. So he, you know, it's just, it's a little thing, and then dot, dot, dot, and then a little, a little stream of consciousness, you know? And so, uh, we barely had to parody it because it was already so ridiculous, you know? But it would be like, you know, "I like yellow, but the best color is orange. When you have to see one movie this year, make it Mickey Blue Eyes." I'm not even sure what is that exactly. I've, I've heard that it was a style that preceded him, right? That was like, uh, you know, Joey Adams kind of guys, yeah, that would just, uh, but their one-liners were probably funny. No, no, no. They were no, they were just, uh, they were just, um, interesting. Uh, you know, aside from doing the news on Saturday Night Live, was that one of your most, I mean, the Jeopardy, uh, thing too, which I got to talk to you about. But, yeah, but the, um, but doing Larry King, did you take extra delight in that? Was that something you pitched? I like doing, uh, uh, impressions. One of my favorite things to do. I didn't think you liked doing impressions. Yeah, I did because I can't act. But when I, uh, pretend to be somebody, I put a big mask on me that makes me look exactly like them. You can do it, don't you think that's what acting is though? If you just kind of find someone to base a character on and then just pretend to be them, isn't that what acting is? Well, I think in any, uh, in anything, uh, like in acting, there's probably six guys that are original. As everybody else just does them, right? You know, in radio, there's probably one guy that's an original, and everybody else is doing him. Yeah. Who is that guy? Yeah, it's either Kevin or B. Well, you happen to be on to something. And now it's the great Howard Stern, of course. No, thank you. No one is greater. By the way, I'll return a compliment. Do you know that Chevy Chase says that you are the only, um, other anchor person of Saturday Night Live that got it right, that actually did it the right way? That was very, that was very nice. You know, he said that. I, I did hear that. Yeah. He phoned me after. It was funny. He told me, he said, "I'll tell you what to do." You know, and I go, "What?" He goes, "Forget about that, because I'll tell you the advice is going to change your life." I go, "What is it?" Chevy. Because I didn't know what to do, right? He goes, "Go on NBC, do four specials a year." "What a special?" Because they'll give you a million dollars per special. Like, "Perfect." Oh, this is 1975. Sounds great. Have Joe Namath. You mean after you were dismissed, which was a crime. It really was. And we all speculate why you were dismissed because we, we all buy into the fact that Don Allmeyer, who was the head of, uh, Saturday Night Live or NBC or whatever the [ __ ] he was doing at the time, he was pissed you were doing O.J. jokes because he was friends with O.J. Well, is finally official, murder is legal in the state of California. Do you buy that theory? No, I don't. You don't buy it? Well, I have a, just, I'll just take people at face value, you know? I find it easier. What do you think the face value was? That you weren't funny? Yeah. That he thought it wasn't funny. That's unbelievable to me. You were so good at that news. I was all right. I was all right. You know, I remember a guy that, uh, that, uh, Jim Downey was a genius at Saturday Night Live. He told me when I did the make an update, he goes, "Be careful about Weekend Update because almost no one has done it correctly." And he goes, "It can really convince America that you're not funny when you are." And he cited Brad Hall. Said Brad Hall was a funny guy in real life, right? And, uh, vilified. You know, yeah. It's a tough thing to do, the phony news. It really is. You got to have an attitude, you know? The first thing, it's funny when you say phony news because, when I started the show, they said, "You got to say something at the start, you know, some, you know, like, uh, just plain trace, and you're not, or, you know what I'm saying, like a little signature line." Right? And I said, "What if I just said, 'It's the fake news'?" Because it's not really fake news. Well, it's some real news. It's real news with a twist. Yes. It's not fake with a point of view. So I said, "I'll just call it the fake." And then afterwards, I would keep, I would read in little articles, you know, "Jon Stewart's great, the fake news," you know, right? And it became, my goodness. But are you shocked by how popular the news has become? The, the idea of taking that news segment and doing it night after night, like what Jon Stewart did or John Oliver? It is kind of wild. Do you think back now with all the times you've tried to sort of create your thing on TV, maybe that's the very thing you should have done? Gone to HBO, sat behind a desk for a half hour, put together a crew and do the news. Yeah, you know, that might have been the right thing. Yeah. Right. I mean, honestly, you're so good at it. And why not? Yeah. And you have a point of view. Why didn't you— Howard is very kind to me. I appeared to the day I got fired. I went to David Letterman. And the next morning, I came here. Not here, but I came to you. Yeah. I was upset about that. I didn't, I didn't think he deserved that. But, you know, it's funny when, when Rolling Stone comes out and says, "Oh, Norm Macdonald, number 147." When did you start smoking? Oh, no. I just did this to just to relax. Okay. I quit smoking. No, but seriously, when, when Rolling Stone comes out with a list of who was the funniest, but they put you like that, you were one of the best guys. That was a very funny thing because when I went to the 40th anniversary, you know, I went to the, uh, the party. My friend had a, my friend had a magazine, the Rolling Stone, you know? And he's like, "They listed all the guys." And then I go, "As long as a joke." You know, I said, "As long as I'm trying, I'm trying to pick the person that's, you know, been the, the least known person ever." So there was a British girl once that was on the show for literally three episodes ago, at least. And I just hope I beat Morena Baccarin. No, you didn't beat her. So I go halfway. And then now I'm in shock, you know? So then I remember when the show first started, they had a fellow named George Carlin, who would play the old guy. Yeah, because they figured they needed an old guy. I go, "Well, as long as I beat George Carlin." No, Anthony Michael Hall. Like, I mean, he would probably admit he was not good. I didn't beat three people that never appeared on the show. All right, Larry Metcalf. Oh, my goodness. Who has never, never appeared on the show. Who did you beat? You beat like three people. Uh, well, I don't want to say who I beat. Why do you think that happened? Because I was big. An insult would that be, right? Were you, were you offended by that, or you really don't care? I don't care. But, you know, it's just one guy. This is what I learned. I didn't realize this, but I just learned this because my nephew does it. He, uh, uh, as a way to make a living, he just lives with his, uh, father in the, in his basement. He makes lists, yeah, on the internet. Everything about the internet is hits. How many hits can you make? That's right. You know, when they say, like, "You won't believe what these, uh, beautiful stars look like now that they're old bags." And then you hit them. You know, a list of a bunch of little bags. And so you hit, you end up hitting like 50, 60 ones. So, uh, um, uh, my nephew, right, for some reason, because it's on the internet, you think it has some authority. But no, it's my nephew in his basement. I know. But you have it right. The best one he did is "10 Celebrities That That Went Black But Did Come Back." That's a good list. Who's on that? Leg. But I mean, it is really bad for them. It's true. Don't we tend to see these things like Rolling Stone? I think we take them as gospel. Like, like if that makes you feel better, there's something wrong with you. Yeah. Because it's some [ __ ] sitting there deciding that you were not the funniest guy. And yet, the, the brilliance of Norm Macdonald was doing the news. The, you know, that's a [ __ ] hard gig to pull off. And also the Jeopardy sketch and Larry King, that was alone, put you at least, at least in the top 20. Come on. Quentin Tarantino. I could do some, I could do some impressions. Nobody else could do. Can you do Quentin Tarantino? How do you do him? I don't know if I can do him anymore. But, uh, um, anyways, Howard, the thing is, okay, about, uh, about Pulp Fiction, okay? Because I had to figure out who was the best, the best guy for it, okay? So, you know, I had to look into my bigness shaping head. If I figure it out, okay. It's like Tom Arnold. He's that nervous kind of, you know, when you're around Tom Arnold, you get nervous for him. How are you, Robin? You look pretty. Thank you. I can't believe you're, uh, you're working on a Quentin Tarantino. I wonder if you guys actually working on that. But, but, but getting back to talk shows, the way I look at it is, yeah, here you were, a guy, you didn't get on Carson. No. And Letterman was your guy. And the reason was, my career guy. I mean, yes, I saw three original things in my entire life. I'll say that right now. Go ahead. You, Mr. Letterman, and Saturday Night Live. And I remember one time a guy said to me, you know, he goes, "I don't like Stern." You know, he goes, "He's original, but I don't like him." And I go, "[ __ ] you know how hard." You know, there are a few originals there are in the entire [ __ ] history. You know, people ask me about stand-up comics, it was good. I go, "Well, the last good guy was was was Kennison." And he was the last original comedy voice. It was amazing. That there was, by the way, Kennison. I didn't realize this. You talk about Kennison in your new book. Oh, yeah. Uh, Kennison, you used to, uh, perform with him. That was your era when you were working in clubs? Yeah. Well, I was after him, but I got very lucky because he, he, uh, he couldn't get that much work in the United States. And so he'd come to Canada, where you were, you know, you're from Canada. So he would work with him because of liking Jimmy. And he took me across the country. Were those crazy days? I mean, crazy. Did you get caught up in the whole drug scene? I watched. I mean, I couldn't believe how much he could do. I know. You know, all these guys, Kennison, Farley. I never thought they died because they, they seemed invulnerable to, uh, their constitution was so, I mean, imagine if they didn't do drugs, they would have lived for a thousand years. They were like, they were like vampires. Exactly. But Kennison, the funniest, because before he was famous, he had that still did the scream. Yeah. And so, before he was famous, it was very shocking to people, you know what I mean? And one time we were on an airplane, we're going to Winnipeg, you know? And, uh, the guy goes over the loudspeaker and he goes, you know, "This is your captain, Captain Johnson." And Kennison goes, "Oh, no, not crash shots. Not crash shots." So you, but you meet Kennison in Canada because he can't get work in the United States, which it's hard. You know, that's when people go, "Oh, some guy's an overnight success." They don't realize that a guy like Kennison had to work so goddamn hard to get there. And I'll tell you how brave this guy was. Everybody talks about Bill Hicks and stuff like that, you know? Bill Hicks is the kind of guy he'll go on stage or Janine Garofalo and go, you know, "Oh, multinational oil companies are bad." You know, I can't get a laugh. But Kennison, I, he would walk the rooms. And this is why he'd walk the rooms because in a comedy club, it's all made up of either married people or people on dates, you know what I mean? So Kennison would go, "You know who's on a date here? You know who's engaged?" And then somebody would point out, you know? And then he'd go up, he'd go, "Don't get married. Look at this face." And so here he was. I said, "I go, this really is brave. He's, you know, he's challenging everything they believe in, you know, right to their face, right an inch from their face." Right. He was, he was bold. That's, that's, uh, that's, you know, saying there is no God. Isn't that [ __ ] right brave? When you work with a guy like that, and this explains this to me because you talk about this in the book. A guy like Kennison would get paid to clear the room. Well, this was, why would they pay him to clear the room? Well, there's a great, uh, great guy I started with who was, his name is Mark Breslin. And he owns all the clubs in Canada, right? And he's a great, great man. And he taught me, "Just do whatever you want." You know? And his own act was crazy and filthy. And so he had this thing with Kennison where he said, "You know, if you walk everybody in the room, if everybody leaves, you get a bonus." And so, yeah, I only saw him do it twice. It's hard to get every single person, right? But I saw him do it twice. Empty the club. And, you know, then that's how people, you know, audience members, I guess they just have to be told, you know, because once Rodney had him on, then everybody loved him. They were told that he was, he was great. By the way, people don't know this about you, and I'm still going to get to my point about Letterman. But early on in your career, this is why you got to read Norm's book. Norm, oh, it's available, by the way, in bookstores. It's available in bookstores. And, uh, "Based on a True Story," a memoir. McDonald's Memoir. How long did it take you to write the book? Forever. Books are shoplifted, right? How long did it, uh, take you? It was supposed to take me a year, but it took me four. Wow. Why? Well, I bit off a bit more than I could chew. Aaron. Yeah. I tried to do things I've always tried to do things that I'm proud of. Yeah. I've always wanted to be the best stand-up comedian in the world. And, uh, when somebody came to me and said, "You want to do a celebrity memoir?" I said, "Here's a chance to do the best celebrity memoir of all time." Because the bar is pretty low. Yeah. I'll tell you, when you look at your life though, you know, and you really think about it, you know, and you go, "What do I do anyway?" You know, in my life, God's sakes, I get up, I, you know, I, uh, you know, I do, uh, 200 crunches. You know, yeah. I, I eat Captain Crunch. Right. Oh, I get you. But, but, you know, you don't do much. Yeah. As a matter of fact, I contend mostly you search for and consume food. Right. You're not that much different than like a caveman. God damn caveman. God damn it. But hey, this is what I thought of yesterday because I was in the theater, of all places, and I thought, you ever hear that the expression, "You can't yell fire in a crowded theater"? Yes. I thought, "What if there's a [ __ ] fire?" So what happened? You gotta test that theory out. Yeah, you could do that on stage as a joke. When you say on in your book that that the greatest gig you ever had was at a hospital for the criminally insane? Yes. I did a hospital for the criminally insane. Now, is that a joke? No, that's a true story. My agent, uh, when you were in Canada, these are the early years, yes, sir. And you go to your agent booked you in a hospital for the criminals. Well, he booked, he didn't tell me that, though. He said, "I'm booking you in a hospital." And you go there, you don't make any money, but it's a good thing to do. So I said, "Oh, that's, that's be nice." You know, there's no pain involved. No. Oh, Jesus. But, you know, you give back, you know what I mean? Yeah. You're right. So you go to a hospital. Yeah. I go to what I thought was a hospital. And, and I get there, and this barbed wire and armed guards. And I go, "What kind of a hospital is this?" And anyways, it turns out to be a hospital for the criminally insane. And then I was like, "Good God." I mean, I told the guys that I don't even know if these guys deserve a show. I mean, you know, I mean, when I heard hospital, I was, I was thinking of, uh, of sick people. Sick people. People you want nothing to do with. I wasn't thinking of, uh, of, you know, people that are in better shape than I, you know, that slaughtered their loved ones and so forth. Did you, did you do a scan of the room? And did you, were there like, literally, there are people there who like kill their family members and they've done criminally insane things? Well, I'll tell you, the sad part was, it, if the Gatlin Brothers were there, the week before, they had like, I couldn't believe the room. What is this hospital? Beautiful room. Like one of the best rooms I've ever seen. How does this hospital get all these top acts to show up? Well, they pay a lot of money. Yeah. But, uh, Gatlin Brothers, you know, I'm sure it's a room full of people who like, kind of thought, wasn't full. Oh, you mean if he was not standing, it was for the Gatlin Brothers. The guy kept, uh, reminding me because only 11 people were there. And he was like, "Good God, there's 700 criminally insane people here." I mean, I'd be scared. I would actually be scared. Well, I was a little frightened. There's a girl. Full set. There's a great, uh, uh, there's a great, um, Johnny Cash at Folsom Prison, you know, where he performs at Folsom Prison? Yeah. And if you watch it, it's hysterical because, uh, he starts the show and he goes, you know, "I just want to do my songs. A man backstage told me that I should do them in a particular order." And I said, "I'll do them in any order I want." Yeah. I would love to say I did. Yeah. But you did not. Uh, no. I did. Yeah. Why not lie? Now, early on in your career, you do anything to make it. You would do anything. Well, I mean, you were in a male hooker. No, no. But, but, but you went on Star Search. Yes, sir. Um, and in fact, this is a great story because you lost to a Liberian comic. You wore a, I remember, a tribal robe and a tribal hat. And he talked about, you know, lions and cheetahs chasing them and stuff. And he beat you. He, oh, he beat me. Oh, he beat me. But you got four stars out of four. Right? And I got, uh, three quarters of a star. Is that true? Yes, it is true. Isn't that what it adds up to? I figured it out mathematically. Three guys gave me one star. One guy gave me zero stars. And I'll bet you anything it was that son of a [ __ ] of a Robin Leach. Isn't that a weird concept? Like when you go on Star Search and you know what? Some people would get crushed by that. Like they would give up their career thinking, "Gee, I lost on Star Search. I suck." But like, that doesn't phase you. You kind of know it's a [ __ ] up situation. You're being judged by Robin Leach. Yes. And there was already a history of, uh, Star Search where, you know, the better person usually wasn't the winner. That's true. But Dennis Miller, nice guy, because he passed your name on. You know, there's people in your career who have been generous. Very, very. Like Adam Sandler. I read that, you know, he recommended you, I think, to Lauren Michaels or something. You said, "Watch him on Letterman." Dennis Miller says to Ed McMahon, "You've got to have my friend Norm Macdonald on Star Search." Which was really nice. And it's not, he wasn't my friend. I mean, you know, he was just, uh, he was just a generous, nice guy. And, you know, managers and agents, at least in my case, yeah, never gave me anything. But my friends, uh, uh, you know, I don't know. I don't think I do it as much as they do too for me. But, right. But I, I, I, you know, I believe in loyalty and saying, you know, uh, nobody makes it alone. You know, nobody's self-made. You know what I mean? Right. I mean, um, would you like, who do I like? Didn't you like Joe Pine or something? I like Bob Grant. Who's that? Was the guy. Bob Grant. I like. Yeah. Well, I used to listen to him with my father. Yeah, yeah. But you're probably as close as they would come to a self-made entertainer. Well, I mean, you didn't have guys going to bat for you. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. There was nobody on my screen. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. People hitting me with that. But, you know, you talk about people going to bat for you. You, uh, you meet Rodney Dangerfield early on in your career. You know, you have the Star Search and all that stuff. But then, you know, you're going to The Improv, you're going to The Comedy Store, you're working at your craft. And you become friends with Rodney Dangerfield. And you said you learned a great lesson from Rodney. And I believe this to be true. You learned that success and money mean nothing because Rodney was miserable. Oh, yes. He used to say, "The heaviness, the heaviness." Right? I mean, he had a tough, his parents actually hated him, right? Like, I didn't realize that. But, Rodney Dangerfield, you know, I saw one time a rose was Rodney Dangerfield. And I was like, "Where are his contemporaries?" You know what I mean? It was all like young guys, Kennison, and and Dice, and these guys that he founded and put on his things. But I didn't see any of his contemporaries. And it's because he had this odd life where he, you know, they made it, and he didn't. He was angry. He had to wait. And he was very angry. He didn't make it. He didn't have success till he was in his late 40s. Yeah, yeah. And it pissed him off. It pissed him off because he liked the, he was one of those old-timey, you know, the booze and the broads, you know, right? And, uh, he taught me a real funny thing, though. Uh, I, I don't know if he ever did this as a joke or if he just told me, but he was going into the hospital. He had a heart, uh, thing and a brain thing at the same time. That's a goddamn [ __ ] right. If you got your, if you got an operation that involves both your heart and your brain, you're not going to be around that much longer. Yeah. So I said, "Rodney, you know, one of the doctors say, 'How long? How long do they say you'll be in?'" And he said, "I tell you, Norm, you're all right." Okay. You always said that. And he said, "They, uh, they said, 'If it, uh, if it goes well, they should be out in five or six days.'" Okay. "If it goes badly, I'll be out in 20 minutes." All right. You take too many liberties with the audience. All right, kid. Is that what he said to you? That's the first thing. He give you a critique. It was a good, very good advice. What does he mean? You take too many liberties with the audience? Well, here's the thing. You know, you look at the old, the old comedians, you know, Benny or these guys. And you, you can watch them on YouTube. These guys are 30 years old, you know? They're in suits. They're complete command of the audience, you know what I mean? Right. And, and, and, and, and nowadays, just people [ __ ] around. Yeah, man. I do 30 specials a week, you know what I mean? It's just talking and wandering around. No respect for the audience, in other words. All right. So Rodney was saying, "You take too many liberties. You're just [ __ ] around up there, right, when you should be, you know?" And he believed in, it's not only jokes. Where Rodney, he had the best jokes, first of all. But he talked funny. He acted funny. He looked funny. He put thought into every bit of his persona. Yeah, yeah. Exactly. Exactly. And he told me, "Read as the comment he ever got was Benny came to see him." Right? And then he said, "You know, I have a, I always thought I had a great character." But he goes, "You have the greatest character in the world." "I don't get no respect." Because he goes, "I'm not a single person in the world that doesn't believe that about themselves." Right? They don't get enough respect. Do you think is part of your act? Um, when I see you on stage, is it really you, or is this really a character we're watching? If I hung out with you off stage, would I see a different Norm? Oh, no, no, no, no, no. It's the same way. It's the same guy. Yeah, yeah. Because I don't have any life outside the stage. You don't. I mean, you know, I have great interests that I absorb myself in. What are your interests? My interests? Yes. Well, you know how you have interests? Yeah. You know, you have interests in painting and photography, yeah, chess, so forth. So I have interests in, in backgammon. I have great interest. I used to be a very good backgammon player. You were a gambler. You talk about it in your book, right? I was a gambler. Yeah. But not anymore. No. Uh, well, the similar, but not, not to the, the point where to, you know, um, but those are your interests. I would say reading is my greatest interest of all. What do you like to read? Oh, God. I can read like, uh, you know, uh, 12 hours a day if I got the time. But I just read the classics, you know? I go from, because of so many books, and then a guy goes, "You got to read this book that was written last week." And like, "I don't want to read that, man, because it might suck." Are you a good student? Uh, yeah. But back then, everything was easy. Do you have a high IQ? I don't believe, I don't believe in IQs. Were you always a witty guy? In other words, no. Yeah, no. But were you always able to make things funny? Was it something you had to work hard? When you do your stand-up or whatever, do you work really hard at it, or does it come easily to you? It comes pretty easy. Yeah, it comes pretty easy. How does it work? In other words, you sit at home and let's say, and you're there, and you go, "Hey, here's a funny thought." Oh, never. I never do that. But how does it work? Like how do you stand up a lot? You know, and I never stopped doing stand-up. Do you do it even when you were doing Saturday Night Live? You did stand-up. Yeah. And you do love it. Love it. Yeah. I love it. I don't love traveling. You know, I really don't love that at all. But stand-up and stuff, I love it. You know? So usually I have one, uh, what the way I do it is this. That's how I do it. Yeah. I have a great idea, you know, a real funny idea. And then I'll, uh, work my way toward that idea. I'll just talk, and I have enough confidence in myself that I can stay funny until I get, until I hit the real great idea. Because this is the reason I can't do the same joke word for word like some comedians can, because I don't have the acting ability to sound like it's just coming off the top of my head, you know what I'm saying? So you have 50 ideas in your head, and you'll go up on stage and work through those ideas. It'll never come out the same way twice. Yes. Exactly, right. And I have, you know, I don't do a stand-up specials all the time, right? So I have hours and hours of material, you know, right? So, um, my goal, like, uh, from when I started, is I thought, "I'll just talk to the audience." And whatever they say, I'll have a joke on that. I'll have a funny idea on that subject, right? So that's what I'm doing now. I'm talking to the audience a lot, you know, because I, because I realized at first I was afraid of time in the audience. But if you go to a stand-up show, you know, uh, uh, that's what people remember, you know, is you talking about interacting with the audience. Otherwise, you just see the guy on YouTube. You can just see the guy. So, in other words, you're comfortable enough on stage not to get a laugh? Like, you'll wait until you can just start talking and working through something, and you have enough confidence in yourself that eventually you'll get to a funny line? Yes, sir. Or the audience, you know, see the audience is in a, in a one-on-one situation. Like if I'm talking to you, and you're in the audience, and you're not Howard Stern, you're right, a douchebag sitting in the office. Oh, why is he going to be a douchebag? Because I'm a douchebag. A fine person that spent money and got a, a house sitter. So you're sitting there, right? Yeah. And, uh, then I start speaking with, you know, maybe you heckle me, even, you know, right? And so I start speaking with you. So I yell out, "Trump." Yeah, yeah. Right. People do that. People do yell out just words. They do that. Tolstoy. Yeah. So I will, uh, just talk to the person, and eventually, because it's such an odd situation for them, there's lights and people, they've never been in this scenario situation before, you know, right? And they'll eventually say just a crazy thing, right? An odd, weird thing. And then you just repeat what they say. Everybody laughs. You go home and have a piece of strawberry rhubarb pie. Yeah. And that's how it works. Yeah. It's not that simple. Somehow. I don't think so. All right. Now, what it is, is just repetition. Just do it all the time until it becomes second nature. And you know, yeah. Well, it, you know, it's tough. I didn't know you still like doing it, though. I love doing it. Yeah. So when you know you love doing what you do, no, when you, is that true? Yeah. I mean, I, I don't, I mean, I can't think of anything else I'd rather be doing. But like you, I go home and I think of stuff I want to do on the radio. And then I have enough confidence that I can come in here and pull it off, right? Right. You know what I mean? So I relate to that. Yeah, yeah. But, but, uh, go back to your career because we're celebrating your book. Don't enjoy. I don't think so. No, I think I'd rather be home. Okay. Yeah. Well, I'll think about that. Think about that right now. Take a breath and think about it. A little break. No, no, no. Not right now. Norm's memory. Norm Macdonald's Memoir. They certainly don't bring that to the air. Well, no, I shouldn't bring that to the end, of course. But it is a lot of pressure. And I feel a lot of, um, I want to do well for the audience and all of that. But right now, I want to do well for you. Would you compare yourself to the, to the, the, the, the myth of Letterman's smashing things in his room all by himself? I relate to that. You do? Yeah. I always think I suck. And I always, it's just too much pressure. Well, that's what a perfectionist does, though. Jay was kind of the opposite of that. Yes. Now, that makes for a happier person, too, though, you know? But maybe not as good at their job, right? Right. I mean, I read a, a definition of mediocre, which I didn't know. I was wrong. And when I read it, I said, "Oh, that's an interesting thing." Because, you know, you think of mediocre as just a middling talent, right? You know, it's not the guy's fault he's mediocre, right? But what mediocre really means is a person that is capable of great things but does, uh, I fully believe that. And that's a sin. I believe artists who become great just work harder at it than anyone else. I really do. I mean, painters, things like that. They just work harder. They might have some ability, but they don't have any more ability than anyone else. They're just driven. I think drive is the most important thing. Well, maybe it's passion as opposed to drive. I think it's drive. But passion doesn't do it. But what about responsibility? To obviously, you're the best at what you do. So don't you feel that you have a responsibility to be good? To do that? To take it seriously? Yes. Because you've been given a gift. You, you, you, I owe it to the audience. I've asked them to pay, right? So, yeah. I went to God. But go back to your career. To God. I owe it to God. Or if you don't believe in God, then you owe it to, uh, whatever it is inside you that, uh, that is this, uh, thing that I, that people don't have. That's right. You know, yeah. But going back to the book, because we celebrate Norm Macdonald's Memoir, "Based on a True Story." I don't.

Understand what we're right. What is it? The memoir? The celebrating him? No, it's your memoir. No, what is, what are we talking about here? What's the story? I haven't even been listening for the last time. Go back to your career here. The reason you feel such a connection to David Letterman. I believe Letterman was really good to you, unlike your Johnny Carson's story or even your Jay Leno story.

Um, uh, you relocated to New York. You're performing at Catch a Rising Star. Dave's, uh, guy, Bob Morton, he, uh, spots you and they put you on the Letterman show. Yes and no. Mind games. Dave thought you were funny. He was your guy, right? And, and so how many appearances did you end up making? It don't say this. I will say this, of course. Uh, Dave doesn't see you until you go out and do your, uh, act, right? He takes his, uh, his guy's word for it that you're gonna be all right. But what I found was, you know, because this was when he did 12:30. And when, and what I found was, if I'd been at home watching it, I would have found it hilarious. But when I was the guy, I didn't. And what it was was that he would go like, whoever the other guest was, you know, uh, it was like Jeffrey Tambor or something like that. And he's like, Jeffrey Tambor is with us. And later, Brian Adams. And of course, the reason you've all showed up, Norm Macdonald. And then everyone would laugh, right? At how that's funny. And, uh, so he kept says, hey man, I go, every time he said, I get, I get more nervous, you know, right? And, uh, uh, Louis Anderson told me one time, and I thought it was brilliant. He said, uh, he said, he realized that when you go on the Letterman show, uh, the audience is in on the joke, you know? And, uh, Letterman's in on the joke, and the band's in on the joke, and even the home audience is in on the joke. And you're the joke. Yeah. You can feel like that, right? Yeah. Of course, yeah. And he always called you Norm Macdonald, like he exaggerated your name, whatever it was. But you went on there and you did really well. Yeah. Oh, he drove me crazy. It would always be, Norm Macdonald is here. And I'm like, Old MacDonald is here. I, I don't know what it was. But when you, it was such a genuine moment when you were the last stand-up comic to perform on Dave's show. I guess you got, had you guys formed a, a friendship in a sense? Or was it just strictly business? No, never. But you're never a friend. I was invited, uh, many times to, uh, to go and have dinner with them and so forth, right? And, um, here's the thing, you know, I've, this has happened to me a few times, you know, where big stars invite me to. And then I go, what happens when it's my turn to talk, right? I mean, they have their stories about the time Al Pacino didn't do so well on their show, you know? And then it's my turn and I go, have you ever hear of a fellow by the name, uh, you know? And you got nothing. George Carlin. I know. Well, you can tell your Bill Cosby story, but, you know, it's so true. You are this interesting guy. Dave probably wanted to get to know you. But I relate to what you're saying. When, when someone like, um, Steve Martin, who I idolize, yes, you know, invites me to dinner, I'm very moved by it. But I feel, oh, how could I be interesting? Does Steve Martin done it all, you know? You do get this feeling of insecurity, right? Of course, yeah. Like in, in Los Angeles, you know? I mean, one of the greatest moments ever, it was, I was at the Aspen Comedy Festival. And I hate those stupid comedy festivals. Why? Well, because it's a bunch of allegedly funny people, and you got to be funny, and funny, funny on all the time. It's funny, funny. You're funny everywhere. Yeah. You know, like this is what I think about movies. If you call a movie a comedy, you're already [ __ ] yeah. You're setting up too high expectations. You're right. And one of the funniest movies, I mean, I even told Tarantino this, and that he kind of agreed with me. I think I said, I think your movies are the comedies. Like, I never watch a movie and cry. Or, yeah, right. Like, I just laughed. So because it doesn't have to be 10 jokes a page. So you can have a scene that goes on for five minutes about a guy shoving a pocket watch up his [ __ ]. But you had an Aspen, you to go back to the Aspen. And I meet Chevy Chase, Martin Short, and Steve Martin. The Three Amigos. And they invite me, uh, to, uh, their, uh, suite, you know, one of them had with their wives and stuff. And, uh, and, um, my God, it was the greatest of the night of my life. It was so, so great. Is there a pressure? One happens that you gotta be funny? You had to be funny, right? They weren't going to be funny for me. Well, suddenly you're the fourth Amigo, and you've got to make things happen. Do you feel that pressure when you're in a room with funny guys that you've got to be the life of the party? Not so much. Like, you know, right here in New York City, they have a Comedy Cellar, which is a fantastic, uh, comedy club. But they have one table, you know, you're supposed to go to this table and you have to prove yourself against the other guy. I don't want to [ __ ] that [ __ ]. Yeah. I'm not gonna sell some guy I don't know, you know? Yeah. But you even, you had a situation where, um, it's weird too with comedians that like you can't light a cigarette. He doesn't like it. He doesn't light it. Robin, stop it. No, go back to Letterman for a second because I thought, you know, sometimes with your, um, the way you are, the way you carry yourself, I don't see you as an overly emotional person. And I was really moved, honestly, when unless you were the last stand-up comic to perform on Letterman, you went out and did a set, and then you turned, then you said a couple of heartfelt things, and you were moved to tears. And I was really moved by that because I didn't know you felt that way about Letterman. And you were so complementary to him. And you kind of let down the, the comedy thing, which I thought was so strong because when you're doing stand-up, you know, it's false by nature. Yes. And then all of a sudden, you kind of opened up as to who you were for real. Yeah. And you showed Letterman how much you cared about him. I'd just like to say, I know that, uh, Mr. Letterman has, uh, uh, not for the mockish, and he has, uh, he has no truck for the sentimental. But if something is true, it is not sentimental. And I say, unsure, I love you. Oh. And it was really genuinely moving. And I think it's because you feel like, wow, awesome. It was accidental. I didn't go out there with that place. No, but you wanted to say something. I wanted to say something. I didn't know quite. It was, it wasn't that, right? Um, it was sort of some stupid thing I'd written, you know, that sounded just written and fake. And then when I started to say it, I was like, I was gonna say it. I'll just talk. You know, did Letterman say anything to you afterwards? After the show was over? Or was it, there was no discussion of it? He whispered in my ear or something that you want to keep private, just keep private. But, uh, he said something to you that, that was special, uh, toward you? Yeah. Yeah. Very special. Very special. Because, and, you know, um, the night after that, Bob Dylan, who was also a very holds a special, uh, place in my life, was, uh, also on the show. So that those three days were, were emotional. We're very emotional for me. Yeah. As much as Saturday Night Live holds memories for me, and, and David Letterman, although I have no backstage, uh, uh, experience with him at all, right? Just the things he's talked to me about in between commercials and stuff like that. I, I always felt so, uh, so close. I felt, I really felt like, um, the, the talk about father figures, that he was my father figure. Your own father? Were you not close to him? Oh, yeah. Yeah. But he's just dead. He's dead, right? It's hard to, you know, I started to have him as a father figure when he's a dead guy. But Letterman loves you. I mean, he once said, if we could have Norm on every week, we would have. That, he said something. And then he said, the ultimate compliment, there may be people as funny as Norm, but I don't know anybody funnier. That had a flair for it, right? Yeah. No, yeah. That meant something. That'll buckle your knees. So every time he's invited you to dinner, you've said no? Um, well, he hasn't personally. It's a, it's a group, it's a group dinner, right? You know, which is, which I really should go because then I'm protected, right? No, it's not one-on-one. Wouldn't all be on you? Yes. But, uh, but I always end up in those, in those things at the last second, chicken. And, I mean, for this book, based on a true story, a memoir by Norm Macdonald, right? Um, um, they said, we'll send some pictures. And I didn't have many pictures. I was on Saturday Night Live for five years. I never took a picture. Yeah. Why is that? Do you think? I don't know. I think I, at the time, in the moment, it doesn't seem so special, right? You don't know you'll be writing a book one day and you'll need pictures. Were you able to locate some pictures through your friends or through archives and find some pictures of me and my mother playing, uh, Euchre and hearts and stuff like that? Perfect. But nothing of interest to anyone, you know? But, uh, but they're, you know, I even asked on, um, Twitter because sometimes I'll just, someone I'll just send you a picture, right? You know what I mean? Like, uh, they sent me a picture. The, the, the book starts off with a true story that happened to me when I was in Edmonton in this hotel. I was doing stand-up. And my agent for me said, turn on your, um, your computer here and look at your Wikipedia. And my Wikipedia said I was dead. Great. My Wikipedia said I had overdosed the night before. And I am telling you, Howard, even though you, of course, know it's not true, at first you go, oh, no. But, uh, it shakes you. It shakes you. And you want to know why it shakes? Why? Because you understand that one day, those will be the words, right? And all it is is they just change the tenses. Instead of Norm Macdonald is a American comedian, Norm Macdonald was. Who do you think changed it? Was it? Apparently, you know, any folks can do can go on there, right? Do you think about death a lot? I mean, it does. It is a freaky thing. They say most people can't spend more than like a minute or two actually contemplating their own demise. Yeah. Like it's almost impossible for a brain to do that. Well, that's interesting. And then, you know, I guess that's why you do anything is to, to avoid that, you know? That's why you do stuff in life. That's right. To avoid that, that thought. Because if, you know, well, I mean, we don't want to talk about that. Well, let's talk about this. You do Letterman? Yes, sir. And, uh, Sandler tells Jim Downey, who's from Saturday Night Live, a watch Norm set on Letterman, which was really nice of Sandler to do such a kindness. And then this guy, Jim Downey, recommends you to Lorne Michaels, right? And then you get the gig. So you don't have to audition? Or did you? I didn't. No, no. Because they used your Letterman set. Wow. And they just call you out of the blue and say, hey, you're going to join the cast. Well, he said, you have to write two sketches, do two celebrities, and do two characters. And so I said to Lorne, great, uh, are you paying for the trip back home? Because I knew I couldn't do it. And Lorne always got a kick out of me because he knew everything about show business, and I knew nothing, right? And I didn't want to waste his time, you know? Most people are take the opposite attitude. I'll come up with something. I couldn't. But I'm not a, I'm not a performer, you know what I mean? I mean, in a way, stand-up is is the worst, uh, training a person could have to be an actor, you know? If you're on the Groundlings or the, then you're talking to other people. But if you're a stand-up, the, the audience is your enemy. The audience is there to be, you have to either seduce them or cajole them or something, right? To keep them in your, in your, in your iron fist, you know? And that's no way to be as an actor. Yeah. You know what I mean? So, so it doesn't train you to be an actor at all. And, uh, and nowadays, because I think, but it was probably cause he was the first actor to, to first stand-up, I mean, to have a show. But in the old days, and, you know, movies, great comedies in the old days, well, they wouldn't start Georgie Jessel, no Milton Berle. It'd be Jimmy Stewart, be Cary Grant, guys who could act, who could act, right? And I remember being in movies or TV shows and thinking up ideas and I go, God damn, I can't do this. But he could do it, and I could direct him to do it. I could tell him how to do it. You're so right. That's why I like Don Rickles. They could never figure out what to do with him on TV because they try to put him in these shows, and it was hard because he wasn't necessarily an actor. No, he was more of a, you know, he was a comic, right? That's why do you keep saying he was, he's still alive? Oh, that's right. That's right. I forgot. I'll tell you one thing. I'll check his Wikipedia. Yeah. I'll tell you one thing where you might think that the end is coming near, yeah, when, uh, on Spike TV, they have a, um, a show called The 93rd Birthday of Don Rickles. It's 93rd. Oh my God. Doesn't that mean, can they, you're not going to make it to another round number? Yeah. You're supposed to do that when he's 95. Yeah. They're not wasting any time. So you talk about your time in the book about Saturday, the book based on a true story, yeah, Norm Macdonald's memoir, based on a true story, yes. Um, the celebration's wild. Did I ever shoplift? Yes. God damn, isn't that thrilling? Yeah. It was horrible. I hated it. Oh, you didn't watch a little kid and a bunch of my friends were doing it, and they all dared me, and I stole a tie tag from Macy's, and I felt like the biggest [ __ ]. And my cousin was with me, and they were all encouraging him to do it, and I felt awful. That and I took him, and I got him out of there, and we left. And it's about, I'd never do it again. And right after I left, they all got caught by the police. Wow. And got in big trouble. So I had a thing, this I still like think about this, and I'm very proud of it. But I, I shoplifted. Me and my two friends, Randy and Sean. I won't say their last names, right? That's right. So, uh, uh, Randy steals a, a KitKat bar, right? I go in, I steal a fountain pen. Sean's sister, and he doesn't steal anything, right? So like, what the hell? It was like a little strip mall. So we beat him up. Yeah. We were only eight, you know, he couldn't beat him up too much. And the, the lady from the shoe store comes out, witnesses it. And, you know, it's a big thing. So, uh, I get home. It was just terrifying, you know. I go in, my dad is sitting there, my mom and my dad, you know, has a frightening man. So I sit across, and he goes, what happened? Did you do it? And I go, no. And he goes, uh, he goes, you didn't do it. I say, I, I say, I can prove I didn't do it. And he says, how's that? I said, we'll go back there right now. We'll go up to the lady at the front, and she will tell you that I bought that ballpoint pen, you know? And so, uh, we went back, and I was sweating, you know? And, uh, we, uh, we went, we asked the lady, and she said, I'm sorry, I just, I can't remember everything that happens, you know? And it was exactly what I hoped would happen. Yeah. And you're so proud of them. And he believed me. Yeah. Because why else would I say? Yeah. But go, go to Saturday Night Live for a second here, because it's funny. It's funny the things that you're proud of or that affect you so much when you're a child, right? You know, did you ever have, uh, when your parents didn't believe you, but you were telling the truth? Yeah. Moments like that? Yeah. That would happen and you still think of them? Maybe a little bit sometimes? Yeah. Oh, yeah. I think, I think about my childhood all the time. Yeah. I'm at the psychiatrist all the time. Oh, that's what psychiatrists are. Yeah. You don't go to the psychiatrist? And I've gone a few times, you know, I mean, I went for the gambling, you know, right? First of all, some of them are like, so how much is your bet? They're all excited. Yeah. Right. That's not a good psychiatrist. But I remember one lady, she said, you, uh, you gamble, uh, to avoid, uh, uh, you know, life. And I said, well, that's why everyone does everything, you know what I mean? You're just trying to get through it. Yeah. You're just trying to get through the day. But with your gambling, though, you even say you, you would do like a million dollar swing, right? Like, in other words, you would talk about big bucks. And you, and it didn't bother you if you lost? You'd say, hey, I'm gonna lose everything. And I'll, and you have lost everything twice. Twice. I lost everything. But I will say this, you know, when you lose everything and you go to that coffee shop and you get yourself a cup of coffee, feel clean? Is that, come on, give me the truth. That's the truth. You weren't scared out of your brain when you lost everything? No, no, no, no, no. That's where you should be. What do you mean? That's where you should be. With nothing but, but your wits and your, you know, you're gonna get back. But you like starting over. You don't know that you're gonna. I mean, well, when you talk about you lost everything, was this like post Saturday Night Live? No, no. I had a job, so I, so I never lost anything in that, in that sense, right? No, but I mean, you lost your entire net worth. Yes. You gambled it away. That would scare them. And plus, you have responsibilities and to other people and all that kind of thing. I mean, I have responsibilities to myself. Annoying myself. Well, I mean, you know, I'm just saying that's, I, I would be petrified to do something like that. I don't know if you would. Oh, yeah. I don't know if you would. I would. I would. Well, I guess, you know what? Maybe the difference is, um, is you probably work much, much harder than I did. And so I think perhaps, and I'm not a psychiatrist, you know, I pretend to be, right? You act like one. Yeah. But I, uh, I think maybe I view the money I make as sort of unearned money because before I get into stand-up, you know, I did common labor for $3.65 cents an hour, and that was earned money, right? You earned that. That's the digital money. And when, uh, somebody gives you a bunch of money to pretend to be, you know, Colonel Sanders, that's earned money. Speaking of that, if I may. Yes, sir. What happened? You were Colonel Sanders. Why are you no longer Colonel Sanders? Well, is that part of the plan? I'll tell you, I love Kentucky Fried Chicken. And the jar I go to to get my Kentucky Fried Chicken is a couple blocks from my house. And all the Mexican guys, they don't know I'm Colonel Sanders. But the guy who runs the place is a brother. That guy knows, right? And he goes, get that [ __ ], get whatever you want. That's Colonel Sanders. When they approached him, [ __ ]. When they approached you to do Colonel Sanders, do you ever have that moment where you go, wait a second, I, you know, I'm a stand-up comic, I'm this, I'm that. People won't get why I'm playing Colonel Sanders on a commercial? You know, was it a big career? No, you just said, I'm doing free money, free money, free money. It's big money. The only thing I felt bad about was, um, uh, Daryl Hammond was doing it before me, right? And I remember watching those commercials and loving them, you know, because Daryl's so great. And he did this, uh, big old cookie thing and stuff. Anyways, I really, really liked, uh, Daryl, and I really love, uh, that guy, you know him personally, and I loved how he did it. But they found me, and they said, well, you got to know in three days. And it was a lot of money. I never got free money before, right? No, it's big money. Had I got free money, hell. So you didn't call Daryl and say, dude, I'm taking your job? Well, you know, I should have. Does he actually hand the costume over to you? Here's what having them is funny. When they replaced Daryl with me, it got a kind of a lot of press, you know, for that, look who's in the new Colonel Sanders. Yeah. An Adweek magazine. Again, were you shocked they asked you? I mean, I would never think in casting, I would go to Norm Macdonald. But then they got a little bit of buzz about it, right? So then they said, we'll do it every six months. And I was like, no, no, just keep me, yeah. You know, I'll be like, you know, uh, Flo from Progressive, right? Yeah. Who is currently, uh, Colonel Sanders. Do we know George Hamilton? You're kidding. Yes, because he plays the extra crispy because of his tan. So it actually makes sense. How many, um, how many commercials did you do for, uh, KFC? I did, uh, like six months. Wow. And just an enormous amount. Oh, my God. Now, you have that money? You didn't gamble that money away? Oh, no, sir. I don't gamble anymore. Wow. You, you kicked it. Was it better? A little bit? You'll play cards. You know what happened? No, there was no strength there. I just got saturated by it, as I, as I think people often do with any drugs or alcohol. They just reach a point where it's not hitting bottom, I think, as much as just hitting boredom. You're over it. Yeah. Yeah. But it's replaced the gambling. A friend of mine, Billy Joe Shaver, country music writer, best goddamn writer in this whole country. You should have him on the show. This son of a [ __ ] shot a man in the face when he was 75 years old. No kidding. Wrote every song on Hockey Talk Heroes. The real deal, this guy. Wow. Cowboy. But, he told me, you know, he said, I turn to Jesus one day because the bottle stopped working. Yeah. What did you think of that? The bottle stopped working one day. So what did you replace gambling with now? What are you into? Um, books. Books. Reading. Reading. I like reading. You know, I, I really enjoy reading. So tell me about it. I know you enjoy reading. Yeah. Audiobooks. Yeah. You know, I read the Kindle. You try that? It's fantastic. Yeah. We'll try that. You say in the, of the, in the new book, Norm Macdonald's memoir, based on a true story, you say when you got to Saturday Night Live, you were quite infatuated with Sarah Silverman. I miss you. I miss you too. Um, uh, you said you were infatuated. Yes. She came to the show. She's a beauty, you know. I was a 30-year-old man. Yeah. And I came in when I came in, it was me, her, and Jay Mohr. And they were both 21, right? And so she's a very young girl, and extremely beautiful. Yes. And, yeah, I was infatuated with, uh, Sarah. And you couldn't get a date with her? David, tell the comedian, the great comedian David, he was, I guess he was a writer on SNL. I know he was a writer on SNL. And within, uh, within New York stand-up, he was the guy, right? You know? And, and she was the, this up and coming girl, right? And he was unshaven, rumpled, half a beard. So something sexy about that. They were the Bogey and Bacall of, uh, of stand-up, you know? And I was just some, will you, you know, a beef steak, a good solid meal. Right. And I will later take you to my bed. And we'll be like, now, here's a, here's what I forgot. Sarah Silverman made the same money as I did. That's right. Minus, minus the 30 that they took off because she was a girl. That's right. There you go. And I'll tell you, some, if the payroll, uh, clerk had seen, uh, Sarah Silverman, by God, they would have taken 60 percent. You had to make a decision. You had to say to yourself, who do I throw in with? There were the guys who were already there, and then there was a whole new crop of you guys coming. And it was, uh, uh, Sandler. And so you'd said, hey, I'm going in with those guys because Farley was out of his mind even off camera, right? You joined Saturday Night Live. They, they send you to the Catskills to have some sort of bonding weekend for the new cast. Yes, sir. And Farley comes running in naked, naked into your room. Yes. Not Sarah. Yes. Farley comes right, and he had a tomato shoved up his ass. He had, uh, he said, would you like to see my impression of a salad? And he poured a salad dressing all over his head and started shoving baby tomatoes up his ass. Wow. And did you think this guy is the greatest? Or did you think, what the [ __ ]? It was the funniest thing I ever saw. And then he took me and he said, I have to tell you a secret, you know? And I was so like, I was saying, oh my God, the great Farley has to tell me a secret, you know? Something about Saturday Night Live that I should know. And it was a big, big resort. And he finally found a room, you know, that was, he's on purpose looking back on now. He took all this time to finally find a room. And he locked the door, and he brought me in the corner, and he said, this goes nowhere, okay? You know, this is between you and I. Pat is a woman I'm interested in. You know, I laughed so hard that he would do this for a stranger, you know? And that's why I love Farley so much. And he's so much different than all the rest of us. Is that he would go down the street and, uh, and just perform for everybody. And I'm telling you, everybody loved Chris Farley. The young, the old, the, the smart. That's what they say. The stupid. The people that liked him, the people that hated him. Yeah. You know, we had a guy come in and do a bad review on the show about how horrible it was and how horrible Farley was. And, you know, he laughed at everything Farley said. Yeah. Yeah. I wish so much, you know, he wanted to do this show. And I kept saying, you got it, you gotta do it, you know? Yeah. I already love you. No, you know, he was one of those guys you couldn't understand. You know, he kept saying, if only I could be as funny as John Belushi. I said, you're way funnier than John Belushi. I believe she's funny. I think he's like a serious actor that was kind of like tortured. But when you see interviews with him, he was a funny person. And so, you know, it always stuns me that that a person could be so unaware. He's walking through life and all he hears is laughter. I know. And for some reason, that was the whole rap on Farley, who I didn't know. But every one of you guys who was friendly with him, say that it was just crazy. Was the funniest guy in the room, and he just never felt like he was worth anything. Yeah. And even with the success of those films, and, you know, just, he just felt like an unfunny guy. But I do remember him telling me, you know, when he was a boy, you know, his father was, like, 600 pounds. I didn't know that. And I remember him telling me that as a boy, he would walk with his father, and all he would hear was the, the talk, you know, people goofing on the dad. Yeah. Yeah. That was his sadness. I don't think that ever left him. Yeah. Well, you know, I mean, although sometimes I'd watch his physical humor, and he was getting big, like, I mean, really. Yeah. He turned beet red. I remember one time, Chris, we were in the rehearsal, and, you know, it was a breakaway table, you know? And his thing was falling into the table. So I said, how the [ __ ], how the [ __ ] do you fall without putting your hands out? Yeah. You know? So, we all tried it, you know? And none of us could do it. If you fall forward, you're just automatically, automatically you've got to break your fall, because that's survival. And he didn't have, that's a Bible survival instinct, which made him so funny. And of course, if you don't have a survival instinct, you're in trouble. Do you think that's what his, his demon was? The whole issue with his dad and stuff, and he was sad, and that's what the drugs did for him? Well, I mean, he may, you know, he may have, he may have demons. But, you know, I considered him an angel because, uh, he, uh, he would try to make everyone he, he encountered life. Also, when we went to the funeral, we were shocked that he had the second life in Madison, Wisconsin, where he went to soup kitchens. And, you know, we were very strict Catholic. And his best friend was named Matt Foley, who was a priest, which he also named the character after. And so he had the second life of, why at Saturday Night Live? Tell me, is this just how out there sometimes you are, or you just think this is the funniest thing? You would go into a writing meeting and pitch the exact same sketch every week. An answering machine sketch. Yes. I guess they never ever made this sketch, but every week you would pitch the same. Is that you saying, in a way, [ __ ] you, because you're not going to sit there and pitch your material to them and let them have that over you? Oh, no, sir. I pitched it because I thought it was the funniest sketch I had. What was the sketch? Uh, well, it's not that funny. No, it's a little long to win. Oh, it is. Okay. But, yeah, um, the first time I did it, you know, uh, people laughed genuinely at how funny it was. And then I wrote it, and it didn't go. The next week, I pitched again. And then, and then at some point, it became, oh, we're just laughing that Norm's pitching the same thing. But you were sincere in this? Oh, hold on. It's still, you still think it's really funny, right? Like, they lost, wouldn't they have given in at some point and said, you know, maybe you should take this goddamn sketch and do it? I think if I had it, if I think if I had another year, one more year, just one more shot. But this is good. You look good. The sketch that you, oh, you look good. I do. Yeah. Oh, thank you. I don't think I look too good. Oh, you do. You look very good. You look good to Norm. Yeah. Thank you, Norm. Uh, but, but the sketch that you got on the air, and you sing in your book, hey, you know, I didn't originate this sketch. I kind of stole this sketch with permission. But the, the famous Jeopardy bit. Yes. Jeopardy. Well, you play Burt Reynolds. And, uh, you say Will Ferrell was key to that sketch because he played such a great, uh, Jeopardy host. Yes. But that thing was one of the most popular sketches. And you pitched that. But you say you admit in your memoir that, hey, that's something I got from SCTV. Yeah. Yeah. And I waited till Martin Short was a guest, uh, on the show, and I pitched it and said, can we do the Jeopardy thing? Yeah. Yeah. They did a sketch on SCTV when I was a child called, uh, Half Wits. And it was, even Alex Trebek was in the sketch because he was a Canadian. And it was just these kids. It was, um, it was, you know, when two schools would fight each other. Yeah. And so they were all, it was real stupid. So I always loved that show. And I said, you know, celebrity, Jeffrey, they always ask such easy questions, and the celebrities are all so stupid. It would be great to do it. Unfortunately, they've already done it. And, um, I feel like I shouldn't just steal the sketch. So, uh, when Mr. Short came to do the show, who later became my friend, I said, who wrote that sketch? You know? And he said, Eugene Levy. And I said, maybe we could phone him, you know, and get permission to get permission. And so he said, yeah, we'll do a conference call. And I said, no, off on, you know, I have a man, you know? Yeah. So I phoned, uh, Eugene Levy, and I asked him, I told him the whole sketch. I said, how much I love the first one, and I asked permission. And he was kind enough to give it to me. There was no better show than that SCTV. That was unbelievable, right? It was amazing. Unbelievable. The, the, the, uh, Celebrity Jeopardy sketch, the reason I really did it is I wanted to do Lorne. I wanted to do, uh, Burt Reynolds. Burt Reynolds. Now, Lorne Michaels, when it came time to do the sketch, I went down, I saw my wardrobe, and, you know, there was a white beard and a ball, the white cap. I mean, no, no. I want to do the, I want to do Burt Reynolds from 1972, right? And it's funny to be there. But no one ever mentioned it. No one ever mentioned that one guy on Celebrity Jeopardy is from 40 years, and Burt Reynolds. It didn't even matter. It didn't occur to anyone who had Burt Reynolds, though, which was an amazing. Was she pissed because he doesn't have a big sense of humor, does he? Uh, you know what? Burt Reynolds loves to do a slap in the face really hard. Do you think one of those masculine guys punching you? You know, but no, he was real nice to me. And he slapped you. He told me really funny stories. He told me he was in the, Deliverance, you know? Yeah. Here's an interesting story about Deliverance. The, the kid that plays the banjo, yeah, he can't play a banjo. Is that true? Yeah. But when you think about it, makes complete sense. He's an actor. Like he's not an actor. They found him in town, right? But they somehow super odd looking guy. So it's fascinating to watch now. You can see it on YouTube. And you can see, I've read the director, I think was Frankenheimer, was at, uh, making it look like he could play. He was convinced. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So he told me he, you know, he said, you know, I used to do my own gags. Gags, I guess are like stunts. He was a stunt man. Yeah. And so he said, you know, they had this gag and where I went over a waterfall in water. No, no. He's a fellow, you know, he just falls off the one hand. This was like Deliverance. They were in the middle of, right, right, right. So he says, I'll, I'll do the fall. We don't need a, we don't need a stunt man. Frankenheimer says, no, no, we need a stunt man. He goes, no, we don't want that. He goes, okay, well, we'll just use a dummy. We'll just throw a dummy over, you know? Yeah. And he goes, no, no. So Frankenheimer's idea was just to throw a dummy over. And then Burtman said, no, absolutely. I'm going to do it myself. So Burt Reynolds says he does it. And he said, he did, you know, he said some term I'm not familiar with. You know, I do a half bike or something like that. He said, his, uh, shoulder immediately hit a rock, then his head hit another rock. And then he said, the next thing to remember is way downstream, all his clothes had been torn off, and he looked up and it was just like in shock, right? The next thing he remembers, he's waking up in a hospital. John Frankenheimer is at his bedside. And he goes, then I said to John, how did it look, you know, on the, uh, on the dailies? And John Frankenheimer said, it looked like a dummy. An Adam Sandler movie, right? And I asked Adam if he would be kind enough to let me go and, uh, and meet, uh, messed around with one of my childhood heroes. My biggest child hero was the great Paul Newman. How do you get around in California? I have a small world. Is that true though? What do you do in L.A.? Do you have a driver who drives you? What do you do? How do you get around? I don't. As I say, I have a small world, you know? And I walk from place to place. Is that right? You walk? Yes. I, I don't do much. You don't have any curiosity to learn how to drive? No, sir. None at all. Are you afraid? Of course. It's the most dangerous thing there is. And you don't trust yourself behind the wheel, or you don't trust other people? I don't trust myself, right? I don't trust other people either, but I don't trust myself. Do you own one of those things you stand on and kind of Segway? But you think that's a way of keeping yourself childlike? No, I'm not making a joke. I mean, in a sense that you can't really get anywhere and you rely on the kindness of others in a way. Isn't that an analogy for life? I can't really get to where I need to go. Is there anything to that? Am I on to something? Yeah, you are. I am. I, I will say this, I can get a lot more done without the tiny things that make up life, you know. But what about meetings? Norm, don't you have to have meetings? Does everybody have to come to? As a kid, did you drive? I mean, did you ever learn? Like when you were nothing? I was out of fear of it. I always had a fear of it, but I never thought of it as a rational fear. I mean, people, more people die. I remember I used to drive Frank and crazy, you know, how Frank and centered around Franklin. He said the senator out, right? What a funny guy. So the guy, well, he was funny, but he, I guess he didn't get jokes or something. I'd just torture him, you know? And like, I grew up and I go, ah, man, I read in the newspaper, did you know that more people are killed each year by automobile accidents than by great white sharks? And he goes, what are you a [ __ ] idiot? And I go, I'm serious. I read this. He goes, well, of course. All right, yeah. What do you like? What are you an idiot? Speaking, speaking of Al Franken, you write about him in the memoir. You know, he won't, it's if you read this message, is the speculation. Norm, is the speculation that Al Franken, yes, sir, wanted the slot on Saturday Night Live, be the news guy? Yes. Yeah. Absolutely. And when you got it, he quit? Uh, well, I, um, he didn't quit right away, but I think that probably led him toward that. Yeah. He wanted, uh, he wanted the thing, the, the update, right? And I didn't really care, you know? And, uh, at one point, he almost had it because, uh, Lorne wanted, uh, a guy to do it with a girl, right? So I ain't doing it, you know. You wanted to be the solo anchor? Yeah. Yeah. Like, because they would tell me, well, what about Dan? And I love Dan Aykroyd, probably better than anybody that ever was on that show. But they said, what about Dan Aykroyd? You know, yeah. And Jane, you ignorant [ __ ]. And I'm like, yeah, but name one other thing other than that. Yeah. You don't remember it. It wasn't good. He played a, a guy from the theater. I remember he had a hat. Yes. He played like a Walter Winchell or something. Yeah. Yeah. So he was playing a character, and it was not a good. You know, there's only been, there was only Chevy, Dennis, and me. Yeah. Yeah. Dennis did a good job with it. Yeah. That's true. You didn't like Seth? You know what I think is unfair is Dennis. They go, now he's not funny, you know, because he changed his politics. You're still funny. Yeah. You're either funny or you're not, right? It doesn't matter what your politics are, right? Politics is just gossip, you know? Yeah. But, well, you know, you do Seth Meyers. You guys worked it out, right? There was a, there was a bit. I love Seth. Yeah. He came on your program, right? And it was probably you. It probably wasn't Seth. Said that I shouldn't have done something or something? No, I didn't say that. You told some stories about what went on behind the scenes at the 40th anniversary, and they were very, yeah, they were very sort of innocuous stories. They were. And I love hearing all that, just little stories. But Seth felt you shouldn't have told those. Yeah. So I did not know this. So I was on a, on a being interviewed by some Huffington Post guy, and the guy quoted to me, he said, Seth thought that you should, um, should have kept those things prime. What did he say? He said, Seth thought that it is not something he would have done, right? So, and then I said, okay, so then, uh, later he said, so are you doing all these shows in New York? Are you gonna do Seth Meyers? And I said, I don't think it's something that I would have done, or something like that. I don't know. Just making a joke, right? That's all I'm doing, right? But, no, I, I know. No, but you, that also, which was a very funny line, like you live your whole life to make sure that you live up to seven. Yeah. Whatever he would do. Yeah. Right. Well, it's very strange. You know, I just did Fallon. Have you done Jimmy Fallon? I did it, uh, before he became the host of The Tonight Show. I haven't gotten. He's invited me on. I just haven't, uh, haven't done it. Well, it's very strange because, you know, my whole life, I, I did Letterman. Atlanta. Almost only the Letterman. But with Letterman, you're in the hands of a man, you know. But it's funny with Jimmy, who's incredibly talented, Jimmy Fallon. But when you look over at him when you're sitting there, it's like a little boy. Yeah. It is. That's a very true observation. It's funny when I watch late night TV now, it doesn't have that same gravitas because, like, you're used to seeing the older guy there, and now, like, I'm the older guy. And how do you go on there and be the goofball that you were when you were young? But you're talking to

These young guys, right? Yes, exactly. Yeah, it's a little confusing, boy, I tell you.

Letterman left a crater, you know, because I think, you know, not only for television but for popular culture. Yes. You know, I would say you and David Letterman are the two people, and I don't know if you're aware of it, but that changed the way people talk and think and act.

Well, thank you for saying that. I, I, I mean, it's incredible, incredible thing you've already done. You could quit now because you've already done, yeah, so much. Yeah, you've already done. I don't know if you could do anything more. It's like the, uh, you're right, you know, it's like the great, the great, the great Japanese authors when they're finished with their, then they put them, it's time for the sword. Yeah. If you don't like what you're doing, you've, you've given so much, uh, to the world that you could just, uh, you know, spend the rest of your life, um, doing different things with cats, you know. It's fun. Yeah. Right.

And, and we like doing that. But, you know, it's funny with Letterman, I remember being at NBC and when I went to NBC radio, Letterman was starting at NBC, and we both kind of started at the same time. We're both working in the building. Yeah. I remember Dave, you know, put me on nationally, and it was just really exciting to have some sort of national audience. And I remember thinking, gee, these are really exciting times, horrible times too, because it was so insecure, but it really, they felt like something big was happening in entertainment. But, yeah, I don't feel that anymore.

Well, there's so many people also, you know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, when there's so many outlets too, so many outlets. I talked to Jimmy Kimmel all the time about it. I go, you know, it's such a harder gig now in a way because there's so many guys. You were putting it out there on Twitter that you would have liked to have taken over for Craig Ferguson, and I thought that would have been interesting, you know, because the way I felt was this, I was, I felt, uh, you know, at one point there was Johnny Carson and there was David Letterman, right? Yeah. That was it. And now I feel there's 5,000 Johnny Carsons and no David Letterman. There's no 12:30 show. The 12:30 shows and the 11:30 shows are identical. Yes. You know, I wanted to originally do a morning show. I thought, you know, if I did a show for the college kids that woke up and, uh, and, you know, were watching, uh, because now they want, you know, MSNBC and all these Morning Joe and stuff like that, you know, I could give them their names.

Well, you write about, you know, at 12:30 at night, there used to be this weird vibe like, uh, it was different. You'd see Brother, uh, what was that guy's name? Brother, Brother Theodore. And you see all these weird, you know. Yeah. Right. You'd see all these weird guests, and there was room for that at 12:30 at night. Now it's, uh, it's all too competitive. Yeah. Now you see the same guys over and over saying the exact same stories. And my God. But I will say this, you're good on Conan, though. I mean, you have a nice rapport with him. I love Conan. I think Conan's, uh, is probably the funniest guy, you know, now. Yeah. You know, it's strange, the elder statesman of, uh, of, uh, talk show hosts now is Carson Daly. Oh, Carson Daly. Yeah. There you go. We've done it for about 35 years. That's true. I forget about that. I'm just not up late enough, you know what I mean?

But now when you go on a talk show, I don't know what you, I guess you could go on Fallon, and I'm not sure, but, but it is a completely different, uh, yes, because before you were the punk, you know? Yeah. And, and Letterman, Letterman was perfect with you. Oh, he was so good. He was like squeamish and what do you know? Oh, yeah. He'd be shocked and, yeah, it was just great fun. Yeah. I mean, I, I, you know, you're right, I don't know really that it works the same way now. I mean, I haven't done it, and I like Jimmy Fallon, I like all those guys. I would go on them, you know. Are you gonna do like karaoke? Well, they once said to me, you want to play a game? I go, no, I don't play games. I'm really bad. I'm a sore loser. You don't want to play games with me. Yeah. It would be funny if you went on Fallon and you played chess there. There you go. Like an hour and a half game and just sit there. Yeah. Two moves. The worst talk show appearance of all time. Thirty-day game.

Well, Norm, I, I do love you, man. You are the greatest. I mean, I love you. Howard, John, what the [ __ ] is that? Who the [ __ ] is John? That's what I want to know. I was thinking of Johnny Carson. Well, thank you. So, what, you got a lot of book promotion coming up or what? I mean, yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yeah. Do you like jokes? Would you like to hear a joke? I would love a joke. It's something the people, I feel, need a joke right now because, you know, times are really weird. This is not my joke. You didn't write this? No, sir. It's just what they call a street joke. Good. But my dad would always tell this joke. It was about a little boy called Dirty Johnny, you know, and he'd be in class. You ever heard Dirty, Dirty Johnny jokes? Yes, I've heard the whole series. In this book, and this, in this joke, he's not dirty. But anyways, the teacher has a thing, and the teacher says, today in class, um, class, we are going to, uh, have a little experiment. You're going to tell a story from your real life, and then afterwards, you're going to tell the moral of that story, you know? So, uh, uh, Sheila puts up her hand, and the teacher says, Sheila, what's your story? So Sheila says, well, uh, uh, my dad works at the hatchery, and, uh, he took, uh, some eggs, and, um, and he put them all in a basket, all the eggs. He put in one basket, and then he put him in the horse and buggy, and off we went to town. And the earth was uneven, and the eggs broke. And, uh, and the teacher goes, well, that's an all right story, but I, I can't understand what the, what the moral would be to that story. So Sheila says, well, the moral is, don't put all of your eggs into one basket. So the teacher says, well, by God, this is exactly what I'm looking for, and what I was hoping for with this experiment. Yeah. And, uh, anybody else have one? So, uh, Marjorie puts up her hand. Okay, Margie, what's your story? Well, my father works for the hatchery. Most of us, most people in that town were going to happen. Thank God for the hatchery, or where would we be? So she says, my father, um, uh, he sells chickens, and he knows that eggs become chickens, see what I mean? So, uh, he had to count his chickens, so he'd go in and sell them in town. So he had nine chickens and five eggs. So instead of saying he had nine chickens, he added the five eggs, you see. He counted them as chickens. So he said, I have 14 chickens. So he, uh, took them, Sheila says, and put them in the horse and buggy, and now if they went to town, but the, the land was uneven, the chickens should survived easily, they frolicked, the eggs broke. Well, the teacher says again, that's a story, you know, but, uh, but what, what on earth could the, the moral of that story be? Well, how, Sheila says, if that's her name, I forgot. She says, don't count your chickens before they hatch out of the eggs, right? Teacher says, you could probably shorten it a little. So, um, but, but that's great, and that's exactly what we're looking for. And then she looks at the back of the class, and by God, there's, because you say [ __ ] dirty dude, he's gonna ruin the lesson. So the teacher, inside of her head, her thoughts are moving around, and she's like, oh God, I don't want to hear Dirty Johnny said this is going so well, but at the same time, I took a vow and I became a teacher that every student today. All right, Johnny, let's hear your story. So Dirty Johnny gets up and he says, this is a story about my Uncle Terry. He didn't work for the hatchery. I don't even like people that did. He was in Vietnam and he lives on disability checks. He got Uncle Terry was not a popular man, not even among those he worked with. And I suppose we've all heard of people who've deserted from their battalion, but I don't know if you've ever heard of a battalion deserting a man. That's what they did. But with Uncle Terry, one day Uncle Terry awoke in the middle of Danang, and everybody was gone. He was alone, and they'd left him three bottles of Jack Daniels and some weaponry. So Uncle Terry got up, says Dirty Johnny, and he downed the bottle of Jack Daniels and two slugs, and he threw it down and smashed it into the, into the jungle. And then he walked, picked up the two Kalashnikovs and three or four Glocks and a couple of hand grenades, and off he walked into the, into the unknown, the jungle. His fate came upon a village, and from the village came people. Now, were they Charlie, or were they the people that Terry was sent to protect from Charlie? Uncle Terry didn't know, but he knew he had to do some. So he took us another swig from the bottle, and he let loose. Took that Kalashnikov and he let it sway like a, like a farmer would a scythe, and the bullets came, and, uh, just as hay would fall before a farmer, so the people fell before Uncle Terry. The men, the women, and, bag, at even the children. And finally, Uncle Terry stood alone in the mud and the blood and the guts, and only at himself. I took a long swig, and his hand brushed against his, his pants, and he felt wetness, and, and then he felt shame because he realized he had urinated himself in fear. And then upon closer inspection, he realized it was not urine, it's ejaculate. And a shame was replaced by pride. That teacher goes, holy [ __ ] [ __ ]! What the [ __ ] [ __ ] kind of [ __ ] story is that? Like we just heard the hatchery or something, and now this. She was a little Dirty Johnny, what on earth could be the, the moral to such a story? So, uh, Johnny thinks about it for a couple of minutes and he goes, well, I don't know. I guess, well, I know one thing, you know, [ __ ] with Terry when he's had some drinking them, and he's uncorked the jug, you stay away from Uncle Terry. They don't like anybody that works at the hatchery either. You remember that. You tell your parents that. Wow. So that's just a lighting thing. What a joke. Your dad told you that? Your dad was a great storyteller. That's my dad's story though. He taught us to laugh again.

Norm, thank you. You look at that ejaculated right in his pants. The thrill of killing. The thrill of it. Well, who knows? Who knows? Who knows what it was? Who knows what would happen if you were putting that? Thank you for that story. Here, we always talk about going back and, oh, if you can only go back in time and kill Hitler, right? Yeah. But what I mean, what a horror it would be to go back in time, meet Hitler, and get hypnotized by him. One of the guys, very powerful speaker, you didn't know. You know, all of a sudden you're killing it. They say he was a parable speaker. Then on YouTube, he's like, yeah, [ __ ] Christ, don't vote for him, but for anyone else beside him. And they clear, they, they make fun of Hillary Clinton when she raises her voice. Hitler was screaming at the people, right? Yeah. Screaming, spitting, every was crazy. Yeah. Yeah. And they're like, whoa, what a silver-tongued devil. Norm Feller is. Yes, sir. You have done it all today. I didn't even realize what time it was. I know the show's almost over here. That joke. Oh, my goodness. I wish I could only have been. I wish I could go back in time, watch you in those pitch meetings at, uh, Saturday Night Live. That must have been nuts. Norm, you're the best. Norm McDonald.

Well, you're the best. You to say. And your memoir, uh, based on a true story, everyone is excited. We'll be available wherever books are sold. By the way, uh, this is kind of exciting, but my, um, my, my book, based on a true story, go ahead, a memoir, yes, uh, it's not really a memoir, uh, is, uh, nominated for a National Book Award and nominated for a Pulitzer Prize already. Yes, sir. And it hasn't even come out yet. No, sir. That's amazing. Yeah. The tour events, I wonder if that's true. It really is true. Wow. That's awesome. How do you get that? Yeah, I don't know. For publishing things, for tour events and stand-up dates, go to normmcdonald.com. Also, because Norm's still out there doing it, still doing it. And I love you. And, and thank you for. It's been a long time since you've been here. And, uh, I love you. I miss it so much, you know. And I love the new, is that what you call it, dude? What did, uh, Burt Reynolds call them? Gags? Yeah. What can I tell you? Norm, thank you for being here. Thank you, sir. Best of luck with the book. We're all gonna go out and read it and study it and try to learn from it and learn from your mistakes. Uh, the great Norm McDonald, everybody. We'll be back right after these words.