I'd Rather My Child Be a Repentant Sinner | DC LIVE

Now, what's your take on the topic? Would you rather your child be LGBT or an atheist?

>> Um, rather my child uh be a repentant sinner than an unrepentant sinner.

>> So, LGBT.

>> Okay. So, LGBT. Now, what's your take on um what's your take on um self self- testing? So, basically, I don't know if you heard of Milo Yiannopoulos. Have you ever heard of him before?

>> I have not.

So he is a conservative and he is a Catholic. Um and he is also a part of the community, the LGBTQ LGBTQ community. And what he does to keep himself from practicing in samesex relationships is he actually mutilates himself.

>> So he burns like hot wax on his ding-along and he um even promotes like cutting himself to keep himself from wanting to have those relationships. So every time he gets those passions he you know he disciplines himself is what he says. Would you support your child doing that instead of being atheist or instead of

>> actually that so though so if I was teaching my child about the Bible I wouldn't teach them to hurt themselves for

>> Does it really? I think Jesus said that it's better to lose your hands metaphorical. What about in Leviticus?

>> What about it?

>> Okay. So, you want to do you want to stone LGBTQ community? Is that what you're getting at?

>> No, sir. What I'm talking about

>> That's in Leviticus, isn't it? Wait, is that not in Leviticus?

>> Well, no. What I'm Okay, now you're confusing.

>> So, you're going to pick Are you going to pick and choose what verses we take out of Leviticus?

>> No, sir.

>> I think we have to understand that the Bible the the laws of the Bible, like sorry, the laws that are in the Bible, there's a difference between the law of man and the law of God,

>> right? Okay. So the law of God is fulfilled through Jesus. It's not about what we do. It's about where our heart lies. It's about our repentance.

>> Okay. So there LGBTQ community is totally fine with you then.

>> There's like two sides to that. So for example like um

>> are they conflicting with each other? The two sides.

>> I feel like a lot of times

>> me myself like I'll give you an example of like a personal example. Um, and I'm not trying to compare anything. This is more so just like a like a personal like understanding.

>> Um, I have my own personal struggles like I have like addictions and stuff which is definitely different but um like I don't I don't uh agree with those just because I struggle with them. Right.

>> So um basically like as a Christian it's not about what sin you're committing. Like if if somebody's gay versus somebody's hurting people, obviously we're like, "Okay, gay is not as bad as hurting people." But

>> let's say non-hetro on my live, please. We just don't take it.

>> Sorry.

>> Um I didn't mean to offend. Um um so if someone's nonhedro, then there's nothing they're not doing anything more or less wrong than anybody else who struggles with sin.

>> Great. And what I was talking about in I believe it's Leviticus,

>> um there were people who were cutting themselves.

>> A lot of people take this as the the no tattoo scripture, right? But what was really happening

>> was people were like slitting their like arms and likeelves.

>> Why were they doing that?

>> Because they were trying to call out to God.

>> Yes. So it's a different thing than selfdiscipline. So you're being disingenuous about where you're applying that scripture.

>> They were still following. Like this is what I'm saying though is what they were doing

>> Mhm.

>> was Oh, there's a deer outside. I got my dog. What they were doing was they were hurting themselves. For example, this guy who's trying to discipline himself is also trying to do it for God. So just because the the reason why

>> but he's not doing it to invoke God. He's to he's doing it to keep himself from practicing sin which you believe being a part of the community or engaging in those acts would be sin. Well, it actually

>> to be clear in scripture it says do not cut yourself for the for the de a for the dead.

>> Oh, yeah.

>> Come on a second.

>> So it's a totally different reason. They're not doing it for self-discipline. And we do see Jesus say we do see Jesus say still harming himself for God.

>> We do. Yes. And we do see Jesus say that's okay.

>> No. Jesus metaphorically said, "If your right eye can better gouge it out, because it's better to live in heaven with one eye than it is on a metaphor in hell with two."

>> Where does it say it's a metaphor?

>> What?

>> Where does Where does Jesus say? I'm figuratively speaking here. I'm not really

>> You're silly, my friend. You're um intellectually dishonest right now.

>> This is intellectual dishonesty.

>> You can't just take the question

>> because you can't answer the question.

>> No, I'm trying to. You can't take the Bible at face value. You can't ask me one question and

>> how do you know when to take it face value though and when not to?

>> I love it when Christians tell me not to take it face value because I agree 100%.

>> Yeah. So, like actually understand the meaning. So when Jesus said gouge your eye out you think a lot you think people started taking their eyes out. No.

>> What there are there are in Christian history people who did do this things.

>> Yeah. And they were wrong. So what I

>> stand but not by Jesus's standard. Right. Jesus agreed with them more than he agreed with you. Right? What Jesus was saying was that what would you rather? Would you rather live your life in hell and have every body part and you have just sinned your whole life or would you rather take he's not talking about your physical like he's yes he is but what he's doing is he's saying you had something in your life if my phone would watch

>> if my phone causes me to watch

>> then I should throw my phone away

>> that's your phone but I'm saying I'm saying if you're a part of the community would you rather your child um discipline himself this way by either um painfully disciplining themselves or go ahead engaging in the natural inclination that they have with a consensual adult.

>> I obviously like I said like I'm not trying to like my child

>> Well, I just need you to answer that.

>> Okay. Like obviously I wouldn't want my kid cutting themselves.

>> So you'd rather them engage in the natural proclivity that they have, right? Well, yes, but that doesn't mean that I'm going to tell them to do that.

>> Why?

>> Well, because if my kid's trying to cut them, if my kid comes to me and is like, I either have to cut myself or be um non-hetero, I'd be like,

>> yes,

>> that's how you feel. But let me tell you the truth, cuz you don't have to go and switch to to hetero. That's that's silly. That's that's like a

>> But I'm telling you I'm telling you right now that as someone that was raised Christian and was a Christian minister, you do some you do get very depressed and it's it's what you naturally want to do. And so self-disciplining a lot of Christians find that that is a way to keep them from engaging in this. So would you be against would you be against a Christian that is honestly trying to serve God the best way they can and they hurt themselves every day because that they are trying to keep themselves from sin.

>> Okay. So what you're telling me Okay. So so what you told me earlier was because the reason these two things that I referenced together of the cutting don't coincide but what I'm telling you it is the same thing. So these people who are hurting themselves for God, I would tell them that they're doing the wrong thing. Just as if someone was sinning, it's a sin. The Bible tells you not to cut yourself.

>> Jesus literally told you to

>> because my Go see if I go to the bar and I drink and I get drunk, I should not go to the bar. If I go out and I see a girl and I sleep with her, I should not go to that place where that

>> These are not analogous. Okay, hold on. We have Nick. Nick wants to speak. We've been talking for a minute, so let's go ahead and give the floor.

>> Okay, go ahead, Nick.

>> Do you think that emotional and mental causing oneself mental and emotional pain is just as equal as uh physical harming?

>> Uh it depends what you are going through and what for. So, I know a lot of people within the LGBTQIA who were uh religious that caused themselves a lot of emotional and mental torment, forcing themselves to be straight. Hi, I'm one of them uh for years and years because it's what, you know, Christ would want me to do. And it causes severe depression and a whole other bag of stuff. um it opens you up to um sexual assault. Um so I I'm just wondering because you keep going back to physical self harm, I'm wondering if you hold mental and emotional harm to the same standard.

>> Yeah, I definitely would depending on the situation. Like I think that like for me for example, if I'm putting if I if I put myself in a situation where I'm going to face persecution, um if I'm facing persecution because I wanted to fight this guy and he beat me up, that's not right. But if I face persecution because I'm spreading the gospel, that's good.

>> If we could get everybody really quick to tap uh to interact with the poll, it's the clipboard at the top left screen if you don't mind and like and share the live, please. Sorry, y'all. Go ahead.

>> Okay. Jesse,

>> sorry. Uh, people within the LGBTQ IA are constantly persecuted by Christians.

>> Christians are constantly putting them through emotional, mental, physical, and yes, even spiritual uh, warfare

>> big time.

>> Sorry.

>> Have you heard of conversion therapy, Seth?

>> Oh, that's I don't I don't believe in that stuff. Um, what I'll tell you is that um, the people don't represent the God. Do you think, because one of the things that you said when you first came up here is is you'd rather your child be a repentant sinner. Do you think telling LGBTQA plus people that they are sinners on a constant daily basis isn't mental and emotional and spiritual warfare?

>> Well, I go through spiritual warfare all times of every second of every day. And I'm not LGBT. Can you tell me who specifically is putting you through that mental duress?

>> Um, the devil.

>> Okay. I'm talking about real people here, not not some madeup fairy tale uh dude with some horns and pitchfork. Okay. I'm talking about real life people hurting real life people and telling them that, "Oh, what you do is a sin. Oh, but we love you anyway." I'm talking about real people here.

>> No, I know. Like but but you can't discredit me just because I have a different view. So what I say

>> I can discredit you because the Christian idea of Satan is is actually not biblical at all. But that is neither here nor there. I am talking about Christians

>> Mhm.

>> putting LGBTQIA plus people

>> in mental, physical, and spiritual duress on a daily freaking basis. Do you think that's okay? I think that there's some Christians who do it terribly and I there's a lot of Christians that attack the LGBTQ in a way that I would call them not Christians.

>> Just calling us sinners, telling us who we are is a sin causes that pain.

>> Like I said, um that's wrong. It's not about what you do being a sin. It's about the nature. So whether you're LGBT, whether you're um like an addict, whether you um go out and party, like it doesn't it doesn't matter what you're doing. It's it's not the idea of what you're doing being a sin. And I think that's where a lot of Christians misunderstand and get things wrong. The idea is that

>> Well, you just did it, Seth. Sorry, but

>> No, I'm trying to explain. You just correlated You just correlated a lot of people who are in consensual relationships with people that they love as adults with someone going out and partying, someone probably unaling other people. I mean, we could fit all sins in that category, right?

>> Yeah. Yeah. So, like

>> how is that not exactly what you're talking against right now?

>> I I see what you're saying. So what I'm trying to say is that like yes, it's about it's about so so it's there's a there's a difference between like being dead to sin and like being being a sinner. So essentially when you are not in Christ whether you're living is what I'm trying to say. I'm like it's not about not comparison, it's just whatever. It doesn't matter what it is. When you don't have Christ, you are dead to the ways of the world. You are a slave to the ways of the world. not about what you're doing, not about it's about what you're being it's about what you what what world you're living in because as the Bible teaches again not to like like give spiritual but like again I do believe in the spiritual and I think it's very real because we see it around us but the Bible teaches that Satan is the god of this world and his he comes he doesn't come as a guy with horns and a pitchfork he comes as an angel of light he comes as beauty He's going to show you that.

>> That's not in the Bible at all, my guy.

>> Actually, yeah, it is. Jesus says comes as an angel of light, which is about the false prophets, which who are they influenced by the devil?

>> The the false prophets is not talking about Satan.

>> It really isn't actually described other than like in the book of Job, all he was, the Satan was um was basically uh God's prosecutor for humanity. His job was to prosecute us to see if we were actually worthy of God. He's not some big bad guy out to be.

>> That's not what Hassatan means. Hassatan means accuser.

>> Yeah. Accuser or adversary.

>> Yeah. That doesn't mean that he had an actual job. He was a prosecutor for God.

>> And Job happened.

>> You're saying two different things though. There's a difference. So Satan doesn't

>> What do you think a prosecutor is? cept

>> pardon.

>> What do you think a prosecutor is?

>> He's an accuser.

>> The prosecute accuses.

>> Okay. Okay. I won't I won't argue with that

>> also. Oh, go ahead.

>> So, but again, anyways, so back to what I was saying. Sorry. Um, personally like the the way that like I've witnessed from others and heard from others and understand myself is it doesn't it doesn't matter even if you are living perfectly and not sinning in the eyes of the Bible. Um, if you reject Christ, it's essentially like if I ask you to come over and you say no and then you come over and knock on the door and I was like, well, you didn't want to come over. Why would I let you in? I'm doing other things now. I'm busy. I made other plans. Yeah, that's a lot simpler of an idea. But it's not about your bad things you do or good things you do. Cuz that doesn't matter. Christ didn't die so that you can do better. Christ died because we can't be as good because we've offended him.

>> That causes mental emotional warfare. We cannot be as good as blank. Well, that's the whole point. Like that's the whole point of Christianity is we go through spiritual warfare and through that suffering we become sanctified.

>> The only spiritual you guys put yourselves through is the ones that you want.

>> Can I ask a quick question? What good what good in this life is being sanctified?

>> Oh, this life doesn't matter. I'm waiting for the next one.

>> Okay, that tracks.

>> This life's temporary. The next one is eternal. So even at the expense of like mental health in this life or how it affects others.

>> Uh not others. No.

>> Oh, it still affects others.

>> Um

>> the way that I come like the way that I come is not to is not for harm. I I don't hope to instill harm.

>> Well,

>> but you just said that the way that Sorry, Jess, but you just said the way that we get to God is through suffering.

>> No, no. The way that we get to God is through Jesus. Jesus suffered for us.

>> Okay. What did you say about the suffering? this as Christians we face persecution. Uh the suffering Paul says Paul says suffering leads to um perseverance. Perseverance builds character. Okay.

>> Character gives us hope and our hope is in Jesus.

>> So you actually support suffering. What is suffering to you then?

>> Suffering is not harm.

>> Suffering is facing anything like poor harmful. Yeah. Yeah. I guess harmful is a one way to put it. Yeah.

>> So how is that not elevating harm? Cuz

>> how can you be against harm when harm actually builds up your character?

>> I'm

>> Would you not want to harm more people then?

>> I don't want to harm people.

>> This is what this is.

>> Well, you just said we build up

>> perseverance.

>> Yes. So,

>> so then what makes harm a bad thing in your world view? Well, there's there's it depends on the harm you're talking about, but um like the the flesh, it says in the Bible to to die to your flesh, which means understand that the ways of the world are foolish, and those who believe the ways of the world are without the spirit and will believe the ways of the Bible to be foolish because the spirit discerns.

>> Um it still causes harm.

>> But that's that's the flesh. That's the deceitful part of us. That's the evil part of us. So why would you not want to put to death something that deceives you?

>> Because you're putting on a can.

>> If you're living a life whether I'm not talking about specifically who who people are and what they're doing, but if somebody's living a life that is going to cause them to hurt others, like like seriously like talk badly about others. It's it's when someone's leading a life that leads to something bad, that shouldn't be something that they should lead. they should lead a better life. Like Muhammad from the Quran, he did some terrible things. He shouldn't have done that.

>> So the idea of the concept or idea of Satan too, like the the way that Satan's in the world, he's deceitful. That's a copout and that's a like it's weaponized usually to not view view people as human if you don't want to, even if you don't mean to. But because of how pe people apply the idea of Satan into the world and and demons and these things, it it takes away it cops out from people participating with reality and viewing people as human

>> and gives it a easy copout from having to be e empathetic or to just be just acknowledge existence. It's more of a copout.

>> Yeah. You really separate that

>> like

>> and that's how it that's another way it can affect other people. I mean, I know that from my experience with my own child,

>> I know that

>> it wasn't it wasn't I didn't realize it was harmful from the get-go. It took time and then I realized if I would have stayed in it, I would have caused more harm to him over time.

>> So, the way that people um I I agree people use Satan as an excuse, as a copout. That's that's not biblical from my understanding of the Bible because just because Satan whether or not we think let's just talk let's just take away like cuz I know we're like iffy about whether Satan is biblical or not. If we have evil that enters our mind and tempts us to do evil things. The idea is that if we do that evil thing that's not evil doing it. We still did it. that responsibility is on me or the person who did it. You know what I mean?

>> Yeah.

>> So just because like Satan might like bringing that back like he has no control over he can't control what we do but he can put in front of us things that will um tempt us to do the things that he wants us to do that evil wants us to do. Do you think being LGBTQ I is one of those things?

>> I think it's iffy because there's definitely a lot of things the Bible talked about when it talked about it that were a little bit different to what was happening today. But I also I also do think that like like a sin is a sin and it's not going to I'm not going to say you're a bad person for sinning because that means me I'm a bad person too. So basically like if I'm

>> sorry

>> people who use their Christianity to do bad things and excuse them by the word of God they're not Christians

>> but they are they go to

>> they call themselves Christians but they're the sons of Satan.

>> It doesn't matter the difference. So, what makes

>> But if you sin and you're a Christian, that means that you're a child of Satan.

>> Again, like I just said, I'm not using I'm not using the Lord's name in vain to do evil things.

>> But I'm sorry. They don't believe that their things are evil. They just destroy the human lives that are not theirs.

>> Well, that's what I'm saying.

>> They don't believe that that's a bad thing.

>> The ten commandments that they are doing good.

>> The ten commandments say don't murder. So they're already doing something wrong.

>> Wait, did you say that they're they're acting as a a child of Satan?

>> Oh, when you're when you're Well, so like there's many people Jesus even said there's going to be a lot of Christians who go to the gates and say, "Lord, I casted out demons in your name. I did all these works for you." And Jesus says, "Depart from me. I never knew you."

>> You're using Satan as a copout right now.

>> No, I'm not.

>> You just You just did when they brought up when did she not bring up like Christians doing bad things in name in the name of God or Christianity? You said they're not Christians. You said they're what? I said I said they're sons of Satan because that's what Jesus says. So essentially what that means is that they in the name of

>> Wait just a second. If they're sons of Satan at that point, then there's no reason to need to advocate for for making them take accountability or get justice at that point.

>> Well, Jesus blood covers that.

>> Jesus what?

>> Jesus's blood covers everything.

>> Okay, this is a good part to to ask you then. What makes a human sacrifice uh a moral thing?

>> The human sacrifices in the Old Testament were not necessarily something

>> actually. Well, I mean Nick always likes to correct me on this, but I would say that there is no atonement of a human sacrifice.

>> There was no wees that people were doing for atonement.

>> They were sacrif. Yes. Right. So they were sacrificing animals like lambs, non-human animals. Okay. So what makes a human sacrifice? Sacrificing an innocent human being and washing in their blood a moral thing.

>> Uh because Jesus is God.

>> But he's also human, right?

>> 100% of each,

>> right? So he's 100% human. So you're Does God bleed? Wait, does God bleed?

>> When he humbled himself into the form of a man, he did.

>> Okay. As a man, he bled, right?

>> His his god nature didn't die.

>> Nope.

>> Right. Okay. So, you are taking your atonement through a human sacrifice.

>> Well, because Jesus is the sacrificial lamb. The only thing So, if you look at

>> So, just saying he's a sacrificial lamb.

>> No, I'm explaining it. I'm explaining it.

>> I'm saying just saying that Jesus is a sacrificial lamb is not actually addressing the issue here.

>> No, it's not. So, I'm going to explain it.

>> Okay. Okay.

>> The Israelites in the Old Testament were sacrificing and doing all these things. But what did that lead to? Did it lead to them being saved?

>> Yes, it led to forgiveness.

>> No. According to the Bible, it did.

>> It did lead to forgiveness, but that didn't save them. That didn't put them in heaven. Nobody went to heaven. Nobody's in heaven right now.

>> That That's because there was no concept of a heaven or a hell

>> up until the helanization of Judaism.

>> The Yeah. Because before Jesus came, it was just God in his throne. He wasn't taking people into heaven because the idea was for Jesus to allow the children to be

>> What do we have? What's the afterlife look like in the Old Testament? Except

>> uh Abraham's bosom.

>> No. Are you talking about Schul?

>> Sh.

>> Okay. Where is the separation between them and other unalive people?

>> Well, they What do you mean? Abraham's bosom suggests that they are in a different place than all other unal alive peoples.

>> Unless that's heaven.

>> Well, well, there was no there like the hell was also if you if you think about that there wasn't like heaven wasn't how how it is after Jesus. Then why would hell be the same? They I would like I would

>> I could what I've researched

>> is the place where everybody went. So when Jesus went to shol to preach, anybody was able to hear him that live that died and that was down there, not just his people.

>> So he didn't go actually go to Shiel. Uh he went to Hades, which is a Greek and uh underworld.

>> Well, so can I speak?

>> You need context though, but okay.

>> Yeah, I'm going to start from the very beginning. So ancient Israel didn't have a concept of an afterlife. They had shiel which literally meant just grave or pit. So basically wherever they put your body that that's where you were um dirt and nappen. Okay. It's not until uh the helanization of Judaism is when we start to see um in the book of Daniel is when we start to see some kind of a a theory of an afterlife um emerge. And that's because they were taking bits of uh the helenic belief system and and putting it into their own. It's it's an evolutionary process of religion, especially when you have a whole bunch of uh groupings of people start intertwining with each other. They they share and adapt in into their religions. That's just something that happens, right?

>> And then it's not until the New Testament that you get into this idea of hell. Well, what is hell? So, first and foremost, it was never called hell because that's a Germanic term that didn't come until much later based off of the goddess hell and and Helheim. Okay. What we had the words that were used were Geana, which was an actual place on earth. It was a garbage dump

>> in which they threw bodies into a pit of fire. Uh they would also unal alive people. Um, they also that's where their lepers hung out too. And that's why it talks about the internal eternal hellfire because that fire that they were throwing garbage and bodies into was always constantly going 24/7. And then we have Hades, which is just the Greek underworld. So why Jesus was preaching about a Greek and Roman life considering this god is a jealous god uh is beyond me. But here we are. And then we also have uh in revelation the whole lake of fire brimstone scary stuff right well that comes from the Greek idea of tarderus but even then they misused that concept because tarderus was only meant for the most heinous of people think Schmidler right so there there is no actual even today the Jews do not believe in an eternal conscious torment

>> and there there is an afterlife but They don't know what it is because the afterlife for the Jewish people is inconsequential because it's based upon what you do here on earth.

>> Yeah, that's not what Christianity teaches also.

>> Yeah, I know. Because Christianity teaches based off of a helenized viewpoint rather than a Jewish one. They adopted the belief systems of the Greeks and Romans.

>> I heard you. Yeah. So, what language was the New Testament written in?

>> Greek.

>> There you go. I don't have to say anything else about that. He said Hades because they spoke Greek. So there's one. So besides

>> So why wouldn't he se

>> he's using Greek, right?

>> Yeah. He's speaking to people.

>> That was your point,

>> right? So why wouldn't he make up another Paul is famous for making up terms to try to fit in with a different concept. Um, we could look at Malachoy for that. So whenever we're talking about him, when we say that he's not talking about Hades, why would he not make up a word or make a conjunction of words to make sure that he's saying something different than Hades?

>> Well, now you're limiting God.

>> No, I'm talking about Paul.

>> Oh, Paul is not Jesus. So why do they have to say the same thing?

>> Because he's the one that talks about Hades and Tartis the most.

>> Okay, but what I'm saying is

>> like I don't remember about Hades. Maybe he did in a couple places, but for me, I remember him talking about Gehenna like Nick was saying,

>> it is Gehenna. He was talking about for the most part.

>> Yeah. And the lake of fire in Revelations doesn't say that's where we that's that's hell right now. That's after the thousand-year range.

>> Could I please get um everybody in here to interact with the poll at the top left in the on the blue clipboard and to like and share the live, tap the screen, follow the host, give the panel if you like what they're saying. We need

>> We need a third option that says both. That's why I haven't been voting.

>> Yeah.

>> Yes.

>> Here, I'm going to redo it. Y'all stand by.

>> Thank you, Nick, for that. True. A lot of atheists like come in here and they don't understand the prompt because it's either one is not bad for us and pagans as well. Um, but this is to get interaction with Christians and they think both are bad. So, I'm trying to figure out which is worse in the world view. If you're a Christian in the comments, feel free to send a guest request up. I would love to have a conversation with you. We're trying to stay cordial as much as possible. Um,

>> so yeah, Seth, so the question is, if if Paul is talking about something different than Hades, why is he using the word?

>> No, I thought that you said that Paul was saying something different than Jesus was saying.

>> I thought that was what you were saying.

>> Yes. When we're looking at what Jesus is saying, right, he's talking about Schol or Ghana, excuse me. He's using Ghana. But when Paul is talking, he's using um Hades and Tartus.

>> Jesus also did use Hades.

>> And so

>> that's something. So I don't see

>> I'm unaware of that, but I'm not going to say you're lying about that. But I would say

>> even won't stand against it. And when he was building his church and he went to uh uh Chesar Philippi and he said to Peter that you will be my rock in which I build my church and not even the gates of Hades will stand against it.

>> Okay.

>> And what and what uh book is that in? Is that in John?

>> Um that's a good question actually. I just remember the I don't remember the actual exact

>> Go ahead, Nick.

>> So we know by the text when it says hell Jesus is saying Gana. Great. So in in the Old Testament scripture then what what would be the Jewish equivalent of Hades? Because we we can back and forth between terminology to see what they were talking about in the New Testament. So where's the back and forth for Hades in the Old Testament so we know what they're talking about?

>> Well, like we like you and I talked about the Jewish people didn't have Jesus. So, they didn't have the idea that they were going to be saved and go to heaven.

>> No, no, no. That's that's not what I'm asking because we know when Jesus says hell, the original term used was geana. And we know Geana was a place on earth, right? So, Geana was not a Greco Roman term. Right. So, what what is the the Israelite term for Hades? What's the equivalent?

>> Well, we we talked about that though. They don't have one because it was before Jesus.

>> Right. Right. Ex. No, it's not because it was before Jesus. Holy crap. Okay, let's let's simplify this a little bit more. Okay, we have a jealous god. Correct.

>> We have a god that says, "Thou shalt not have any other gods before me." Correct.

>> Amen.

>> Okay. Why would he use a Greco Roman afterlife to punish his people?

>> He's not. I mean, Hades is literally Greek. Tardus is literally Greek. The idea of heaven, which is allesium, is literally Greek.

>> Who are they talking about?

>> Why is a Jewish god using Greeks? Period.

>> For one, the the world that they lived in was Greek.

>> No. No. Okay. So, we have the entirety of the

>> He's not getting it. Oh, I'm trying to explain.

>> I'm gonna try a different way. I'm gonna try a different way. We have the Tanakh, correct?

>> Yes.

>> Okay. And the Tanakh was written by by Hebrew and Aramaic uh scribes, correct?

>> Yes.

>> Okay. So, Jesus was an Israelite, correct?

>> Yeah.

>> So, so if they were able to write the entirety of the Tanakh, why were they unable to write the entirety of the New Testament? didn't happen yet.

>> What the [ __ ] While it was happening and after it happened, why why wasn't it written?

>> Why was it not written in Hebrew or Aramaic? Why was it written in Greek?

>> Because the common trade language was Greek. Everybody spoke Greek.

>> Okay. So why why

>> when Paul was writing the letters to the churches might not have spoken other languages getting frustrated DC I'm mathing it out for him and he's still not seeing it.

>> No you're mapping it out. My math adds up.

>> Sure. So when we're looking at it why is Paul using Hades? These people are Greek like you said, right?

>> So they understand what he's saying.

>> Okay. So they understand what Hades is. He's not correcting them or re-educating them on what Hades is necessarily.

>> He's using a terminology to help them understand what's

>> not just a terminology, not just a terminology, my friend. He's using their afterlife to

>> threaten terminology.

>> So,

>> no, this is a concept, not just a termin,

>> hold on. If Paul wants to if Paul wants to say this is not the Hades that you understand, where is that scripture?

>> Well, again, I'm not saying that. What I'm saying is that he's trying to help them. You're saying it's not you're saying to be clear, Seb

>> to be clear, you're saying that this is not the Greek afterlife that he's using. You're saying it's something completely different.

>> What I will say is that he is using the concept of the Greek afterlife talking to people who speak Greek things so that they can understand of the Greek afterlife. You just said it.

>> But a concept doesn't mean

>> you just said it.

>> A concept is a fact.

>> No, a concept is not a fact. You You're saying that they were using the Greek and Roman afterlife. You just said it.

>> Yeah. And Roman.

>> So, you just said without even realizing it that you don't believe in hell.

>> I don't know about hell because there's not much that talks about it in the Bible. All I know is separation from God is what happens when you don't follow him.

>> Okay. And what does that look like to you?

>> I don't know. I'm not there.

>> All I know is where I'm going to go. It's not going to be there. And your math is mathing.

>> He's trying to explain something to these people. He's trying to tell them the weight of not following Christ. He's not trying to tell them you're going to burn. He's trying to tell them the weight of sin is death.

>> Period.

>> Okay.

>> So, when we go back to the the prompt here, would you rather your child be LGBT or an atheist? Do you think God's going to send either one of these groups to hell?

>> That depends. It depends on what

>> on their repentance on their faith in Jesus Christ.

>> Okay.

>> And so what is that? What do they have to do to get uh that salvation?

>> Uh what you have to do is you have to believe that Jesus Christ lived and died for your sins and resurrected and is the God.

>> We'll stop there. We'll stop there. How does someone believe?

>> Well, there's there's multiple different forms of the word belief is an action word.

>> Okay. You start by taking something in.

>> So you start by like hearing about something uh learning.

>> And when you learn, you can make that decision. Okay. What what am I learning? Is it true or is it not? And there's ways to test that.

>> And then okay,

>> so it's pretty much so you agree that it's pretty much convincing.

>> That's how it starts.

>> It's pretty much being convinced. Okay.

>> That's how it starts. So, and so whenever we're talking about atheists specifically, they're just not convinced of the claim. So, why would your God punish them for something he does not make clear evidence for?

>> Oh, he does.

>> Well, not clear enough for them. Well, obviously not because we have atheists.

>> Well, that's that's not God's problem. That's the people's problem.

>> How is that not God's problem? Does he not want

>> He gave us

>> I think he said he doesn't will for anyone to perish, right?

>> No, he doesn't.

>> Okay. So, why does he make clear evidence? Why doesn't he make clear evidence that he is real?

>> Can I give you uh clear evidence?

>> Please.

>> So, uh it was about 500 to 700 years before Jesus was born and it was well before like Roman crucifixions weren't a thing back then. But in Isaiah 53 talks about a sinless servant. And earlier in Isaiah it talks about somebody who is going to have the rank of God. So if he's not talking about Jesus, he's blaspheming. And that means that's BS, right? So the book in Isaiah 53, it talks about um surely he took upon our pain and bore our suffering. Yet we considered him punished by God. It also says uh we like sheep have gone astray. Each of us has turned to our own way and the Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all. So this was years and years before Jesus and this explains how he was pierced for our transgressions uh crushed for our iniquity in iniquities. All this kind of stuff that perfectly explains Jesus's death.

>> No, that explains that.

>> No, it's literally a mistrans. So 500 years ago, someone predicted you would live and how you

>> So first of all, that wasn't written 500 years before Jesus. Second of all, okay, second of all,

>> what about the Dead Sea Scrolls?

>> They show that it is. The Dead Sea Scrolls show that it is.

>> Dead Sea Scrolls show the prophet. Like they

>> When were the Dead Sea Scrolls written?

>> Well, I don't know, but

>> Oh my god.

>> Hey, let me Jesus isn't in the Dead, my guy.

>> The prophet Isaiah.

>> How can you believe something you don't understand?

>> The prophet Isaiah was like 300 to 700 years before Jesus. He

>> How long did it take them to write Isaiah?

>> Well, I don't know. I'm not 25 years old. I'm not a whole scholar of the Bible.

>> Okay, that's totally fine. Well, it took them a really long time. They were still writing Isaiah. Nick can correct me if I'm wrong, but they were still writing. I think Isaiah 50, that would actually be the last parts of Isaiah. So, that would be in the first century, right, Nick? That they're still writing it or close to it.

>> It they were Whoa. Are you okay, dog? Sorry, my dog just had a weird sneezing foot. Um it it took him a long time to write Isaiah because it's actually written in three parts and the uh it's pretty much all revolving around the Babylonian exile. Um the suffering servant has been proven time and time again. It was talking about Israel. There's multiple references throughout Isaiah to the suffering servant being Israel. And the this is what I tell Christians all the time. Isaiah is not one of those books that you can cherrypick verses from.

>> It has to be read in its entire teeth.

>> If I'm sorry to say this, but you say a lot of things and it's hard to attack one thing you say because you say multiple different things.

>> It's okay difference.

>> Um, no, I just I can't keep track.

>> It's fine. It is a lot to keep track of, but the thing is if you really want to understand um Isaiah, there are free Yel courses that you could take and it goes through the whole Isaiah.

>> So what I will say,

>> these are literal scholars. These are literal Bible scholars that go through Isaiah and like even someone that just barely studies, right? Even you don't have to have a degree to understand these things. Even someone who just barely studies Isaiah will understand the suffering servant is not Jesus. It's Israel.

>> It's Jacob. It's Yahweh's portion.

>> Do you understand what prophetic language is?

>> Do you understand what prophetic languages?

>> Yes, sir. I understand that if you refer if I tell you my door is going to open, but three people open the door in the next hour. Which one was I talking about?

>> Yeah, I don't know if you're not clear about who. Isaiah is talking about one thing, but because he's a prophet,

>> there is a greater understanding to the words he is using.

>> So basically, you're saying it could be any of them that you choose. So if you just tell me that someone's going to open the door, and there's three people that open the door, you get to just pick whichever one that's more convenient for your belief.

>> No, what I'm saying is that my prophecy about the door being open was fulfilled. I don't know which one it was. What I'm saying is that there was three different times that was fulfilled, but I'm only referring to one time. So Isaiah is referring to one thing, but he is also, if you look at the book of Revelations, this happens. There's so many things that has happened in Revelations over the course of history. Jesus still hasn't come back.

>> Gods, don't get me started on Revelation.

>> No, I'm not. I'm just using it as an example.

>> Revelation. So when we're talking about the suffering servant, it's very clear all through Isaiah, the suffering servant is Israel.

>> And who is Jesus? The new Israel, the new covenant.

>> No,

>> because Jesus

>> we have

>> Hold on, hold on, hold on. Jesus didn't fulfill the new covenant as uh prescribed in Jeremiah. Jeremiah has the new

>> Jeremiah has the outline for the new covenant. He didn't fulfill it.

>> Well, I'll open it right now. What is it? Give me a second.

>> It's probably in the header of one of the codes. Yeah, I might be able to find it.

>> Hey, Scribbles. Thanks for being here, buddy.

>> Hey, what's up, brother?

>> Hey, nothing much. What's your take on the background? Um, would you rather your child be LGBT or an atheist?

>> My child could be both and I wouldn't care.

>> Love I love that answer.

>> Uh, and I am a Christian and Deconstruction knows that. That's probably why he loves the answer.

>> Yeah, Super rare.

>> It's in first Corinthians 5:12.

>> Who am I to judge those outside of the church?

>> Amen.

>> Do you think that someone in the LGBTQ community can be inside the church?

>> Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I I just think that when it comes to the practicing of uh relationships and and you know smeual relations that it just has to be done for pure reasons. I mean I think if you're just having smecks to have smacks, you know, oh well I don't think it's really harming anything but it's not exactly like you're dedicating your life to that person either.

>> Yeah.

>> But like member in the members in the LGBTQ community could be not doing it

Just for the hell of it. Right.

Well, I don't think I don't think most of them are just doing it for the hell of it, but I think there's people in all aisles that do it just for the hell of it. Same. So, and that isn't wrong, by the way. At least according to God, so long as you're married.

Y'all hear me? Great. Yes. Okay. Did you get that? No. No. You're great. You're great, Jesse. Nick, did you have the um verses?

Yeah. Jeremiah, it starts at it's Jeremiah 31 and it starts at verse 31 and goes all the way to verse 40.

Um, y'all make sure you're tapping the screen in the meantime. Like the live, share the live. Hey, Scribble. Miss you. It's been a while. I've been on the religious lives a little bit less lately. I'm tired of arguing with Christians. Totally agree. Some of them, it's not even like that they make points to they're good or not. It's just they're a lot of them are really incessant.

Well, I mean, a lot of them hear like a few things in church and, you know, they hear a few verses as they're going around these Tik Toks, but they don't take the the time to understand them. in Hebrew or Greek or Aramaic or even in English.

Yeah. Well, that's why like for example, my pastor, he he will always like break down the Greek and Hebrew and stuff for us to like understand.

And I think that's crucial. Oh, amen. Yeah, it is. You know, some a lot of not even just some, most churches won't ever offer that. Uh so then you kind of have to rely on solos scriptorra and understanding these languages on your own.

Which is rough. Sounds like a Catholic thing. According lately, most churches won't even offer a baby formally either. But I'm personally fine with solo scriptor Torah. I mean, it's the Holy Spirit who's the greatest teacher. And in first Corinthians, uh I know I've this second time bringing it up. Paul writes that you shouldn't rely upon him. You shouldn't rely upon Mark. You shouldn't rely upon Matthew. You shouldn't rely rely upon any of them because they don't fully understand themselves. the greatest teacher is Jesus or the Holy Spirit in which you come into that relationship and learn over time.

I mean, if the Holy Spirit was doing its job, we wouldn't have 40,000 denominations of Christianity. Just saying.

Well, you're blaming the people for God's. But to receive the Holy Spirit, there's some criteria that I don't think any church has met.

I could agree on that. I don't think anybody met that far. I I think a big thing too that like like to understand is that just because somebody says they're Christian doesn't make them a Christian.

It doesn't mean they're actually living up to the tenants or capable of receiving the Holy Spirit. We're all saints who struggle with sin of God.

How is that not how is that not Scotsman fallacy? Well, okay, there's still Christians, right? Like you can define yourself what you want, but when we're looking at the book itself and the ideals that you are supposed to base your life off of and following them, not only do most Christians fall short in this world, they don't care. They don't really meaningfully try to change it unrepentant.

So Paul say about free them into the hands of the devil. Sorry.

Seb, what do you what do you believe about um not being promoted in life after you receive salvation? I think everybody receives salvation. I think there might just be a period of punishment for those who didn't come to God. That would be proportional.

We're talking about biblical Christians, quote unquote, right? Paul did say that after you receive your salvation, you shouldn't if you're not married, you shouldn't get married. If you don't have kids, you shouldn't have kids because Jesus is coming too soon for that to even matter.

Oh, okay. What he's trying to say there is when you when you get put when you f when you're when you're in a position let's say he says in that book that you're quoting um if you're a slave don't just go try to get your freedom because you're with God now allow God to do that. No what he's saying is don't be promoted in life like don't get married. Sorry Nick go ahead.

Uh I don't want to apologetics today. Um sorry can we uh do the new covenant DC? It is your live but I wanted to ask you uh first permission for sure if not for sure for sure.

Okay. So the days are surely coming says the Lord when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah. It will not be like the covenant that I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt. A covenant that they broke though I was their husband, says the Lord. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel o after those days says the Lord. I will put my law within them and I will write it on their hearts and I will be their God and they shall be my people. No longer shall they teach one another or say to each other know the Lord for they shall all know me from the least of them to the greatest Lord for I will forgive their iniquity and remember their sin no more. So let's stop there for now. is um

Jesus fulfilled that. No, because uh his his word is not on the hearts of all people and and we still do you still have to teach non-believers about Jesus? Do you like do you do you still have to teach that he is God?

Um that's what the apostles did. No, no, no. Hold on, hold on. It says, "No longer shall they teach one another, Satan to each other, know the Lord, for they shall all know me. Does all people on earth from the least of them to the greatest know him?"

Did you explain an exact time? This This is the prophecy of the new covenant. You are claiming that you're under the new covenant with Jesus. So, under the new covenant with Jesus, does everyone from the least of us to the greatest know him or does it still have to get taught?

Not yet. Um, like I said, you claim, are we currently under the new covenant?

You're trying to say two different things. Are we Yes or no? Do Christians claim we are under the new

I'm answering your your uh your trap question. Sorry. It's not a trap question. It's like, well, I explained to you and it's not good enough.

Okay. So, what you're being now is disingenuous. No, I explained to you my answer. No. Yes or no? Are Christians under the new covenant?

I'm not allowing you to have a foothold over me right now. Okay. Uh, do you see this is pointless? You're just not letting me answer. If you want the answer you want, don't ask me the question. Oh, I want a yes or no question. Do Christians believe we're under the new covenant? Yes or no?

I know what you're going to come up with. Then you're going to say, "Well, because I say yes, that's not the new covenant." And I don't want to connect. It's because you know it's not going to be favorable to your position. I know that she's trying to put me in a position to make it seem not favorable to me. So I'm trying to explain to her the truth. Listen, whenever we're talking about the prophecies, what you said, you said that you wanted to know specifics. She's bringing up specifics. This is what she do. This is what's happening right now, right? And now that we're bringing up specifics, you're trying to run from it or saying it's a trap question. No, this is the prophecy of the new covenant. If you say that this is the new covenant, which Christians do say that, we know that, right?

We know about disposationalism. Yep. Okay. So then I don't know why you're running from it. I'm not trying to explain to you how like the New Testament is the new covenant, right? I already know how this conversation's going to go because you're going to say, "Oh, well, because nobody knows him yet.

Um, not everybody knows him yet. Um, it's not true. The Bible, the Bible has to be spread across the nations. Jesus sent his disciples to spread the gospel, right? Which shows he did not fulfill that prophecy.

The prophecy will be fulfilled. It doesn't No, no, no, no. It has to be fulfilled within a lifetime. Otherwise, people can We've been waiting 2,000 years for everyone to know about this dude. Okay.

There's a book about it is accurate. What? There's a book that's historically accurate if you want to read that one. There's 66 books in there. Uh, you don't think I've read the Bible? Oh, so Jerusalem's not real. King David didn't exist. King Solomon didn't exist. King Saul didn't exist.

Well, I mean, okay, everybody go everybody uses this, and I hate using arguments that everybody uses, but [ __ ] it, right? Like, Spider-Man was in New York. Like if you watch the cartoons, they use literal mayors of New York. He's the new Miss Spider. Yeah, but did did somebody that's in New York right now write down that they saw Spider-Man swinging and did Well, I'm sure there are people that people I'm sure that you can get plenty of people in New York to attest to that.

Okay, but now you're saying like now you're just talking silly stuff because it's not one person that claimed this. This is a book that's been preserved over 1500 years. No other book has that. It's a reductio in absurdum.

So what has happened because I raised you sound like Darth the new covenant that you claim to be in because I was ra um raising a point right now all of a sudden you've got cognitive dissonance. All right. Now suddenly you are separating yourself because your brain is is literally trying to run away on you. I'm not I'm trying to answer your question. You're not letting me.

Okay. So, I want to go back to my question. Do Christians believe that we Jesus fulfilled the law and we are in the new covenant. Yes or no?

I'm not giving you a yes or no answer. I'll give you the answer. I give. So, that's cognitive dissonance. Your brain is your brain is literally running away from the You're setting me up for failure. I know what you're going to trying to set you up for failure. We're just making a point. As much as this question could easily be answered with a yes or no. Technically, he does have he can say, "Hey, look, this is a loaded question fallacy, uh, you're you're giving me something that has a [ __ ] ton of information behind it and expect me to answer with a yes or no."

It doesn't have a [ __ ] of information because I take it one bit at a time. This is we're dealing with one prophecy, not 10. Okay. The prophecy requirements about prophecies. The prophecy wait is that messianic prophecies. Okay. What he wanted to use was Isaiah 53 as evidence. This is where it all began. He said there is evidence and he's going to give it to us. He gave us Isaiah 53 which is talking about Israel. It's not talking about Jesus. Okay. And then we were like okay let's and he's assumes that we don't understand prophecy. So when we actually go to messianic prophecies, he you guys are trying to throw out fallacies. He's trying to say it's trap and we're literally just saying, "Okay, well, if you're going to accuse us of not knowing prophecies, let's actually go through the real ones."

Yeah. No, I'm trying to So what I was trying to explain is that what I explained with Isaiah is that just because of like Jesus fulfilled the prophecies that and the prophecies are and that's Oh my god, he interrupted me. you. If you didn't interrupt me, maybe you'd actually know what I'm trying to say. We do. Since we've had this conversation with It's got to be well over a thousand Christians by now. Okay. Prophetic language referencing multiple periods of time, not just one.

It's not worth that. So, hold on. Se Can you just give us a list of prophecies that he fulfilled? The cult, the Wats for clothes, the crucifixion. Okay. So the in the messianic prophecies of the Messiah, there is no crucifixion.

Well, obviously there's not a legit crucifixion. Roman crucifixion. No, no, no. So the whole point to the Messiah, right? The whole No, no. I'm about to give you is some free education. This is some university level [ __ ] that I'm about to give you for free. Okay. So, and Okay. So, you're just going to, you know what? I'm going to ignore that. I'm going to I'm going to be a good person today. I woke up decided I'm going to be a good person. So, I'm going to continue to be a good person today. So, the Israelites in Judaism, right? The whole point to having a Messiah was to prepare the world for the return of God so God could dwell on earth with us. because they want to bring heaven to earth, not put people into heaven. They want to fix earth so we can be abundant and multiply and things are the way that they should have been. Okay? So the Messiah, Christians believe that he couldn't do that if he was unalived, right? He couldn't prepare the world if he was unal alive. So there is literally zero messianic prophecies. Okay? There's there's major five five major messianic prophecies. None of them have anything to do with the Messiah being unalived. Not a single one because he was supposed to um be a mediator and and sit on the throne, physical throne of David here on earth to get the world and people ready for God to return. You can't do that.

What do you mean you can't do that? You You can't do that if if you came for 33 years and then were brutally unalived. But you're you're giving the wrong you're getting human logic. Hold on. We have an echo. So if you're not talking, let's meet up. Go ahead. Uh like that's human logic. No, that's God came down and died, but didn't die and stay dead. He resurrected. He came back to life.

Jesus is as much God as Moses was. No, Jesus is God. Moses is not God. No, you just I feel like the pro I feel like we're going to be stuck in cognitive dissonance. You're going to be digging your heels in. Okay. So, we're just going to go with this one. What is God a title to you? This is popular apologetics. God's not his name. Yeah. It's a title, right? Yeah. Okay. And there are certain properties for one to fill to be considered God. I assume you would agree with that. You have to be the father, son, and the holy spirit. Yeah. Okay. So that's not the properties. Okay. So we're talking about properties. We're talking about omnipropies. So do you think do you think that God is supreme? 100%. So he doesn't need approval before he does things. Correct. He doesn't know. He doesn't get approval before. Okay. When Jesus says in John, he says that he doesn't do anything without the father's approval because he is God. Or what about John 17:3 when it says the only true God is God the father because God the father is above Jesus. Jesus is a son. He's subject to the god. Yet have you read the parable of the wicked tenant? He describes exactly his role in the entire hierarchy. He's the son of the vineyard owner who inherits all but is not the vineyard owner himself.

I want to say thank you everybody for the 9.2,000 likes. I do appreciate it. All the gifts you got, Jesse, you're amazing. This is going to help me give my gifts to uh friends who are doing good work on here on TikTok. We kind of just pass them on. Um, I do appreciate that. I do have a book. I just want to give this promotion. I do have a book uh 500 reasons why you are better than the Evangelical God. If you want to go ahead and DM me, um, I will send you the info on info on that. That helps me run my communities on Facebook and other things. Okay, Seth, go ahead.

So, if you don't think that Jesus is God, then maybe you shouldn't have a Bible or believe it. Yeah. Well, I came to that conclusion using Jesus's words himself, not the writings of Paul, which are heavily uh they're heavily manipulated. Um, I don't rely upon Matthew or Mark or anyone else just like I'm told to in first Corinthians. I'm told not to rely upon these people by Paul himself. Uh, and I I sought Jesus for revelation there and it it was made very abundant to me. He knew that there was one God. That one God was not him. It was the one that's greater than him, which is his father. And he is the one who will inherit all.

Do you understand why Paul was saying that to the Corinthians? Uh, yes, I do. I've read all of Corinthians. first. Do you understand why Paul was saying not to follow certain people? But yes, he said because they didn't know everything. They didn't have the full spiritual truth and only Jesus did. That's part of it. That's part of it. Um I mean that's the reason he said so. Yeah. But do you do you understand what was happening at the church of Corinth? Uh yeah, they were falling into sexual idolatry or sexual immorality, idolatry, other things like that. So what they were doing as well they were writing a pagan they were writing their paganism into the books. There was also something else. They were extremely divided. So they were saying that I'm better than my brother because I follow Paul. And the brother was saying I'm better than my brother because I follow Silas. So it's not about don't believe what we're saying. It's about don't exalt yourself because you believe a person. Exalt yourself because you believe Christ and you don't exalt yourself. Paul literally said, Paul literally said, "If any other apostle comes to you, if there's any angel that comes to you saying a different thing, don't believe them."

So why would they not be doing that? Saying a different thing. So that was John. Preaching a different gospel. That was Paul. So So my thing is, so I guess that's kind of a tangent. My thing is, okay, is God omnipresent? Yes. Okay. when Jesus was telling them, "I'm going to go away and there's going to be a comforter." That's John, I believe, right? Uh I don't know. Maybe. Okay. But you know what I'm talking about. He's talking about when he's going to send the Holy Spirit, which uh where does it say? I just want to open it up so I'm not Okay, let me find it real quick. Sorry. I just uh quickly while he's finding it, I just want to say as he said um so basically what Paul was saying to the Corinthians wasn't don't believe me. What he was saying was don't commend yourself because of a human belief in following a human. He was saying if anybody comes preaching a gospel different than the gospel of Jesus Christ, don't listen to them. He was also saying I don't come to you with um with knowledge of my own. I don't come to you trying to persuade you. He was there as a as for Jesus. He wasn't Paul wasn't writing to to Corinth to be like, "Well, look at me. I'm Paul." He wasn't, you know, he says he became like the pagans to convert the pagans. He became like the Jew to convert the Jew. Uh he became like these people to convert them. And so when he did that, a lot of their philosophy from the previous religions remained. Uh but as to why he said not to follow him, sure he said you should only take pride in the Lord if you're going to be prideful at all. But he was very clear. He said do not rely upon my words. Do not rely upon the words of Mark and Matthew. He says don't rely upon these people. Not that you can't listen to them or follow them or take in what they're saying or believe what they're saying, but don't rely upon them because he said there is one teacher that's greater than them that knows better than them. I want to ask a quick quick question to the Christians while DC's getting that because it's kind of off topic. Um, are you guys familiar with the baby formula social experiments going on right now? I'm not. Um, pretty much there's there's somebody there calling uh churches and they're playing a recording of excuse me like a baby crying in the background and they're asking the church if they can donate the baby formula because baby hasn't eaten in a couple of days. And the number of churches that denied were alarming. They're not like, she wasn't accepting the formula. She was letting them know it's a social experiment if they said yes. Um, but most of the churches said no. There's been more uh there's been more mosques and temples.

I was just going to see what you what Christians thought of the lack of response of churches. Yeah, that's sad. A lot of churches around the world right now are like really having a hard time with their uh with what they're following. I believe that the synagogue of Satan description that Jesus puts forth, uh, most of the churches now would fall in that description as well. They they've also become synagogues of Satan. They're just I wholeheartedly agree with that. They're they're they're selfishly human. Nothing about God. It's all by the altar. And it's really sad, too, because the the church leaders of the churches that denied it, like they make videos afterwards. Some of them even called the woman a witch uh shaming single mothers. Some of them went on there a couple a few of them apologized and said we need to do better but not before like praising their church. But it's just been really strange like the response to it and the lack of response.

So John 16:7 we said God is omnipresent right? Okay. So do you want to turn there before I start reading? Is that okay? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, skip ahead. Oops. I'm already there. Sword drills. 16. So, next page, verse seven. Yeah. Can you go ahead and read that? Yeah. Very truly I tell you, it is for your own good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the advocate will not come to you. But if I go, I will send him to you. He's talking about himself, right? And so if God if God is omnipresent and Jesus is God, how can he go away? Because he's in the form of a man. So but even as God even his godhood's going away. He said I am going away. He's not saying a part of me is going away does it? Yeah. So So was was God. Okay. This is this is where it gets um so God and Jesus Jesus. Here comes a pretzel, guys. No, give me a pretzel in the chats. Give me a pretzel. It's not a pretzel. Jesus humbled himself as into the form of a man. Okay. He limited his own power because he's all powerful. He can do that. And became a man. And so when he was a man, he was not in the same accordance as he was when he was with the father before and after his life on earth. He would be the father. there to be no separate separation. We were separate because he humbled himself because he can do that because he's God. Again, no, you can't say God can't do something because he's all powerful. God cannot. Let's just get this. All powerful. No, God is a very private. Hold on. Scribble. Scribble. Hold on. We We Scribble. We agreed that God is a title. Correct. Yep. Yes. And we both agreed that there are properties that God must fulfill. A being must fulfill to be considered God. Right. But you're you're limiting the Yes or no? We just need to make this so simple. We just need to make it really simple. There are properties that God has and if someone if a being does not have those properties, we should not consider them God. Right. Sure. Okay. And you believe God is omni. He has the omni properties. Yeah, he's all powerful. He's omnisient. He's omnipresent. Correct. Yeah. He's unlimited. So don't you can't limit him by human logic because he's not human logic. Okay. So when we talk Okay. And so what I don't want that to be is a back door for your brain. Okay. So when we say God is when we say God is not limited by logic, do you not think God created logic? He did. Okay. So he would actually be violating a law that he created, would he not? Why? No. Like just by creating the law of logic. He is a spirit of truth. Why did he create? If he's a spirit of truth, the law of logic is here to help us understand what is true and what is right. What is true and what is wrong. Correct? Mhm. Okay. So, there we go. If something violates the law of logic, it's probably satanic and it's probably there to manipulate you. So, when we look at this, we say, "Okay, God is omnipresent." What are we reading in John right here? The verse you just read. Jesus says, "What?" You're you're just circling on yourself, man. No, I'm not. Yeah, I know what you're saying. I know what you're saying because Jesus isn't omnipresent. He's not God. I know what you're trying to say. That's not true. Okay, there we go. or all powerful, all knowing, he might be he might be able to make a case for all never mind you can't even say all loving because he says he hates iniquity. Can I ask you something? So when we say that God is hold on so when we say that God is all knowing Jesus says that there is a day and hour that he doesn't even know. He stripped himself of his title became a man. He's also explained as uh growing in wisdom. So he stripped himself of the title. So, you're saying that while he was here, he was fully man, correct? He was fully God and fully man because he still had his divinity. You can't be too he can cuz he's a limitless one. I need pretzels in the chat. There's no way this is a twist. No pretzel here, my friend. You are trying big ass pretzel. No, no. Let me give you logic. Stop interrupting me, please. This is logic. Limitless versus limited. You can't take if if something is limited, the limited can't take the limitless and make it limit limited because So, do you know why that doesn't created time? He still lives outside of time. He's not breaking any laws. We're not going to load it down. We're not going to load it down. You just said the You just said he gave up his godhood, which means the thing that would make him limitless, he gave away. But But you're not understanding that he You're not the son did that. Not Not the Father or the Holy Spirit. Okay. So the son did that. So he's no longer God. He's not limitless. He gave that power away. Well, I don't think I don't think he really understands what God is in the in the Hebrew or the Greek because they're the same word. The Greek is derived from the Hebrew. You are a god. I am a god. The Pharisees are god. The Sadducees are gods. Moses is god. Every prophet who's ever been is god. Every angel that's ever been is a god. They are not the only true god. nor are they the supreme deity. And I think that's where we tend to get it mixed up is that in English, this is where the English translated God is the first commandment. Yes. This is where the English translation [ __ ] us, right? Hold on. Because when we look at like Psalms or even Jesus says, "Do you not know all of you are gods?" Okay. What what gods can mean is like a lord, like your lordship over your house. You're a god over the house. This is literally how this word is used in many places in the Bible. That's why whenever we look at Lord, Lord is spel Lord is different names. That's why we have sometimes the Lord is all capitalized. Sometimes the Lord is uh like the first letter is capitalized. And if I'm not wrong, sometimes it's just a lowercase Lord. So when that happens, it's just like uh someone that's lording over a place. Well, like a mayor or a governor. Elohim and theos, they have the same meanings. Uh it's anything that can be likened unto God in any way. If you are a righteous person, you're a god. You're an Elohim. If you are a divine ruler, you're an Elohim. If you're a divine judge, you're an Elohim. If you're an angel, because you are divine, right? They still have divinity. Just like every human on this earth has divinity, but it is like a fire that needs to be reignited in you, right? Everyone is capable of of of this divinity that Jesus touts, right?

Okay. So, first one, us guys are talking a lot. Nick, is there something that you want to add or Jesse? Is there anything you guys have in your mind to?

Um, unfortunately, I think he's gotten to the point where cognitive dissonance has completely taken over. And I don't know if there is anything I could teach him or say to him that he's going to accept because it's just going to be nuh-uh because I believe this apologetic. So I I really don't know what to say right now. We're just going to pray in the Holy Spirit right now. I bought a Honda, but I should have bought a Nissan. Oh, I bought a Honda, but I should have bought a Nissan. Hallelujah. And we're going to pray right now except that uh Dude, you sound like an American church pastor. Amen. Tongues are languages, not random words. Okay, that's to that's in your interpretation. We're talking about glosselia over here. Uh just like the dianis would have practiced and the people that were around want to talk, right? Yes. Yes. They babbled. And so se um whenever we just we're just praying in the Holy Spirit and we're asking God to have the spirit of truth come and lead you out of your pretzel. And thank you for being up. I followed you. feel free to come up in any other chest that we have. I don't want to lead you further into cognitive dissonance because unfortunately you will dig your heels in at that point and that's not going to be good for you. It's actually unsafe for everyone you know. You can a lot of people become violent in that state of mind and um really psychosis is the next step. So