Transcription
Maybe I'll ask you then. So, how sure are you out of a hundred you're going to heaven?
My problem with you is your characterization of penal substitutionary atonement.
Can but can you answer that question between zero to 100? Like what do you think?
You're trying to run from my arguments here. 1 Thessalonians 4 says that if you abandon sanctification, you abandon God. How does that not uh how does that justify easy belieism?
Yes, it does. Again, I don't you're not actually complying. You notice how you said I'm going to comply with the viewer chat rules here, but you're not really doing that. Instead, I'm trying I'm trying. Yeah, Alex, looks like you're not actually complying with the rules. I would encourage you, man, to read through Romans.
But once you realize, don't you want to have peace with God, Alex?
Of course I do. But easy belieism is not the way, which is what you believe. We're talking about being justified by faith. You muted me again. You muted me again. By coming on the viewer chat, you agree to get to the point quickly. Make sure you have a question or topic you want to ask about.
Not interrupt Ryan when he was speaking. I'll bet you they added that one after his interaction with Val.
Give me your justification of your 27 books. How you know them to be true. Okay.
You're missing You're missing my point. I'm I'm pointing out the special plea when I'm pointing out the special p. So I'm just simply asking right I'm simply asking the epis let me make the point7 book canon but I just want to keep things come with a humble heart would be my encouragement in this discussion my friend
Ryan will determine when a topic has been sufficiently covered to prevent going around in circles. If Ryan mutes the viewer the viewer is not to unmute themselves. You have to come with a humble heart, ready to learn, not a rude or combative attitude. I hope that these rules go both ways, dude.
I hope that they go both ways. Uh, Spartan Speedrun sent $5 super chat. Thank you, for the super chat. I know it gives grace in some way, but what exactly does the Eucharist do in us and for us? How essential is it for salvation?
God bless you, man.
All right, we'll bring up Alex. Welcome, Eron. Alex. Yo, what's up?
Hey, man. Good to have you here, bro.
Yeah. Well, I want to be open from the get-go here. I am a a YouTuber and I post uh Orthodox content, so I'm an Orthodox Christian. And I guess I'll get straight to the point to adhere to the rules that you have here. I have a problem.
Can Can I see you? Can you turn your camera on? Is that possible or No.
Uh, sure.
I'm also live streaming, so yeah.
Oh, yeah.
Hey, man. Nice to meet you.
How are you?
Yeah, not bad. Not bad. Yeah. So, maybe I'll ask you then. So, how sure are you out of a hundred you're going to heaven?
Uh well, I am saved. I am being saved and I will be saved. Uh I don't think assurance is something that's guaranteed. But again, uh my problem with you is your characterization of penal substitutionary atonement.
Can but can you answer that from zero to 100? Like what do you think?
Uh, I'm pretty sure uh 0 to 100. Uh, I guess I can't say 100.
You can't say 100. Okay.
All right. Do you think Do you think the Apostle Paul could say 100?
Uh, no. I don't think he did.
Really? I think he did. So, have a look at it. Second Timothy 4 verse 18. He says this, "The Lord will rescue me from every evil deed and bring me safely into his heavenly kingdom. To him be the glory forever and ever. Amen. So Paul was sure about where he was going. He knew that the Lord will bring him safely into his heavenly kingdom.
Yeah. I think a better way to look at that is that he has a hope that Christ will bring him into the kingdom because there are other places in Paul's epistles where he very clearly struggles uh with his salvation.
This is not describing any sort of doubt. He's not thinking, look, I'm not sure if God's going to let me in. This is an absolute certainty. In fact, the Bible says we can know. I brought this up earlier on that I write these things to you who believe in the name of the son of God that you may know that you have eternal life. And so if you're like, "Well, I'm not sure. I could I could sin tomorrow. I could end up in hell." Then you don't know you have eternal life.
Uh well, if you look at 1 Corinthians 9, because I'll admit I wasn't prepared to discuss this topic. I did want to talk to you about PSA because that was the topic that you were talking about right before I came on uh came on here. But he talks about like disciplining his body and bringing it into subjection so that he will not be disqualified after preaching.
Uh there are a bunch of things disqualified is not disqualified from salvation here but disqualified from ministry. If you have a look at this entire context here, he's saying like to the weak I became the weak that I might win the weak. have become all things to all people that by any all means possible I might save some. And so he's talking about in his ministry he's making sure that his body he's not going astray into sin unless he be disqualified because if you do give over to sin then it can disqualify the effectiveness of your ministry quite a lot. So, I just don't see anything in what Paul's saying where he's like, I'm not sure where I'm going to go when I die.
Christianity gives us that certainty of salvation.
I'll concede that that point is about his office. What do you have to say about in Titus where he talks about people were disqualified from salvation by their uh actions
init 16? What are you talking about?
Yeah, I don't have the it's Titus chapter 1. I don't have the exact verse citation off the top of my head.
Pull it up.
Is someone tell you
they profess to know God, but they deny him by his works? Yeah.
Yeah. 16. Yeah. So they Yeah. So they they profess to know God. They profess to be a Christian or know God in some sense, but their actions deny him.
So this from knowing God.
Well, no, no. It's saying they profess. It's professing to know God is different to actually truly knowing God. So that verse doesn't support your case either.
Well, okay. What is he supposed to say? That they know God, but then they don't know God because of their works. Cuz in Hebrews 10, St. Paul does explicitly say that
it's saying here they profess to know God. There's people that profess to know God. Even Mormons profess to know God, right? But that doesn't mean they actually truly know God. If they deny the Trinity, they don't really know God. But they're professing to know him.
So you don't think that uh your works disqualify you from salvation?
No. Because I know that in Romans 8:1 it tells us that there is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. You can't be condemned if Christ paid for your sin.
So how do you uh uh bring that together with Hebrews? I think it's I think it's h chapter 10. Again, I don't have the citation off the top of my head because I'm doing this a bit off the cuff here that says that there are those that have tasted of the Holy Spirit and they have fallen away and that if you continue to sin uh intentionally or willfully that there is no sacrifice left for you.
Yeah. In Hebrews 10:26, what you're referring to there is referring to the sin of rejecting Jesus. Right. Because the he's making the contrast here between the animal sacrifice, you look at verse four of the chapter. It is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. Have a look at verse 11 when he says, "Every priest stands daily at his service offering repeatedly the same sacrifices which can never take away sins. But when Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God." So he's the Hebrews are feeling tempted to go back to Judaism and reject Christ. And he's saying, "Look, if you deliberately go ahead and do that, it's a sin, right? to go and deliberately reject Christ, go back to Judaism, there's no sacrifice left because I've already he's made clear that the animal sacrifices cannot save you. And if you reject the once for all sacrifice of Christ, you got no hope. You just got hell to come.
So this says if we sin sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins. You're telling me that this doesn't mean if you sin willfully, this means if you reject Jesus,
which sin are we talking about? The sin of rejecting Jesus. That's a sin, correct? To reject Jesus.
Yes. But this is not specific language. This is just if you sin willfully after we have
you got to read things in context. Have you read the entire chapter of Hebrews 10? It tells just take a verse out of context.
So I want to ask you then, Alex, have you ever done a sin willfully?
Uh yes, of course.
Right. So after coming to the knowledge of the truth, you've done a sin willfully. So if you're taking your interpretation, then man, there's no sacrifice for you. That means you must be going to hell.
Well, that's what we have the sacraments for for confession. And we have tangible of remedy.
It says there's no sacrifice. You can't go to confession if there's no sacrifice for you. If the sacrifice of Christ is null and void for you because you've sinned willfully after coming to Christ, then man, how you're interpreting this means that you've got no hope. You must be going to hell based on your interpretation of this verse.
Well, because you can't take one verse at a time. You know, Paul also teaches us that
read things in context then.
Yes, of course. So, if you then you have a look at the context and you see that the sin from earlier in the chapter to obfuscate a general term later in the chapter. It very clearly says if you sin willfully, you can't restrict the term to what you want it to be earlier in the chapter. It's talking about sacrifices and
so you've sinned. So, so Alex, you've sinned deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth. Then therefore, what's going to come for you? And what it means is there's no longer a sacrifice for your sins. And all there is judgment
and a fury of fire that's going to consume the adversaries. That's what's coming your way based on how you're interpreting this verse
by virtue of your actions. Yeah, that's what
Okay. Well then, man, you're lost then. If you got if you've got no longer Jesus, he can't he's not going to help you cuz there's no sacrifice left. Jesus won't help you.
That's what the sacraments are for.
It doesn't say that. It doesn't say that. If the sacrifice of Jesus is null and void because you're not letting me talk about the greater context cuz in Romans Paul says that if we confess our sins now for so now you're not going to take the context of Hebrews you're going to go to a different book the context of
course you have to take the apostolic deposit as a whole. I understand but you notice you're not actually you said this was a general principle here but now you're not actually taking it as a general principle and saying well actually if you go do a sacrament now you do have a sacrifice for sins but I thought if you think after coming to the knowledge there's no sacrifice left
so where does does the Bible ever say that if you've lost the sacrifice of Jesus if you do a sacrament you then regain the sacrifice of Jesus
yes when Paul says that if you confess confess your sins. He is good to forgive you.
Paul doesn't say that.
Of course he does.
No, you got first John 1:9. I'm not sure how much of the Bible you know, sir, but my encouragement is to ask yourself, does the Bible say that salvation is
I got my citation wrong, but that is in the text.
Yeah, it's it's John. It's not Paul. But
yeah, 1 John 10:9. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. So you can't take just one verse. You have to take the apostolic deposit as a whole. And this is what I think is lacking in your view. Ryan is talking about confession, Alex, to a priest.
Excuse me. You have no concrete means for uh repentance.
Talking about to a priest.
It uh well here, let me pull it up.
Doesn't say that. Doesn't say anything about going to a priest, having to go to confession.
What does it say?
Oh, it doesn't say anything about going. It just says if we confess our sins. Now, if you look at the context of the verse before, Well, if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. So if people claim that they're without sin, deceiving themselves. And he's contrasting those people in verse 8 to the people in verse 9 who if we confess our sins, so as in we are not those who say we don't sin, we confess. And the word confess just means acknowledge there. If we acknowledge our sins, he's faithful and just to forgive us our sins. So as in we acknowledge our sinfulness. So therefore we put our trust in Jesus to save us.
Who do we confess to?
Well I it doesn't it's actually not specific here. In fact I think the word confess specific. Do you know where it's specific?
Well you can confess to God. Um that's fine. You can and it says confess your sins to one another.
Your biblical knowledge we can confess confess to one another says that we can confess to each other. That's exactly what I just said. Confess to one another. Notice it never says to Alex. It never actually says confess to a priest in order to receive forgiveness of sins. Alex, that's not how we get forgiveness of sins. By confessing to a priest. Can you give me one Bible verse that says confess to a priest to get your sins forgiven?
That's a straw man. That's not my position.
Okay.
Excuse me. I don't know how thorough your knowledge of church history is, my brother. I love you, but I don't know how thorough your knowledge of church history is. The way the church practiced this at first was that they would confess out loud to the entire church. However, as more high-profile people join the church, that out loud confession in front of everybody did not become a tenable thing. So that you would go confess to a priest. So we have the sacrament of confession by when you go to the priest, you don't sac, you don't confess to the priest, you confess, you confess to God. The priest simply aids.
It's interesting you say that though. Interesting you say that because I was reading through, let me bring this up. The um this is from the con the Orthodox You said you're Orthodox. Um it says here
in the Orthodox Catechism, basic teachings of the Orthodox faith. Bishop Seritus says, "Let no one say then that he can confess to God himself or to a saint or to an icon. No, it can only be done to a bishop or to a priest and to no one else.
Yeah. Well, if you knew about the Orthodox church, you know that there is no one bishop that speaks for the Orthodox Church. The Orthodox Church speaks through its sinods. So, the standard understanding of the sacraments of
uh I don't know the greater context of this. Based on this one quote, I would say that that is not entirely true. I think that there is more.
So, are you saying that you know better than this this bishop in the Orthodox Church?
No. Well, what I suspect more is that you took that quote out of context.
No, you can go have a look at it you want. All you want to say understanding of confession is that the priest uh helps the confession along, but you're confessing to God. He's just there to uh help the process go along to ask questions, probing questions. Have you ever confessed to your sins to anyone, Ryan? Have you ever confessed to a clergy about your sins? Why? There's I don't see any biblical need to go and confess to a priest in order to try some. In fact, I've I've received forgiveness. I know 100% that I'm going to church.
I know that I've been justified by faith as it makes very clear in Romans 5:1. It says here, "Therefore, since we've been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ." What about first Corinthians 4? It says if you abandon sanctification, you abandon God.
No, I reject I reject your easy belieism.
I reject easy belieism.
So you you you reject that we're justified by faith.
I reject that we're justified by faith alone because the Bible also says that
reject but do but do you reject that we're justified by faith?
No, I reject that we are justified by faith alone.
So then by what means, according to Paul, by what means are we justified then? uh sanctification. We're justified by faith. According to St. Peter, we're justified. So, according to Romans 5:1, we're justified by faith. And what does being justified by faith mean?
You're trying to run from my arguments here. 1 Thessalonians 4 says that if you abandon sanctification, you abandon God. How does that not uh how does that justify easy belieism?
Yes, it does. I don't pull it off. You're not actually complying. You notice how you said I'm going to comply with the viewer chat rules here, but you're not really doing that. Instead, I'm trying to Yeah, Alex, looks like you're not actually complying with the rules. I would encourage you, man, to read through Romans. This is what helped me, Alex, come to know the truth. And I really want you to come to know the knowledge of the truth.
He muted me.
Once you realize no amount of good deeds you could do could ever make you right before God, doesn't matter how many times you pray, get baptized, do do other sacri. not going to make you peace have peace with God. Once you see, I should be in hell for my sins, but Christ died for me. While I was still sinning, Christ died for me. Once you put your trust in him, you'll see this is you'll have peace with God. Not a ceasefire, which you think you may have, Alex, until you do your next sin. But actually true peace, shalom with God. Don't you want to have peace with God, Alex?
Of course I do. But easy belieism is not the way, which is what you are. You're talking about being justified by faith.
Muted me again. You muted me again.
Notice actually instead of dealing with the text, you you you basically present straw man. It's like, oh, easy belieism when Paul says justified by faith. And so my hope um Alex is that once you come to believe in Christ, you'll have the certainty that Paul had when he says, "Since therefore we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God." So if this is true, being justified by his blood, this is even more true,
right? It's definitely going to happen. He's saying,
"So under your view, you could be justified, but then oh, you do a sin, you die in that state of sin, hell, that undermines what the passage is saying here." So, Alex, I do pray that God does bring you to to himself, but abandon trust in what your church is telling you and put trust in what Christ says in his word and what the scriptures say, the apostolic deposit, which is the word of God. Thanks for coming up, man. God bless you.
All right, let's pray for him. Heavenly Father, we pray for Alex and we pray that he will come to read Romans 3:4 and 5 and
Dude, he kicked me justified is by faith, not based on he
dude, let me pull up first Thessalonians 4. He kicked me. He didn't even let me get the last word. He accused me of breaking his rules and then he broke his own rules. He freaking kicked me, dude. I can't believe that he didn't like that I said easy belieism. Show you guys First Thessalonians 4. If you disregard sanctification, you disregard God. So, how can you be saved if you're disregarding God when you're supposed to when you're supposed to abide in God? Uh, I have to go back and answer a Spartan speak. Night trembles in the halls of fear. Ecclesial anxiety. His mind unclear. He hears my call yet avoids the fight. Hiding in the darkness nowhere inside. He got.net plays with children's toys at night. Needs a face full of makeup to enter the light. Debates only fans girls who have lost the way. But when Saurin calls him out, he's gone. He's dismayed. I rise to the challenge. The fire of the word. All of them retreat. Their hearts are disturbed. No armor, no seal, just trembling in shame. I fight for truth. Nothing they cannot claim. They run from the god. Let they flee my truth unit by my context trying to stop and is mine is broken with my gay. into your head. Bible in context talks smack like a star. But when confronted, he retreats a far. Tail between his legs, no battle in sight. But with cowardice in the face of a fight cannon agreed his mind crashed out. A psychological collapse is what he's about. The truth is relentless. The word is a sword. None can stand. None dare draw to what I call them to reason to clash in the prey. But all melt away. Their courage astray. No answers, no counter. Just fear in their eyes. The power of truth in my voice. They run from the gauntlet. Let they flee my call. Truth unites me God. Bible in context trying to stop. Can his mind is broken with my gaze? They all flee into a haze.