Transcription
I think that's a pretty common thing. They don't understand what even title means. Mhm. You know, it's just like, well, of course I own it. I live here. I pay the property taxes. Mhm. Whose name are on the property taxes? Well, my grandma's. Right. She died 5,000 years ago. Right.
Welcome to the Turning Profit Podcast. Heather, it's great to be here again, isn't it?
Yeah, I'm excited. What are we talking about today?
Well, we're talking about the questions to ask a seller when you're talking to them about their land.
Okay. Easy. So, the person you're buying from, the person that you're buying from, basically, we've got a whole list of questions that we ask a seller every single time, and it's designed to kind of get them talking about their property and to learn as much about it as we can. Now, sometimes people know nothing about their properties depending on the situation. Sometimes they've never been there, but it's true. Sometimes they've never been there. They inherited the property and it's in a different state and they've never been there. So, there's very limited things that they can tell us. But, but there are some questions that they can answer. So, I've got this here. This is part of our training program, by the way, which will be released very soon, and it's uh it's in our land flipping community, and it's completely free. It will be completely free when it's done.
Where is that?
Um, you can find it on turningprofit.com. There's a button there, or if you're watching this on YouTube, there will be a link right below this video.
Okay, cool. So, yeah. So, why don't we get into kind of the current events part of this uh podcast where we're talking about what's in the news, Heather? I know this is your kind of favorite section.
Yeah, I know. But like this time it's actually um I was reaching for my phone. I just remembered I didn't really I I normally like screenshot things but I didn't. It's kind of boring. It feels like the same old same old in the sense that like is commercial real estate crashing you like you hear about we uh we work is defaulted but you know on some things you know and and strategically is what I would imagine. That's why it doesn't scare me like I know that if you see a headline and and we work has done this. Do you remember when the pandemic first started and we saw there was news that Cheesecake Factory had like told all of their landlords that they were going to be defaulting? Like that was a strategic move. It wasn't like they were like, "Okay, we're going to have the money and then suddenly they don't have the money." Like they were looking at the big picture and they were saying, "Hey, this is going to happen."
Yeah. And they were using as leverage to maybe renegotiate their leases.
Right. Right. And I think that when so when you hear these things like okay commercial properties or or commercial leases are doing all these things or the leaseors or you know all this stuff happening you have to remember that it's not like it's a something that happened. It's more like they're stating it because they're structuring things and that's way better than you know someone expecting to get this big check and then not getting it right.
Yeah. And there's like a ton of turmoil in the commercial space because a lot of things are changing and people are trying to wonder where things are going. But the big thing that I think is interesting kind of I mean it's been current news for for a while now but is the whole AI thing.
Well, okay. So, you steal my thunder there. Like I was literally going to get I was trying to segue.
Were you worried I forgot?
Yeah, I was worried you forgot.
Yeah, that's hilarious. You told me that's what you were going to talk about. So, I was like commercial.
I know. No, I was So, I think that's like the big real estate like if it were just talking about real estate, but then the big news is AI and you are super excited about that. So that's why what I I don't normally tell you ahead of time what we're going to talk about in this segment, but yesterday I was like, Pete, guess what I'm going to bring up because you love AI, right?
Yeah. Well, it's going to disrupt everything now. Pretty much every single industry. And you know, it's hard to even fathom how each industry is going to be disrupted. I mean, some things we we kind of have a good idea, but some industries are going to be disrupted in ways that we can't really even fathom at this point. And so when we were we were talking about like how does that work with land investing and real estate in general and we were talking about this on our walk and I think like I was trying I originally was trying to think of all the things or I was trying to count how many things that you said during like a 5-minute thing but then I got lost in our conversation but just in that initial couple minutes you were like well well it could help with in the land business in this way this way and then you got into like broader real estate and like the next thing I knew it was like 45 minutes later and we were turning around on our talk and we were you know what I mean right because and then then we were talking about how all those things but I was like but then the thing is that at the end of that it's going to because we'll get to this point then there's going to be so many things that we can't even think about right now right
yeah they're going to be down the road as this technology improves and as these different tools that are developed are able to communicate with each other and kind of make things seamless so give me an example of something in like land investing
well one thing that we're experimenting with right now which preliminarily has been some pretty good results is that we're using an AI company that uses some AI related things to kind of trim our list down. So basically they've built a a whole algorithm to to determine which sellers are the most likely to sell. We send them a huge list. They basically trim it down and give us 50% of that list and say, "Hey, these are the people most likely to sell." So the goal here, the reason that for doing it is that, you know, if we're only sending to 50% of our list and that list is the part of the list that's actually going to sell to us, we're going to be able to send save a whole lot of mailing expenses. But I view it in a different way in that we can send twice as much mail and then have twice as, you know, twice as many leads, twice as many deals, twice as, you know, twice as much profit. So that's the way I look at. So that's one area we're experimenting with. I think that there's so many different things from the the side of the processes and efficiencies that you can kind of build into your business depending where you're at. I've got some really cool ideas that I want to work on. I want to pay people to develop for us, but you know, I try not to get sidetracked too much as well.
Yeah. This weekend you were I could tell you were really into it. You were like, "Okay, I could do all this." And I was like, "This is really cool." But but you need to focus, Pete, and get your training program. Finish this and then you can have free reign over that. But I think that the reality is that we don't know. Just like we're like, "Where's the market going?" We don't know how far this is going to take us because everything that it's going to be able to eventually do, we can't even imagine it doing because it's not happening right now. Right there. There will still need to be obviously there will still need to be that that physical connection with the real world that's very difficult to complete with AI. Although on 60 Minutes they had all these robots that were there. they were training to do different things with their their AI but Google has this but you know so maybe we'll have the robots to help us in the physical world also but I think that a lot of the things will still need to have like a human touch to them and obviously those won't get replaced like the person that does your hair or the person you know that I don't know though well maybe there will be a haircuting robot that but wouldn't it or even coloring like it'd be more um precise precise but I don't know I'm I'm not a hair stylist, so maybe that's actually not the way you do it. Like maybe it's not precise. It's like other things that go into it that you know and and before a lot of these tools came out, you would have thought that art was one of those things that's going to be not replaceable, but there are some really cool um tools related to art, photography, all these things that are you would have thought would be off limits for AI, but are actually being impacted the most right now. We talked about that too that the people who are going to be the most successful are the people that aren't going to push away from it. It's going to be the artists that say, "Okay, I just need to because of my artistic brain and I know, you know, like we're talking about um the different things on a camera like the f-stop or the aperture or all that kind of stuff." The people who are embrace it and know how to speak both languages. So, they know the cameras, they know what the magic thing the camera can do. they know about the timing and the lighting and all that, but then they're also able to speak the language to replicate that I think are the ones who are going to come out ahead. Like I think there's some things you can't replace. You have to embrace it and it can supercharge whatever you're good at, right? So, you know, just kind of think of it that way. Don't be scared. The robots are not going to take over anytime soon.
No. Well, I don't think I know. I'm just waiting for Rosie, that one from the Jetsons that can clean our house and cook food and stuff like that.
Yeah, that would be cool. I know. Right now, the robots are only doing singular things. remember how they were saying that and they were doing it like they're playing soccer kind of.
Yeah. But so I guess I would like the way that we're looking at this is everything that we're doing that can be systemized or like gosh if I had someone that was not emotionally vested in this that could look at the big picture like think of okay could you create a use AI to help you do this. So think of every single thing you're doing and what's right where could you use that right?
Yeah. And believe me, over this next year, there's going to be so many different niche type AI tools that are developed to help in many different aspects of business and life. And uh yeah, it just be exciting to kind of see where it goes. So I I think in the immediate near term, the big thing will be to get all these different niche tools and things to talk to each other, work together seamlessly, and solve bigger problems.
Yeah. and make it so that people can ask for help in plain English like not English but plain language. You don't want to have to be a programmer to to understand and use all these different tools. So kind of make that easier, you know, for the general public. It's the same thing with with kind of home computers and their evolution. You know, they really started taking off with Windows and things which made it very easy to interact with the computer instead of having to write programs and code and all this kind of stuff which most people are not going to learn how to do. You need to be able to just type something in and have it do something, right? Not like the slash click a mouse and have it do something.
Yeah. Do you remember when you first used a computer? Did you do the flip screen where you wrote the program? Like I don't even know if it was called that. I just remember that it was an Apple and it would an Apple 2C.
Yes. I remember working on those. I have no idea if that was if it probably was, right? Our school had.
Yeah, that's what our school had. But we had like in the library it was like so exciting to go. But it was like, "Okay, everybody do the flip screen." And I think you pushed a button and then you'd like typed in some code and then you flipped it back and you were like, I made a square move and it was like no way, you know? It's like things are a little more advanced than that, right?
Right. But like that excitement, it's that same kind of thing. It's like, wait, I can actually do this.
Mhm. Yeah. A whole new world we're entering into and we'll just have to see where it goes. So yeah, but I think um it it will help in real estate. Just need to
It will. Yeah. just just keep your eyes open and kind of look for opportunities and ways to improve your processes and things and you know maybe don't do some of these things manually if you can automate them and bring in an AI friend to do that work for you. I thought of something else we were going to talk about before we even get to that. Um, I don't even know if you remember it, but we were talking about how I'm scatterrained a lot, you know, like I keep a list of everything that like I have to get done. And I could see myself getting hung up on some of like the processes for this if it weren't, you know, for you. And I'm sure that there's other people out there that kind of are on the same thing like once they get it started, what you and you told me like I can't remember the exact like phrase you used, but pretty much that like you have to have system like you know what I mean? Do you remember that? You want to talk about what that was? you have to have systems and processes in place. So once you identify what needs to happen in order for your, you know, say your business as a whole to run, like you've got all these different things that need to happen. What was the one thing though that you said like you have to do? You cannot get off. It has to be like clockwork.
Oh. Is sending out the mail. Yeah. the you know the lead generation side of things that has to be systematized and it has to be it has to be like clockwork or you are going to have a lot of ups and downs and things in this business which are completely not necessary. It sounds like the easiest thing in the world to do and most people will blow me off when I say that but most people won't actually do it you know. I was like, I don't know that maybe. Well, I'm sure they'll phrase. Well, I'm sure people hear that and they say, okay, sending out the mail every two seconds is so dumb.
Yeah, I know that's a little too obvious, but the fact is that most people don't do it. And it they over complicate things. Like it doesn't it's not that complicated, but it's maybe hard if if you're not that type of person. And if you're not that type of person, then you need to put a system in place that takes that kind of out of your hands. Like maybe you hire an assistant, their only job is to make sure that mail goes out every two weeks and you you know because you know that for you to actually do that is going to be too difficult. Like it it may happen this week or next and next time but you know over the long haul it's probably not going to happen. So you need to put some sort of system in place to make sure that happens. And I think too once the leads start coming in and you're like oh my gosh I've got all these leads and okay well you're not going to make time to send out the mail.
Exactly. because it's like you're really busy, but the problem is if you don't send it out now since there's that lead time and down the line and and we tell that story about how when we went on that cross country road trip and you know we decided not to send it out to give you a little bit of a break cuz you were doing the majority of it yourself and then it took like 3 months to catch up again. It's it's terrible. It was dumb. It was like we had the momentum going and then we stopped. But I think that's the same case in every especially real estate business. Like it's because the ones that you're like seeds that you're planting today will be, you know, the
Well, that's right. Like the mail we send out right now is, you know, it's probably 90 to 120 days away from actually receiving any sort of profit or income from that, right? So, it's it's hard it's hard to kind of think that far ahead. And really, that's not in in business. That's not that far ahead.
No. But, you know, so if you're not doing that now, you're going to be struggling months down the road and it's, you know, it's something that could have been completely avoided. But I could just see myself with all and the whole reason we're talking about is I could see myself saying, "Well, I'm really busy right now." Or, "I don't have time to sit down or that's sending out a chunk of money."
Mhm. Or I'm sure I could What other excuse could you hear from me?
Oh, lots of them. But thank you. That's great, Pete. I mean, I don't know. Like, I think that that it causes other problems, too. So, say you don't have as many people. Wait, are we still talking about the the mail? Like the mail and the cons consistency. So, like if you're not sending out enough mail, you're not getting, you know, consistently, you're getting in leads or potential deals that are not as good. So, you're going to end up taking some deals thinking that this is like kind of like the best thing you got. That's all I've got, right? So, oh, I got to make something work. And then in reality, you're probably taking a marginal deal that is going to be hard to sell. it's going to take longer to sell. You won't make as much money on and it's just going to have a chain reaction of events. But that can all be avoided if you got the deal flow coming in. You've got the leads coming in like clockwork. You're like, "I don't need to take this cuz there's something I don't need to take this crappy deal."
Yeah. Cuz something better will come.
Exactly. How many times do you people hear people say something like, "Yeah, it's just not working. Like, I'm just not getting uh good deals." And then you ask them like, "Well, how much did you send out?" And you're like, "There's you didn't send out." Like, do you think that's common?
I think it's common. Yeah. I think people look at look at a number and say, "Okay, I sent out, you know, 5,000 letters and they're expecting to get, you know, 10 deals from it, you know, 10." And it just you you will get a bunch of leads from that, but how many will actually turn into deals is another thing. Deals that you want to do that have enough profit that check all the boxes, you know? So, if you don't if you're not sending out enough mail, you're not going to get enough deals at the end. And I I've said this numerous times, like for us at this point, we're send like each deal cost us about $3,000, which is about 6,000 6,000 letters. Now, we're very picky in the deals that we go forward with. We're only doing bigger properties at this point. Like, if you do smaller properties, you can get a lot better ratio. You can you can get more deals than that for every piece of mail that you send. You know, that ratio would be a lot better. But for us, we've kind of progressed to the point where we want to do just kind of the bigger deals. And uh so that's where we're at. So you need to figure out what your numbers are and make sure you're sending out enough mail in order to generate the type of business you want to generate, right? But I think if you had like I used to always compare things like a sandwich shop. Let's say you're spending $3,000 on advertising for a sandwich shop. And how much do you think you would make like one of those big deals? Like get just give me a random number.
Oh, a pretty decent deal. 50 grand.
Okay. So if you told a sandwich shop you need to spend $3,000 in advertising, but you're going to get income of $50,000 from that.
Mhm. I mean, yeah, they'd be all over. I don't know how many sandwich shop places would be like, "That's bull, you know, I'm not doing it. You're horrible." So, I know that like it seems like, "Wow, that's $3,000 for something that's actually going to turn into something." But if you look at it that way, like if you put it in that it makes sense. So, I think the big takeaway and what I was trying to get at is that for someone like me that would give every single excuse not to send mail in my natural state, I'm better now.
Right. Right. Um, the best way to combat that is to put it on your calendar and don't even think about any outside forces. It's just that, oh, it's the 15th of the month. I need to buy more mail, right? You know, and then do we ever get one where it's like maybe we're sending to we do two mailings and it's to pretty much the same area and some of them just it's just not the best leads and some of them it's like my gosh, there are so many leads it's insane.
Oh yeah, happens all the time. And it's just the time of the year or you know it's not even like anything else has really changed. So that does happen, right?
Oh yeah. And you know many of these areas you know I mail every the many of the areas that I really like a lot I mail every 3 months. So I've mailed these people many times. Like I've mailed them probably for a year and a half some of these people. They're like the seasons change is emailing me again or not emailing you but sending me a letter. This guy just doesn't give up. But but obviously they didn't respond to my other pieces of mail that I sent them. But now they're responding. They've got the letter in their hand. They're like, "Maybe the time is right. Maybe we do need to sell. Maybe something in their life has come up where they could use the cash rather than this piece of land that's doing them nothing. Maybe if we sell it to him, he'll stop mailing us."
That's right. Yeah. No, but I mean that's the reality is they say that like a lot of times if you don't like a food, if you try it three times, it you know, it's the same kind of thing though. They might they might look at it, they see your name and they throw it away. They don't even really look at it. The second time they're like, "What what is he mailing me? Okay, is I don't want to sell my land." And then the third time they're like, but after that second time they're like, "Huh, I wonder if I did sell that land, what I could do with it, you know, or the money or whatever it is." And then that third one, they're like, "I'm going to set this aside. Okay, now I'm going to call them. Hey, I'm going to call them. Maybe they'll pay me more for that. Maybe, you know, who knows what the case is. But, uh, yeah. So, I, you know, I'm big on the consistency of the mail. And if you can take care of that thing, that part of it, then so many other things are going to fall into
Well, because then you're forced to deal with the leads as they come in, right? It you can't, you know, shut down with I mean, you could, but you're not going to want to cuz it's exciting. So, it's very simple. This business is very simple from that aspect of it. Take care of that and everything else will take care of itself eventually. Eventually, everything will be okay. everything else will everything else will fall into place and it'll create more problems like how to deal with all these leads and you
Know how to fund all these deals and stuff like that, but those are good problems to have. And those are all solvable, one by one. And I think, again, to reiterate, if you have a good enough deal, you can find the money. Oh yes, a good enough deal is, you know, yeah, the good deals are are gold. So, you're mining for those gems, right? And someone will—I mean, and if they're not willing to do it, then it wasn't a good deal, right? So, but so don't let that be your limiting factor.
No, it's not a limiting factor. And in fact, that again, with the way my brain works, that would be like, well, okay, you know, where would we get the money to do all these different—I could see myself saying something like that, right? And if you're if you're wondering like, where do I find these people? That's in our community, our land flipping community. Link below this video or on Turning Profit. Give like a 5-second—give me that really quick so I can just read it.
Okay. Thank you. And then just give like a couple seconds about what that looks like, because if there if someone's just joining us, what it means by someone funding it, you know, the funding side of things.
Yeah. Like so I have a really good deal.
Oh, okay. Yeah. So the basics of it are, in this business, you don't need to actually have the money to buy these deals. There are plenty of partners out there, deal-funding partners who will, if you've got a good deal, they will actually send the money to close the transaction to buy the property. You, as the land investor, are bringing the deal to the table, and then after you resell the property and you make a profit, then both parties split that profit. So say you bought a property for $50,000, uh, it was worth $100,000 after you resold it and remarketed the property. You've got a $25,000 profit for each, you know, the funder and $25,000 for yourself, and then obviously the funder gets their original money paid back to them as well. But so you make 25 grand in that situation, and you didn't even put any of your money towards a deal. Obviously, you put some money towards the marketing to generate that deal, but didn't have to actually buy it yourself, right?
Okay. So I think that's um probably another hiccup. I'm trying to think of all these things that that would be common, um, you know, things that would—Well, yeah, you know, I understand that's that's always a question, like the money—like this all sounds great. I think, you know, it makes sense, I can get these deals and things like that, but how do I actually make them happen? That part of it is really pretty easy.
And then what would you say is like your ideal first mailing? How many pieces?
I go big on everything. So maybe I'm not the right person to ask, but you know, I think 5,000's a pretty good amount. And um, you know, as long as you're not mailing like super huge properties, I guess, you know, if you if you mailed a list of 5,000, you know, maybe smaller type properties where you're going to have a better ratio and maybe s not into areas that are super highly competitive. You know, that's a mistake I I talked about I made on my first mailer. I I mailed this area was like the hottest area in the country, and u and then I offered them such a low percentage. I think I offered them 25% of market value, something like that. And it was, you know, it was too low and it was also into a highly competitive market. So, I really didn't I didn't get any deals out of that first mailer. And that was 10,000.
Wow. But I I made that mistake. I didn't really tell you at the time. I I told you those deals were coming, but they never came from that mailer.
How much um do you think that 5,000 like just on average that would cost?
I think it, you know, doing some beginner type volume like that, you're probably looking at 60 cents per letter. So, what is that? $3,000, something like that.
Okay. See, now in my brain, cuz I'm, you know, more cautious than you, that doesn't sound insane.
No. No. Like I could do that. Obviously, you could put that in a business credit card or something like that. Um, as long as you have a plan to pay it back as well.
Yeah. Okay. Well, um, thank you for letting me go off on a tangent about that. Um, okay. So you—this is you've created or you've written down everything that we ask—the questions for sellers. So this would be someone who you sent a letter to, and it's like the first contact—they call back or or you've gone through our—it's gone through like the minimal to get to this point, right? What what has it gone through?
Well, yeah. So what what happens is that our process is that we'll send out the letters; they either call, they email, text back, something like that, or mail us back sometimes. But generally, this is when we get someone on the phone, when we talk to them on the phone. Also, we do the same thing by email if someone wants to communicate by email. But if we get someone on the phone, uh, here is what we do. Like we'll look at the property before we call them and kind of get some some general idea like, hey, does this property look like it could have a potential? Uh, and then if it does look like that, we'll call them, and we'll go through this list of questions to find out any more information about the property to help us make a decision on that. So, we send them out an actual offer price. Now, that offer price may or may not be accurate. We go through these questions to kind of drill down on that and to figure out where we're at on it.
Okay. So, the first one you ask is, "What can you tell me about the property?" So, I mean, that makes sense. Like, you just ask them a broad question. What can you tell me about it?
Yep. It's an open-ended thing and just to get—designed to get them to talk about the property. A lot of times they'll open up about things that you never anticipated about it. They might say stuff like, "I just got to get rid of it no matter what the cost." Or, you know, right? I, you know, they'd say all kinds of things, but I know the tendency or the maybe the urge is to kind of butt in and and like kind of, you know, stop people when they're talking, but you really at this point in time, you just want to let them talk, right?
Good. That was good. Thank you.
I think so. What's some crazy things you've heard? Stuff like that. Like, I need to sell this property right away. I don't care what I get for it, you know, things like that. Um, you're all—don't—don't ethical, you know, we're going to—I'm not going to like take advantage of a situation like that, but the wrong person would—um, I think—but you know, so things like we hear things like, you know, family situations, and they go into all this depth about all these different things—things that happened behind the scenes in their family and why they ended up at this property and things like that. Like a lot of that stuff is irrelevant to what we're doing, but really the things that I'm concerned about are, you know, title—as titles of the property go. We go through a list of questions, but but um, it's just interesting and and uh, sometimes they'll just tell you some interesting things about the property. Sometimes some of the things they say make the property more valuable than I realized it was initially, right? They might say like, "Oh, yeah, and this is, you know, it's got this really cool access or—who know, you know, or they might tell you like all 50 descendants were born by the log—by the side of that river. But even if they talk about something like that, you might not be able to see necessarily this. You're like, "Yeah, the trees cover this big pond," which you might not see, you know what I mean? Or, you know, floods, whatever.
Okay. Um, and then you ask them, "How long have you owned it?"
Mhm. Yep. And that's obviously a pretty easy question, but that'll sometimes get in—they'll start then talking about how they acquired the property or things like that. So, kind of interesting sometimes and sometimes some information we can use.
Okay. Is the title in your name only, or are there others on the title as well? If there are others, are they on board to sell as well? This is super important, right?
Yeah, it's really important. First of all, they have to be the owner of the property in order to sell it to you, right? So, when I say, are they on title, that means like, do they own the property? And you'd be surprised how many people call in and say, oh, yes, I own uh 25% of this property. Can I just sell my 25% share? Or—which obviously we're not going to do. We're not going to be partners with whoever their family is that own this property. It's just absurd. Uh, or, you know, sometimes they'll say something like, "Well, my great-grandmother, you know, uh, she got this property from so and so who said that they could live here, and then this whole time we just paid all the property taxes, and you know, that type of thing." Like so weird situations, you know, where they they've actually got possession of the property, and no one's really challenging their possession of the property, but they don't really have clear title to the property. You know, those types of things can happen. So, you know, maybe they didn't officially inherit the property, but they kind of ended up there as a family member that's just—and no one's kind of contesting that. Like those types of things happen sometimes, and they think because they're paying the property taxes on the property, they actually own it, which is not the case, right?
I think that's a pretty common thing. They don't understand what even title means. You know, it's just like, well, of course I own it. I live here. I pay the property taxes. It's like, well, whose name is on the property taxes? Well, my grandma's, right? She died 5,000 years ago, right? And then if there are other owners, you know, are they on board to sell? And they might be like, my brothers own it with me, and yeah, we're all ready to go. Yeah. And sometimes we get into weird inheritance—inheritance situations where, you know, someone dies, and they, you know, it just kind of passes down to the next generation, and then that person dies, and then so there's these situations where people don't even realize it, but there could be like 16 owners, 64 owners, something like that, you know, when people have lots of kids and they're next in line, and and then you know, there's these different branches of the family, and all these people on this side, all these people on that side. And when you get into a situation like that, they never come together. You know, the most I've seen—I think that we've been able to put together is when there's eight owners, you know, and the only way that actually happens is if there's one point person for the family that everyone kind of looks up to and under, you know, and and trusts, and they're the ones that coordinate all the document signing and things like that. But but if you get in a situation where someone says, "Oh, yeah, I own about an eighth of the property. I haven't seen my, you know, cousin Jeff for, you know, four years, and last time we talked, he was thinking about maybe selling, too, and stuff like that." So, like those types of situations never come together. It's like too much work. And even if you got a hold of cousin Jeff, would you be able to get a hold of cousin Lisa and you know, Aunt Mary and all these different people that own an eighth of the property? And, you know, those situations never happen. It's just a waste of time.
Especially if one of them has a sentimental—
Exactly. One person could throw a wrench into the gears, you know, and it wouldn't be—it it wouldn't even have to be someone that says, "Oh, I don't want to sell." They could be like, "Oh, I want to sell, but I don't like your price. I want twice this." And it's, you know, so all those—too many variables, and they just never work. I could tell you right now it's not worth your time.
Right. So, you say, "Hey, if you guys can get it all together, reach back out, but—"
Right.
Exactly. We can't do this.
Exactly. Okay. So, after we get through that, then then your next question to them is, "Are there structures or mobile homes on the property? If so, tell me about those. Are they vacant? What condition are they in? Are they livable or a tear-down? And then you also go on here, if it's a mobile home, do you have the title to it? Are you willing to transfer the title to it during the sale process?"
Yep. So, so obviously some of those questions apply uh and some of them don't depending on the situation. Do you kind of go into follow-up—it's almost like follow-up questions on those certain things depending on what their answer. So, like your first question be are there any structures on the property? And I always ask that because a lot of times it looks like vacant land, and you look at aerial images, and it's just looks like all trees, but sometimes there's like a little house or something below those trees that you didn't even realize. So we always ask that question, and a lot of times there—h—there they're—there situation where we're like, yeah, there's a there's a home on the property, we've got a mobile home there, you know, whatever the case may be. So if there's a home on the property, the first thing we want to know is like what's the condition of the home? Is it—is there anyone living there? If there are people living there, do they have a lease, you know, what's the situation? Are they willing to move out before we close, you know, escrow? So, those types of things are really important. Like, you don't want to end up with a property with a squatter-type tenant that's not paying anything and doesn't want to leave your property and, you know, so those are types of issues you don't want to deal with unless you get the property for super cheap and it's worth your time to to deal with that—to deal with an eviction or to deal with that that type of situation. So, and people who don't know—that's like a very extended—depending on the area, depending on the state, you know, cuz the whole plan for the land is to buy it low, sell it low—still, you know, not top dollar and flip it fast.
That's right. You know, do whatever we can if we need to. So, if you get someone in there and you're thinking, well, it's not a big deal. It can get pricey, and it can extend that time substantially, or they can sabotage it, or, you know, all these other things. Can you imagine trying to, you know, list and sell a property, and then, you know, they—your tenants, your squatter tenants are greeting someone with a shotgun every time they try to come onto the property. You're not going to sell it.
What if they breed wild boars?
Yeah. Yes. You're not going to sell it until you deal with that that situation first. So, it's very important for us to know those things. And you also ask if there's other things like tires or barrels or anything like—anything. Is there anything on this land?
Yeah. And sometimes uh old houses as well. Like sometimes there's old houses on there, and they may be like, "Okay, well there was an old house there that fell down or something like that." So it's interesting to at least know the history of of these properties and mobile homes that comes up a lot because sometimes people just, you know, wheel a mobile home on there under the trees, and you don't really, you know, no one knows it's even there. Uh, in those types of situations, you know, we want to know stuff like is it officially connected—connected to a septic system? Is there electricity? You know, things—follow-up questions. And the other thing we ask about mobile homes is—there a title to that property, and it—are you willing to transfer that title to us during the during the purchase process? So, and because of that, it could have a different person that owns it to do a private property eviction.
Mhm. You know, because then again, that's—
Yeah. It it can bring up a lot of issues, but we've bought properties before where there's mobile homes on it. A lot of—a lot of properties actually—mobile homes on it, doesn't come with a title, you know, and then we just resell it kind of as is. And just to let them know, hey, there's an old mobile home on there. We don't have the title to it. It's vacant, you know, but no one's putting a claim or anything like that. So, and then sometimes we do end up with the title to the mobile home, which makes it more valuable, and then we can resell it with that title to the next person, and that it's more valuable. It's kind of crazy because mobile homes are kind of like their cars.
Mhm. Yeah. You know, so if you think of it that way, it makes sense, but some people depend on it for an actual home. So, you don't want to be—you don't want to be a landlord, right? Unless you want to be a landlord.
Unless you want to. Right. Okay. This is a really important one though. Have there ever been any perk tests done on the property? If so, what were the results?
Yeah. And this is kind of uh depending on the area as well, and sometimes, you know, if an area has sewer access or something like that, maybe that's—that question is not really relevant, but in certain areas, perk tests are pretty important. So, we always ask about that. I mean, depending on what they say—people lie. People lie or they fail to tell the truth. With a grain—grain of salt, you know, we ask them, hey, has there ever been a perk test on the property? They may say, oh yeah, we had a perk test done a couple years ago. I've got the copy for it if you want, you know, and instantly that makes it more valuable to us. So, we look at it from that perspective. Or they may be honest and say, oh, it failed a perk test 5 years ago, but we think that we could get a perk in this different area. So, it's just some more information. You know, I wouldn't like completely discount that property, but I would be a little bit more cautious and and maybe ensure that we get a perk test during—while we're under contract and see if we can get it perked. And if not, maybe we're buying it cheap enough that we could just sell it as a recreational property where it doesn't really matter either way. So, those are the things that we look at, but you know, sometimes they'll—they'll say those, you know, sometimes they'll say, "Oh, no, I don't think so." But we still check that. We still call the county and see if there's anything on file for—for a particular—and especially if it's inherited, they might not be doing it maliciously. They—a—might not know or b—some people don't even understand like getting the perk test. They might not even think of it—called that. They might think of it as a septic test or—you know what I mean? So when you say a word, they're like, no, we've never done that.
Yeah. And the other thing is too—we can come back to that—like say for instance, they said, oh, no, there's never been a perk test on the property. Okay. We've taken that information—what they said is kind of the gospel, right? And then during our due diligence process, we call the county, and the county says, "Oh, there's been like five fulfilled perk tests." We would then go back to the seller and say, "Hey, you didn't tell us about this. It's obviously an issue. So, we can't pay that that amount we were going to pay because we thought that that was not a problem. So, based on this new information, this is what it would have to be in order for it to make sense for us." So we can then come re-visit that and use that that situation to our advantage. But you know, obviously we would have probably gone in with that that same, you know, lower price at the beginning had we known there was an issue from the start. So it's not an unethical situation at all. It's like they were withholding information from you, or maybe they didn't know the information, but it came up during our discovery and u—you know, so it is what it is.
Yeah. Wow. That was a little scary. After this many years of marriage, right? Complete each other's sentences, right? But um—and then the other thing I think is interesting is that in certain areas certain types of septic tanks are more, you know, like certain systems or different things are more common. So it, you know, just because of it doesn't mean that it's an absolute no.
No, cuz maybe in that street or whatever it's—or there—there's going to be sewer coming soon or something.
Okay. Has any timber been removed from the property recently? If so, and when and why? Does this matter?
Well, obviously on these satellite—we're looking at satellite images to really do a lot of our evaluation. So, most people prefer to have a nice, you know, if it's a—if this is the type of property that they're wanting to buy, it's like a a nice forested property or something like that is worth more than a property that has just been clear-cut of all the trees and big ruts and stumps and things everywhere—that's kind of left in disarray. So those trees are actually worth money that they can sell to a timber company generally uh and then they regrow over time, and then they sell it again. So we've had a number of situations where on the satellite image everything looks good. It looks like a nice forested property, and then we send the photographer out—there's no trees there at all. So we we based our price that we were going to buy the property on the fact that there's all these trees there, and it's a nice re-saleable type property. And then we get out there, and it's just like a barren wasteland of stumps, and you know, there's very limited things that you can do with the property after that point, you know, uh, in some of these areas because it's not—you know, aesthetically pleasing.
Yeah. It's not aesthetically pleasing, and you—you'd have to spend a lot of money in order to to kind of reforest it or something.
Yeah. Exactly. So we always ask them about that. So you know, generally we'll find out, but it's just good to have a head's-up.
Exactly. Well, and it helps us—the value from the beginning cuz I don't like to have to go back to people and say, "Hey, you know, we can't pay what we thought we were going to be able to pay because of this." I'd rather know all this information from the start and say, "Hey, you know, since you timbered the property, it's really not worth as much to us. Here's what we can do."
Right. And we ourselves don't timber properties.
No, no, no. And I know that's—that's a—that's a way people make money. And and obviously that's—that's a way that it can be done. There's ways that it can be done sustainably. And some of these properties are just—it's almost like a farm—like they plant these pine trees just so they can cut them every 10 years or something like that, you know. So we're not big into destroying natural habitats or anything like that. So but maybe if it was for—if we were doing a project for solar panels or something and that would make sense because the benefit would outweigh the detriment to the environment.
Okay. And also when you ask about like how long ago because like you said, if it's one of those ones where this is what they do and it's been six years, right? You know, and you know that the—it's a 10-year cycle or whatever it is. And a lot of these trees are pretty—like in some of these areas, these trees can get pretty big in like six years. So, right.
Um, you know, but it's good to know because that also—people who really know that—who are looking in that area, you might still take off a little bit because they would want ones—
That are tall or whatever. Okay. So, just because it doesn't apply to us and we say that all the time, like in California, that wouldn't apply to us. That's why you need to know the local area. Um, okay. And then you flat out ask them, "Are there any problems or negatives with the property?" Right. Yeah. Again, just trying to kind of flesh out anything that we didn't ask them about that maybe, you know, we kind of—that's kind of a more direct question, like any negative things. And a lot of people say, "No, not nothing that I know about," but sometimes they will say something like, "Well, you know, we got this one neighbor who's kind of a jerk," and, you know, so things like that have, you know, come up from time to time and they do affect the value of the property. So, we like to actually ask them about that. And that's kind of a maybe not a 100% dealbreaker, but that's almost a dealbreaker for us. Like we're not looking to deal with crazy neighbors, but it's like when you go to the DMV and they—you're renewing your driver's license, they're like, "Have you done illegal drugs or something?" You're like, "Who in the world is going to say, 'Uh, yeah, like right before I walked in, I did, you know, whatever' in the parking lot." Yeah, exactly. You know what I mean? And it's because it's it's it seems stupid to—because you're like, who's going to say that? Then I asked one time I asked him like, "Do people do that all the time?" and I was like, "Man, so it it sounds silly to say like, 'Are there any problems or negatives?'" Yeah. Well, you know, I think if I was selling—if I was in this situation as a seller and someone asked me, you know, I'd try to be upfront as I can, like and let them know all the info about the property. If they want to buy it, great. If they don't, I would—I wouldn't try to withhold anything. So if I had something in the back of my mind that I considered a negative, I would probably mention it to them. And it might not even be right. It might not be something that affects the value at all, but you know, they're like, "There's mines everywhere. I—" It's booby trapped. That would not be good. I was like, "Has that happened?" Okay. Please don't let that happen. Um, okay. Is—okay. The next question is, "Is there a loan or any money that is owed on the property? If so, how much is owed?" Yeah. So, obviously that's a big thing when you're talking about—Does that happen a lot? Not too often. No, but but it does come up from time to time. When you're talking about single family homes, almost every home has has some sort of loan on it. There are some people that own them outright, obviously, but but it's very—the common thing is that there is a loan—there is money owed against the property. This happens with land as well. Sometimes people take out land loans or some—sometimes they've got another loan that's kind of secured by the property or something like that. So, we ask that question. Sometimes it comes up. We just want to know about that during the process and so we can make sure that that's being being uh dealt with, right? Because you don't want to say—they're like, "Okay, I owe 50,000." And you offered them 25,000. like they're like, "Sold," and then you're like, "Yeah, I don't think they're really figuring out how they're going to pay off that deficit." But yeah, exactly. You're like, "I'm not really looking to pay 75,000." And then you just—let's also ask, "Is there anything else that we should know about the property?" Right. Another open-ended question and maybe just kind of the last final thing—asking, "Hey, is there anything else that we should know about?" Right. And a lot of times, like you said, it's—yeah. You'll get some stuff that's the negative, but there's also a lot of stuff on the positive. And you don't know every single area. You don't know like this one. Yeah, this one's really cool because it's like right down the street from blah blah blah, you know, which is a national whatever, right? And they're building this thing down the road here and, you know, all these kind of things that maybe good information to have, but you don't know everything. I mean, I know mostly everything, but yeah. Uh, I don't—I don't actually have these conversations anymore. Our team does these things, but these are are very important things. And obviously this is a this is a list of questions we developed over time and it didn't always start asking all these questions, but certain things came up over time which made me want to add them to our list. Okay. So you also go into—ask—you ask them—oh, okay—ask us only if there's a possibility of being landlocked. Okay. The map shows that there could be an access issue to the property. Do you know if there is deed access and if so, where is the access from? And you're specific in deed access—like—yes. Exactly. Not just that your neighbor chose—there's a dirt road, you know, and a lot of times, you know, and that's a big thing. So, we buy properties that are on the main roads. That's our preference because those are the easiest to sell and those are the most valuable really. But then we also buy properties that are uh not frontage on the main road, but they may have like—on the map, they may have a dirt road going there. And it's ju—just by looking at the maps, you don't know if that's actually deed access or if that's just access—like someone can—is actually driving their car up there and you know—through someone else's property. It's important for us to make sure that that's deed access and uh and on—and that generally means that on the deed there is something that says, "In perpetuity there's a, you know, 30-foot wide access running from this point to this point out to this main road." Or it could also say something like, "All easements and everything noted on this plat map done by this surveyor on this date." And then you would actually have to pull up that plat map and and survey and see what shows on that map. And if there's an easement noted on there—like a little road showing on there—easement—then that's actually part of the deed as well. So it's just not like directly written on there. So, uh, we want to make sure that there's something noted about the access on these properties. And if there's not, then, you know, it's generally something we're not dealing with, is because it's considered landlocked, right? And if you're looking at it, you're think, "Okay, well, you were saying originally you like front of, you know, road frontage, road frontage." But sometimes it's like down the street. That's not uncommon in a lot of areas. So, that shouldn't be an instant like, "No, it's not." And also, road frontage doesn't mean that it's, you know, a busy busy busy road. It could be just a common road, I guess you'd say. And then, you know, there's the kind of the—maybe even it is a little road and then the house is off of that, but that one's dirt. In some areas, that's totally common. Here, that's very uncommon. But in a lot of places, it's the norm. Yeah. Just the way things were parcled out over time. And it's just—um—you just want to make sure that your property is not officially landlocked. And obviously sometimes the sellers don't really know, and sometimes we can't pull up, you know, sometimes we could pull up the deeds online and these plat maps online and kind of piece it all together to see if there is deed access, but a lot of times we don't actually get that information until we go through the process and get the title company to actually review it. So in those types of situations, it's kind of a gray area. So if if someone says, "Well, there's this dirt road in front of our house. I—I think it's uh deed access, but they don't really know for sure," you know, that that type of thing happens a lot. So, we'll look at it and we'll see if there's other homes on that that dirt road and things like that to kind of piece it together and think like, logically there probably would be deed access in this situation. We're not going to be able to know or verify that until we get the title report back. So, we're going to roll the dice, move forward with this one in the hopes that it is deed access and everything is going to work out fine. It happens sometimes where we do that and we spend money on a photographer, we spend money on due diligence, we waste kind of time going to the process and the title company comes back and says there's no needed access, then we have to cancel the deal. So, it happens like that sometimes. But more than uh more than likely in a situation like that, we—if we got a pretty good idea that there would be deed access, uh it generally works out that they get confirmation on that and we're good. But right—and and sometimes the sellers aren't trying to pull a fast one—when like that term "deed access" might be something that they have absolutely no idea about. Yeah. They maybe never looked at the deed, right? You know what I mean? And they don't even know that's like a thing. There's a—there's a road, right? I drive on it to get to my property. There's access, right? You know, and it's like, yeah, that's cool except for that it also could not be cool. And so we just needed to be like set in stone, right? Yeah. Yeah, and that's why we go through the title companies from our attorneys and escrow companies when we purchase these properties because we want to make sure everything's good. And uh you know, last thing—I—you know, I—I hate wasting money on properties that never turn into an actual deal, never turned into an actual closing, but uh but you know, sometimes—sometimes you got to go down that road or otherwise you're kind of throwing out a lot of good potential deals um in the process. Put it as—it's just the cost of doing business. And I know that we could save a lot of money not using attorneys, not using title—whatever—insurance. I mean, not a lot, but we could, right? But I would much rather the cost of doing business and spending that money to ensure that our transactions—it's safer for the seller, it's safer for us, it's better for a resale. Yeah, we've saved a lot of money by by not going ahead on certain deals where we discovered something like that during that process. So, I think it's money well spent. This isn't necessary. It's just part of the process. Like you need it. And then the other thing too is let's say you get a property that you're like, "This is just a really good property," and you don't have deed access but they've been driving on this road or whatever. If you have the time and you and the resources, you could say, "Okay, I have to pause this right now," or "I'm going to buy it for a lot cheaper because it doesn't have it." And then you could um either concurrently with the escrow or after you close it—if you get it for a lot cheaper—get that deed access. Right. Yeah. You work with the neighbors to try to get it official or you could even attempt to sell it to one of the neighbors. Yeah. And I think there's actually some neighbors—don't—I mean, I wouldn't bank on this—but that if you went to them and you were like, "Hey, I've always had this—" they'd be like, "Yes, of course you have—let's do it—make it official." You pay for my—you'd have to pay for their attorneys and—yeah—pay for a surveyor to get the official and you know—maybe pay him a little bit of money to you know—make it—make it all good, but—right. So it's not like the end of the world. It's just not what we do because again it's just not part of our business plan. Right. Maybe in the future. Okay. Um, I've got some questions that Peter Ree sent over to me. And these are from our land flipping community. And if you're not a member yet, we would highly encourage you to join. There's a link below this video in YouTube here. You stole my thing. I was like, "Where do they find, you know?" Okay. Or you can go to turningprofit.com. There's a button on there. Just press that and uh and join our land flipping community where there will be a brand new land flipping training program released in there very soon, as soon as I get it done. Okay. Close. Okay. So, um, I know I say botch people's names and I got to complain about that and I apologize. I'm not trying to, but I keep doing it just because I suck obviously. Um, anyways, this is from Anson, and I'm not going to pronounce your last name because I don't want to get in trouble for, you know, watching it. I've received several leads from my uh first mailer using two counties' delinquent tax list, but I'm finding that all the leads so far end up demanding market value and turning down lower offers. That's kind of funny. It's like at a tax sale, right? But anyways, okay, I keep going. Some of them are not even behind on their taxes at all. Oh, after all. Okay, that makes sense. Has anyone ever uh else experienced this or switched to a data service instead of using—or instead of the details due to this reason? Yeah. So, basically what Anson is talking about is delinquent tax lists. When people are behind on their property taxes, there are companies that will put together these lists of property owners that are, you know, obviously late on their taxes. And you would think in a lot of cases that these are motivated sellers or or people that obviously, you know, may have a financial need in order to sell. So basically, it should be a higher converting list. And I would imagine that it probably is—like if you only sent to the people that are delinquent tax um lists, you could probably get a better conversion rate on your list. Uh, but then on the other hand, there are other problems that go with that. You know, some of these people are, you know, are not motivated to sell. They just—they just only pay their property taxes every few years and, you know, and then they're getting inundated from a lot of investors that are using these same type of lists. And uh so it's one of those things that you can experiment with and maybe as you're trying to break into a new area, maybe you just focus on these people first and then you broaden out from there. I've thought about doing some some things like that in the past. But yeah, so it's something to test and you know, one area may be completely different from the others, but it's like anything else. Some some of the people will be completely unreasonable with what they think the property is worth. Some of the people will be interested and and really willing to work out a deal. It's just kind of a numbers thing. So, I'll add my spin—a lot of people don't—I know people like this who will wait until they get that notice and pay their taxes, right? So by the time you—the list is generated—then they've already paid it, right? You know what I mean? That's the first thing. The second thing is you've got more people—like more competition—because these lists are easily—easier to come by. So I wonder how much they actually cost versus if you would put that towards—right, you know, and if it's not working for you and you—like he's clearly capable, you know what I mean? So it's like maybe if he diverted funds towards doing the other kind of mailing, he would have a lot more success. I would say most investors don't just focus on those type of lists. Most land investors focus on broader criteria and really don't worry about the delinquent tax list. I mean, there naturally will be a lot of those delinquent tax people in your broader list, but you know, it's not uh doesn't have to be any sort of focus on those types of things, right? So, you're kind of dealing with the entry. Mhm. Because it makes sense because then you're not—if you don't know how to formulate the list, this makes sense. Yeah. And there's a lot of different things that you can do kind of like that. Like some people only focus on absentee owners. That could be a good way to kind of break into an area. Absentee owners—maybe in the land business—could be something like someone that lives in a different state but owns this property in this other state. So, uh you know those types of things you might get a higher return on your—you know—conversion rate on your list. But I just have a feeling that since he's already doing this—like he's ready to take it to the next step. Yeah. You know what I mean? I would go with a broader list at this point. Yeah. Personally, but—okay. Um, and then Todd Smith says, "Pricing non-disclosure states, looking for pricing best practices in non-disclosure states. Any advice or guidelines?" Now, Pete Ree responded to this. Should I read Pete Reese's response or can you—I can—I can give you Pete Reese's response. Yeah, let me know. I'll let you know if you get close. Yeah, if it's the same advice. Sorry. Nope, that's not what he said. Yeah, I wanted to highlight this one because I thought it was—it's a pretty interesting thing. So, first of all, non-disclosure state means that they don't publish their sold prices publicly. So when you look—a lot of normal—normal states, I guess you say—they're disclosure states—obviously you can look on Zillow, you can look on Redfin, see exactly what property sold for—it's just public record—now some of these non-disclosure states—it's not public record—so basically you kind of have to piece the puzzle together a little bit in order to figure out comps. So, real estate agents have access to this information in a lot of these areas, but you don't want to be calling up real estate agents to, you know, see um, you know, every single potential deal that you have, but it won't end well for you. No, it won't. It won't be good. So, you need to use the online tools available to you and the information that's out there to kind of piece it together. Now, it's not going to be exact in these areas, but the kind of the way I do it is that first of all, I look at what's listed. So, those prices are obviously public. So you see what kind of properties are listed out there um using Redfin or Zillow generally. And then what I look at is, you know, are these properties—how long have they been on the market for? That'll tell me if the list price is too high or if it's right on—what type of activity they're getting. On Zillow, when you click on a property, a listing, you can see how many views it's had, how many saves it's had. So those are indications to me that those are generally priced pretty well. Mhm. And then, you know, you look at the list dates and see if it went—when—when they went pending and things like that. So, if a property was on the market for, you know, 7 days and it went pending right away, you know, that that list price is pretty—probably pretty accurate. You know, you might want to back off 10% or something like that just to be safe—to kind of come up with your estimated value. But you—you'll just want to use all those kind of hints to to piece together your your comps, basically context clues. And and my little take on that too is that this is way harder to do than a state that's—has disclosure. However, having said that—any barrier to entry is to your advantage. So if you're willing to do that legwork, 99% of the people won't. So you've got a leg up, right? But it just comes down to like—could you spend more time—like you know what I mean? Like where's that balance, right? And you know, and then you know, the other layer of it is that once you piece together what you think the comps are, you know, to get an idea of what you think the value is, get the property under contract. And then that's a point where you bring in a local broker—agent—to kind of confirm the values that you assume there are. So, right. And they could also—once you have an agent that you have a good working relationship with, they can do—print—like they can print out market trends and—yeah. Exactly. Yeah. And you—you may be able to, you know, once you start building these relationships in these areas, sometimes you can get these opinions before you go under contract and get their, you know, kind of ballpark on something. Yeah, "We can lock this one up. What do you think?" Yeah, exactly. Right. Um, okay. Steven says, "Mailing, I'm new, so be merciful. Let's be horrible to him." Okay. Um, has Pete ever done a deep detailed dive into the process of mailing? How does he find the lists? How does he narrow it down? How does he have a tailored offer? Because already included in thousands of letters. What are some things that you want to include to ensure success? Pitfalls. I'm not done yet. I know absolutely nothing about mass mailing. So, a detailed explanation would be amazing. Yeah. Okay. Now, permission to—okay. Well, I've actually got two full levels of our training program. And we're not calling—they're not modules, they're levels in our training program that are—oh, we're releasing hints, aren't they? Little hints—little hints—um—that are devoted to this. There's basically the building the list, choosing your areas, that type of stuff. And then the next part of is the logistic part of actually doing the mail, uh, getting the mail sent out and all all the different steps that you need to do in that. So, go through every single piece of that. And obviously, it's way too much to just kind of answer. And I was going to be like, "There's no podcast," but but yeah, there are specific steps that you need to go through and you can't skip any of them if you if you want to have success. But uh one of the little things in there is the—you mentioned how do you send out all these you know different offers to all these different people. You basically build a list. You have a letter and then it gets merged together and then it gets sent out by your mailing company. He doesn't sleep at night. He's in here in this same room right here writing out offers. He has a handwriting—signs them. I write them with like a—yeah—calligraphy and a quill and um ink. You know that type of thing. If you're lucky enough to get one of those offers, frame it. No. Um, I think that the thing is that you—you Steven—know exactly that there's a lot to it and so it wouldn't do justice to even talk—touch on those. I think that when you get to the training program that's—that's the whole goal is so that he's sharing each specific step. I just bit the microphone. Okay. All right. Well, you know, I think that's a good place to wrap up. Uh, we've talked for a long time today, but uh maybe I'm a windbag. No, I'm the one who talks too—oh, you're the one that talks about—okay. All right, Heather, don't read the comments. Anyhow, we hope you enjoyed this episode and a couple last things to kind of go over. If you haven't checked out our website, turningprofit.com, we do a monthly income report about land flipping. You do? I do. Okay. Monthly income report about land flipping—talk about the revenue we took in, the profit that month, each and every deal we did, what we bought it for, what we sold it for, how many days we held it for, notes on each individual deal. So, check that out. The other thing is that we do an extensive video along with that, and you can find that on our YouTube channel. What else we have to say? Join our land flipping community if you haven't already. And I guess we'll see you next week. Yeah. All right. Bye, guys.