Transcription
So, welcome Angela. Thank you for joining us today. I I'm very happy to have you here in Expat Experts.
Thank you.
Where where are you actually right now? Like that's something that we were just talking a bit but I didn't ask you before.
Yes, I'm in Brussels in Belgium.
Nice. But you are not originally from Brussels. So that's
No, I'm not.
You're still like still an expert let's say like this. So maybe we start from that. Where where are you originally from?
Yeah, I was born and raised in the New York City area in the US. Um and I lived there until I was 30. I left in 2010. So yeah, majority of my life uh was spent in the United States in the New York City area.
Nice. So you decided to leave. Why exactly? Like where was the first move? maybe you can walk through because I know that you lived in Asia, Pacific, Europe, Middle East even. So, it's a very random points in the map. What What was the main reason for moving?
So, it's a great question. Um, for me, it wasn't really at first a desire to be like, I need to explore the world. I was working as a um high school history teacher and in 2010, the economic downturn um dare I say, handed me a plate of opportunity. Um, I could see it as that I lost my job, but what I saw it as I can find a different way. And um, when I lost my job, I realized I could struggle and work multiple jobs because in New York, it's very you need a lot to live comfortably.
Um, so I decided to look at other options. And out of all the options, I looked at things in regards to a similar salary that could pay the bills that I had back home, plus safety. And then I ended up choosing Seoul or actually at that point it was Inchan which is about 45 minutes away from Seoul in South Korea.
Yeah. So I was working there as an educator and I ended up switching to uh universities and I worked as a university professor for a while as well. Um spent three and a half years there and then I moved to Amsterdam.
Um, and while I was in
No, um, that's a great question. Thank you for asking. Um, you know, in South Korea, I just kind of felt after a certain period of time that I, um, it life didn't look the way that I wanted it to be. I really enjoyed my time there, but I felt innately like I I wanted to settle down, and I didn't feel like that was going to happen there. Um, it was a very easy life, but it just seemed a bit too much like an extension of my 20s and not really something that I saw myself in forever.
Um, so yeah, I moved to Amsterdam um because a friend of mine told me that Americans could start their own business with a a reasonably small deposit. Um and um so I started a consulting business, an educational consulting business there. Um which was focused on helping people in the Netherlands to become better communicators. And so that's how I got my way in. [snorts] Um and I lived there from 2014 to 2018. And during that time I met my husband. Um, and in 2018, we ended up moving to Brussels, Belgium, because my husband got an opportunity working in the capital of the EU.
I mean, it's not that big of a change. I mean, [laughter]
between Amsterdam and Brussels, the distance is more reasonable. Let's say like this, but yes,
but the jump from United States to Korea, it's going to the other part of the world and then going back to Amsterdam. Um there is not only that but suppose languages at some point of time in Korea you teach in English or did you learn Korean for
for teaching? No, I I taught in English. Um I was actually teaching English um at a training center teaching also educators to teach English um more like pedagogy. And then after that I taught English and business. Um I also have a background in business um at the university and yeah you needed to learn some basics in Korea for sure. It was um a place where everyone's taught English from a young age and in fact many of the older generation also spoke some English because of the remnants after the Korean War and the effects of English on the Korean language if I can generalize it in that way. Um yeah so I I did need to learn some but I definitely was not nearly be able to even have a conversation. It was really survival Korean. I had working hours that really just prevented that from being able to happen uh for me to take a class and really dive deep into the language. But it's fascinating like breaking the hungle character set is almost like cracking a code. It's just it it opens up a part of your mind that you're just proud of and just also amazed at
but also complex. I suppose it's not as easy as going to any other Latin based language or Angloexonic based languages. But what's fascinating about Hungul [snorts] is that they changed it used to be um the similar character set to Chinese but the they changed it in Hungul is only 26 characters if I remember correctly. So it's actually quite easy to grasp on. The only problem is is that the character combinations can mean different words when and it's just almost mind-blowing as like couple character sets can mean like three different things. So, it was bit complex in that way, but to be able to understand what you're reading and to be able to understand in order to, for example, tell a taxi cab driver, hey, I'm here. Um, or where you want to go or what to order in a restaurant. Um, there was you, one could learn enough in that way to be able to live one's life. [snorts]
Cool. I mean, you said that you did the move already like being an adult. It wasn't a move that it was like I don't know early 20s you go into Arasmos and then you decide you find a country so you were already having I mean of course you had the moment of change of life losing the job and then finding opportunities it's always a a changer or a big uh change but um how was it like the adaptation on a on a absolutely cultural different uh countries from coming from United States to going to to South Korea in that sense?
Yeah, that's a great question. At first I definitely had some homesickness for sure. Um, I think at first I was just amazed at how different the world was. I feel like Americans are a bit sheltered and if I could go so far to also say a bit brainwashed um in the essence that we have such a large country and so like everything that we have is enough and it's big enough and once I stepped out of that I was just really blown away um but also missed the creature comforts of back home. I think that's totally normal.
Um and I was very lucky that I knew two people in Korea. one who worked in deu at the university and another one who was in the US Air Force. Um, and it was really a beautiful way to have like one foot in the US with my friends that are both American there, but also one foot in South Korea at the same time. And I also was very held by a very international team at the training center I first went to which was filled with people from Canada, South Africa, US like really a diverse team and it was just a really comforting kind of space because we all were so diverse but all expats and all non- Korean speakers or having much uh connection. I say much connection because there were two Korean-Americans on the team. Um but yeah, it was it was really a beautiful experience to just kind of go through that and to observe myself through that. And I think there were times where I was like, well, I don't know if I can do this. But I think I just continued one day at a time with curiosity and just trying to see what I could uncover. And those three and a half years that I spent there, I think I spent longer than I thought I would, but at the same time, I was able to travel so much and it was just such a great opportunity. I think during that time I probably traveled to like 30 different countries.
That's so cool. I mean, that's something that I always like miss and I maybe as a European you have this concept no like you are from Europe and then traveling around European countries especially since Shenhen it makes it easy for us internally let's say like this
for other countries with who doesn't have an agreement with Shenen that's a getting a Shenen visa it's a it's a nightmare probably but um
at at the at the moment of like saying okay you start counting countries and you say Okay. Yeah. But for us it's normal. No, you jump from one country to another in a short space and in Asia that also kind of can happen relatively easy.
But if you are not there permanently doing the jump uh from one country to another, it's different. No, you do this one traveling one time and going back home uh while you are there. That's it's incredible. I suppose like you need to discover so many different ways of doing so many countries, so many uh different experiences. That sounds amazing.
Yeah. I mean, one that really sticks out to me was like just discovering um things just like little little things like when you go to Cambodia, they use American dollars.
[snorts]
I remember just randomly bumping into that like I'm going to go to Cambodia when I'm traveling through Southeast Asia and it's like okay well keep in mind this and that and it's like what? So, you really have to do your research. Not only that, you should learn how to say please, thank you, where is the bathroom in the local language, you know, hello, goodbye. Um, but also these little things about getting your visa and what do you need to enter and what kind of currency would you because in some places maybe you don't have ATMs, but uh yeah, this was almost 15 years ago, 16 years ago. So we're looking not at a different time but somewhat you know so there are things that we still need to look into to understand to be able to make the process as smooth as it could be.
Yeah makes sense.
What about the teaching there like you did teach Korean uh students mainly or how how was this is it very different from the teaching in uh in United States or in anywhere else?
Yeah. Um because of Confucian values, teachers are like kind of treated with a respect that I would say is much higher than what I've seen in European and or um well I I'm generalizing here because I haven't taught in every European country nor have I taught in every US state but um it's much higher that they're literally treated to a different respect level. Um confusion values is huge. uh it's a huge kind of part of their being.
Um so of course they're curious to want to get to know you because you're not their standard English teacher or the English teachers that they're used to um or the business teachers that they're used to. Um but at the same time there is a level of respect that I think most westerners will be very surprised. Um yeah they look up to them. um and to I would say almost a detriment because the the ability to ask questions is almost blocked because it's just like this person I should be showing so much respect to when in the grand scheme of things if the respect blocks creativity and curiosity and the drive for critical thinking or whatever it may be and it's just a blind acceptance that's where things kind of go from okay we wanted to be respectful to okay how is this impacting my learning, you know.
Yeah. It's following a little bit. Not like a ship without own mind. Okay.