Sales Roleplay - Executive Coaching Offer With $1M/mo Trainer [LIVE]

All right, we are back with another high-ticket sales roleplay. I'm here with Valentina and Victoria, and we're going to jump into the discovery part of a high-ticket sales call. Valentina is going to play the closer for an Executive coaching offer that helps people who are either unemployed or employed wanting to get into a position at a mid-to-senior level. So, if you don't know what that means, that means manager, director level, earning about $150,000 to $400,000. Then we have Victoria, who on this call is going to play the prospect. We're going to go through all of the different sections of the discovery part of a call so that you can uncover the truth, you can get to what really matters, and ultimately you can help someone make the best decision for them, which most of the time is actually they need to buy because they booked in the call because they're not where they want to be. So we'll go through all the different subtle nuances of what does need to happen, what you need to be doing on a high-ticket sales call so you can close the deals, help more people, and make more money.

So whenever you're ready, Victoria—uh, no, Valentina—crack in with your opening question. So Victoria, what is the biggest reason that you are looking to get out of your current role right now?

Yeah, so I've been with my current company for seven years now, and I've really—I've loved everything about it, but I just feel like I have gotten to the point where there's not a lot of growth anymore, and so I'm looking to make a change.

Got it. Now, how long have you been feeling like there is no growth there?

Nope. Pause. One of the most powerful, simple things that you'll be able to add to all your calls is when the prospect says something, say back to them what they said, especially if it's pain, and then they have to reaffirm it again, and it just puts the nail in the coffin twice. So I would have just said, "Okay, got it. So you've been in this company for seven years, up until now you loved everything, but right now you aren't growing, is that correct?" And then they say yes, and it does two things: it makes them have to reaffirm it, so they say, "Oh yeah, [ __ ] I'm in pain, I've got a challenge," but number two, it shows the prospect that you're smart enough and articulate enough to take everything they said, condense it for them, which is showing the prospect, "Wow, this person can help take me from a lack of clarity to more clarity," and they start to buy into you as the closer as much as they're going to start buying into what you're about to sell them. They're like, "Wow, Valentina is able to listen to everything I'm saying, and I trust her that she's able to grasp the pieces that are important." And it's these little nuances that remove trust objections, that remove "I'm not going to make a decision right now" objection, or "I need to ask someone else for permission to make a decision," because actually what it is, they don't feel comfortable with themselves, the prospect, to put all their trust into you to help them make this career change, but also to give you their credit card details. Does that make sense?

Absolutely, that makes sense.

So it's up to you. What we usually do on these roleplays is we go back so that you can rerun it again how it would have been if you did it even better, and then you're just practicing the muscle memory of doing it the way I just said. Does that make sense?

Yep.

Okay, so do you want me to start from the initial question or from the summary?

No, I—I would just go with the summary and just say however you would summarize it and then go from there.

Okay, so got it. Victoria, you've been at this company for seven years, and you originally loved it, but now you're feeling like there's no room to grow there. Is that correct?

Yeah, exactly.

Okay. Another point: when we add certain little words, it can diminish the association to the reality. And so what you said is you feel like there's no growth—very different to being a little bit more direct and saying, "Okay, so you've been there for seven years, up until now you loved everything, but now you are not growing." It's such a subtle tweak, but when you say, "Oh, I feel," it's like when people say, "Oh, my emotions," it's like it's not as powerful as saying, "The current reality is you are not growing." Now you can't say those words if the prospect hadn't said them, because that's putting words into their mouth; that's you trying to lead the conversation or telegraph. But she said it, so because she said it, you can then just take the very direct problem and say, "You are not growing," and she's like, "No, I'm not growing," and then we're taking all of the—the uh—the vagueness of what's really going on and making it concrete. "You are in a position, and you are not growing," is that correct?

Yes.

Okay. All right, got it. So you've been in this position for seven years now, and you loved it, but now you are not growing, is that correct?

Yeah, exactly.

Okay. Okay, sorry, pause. You did that perfectly. I'm curious for both Victoria and for you. Victoria first, as the prospect: Victoria, how did that feel to have to reaffirm it in that way versus the previous two times?

It made it feel real, like, been there. It made it feel real in a sense of like putting the reality that I've been there for seven years, and I loved it, and I'm not growing, so it like left me with that feeling of not growing.

Correct. It will leave the prospect with the feeling of what's actually going on, and more specifically the problem—why we're on the call. So then, for you, Valentina, delivering it in that way, did you feel any difference?

Absolutely. At first, I felt like there was more—I was holding more authority because I was not telling her anything that she didn't tell me. I wasn't assuming; I wasn't putting anything onto her. It was just simply stating. I felt the power in that.

Nice. Perfect. All right, keep going from that.

Okay, so how long have you not been growing in this position? That—that is the wrong question. Have a guess why?

It's definitely not the right next question.

What have you missed? I feel like I need to start gathering data.

Okay, so based on what the prospect said, based on what Victoria said, what is the next most relevant piece of data that you need to gather if it's not how long?

Well, because I was going to say, "How long have you been feeling this way?" but to not use the word "feel," then um—well, now, how long has she been looking for a new position? No, nothing to do with how long. So to gather data, first thing we need to know is the problem. The problem is not growing, but what does that mean? What does that actually mean? What—

So the next question that you should ask is, "What is not growing? What specifically is not growing, or what—what in your life specifically—is not growing?" Anything to do with what is not growing. Now, when Victoria and you are having the conversation, there's kind of this obviousness of, "Well, she's probably talking about money," but we don't know that. It might not be. Even if it was, though, you need to take things breadcrumb by breadcrumb, because—and I was doing this on one of the previous roleplay trainings—that if there was a—a magic wand that you could wave to go from the beginning of the call to the point at the end of the discovery where you just have all the data, but you able to just do it in the click of your finger, that would actually be worse, because it's going through each question and getting the prospect to answer it. What we're actually doing in the discovery and why we're gathering—gathering the data is not to have a sheet of paper with a bunch of data points on it; it's that as we're gathering all that data, Victoria is having to feel into each response. So to jump to like, "Oh, well, how long have you felt that way?" We miss that Victoria has to tell you, and more importantly tell herself, what is not growing. When she then says, "Well, I'm not growing financially, I'm not growing personally, nothing's growing," she's going to start to—to sit deeper and deeper into this guilt and this shame and this frustration and this fed-upness, and it's moving the prospect through the emotions from, "I don't feel anything; I just booked in a call, and I'm kind of my head's buried in the sand," to, "Holy [ __ ] I feel crap!" It's moving the prospect through those emotions; that's what we're actually doing in the discovery. Gathering data by asking questions is how we do that, but if you could just get all the information, that's not going to close the prospect. And the biggest reason why is because otherwise we would just get prospects to fill out an application form and have a buy now button. If—if a price of a product is high enough, and for whatever reason there isn't enough pre-branding that people can just buy it without talking to anyone, what we have to do through the discovery is connect with and pull out of the prospect all of those emotions that make them decide to pay $5,000 or $10,000—$10,000—and do it right now. Does that make sense?

You got to get—yeah, Victoria—to feel all these emotions one by one. So the—the very next question is, "Okay, so in what way are you not growing?" Something around that would be what the question needs to be. Okay, then we have to chunk it down and get into all the data so that she feels that problem.

Got it. Sorry, um—so when you—when you asked me that, I was in my mind thinking because there were different aspects that I wasn't growing; I was like, "Which one should I choose?"

Well, most people might actually have more than one, so you can say multiple, and that will actually give Valentina more of a challenge to have to dig into all of them, which is quite realistic that you'd have to dig into all of them. It's very rare that someone gets to a point where they book in a call because one thing is the problem—we've not grown. Oh, it's just the money. No, it's, you know, if you've ever heard the story of, you know, the straw that broke the camel's back, it's all of these things that build up until eventually they're like, "Oh, well, I need to book in a call." It's rare that it's going to be one of them.

Okay. All right, so do—do that again, so you can say imagine you've already done the summary, and then—then you're about to do the next question from there.

Okay. Victoria, in what way are you not growing?

I would say from a personal development aspect I'm not growing because I just feel like over the past couple of years like I've just stayed the same; like I haven't learned new skills, I haven't taken on any more responsibility, it's just been the same almost like every single day. And then from like a money standpoint, I just feel like I'm capped.

Gotcha. So from a personal development standpoint, you feel like that's at a standstill?

Yeah.

Now, how long have you been feeling that way in your role?

Nope. We have to go five layers deeper into both of those.

Yeah, yeah.

Okay, give it—give it another shot, and if you get stuck, I'll—I'll give you some examples, but th—this is where the money is made; this is where the sale is made is this front part of the call. I mean, so far, I—I don't know how many we've been going, probably 15 minutes, but on the actual call, if we imagined it was without my—my interruptions, we're probably only like 90 seconds into the call, and I've already given you four things to work on. It's the front—front—front part of the call, the first 5 to 10 minutes where the sale is really made. What people think, because of the misconception of the word "closer" or "closing," is, "Oh, the sale is made at the end of the discovery or even after the pitch." It's like, "No, no, no. When you really get into the nuggets of what's going on in the first 5, 8, 10 minutes, and we go three, four, five layers deep, that's when Victoria is going to feel like [ __ ]," and then we're just going to tie it all down with, "Well, how long have you been feeling this way?" Okay, have you gotten to the point where you're done? Yes. Okay, how much longer? Those just kind of like put a—a ribbon on the present, but we have to pack the present first with all of this stuff at the front part, so we have to go way deeper into that. Okay, give it another go; if you get stuck, I'll give you a hand.

Okay, so with personal development, if you don't mind just giving me some more clarity on exactly what you mean by that.

Yeah, so I feel like I haven't been able to like learn any more skills, take on any more responsibility, and the job just kind of feels like it's the same thing over and over again, and I'm not really growing in any aspect of it.

Got it. Now, what would taking on more responsibility look like to you?

I think that—yeah, hang on, sorry. I wouldn't go that way because we're now talking about the future; we're talking about the hypothetical future. We want to stick on the reality of the pain of now. What—what's bothering her about this rather than what would that look like or why would that, you know, change things. Stick in the fact that she's going to work every single day, not learning any new skills, not taking on any responsibility, doing the same thing over and over again. Focus on that and try and—try and stay in the present. You—this is where you hold the prospect's feet to the fire. When we move to, "Oh, well, what would that look like?" We take their feet away from the fire, and they're not under any pressure.

Okay, got it. So, Victoria, how are you feeling going to work day-to-day, feeling like your personal development is halted? Be—be specific. Def—put all the specifics into the question, and sometimes the question will become quite long, so it's better to summarize and then add the question on the end.

Okay, so you're going to work every day, you're not learning any new skills, you're not taking on any responsibility, you're doing the same thing over and over again. How does that feel for you day-to-day? You see the difference?

Yeah, so I can take everything first and then add the question at the end, or I can do it the other way. Sometimes it just gets a bit of a mouthful. I could say, "Okay, so how does it feel going to work every day, not learning any new skills, not taking on any responsibility, and just doing the same thing over and over?" I could do it that way; I can do it both. I personally prefer to summarize and ask the question after; it's just usually a little bit more direct. But take the prospect's words and keep on top of—they said this; I'm going to put it back onto them and add to it with another question. Don't remove the things that they say, because we just start going from the—the—the very serious and highly defined reality to vagueness again. You don't want to get into vagueness; you want to keep things defined.

Got it. Yeah, I can see the power in the summary.

Okay, so you're not learning anything; you feel like you can't increase in your responsibility, and you're just doing the same thing over and over again. How does that feel on a day-to-day?

It sucks. It feels like every day is the same. I wake up just not motivated to even continue doing it. I feel bored and—um—no, it doesn't feel good.

And how is that impacting you on a personal level to not feel motivated every day and to feel bored every day?

It's definitely, you know, affected how I show up every day. I, you know, don't even feel like going to the gym or like just doing things that I want to do because I—I just feel so unfulfilled, and so it's also, in a way, like impacted my relationship with my husband because I just kind of feel like I don't know—just not excited to do anything.

Okay, pause, pause. So this would be a trap because it would feel like we—we're into some like juicy deep stuff now about her husband, which is—which is good, but I wanted to let you go a bit further without interrupting. Um, so I—I gave you the example of summarizing the prospect's words and then adding the next question, and then we carried on; there was still like another two or three layers before we get into all of this. So let me give you an example to show you how many layers before we're even going to get into, "How does this make you feel?" So I'm going to go all the way back to—"You're not"—in terms of the personal development, you're not learning skills, responsibility, and doing the same thing. Watch how many layers I go into that before I even move on. Okay, what skills are you not learning?

I feel like I'm not getting better in terms of leadership skills—um—so in terms of like taking on a bigger team and what that looks like from like a managerial perspective.

Okay, so you're not learning leadership skills, you're not taking on a team, you're not doing anything managerial. Anything else?

Well, I also like—don't know what I don't know, so I don't know what that next level would even—would even look like—um—and in terms of possibly like a director role. But ultimately, I feel like what I'm not learning is like developing my leadership skills, which is something that I—I've always—I've wanted to do. That's why I am in a manager role.

Why have you always wanted that?

I have just felt fulfilled helping—um—people on—on my team, and I grew into taking on more responsibility and being in a leadership—and as I've done that, I've really felt like it's nice to help others in that way and help them with their, you know, careers and their sales careers, and it's been really fulfilling to do that within a team.

How does that make you feel when you're helping others and doing that in a team and leading other people?

It makes me feel great. It makes me feel like I'm needed; it makes me feel—feel like I can be counted on, and in a sense it kind of makes—makes me feel important and valued, and I love giving back to my team.

Okay, and so you're not developing these leadership skills or leadership responsibilities with teams, management, so I don't want to assume, but does that mean right now you don't feel important day-to-day during the whole time where you're at work, you don't feel valued, you don't feel needed?

I feel like I feel valued and needed when it comes to my team.

Okay, but it's hard because my director doesn't make me feel valued or needed.

Okay, so why don't you just find a position with a different director?

Well, that's what I'm—I'm wanting to do.

Do you want to become the director, or you want to just move to a different branch where you have a different director?

Yeah, I can't become the director because there's already a director, so I—I can't really level up in that sense until he—he gets promoted, and I don't know when that would ever happen. I don't even know if he wants to be promoted to a regional. So ultimately, this is where it's—I'm—I'm feeling like it's time for me to look elsewhere because you feel like you're stuck where you're at, but you can't go up either, so you're just stuck in this position of no ex—no growth on your leadership and no growth on—essentially feeling counted on more and feeling more important and more valued, so you're just stuck in this middle position, is that correct?

Mm-hmm.

How—how does that make you feel knowing that you're going to work every day, wanting to help people, wanting to be counted on, wanting to lead people, and you're just stuck like banging your head against the wall? How does that feel?

It sucks. It doesn't—it doesn't feel good.

And sorry, just quickly—what's really important that hopefully you're watching along, Valentina, is Victoria said "it sucks." She said the exact same words to you when we were five layers less deep, but the energy of how she said "it sucks" was completely different. When you asked her, "How do you feel?" She was like, "It sucks, sucks." It was kind of like, "No, it sucks, flipping." Now she's like making a nervous laugh because of how bad she feels about herself, keeping herself in this position that sucks so bad. So she said the same words, but because we're five layers deeper, it means more. Does that make sense?

Absolutely. I—it—yeah, the way that you said it there was a lot more emotion there, and it's—it's so funny how, you know, just now getting into the scriptless discovery, I—it's like you jump so quickly to the "How does this make you feel?" question, genuinely empathetic when you ask it, but it's always been the struggle on how—um—how to chunk down and how to really—really get to the root of what's really going on before asking that question. So this—has been phenomenal to just observe as well.

Okay, keep watching because I'm still in the same section; I haven't even moved on to, "How long has this been going on?" And I could have probably not even asked, "How you feel"—um—

Okay, so that's the leadership skills, that's your position, and so you've mentioned wanting to lead and wanting to take on a team. What are you taking on right now on a day-to-day basis?

Right now, I'm currently managing five sales reps, and the territory is fairly small, so I'm—right now I'm just handling the Southeast region of Florida, and it's nice. I—I love having an intimate team, and I feel like we've—we've grown, but like I said, I'd like to do—I'd like to take on more.

Do you think you could still have that intimacy with more responsibility and a larger team?

I think that—I think that I could.

You don't sound 100% sure. The reason I ask is because let's just imagine that we help you get into a director role or a manager role or just anything that has more leadership skills and more leadership responsibility, and because of that you have massive growth, but potentially you lose a bit of the intimacy that you have with where you're stuck at now. Mh—like if you were in that position, which direction would you want to go?

I don't want to help you get someone then you're like, "Hey, Josh, you—you ruined the intimacy that I liked with my team, and then now I've got 200 people—people in front of me." What about that?

Yeah, no, that's a good point. It—I obviously love the intimacy with the small team, and it's something that I—I know that it's not going to be as intimate when I, you know, if I can get to this next position—um—so that's—that's something that I'm okay with.

Okay, so you've—you've come to terms with that being totally fine because you—you care more now about impacting more people and having more growth and more leadership skills, even if there's a little bit of a reduction in how intimate it is with each person. You've come to that conclusion?

Yeah, absolutely.

Okay, makes sense. All right, let me pause there to just explain what I'm doing. Notice how I'm not trying to sell Victoria; I'm actually saying, "Well, this could be an issue, and it might not even be worth you joining our program." No, no, no, it's not going to be an issue; I've already figured it out. Now what that does is it shows Victoria, "I'm not trying to sell you; I'm trying to find what's best for you." That one moment there, it wasn't forced; it just happened naturally because Victoria said something that I thought, "Well, that's interesting. What if you lost the intimacy by doing that?" An ethical way, actually talking about it, not brushing it under the carpet because you think that might ruin the sale. Victoria's trust level now for me is through the roof; she's not going to say, "I need to ask my husband"; she's not going to say, "I need to think about it"; she's not going to lie and say, "Oh, it's the price," when actually it's not the price; she's just afraid. What I just did there is the difference between getting to the end of the call and having no objections or getting to the end of the call, and she has a concern, but she just tells me what the real concern is as opposed to a smoke screen or—or seven different objections back to back, and I now have to do all my little objection loops. We may get to the call, and she says, "I'm ready; here's my Visa" at the end of the call, or we may get to the end of the call, she says, "It's a lot of money; I have the money, but I'm super scared." Okay, well, that's normal; what are you going to do? I don't have to do objection handling 'cause she's just told me the truth, and I'm just going to say, "Well, what are you going to do?" That would change because of that little tiny moment there that I did with just being honest with her—"Well, what if this causes more of a problem than it fixes a problem?" Does that make sense to both of you?

Yes.

Any—any thoughts, Valentina, feedback?

Yes, I—um—I mean, I think I saw how that just increases her trust in you because the word that just keeps popping up in my head is "curiosity"—like you just had—I just saw you have genuine curiosity, and then you are qualifying her, which at the end of the day you have authority, you're holding the frame. And so often we pre-frame and then try to pre-sell, or we pre-frame and we try to—um—then tell them how they're such a great fit before it's even time to do that, but instead you actually are caring, and you're actually curious, and so I think that's the biggest differentiator than even what I find myself doing. So yeah, I—um—I have a question for you: when they're—so Victoria is employed now. Now, at the end of the day, sometimes would you just trust when it's time to move into how long she's been looking, or—or is that something that might matter less if we're really uncovering the truth of the situation in her current role?

Yeah, great question. So once I have all the pain and we've gathered all the data on the current situation—like what's actually going on right now—the whole thing, I'll then say, "How long have you been in blank, blank, blank situation?" 'Cause now what it does, it takes all the pain and all the reality and—and expands it across a timeline. And then by knowing the severity of the situation and the timeline, my obvious next chess move on the board is, "So you've been feeling and experiencing this for this period of time; why now are you doing something about it?" It's kind of like the—the obvious three things: what's going on right now, how long has it been going on, okay, well, why are we fixing it now? Why are *you* fixing it now? It's kind of the—the three things. Whereas if I don't go deep enough in the pain, my "How long has it been going on?" has less impact because I'm not—I'm not—I'm not dragging an elastic band that actually has much density to it; I'm not expanding the timeline across that much pain. Or if I don't ask how long, my "Why now?" question is just like superfluous; it's like, "Well, why now? I don't know; I just saw an ad." No, it's—you—you—you've been in this [ __ ] situation for a year; why are you doing something about it now? Now she's thinking, "Yeah, I have been in this situation for a year; what was actually the turning point?" And it's a real question—"Why now?"—not the next question on the script—"Oh, I need to ask a 'Why now?' question," which just sounds weird if—if there's no obvious anchor points to why we're asking that question. I'm asking, like you said, out of curiosity—"Because your life has sucked for two years, why are you doing something about it now?" It's—it's—it's genuine; I don't understand—like why—why now are you doing something about it? Whereas if I don't have those two things, then I—the "Why now?" question is just a scripted question, right?

Yeah, or if it's—if it's not a long period of time. Okay, so you've been in the [ __ ] situation; it's only been going on for 30 days; it's not a very long period of time. Is there any particular reason that you're making a move so quickly and so abruptly? Same thing—curiosity—"Oh, it's not really been a very long period of time; I'm going to kind of unell you a little bit."

Got it.

Yeah. All right, I'm going to pause my examples; jump back in wherever you want to jump back in. Hopefully, now you see about going much—much—much deeper. We've probably covered most of the leadership and the responsibility; we haven't touched anything on being capped financially, so you need to dig into all of that as well.

Okay. Okay, got it. So you also mentioned that there's no room to grow financially. What is your current salary right now?

So—so right now my current salary is at 100—

Sorry—sorry, guys, say the exact words the prospect said. So you also mentioned that you are capped financially. Use their words; use the most painful words. "Being capped" is not a logistical phrase; it's an emotional phrase. "Being capped" is like, "I'm stuck; I can't go anywhere." Okay, you mentioned that you were capped financially. What salary are you at right now?

So right now I am at 150,000.

You're at 150,000. Now, were you always at 150,000, or did you step into this role at a little bit lower?

Yeah, so I stepped into this role seven years ago, and when I started seven years ago, I was at 90, 95,000.

Got it. And then when did that increase to 150?

[Music] So I always get about—depending on the year—around like a six to 7% merit increase yearly, and then about two years ago we—there was a merger, and once the merger happened, they actually—um—decided to raise our salaries—um—to be of market.

Got it. And then in those two years since they raised your salary to be on market?

Yeah, there's been no opportunity to grow that six to seven per—higher per year.

Correct. I would still get the six to—like I still get the merit increase every single year.

Okay. Um, but other than that, besides a six to 7% merit increase, like there's not a large jump in the salary that I can get to.

It's got—so you're still getting the six to 7% merit increase, but you're looking for something much larger than the 150k that you're at right now?

Yeah.

Get—get her to tell you specifically. So she said—Victoria said, "There's not much of a jump that I can do." Well, I need you to tell me that number because it's going to make you feel like [ __ ]. So you missed that extra question. Okay, she said, "There's not much of a jump." How much more of a jump is there available?

Got it. On to that—Victoria—there's not much of a jump available; there's only the six to 7% merit increase, and that's really based on my—um—like how I did for the year. So the highest I can get to is a 7% merit increase based on my annual review. And how much is—

So have you calculated how much is 7% over the next 12 months? Then what is that going to—to go up by?

I haven't calculated that.

Okay, let's just do it quickly then. So 10% would be 15,000; 1% would be 500; so 7,000, so 10,500, I believe. So if you stay in your company for another 12 months—um—not feeling needed, not feeling counted on, not feeling important, not feeling valued, not learning any more leadership skills, doing the same—same thing over and over again, the only benefit for you is you're going to make an extra 10,500 jump on your salary, but in exchange for that, you have to put up with losing 12 months of your life doing the same thing over and over again and not growing. Does that make sense?

Yeah.

So when you—when you think about, you know, the next 12 months and what it could be—should be—what you're going to do with it, when you kind of look at it in the way I've just explained it, how does that make you feel?

It doesn't make me feel good, like knowing that all the effort, all the time, everything that I do for my team, I'm only getting, you know, a merit increase based on my annual review, like if I put double the amount of time, it doesn't even matter.

How does that make you feel knowing that the amount of effort that you put in, especially seeing as you want to help other people, doesn't get noticed?

It doesn't make me feel good at all, especially because my newer regional director continues to—is always just wanting me to do more and more, and—um—yeah, so it doesn't make me feel good knowing that I'm expected to do more, and I'm—I—I don't get anything in return.

Can you give me an example of something, maybe in the last 3

Didn't say why not. She was like, "Well, no, I don't want to do that," and the reason why is, "I don't even want that position and it's not going to grow." But she only started to open up more and more and more and be honest because I wasn't trying to sell her. I was like, "Well, you can stay there if you want. Are you in that position?" And then she starts selling herself. Is that clear? Extremely extremely clear.

I think I watched this in the role play you did with Christian and Alex where you were like, "What you think is the next question?" And there were moments where, as you were digging deeper, um, first that was just incredible to see. And then in my head, I would go, "Why?" And then you said, "Why?" And then when Victoria said she's just preparing herself just in case, I almost got off like, "Why are you on this call, then?" And then you asked, "So is there a reason why you booked in? Or what, whatever that question was?" It just shows that, um, yeah, it's not about you're not selling her at all. You're not selling her at all. But I would like, buy, I would have bought this yesterday. You know, it's, it's, um, it's really really cool to see. And that makes perfect sense to me on just how to really chunk down. There's just so much to chunk down on before moving forward.

So then probably at this point, she's told me, "I'm done. I need to make a change." I could then say, "Okay, you know, you you had that moment now where the director gave you more more stuff to do and you said yes again. How long have you been saying yes to more things that in your own words are just going to give you more work but give you no reward? How long have you been doing that?" "I've been doing that probably now for around like five or six years." "Okay. I mean, can I be blunt with you? That is a little bit of a concern for me. Why do you think that is?" "Probably because I've allowed this type of pattern and behavior for so long without doing anything about it." "And what, why do you think that should be a concern for people like us that help people make a change?" "It probably makes you hesitant to know if I will actually make a change for myself or not." "And so why, if you would, would you make a change? Because you you've just allowed this to be your reality for 5 to 6 years. So you tell me why. Why should I not be concerned that you're going to continue to, I guess, just play the carpet for everybody to walk all over?"

"When I started with this company, I truly felt like this is where I wanted to retire. Like this is where I wanted to be. I was really excited to get into this company. It's not an easy company to get into. And that's kind of where my head space was at at the time. So I felt like, and and the culture is very much like that. And so, um, I in the beginning I wanted to do those things. I didn't mind it. But over the years and you know the continual feeling capped and you know just not being able to fully flourish into my own and what the next level is for me, like really made me want to change." "I completely understand why you want to change. I mean, it's clear to both of us. What I'm not clear on is why did you allow yourself to be walked all over for 5 to 6 years? And I get that you're saying, 'Oh, well, I wanted to retire in this company,' but did you not get to a point two years in, being walked all over, that you're like, 'Actually, I don't want to retire in a company that walks all over me'?" "I wouldn't necessarily say like I was walked all over. So I wouldn't say that because there was just a there is a lot of good in it too." "Hang on. Well, tell me where someone is being fair to give you more work than you're going to be rewarded for. In what way is that not being taken advantage of? Help me understand how that's someone respecting you or helping you advance in your career. 'Hey, here's more work to do, and I'm not going to reward you in any way, shape, or form.'" "There were times where, yeah, I mean, I see what what you're saying. There were times that I was rewarded, um, for taking on and was recogniz…" "Sorry to be blunt, Victor, but that's like a woman saying, 'My husband beats me up, but then he buys me flowers.' The the point is, the big picture is, if I understood correctly, for a number of years you have known that you're accepting to do more more without any reward. Yes, you did other work that you got rewarded for, and you obviously got a salary, but for a number of years you continue to take on work that you were not going to be rewarded for. So what I'm trying to understand is why do you really feel that you allowed that to happen to you for so many years, being aware of what was happening?"

"In a way, I felt like at some point they would recognize me. Like I genuinely thought that it was going to be there was a payoff for me. And now saying it out loud, I feel really stupid." "Well, at least you at least you're being honest and being aware of yourself. So again, I'm not saying this to judge you. I just want to get to the truth. Would it be fair to say that you were naive for a number of years?" "Yes." "Okay. Where is that naivety now, on a scale of one to 10?" "I would say it's after taking on this last one, it's at a zero." "Okay. So you know you have to take charge of your own life. No one else is going to come and pat you on the back or reward you for being someone that wants to help other people, someone that wants to lead other people, someone that essentially just wants to advance in their own life. You have to take control of your own life. And it sounds like you've come to that conclusion now." "Mhm." "Okay. Makes sense. So I'll pause it again there. That's another section. But look at how a lot of times in calls like we have to get a little bit on the edge of combative because people just rationalize themselves. 'Oh, well, it wasn't that bad.' Well, what? Because you got a salary, but you were also just being given more and more and more and more work. 'Well, it wasn't that bad.' And Victoria said that like three times, and I'm like, 'No, I'm not buying it.' And I can have that level of whatever we call it, intensity or or or staying in my position because I I don't need the sale. I don't care about the sale. I care about Victoria telling herself the truth. And if the truth is, 'Yeah, actually, I was an idiot, and now I'm not going to be an idiot,' brilliant. Then I'll sell you. If what she wants to say is, 'No, I wasn't an idiot,' then I would just unsell and say, 'If I'm being honest, someone that's going to do really well in Executive coaching certainly is not somebody that's never made mistakes. That's not what I'm saying, but it's it's absolutely someone that, having made a mistake, can look at themselves honestly and say, '[ __ ] I was a bit naive there for quite a long time. I'm a bit of an idiot,' and that's the person that turns into a fantastic person in a director role or a managerial role. If I'm honest with you, at this point I'm not hearing that level of self-awareness or reflection. And at this point, I would say that we would find it very difficult to land you a good director role or a good managerial role because we're not going to lie on the application and say, 'Oh, you're you're a super self-aware person.' We're going to be honest with you, and it just doesn't seem like you've come to that point yet. But if in the near the near future something changes and you think about this conversation and you think, 'Actually, you know what? I was a [ __ ] idiot for a few years,' then you're welcome to reach back out, and we can help you get into a role. And I would just unsell them. Now that's very very rarely going to happen because the bit that I did before, usually prospects will say, '[ __ ] this guy or this girl is not letting me off the hook. They're not trying to sell me. They're actually more than happy to burn the lead or burn the sale than to try and sell me.' And you go through that little friction point with the prospect, they're going to buy from you. They're going to give you their credit card and buy from you because nobody else is going to do that with them. So they're like, '[ __ ] I I trust this person.' And the other thing to remember is the level of trust that the prospect feels with the closer is by association how they assume the program is going to be. In other words, how good your pitch is. They're going to be wearing rose-colored glasses or rose-colored headphones while they're listening to your pitch, thinking, 'Wow, this sounds so amazing. This is so cool. This is exactly what I need.' They're they're listening to it that way because you're the one telling it to them. And it's like the reciprocal of when people say, 'Don't shoot the messenger.' Yes, but the opposite is true. If the messenger is someone that you think's the best thing since Jesus walked the Earth, whatever [ __ ] message they tell you, you're like, 'Wow, this is the best thing I've ever heard in my entire life.'"

"It's all done in the discovery. Is that clear?" "Yeah. Yeah. Ex- any any thoughts or feedback on that?" "My I mean my biggest just realization that I just had is that I find that the combativeness or the unsell or can happen in the objection handling, and this is literally how to avoid the objection." "Yep. So I'm just gonna sit with that for for a minute because it's it's really about chunking down on and getting to the the root, and then there's no then you're just having a conversation. Then it's not an objection. You're just talking." "Yeah. Because because imagine the most likely objection from Victoria if we hadn't had that conversation there. It would have gone something like this: 'Hey, Victoria, the investment's $110,000.' 'Oh wow, that's a lot of money. You know, maybe if I keep doing work and I just keep accepting what the director's saying, I'm sure at some point they're going to recognize me and they're going to give me a promotion.'" "That would have been her rationalization to the objection." "Well, she she ain't going to say that now cuz she's just told herself that that's not true. 'No, I was being naive.'" "Okay. How much longer are you going to be naive?" "Not anymore." "Why not?" "Well, cuz it's cost me blank blank blank blank blank." "So we we took her, you know, ammunition for objections and just threw the ammunition out the window, and it's gone. She can't use that anymore. But even if I'd have tried to say in the objection handling, 'Well, how how many years have you been in this role? Blank. How how how long have you been accepting extra work? Blank. So if you've been accepting extra work for this period of time and they've not given you a promotion, why why are you thinking now that they would?' The difference is the frame. The frame is, 'Oh, well, Josh is just trying to sell me. Josh is just trying to loop me into a word track that makes me feel like I have to buy because because of the frame.' The frame is, I'm having that conversation with you, the same conversation after I've told you the price in objection handling whilst I'm trying to close you. Same thing. 'Don't shoot the messenger.' Well, if the messenger is 'I'm trying to get your visa card,' you you're just going to see everything I say through that lens. Whereas if I haven't even told you the pitch or the price and I'm saying, 'Well, you know, do you think you've been naive?' And she's like, 'No.' Okay. Well, I don't agree with you. Like I'm not trying to sell you anything. I'm just having a conversation with you and being honest so you can do the same things in objection handling or in the discovery. 99.9% more effective in the discovery because of the frame. The frame is so different. It's it a good example is like if you walk into a doctor's office and the doctor's wearing a white lab coat and has a name badge and has all of his certifications on the wall, anything he tells you about medical stuff you just believe it because of the frame. The frame is, 'Oh, it's a doctor telling me.' The frame is, 'This is a person doing the discovery,' versus the frame of, 'This is a person trying to close the deal.' Could say the exact same things and has such a different effect. Is that clear?" "Yes." "All right. That's pretty much it, to be honest. We can go back and you can go through it again, um, you running the call if you want. From this point, there's only a few things that I need to know is why us, why do you need Executive coaching, why why not just do this on your own? I'd ask a 'how much longer' question at some point. I'd probably ask her, uh, ask Victoria, 'You know, for all of these years that you haven't grown and you know haven't been getting rewarded for your your time and effort, etc., what do you think would have been the difference if you'd have been in an executive position where you are rewarded for all of your time and efforts?' So then I can get probably a a Financial tie-down. 'Oh [ __ ] I would have made an extra $200,000.' Now we've got price anchoring. 'Oh well, it cost you $200,000 to not have this Executive coaching that's costing 10,000.' Would have been a nice thing to have. If I could have got it. Huge part of the call we didn't even get to. And so this is how many layers it is. What impact is this having on the other areas of your life? A whole another category of the conversation. So you can see how much can be done in a discovery. There's there's so much. And and cuz I'm cutting in and interrupting, it feels like it's long. I mean, we've been going 56 minutes, but if I'd have just done this without interruptions, this would have been 25 minutes, but we would have gone so [ __ ] deep into everything that Victoria is [ __ ] like there's no way she's not going to buy. Like, sorry to be blunt, but you're going to buy cuz this is still the the current problem. We haven't even talked about, you know, you mentioned husband and you know health and this that and the other. What impact is it having on all of that? 'I haven't been able to pay for the gym membership I like cuz I'm not making more money than I want and haven't been able to… me and my husband have been engaged for two years.' 'Okay. Why for two years?' 'Well, we want to have this beautiful wedding. I've never been married before. I want my dream wedding. It's going to cost $50,000. We just can't justify that right now when I'm not progressing at work.' Like so many other personal things that can come up. And then we get all of that. And then my 'how much longer' question is, 'So let me ask you, how much longer are you willing to be naive and staying in a role where the time and effort that you put in is not turning into money in your bank that you can pay for your wedding, skills that you can equip yourself with, people that you can impact to be a leader and to be needed and to be counted on? How much longer are you going to stay in a level where you are never going to have that reality?' And it's like, 'What? Not another day.'" "Not another day." "Yeah. Yeah. Because of how specific you got and you got her to say the truth. So then it's not just asking that question without uncovering it because then they can just give you five million different excuses." "Correct. Correct."

"All right. So let's go back a little bit and I'll let you run it with Victoria for 10 15 minutes, um, you can go from wherever you want. So you can pick up wherever we stopped off, go back a little bit, go forward wherever. I just want you to have a shot at digging into all of these different layers." "Okay. So whenever you're ready." "Absolutely. So Victoria, you just, um, said that did you say that you no longer wanted to be naive for one more day? Was that right where we left off?" "Yeah. I think he asked, um, like on a scale of 1 to 10 how naive do I feel, and I said zero." "Okay. So you're at zero now. How I'm getting stuck here. Hold on. It's right." "No worries. What you can do because the bit that I think would be most useful for you to practice, although you could disagree, is the bit about having to challenge Victoria about being naive. That's probably the hardest part of the call if we say that there's a hard bit. So I would, if you want to go back to the bit where I said something like, 'How how long have you been accepting extra work knowing that you're not getting rewarded for it?' And then from there we have to challenge her on, 'Why did you do that?' 'Oh, you know, I hoped and prayed.' Okay. Well, what? For what? For seven years, right?" "Yeah." "So all of that little challenging pop. So Victoria, how long have you been doing extra work without getting rewarded at all?" "I would probably say like six years. Five six years. Taking on extra work five six years." "MH. Wow. Why did you let five to six years go by with you feeling that way?" "I feel now that I think about it five six years like that is a long time. I feel that in the beginning I genuinely wanted to do it because I really loved the company. I loved the culture. Obviously, like there's faults in every company, um, and in the beginning I just genuinely felt that it was something that I could do and it was honestly something that I wanted to do. But over the over time it's just with everything else with like the salary and like the more work but like not being able to grow personally, it just has worn on me." "I can imagine. Now how has that… No, because she's avoiding the question. She she's not saying, 'I'm an idiot.' She's saying, 'Oh, it was wearing on me.' So you need you need to hold the line with challenging. So, 'Oh well, you know…' And the key word I was hoping you picked up on, it she said, 'In the beginning.' In the beginning I thought blank. So I would have done this. Okay. When was 'in the beginning' in terms of timeline?" "Five years ago." "So you started seven years ago, and then for the first two years, 'in the beginning,' you thought, 'If I keep taking on this extra work, I might get rewarded.' Is that what you're saying?" "Yeah." "So why did you continue for another five years? You you see what I'm doing, Valentina? Like you ain't going to wriggle out of it. Can't… The key word was, 'Oh well, in the beginning,' she she handed you on a silver platter the the the the way that she was trying to mislead you. It's like when the the magician says, 'Oh, watch this hand,' while they do something with this hand. 'Oh well, in the beginning it was this, and then I got, you know, then it wore on me.' It's like, 'No, no, no, no, no. You said, 'In the beginning.' So when was 'in the beginning'? Oh, that was the first two years. It's been another five. Why?' 'Well, because I've been an idiot. I've been naive.' Ownership. Real accountability. Self. That's what we need to get to on the sales call. And that's where I struggle." "Yeah." "Oh yeah. Well, I was just going to say that's where I struggle because I found myself even like the whole point of this was to challenge and then I found myself going back into okay and then deeper empathy and deeper pain and deeper empathy and deeper pain versus being like, 'Hold on.' I started this roleplay again to challenge Victoria, but it was it's it's um wow, it's it's the it's the oxymoron of empathy. The most empathetic thing you can do to a person is show them how bad the mistakes are that they've been making because when you show them how bad the mistakes are that they have been making, you're also empowering them to be able to make better choices. When you don't show them how bad their current choices are and just say, 'Oh, that sucks,' you know, yeah, it must have really worn on you, we're actually disempowering them cuz we're making it seem like everything's external causes as opposed to internal. 'Hey, you made a bunch of [ __ ] choices that cost you a lot.' 'Yes, I did.' 'Okay. What are you going to do now?' That's the most empathetic thing thing you can do, even though on face value it feels harsh. It's harsh now to save them in the future. Whereas if we just, you know, pat them on the back and say, 'There, I'm so sorry that you had to that you I'm so sorry that you got given all of this work and you didn't get rewarded for it.' 'Oh yeah, VI uh Valentino, I feel so bad about that. It's so bad.' Now we just have someone moaning on the sales call. And if someone's moaning, they don't think it's their fault, which means they're not going to give you $10,000 to fix a problem that they don't think is their fault. So you got to you got to do two things on a sales call. You have a massive problem, and it's your fault; therefore, give me your $10,000 to fix the problem that is your own fault. You have to get both of those things on a sales call. All of the pain and the problem and the severity of their situation, but also they have to admit that they chose to be there, otherwise they don't have a choice to choose to no longer be there. Does that make sense?" "Yeah." "All right. So do it. Do it again because I I want you to be able to feel how that feels to do that."

"Wa so, um, I'm trying to remember the initial question." "Yeah. Go from, um, so how long have you been taking on work knowing that you're not getting rewarded for it?" "So Victoria, how long have you been taking on this amount of work knowing that you're not getting rewarded for it?" "I would probably say five five to six years." "Five to six years. Why?" "In the beginning I felt like I I wanted to do it. In the beginning, like I was happy with the you know I was happy to have this role, and I was excited to be into this company, and that's where I was at. And then over time, taking on more work and also feeling like I wasn't growing as a sales professional, as a leader, as a manager, and then on top of that my salary wasn't increasing, I just felt really worn out." "Got it. So when you say 'in the beginning,' when exactly was that? That's that's perfect. You can ask that a slightly more advanced version because of the fact that it's script of selling. I would have taken her words, and my question is formulated from her words. So her exact words were, 'I wanted to do it in the beginning.' So my question would have been, 'When did you no longer want to do it?' And then she has to say, '[ __ ] When did I no longer want…' Well, probably after two years. So why, for another five years, did you continue to do something you no longer wanted to do? It's the same as what you're saying, Valentina, but it's just much more accurate because I'm getting my question from Victoria's words as opposed to, 'Okay, Victoria said this. I know what Josh said the last time she did it, so I'm just going to steal that question and pop it in there.' It works, but it works coincidentally cuz I just told you what to say. That's not going to teach you anything. What I need to teach you is how to listen to what the prospect says and go, 'Hang on, she said she wanted to do it in the beginning, so I'm curious. I'm wondering, when did you no longer want to do it?' 'Oh wow. For another five years you no longer wanted to do it, but you carried on doing it. Why?' 'I I my my job is to teach you scriptless selling. Right on these role plays, I'm demonstrating so you could just copy what I did, but then you're not going to learn anything. What I need to teach you is how to listen to what the prospect says, be curious, and think about what they're saying and then go, 'Well, that doesn't make sense,' or 'What's missing in what she said? I'm going to ask about that.'" "Okay. Make sense." "Yeah. Yeah. Go for it." "So okay, as the prospect, when you ask me that question, that question that I give you before, you're going to chunk down. It feels like such a rationalization from the jump. Like, 'In the beginning I wanted to…' It's like rationalize rationalize, but then like you're going to like it feels like you're cornering me, and then that is when I take ownership. Like I can feel that part. Do you know does that make sense?" "Yeah." "And it it sounds bad, but like you have to corner the prospect. You have to be like, 'Listen, man,' or 'Listen, woman,' if you're cornering a woman, you know, you're making these choices like you you have to get them into the corner of the room and be like, 'Do you realize what you're doing?' And then they're like, '[ __ ] Like I I can't go backwards. I can't go anywhere. Like I have to face reality.'" "Yeah. You you do have to corner the prospects into reality of their ownership." "So let's go back because Victoria may phrase her response slightly different because I want you to take her response to create the question. So we're going to start with the question of, 'How long have you been doing work knowing that you're not going to get rewarded?' And then however Victoria responds to it, that's how you're going to devise the next question. So, 'How long have you been doing all this work without getting rewarded?'" "I would say going on six years." "Okay. Now why did you let six years go by? Why did you do all of this work for six years because that's kind of a long time knowing that you weren't going to get rewarded?" "Don't downplay it and say 'kind of.' It's not 'kind of.' It's a…" "Okay. So sorry, you're saying that CU you're feeling uncomfortable to to challenge the prospect, which is what I'm training you on. Like I want you to get both of you girls to get to a place where you can just be directly blunt with the prospect. And so anytime that I'm seeing you now playing the closer, rationalizing your question, you're doing the same thing that Victoria is doing as the prospect. You're like, 'I don't really want to tell her it's that bad.' That's what Victoria is saying. 'Oh well, in the beginning…' You you're doing the same thing now as the closer in your language. Okay. So do it again." "Okay. Wow. Six years is a long time. Why have you let yourself go six years without being knowing that you're not going to be rewarded?" "I don't know. Like thinking about it like that, I honestly can't believe I did that for six years." "Did you know that you were doing that for all six years?" "No." "She knows she did because she already said that she's she's she's trying to not answer the question. 'Well, I don't know.' Well, why did you like you you kind of just have to ask the question again." "Yeah. There's got to be a reason." "Well, it's it's it's not… we're looking for a logical reason. It's you still have to face the reality that you chose that whereas saying, 'I don't know,' is the prospect kind of attempting to say, 'I didn't choose it. I didn't know.' So well, you still made a conscious choice to keep accepting work. Saying, 'I don't know,' is is not a good enough response, so we can't let them off the hook with that. Okay, Victoria, you're saying you don't know, but if I could just give you some honest truth here, you did choose to stay in this position for six years. Do you have any idea why exactly that is?" "One more thing. It's not that she stayed in the position that's the problem. What is the problem? She let herself do all of the work without being rewarded. Correct. She chose, and it's not… even your language is kind of letting off the hook. 'Oh, she let herself…' No, no. You continued to choose to take on more work given to you by your director, knowing that it was going to be the same thing as the last year and the last two years and the last three years and the last four five six years where you keep saying, 'Yes, I'll do it. Yes, I'll do it. Yes, I'll do it,' knowing you're not going to get rewarded. Is that accurate?" "Well, Josh, yes, I guess that is accurate." "So why did you continue doing that? Like take the take the harshest most honest truth and put it back on Victoria cuz that in in the long term it will help her. In the short term it will make her feel like [ __ ], but that will help her in the long term. So Victoria, you chose to continue to do all of this work and not be rewarded for it for six years. Why?" "Excellent. Well done." "I don't know why. I know that I I chose to do it. I just was hoping hoping and hoping that finally like all of this that I took on that I would get rewarded. And to do that for six years, I mean, it sounds silly like because it never happened over that six years." "So you thought that you would get rewarded. You didn't." "Yeah." "Are you still holding on to any hope that there's going to going to be a reward at the end of this work that you're putting in?" "No." "Great question, Valentina. World got it. Go one layer deep. One more layer. What would be the next question after that? She had a belief for seven years. She changed her belief. Do you have any curiosity around that? So why now? Why just…" "Well, I would just say, okay, hang on. You'd say, 'Okay, so you had a belief for seven years, which was hope hope hope hope hope that if you put in this work and you go above and beyond that you will get recognized. Now I asked you where is that hope now, and you said it's gone. Why is it gone?' Yeah, I would have just said something like that. So there was one extra question. So and this is the thing, and this is what everyone does when they come on these role plays or on the weekly live training. You think it's this amount of layers, and then we do this amount of layers, and even when you have been trained by me and you're like, 'Oh, I've done what said,' it's like there's still another layer." "Yeah." "So right now there was one extra layer, which is, 'Okay, why?' Cuz it's that final why where she now has to reflect on herself and say, 'Okay, I've been naive for six or seven years. I've now realized I was being naive. I've now decided to change my belief,' and she's now asking herself, 'Why did she change that belief?' And it's that final why that she's she's telling herself why she's no longer willing to live with with this stupid belief." "Yeah. You're you're you're making her sell herself on changing her belief." "Yeah. Right. Do do it again from that that last bit." "Are you still holding on to any hope that there is a reward at the end of this?" "No." "Why?" "Because there isn't. There is never going to be a time where I'm going to magically be rewarded after all this time and all this work. And it ultimately it's not what I deserve. Like I deserve to be rewarded in the beginning, and that's ultimately why I want to make a change. Like I want to find a place where I can grow professionally and I can also be rewarded for the things that I do from the beginning." "So now you've acknowledged that you can no longer stay in a position where you are not rewarded." "Nope. Nope. That's not exactly what she's changed. Look at the difference. You said, 'So you've come to the realization that you can't stay in a position where you're not going to get rewarded.' That is the symptom of the real problem. On a sales call, we have to solve the real problem. Look at this. This is the difference. So you had a belief that was you were magically going to get rewarded for just doing more work. Is that correct?" "Yeah." "Okay. So if it's not magic that's going to reward you, what is?" "A new job." "Okay. Why is that going to get you what you want as opposed to just hoping and praying that Disney's real?" "Because I've been looking, and I know that…" "Pause. Sorry, Victor. Victoria, I didn't need the answer. I just wanted to show that…" "Sorry. Sorry to cut you off, but you see that the real thing that we're solving is her belief in magic. Her her her what we're actually selling this lady is a new way of thinking that's opposite to being naive. What you're actually selling Victoria, if this was a real prospect, is a a massively transformative way of seeing life. Her way of seeing life was, 'I'm a good person. I do good things. I do more than I'm asked. I go above and beyond. Surely I'm going to get rewarded for that.' She's come to her own conclusion through her own vities, which is the the challenges and pain and problem she's gone through in life that that hasn't worked. She's then booked in a call because of that. We're now helping her transform like the the caterpillar turning into the butterfly into this new reality. And the new reality, ironically, is not a new job. It's a new way of behaving. Instead of behaving based on magic and behaving based on naively thinking, 'If I'm a good person and I do good things, I'll get good rewards.' No, no, no. What she now realizes

It's up to you. I'm going to summarize everything to the camera. All right, so there you have it: another scriptless discovery. We went really deep into a number of different things that are truly going to be game-changers for you if you implement them.

Before I go through a summary of all those things, I have to be honest with you and share that whilst I can give you these things you need to do on a discovery and just list them out for you, and you can watch these YouTube role plays if you really want to master them, if you really want to be able to harness them, you need to train on them. Just like Valentina is doing; she's the one in the closer position, getting personal feedback in real time. Victoria is then coming on, and we're going to swap over next week, and she's going to move into the closer position. Having access to a mentor that's going to take you through the trainings you need to equip yourself with is what's going to change the game for you. Just getting the education and the information is not actually going to put more money in your bank account, because it's about the implementation, where things actually change and the rubber meets the road. So if you actually want to get mentored by me and my underground mentor, there'll be a link somewhere below the video. Click that link, go to the video, watch the video on the webpage, and if that aligns with what you want to accomplish as a high-ticket closer and as a human—because this is not just getting better at sales, mastering communication, learning to understand people; it's about mastering yourself in the process—you saw with Valentina, we weren't only training on skills; we're also training on how she needs to show up in a way that's not afraid to challenge someone, even going through a little bit of friction on a sales call. That comes from doing the internal mastery first; the step to be able to challenge someone else is being able to challenge yourself. If you can't push yourself out of your own comfort zone, you are never going to be able to push someone else out of their comfort zone. So click the link below, take action, be the prospect that you want to find on your sales calls.

All right, summary: a number of different things. First thing is: every time a prospect says something, you do want to summarize it back to them. That allows you to check in and to make sure that everything you said was accurate, but more importantly, it allows the prospect to see, again and again, the harsh reality of their current situation and feel into their body the disappointment, the dismay, the frustration of where they're really at—twice: once when they answer the question and a second time when you summarize it back to them. Second point: do not change the prospect's language in a way that downplays the severity of their situation. There was a moment where Valentina said, "Okay, so you feel like you're not growing?" No, no, no. "You are not growing," reality: you are not growing, rather than "it feels like you're not growing." If we take the feeling, we're slightly disassociating the prospect from the reality, and we're talking about it ephemerally, like it's just an emotion. No, no, no. Their current situation is what it is, and it sucks, and it's not where they want to be. Next one: do not jump data. You go through the discovery on a sales call to get the prospect to move through different emotions. As their emotions change from abstaining from responsibility, not really thinking it's that bad, kind of just being nonchalant or flippant about their situation, and you move them through the data, they start to feel different. Even Victoria, pretending to be a prospect, could feel the things that I was asking her as questions and the things that Valentina was asking as questions and started to feel, "Holy [ __ ] this doesn't feel good; I need to do something about it." If you just jump from one question to a question that should be much later in the sales call, you might gather the data that you needed, but you missed, as they would say in Monopoly, passing go and collecting $200 as you go around; you have to collect the emotions through each question that you're asking. Make sense? Good. All right, the next one: do not move to the future or hypothetical things in place of talking about the right now. Don't say, "Oh, well, what would it be like if you get to this?" or "What would it feel like?" That may be useful sometimes at the later part of a call, but on the front part of a call, we need to talk about what is going on right now. Those first 10 to 15 minutes of a discovery is where the sale is made or lost; it's not when you're trying to close the call at the end of the discovery or after your pitch. Next one is: always add the prospect's words to the front of your questions. Now that can be done from what I was saying before, which is the summary: "Okay, so you said blank, blank, blank," then you ask the question, or you can integrate the words into the question. What that does is it makes the prospect realize you're listening, you're understanding, and the question is now delivered in a way that's more relevant. Increasing your ability to close and making more money is not about being more significant, saying smart things, or being a clever person; it's about being more relevant to the prospect. Next one: genuinely being curious. And genuine curiosity comes from being detached. You cannot be truly curious if you're trying to force a sale or close a sale or make a sale. You can only be genuinely curious if you're just trying to figure out what's going on. So curiosity: the most, bar none, important way to show up to a sales call. All right, we got three more. Number seven: selling themselves versus you trying to sell the prospect. If you master a scriptless discovery and you master the internal mastery, you will find that the questions you deliver, they land on the prospect in a way where they're now convincing you why they need to do this. That is about selling themselves, and it's the most powerful way to sell. It's not objection handling that you need to master; it's the discovery part where you get prospects to sell themselves. Number eight: challenging the prospect. This is massive. 99.9% of closers that are not where they want to be financially have a gap, have a leak in their ability to challenge the prospect on the discovery. Until you fix that leak—I call them money leaks—you are going to continue flushing commissions down the toilet every single month, month. How do you learn to challenge someone? Well, in my opinion, the best way to learn to challenge someone is to get into a group where the energy and the dynamic of the group is a much higher level of standards, what we call a standard of excellence. When you're at much higher standards, you are having to judge yourself whether you're, quite frankly, being a [ __ ] or actually being courageous and actually being certain and actually taking the actions that you need to be taking. If you join a group where that is just the standard—that we do what we say, and we say what we do, and we mean what we say, and everything in between—that is just going to become your new reality. You can't be trying to challenge prospects if you're not willing to raise your own standards. As you do that, bit by bit, and as you work with me or work with my mentor, you start to become, from the inside out, the type of person that is comfortable with challenging your prospects. And the final one here is: you have to sell the real thing. Master closing is not selling the product or not selling the service or not even selling the transformation of the product or the service; it's selling the person on changing the way they've been acting and behaving and thinking that has caused them to be in their current reality and stuck in that situation. So in this case, we weren't selling getting into a new job or into a new position; we were selling no longer being the type of person that is naive and thinks that hard work guarantees you get recognized and get rewarded, but actually stepping into reality to realize the only thing that's guaranteed is if I take action, I take responsibility, I take ownership over my own future, my own growth, my own progression, and investing myself into, in this case, executive coaching. So that's everything that we covered on this high-ticket sales roleplay. As I said before, if you really want to master this, if you want to become the top 0.00001% of closers, click the link now, now, somewhere below this video and join the Unicorn Closers Mastermind, and we'll get you to the top. I'll see you in the next video.