Transcription
Kirk Cameron catches major backlash for his recent video. And you won't believe why.
Last time Kirk Cameron caught backlash, it was because he came out with the view of annihilationism. Basically, the idea that hell may not be eternal. This led many people such as Wes Huff, myself, and others uh to the conversation of is hell being eternal conscious torment an essential doctrine that you need to believe to be saved or is there a bit of wiggle room throughout church history and uh scripture not being so cut and dry on the topic? That led to a bunch of people being upset and feeling like he was denying some of the foundations of Christianity.
Well, this week he's getting dragged for something even less controversial. Okay. And you guys won't believe this. And to me, this I think could be a lack of biblical literacy all over again. Well, Kurt Cameron released this video says, "Christian men are drinking whiskey and smoking cigars at Bible study." Now, okay, so that's what the video is called. And the shocking part about this is that he isn't even coming out as someone who supports this. He's simply stating that this is happening.
Can a Christian smoke a cigar to the glory of God? Can a man sip a well-aged scotch and read the Bible and sing psalms and love his wife and raise faithful children and still have a clean conscience before the Lord? Or is that kind of stuff uh ruining our testimony to a watching world? Because I'll be honest with you, when I moved from California to Tennessee, I discovered a fascinating phenomenon. Christian men here don't just gather for Bible studies. Sometimes they gather for Bible studies with whiskey. He's simply stating the question in the intro. Okay, simply stating the question. Later on in the video, we're going to look at him actually coming out and stating his position on this. But first, let's just look at how left the comments has gone. Okay, now somebody's a fairly reasonable, and I'll show you guys where I'm at at this at the end of the towards the end of the video.
"Not smoking or drinking has cost me nothing. When my grandson was a new Christian looking for church home, he went to good reformed uh Baptist church in his hometown. He was fine until some of the young men approached him and invited him to be and Bible study. He never went back to that church. They are called spirits for a reason. In 23 years of pastoral counseling, I've never had a couple say, 'We were having trouble in our relationship and lives and then we brought in alcohol and everything improved.' I believe like the Bible says that we should be separate from the world. We should not do what the word for does. What we should not do the word for does think they meant we should not do what the world does. They will think it's okay to do those things because they will not understand what you are saying. They will not have to change when we be when we born again."
Okay, I don't know if this is a bot or not. This is terrible. As a sober alcoholic, this topic is very black and white for me. Keyword for me. Okay. Now, if you guys are interested in this topic, you go watch this full video, but at the 12-minute mark, he basically comes out, puts all his cards on the table. Take a listen.
"Personally, I don't like cigars. Uh, I don't smoke them. They make me sick."
>> "But I kind of"
So, that's his position. Okay. So, people are commenting without actually looking at his position. Okay. He says, "Personally, I don't like cigars. They make me sick, but I kind of like the smell of them when other people are smoking around me."
>> "Like the smell of them when others are smoking them at a distance."
"I don't like the smell of a pipe even better. Even though I don't smoke those either. I'll be honest, just the other night I ran out and found a bottle of Brooklotti single malt scotch recommended to me by a friend just to have on hand in case he or some whiskey loving friends and family who might come sit around the campfire would like some. I've even got a few cigars on a shelf, too."
Okay, so Kirk is saying, "I don't smoke. I don't mind it when it's in my general vicinity. It just sounds like you kind of keep something on hand uh for hospitality purposes. Not because I think cigars are essential for Christian fellowship. They're not. You can have a deep conversation about the Lord over coffee or water or ribs and brisket. But I do appreciate what often happens when men slow down for an hour >> and smoke a cigar."
So, one of the things that I discovered in my conversation with Matt Frat was when two guys sit down to smoke a cigar. That cigar is more or less a commitment to the length of the conversation. You light a cigar, you are committed to staying in that conversation. You don't get to get up, weasle your way out of it. You're there present for the conversation. Now, obviously Kurt's saying, "Hey, you could do that through brisket and barbecue and uh coffee and all sorts of things, but there is something unique about the being all-in when you're sitting down to have a conversation with someone over a cigar. They listen. They're not distracted. They laugh. They open up. And they talk about marriage, children, work, their fears, even their failures, their hopes for the future, their temptations, and talk about the Lord. And if a cigar or a glass of whiskey becomes an excuse for a meaningful conversation with my son or my son-in-law or friends or neighbors, I'm not going to panic. I'm gonna pay attention and I'm gonna thank God. Now, let me be clear. If your wife won't kiss you for a week after you smoke a cigar, that might be wisdom speaking to you, too."
>> "Hello."
>> "And if your children are watching, think carefully. If they see you enjoying liberty in Christ with good friends, exercising self-control, gratitude, a merry heart, enjoying in moderation, that can teach them something good."
>> "Yeah, it's good. After all, you don't want their friends to teach them how to drink, do you?"
>> "But if they see you making excuses, hiding habits, >> becoming dependent and addicted, or laughing off poor behavior, making you angry, and speaking disrespectfully to your spouse, that teaches them something, too."
So, Kirk's getting a lot of backlash over this, and I got some backlash of my own for you. We've been hearing that YouTube has been unsubscribing some of you guys from this channel without you even knowing. And we checked the backend analytics and found out that 64% of you who watch this channel regularly, unfortunately, are not subscribed. And even less of you guys have your bell notifications on. About 10% of you guys. So, do me a favor. Make sure you're subscribed. Make sure you have your bell notification on. Let's jump back in.
Now, pay attention to some of these comments over on X. Adam Samson, which is a verified account, says, "This is dumb as is. Why not two?" Someone said, uh, "At our landmark Baptist church, no alcohol drinking is part of our church covenant. You can't be a member of the church if you drink. Sobriety is a hallmark of Christianity. Nobody wants to hear about salvation from a Christian with uh, alcohol on their breath."
Someone even went as far as to make an AI slop graphic of what they think Kirk Cameron's describing here. "When a men's Bible study turns into a reformed speak easy, what a fellowship would a joy divine past the scotch and light mind." And it's a bunch of guys laughing uh drinking with I guess all sorts of drink menus and signs. They just This is real bad AI slop. They really overdid it. "Iron sharpens iron. So does cigar ash."
Kirk Cameron 316. So, here's the guy who posted that AI slot meme and he jumps into kind of explaining it. He says, "People may wonder why I posted this meme." So, here's the reason Kirk Cameron released a discussion about Christian gathering around cigars, scotch, uh, leather chairs, and theology describing groups with names such as puffs and pores, psalms, and be did he really say these things? Puffs and pores is a pretty cringe name. I'll admit that. But, you know what would be even better than that? Puffs and prayer journals. No, I'm joking. But you really should get our Bless God prayer journal. And we only have about a hundred of these left in stock. And this is one of the things that's been huge on our website, laying out a foundation for you to have some structure and order to your prayers. Every day you start out with things you're grateful for. So praise reports, then you go into prayers for other people so you don't walk around here with main character syndrome just praying for yourself. Then you go into prayer requests for yourself. Memory verse. I will get this done. On this section, we have a time in the word. So, like, what did you read today in the word that helped you reflect? And then just additional notes. So, we have a few of these left over at bless.co. I think we've sold over 15,000 of them. The reviews are absolutely insane. You can go read them. Bless prayer journal. We have some tan ones. The black ones, unfortunately, are sold out. We're trying to get them restocked. But I promise you, if you aren't documenting your prayers, it's one of the coolest things you could do because often we need to be reminded way more than we need to be taught. Meaning God is actually moving, answering your prayers, but you're forgetting because you're just throwing up these prayers without remembering what you're praying for. When you document them, document the people that you're praying for, document the situations that you're praying for. Often you'll remember them when you write them down. Great way to document them. So go to blessgod.co. Get your prayer journal now. They're only $24.99. It's a great way to support what we're doing here as well.
He argued that these things may fall under Christian liberty when practiced with moderation and clear conscience. To me, however, the whole picture looks just as ridiculous as it s as it sounds. Men blowing smoke into the room, sipping whiskey and singing, "What a fellowship. What a joy divine." As though intoxicating drink and tobacco somehow deepen Christian brotherhood. I'm not interested in spending the entire day talking about Kirk Cameron. He was already on strikeout and that's after the hell conversation. And then of course there's a KJV reference which you know I think kind of explains this dude's probably some of his theology. This is why we made the meme. Sometimes satire allows people to see instantly how foolish an idea becomes. Apparently growing pains didn't produce adulthood. This manchild behavior is so pathetic. This is insane. Might as well go out and spend your next four paychecks on pagan tattoos. It's a foolish choice in my opinion to partake. I wouldn't want to poison my body or friend's body.
Okay. How many of you guys are eating fried food, processed food, how many of you guys are are drinking all your calories from juice and other stuff? Like the devil's standards here are wild. If someone's going to go out and have a drink once a month versus someone that's eating processed junk, the typical American diet, which by the way, 70% of Americans are overweight. 40% are morbidly obese. Which do you think is going to bring more harm to your body? The hey, we're going to have a cigar once or twice a month when we're getting together with the guys. We're going to have a drink once or twice a month when we're getting together guys. Or someone that's consistently eat the average person, the average person, the average American eating the average American diet. What do you think is actually going to bring more harm to your body?
Alcohol and cigars act as highly addictive poisons that ruthlessly destroy your vascular systems permanently. Yes, when when abused, absolutely. Okay. So does sugar. So does processed food. So in my opinion, the fact that Kirk Cameron simply just asking the question creates so much visceral backlash is very telling of where we are on the internet and where Christians have always been.
Now, here are some basic facts about scripture. Jesus's first miracle was at a wedding turning water into wine. And unless you're just a absolute ahistorical weirdo, that was actually wine. Scholarly consensus, basic reading of the text, that was wine. Now, some will say, "Well, Rouson, the wine was different. It was fermented different. It was more watered down." Okay. Well, in Deuteronomy 14:26, it says when they're uh going to travel outside of the area of where they typically offer sacrifices that they could exchange their sacrifices for silver, use silver to buy whatever you like, cattle, sheep, wine, or other fermented drink or anything you wish. Then you and your household shall eat there in the presence of the Lord your God and rejoice. So the NIV says other fermented drink. The NLT says other alcoholic drink. The ESV says other strong drink. So this is why it's important for us not just to be biblically literate but to also have access to the original uh Hebrew and Greek. So if we select other strong drink, we could hit study. So in Logos, one of the new features I've been enjoying is the ability to view the interlinear translation. So this is the Hebrew underneath and this is how the word is pronounced. Now I'll tell you guys where I land on this in a second, but let's just again go back to it. the text says. So this is Deuteronomy and here we see that the word in the original language is fermented. Right? So you got wine, you got fermented. Now if we select this word fermented, we can then hit study. Takes us to the original Hebrew >> shakar. Right? This is the dop part about the insulinar translation is the word shakar is right here. We could go into the Bible study shakar. And what does it say? Long and behold it says intoxicating drink. So what is going on here in the passage? The place of worship where they were to offer up their sacrifices was too far from where they were at. And so what they could do is they could take their offering, they could exchange it for something, and then they can convert it to get whatever it is that they wanted to offer up, including hard drink. And lo and behold, according to the Hebrew in the Greek, these were alcoholic drinks. They were intoxicating drink, intoxicating beer.
Now, if you guys want to do a deep dive on this exact topic, I recommend this video from Mike Winger. Uh, the Bible changed my mind on alcohol. The full title of the video is what the Bible really says about alcohol. Funny enough, that's actually one of the first Mike Winger videos I watched in around 2018, 2019. In the same way Kirk Cameron says he keeps some alcohol at the house. I think we may have a bottle of wine that someone gifted us that we have in one of our little pantries, but we don't drink alcohol. However, because we will look at what the scriptures say regarding this topic as we see in scriptures that it's it's a bit more nuanced. Uh often people will assume that we're just for this flippant let everybody get drunk even though we don't drink. I don't drink. Kirk Cameron doesn't seem to drink. Mike Winger doesn't drink. But we got to stick to what the scriptures actually say.
So here is I think the practical application of this. Uh, and then I'll talk about the psychological implications of this here in a second. So, this is Romans chapter 14. This is an important chapter and I think chapters like this are there for a reason. Paul is writing a mixed church in Rome, meaning that there's Jewish Christians that are still holding to certain Jewish customs. There's also uh gentile Christians all living amongst each other and Paul's having to write and explain some of these things to them. So, in Romans 14:1, he says, "Except the one whose faith is weak without quarreling over disputable matters." So first and foremost, we have to acknowledge that there are disputable matters that yes, there's many things in the scriptures that are black and white. Being drunk is a black and white issue. Adultery, sexual morality, those are black and white issues. But there are disputable matters. There are wisdom issues like can one smoke a cigar once a month? Can one have a glass of wine with their wife and not be drunk? Those are wisdom issues. Okay.
Paul goes on to write in verse two. He says, "One person's faith allows them to eat anything. But another whose faith is weak eats only vegetables. The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not. And the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted him." Now, it's important that Jesus tells us that we are to judge correctly, not by superficial means. Paul is saying, "Hey, whether or not you feel comfortable eating everything or you're restricted in some of the things you eat, uh, this was connected to some of the meat that was eaten could have been offered to false gods." And so, some people felt uncomfortable eating that or they came out of perhaps some pagan practices, felt uncomfortable engaging in them. Paul is saying, "Hey, whatever you're eating, like you need to not judge the other person based on whether or not they're willing to eat stuff." Now I think in today's context uh meat sacrificed to idols in my opinion is way more intense than uh having a glass of wine or a cigar right I probably wouldn't feel comfortable meat sacrificed to idols yet in this context he's saying listen some of you guys could eat any type of meat some of you guys you know you feel convicted about that and you eat vegetables don't judge each other over this right who are you to judge someone else's servant and that's where Kirk Cameron was going with all this to their own master servants stand or fall and they will stand for the Lord is able to make them stand.
One person considers one day more sacred than another. Another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God. And whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. For none of us live for ourselves alone, and none of us dies for ourselves alone. If we live, we live for the Lord. And if we die, we die for the Lord. So whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. For this very reason, Christ died and return to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living. So whatever it is that you're doing, you're going to do to the Lord. Now again, I'm not talking about sin. I'm talking about these wisdom issues, right? You then, why do you judge a brother or sister? Or why do you treat them with contempt? For we all stand before God's judgment seat. It is written, "As surely as I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow before me. Every tongue will acknowledge me." So then each of us will give an account of ourselves to God. Each person is going to give an account based on what you chose to consume and not consume based on the words that came out of your mouth. We We're all going to give an account.
Verse 13, therefore, let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in the way of a brother or sister. So Paul's adding this nuance here. Hey, don't judge one another over these disputable matters. However, don't be a jerk and put stumbling blocks in people in front of people that you know may be struggling with someone. If someone's been an alcoholic before they were a Christian or they've struggled with this, don't invite them over and pour a glass of wine in front of them knowing that this was a struggle for them. You got to be socially aware. You got to be uh somewhat empathetic to other people's struggles, right? I know that word's been hijacked a lot, but we got to be compassionate towards where other people may be. So, don't put a stumbling block in front of people.
I am convinced being fully persuaded in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for that person it is unclean. So Paul's saying food's not unclean. These things are not unclean. But if someone deems it as unclean, it's unclean for that person. If your brother or sister is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love. Do not by your eating destroy someone from whom Christ died. Therefore, do not let what you know is good be spoken of as evil. For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace, enjoy, and the Holy Spirit. Because anyone who serves in Christ in this way is pleasing to God and receives human approval. Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification. Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a person to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble. It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother or sister to stumble or fall.
Now here's the thing about this verse. Paul is talking about in-person local church fellowship. He is not talking about knowledge of liberty. Punchline. Paul kept on eating meat after this. He kept on drinking after this. Okay. He encourages Timothy to get some wine because his stomach was hurting. So Paul is not saying knowledge of liberty if you know that someone has a glass of uh if you know someone has a bottle of wine in their house is the same as causing someone to stumble. And this verse is often weaponized by the weaker believer who has an issue has a struggle and they take this and then they weaponize and they say Rouslon I am convicted by tattoos. Therefore me having knowledge of you having a tattoo in your video I am going to uh tell you that you're causing me to stumble and you should always cover your tattoos. No, no, no. That's not what that's saying. If I were, if I knew you had an issue with tattoos and then I go and invite you to get a tattoo with me, that would be causing somebody to stumble. But this is not the same thing. Knowledge of liberty is not the same as causing someone to stumble.
Verse 22. So whatever you believe about these things, keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who does not condemn himself by what he approves. But whoever has doubts is condemned if they eat because their eating is not from faith. And everything that does not come from faith is sin. So Paul lays out this very nuanced take. Mike Ringer does the same thing with his video regarding that alcohol is seemingly permissible in scripture. That that does not mean that he personally drinks. I'm in the same boat. I think alcohol is permissible in scripture. I don't drink. I haven't drank in years. Uh I think the last time I had a drink was when I was in Israel uh and we were having a Shabbat dinner. I had a glass of wine and that was in 2022. So this is not something I do, but we do have wine in in our home. So, uh, the idea that people are taking this, weaponizing it, getting mad at Kirk Cameron for the most reasonable take on this entire conversation is wild. Now, are there Christians that perhaps abuse this? Absolutely. Are there Christians that gather and they drink scotch and cigars under the guise of Bible study every single weekend and get tipsy and drunk? Yes, that probably happens. That is not what Kirk Cameron's video was about. He's saying the idea of it just simply being permissible. I think the core of this is an all or no thinking which people who are religious tend to have. It's everything is binary. Everything's black and white. A lot of things are black and white but not everything is black and white. And here if you uh do a basic search on what is happening when people struggle with all or nothing thinking uh also known as black and white thinking. This is a cognitive distortion where situations people or yourself are viewed in absolute extreme terms. It ignores nuance, meaning anything less than a flawless success is perceived as a total failure. People who operate in this often are in binaries and it's potentially rooted in a degree of cognitive distortion. Cognitive distortions are habitual inaccurate thinking patterns that cause you to perceive reality in a negatively biased way. Translation, there's some issues with critical thinking. There's some issues with processing that. Hey, something could be permissible for one person and not be permissible for me because of my own past struggles. My mother is an alcoholic. Uh I come from the Soviet Union, communism, a lot of alcohol, a lot of abuse of alcohol. That is not something that I can have a liberty on. I cannot do that. That's personal conviction. If someone wants to sit down and drink a glass of wine with their wife, why would I judge them for that? That that's stupid. Okay.
Now, in my personal life, uh I don't drink alcohol, but I will have a cigar once a month. That's my limit. And we actually do have a gathering similar to this around here uh where we get together with a bunch of apologists and a bunch of professors and we get around and we go to a friend's house and we smoke cigars and I have one cigar a month. That's my limit which by the way they say that's the limit on uh if you're perceived as a smoker or not uh according to life insurance, right? So I have life insurance so therefore I'm not I don't want to be perceived as a smoker. And I also know my own tendencies that hey I need to be very intentional with moderation and calculated with how I navigate these things. So that was my parameters. Uh Kirk Cameron says he doesn't even like smoking. But this idea in my opinion is harmful because it reaffirms the black and white all or nothing thinking in an area that should have a degree of nuance. Not to mention all of the great men of God throughout history from Charles Spurgeon to CS Lewis to J.R. Token that would have a cigar and a glass of wine or a glass of scotch and uh it it helped them connect with people, help them write, help them be creative. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. It's not for me. Alcohol is not for me. But I think that there is a permissible time and place for it. We see it in scripture. We see it in church history. And uh I think anyone trying to judge Kirk Cameron for even saying it's permissible is cooked. I think they need some help and uh need to do some deep soulsearching on what it is about their worldview and paradigm has driven them to this place.
If you guys want to see the last time Kirk Cameron was in some hot water and Wes Huff and others coming to defend him, we'll have this pinned over here. And if you want to check out our Bless God shop, we'll have this pinned up over here. All right, I'll see you guys on the next one.