Transcription
Probably in 2025, we at Meta are going to have an AI that can effectively be a sort of mid-level engineer that can write code. The entire landscape of software is changing before our eyes, not only the actual software being built but how it's being built. Just a few weeks ago, SAA Adela said that applications are essentially going to be collapsed into agents.
Now we're hearing straight from Mark Zuckerberg's mouth that in 2025, they are going to have mid-level engineers that are AI writing their code for them. Here's the thing: Meta has a lot of resources, both money and GPUs, so they can throw a lot of mid-level engineers onto their team. I have been talking about this this year quite a bit already. This is going to be the year that AI floods into the workforce.
And here's the thing about him saying a mid-level engineer that is 2025. This year, a mid-level engineer—what about 2026? What about 2030? 2035? At that point, software is going to be almost entirely written by artificial intelligence. This is something that I've discussed on this channel quite a bit. What happens at that point? Does code look like the code that we're familiar with? Does it get pre-written? Does it get generated in the moment when it's actually needed?
I think it's actually probably the latter. I think in the midterm, we're going to have traditional databases because we need that ground truth. Then AI, in the form of agents, is going to write code when they need it in the moment. So you have some request or some task that you need your agent to accomplish. It's going to write the tools necessary to interact with the database. It's going to write the UI layer. It's going to basically do everything.
At that point, applications aren't really the same as they have been for the last 50, 70 years. All right, let's watch the rest of this portion of the interview that he just did with Joe Rogan. Once you have that, then in the beginning, it'll be really expensive to run, and you can get it to be more efficient. Over time, we'll get to the point where a lot of the code in our apps, including the AI that we generate, is actually going to be built by AI engineers instead of people engineers.
But I don't know. I think that that'll augment the people working on it. So my view on this is like the future. People are just going to be so much more creative, and they're going to be freed up to do kind of crazy things.
So here's a couple of things based on his sentiment here. One, more and more of our code is going to be written by AI, and there are a lot of things to think about. Is it even going to be readable by humans at a certain point? Is it going to be in English or whatever language that you write your code in? Is it going to be symbols? Is it going to be something else that we can't even imagine?
Well, I guess we'll have to see, but more and more of the code is going to be written by AI, which means we also need people to review the code. Is that also going to be AI? If AI is writing so much code, humans are going to be the bottleneck as the reviewers. So entire systems are going to have to be built to handle this new paradigm.
I also completely agree that this is going to complement humans, not replace humans. Humans in the future, and even now, are just going to be so much more efficient, so much more productive. I believe rather than all of these people being out of work, a much more likely scenario is we're going to have so much more productivity.
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Next, Joe and Mark are going to go a little bit deeper into what the future economy looks like. What do jobs look like? A lot of people are afraid that they're going to lose their jobs to AI, but as you're about to hear, that's not what Mark Zuckerberg thinks.
Let's listen. Another concern that people have is that it's going to eliminate a lot of jobs. Yeah, you know, what do you think about that? Well, I think it's too early to know exactly how it plays out, but my guess is that it'll probably create more creative jobs than it will eliminate.
I guess if you look at the history of all this stuff, my understanding is like 100 years ago, I don't know if this was 100 or 150 years ago, but at some point, not too far along in the grand scheme of things, the vast majority of people in society were farmers, right? Because they kind of needed to be in order to create enough food for everyone to survive.
Then we turned that into an industrial process, and now it's like 2% of society are farmers, and we get all the food that we need. So what did that free up everyone else to do? Well, some of them went on to do other things that are sort of like creative pursuits or cultural pursuits or other jobs, and then some percent of it just went towards recreation.
I think generally, people just don't work as many hours today as they did back when everyone needed to farm in order to have enough food for everyone to survive. So I think that trend has sort of played out as technology has grown. My guess is that the percent of people who will be doing stuff that's physically required for humanity to survive will get smaller and smaller.
As it has, more people will dedicate themselves to kind of creative and artistic and cultural pursuits. I think that's generally good. I think the number of hours in a week that someone will have to work in order to get by will probably continue to shrink. Yet, I think people who are super engaged in what they do are going to be able to work really hard and accomplish way more than they ever could before because they have this unimaginable leverage from having a lot more technology.
All right, so Zuckerberg obviously has a very optimistic view of the future. I do as well. I really do agree with a lot of what he's saying. Right now, bringing it back to software and software engineers, this is kind of the process we're going through right now. What happens when all of a sudden a software engineer can write 10, 100, a thousand times more software than they could before?
Does that mean that they have less work, or does that mean that they produce much more? I actually think it's the latter, and this shows itself with technology trends as well. Typically, as a technology gets cheaper, faster, more efficient, you might logically think that a company that is buying that technology would need to buy less.
But here's the thing: it's actually the opposite. As technology becomes cheaper, companies and people tend to buy a lot more of it. That's because as the unit economics of a piece of technology decrease, the number of use cases that it can be applied to in a positive ROI way actually increases.
So it's a really cool phenomenon that happens, and I do agree with that. But it's not all going to be rosy, and it's not going to be a very clean transition to this future. There are going to be people getting laid off. There is going to be this really high-friction period in which we're trying to figure out what it looks like.
Here's an example of that: there was an article just from a couple of weeks ago. Salesforce will hire no more software engineers in 2025, says Mark Benioff, the CEO. The reason? Because they're seeing significant productivity boosts from AI. So because of AI, they're not going to hire as many engineers, and of course, that's kind of the counterexample to what Mark Zuckerberg is saying.
Now, before I give you my thoughts, let me read a couple of other segments from this article, and I'll drop this article in the description below. So, 30% productivity boost from AI. In a wide-ranging conversation with the venture capitalist, Mark outlined the reasons why his company decided to implement the hiring freeze.
When asked if Salesforce would have more or fewer employees in five years' time, he said he thinks the company will probably be larger. But he went on to say, "We're not adding any more software engineers next year because we have increased the productivity this year with Agent Force and with other AI technology that we're using for engineering teams by more than 30%."
This is not the first company to come out and say something like this. I forget the name of it, but there was a customer service company that just came out and said, "Well, we actually are able to cut our team because AI is helping us so much to the point where our engineering velocity is incredible."
Now, obviously, he's a genius marketer, and this is all just marketing talk and trying to push his stock and his company, but he really did do a hiring freeze. We will have less support engineers next year because we have an agentic layer again pushing Agent Force. But if it's working, it's working.
We will have more salespeople next year because we really need to explain to people exactly the value that we can achieve with AI. So we will probably add another 1,000 to 2,000 salespeople in the short term, which is hilarious because they're adding human salespeople to sell AI that will take other people's jobs.
It's again very murky. So once again, the entire software industry is changing. I've covered opinions from Elon Musk, Satya Nadella, Mark Zuckerberg, and Mark Benioff. There's no denying it; things are changing, and they're changing rapidly.
So if you're not already using AI to code, I really encourage you to do so. Play around with tools like Cursor, Pythagora, and the multitude of other amazing tools out there, and really get to know them, get to use them. I think what we're going to see in the future is a lot of companies solving a lot more of the long tail of problems with far fewer people.
Sam Altman predicted probably a year and a half ago that we're probably going to see our first billion-dollar company that was just one person—just a single person with the power of AI. I'm very excited about that future because that frees up a lot of other people to go start companies, of course, to do a million other things.
But what I'm particularly interested in is entrepreneurship and founding companies. So I'm really excited for all of the people who are going to be freed up to go start companies and use high-leverage artificial intelligence to build something amazing and to solve real problems.
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