Transcription
I realized that taking a step back and detaching, I got to see infinitely more than even the most experienced guys in my platoon. And I started doing it all the time. And it always allowed me to see what we needed to do.
And then I started doing it like when I was having conversations with people; having a conversation with my platoon chief, and I can see that he's starting to turn a little red in the face, and we're about to argue about something. I said, "Oh, wait a second. I'm taking a step back looking. He's getting mad right now, and he's the platoon chief. You better just deescalate this thing real quick." And I'd say, "Hey, you know what, Chief? That sounds good. Let me go take a re—let me go relook at the plan or whatever." And so I started to do this kind of with my normal life—was to not get wrapped up in my own emotions, not get wrapped up in the gunfight that was happening right in front of my face, not to get wrapped up in the details of what was going on, but instead take a step back, detach, look around, and then you can make a much, much better decision.
In this video, Jocko Willink breaks down one of the most powerful tools you can use in any high-stress situation: detachment. Whether it's in leadership, combat, daily life, or emotional conversations, learning to take a step back and widen your perspective can change everything. You'll hear a powerful story from Jocko's early days in training when one small step quite literally changed his mindset forever. Alongside Andrew Huberman, they unpack how science and experience align when it comes to mastering calm, making better decisions, and not letting your emotions run the show. If you've ever felt overwhelmed, locked into a problem, or unsure how to respond in the heat of the moment, this conversation might be exactly what you need. Let's dive in.
The solution to your problem is not going to be found in the problem. It's not going to be found in there. You have to get out of the problem so that you can look at it, make an assessment, and you can assess how to solve the problem, or whether you need to solve the problem or not. I mean, there's a lot of things in my life right now where I shrug my shoulders and go, "Okay, it's okay. Oh, someone's saying this. Okay, roger that. Like, carry on. No factor. Move on." And then occasionally you go, "Okay, this is something I need to contend with. This is something I need to deal with. This is something I need to shape or adjust or move or or solve," to use your word. And the reason I laugh when I say that is because problems—you have to get in there, but if you take a step back, you can usually say, "Oh, little adjustment here, a little adjustment there, and that thing's going to sort itself out." So detachment is a superpower, man.
Certainly is, and it's certainly one that I need to focus on more. I'm—I'm grateful for um you bringing that up. Is this—is the uh the biologist in me, but you know what is your process for engaging detachment or for disengaging? Is it an active process where you go, "you know, I'm—I'm going to detach from this? I'm going to put myself in a situation that is pulling on me. There's this gravitational force, and I'm going to—I don't know, create some imagery in my mind of walking away from it." Do I physically walk away from it? Do I outsource it to somebody else? What are—what are some tools for detachment?
Yeah, this is one of those situations to where you and I had a discussion about the science and the practical application aligned. So my original experience with detachment was—and this is one of those moments where, you know, I said a lot of times things are just small moments over time, and you make a little adjustment. This is one of those moments I in my life, and I wrote about leadership strategy and tactics where I recognized like in a moment what detachment was and how helpful it was. I'm on an oil rig doing a training mission. My whole platoon is in a skirmish line looking at a large area of the oil rig that we're supposed to be clearing. Again, this is not combat. This is in the '90s. There's nothing going on. We're just doing training. And I'm standing in this skirmish line, and by the way, I'm the youngest and most junior guy in my platoon. And I'm standing there looking down the sight of my weapon, and I'm waiting for someone to make a call and tell us what to do. And I wait for 5 seconds. And I wait for 10 seconds. And I wait for 20 seconds, and no one's saying anything. And we're waiting for a leader in my platoon to to make a call, to tell us what to do, tell me what to do. And finally, after like 30 seconds, which seems like an eternity, I can't take it anymore. And so I take a step—like a—like a a foot—a one-foot step—12 inches. I take a step off the skirmish line. I look to my left. I look to my right. And what I see is every other guy in my platoon is staring down their weapon. Staring down the sight of their weapon, which means their field of view is tiny. It's like a 20-degree field of view. You're looking down the—the—the scope of your weapon or the sight of your weapon, and that's how big their field of view is. And I'm looking and I'm thinking, "Oh, there's my platoon commander. He's looking down the scope—the sight of his weapon. There's my platoon chief. He's looking down the side of his weapon. There's my leading petty officer. He's looking down the side of his weapon. There's my assistant platoon commander. He's looking down the—" So, everyone in the platoon is looking down the side of their weapon, which means they all have a very narrow field of vision. Well, when I take a step back and look to my left and look to my right, guess what kind of field of vision I got? I got a massive one. I can see the whole scene, and I can see exactly what it is we need to do. And at that moment, look, as a new guy, you need to keep your mouth shut. You don't say anything. And I'm thinking, well, but no one else is saying anything. So, I muster up all the courage I can. And I open my mouth and I say, "Hold left, clear right," which is a basic tactical call. No, no, no. This is not a patent-level genius maneuver. It's just a normal call to make in a situation that we were in. I say, "Hold left, clear right." And I'm expecting to get kind of slapped, told, "Shut up, new guy." But instead, everyone just repeats the call. Hold left, clear right. Hold left, clear right. And they—we execute the maneuver, and we finish the clearance of this oil rig. And we get done. We get to the—the top of the oil rig, which means we cleared the whole thing. We're on the Hilo deck at the top. And we go into a debrief. And now I'm expecting, okay, now I'm going to get told, "Hey, what were you doing? You need to keep your mouth shut." And instead, the platoon chief goes, "Hey, Jocko, good call on the seller deck down there." And I was kind of like, "Yeah, that's right." But then I thought to myself, "Hold on a second. Why, if I'm the youngest, most junior guy in this platoon, why was I able to see what we needed to do and make that call? Why did that—why did that just happen?" And then I realized it was because I took—took a step back, to use your term. I broadened my field of view, which allowed me to think more clearly, 'cause instead of being hyperfocused and narrowly focused, I broadened my range of vision. I took a breath before I made my call, right? I had to take my—take a—a nice breath to—to speak clearly. And I realized that taking a step back and detaching, I got to see infinitely more than even the most experienced guys in my platoon. And I started doing it all the time. And I started doing it in land warfare. I started doing it in urban combat. I started doing it in all these tactical training scenarios. These are just training. This is the '90s. I started doing these training scenarios. And it always allowed me to see what we needed to do. And then I started doing it like when I was having conversations with people. I'm having a conversation with my platoon chief, and I can see that he's starting to turn a little red in the face, and I, you know, we're—we're about to argue about something. I say, "Oh, wait a second. I'm taking a step back looking." He's getting mad right now. And he's the platoon chief. You better just deescalate this thing real quick. And I'd say, "Hey, you know what, Chief? That sounds good. Let me go take a re—let me go relook at the plan or whatever." And so I started to do this kind of with my normal life—was to not get wrapped up in my own emotions, not get wrapped up in the—the—the gunfight that was happening right in front of my face, not to get wrapped up in the details of what was going on, but instead take a step back, detach, look around, and then you can make a much, much better decision. And it's not—it—it's exponential; you—if you're looking down the sights of your weapon and you take a step back and you look around, it's exponential how much more you can see. Now, listen, if you are the only person in a gunfight, it's going to be harder for you to do that because you got to be focused on whatever you're shooting at. But when you have 16 guys or 20 guys, they're all looking in the same direction, it's very easy to be the guy that goes, "Oh, take a step back, look around, make a call." So when you talk about the mechanics—when I teach this to people now—the mechanics of it—take a step back—literally—you're—you know—you and I are at a meeting—there's a bunch of people—this starts to get heated—argument—I will literally push my chair back away from the table—change my perspective—perspective—open—widen my field of view—the other—the other thing—like on the—in—in the SEAL teams—you don't want to—you don't want to sound panicked on the—for a couple reasons. Number one, because when you panic on the radio, it's going to cause other people to panic. Number two, if you panic on the radio and you sound panicked, everyone's going to make fun of you. So, you know, when you get back from the mission, everyone's going, "Yeah, you sounded like a baby out there." So, what would I do before I would key up my radio? Take a breath. And so, here I'm manually slowing down my breath. I'm broadening my field of view. So, if you're in a meeting or you're in a, you know, you're at the—at the supermarket parking lot and someone starts to yell at you, take a step back, take a breath, broaden your field of view, detach from those emotions that you're having, and make some space. And that's—that's how I go through the mechanics of detachment. Now, I can tell you right now, I mean, when—when—when you do this all the time, which I kind of do this all the time, I don't—I don't really have to like step back, but when you're starting to be able to try and do this, absolutely make a—me and I'll tell you, here's another like weird little nuance thing: lift your chin up, and put your hands down. Now, this is not in a combat situation, not a—not in a fight, but here's the thing. When—when—when I get defensive, what am I going to do? I'm gonna raise my hands up. I'm put my chin down. That's like a fighting mode. So, if you and I are having a discussion and I'm starting to get heated and I'm starting to like, "Oh, he's not listening to me." Instead of me putting my chin down and—and put my hands like up—up to where I can put them in your face a little bit—no, I'm actually going to take a step back. I'm going to say, "Put my chin up." It changes my perspective a little bit more. Changes my visual perspective just by changing the angle of my head. Take a step back. Put my hands down. I'm not being in a defensive mood. I actually want to hear what you have to say. And if I start listening to what you have to say and not talking, it's very hard to be detached when you're talking. It's another key component. You want to detach, shut your mouth. So, I'm in meetings, you know, I—in a bunch of different companies. I'm running a—I have a bunch of—I own a bunch of different companies. I'm in a meeting in my companies. I'm not the one that's doing all the talking. In fact, I'm doing mostly listening. When I'm in task unit bruiser, my task unit, I'm not sitting there giving the entire brief. No, I'm letting the platoon chief and the platoon commanders give those briefs. And that way, I'm detached. I'm listening to what they have to say. I'm more capable of seeing what holes there are in their plans by not moving my mouth, not talking. I'm listening. So those are some of the methodologies that I use and that I advise people to use in order to effectively start down the pathway of being able to detach in various scenarios.