Transcription
Not familiar with how all of this did play out as far as the timeline. We know that Charlie Kirk was speaking. Those are some of the photos there at Utah Valley University, about 3,000 people in attendance, as the gunshot was fired. He was rushed over to a hospital afterward. We later heard from President Trump that Kirk did pass away. I want to discuss the case in general and what happens next? So let's bring in a friend of the show here. We do have Jillian Snider, an adjunct lecturer at John J College of Criminal Justice and resident senior fellow at the R Street Institute. She is also a retired New York City police officer. Thank you so much, Jillian, for taking the time to join us here.
Good morning, Josh. Thanks for having me. Good morning. Well, first off, I do want to ask you because we know that within about 48 hours, we saw this arrest made, the suspect taken into custody after a reward was offered of a hundred thousand dollars. And also, you had the videos and photos that were circulated. So, based on your experience here, how common is it to see an arrest made in a case of this magnitude here within 48 hours?
As you just said, he was taken into custody within 33 hours. And that's extremely fast by traditional investigatory norms, but it does often happen in high-profile cases. And it's because you have so much inter-agency cooperation. In this case, obviously, we had so much media exposure. And then once the release of the surveillance footage and videos went live, you have millions of people across the country looking into this. And ultimately, a family member, the father, is what we're hearing, recognized the suspect, confronted the suspect, and he was ultimately taken into custody. But again, we also saw the show, "The First 48 Hours." We know that those two days are the most impactful for talking to witnesses, getting surveillance, talking, getting victim statements, and collecting forensic evidence.
You mentioned the father, that's of course, uh, what we did learn about how the arrest itself happened and how he turned himself in. But how common would you say it is for people close to the suspect, especially a family member like a father, to be the ones who are alerting police there after seeing surveillance photos, videos, and saying, "That right there is my son"?
Honestly, it's one of the more common ways that big cases are cracked. Um, and it did play out in this investigation. So the suspect's father recognized him, as we know, and a family friend reportedly helped get that information to police. And again, we're hearing that the father urged the suspect to turn himself in. So normally, people think it's the anonymous tipster line, but in reality, it is often people close to the suspect, whether it be a family or a friend or an acquaintance, because they do have that information, inside information. They would more easily recognize that suspect once the video surveillance or surveillance photos are released online. So it does happen more commonly than most things.
When you're talking about the FBI Director, Kash Patel, and his comments yesterday, he said 11,000 tips and leads did come in over that 33-hour period there. How does that compare to maybe another case? 11,000 seems like a lot of tips from the public. And also, how do law enforcement officers, investigators there, go about combing through those at a quick rate in determining, "Is this legitimate or is this a false lead?"
11,000 tips is a, a great amount. But one of the contributing factors to that was the sizeable reward. You don't often see a hundred thousand dollar reward offered that quickly in an investigation. You'll actually see the reward amount increase the longer the investigation is active, more as like an incentive for people to pay attention. So, but when you have thousands of tips, 11,000 in this case, uh, law enforcement and detectives have to rely on a triage system to sort them out. So they prioritize tips that they find to be credible but can be corroborated with evidence that they currently have. So in this case, they did recover a rifle very early on in the investigation with the etchings and markings on them. They did have footprints that they were able to cast into and, you know, make comparisons. And they did have some video footage. So they're going to look at tips that kind of match or mirror those and prioritize those. They will still log every other tip and they will still follow up inevitably on every possible lead, but they need to do it based on a triage system of what seems the most practical and probable.
I want to ask about something you just mentioned here, and those are the markings and the words that were written on the bullets themselves. Does that detail have any investigative significance? What, if anything, can be understood from those messages that are written there?
So, these messages were interesting because typically, you'll see a suspect have a common theme. We did see some commonality in some of the etchings, um, the "Bella Ciao" and the, the "Catch it fascist" or whatever. I'm, you know, paraphrasing here. But then he did have other ones that said, like, "If you read this, you're gay, LOL." That's again, when we're looking at a criminal mastermind, we're looking for someone with some consistency in their messaging. So this does implicate that he is, um, immature. Um, he was trying to make a point, but it was immature. But because a lot of what he wrote had political undertones, had ideological meaning behind it, they will use that as their, their foundation and their cornerstone. Of course, the victim in this case, the political arena in this case, all a lure to political violence. But we need to look at what the, the suspect left behind. And he left behind these etchings which are very impactful. But that's just going to be phase one. Because political ideation, yes, could be a motivational factor. But in most cases of assassination or would-be assassination, notoriety and the need and feel of meaning to see visibility, those are really the motivating factors with the political undertones being secondary.
What you're looking at is some of the video that was captured as the gunshot was fired. You can see about 3,000 people there at the event, according to event organizers, and they are running because again, they just witnessed something horrific. They heard a gunshot. They don't know if more gunshots are going to be fired. What role did that large crowd right there at the event likely play in allowing the suspect to escape afterward? Because again, we know, according to investigators, that he was actually on a rooftop at the time, he was not in the crowd itself.
So, as you said earlier, and as reports have said, there was approximately 3,000 people at this event. That's going to create a lot of confusion as you're seeing these attendees are just running in all types of directions. It doesn't seem like there was any evacuation protocol put into place. But honestly, even if you have the best evacuation protocol, when something like this happens, people immediately just retreat to safety. Um, so that in itself makes it super hard for law enforcement to immediately secure a scene. Um, additionally, as you also just said, the suspect was perched on a roof about 200 yards and was able to slip into that chaos after the fact. Um, but on the, the better hand and the more positive note, because you have this many people, and this is a younger crowd, they are all holding their cell phones. That's a huge resource for for investigators. So dozens of people have already come forward with video tips and with video footage and have been able to provide law enforcement, which were enabling them to piece together minute by minute when this suspect got off the roof and ultimately fled.
One thing that's interesting, a note from yesterday, investigators did reveal here that the suspect, while he is in this jail that you see right there on your screen, he's been questioned by investigators. They have said that he is not cooperating. He is staying quiet, not answering any of their questions about a motive or anything else. Again, that information, obviously preliminary, coming in from investigators. But coming, does that say to you? Is that fairly standard that a suspect is not going to talk and share any details about any of this?
So, it, it, it varies based on the way in which the suspect was captured. In this case, his family brought him in. They offered him into law enforcement. Um, when you have someone who's on the lamb, on the run, and ultimately apprehended by law enforcement's diligence, they're often going to, because they're upset that they got caught, they're going to open their mouths prematurely. In this case, the parent brought him in, and I, I would speculate that he was told not to cooperate, to ask for legal counsel. In a situation like this, but we have so much other corroborating evidence. And investigators will, unfortunately, now if the suspect is not speaking, they'll have to rely solely on that forensic, digital footprint, the the found rifle, the found etch markings, any footprints, anyone that's willing to come forward with a statement. So it will take a little longer because we don't have a direct confession. But I'm sure with what the victim's fam, I'm sorry, what the suspect's family and what some victims on scene have said, um, we're going to be able to piece this together much quicker.
We did not get a news conference, uh, last night. We know that there have been several throughout the day as they were still, uh, looking for him. But yesterday, they held a very detailed news conference afterward. What question or questions do you still want to see answered? Of course, with your background, I'm sure you're inquisitive and and you just want to know certain things. So, what question or questions do you still have?
Well, I want to say, firstly, I do commend them on providing such a detailed press conference. You don't typically see that. They'll give you breadcrumbs, um, but they're not going to come forth with all the information that they did yesterday. So I think that was a true testament to the willingness to be transparent with the public. Um, so I'm just very proud of law enforcement and Governor Cox for coming forward and giving us almost a 30-minute press conference. Um, but with that being said, uh, we have them in custody. We have so much evidence that's already seemingly showing that he is, in fact, the suspect and alleged shooter. But I, I want to know how he got on that rooftop. I want to know, he wasn't a student at UVU. Did he go there and do counter-surveillance? My assumption is most definitely, because for him to identify that vantage point. And we have to look at this, the the rifle that he used, 200 yards is not a far distance for a rifle like that, which also makes me think he's not an expert marksman. Um, a rifle like that is actually capable by an a skilled marksman shooting 400 to 600 yards away. So I want to know all of that. Did anyone in his family know that he was going and doing target practice with rifles? But the most important thing is how is he able to access that campus, not being a student, and be able to map out and plan out this attack?
Jillian Snider, as always, thank you so much for taking the time to join us and provide some perspective. There are still a lot of questions, but as you mentioned, a very detailed news conference about 30 minutes in length held by, uh, the Utah governor and other officials there. Thank you again for being here. Anything else you want to add about any of this before I let you go?
No, I'm just really grateful that the FBI was able to work with Utah Public Safety and capture the suspect so quickly. Thank you again for being here. We definitely appreciate it.
Thanks, Josh. And I do want to take you out to some of the video that is coming in from Fox News. As you can see, a vehicle that is actually being transported from the scene of, uh, the home of that suspect. We did get this video just coming in, so I'm taking a look at it for the first time. But it, uh, looks like the vehicle is towed away as part of the evidence. This is outside of the home of the accused killer. Again, we don't have a lot of information, but as you can see, the FBI agents are there on scene. They drive up several vehicles. They are combing through that home, looking for any evidence in connection with the case. Again, as I mentioned, uh, we are told by investigators that the suspect is not cooperating with law enforcement and not answering their questions. We'll keep you updated here as we do get more details. But that suspect also expected to appear in a Utah.