Transcription
All right. The way we all get news now has completely changed. And I really look to a lot of influencers on Instagram that have common sense, sharpest attacks, and know how to fight these [ __ ] fascists. And one of my favorite follows online right now is a man named Charlie Golden Sun. And his Instagram handle is ShayChuck. C H E Z Chuck. How are you, Charlie?
>> I'm doing so good, Jennifer. How are you?
>> Very well. I um when did you start doing political commentary on Instagram?
>> Well, and also before I even say that, I need to stop saying I'm so well. It's just like an automatic response in this environment and then I say that I'm like that's insane. This the world's on fire. Um I started less than a year ago, but the thing is I was I've worked in politics my whole career. I've been a Democratic strategist basically since I left college. I've worked on the Hill. I've worked in the Senate. I've worked in the White House, presidential campaigns, media companies, and so like my my background has always been um in producing digital content for impact for political purposes, but I've never been public facing. The reason I started do, you know, screaming into my phone myself was I was a I was adviser on the Kla Harris campaign at the very end. And um I I got brought in after Biden dropped out. Um, and you know, I just saw the insanity that was that campaign and that was how we continue to run Democratic political operations right now, which is setting hundreds of millions of dollars on fire on massive premium production TV ads, endless testing, endless consultants, and simultaneously we're having all these discussions about, you know, we need a Joe Rogan of the left and we need to figure out how to utilize digital infrastructure and invest in digital infrastructure. Um, and when we lost that campaign, I was invited to speak on some panels and I was in a thousand meetings about how do we get Democrats back? How do we win back young men? Blah blah blah. And I was really thrilled to be in those meetings at first. I was like, "This is great. We're ideulating. We're we're figuring out solutions here." You know, by the 30th meeting, the 30th panel, I [ __ ] lost my mind. And I was like, "This is insane. This is the problem. Um, we need to stop [ __ ] ideulating and we need to start doing." and and it genuinely was out of frustration. I figured I'm a guy. I have a deep voice. I know how to talk about these things. Let's see if I can be a voice here. And it just it just took off immediately to to my surprise.
>> I think that's incredible. So knowing that you were a Democratic strategist, I right now have been probably since Kla Law, probably a little bit before then, have gone through a bit of a political evolution where all I can think about when I think of Democrats right now is just how weak and feckless they are and that they have to crowdsource and that they can't stand up to Benjamin Netanyahu and that Chuck Schumer and Hakee Jeff make me want to individually tear out every piece of hair on my head
>> and then paint my room with a Q-tip, two coats, to not listen to them. And it's so frustrating right now being a Democrat because you probably read this report where the autopsy came out, which I think is really important information. I think that the fact that Ken Martin said, "No, we're going to get give it to you is very insulting to my intelligence, takes advantage of my vote." Um, and also millions of other Democrats. What is your take on them spiking the autopsy, which what now we know is because they didn't tend to the progressive base. Instead, they trotted around with Liz Cheney.
>> Yeah, I have a thousand thoughts. I'm so glad you started with this.
>> If I could just set some context really quickly. So, I I worked in the Biden White House in in 2020. And before that, um I was the digital and brand director for Jill Biden on the 2020 campaign. They the Biden campaign had asked me to come onto that campaign in the early in the primaries in 201 18 early 2019 and I said no because I was a Bernie Sanders supporter. I've a life I was I've been supporting Bernie since I was in college. Um and Bernie you know Biden was not my horse. I thought he was going to lose. Um so I turned them down. I was volunt I was you know doing work with the Bidens and doing work with Elizabeth Warren and and Booker on their campaign side on the strategy side for a while. But on my weekends, I was volunteering for Bernie. And so I turned them down. And then a year later when they won the primary, they came back to me and they said, "What about now?" And that at that point, I said, "Fuck it. All hands on deck to beat a fascist." And like that's when I I got in. It was in my mind it was a binary choice at that point. It was the same thing that happened in 2024 when I went on to the Kla campaign when it was still Biden. They were asking me to come on. It was post Gaza. I said absolutely [ __ ] not. Um, and then when it switched over to Kamla, there was some, you know, for me personally, there was kind of like a psychological switch that just that allowed me to jump in and say, "All right, all hands on deck. Let's do this." Again, that being said, um, I think the biggest [ __ ] up morally, politically, socially, whatever, of the Democratic Party is Gaza. And I think what this Axis report did is just prove what all of us have known for a very long time. and you've been talking about it on your show. I've been screaming about it into the ether into my phone, right? Like to me, the fact that they buried this report and now the reporting shows that the reason they buried it buried it seems to be because it revealed that yeah, like a genocide in Gaza did lose voters, did lose young voters. To me, not only is it stupid and feckless, but it's like criminal. What it's saying is that the Democratic Party, the DNC, has knowledge, strategic understanding of things that went wrong. Again, from a messaging standpoint, a campaigning standpoint, a policy standpoint, a moral standpoint. They're sitting on that knowledge and still refusing to actually change their position, still refusing to actually pivot direction, which to me is is insanity. That's making a proactive choice to say we know we [ __ ] up here and we still are going to not make an adjustment. Um, and so while it's infuriating, it's also like so many other things I'm feeling these days, which is like no [ __ ] right? Like of of course it lost votes. We knew that when we were on the campaign. We knew it was going to lose votes. So, it's just another one of these things where it's like I unfortunately hate to say I told you so, but it's like the progressives here have been right and like we're trying to drag folks along and like slowly but surely it seems to be happening and you know they're they're they're holding out but maybe these kinds of reports will help. So when you see uh House Minority Leader Hakeim Jeff get interviewed by Joy Reid and Waj Ali and WA Ali says are you going to continue to take Apac money and uh Jeff says I'm going to continue to raise money the way I always have which means yes I'm going to continue to take Apac money and then you know about this report to me the biggest betrayal that I've felt is coming to an awakening of how condescending the Democratic Party treats its voters. And I bought into it hook, line, sinker. I voted for Hillary in the primary in 2016. I was a good MSNBC Democrat. I did my job trying to fight in this red state for women, for queer people, etc.
>> And they took my vote for granted. And so now, as I've really dug into this, like how do you lose a campaign to a convicted felon [ __ ] Seriously, like how do you do that? How do you [ __ ] up so bad? And then you see Hakee and Chuckles pretty much beholden to Apac. And then you see who would be the a good front runner, but he's made a lot of fumbles lately, Gavin Newsome, uh seed ground in podcast to Ben Shapiro. I'm like, what the [ __ ] are you doing? Like, why aren't you sitting down with Hassan [ __ ] Why aren't you why aren't you courting progressives? Even if you disagree with them, court them.
>> So what is your take on that?
>> Again, thousand takes on this. I'd say like it goes back to me again, not to to set additional context. I think like you can't have this conversation without h talking about the like massive debate that we're still [ __ ] h having over like should Kla Harris have gone on Joe Roen, right? And like there's there's two discussion points there, right? Which is should she or shouldn't she have? That's one. The other is like, could she have done it successfully? Right? If you had dropped Kla Harris into a three-hour interview with Joe Rogan, would she have performed? Would she have been able to do it? And my view is she should have done it because the risk was worth the reward. And yet, I'm not that confident. I'm not confident that she would have done well, right? Because we know that a lot of these politicians, Kla Harris included, respectfully, I work for you, but like come on. Like if you are Hakee Jeff, like Gavin, if you are building your entire messaging points around consultant-driven talking points, you're going to be [ __ ] exposed when you are questioned by folks like you. When you're given actual time to have to give answers, when it's not a 4minute rushed interview with some traditional media, but you're actually going to get follow-ups and follow-ups and follow-ups. So I think that's one of the reasons that these folks don't go on these podcasts. It's not because they don't understand the importance of it. It's because they know they're going to get [ __ ] cornered and drilled, you know? Like, I've seen you do it, Jennifer, right? And like, thank God that you do that and I think they're scared of that, but that's a reflection of why they're not the right people for this time. Like, if you can't have a [ __ ] conversation and sound like a human being, then like maybe you shouldn't be in a [ __ ] elected office right now. And I will say that like I'm gonna tie this to Zoron really quickly, which is like there's so many things Zoron's team did, right? Everybody talks about their social media and their influencer strategy, etc., and their video program. Like, yes, of course, amen. And their their policy positions being genuinely populist, and yes, of course, amen. But like, I think it's underappreciated that like he just talks like a human being. He he just is relatable, right? like he just he's not being pressure tested against some like [ __ ] $100,000 poll every day. And so yeah, and like when you talk about Gavin Newsome, oh my god, I mean I just did a a little interview with Vogue about this of like the it's not just good enough to go everywhere, right? Like it is the it is the the the baseline now is that Democrats have to be everywhere all the time. Every podcast, local news, national news, like go get out there. However, if you're unable to actually perform in those arenas, if you're unable to actually drive your point forward, if you're unable to actually stand your ground and [ __ ] fight for your positions and not give ground on [ __ ] trans issues or the billionaire tax or whatever like Gavin continues to do, then sorry, man. Like, that's a [ __ ] bad strategy. Like, you need to be able to go in there and fight and debate, not befriend them, not tell them that your son loves them. Like, that's ridiculous. And so I think there's a thousand different factors at play here, but at its core is like if you can't go on these shows and speak honestly, then you're probably not the right person for this time. That's my view.
>> I think that's incredible. So knowing that you were a Democratic strategist, I right now have been probably since Kla Law, probably a little bit before then, have gone through a bit of a political evolution where all I can think about when I think of Democrats right now is just how weak and feckless they are and that they have to crowdsource and that they can't stand up to Benjamin Netanyahu and that Chuck Schumer and Hakee Jeff make me want to individually tear out every piece of hair on my head.
>> and then paint my room with a Q-tip, two coats, to not listen to them. And it's so frustrating right now being a Democrat because you probably read this report where the autopsy came out, which I think is really important information. I think that the fact that Ken Martin said, "No, we're going to get give it to you is very insulting to my intelligence, takes advantage of my vote." Um, and also millions of other Democrats. What is your take on them spiking the autopsy, which what now we know is because they didn't tend to the progressive base. Instead, they trotted around with Liz Cheney.
>> Yeah, I have a thousand thoughts. I'm so glad you started with this.
>> If I could just set some context really quickly. So, I I worked in the Biden White House in in 2020. And before that, um I was the digital and brand director for Jill Biden on the 2020 campaign. They the Biden campaign had asked me to come onto that campaign in the early in the primaries in 201 18 early 2019 and I said no because I was a Bernie Sanders supporter. I've a life I was I've been supporting Bernie since I was in college. Um and Bernie you know Biden was not my horse. I thought he was going to lose. Um so I turned them down. I was volunt I was you know doing work with the Bidens and doing work with Elizabeth Warren and and Booker on their campaign side on the strategy side for a while. But on my weekends, I was volunteering for Bernie. And so I turned them down. And then a year later when they won the primary, they came back to me and they said, "What about now?" And that at that point, I said, "Fuck it. All hands on deck to beat a fascist." And like that's when I I got in. It was in my mind it was a binary choice at that point. It was the same thing that happened in 2024 when I went on to the Kla campaign when it was still Biden. They were asking me to come on. It was post Gaza. I said absolutely [ __ ] not. Um, and then when it switched over to Kamla, there was some, you know, for me personally, there was kind of like a psychological switch that just that allowed me to jump in and say, "All right, all hands on deck. Let's do this." Again, that being said, um, I think the biggest [ __ ] up morally, politically, socially, whatever, of the Democratic Party is Gaza. And I think what this Axis report did is just prove what all of us have known for a very long time. and you've been talking about it on your show. I've been screaming about it into the ether into my phone, right? Like to me, the fact that they buried this report and now the reporting shows that the reason they buried it buried it seems to be because it revealed that yeah, like a genocide in Gaza did lose voters, did lose young voters. To me, not only is it stupid and feckless, but it's like criminal. What it's saying is that the Democratic Party, the DNC, has knowledge, strategic understanding of things that went wrong. Again, from a messaging standpoint, a campaigning standpoint, a policy standpoint, a moral standpoint. They're sitting on that knowledge and still refusing to actually change their position, still refusing to actually pivot direction, which to me is is insanity. That's making a proactive choice to say we know we [ __ ] up here and we still are going to not make an adjustment. Um, and so while it's infuriating, it's also like so many other things I'm feeling these days, which is like no [ __ ] right? Like of of course it lost votes. We knew that when we were on the campaign. We knew it was going to lose votes. So, it's just another one of these things where it's like I unfortunately hate to say I told you so, but it's like the progressives here have been right and like we're trying to drag folks along and like slowly but surely it seems to be happening and you know they're they're they're holding out but maybe these kinds of reports will help. So when you see uh House Minority Leader Hakeim Jeff get interviewed by Joy Reid and Waj Ali and WA Ali says are you going to continue to take Apac money and uh Jeff says I'm going to continue to raise money the way I always have which means yes I'm going to continue to take Apac money and then you know about this report to me the biggest betrayal that I've felt is coming to an awakening of how condescending the Democratic Party treats its voters. And I bought into it hook, line, sinker. I voted for Hillary in the primary in 2016. I was a good MSNBC Democrat. I did my job trying to fight in this red state for women, for queer people, etc.
>> And they took my vote for granted. And so now, as I've really dug into this, like how do you lose a campaign to a convicted felon [ __ ] Seriously, like how do you do that? How do you [ __ ] up so bad? And then you see Hakee and Chuckles pretty much beholden to Apac. And then you see who would be the a good front runner, but he's made a lot of fumbles lately, Gavin Newsome, uh seed ground in podcast to Ben Shapiro. I'm like, what the [ __ ] are you doing? Like, why aren't you sitting down with Hassan [ __ ] Why aren't you why aren't you courting progressives? Even if you disagree with them, court them.
>> So what is your take on that?
>> Again, thousand takes on this. I'd say like it goes back to me again, not to to set additional context. I think like you can't have this conversation without h talking about the like massive debate that we're still [ __ ] h having over like should Kla Harris have gone on Joe Roen, right? And like there's there's two discussion points there, right? Which is should she or shouldn't she have? That's one. The other is like, could she have done it successfully? Right? If you had dropped Kla Harris into a three-hour interview with Joe Rogan, would she have performed? Would she have been able to do it? And my view is she should have done it because the risk was worth the reward. And yet, I'm not that confident. I'm not confident that she would have done well, right? Because we know that a lot of these politicians, Kla Harris included, respectfully, I work for you, but like come on. Like if you are Hakee Jeff, like Gavin, if you are building your entire messaging points around consultant-driven talking points, you're going to be [ __ ] exposed when you are questioned by folks like you. When you're given actual time to have to give answers, when it's not a 4minute rushed interview with some traditional media, but you're actually going to get follow-ups and follow-ups and follow-ups. So I think that's one of the reasons that these folks don't go on these podcasts. It's not because they don't understand the importance of it. It's because they know they're going to get [ __ ] cornered and drilled, you know? Like, I've seen you do it, Jennifer, right? And like, thank God that you do that and I think they're scared of that, but that's a reflection of why they're not the right people for this time. Like, if you can't have a [ __ ] conversation and sound like a human being, then like maybe you shouldn't be in a [ __ ] elected office right now. And I will say that like I'm gonna tie this to Zoron really quickly, which is like there's so many things Zoron's team did, right? Everybody talks about their social media and their influencer strategy, etc., and their video program. Like, yes, of course, amen. And their their policy positions being genuinely populist, and yes, of course, amen. But like, I think it's underappreciated that like he just talks like a human being. He he just is relatable, right? like he just he's not being pressure tested against some like [ __ ] $100,000 poll every day. And so yeah, and like when you talk about Gavin Newsome, oh my god, I mean I just did a a little interview with Vogue about this of like the it's not just good enough to go everywhere, right? Like it is the it is the the the baseline now is that Democrats have to be everywhere all the time. Every podcast, local news, national news, like go get out there. However, if you're unable to actually perform in those arenas, if you're unable to actually drive your point forward, if you're unable to actually stand your ground and [ __ ] fight for your positions and not give ground on [ __ ] trans issues or the billionaire tax or whatever like Gavin continues to do, then sorry, man. Like, that's a [ __ ] bad strategy. Like, you need to be able to go in there and fight and debate, not befriend them, not tell them that your son loves them. Like, that's ridiculous. And so I think there's a thousand different factors at play here, but at its core is like if you can't go on these shows and speak honestly, then you're probably not the right person for this time. That's my view.
>> You know, a person who does this really well is Ro Connor. He was on my podcast the other day and before that he was on like Sean Ryan. He's done that guy. I forget his name. The guy with the mullet uh right-wing mullet podcaster,
>> Theo Von. Is that who you're talking about?
>> The Von. Yeah. And Ro Connor goes on all of these places and never seeds ground. Yeah.
>> And gets them to agree with him.
>> Yeah.
>> And then when I see Gavin going having Shapiro on or the late Charlie Kirk and he's seating ground, I just it makes me it enrages me. I'm like I get so angry because I'm like why are you committing social suicide right now? Like why are you doing this? But when we get to uh this I want to go back to this autopsy and don't you think it would be best because it's going to keep dripping. There's going to be more [ __ ] that comes out. What do you think it is? Do you think the DNC is is every bit as beholden to the same corporations and they don't want to cut off funding? Is this all solely do you think about Israel? Um because it seems like all roads in the Epstein files um with this DNC autopsy lead to us having this relationship with war criminal Benjamin Netanyahu. And my fear is you have some opportunists on the right like Tucker Carlson and Marjorie Taylor Green.
>> That message very simply these people are not America first. They they seem to be Israel first. And that for people that are lowinformation voters that only tune in a couple weeks before an election is gonna pull a bunch of people in. And I think the Democrats just not having more moral clarity on the Gaza issue is really damaging.
>> Mhm. Um again a thousand things. Um, so one is first thing I'll say is I think that like I think that there's a it's not to like justify our excuse, but I think we need to like people need to understand or we need to do a better job explaining that like the DNC, capital D, capital D and capital C like is it is its own institution, right? And like they are not necessarily they do not like have power over Hakee Jeff, right? I think people kind of like misunderstand how this stuff kind of works. where they do have power and influence of course is their fundraising dollars and how they allocate those fundraising dollars. So like I do think that like we often have it's can be complex but like the Democratic party can be at times different than the DNC. That being said, I think one of the problems with the DNC or the Democratic Party both is that yes, there's entrenched interests, there's big dollar donors, there's Apac. Those are all uh tangible real factors that I think are like driving this ridiculous position. I also think though that it's that our party, the establishment wing of the party is run by an older generation who does not [ __ ] understand the media landscape we're in anymore. Who does not understand how quickly and rapidly information is shared. how does not they don't understand that like you can't change people's minds with a million-dollar ad buy on local cable news anymore, right? And so like that's actually I think there's beyond the like moral and like philosophical questions here, I actually think there's also just like bad [ __ ] archaic strategy happening, which is they don't think they have to actually own up to this stuff. They view Gaza as like gas prices. They view Gaza as um you know singleisss issue voter issues that are like much more day-to-day versus an entire generation or multi multiple generations of Americans who are watching a [ __ ] genocide happen on their phones, right? And like I think they think that they can just like dump a bunch of money into paid advertising three months before the election and like win people back. I genuinely I think it's bad strategy is what's like leading so much of this stuff and a lot of that comes from a a failed understanding of the modern media ecosystem like and and those are the people running their party and running these kind of these operations.
>> You're you're putting into words what I feel like uh when I think about the Democratic establishment. I feel like they're conservative. I and it's not so much that they're like conservative issues but their approach to politics. They are preservationists. They want to preserve the um losing strategy that handed the executive branch to a [ __ ] [ __ ] And I I just
>> and and then the um hostility, passive hostility that they treat the electorate with that we're so stupid about Israel and the weaponization of uh anti-semitism
>> is it is just such [ __ ] because I was kind of skeptical when I educated myself on this to even speak out about it because I didn't want to be a bigot. Sure.
>> Um, and the Democrats should provide a path, a moral path very concisely. Criticizing Israel is the best thing you can do to support Jewish people. Just like right now in the United States, I'm begging for people in Europe to hold everybody in the Epstein files accountable because I know cash ching money [ __ ] Patel isn't going to do it.
>> No, he's too busy, you know, drinking beers at the Olympics. Um, no. I mean, I'm Jewish, right? Like I talk about this a lot and like it sounds so bizarre to say this, but like, you know, I'm a cis straight white dude, but I'm also Jewish and that gives me permission to like speak on this in a way that I think other folks can't because they're concerned that they're going to be called anti-semmites. And they should be concerned, right? Like I can't imagine the amount of people in your DMs and messages calling you a Jew hater, calling you an anti-semite. Hassan [ __ ] right? like he's wearing it on the chin every day. I am a Jew. I am a Jewish American. And I can tell you that like the insane rhetoric, whether it's Republicans or Democrats, anybody tying our political processes, tying our um allegiance to the government of Israel, and supporting a genocide, saying that anybody who supports uh uh Palestinian liberation is somehow in the hands of Hamas, calling us anti-semites. Here's the reality. That kind of rhetoric drives up anti-semitism. It does not drive it down. And we do we do a good job, I think, but like mass media and politicians. You know, there's this cognitive dissonance when we talk about rising rates of anti-semitism in this country, which there are. That is an objective truth. But in my mind, again, as a Jew, you cannot separate the rising rates of anti-semitism from the insane rhetoric that's coming from Republicans and Democrats, pro-Israel Zionist Republicans and Democrats, because every time they call a Palestinian supporter a jihadist, of course, and then base that language in their Judaism, of course, people are going to blame Jews. Of course, they're going to come back and say, "Well, that's a Jewish position." So like you know it's that's been one of the most infuriating pieces of the last three years for me. Yeah.
>> Let me ask you a question. So I'm familiar with living in Oklahoma rapture preppers and how they feel like like I'm talking about Huckabe Crew, Ted Cruz, Lindsey Graham. These guys are full-blown Christian nationalist rapture preppers and they think in order for Jesus to come back for the rapture that the Jews need to be in Israel. I've always found that to be so uh dismissive and using a whole race of people as a prop, but that's just my take as an atheist that had to live around all these Bible thumper rapture preppers. I'm like, well, that seems really hateful. What is your take about the religious rapture preppers that now Benjamin Netanyahu is co-opting these people to get what he wants? the same way that the NRA co-opted them, the same way that, you know, uh, the pro-life movement co-opted them, the same way the Republican party co-opted them, the same way these are the 90% people that got Trump. So, what is your take on these white the Lindsey Grahams, the Ted Cruz's, the Huckabes that want your ass to be in Israel so that Jesus can come and then send you to hell? That seems pretty insulting to want us to go back to Israel so that I believe like 70% of us will die also is the Yeah.
>> Um, I think it's [ __ ] insane. And like the part, you know, I know like the Tucker Carlson piece of this to me is important, right? Because he represents a really big or growing sect, not growing sect, maybe a publicly acknowledged growing sect of like these like anti-Zionist Christians or Catholic Republicans. And I'm sorry, like Tucker Carlson is an anti-semite. Like his
>> Yes. like his support for for uh Palestinian liberation and against the against BB Netanyahu is not about his care or his morality. It's because he wants to be brought to heaven or whatever and he wants that it's a religious act and like the fact that that gets ignored in this discussion, right? or that people like I won't name names, but like some folks on the left supposedly are now like aligning themselves with Tucker Carlson because they somehow find like a meeting point on Israel. It's just as infuriating to me. I'm like, you know, it we can't part of the battle here when it comes to Gaza, when it comes to go, whatever we want to call this this problem now is it's difficult to try to stand up for this cause while simultaneously calling out the real legitimate anti- Zionism that does often align itself with this cause. And I think that we do damage to ourselves when we do not call that out. It delegitimizes our position by saying that no, none of this is anti-semitic. There's absolutely anti-semitism in this as well. And we should call those [ __ ] out. Excuse my French, but like we're not doing that. And then we have leftist commentators, leftist commentators trying to find common ground with them. And my view is they're doing this for a very different reason than you. They're doing this for like a what I view as like [ __ ] insane broken bra. like they're they're
>> totally nobody talks about it and it's [ __ ] crazy.
>> Um the
>> it should be institutionalized like it's crazy.
>> It totally is. Huckabe just recently said that his foreign policy Tucker Carlson was interviewing him was based on biblical law. But here's my thing about Tucker, about Marjorie Taylor Green, about these people that are using uh the Israel thing. And I know why they're using it. Because if they go into red states and they they're trying to keep the cult together and they say this policy of Ted Cruz, of Lady Graham is um it's not America first, it's Israel first and Israel, they have healthc care and blah blah. It is an opportunistic um play that they're trying to for higher office. It won't surprise me one bit if Tucker runs for higher office. All I need to know about somebody's sense of human rights is are they universal? With Tucker Carlson about three weeks ago, he was calling uh gay people [ __ ] on his podcast over and over and over and over again. He said it over and over and over again. Well, then how am I supposed to expect that you care about Palestinian people when you call American gay men [ __ ] multiple times? I know that you're full of [ __ ] Same with Marjorie Taylor Green. I know she is full of [ __ ] and an opportunist. And the fact that Tucker Carlson said that he was in bed and demons attacked him when he sleeps with these large dogs. I know the type of people that believe this [ __ ] because I grew up around all these crazy Bible thumpers and I know that they believe spiritual warfare is real. And I know that Tucker Carlson knows he wasn't attacked by a demon. And I I know them these types of people. And that's why I think their stance against Israel is more as a means to keep the cult, Donald Trump's base together because they've seen it. This guy's frail. Donald Trump is I mean it's curtains for this dementia duck that's in office. And so they're moving on. Uh and I I'm just 100% with you that we have to talk about how insane the foreign policy is people.
>> Yeah. I also think and I don't have numbers on this. There might be somebody who disagrees with me on this, I don't know. But like my sense has always been or recently is like it's also strategic. Like they know that Gaza and Israel is fracturing the democratic base. So like why would they not continue to hammer it knowing that like until the DNC actually acknowledges these fuckups and and pivots like there's going to be a delta here. There's going to be a a space between the Democratic base and the party. And like if I was a Republican strategist, I'd absolutely be trying to widen that gap. Like of course I want to drive voters away from their leadership and their party. Like that would be the best strategy for me. Um so no, I'm with you 100% Jennifer. And it's just like I mean it's it's it's almost like I I genuinely can't believe we're still having this conversation, right? Like it goes back I think to the like speaking politicians who speak honestly component of what you said earlier of like you know I think one of the most insane things Democrats and Republicans but like you know Biden really led it on the like Tik Tok ban initially was the blaming of Tik Tok for the radicalization of young people when it comes to support for Palestinian liberation or whatever we want to call it instead of like understanding that like this isn't a tool being weaponized is to radicalize young people. It's that information is being shared and young people or everybody are seeing visuals perpetually that like we haven't seen before. And so the problem is not with Tik Tok um leaders all over the country. The problem is that your [ __ ] policies are disgusting and immoral and broken and like the American people finally have an opportunity to actually see what this looks like overseas and they're disgusted by it. It's pretty simple. It's devastating. It's really devastating. Okay. Char Charlie. Do you go by Charlie Chuck or
>> Charlie? I go by I go by So I started the I started the Shay Chuck account under Chuck because I was like I didn't want to dox myself. Like I was like I don't want people to know who I am. Um so I I introduce myself as Charlie. Friends tend to call me Chuck. Um but yeah, Charlie. Chuck. I go by both. I
>> I loved having you on. I'll be back in New York next week and we'll do it again in person once the blizzard has passed. Um, I'll have Kylie and Seth put up where to follow you online, you guys. He is an excellent, excellent follow. And as a guest on this podcast, because I believe that some of the best opinions and news are from independent voices that are not beholden to the same people that made us lose. So, thank you so much for your voice. I promise we will do this again in person in New York. Go follow Shay. Thank you.
>> Awesome. Thank you, Jennifer. Really appreciate it. Bye.