The TOP 10 Games of ALL TIME | State of the Arc Podcast

You can sit here and try to, like, point at all these reasons for why that there, there's actually a ton of problems with this, and yet it will still be swallowed up by this intuitive sense that there is actually something here that you cannot deny that makes this one of the best games of all time.

Welcome back, everyone, to the State of the Ark podcast. My name is Mike. My name is K. We're going to do a light and fun, but slightly competitive episode today. Only slightly. Only slightly. We've, we've kind of been stepping in some kind of hot, controversial territory over the last few weeks, and, uh, we are not done having the conversation about localization by any means. No. But, but, uh, we're going to give it a rest for a little while. We don't want to just do a localization topic every single week for months and months and months. Yeah.

Um, but anyways, we're going to take a break from that for a minute, and we're going to, as the title says, uh, deliberate on our top 10 favorite games of all time. Now, just to be clear, this is not a combined list. This is my top 10 against K's top 10 games, and you guys get to participate. So, essentially, we're going to make our arguments for why each of these games are amazing, why we love them, why they deserve to be on the list, and their placement on the list. You get to be the judge of who has the better list and ultimately the best taste in games. So, we have to make, we have to make, uh, good cases for all this stuff. So, you guys tell us in the comment section who ultimately had the better list.

So, why don't we start with, is Deadliest? If you haven't seen that show, oh, it's a great show. Is it still going? It's old. Definitely not. There's definitely all sorts of people to pit against each other. It was Deadliest Warrior. Deadliest Warrior. Yeah, man. We, Samurai versus Navy SEAL. And hilarious stuff. It was so stupid, but so freaking fun to watch, particularly with the group, the group of guys that we had at the time. We were living together. Here is the point system and how you will grade or come to the conclusion of who has the better list. So, each stage as we move up, the amount of points for the winner of that round increases. So, the winner of 10 gets one point, and get the winner of nine gets two points. The winner of eight gets three points, all the way up to the top. And if we both end up picking the same game on the same, uh, round, it's a draw. It's a, it's a draw. We both get the points. Okay, cool. So that's how you're going to tally it up. So, who wins number 10, one point? Who wins number nine, two points? That's, and that's how you'll grade it. And then whoever gets the most points wins.

Uh, it's a good place to start with honorable mentions. Those did not quite make it in, but that you got to at least tip the cap to. I think you better go first. So, I have two. I have two specifically. Ref, ref. Mike is already cheating. I'm already cheating. Haven't even started yet. I, um, I have two games that I desperately wanted to put on this. Yeah. And, and I think will already hurt me in the long run in terms of being picked because of what I picked ahead of them. But I, I can't, I cannot bring myself to take off of number 10 what is there and put one of these in its place. So, we talk all the time about how Yasumi Matsuno is like our favorite game director. I know. I thought about this too. He didn't make my top 10, and he didn't make my top 10. That really bugged me. There's a very good reason for it, though. I tried to put him in, and I couldn't do it. There's a very good reason for why. Yeah. And that is because Yasumi Matsuno games are paced and structured in a way that are, are not my ideal for the balance between story and gameplay. Yeah. So, Yasumi Matsuno games are really great, excellent short story sequences that are punchy and like amazingly directed. And then you have like five hours of meandering block puzzles, puzzles, or like tactics, just very in the weeds, like party setup, and just extremely hardcore systems that you have to like navigate. Some of that can get really cumbersome, right? And so, for me, that imbalance is the only thing that holds back a Yasumi Matsuno game from entering my top 10. It's the gameplay side of it, not the story side of it. This, these, the stories he writes absolutely deserve to be at the top of the list. But Vagrant Story's gameplay, just like after a certain amount of time, just starts driving me crazy a little bit. Yeah, just a little bit. So, so that's it. So, Vagrant Story, um, is an honorable mention that I would put maybe 11. And then Shadow of the Colossus would be my next, Shadow honorable mention. That where it's just like, it's right there. It's right there. But again, it can feel just a little clumsy to play. And that's, that's a little bit true of, you know, Team Ico games as well. It's just, it's just a little bit of jankiness. It's not like the most solid or fluid gameplay experience. Have you? What about the remaster, though? The newer, even that, um, the remake, because there's a remaster and a remake. Um, they were very, very faithful to it. It's a, it's a little better, um, certainly. I think the control scheme is way more intuitive. But there's still just those instances where it's like, like, it's just, it just a little weird. Yeah. Um, so that's the only thing that held that back from getting it. So, well, we can agree on Vagrant Story, yeah, being on the list. Um, but there was another one that I had. Actually, I had Vagrant Story was my one. I tried so hard to fit it into the top 10, and I could not do it. I just couldn't do it. Um, but my other honorable mention that actually ousted Vagrant Story, once I realized how dope this game is, it's Nancy Drew: The Shadow at the Water's Edge. Now, just the name. So, why specifically that? Because there's a, the Shadow at the Water's Edge. It's a great title. Just talking about Alan Wake. That's true. The collective unconscious being in the lake. Water's Edge. I mean, I can already pull. Shadow. The shadow is definitely a Ying thing. So, is any of that actually in the game? Not even close, man. Not even close. This game's for like third graders. Um, it's a blast. The game is so much fun. I absolutely love it. I really was putting story there, but upon thinking about it, since it's an honorable mention, it doesn't really matter. And you're not allowed to hold this against me. Um, you know, I was like, Nancy Drew, let's throw Nancy Drew in there. Those games are a blast. They're super fun. Played them with my wife. I've played all 30 of them. Um, this one's the best. Ghost of Thornton Hall, maybe, as well. Um, but yeah, those two are are dope. Um, so let's get into number 10 now. All right. Number 10. You're only allowed to judge the top 10. You're not allowed to judge honorable mentions. I made that rule just now. Yeah. That's, that's a rule. It's set in stone. Well, I'll give you my number 10 real quick. Go first. My number 10 is a game that impacted me a lot. Um, if I had played this game five years later, which, it's, it's now seven years old now, um, it wouldn't be nearly as impactful. But you have to understand the experience that I had playing this game. We went to E3 in 2016, and it was all about Breath of the Wild. And that game, the experience, having Aonuma walk right past us while we were playing the game, because we got to be, we were special. We had VIP, VIP at E3 at that time. Um, and being, and like in the same, like rooms as all of the Nintendo executives. And, uh, they told us, hey, don't, don't talk to him. So we didn't. But for the most part, we were there and playing that game. And then when it came out for the Switch, and we got an advanced copy, like two weeks early, um, we went through the whole game. The, the dragons, the, the climbing, the world, everything about Breath of the Wild was so absolute magic to me, that I believe it holds, for me personally, a place in the top 10 favorite or best video games of all time. And I, I believe that it is one of the highest rated games ever made as well. If you look up, you know, just the aggregate review scores and stuff. I, I think I am justified in putting it there. Um, but I gave it the number 10 spot. You don't get to decide if you're justified. They get to. Oh, no, but new, new rule. New rule. You don't listen to Mike. Only listen to me. I'm the, I'm allowed to make new rules. Not you. So, um, no, I, I really agree with that whole E3 experience being like one of the best experiences in my lifetime, man. That was something else. Just even like the whole, I don't, you, you don't even call it a booth. It was way more than a booth. Yes. Giant building, like a giant freaking set that they built all with the with all the monsters. And you had like, you know, the statue of Link. And they had like, you know, just, just an amazing scene. They had even like the little cauldron where you do the cooking and stuff. And the little food kind of danced around inside of it, just like in the game. So much fun. They kind of walked us into a theater room that they, that they played kind of a trailer thing. But then it opened up, and it was very much like the beginning of the game where he's down underground and he comes. The whole experience of their quote unquote booth at E3 for Zelda was absolutely. Never seen anything like it. A million out of 10 experience. It was unbelievable how cool that was to go through. And they walked us right to the front of that line because we were VIP because that was a three-hour wait for people. Right? Yeah. That was so, like, we got to go into a special area to play it that was away from where everyone else was playing it. Kind of in that area. They gave us a little coins as like a, you know, like a memorabilia to take with us. Those are now, I've still got mine. I don't know if you guys kept yours. But I definitely kept it. I just don't know where it is. It was an incredible experience. Yeah. That E3 2017 was amazing. Was it? 201. I think. Six months before, because we played it on the Wii U, right? When we first played demo, right? We played the Wii U version. The Switch. And we were just saying the whole time, we were like, because at the time, what was it called? The, the Switch wasn't called the Switch. It was called Project E. Project. I can't remember. F. The Re. No, Revolution was the Wii. Yeah. Um, gosh dang it. The N. The N something. NX. NX. NX. Um, we were like, dude, I'll bet you it's right in the room behind us. That Numan just went right into. Um, yeah, it was, it was, it was cool. Yeah, super cool. I, I think that's a, a totally justified pick. Um, I picked Harvest Moon 64. Oh my gosh. Why didn't I put that game on here? Okay, honorable mention. Harvest Moon 64. I couldn't. I couldn't fit it. If, if I'm to sit here and like justify to the gaming general gaming audience why Harvest Moon 64 is a better game than Shadow of the Colossus or Vagrant Story, like, there's not like the greatest, maybe like solid foundation of an argument I could build from that. But what I can tell you is the impact that game had on me as a child, too, was immense. Me too. Um, again, it's more about like the context of that experience more so than even like the technical game itself. Though I do think it's a very technically well-made game. It's buggy here and there. There's some things about that aren't like the most well-polished. The day cycle's a little too short. Just a, just a little hair too short. Um, but there is magic. There is a magic I cannot explain that captivated me as a t. No, no. I was older than that. At least 12 years old. It's 98. Or I want to say I was, I was 12 when, when I was. So, I came over to your house. Yeah. And you guys were playing that. And I was like, why are you playing that? No, because you get a farm. And you look, I got a greenhouse. What the fetch is the appeal of a farming simulator? You guys should be playing something cool. Something where you kill stuff. Something like, something hardcore. Something awesome. And you guys talked me into giving it a shot. And I don't think I've had, well, maybe that's going a little too far. But it's among the most captivated, uh, most captivating experiences I've had where, where I got like obsessed with it. Like I couldn't put it down. I'm like thinking about it all day. I got to go home and like play more. And like, you get to the end of the three years, and then you just start over and do it again. And try to do things a little differently. Let's see if I can like do it this way this time, right? Have a different wife, do a different family, like make a different focus, try to win the horse race this time. Yes. See if you could train your dog to do better than just sit around all day. I mean, like absolutely obsessed with this game. Like all I can think about and do in any spare minute I have is play Harvest Moon. And even games, good at fishing. Yeah. Any game. A lot of the games that are going to come ahead of it on this list, I didn't play that obsessively. Okay. Like it was like a, at least six month, just like, Harvest Moon is all I do kind of thing. It's so much fun, man. It's, it's so much fun. The characters are so endearing. The music is just great. And it was, I, I, as far as I can remember, one of the first games where it was compelling with no violence. Yeah. And I look back at that now, and it's like, I'm, I'm very much an advocate at this point for, if you can make a compelling gameplay loop that that has no violence at all, that's kind of what I want to see more of. Uh, violence, I think is fine. It's a very easy way to create great stakes, life or death. It's human. It's, but it's easy. It's harder to make relationships with like, uh, townsfolk from the village and like, uh, you know, those types of conflicts feel that big. The day you get like that, the, the pink heart, right? From the, from the, the, the woman, or even the festivals. I remember to the argument of people, you know, to the localization argument. I actually got exposed to some Japanese culture in Harvest Moon 64 in ways I didn't expect. But things like the Lantern Festival, and sometime like when Karen says K, and I'm like, what is K? Like, what is that? Oh, it's a Japanese thing. Oh, and the way that, you know, some of the people emote and different things. It's a very Western focused, like styled game, but those Japanese elements were foreign and interesting and wonderful. And I just was, I was fascinated by that game. Yeah. It's, it's incredible. Um, it will never, ever be a game that I'll stop playing. Like, I believe I'll be 95 years old and be like, let me give Harvest Moon one more go. One more time. One more go before I go. Ride your horse around. Get off. Whistle for the dog. Go check the mail. Go to the greenhouse. Harvest. Go up to the mountain. Get the green herb. And then go fish and catch something. And then go down and give it to somebody. Like, I had game down, right? It was just like, so quick. And then the day's over. Go to sleep. Amazing routine to try to accomplish all the things you have to do in this short space every single day. And there's one thing I still haven't done in the game in all my playthroughs, which is get the party picture at the end. I have not ever done. Very difficult requirements to make that happen. And there's a part of me that one day that that is almost looking forward to that being like the 95-year-old final playthrough of Harvest Moon. One, being serious right now. Like that would be like the perfect fetching way. It's like from 12 years old, not knowing how to freaking make this happen because game FX couldn't figure it out until like maybe like now they've data mined it to the point where they finally figured out what the real, because it was just rumor upon rumor, you actually have to do to get that. Nobody knew. Now I think they do. But still, it would be like, I didn't figure it out over a life, and then finally at the very end, I got there, and it's like, I can, I can go now. Like, it's complete. One can spend all their days trying to get the family picture in Harvest Moon, and it would not be a wasted life. Exactly what I'm saying. All right, let's move on to number nine. Number nine. I put Splatoon. Splatoon. Once again, this is a game that we got early access to from Nintendo, and I was like, what the what is this game? It made no sense to me. Yeah. Um, and I, this is the only multiplayer game that I have on this list. Um, I put so many hours into the multiplayer, the online multiplayer of that game. I'm not one to care much. Like, I played Call of Duty, I played a little Halo, I've done those games. I never get that much into them. But Splatoon captivated me and held me tight for a long time, and I had so much fun, just pure fun playing that game. And this is one of the ways that, um, after I got married, and then my brother got married, and we stopped seeing each other as much, and then eventually Landon stopped, um, doing the podcast and the channel as well, and I really kind of lost connection with him. That game is one that we both loved, and we would play, and we would co-op. And I, it was a really fun way for me as I was getting older, and, you know, life was doing, you know, our, my life was going as the way it does, you know, away from my childhood and, you know, some family and friends, and I start losing touch with people. Um, but this game was able to like, um, was a way for me and Landon to kind of reconnect and have some fun. Especially when the kids were younger, they couldn't do anything yet. Now they're older, and I, I haven't played Splatoon with Landon in years. Um, but this is one of those games that, like, our wives could play it too, and it was legitimately fun, and everybody can contribute. Christa is quite good at the game. She's actually very good. She would do the roller, and she was good. And it, it really was a fun time. Um, I have nothing but good memories associated with Splatoon. Absolute blast. And it was a surprise to me because I was very confused by that game at first, and it ended up on my top 10 list. Yeah. That's, that's a, that's a good pick. I actually don't think I've played one minute of. You, I don't think I've played it at all. Watch you guys playing it, but I have not played it myself. It's so much fun. And this will be a theme of my list, and it has been for the lists I've done in the past on the channel. Um, I pretty much play single player games. That's about it. Um, me too. Mostly. If there's some co-op element, I'll get into that, but not usually the competitive online stuff. It's just not my thing. Splatoon pulled me into that world of other people for a few minutes, and that was, yeah, that was nice. All right, number nine for me is Dark Souls. Dark Souls. See, that's one I have. I have not played one minute. Dark Souls. Yeah. This, this, this was interesting because this game launched right at, at the same time as Skyward Sword and Skyrim. Oh, yeah. 2011. It was one of those games where it's like, this kind of, I don't want to say unknown, but at least like not yet like super popular developers, FromSoftware. Right. They had made Demon's Souls right before. They made Demon's Souls before, and I had, I had already played that, right? Yeah. Um, so I kind of already knew about them and the style of game this was going to be. And, uh, I, what's funny is I did not get Demon's Souls. For anybody who has had the experience of like coming into a FromSoftware game and it's real, real frustrating at first, and maybe you don't finish it, and you put it down, but then maybe you pick up another one or pick up the game again later, and all of a sudden, there's just a moment where it clicks, and you just get the game, and all of a sudden you're playing it, and now you're making progress, and you're having fun, and it's just, it just starts working. So sometimes that, that moment takes a while to work up to. So for me, the initiation to the click, which happened in Dark Souls, was my Demon's Souls playthrough that I never finished. So Demon's Souls was the hard thing that got you into it, and then Dark, like, holy crap, dude, I, I just can't get, I can't progress. It's too hard. I gave up on Demon's Souls. I play Dark Souls, it clicks, then I go back to Demon's Souls and beat it over and over and over, and I love it. Oh, nice. So anyways, there was something about the moment where that clicked. There was just like this, this like, you have horse blinders on, and then all of a sudden, like, just the possibilities just like open up. You're like, wait a second, hold up. I could do this, or this, or this, or this. I could try it this way. I could do this build. Like, and you just dive into all of its possibilities, and you try a million different ways of going about challenges, and all of a sudden, it's just like, the game becomes amazing. Just amazing. Um, and there's something about that, you know, kind of grim dark fantasy world that the FromSoftware games do, that they just, they, they have this really unique way of going about it. They tell their stories through. And, and this is something, uh, the director has talked about. He would read like fantasy novels in English, and so there's a certain element of he's not necessarily totally fluent in English, so he's not quite picking up on everything. So he has to like, you know, just try to piece the story together as best you can with like jigsaws of what he understands. That's pretty cool. And that's the approach to how storytelling is done in games like Dark Souls. You're, you're reading the descriptions of a weapon you just picked up, or of a suit of armor you just picked up off a dead body, and you get these little hints, and, and you're trying to like piece the whole thing together. And so, it, it's a game where exploration is key, and exploration is the storytelling. You're rewarded through your exploration by finding things that will give you more context to the story. And that just is such like a Pandora's box of mystery that you almost never can, like, because it's left so vague on purpose, so people can create theories and debate them online, and nobody knows like what the real answer is. And so, there's a, there's a, a profound depth to the mystery of those games. And in particular, for me, Dark Souls, which I've played over and over and over again, that it, it allows you to come back, and you always get something else out of it. The, the unsolved mystery is what you'll remember in the end. That's beautiful. Um, also speaking of him reading a book, learning a new language, um, the experience of learning a new language is also one of slogging through difficulties after difficulties, and then all of the sudden, it just clicks. It's that same type of process. And boom, I wasn't fluent yesterday, I am fluent today. I don't know what happened. I might have just been a millisecond too slow in my understanding, and finally that just hit the right point. Um, it could be all sorts of things, but it's that same type of experience of learning a new language. That's very cool. Yeah. All right, number eight. Number eight. This is a game that I first watched my brother play, and I did not play it at first. But the concept of wielding a sword that was sharp on both ends. This is before Star Wars Episode One, by the way. Actually, no, this is about the same year. But I believe, okay, I don't know which came first. They both came out around the same time. But the, the concept of a dual blade, of a dual wielding blade, blade was very cool to me. That's not the only reason I like this game, but it is one of the things I remember from it. Um, and the intro. The intro to this game is, I find, just incredible. It's one of the best intros to any game. It might be the best intro to a game that I've ever seen. Um, certainly one of. And the intro, you, if you get the intro right, I will follow you wherever you go. And, and if you can wrap it up in a reasonable enough way that justifies the intro that you promised at the beginning, like, like I'm with you there. And this game was able to do that. And I will now name it. Final Fantasy 9. Oh, is number eight on my list. Um, I, I cannot get the intro of that game out of my head, no matter what I do. This is one of the games that I just had a blast playing when I was younger, and that is a game that I'll continue to play through the rest of my life. And also one that I was very pleasantly surprised to find out that my wife actually loves as well. It's her favorite Final Fantasy. And so, this is, this, that when it from when it first came out until now, um, I feel like the game still holds up. It's not just the. No, even playing it now. I couldn't quite say the exact same for Breath of the Wild, but I can say that for FF9. That game is wonderful. And I look forward to when we review this game and analyze it on the podcast at whatever, whenever we do it. Um, that it, it only can go up from here. I don't think this game can, can fall down. It's, it's that good. It, it deserves a solid place in the top 10. Yeah. Uh, just adding to that, um, I really love the, the sort of Sakaguchi-led FFs, this being one of them, particularly because, kind of his big main, how he handles intros. I think he just, that's one of the things he's best at as a storytelling writer. He's really good at introductory sequences, and FF9 is just magical. It's, it's magical in all the right ways. It's, he, it's, it's swashbuckling. It's like, it's not just, yes, it's hilarious. It's got good stakes. There's a play, but there's like, there's also, and then there's some trickery as well, where you kind of don't know what's going on or how things are. Oh, that's what they're doing. Um, and there, there's depth there, which is wonderful. But also, it just has it all, right? It's got the, the romance, it's got the intrigue, it's got the politics, it's got the, the humor. It, it just has everything packed into this intro sequence that introduces me to some characters that I really like and don't ever stop liking throughout the entire game. Some of the most beloved characters that I've ever been introduced to in my life are from FF9. Kina being one of them. Hilarious. What a great character. But also Steiner, just, just, he's just him. And he, he is so, he is such an an interesting character. He never breaks. Like, he, you know what to expect from Steiner. You always know what you're going to get. He's loyal to a fault, sometimes. But he's like Samwise Gamgee, almost in a lot of ways. I love that. And then of course, Aden and Garnet, and just everybody. That that game had a perfect cast, perfect intro, and, uh, a good ending. We'll just put it that. But there's a reason why it's eight and not number one. Yeah. But the ending was good enough to justify, in my opinion, the entire thing as a whole being on the top 10. Number eight for me is The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time. Ocarina of Time. Yes. Uh, this is a really special game for me. Um, it's actually not my favorite Zelda game technically, but it is going to go ahead of my favorite Zelda game on this list again because of impact at the time, right? Okay. Okay. I would not be sitting here talking to you right now if I had not played The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time when I did. Yeah. It's one of two games on this list that essentially cemented my absolute passion for the art form of games. And, and it's what made me realize they are an art. Because I had played video games for many years before this game came out. We had an N64 at home. I went to my cousin and my friend's house to play Super Nintendo. I played Tecmo Super Bowl. I played, you know, Ninja Turtles games because I was obsessed with that. Turtles in Time, dude. You know, I played Mario. Yeah. None of that presented to me a story with characters, with a world that I could get lost in. Because I was already a big fan of fantasy as a genre. Yeah. Um, my mother read fantasy stories to us as when I was a child. So I, I loved fantasy literature already. And I loved fantasy films like The NeverEnding Story, The Dark Crystal, and several others. And so I already had a passion for that. But I had never encountered a video game that sort of like presented something like that to me. The hero's journey, sort of like archetype. Yeah. And so the Christmas in which we got the N64, each of us in the family got three games, or got one game, so, so three total. My little brother got like Yoshi's Story. No, no, it was Mario Kart. Mario Kart 64. Yoshi's Story was the next year. Um, I got Kobe Bryant's NBA Courtside. Yeah, of course. Because that's it. Yeah, of course. And my older brother, yeah, my older brother got GoldenEye. And, uh, my father was so, so disgusted by the level of violence that was on the screen as we were going around shooting each other in GoldenEye that he forced us to take the game back and return it. And I didn't go with my brother to the game store to return the game. And so I didn't, it was his game. He got to pick what was next. He got to pick the replacement. And he picked Ocarina of Time. And that could not have been a more fateful decision. That was not even made by me. That's wild for my life. Say there were more powers at work than, um, again, just an absolutely magical experience. Much like Harvest Moon that mentioned earlier, where I got obsessed with it, just totally obsessed. And this is part of the reason why it's no longer my favorite Zelda game, because I've kind of ruined the magic by playing it so, so, so much that there's nothing left for me there. Got you know what I mean? Like, I really like to replay stuff. And, and the one of the reasons I like doing that is because I discover something else about it each time. Okay. And I have played The Legend of Zelda, this is not an exaggeration, I promise, probably 70 times from beginning to end. Something in that range. It's a lot. Um, and most of those times happened in the year in which we got the game. It was like at least 40 times in that year. I just replayed it and replayed it and replayed it and replayed it. It, it absolutely just yanked me by the collar into that world of Hyrule, and I could not leave. Um, I just read for the first time, The Ever Story, the novel, which is funny that I loved that film all growing up, never read the novel. Read the book. Um, there is a little bit, and I'm not going to say anything to spoil, because the first half of the movie, or of the book, is what's covered in the movie. The movie only covers the first half of the story. The second half, I never knew. And so there's something about the going into that fantasy world and losing yourself in there that I, I feel like I had some parallels specifically with this game. It's just like, my life was Zelda. And you could even talk to my mom about it. Not that you ever met my mom, but you could. And she would just, just tell you how obsessed I was, almost unhealthily, with this game. Um, but it, it was, it was the first time the hero's journey, which is an archetype for storytelling that I've always, and every, you know, everybody does to some degree, but for me, especially, absolutely loved. The Odyssey was another story growing up. My kids are captivated by the, just, yeah, same in the same way, just inspired me so incredibly that those were the first times in my life I, I wanted to be a storyteller. I wanted to write something myself. Right. So this was me being able to participate in something like that. I was the hero. I was the one going on the journey. I was the one vanquishing the monsters and facing the dragons. And, and, and that was like, oh my gosh, this is what a video game can do. This is how a video game can make me feel. I'm obsessed. I'll never stop playing them. Like, this is amazing. Right? Like, again, sort of like a, a world opening up where it was like, this is just, this is something I had no idea was possible. That, or that games were doing. And, yeah, inspired me in ways I can't even freaking describe. So that's my number eight. Well, well deserved. Number seven. Number seven. It's funny that you put Ocarina of Time as number eight, because I put Wind Waker as number seven. Wind Waker is a game that was an absolute blast for me. And it, it, it converted me to being okay with the serene, slow-paced, like movement progression pace of a game as you're moving from one island to the next. I remember for most games, it's like, I like Ocarina of Time when you have, at the very beginning, when you get out of Kokiri Forest, and you have to make it all the way across that big, long, it's not that big, but at the time I was like, this is the biggest game ever. Go across Hyrule Field, and then you can, usually some people can kind of game the system a little, but usually you don't make it into the castle in time unless you turn backwards, you backflip the way, or side jump. For some reason, Link runs faster backwards than forwards. I, I don't know. Actually, that's true. You don't even have to back look, you just literally run backwards. Yeah. But if you, if you play the way game the way it's meant to be played, you don't make it there in time. It's so long. And I remember enjoying it, maybe the first time I played it, where it's like, oh, cool, there's a flying pineapple with like swords. It's going to come kill me. Um, but I didn't quite, um, love, I don't love that part of the game. Each time I play it now. Hyrule Field isn't quite as magical to me as the ocean in Wind Waker. It is the serenity, the music, and just sometimes I would actually get disappointed when I saw the island pop up on the horizon, and I'm thinking, oh man, it's over. The joy of me sailing and looking for treasure, and the big swells of the ocean, and the nighttime when the music is gone, and it's just me and the wind and the waves. It was a way for me to experience some simulacra of like nature when I was a kid and just wanted to be inside and play video games all the time. And it, it delivered to me an experience vicariously of, I don't live near an ocean. We, we lived in the mountains, like, you know, Denver, Arizona, and Utah. We never really lived in a place where I could just sit and listen to the beach. But Wind Waker gave me that vicarious experience through the game in a way that was just absolutely magical. It's something that even to this day, when I play the game, I, we have, we got the, um, the HD remake, and it comes with a quick sail. Yes. So that you can get that sailing nonsense over complaint. And the wind thing, you don't have to do the song, it just, the wind changes whenever you want it to. Um, and that is not what I'm referring to when I say that Wind Waker, I'm talking about the base game from 2002. Is, is not what was promised at the game dev's conference that one year. It is better. Yeah. And it, the graphics are still great even today, because they chose to go with a more cartoony style. Um, everything about that game, it's funny, it's witty, it's fun, it's got a great intro, it delivers very well at the end. Um, the story gets bigger the more you progress. Um, but the thing I remember most about it is sailing on the seas. Yeah. I, I actually love that take, because it's so funny how I think overstated the boring traveling between islands is, and it's almost my favorite part. Yeah. Always has been. Like, the discovery. I remember, this is a really funny story, and it's tangent a bit, but so my brother, my older brother, uh, we were playing Wind Waker, and we had to take turns. I'm sure you guys also had to do. Oh, yes. 30 minutes, 30 minutes. And Mom, there's no safe point. So he's playing the game, and he doesn't realize that he has to get the sail to get to the next island, right? So, you know how you can, you can hold R to like, very slowly, like progress across the ocean. My brother, the r just kind of goes, oh my God. My brother went all the way from like, that island to the next, just slowly crossing without the sail. Great. That is so funny. I do remember watching your brother play games, because he doesn't do this anymore, but at the time, he's one of the people who would just skip the dialogue. He would just, and I'm not reading that. They make it very clear you need a sail, man. Go get the sail. He made it all the way, all the way across to the other island, and then obviously had to end up going back to the same exact way to get the sail. This game sucks. Oh my gosh. Oh, man. Really, really. Okay. Amazing. Hilarious story. From there's a, there's a happy medium. There's a happy medium. You don't want to be too slow. But my controversial hot take for this episode is that fast travel ruins games. Yeah. And it ruins the immersion and the experience of the game. Dude, and avoided it where, where possible. I was in Vegas at the time that Oblivion released. So Oblivion came out five or 0. It was 06. 06 was when I when I left. So I was there. And we went into somebody's house, and he was playing Oblivion, and I just sat there, jaw open, like, oh my gosh. I got, I got when I come home, I'm playing this first thing I do. And I, what I told myself was, I refuse to fast travel. I am going to roleplay this. Yes. In, in such a way to where this magical fast travel doesn't exist. I have to actually walk. I have to prepare myself correctly when I decide to leave. Am I really ready? Is this really the best path to take? Um, fast forward, I didn't end up doing that. But I set out to do that for. And I have this, I feel the same sentiment. Like, there's a happy medium. There's a happy medium between the two. Um, and, and, and slowly ruting your way across that's, that's obviously unacceptable way to play the game. But it was very funny. Yeah. All right, number seven for me is Hyper Light Drifter. Um, we just did, I feel, a really solid podcast episode. Yeah. On Hyper Light Drifter. Um, if you, uh, would like to please go check that out to get like our full thoughts on it. That might be my favorite podcast we've ever done, actually. I, I think it turned out really, really good. Um, but this has become, at this stage in my life, in adulthood. So now we've moved from the childhood sort of like games that initiated me into the world of games, and why into what do I appreciate now when I play a game? And a lot of times it sort of or orbits this idea of facing one's own mortality or death. Yeah. And the way that Hyper Light Drifter approaches that topic is beautiful without saying a single word. Not one word. That's crazy. And it is able to present that existential dread, that struggle against sort of resisting, you know, the, the fear, fight against nature, and the eventual acceptance, and the beauty of that moment, in a way to which I won't get into now, but if you follow our podcast, or if you go back, you will hear it in, in other, in that, in other episodes. My own experiences. Yeah. In a way that just reflected so beautifully that entire conflict that every human being has to come face to face with at some point. You don't have a choice. It's coming for you, right? And whether you choose to deal with it as a young person, or an old person, when you don't have a choice, or somewhere unexpectedly in between, right? Nonetheless, you will face this moment. And what will you do when it comes? And, uh, that for me, I think is really beautifully illustrated in just the most creative, artistic ways, visually and with sound, because there's no dialogue in the game. He can't. Uh, so Alex Preston, the sort of like creator of the game, we'll call him that, although there are many collaborative, co-creative process. Co-creative process. Yeah. The way that he presents that from his own experiences of dealing with, basically, he's had to face his own mortality since he was a young child, since he was a baby. Yeah. Many times. General heart disease, born with this in hospitals his whole life. He has some real life experience with it that just bleeds through the atmosphere of this game in a way that just washed over me, and I just can't say enough good about it. It is a beautiful game. Beautiful. He has a wisdom beyond his years because of that. 100%. Yeah. Um, so I made my list, and I was like, I'm missing a game. There's a game I'm missing. And I went through, I was like, we did a podcast, and I know we did. And I went through a list of all of the podcasts we've done. That was a one-off episode. It doesn't have a playlist for that episode other than playlist. So I was like, well, I guess, I guess not then. And I forgot about that game. I knew I was missing a game. Um, and that was it. And I, it's not on my list. It's too bad. That's too late. Ref, ref, can I, can I get a change? Okay. Okay. Well, um, hats off to you for remembering the game. I, it's like one of my favorite games. Why do I not remember it? But when it comes down to it, whenever I have to think about my favorite games, like hundreds of games, I'm just going through all of them, and I'm just like, oh, which one, which one? And I'm, I'm obviously, I'm forgetting some. Um, I think I said in the podcast for that game that it was one of my favorite games ever. Um, but here's, here's the thing. Number 11 and 12 and 13 and 14 are all also one of my favorite games. Yeah. Right. Boy, to 10's really hard, right? But that was a specific game where I was like, ah.

Well, hopefully it wasn't an important one. It was an important one, that was it. Um, but congrats to you for remembering. Um, great podcast, by the way. I absolutely loved it.

Number six. Number six, I have Final Fantasy 10. Now, Final Fantasy 10 is above Final Fantasy 9 for one reason, and that is because we did a podcast on it where I dove so deep into it. Um, Final Fantasy 10 probably would not have made my top 10 list before our podcast, um, deep dive into that game. Uh, it was good. I liked it. I enjoyed it. Maybe top 30, top 40. It's a good game. It's a well-made game. I appreciated it. I played it well after its time, though. I didn't play it until maybe 2015 for the first time, 2017 maybe. Um, so I didn't get the early experience that a lot of people did when it was the, the new Final Fantasy of 2001 or something like that. Um, but that was mind-blowing, absolutely mind-blowing. That's what I heard. Voice acting and the graphics. Had a buddy who had it, and I just went to his house like every day to play Final Fantasy 10. So I didn't get that. And so when I played it, I was like, wow, this is, this is a good, this is a good, solid, solid game. You know, I'm glad I played it. But upon further analysis through our podcast, I came to find a deeper appreciation for FF10 than I thought I ever would, and that I thought was even possible. Um, the way that all of the artists of the game kind of came together to tell a story through the art, through the clothings, through the buildings, through the islands, through the water, through the, the way people speak their language, the invention of like the, uh, kind of crypto. It's not like a new language per se, but it's, you know, sort of, yeah, the poor man's new language. But, but, but, and Alexander Smith actually had a lot to do with that. That was fascinating to find that out. Um, but the, the culture, you know, and then a lot of the themes and, and the, the, the different, the way everything kind of meshes together to, to present to me this world that not only did I find believable, um, you know, within the fantasy setting that in which it's presented, um, but that I like. Look, you know, that initial time when Tidus does the little laughing contest with Yuna, I didn't like it at first. Yes. And upon watching it again, I love it now. And it's, it's only because like, it's, it's so easy to just kind of play these games and take everything at face value. I don't blame anybody. Like, most people have a Steam backlog of 300 games, right? It's like, you don't have time to deeply analyze every game you play. So, all right, so be it. If you, you thought it was weird, move on with your day, go play your next game. But if you're willing to give certain times and certain moments in games that maybe came across a little awkward, often I've realized that if you try to dig down into maybe the artist's intent or, or to maybe, um, to, to try to really understand the character, maybe on a deeper level, instead of just however you understood it the first time you played the game, um, I've often found that things come across a little bit differently, and the subtlety, the nuance of that particular scene actually is something that I enjoy now that I never used to enjoy before. Now, there's a little awkwardness with the spacing of this. Is it was the for first fully voice-acted game? Like the way that lines are delivered, there are awkward pauses. That's going to happen. And part of that, we actually learned the reason. Yes, the frames. When we talked to Alexander O. Smith, one of the translators, could technical audio engineering reason why that is. And it's, it's so unbelievable, I don't even want to think about it. But, but I gain an appreciation for Final Fantasy 10. That it, it is what it is. Number six. It is my sixth favorite game of all time. Um, now, after having done our analysis, and, you know, if any of you want to watch it, go check it out. Yeah, you know, that podcast series we did was also, I think, one of our best and one of my favorites. So we did, particularly because of the appreciation for FF10 it gave me. I always liked FF10. Yeah, me too. Um, all the way going back to my first time playing it. It was never my favorite Final Fantasy game, and it like shot up the list when we did that analysis. There was so much there that I had never picked up on before, so much there to, to really chew on and to really implement into your own life. And so much I learned from you just from breaking down, like this, the symbolism in the game that was just like, wow, wow, wow, wow, wow. They thought about this on a level I did not give them credit for. Exactly. In the past. And, um, yeah, it, it opened my eyes again. Another example of those blinders coming off and like a whole world opening up. And that came from our, how, how many episodes was that? It was more than 20. It was like, close to 20 episode breakdown we did on FF10. Um, yeah, it, it, it definitely gave me a way, way bigger appreciation for it. But it is not my number six. It's so stupid that I'm going to have to give a disclaimer right away when I give this for why this isn't higher. Okay? But you should know better. Those who would complain, I know what Mike's going to say. It's Xeno Gears. Xeno Gears is number six on the list for me. And the only reason that it is not all the way at the top is because it has, and everyone knows it has, extremely rough edges. Um, that does not hold it back in terms of my appreciation for its story and its themes. It only holds it back for I have to actually navigate this dungeon. I have to actually play this to get to the part I want to see. And, uh, dungeons in particular, I think can be poorly designed. The whole second disc is, you know, approached in a way that I don't have the same disdain for that other people do. I kind of like this too. But it's still kind of a shock to you're not really playing this game anymore. You're kind of reading it at this point. Um, so there's a lot of repetition in the combat. You know, there are just certain gameplay elements again that hold that I have to like, I can't ignore those things and say I find this to be a better game than what I've put ahead of it. But goodness gracious, did it change my life in terms of the way that I view the world and the way that I view myself and the way I view the people in my life and the way I look at everything. Um, the, there are no words that I can say, even in 21 episodes of a podcast that we, that we were doing longer, we were talking for 4 hours plus, trying to put words to how absolutely profound this story is. And none of those words, however many we spoke, can actually really put it into, to the correct context to explain how I felt, even the first time playing it where I didn't get it at all. Like, right? I was sitting there like, literally like fighting with myself in my initial videos, trying to like work through, like, how do I feel about this, right? Like, I could not put, I could not figure it out because I was, I was trying to with the rational mind be like, look at all these frustrating things and all this stuff that doesn't make sense and how the, what the fetch is this? And the, the other side, the non-rational part, the unconscious part, that is saying, you can't resist how much you love this. You just can't. You, you can sit here and try to like point at all these reasons for why that there, there's actually a ton of problems with this, and yet it will still be swallowed up by this intuitive sense that there is actually something here that you cannot deny that makes this one of the best games of all time. And that is somehow something that Takahashi and Soraya Saga and everyone else who was involved in the project captured. There is just something underneath what you can explain because it's a universal thing. I feel like in all human beings that we can just tap into and get that just absolutely touches your heart. And then when you begin exploring the inspirations, the references, and start learning from the, the people that inspired the game, the scientists, the psychoanalysts, the, uh, philosophers, you start reading their stuff, all of a sudden you start understanding what's going on here. And it just, again, opens up this whole freaking world you never knew before and changes your life. It's amazing. Xeno Gears. Well, shame on you for putting at number six. It's not high enough. That's all I have to say. We'll get into my thoughts on Xeno Gears later. We'll just put it that way. All right. Um, so my number five here is a video game called Outer Wilds. Ooh. This game. Um, shame on you for not putting this higher. I'll get to my thoughts on Outer Wilds later. I, this game, this game confused me at first, um, and quickly became very endearing. Now, I understand that you have this higher than I do. Um, and with good reason. I share all of your same sentiments there. Mhm. But childhood nostalgia is a difficult thing to overcome. So, you know, we'll see as the list progresses. Um, but this game, without fighting and killing people, as we mentioned, we try to, you know, maybe show more interest in games that are trying to do things a little differently than games have been for the past 40 years. Um, Outer Wilds does that to a beautiful degree and incorporates themes that amongst all of the silliness and the maybe simplicity of like the, the, the way that the game, the way that the characters act, or the duct tape ships, and the, the kind of treehouse kind of, I'm playing in my backyard aesthetic that the game has, um, that almost makes the depths of the thematic material in the game all the more profound. It is, it is absolutely going to, to touch your heart and change your mind and change your life in ways that you would not expect. And upon thinking about it even more, the fact that it's introduced to you in such a light-hearted, childlike manner is actually perfect. Um, everything works together so perfectly. The characters are just wonderful. Once again, like Sam Gamgee type people here, like, like just salt of the earth, wonderful people. Maybe not always the deepest thinkers, but just great people that I feel like I was able to know because the trees are pretty elaborate, you know, you can have pretty lively conversations with people in this game, and I felt like I got to know a lot of them extremely well. Um, and the game is certainly one that opened my mind even more and changed my life in some pretty profound ways. And also kind of brought this new, this new kind of way of analyzing things going forward that it has some really ancient symbolism in it that I find absolutely fascinating. And upon further review, a lot of games have that same thing. And Outer Wilds was the first one that without even explicitly pointing out, kind of showed me the, the beauty of this type of mystery, right? And what it means to actually, like, to be initiated into a mystery or something like that, and what it means, and especially its connection with something like mortality and what the world is all about, you know? And I'm not saying it answers those questions. We just talked about this in Alan Wake. It's not about answering the question. It's about posing a question that the, through the frame of which you can then apply to your life and, you know, maybe apply some constraints to the way that you, you know, approach things. And it ends up kind of presenting itself as, as a mystery, but one that you are willing to give yourself to instead of try to pick apart and find out the answer to. And this game does that brilliantly. Yeah. I will talk more about that shortly. All right. Um, number five for me is The Witcher 3. See, I, um, I never played that. You, you haven't played it yet. This will, this will someday be a podcast that we do. It's so hard to know how to approach The Witcher. Do we have to do the first ones? The thing is, I, I think you, I think we should. I think we should play them in order. And we should probably, and read some of the books. I really feel like I would suggest you read the novels too. Well, I tell you what, the audiobooks are very well performed, very compelling. Very, very compelling. I might learn Polish though. Um, that could give you a reason to read. Never wanted to learn Polish before. I don't know. I might need a little more than just The Witcher to get me to learn Polish. Yeah. Um, The Witcher 3. Um, here's this doesn't just apply to three. It applies to anything. The Witcher outside of the Netflix series, season one was okay. You know, it was okay. It was okay. No, it wasn't good enough to get me to watch season two because here's the reason why, right? The reason why I don't like the Netflix series is because it's the only Witcher property of all the ones I've engaged with that doesn't get this, okay? And that is that the compelling part about The Witcher are the philosophical witty battle of philosophies. I see that. That's what it's really centered on, right? You go through almost every story and every single time, the part of the book that is the most compelling is here was this guy against Geralt, and it was the battle of their perspective, the battle of their philosophy, the battle of their wit as to this particular difficult sort of topic that doesn't have easy answers. The Witcher is is is not compelling because he's a monster slayer and there's cool action sequences. That's that's your 12-year-old mind thinking that's why it's cool. It's it's not that. It's it's not the sexy sort of side of it where, you know, the sort of, um, you know, the, the adult rated parts where, and sort of the dating sim in the games sort of like part of it. Those parts add a sort of like tapestry of of sort of coolness and and evocative kind of like tone and atmosphere and and world. Yeah, but it is always at its most compelling when Geralt is debating some other really smart character, villain or otherwise, and they are battling philosophy. And I can just read or listen to those conversations over and over. And I have. I've read The Last Wish, I think, seven times at this point. Um, I've played The Witcher 3 five times at this point. And what The Witcher 3 captures more so than the two games before it, though they also do, is that element of what I think makes The Witcher is so special. What I look forward to are the conversations. Yeah, the conversations between the Bloody Baron and Geralt, right? The conversations between Triss and Geralt in maybe like, uh, the novels or something like that, right? Um, there's, there's just these amazing, amazing conversations that are so well written and that flip the table. I like, there will be an argument presented from a character, and I am just on board with everything they're saying. It's just making perfect sense, and it's like, the dude is right, he's right. And then Geralt will come in and go, well, now I don't know anymore. And like, they just, that's just incredible. The way not only Sapkowski is able to do that in the novels, but the way that the game creators were able to carry that into the game in a very real sense, really. And so, yeah, I, I love, you know, the fantasy setting and the politics and the characters and the cool monsters. All that's great, but that's all window dressing. That is sort of like drawing you into like the real heart of what those games and those stories do, which is get you to think and rethink some of your own assumptions, misconceptions, bad perceptions, bad arguments. Mhm. And, and, and do a better job at like forming your own moral foundations. And so for me, uh, that's the biggest appeal to The Witcher and why I love it so much. I didn't know The Witcher 3 went too far into the literary side of things like that. Amazing. Oh, it's like literally the reason to play the game. It's not the best. It's not the best open world ever. It's not the best combat ever. Certainly. It's, it's, it's not like the most compelling plot in terms of like interesting things happening. It is all in those one-on-one moments between Geralt and another character where they're talking about things that make you go, I'm not really sure. I got to think about that more. What do I think about that? Very cool. Yeah, very cool. All right, number four. On number four, I have The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time. This, this game ranks so high because of the nostalgia. It's powerful, man. It's a good game. And it hit me. I mean, we're about the same age, so it hit me right when it hit you. And, um, also my older brother got it, not me. We actually got it in '98 before I had moved to Arizona, so I hadn't quite, um, met you yet. But it was one of the last games we played before I moved from Colorado to Arizona. And that move, it's so funny because when I look back on that move, all I really remember from the last few months of me living in Colorado at the time is that N64 games that we were playing. It's Banjo-Kazooie. Literally the same. Because we moved to Arizona around the same time. So yeah, I had played it in that year leading up to that move. Yeah, that's where I got obsessed. We got the gold cartridge for Zelda because Landon was way into it. I had the poster of Link up on my wall over my bed. The one I had two of them. We had the one of him with the arrow, and then the other one where he's like holding his sword up and there's all the monsters below him, and he was like getting ready to fight him. I spent so much time daydreaming about Link from Ocarina of Time. Um, and unlike you, I had played A Link to the Past. So my first entry into the, um, Legend of Zelda was actually A Link to the Past. And the hype for Ocarina of Time was real in '97 when we had Nintendo Power and everything. So we were subscribed to the magazine, we saw those first initial updates for a Zelda 64, they were calling it, and just like, oh my gosh, the, the graphical leap from A Link to the Past to Ocarina of Time is just insane. You will never get that again because, you know, what, what Zeno's Paradox, the, the, uh, marginal gains in graphical processing power don't yield as wide of a leap as they used to, right? Uh, back in the '90s. And so, but I always, I loved Link from A Link to the Past, but he looked weird, you know, he kind of had pink hair, and he had the shield and the sword, and he just looked like a little, a little runt, just kind of like trying to make his way in the world, poke, poke, poke. And my imagination was doing a lot of work there. I still loved it, but I was like, I want this game but with a better character that looks like cooler, who looks cool. And then Nintendo Power was like, hey, here's the next Zelda. Tell, I think that's exactly the sentiment or feedback they must have heard because that was kind of the whole concept behind making Link an adult. Yes. Not keeping him a kid the whole time. Yeah, yeah. I think that was kind of what drove that. And I didn't even know about Adult Link other than, well, I sort of did, I suppose, because Nintendo Power shows Adult Link in that screenshot. But when you play the game, it's like, okay, maybe they changed things or whatever. And the fact that you became an adult, even though I saw it in the posters, I was just kind of confused, like, where's the, where's the cool belt on the shoulder? Like, I'm missing something here. And then the time skip happens, and the whole game just opens up again in the coolest, coolest way. Um, Ocarina of Time, I got so much mileage out of. Um, but without Ocarina of Time, you know, the other games on the list also aren't, is it like Wind Waker? You know, I don't, you need, you kind of need that foundation. Ocarina of Time needs, even though it wasn't the first Zelda, it has to be the foundation basically for all the Zelda. Well, it's the foundation for the 3D versus the 2D distinction between of the Wild. They still, still kept to it, like fairly faith. I mean, it does advance it or evolve it. It does, but like, there are obviously some very foundational started with Ocarina of Time that that still kind of remain. And Wild, they got it right on their first try making a 3D game, right? And it's like Nintendo, they got some geniuses over there. But a lot of companies really weren't hitting it like nailing it on the 3D side, especially as games started moving into that era. It was like, there was some weird stuff going on. Ocarina of Time had none of it. It was well-polished. It was such a good game. And just like what you said before, it introduced me to the hero's journey in a way, in a fantasy medieval setting that for whatever reason, just applies, like, just fascinates me. And most people, specifically boys, like something about a knight with a sword in medieval times is just, that's what young boys look up to. I don't know why. In a thousand years, they'll still idolize the medieval time period. I think the fantasy settings will still have that. Um, but Ocarina of Time just kind of took a lot of what was good and beautiful about those fantasy worlds and put it into this game with this Japanese flavor to it that I absolutely love. Um, a lot of these early games, not only served to get me into gaming and to thinking, you know, building my imagination, just letting it run wild, but also served as just subtle, um, stepping stones, subtle entry blocks into J, Japanese, which I eventually ended up learning and, you know, visiting and all of that stuff. You know, a big part of my life is Japanese and Japan and stuff from Japan. And a lot of these early games from the '90s, um, they served two purposes, not only to introduce me to new cultures and languages, but also the game itself is just so, so dang good. Yeah, so like Harvest Moon, like that as well. But a lot of these games, man, that Japanese undertones just really fascinated me. Yeah. Um, number four for me. It's funny that you picked Ocarina of Time because I, my thoughts on it sort of piggyback off of that. Okay, because that sort of like introduced me into this world of gaming I didn't realize was there. Oh, this is the type of thing I can have. The next one was like a springboard to take it to the next level. Okay? And that was Final Fantasy 7. Final Fantasy 7, dude. So I have a lot of really good memories specifically with you in regards to this game, cuz we played it a little late. We play it. So I played the PC version. PC, cuz we didn't have PlayStation. So I had the PC version. And you could go into like the file hierarchy for the game's installation and you could find all the cut scene movies, watch them. And I spoiled the crap out of myself for this game by watching all the cut scene movies because holy fetch. Yeah, like that was, anyone who, who in the modern age looks back on Final Fantasy 7 and talks about how, oh, it looks so weird graphically. And there, there I think there's almost this like, uh, false memory going on where people like said they imagined. Say what? Like FF7 Remake looks like. Oh yeah, no, this was top of the fetching line graphics. It was unbelievable. And that was the reason we were watching these movies. We were like, dude, what the heck? Looks so real, right? And so we're just watching them, captivated. And then of course, you're going to come across some of the biggest spoilers in the game in those cut scenes. But like, whatever. Like it was so sick. Spoiled. You spoiled so much for me when I came over. But honestly, without those spoilers, I wouldn't have, I wouldn't have, um, been as interested to play the game. I was like, whoa, I want to know what led up to that. Like, that's crazy. Can I borrow this game? And you let me borrow your PC version, which is how I experienced the game at the first time as well. Yeah. Um, so again, going back to Zelda, Zelda gave me this sense like I could go into another world. I could go be the hero. That never story, like the kid goes into the world of the book, right? Like I went into the world of the game and explored it, and it was just like amazing. But Final Fantasy 7 was like, this is next level for plot, right? And characters and like dialogue and writing and just captivating, captivating stuff. There. Theme, R, philosophy, theme. Yeah. Theme and philosophy and music. Just like, oh my goodness. That's right. It's just, it, that bombing mission run, the music, how it, how it goes from that ethereal sort of like harp that brings you in and strings where, where, well, at the beginning, you actually have something more. It sounds actually more like, you know, when NASA will publish, like, this is what this planet sounds like, they actually, yes, yes. Or like what a black hole or a galaxy sounds like, right? They get like the waveform and then they interpret it in sound and you listen to it. That's, it's, that's almost where it starts. And just looking at the stars, right? And then it comes right into that string to introduce Aerys, and then you pull out and you, and you get the title theme, that bombastic, and then right into that unbelievably exciting opening sequence with the train pulling in and the bombing mission. That intro is something. That intro is possibly the best video game intro of all time. It's, it's just, it does not get better than that to me. I, I, I, so I did also did not get this game for Christmas. This was a game my brother got for Christmas that I ended up liking his game way more than mine. My game was not as good as his. Twice now. Um, almost. I think that was back to back. It was, it was so Final Fantasy 7 came out before Ocarina of Time in '97, but I didn't play it then. I played it on the PC version, '99. So I was a couple years late to it. And I had never heard of it before. I don't have no idea how he even got it. I didn't, I don't know. I didn't know he asked for it. I don't know how he knew about it, cuz I didn't know about it. So I'm watching him play it and I'm going, why are they taking turns kidding each other? This is the dumbest thing I've ever seen. That's, yeah, yeah. Again, kind of like that, that like fight between like my rational brain and then my unconscious that is actually loving every second of this and like trying to deny that. But like, there's something just like unconsciously grabbing me and gripping. And it's this combination of the music, the, the characters, the design, the story. And, and so I got absolutely obsessed. Um, and I think what lasted with me, though, was that this game got me thinking about the real world in a way again, that I didn't realize games did this. Yeah. I started thinking about environmentalism. I started thinking about corporate greed. I started thinking about these things in a way that I, I started for the first time in probably my life, at that young age, connecting what I was seeing in the game to what I was seeing on the news or to what I was seeing in the real world and going, wait a minute, they're, they're saying something about that. There's something similar. Yeah. And I was like, oh, wow, this applies to the world. It makes me think about the world. Right, right. And so like, that was the first experience I had where I did that with a game. And that was, it was game over. That point, if it hadn't already been game over with Zelda, it was totally game over. Whereas like, I knew this was a valuable medium for art. Like, I just knew it in my bones. And I was super, super, super passionate about it ever since. So that, that's, that's FF7. That's what FF7, man. Great, great game. Okay, we come to number three. Number three for me. This is a game that I first experienced at Incredible Universe in Colorado. My brother, I had the exact same reaction to you that you did for FF7 to this game. The questioning, why are they taking turns? My brother telling me, no, it's cool, it's like chess. And then me saying, oh yeah, I guess it's cool. And I legitimately, this is how, like, there's a theory, who was it? Um, Rene Girard has his theory of desire called the mimetic theory of desire, that you only want what you want because someone else has it and someone else wanted it and you like them, and so you want it now. I see this with my kids all the time, by the way. It's really sad because my oldest child will start playing with a toy, and just because she's playing with it, everyone else wants to play with it now too. And then we have to take turns, and she gets upset. So she plays with something else. Well, pretty soon, the first thing she played with gets boring, and now all the kids want to play with the new thing she's playing with. It's a problem. But this is how people are, right? I liked it because my brother liked it. However, there is some serious, there are reasons why my brother liked it. First of all, and there's some serious depth to the to Super Mario RPG. It is a brilliant game. Now, I talked a little bit before about Final Fantasy 9 and how the intro gives you this perfect blend of like a serious situation with some like over-the-top kind of, you know, melodrama, also the political and some intrigue. But the humor is the biggest deal. The humor of the intro to FF9 and the way the character kind of feels, maybe at the beginning at least, something of like an anti-hero type role, just kind of, you know, it lends towards just a fun adventure in a game. It's not so down and serious, you know? But it's just a blast to play. It's very fun. Um, Super Mario RPG is a blast to play, and I am happy to say that the remake does a pretty faithful job. You know what? I was, I was just thinking, one of the best experiences I've had with creating a video for YouTube was editing that video we did on the remake of Super Mario RPG. Like, it was just an absolute blast for me to sit next to you sort of playing through that. Like the passion and the joy was like infectious. Even though I don't have like childhood memories of Super Mario RPG, I didn't play it till I was probably 27. Oh, dang. Uh, actually, all the way through. And I, I like it a lot. It's a really fun, funny, um, as far as like Mario RPG games go, um, I, I love that witty, and I like the game a lot. But, but, but there's another level in terms of like the memories and and the connection to your brothers and the, the times, just the times were different. The, the going to the, the game store to demo it, Incredible Universe, right? There's just a whole context there I don't have. But, but hearing that story and watching you recount it as you were playing this remake, that is what remakes should do. That's how, what they should exist for, is for like that moment where I sat and watched you re-experience that amazing childhood memory, right? It's such a blast. And the game was my number one favorite game for a very long time. Intro, the introduction to the RPG system where there's actual strategy. The innovation on that system of timed hits, right? The way that the characters, the stories, like Mallow's story is just hilarious. It's just hilarious. The fact that he ever thought he was Frogfucius' kid is just hilarious. It's really funny. And then, and then Geno is just the coolest character in any game ever. And the saddest moment for me with the Square-Nintendo breakup in the late '90s, the saddest part of that for me was that Square retained the rights to Geno, the character, and Nintendo retained the rights to Super Mario RPG and the game and the property. And they're not friends anymore. So this cool thing that could have been, this character that could have gone on to have his own games and his own arcs, the IP got split in half. And that's why there is no Mario RPG 2. It turned into Paper Mario or, um, Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time or with the DS versions of the games and stuff. Um, it is heartbreaking. It's hard to explain the absolute heartbreak to me, especially as a kid, that like, it's like, Mom and Dad don't love each other anymore. Like, why? Just, just get back together. You guys are being stupid. This is ridiculous. Just figure it out, right? You got people who love you and who just want you to get along. Why do you have to do this? And maybe that's part of why I'm so passionate about Mario RPG is because that whole situation, it carried it out for like 20 years. Like they're friends now, I guess, but like, it's not what it used to be. Uh, they co-amicable, amicable sort of like they're back amicable terms. Yes, yes, yes. They can, they can be in the same room again. They can stand to look at each other without naming each other's faults every two seconds. Yes. But they are not married like they once were. It really felt like, like these people who helped create my childhood decided to split up. And for, for reasons that, in my opinion, do not warrant that type of reaction. Like, we're here to make good games and to play them. And, and I know there's business interests and reasons and Sony and all this stuff. I know, I know the whole, I made a whole video about it. I know the story. But that almost just fed my interest even more. This is when I started getting interested in the business aspects of things, and who made what, who is this Miyamoto guy I see at the end of every game I like, right? Who is he? Who, why, why? Um, who was that CX character? Who is this U guy? I don't even know what they're talking about, right? Well, it turns out there's a whole another series of games that I'd never heard about called Final Fantasy, and that he, it was a, it was a mix between these two games, right? And I'm thinking, this is awesome. It's sort of what kind of Square Enix maybe turned into something like Kingdom Hearts, and that they carry on forward with that. But it all started with Mario RPG, right? And that game was a collaboration of the best game makers in the world, and they collaborated on a game together. It's one of the best games ever made. And it is so sad and disappointing that very soon after that game was released, the most promising collaboration between these giants of the game making industry, that they decided, we're never doing that again. And it's, it just broke my heart. But that almost adds to the legend of Mario RPG. It adds to the drama of what that game is. And as it turns out now, the remake has outsold the original, and the game stands the test of time. They didn't even change that much for the remake. They really didn't. Basically the same game. And here it is, selling millions, even still today. That's a testament to to its greatness. Um, so SMRPG, number three, really good game, really good game. My number three, there, there's some similarities, um, in terms of its supposed or maybe on the surface level simplicity that people might question as to like, how can this be higher than something as complex and in-depth as Xeno Gears? And, we will eventually do a podcast on this game as well, and I think you will be surprised at the depth that it has. Okay, but admittedly, it's not the same type of depth. Okay. It is Chrono Trigger. Ah, yes, of course. This for a long time was my favorite game of all time. It has only recently been surpassed. It was top 10 for me for a long time as well, and it has recently dropped out of the top 10 for me, but that's because I have not played it in a long time. It still stands a chance. Are going to cover this? Yeah, I would say next year is a high possibility. Sure, that'd be great. Um, but, you know, the voters will decide. We still got FF9. That'll probably on a, on, on a poll with Chrono Trigger, okay? But there's a high likelihood we'll do this in the, in the somewhat near future. Chrono Trigger came into my life at the right time. I was real depressed. I was feeling like totally unsure about myself and what I wanted to do with my life. I was 21. So the funny thing about Chrono Trigger, I played it late again, like that. Even though it was a game I had dabbled with younger, because we played FF7, and it was like, now we got to play everything Square ever made. It was like, we're going back in the, in the, in the list here. We're playing FF6, we're playing FF4, we're playing all these other great RPGs they made, man. All the Mana games, like, but, you know, emulation was basically my only way of doing that. And for whatever reason, at the time, emulation, the experience wasn't quite there yet at that point to where it, I felt like I could just play a whole game emulated this way, okay? I can't even really explain why. It's not like they didn't have good Super Nintendo and any emulators that functioned more or less perfectly on computers from that time, but it's just weird playing it on a keyboard. We were playing on keyboards, not with controllers. Um, there were other barriers, I feel like at the time. The fact that it had to be played on a computer rather than on a TV, you know, we had to share computer time. My parents, with my parents, not just with my siblings. And so it just wasn't the optimal way to do it. And so I would dabble with it, but not complete it. So I didn't complete Chrono Trigger until the DS version released, and I got it on the DS. Very nice. Um, and I was at a crossroads just in my personal life of not knowing what I wanted to do. I had grown up, kind of like I even alluded to earlier, I want to be a writer, I want to be a storyteller, I want to be a filmmaker, I want to do something creative as a career, right? Um, I was watching a lot of other people get started on these, this just new thing, this, this internet content creator type career, and I was like, oh, I could do that. Like, but at the same time, I was in a living situation where this was greatly, greatly repressed. No, absolutely you should not do that. You need to be doing these kinds of studies. You need to get into this kind of school. And you need to do this. Like, there's a really stupid idea. And it's not like, you know, I had to do what I was being told, but I just had those voices so incessantly in my ear, telling me, abandon all those dreams you had. Like, this is the real world, and you're going to need to have a family and provide for this family, and you're going to need to live in this certain way. And I was hearing this all the time, and just confused, like confused, like, what should I do? Like, are they right? Like, should I go be a doctor or something? Something I never considered in my whole life. Should I, uh, go be a lawyer? Like, I've, I never want to be a lawyer. Like, I never, should I, you know, I was never that great at math. Should I like double down on that and become some kind of scientist or physicist or, you know, like researcher? Like, none of that was really calling to me. It actually sounded miserable. Mmm. Yeah. The very thought of doing that instead of writing a novel, right? I'm diverging a bit, but when I was in high school, I had a teacher in sophomore English class who gave an assignment to write a five-page story that incorporated all the archetypes and elements of the hero's journey. The hero's journey, yeah. And I turned in a 124-page novel. And she turned around to me and said, you are a writer. You need to be a writer. You need to publish this story. Do not lose whatever it was that made you turn this into me. This is amazing what you did. And I said, oh, I wrote this in a week and a half. Like, I, I got to make it better. It's not good enough. And I've been working on that story ever since. So coming on the back of having that kind of encouragement, that sort of like figure who like lit a fire underneath that dream, and then having that all just doused almost on a daily basis in the situation I was in, left me in a place where I was like, dude, I just don't know. But I feel miserable about what they're telling me. And then I popped Chrono Trigger into that DS, and I had never been so inspired in my life to do something creative with my career instead. Um, Chrono Trigger is an amazing game for a million reasons, not the least of which it might be technically the most well-designed game of its type that I've ever played. There is zero fat on this game. Everything is done with a purpose. Everything has a payoff. Every side quest is fun. Every gameplay element is fun. Every character is fun. Every environment you go into is fun. Like, there is not a moment of that game that is boring or frustrating or, gosh, do I really have to do this again? Nothing. It is just a smooth experience all the way through. It has my favorite soundtrack of any video game of all time. A brilliant soundtrack. Um, just absolutely lights a fire in my belly when I hear that music. It's so good. And I think there is depth to that story, though many would probably dismiss that notion, but I will reveal why that is when we do the podcast. Um, but it just absolutely inspired me in a way that very few things have. I can name them: The Odyssey when I was young, The NeverEnding Story and The Dark Crystal when I was very young, The Lord of the Rings when I was in high school, of course, Final Fantasy, Heaven, and Ocarina of Time at that specific time. And then there was kind of this, uh, Prince of Persia was one too. Yes. There's kind of this lull for a while. And then into my adulthood, this was probably the first thing that I played. I felt that level of just fire and passion and inspiration. It is, I would consider it a perfect video game. Oh, wow. I don't know if there's anything in that that I would criticize like and say, this was not executed as well as it could have been. The execution is at a higher level than anything I've ever seen. Um, there's not one complaint I have about it. And so why isn't it higher? Well, it comes down to a very specific theme, which we'll get into in the next game. But, um, Chrono Trigger's amazing. And, and lastly, there's something so captivating to me about the idea that you can see your sort of like environment where you're used to with the place you live, yeah, but 100 years ago, yeah, thousands of years ago, yeah, millions of.

Years ago in the future, yeah. What does this place look like in those different times? How has the environment you grew up in, that you formed your identity, how has that changed over these millions of years that the Earth has been around? And how will it continue to change? How will it continue to change? There's something, there's a sense of exploration in that time, yeah, yeah, that a new land has rarely been captured by anything else I've ever played. And I, I would just jump between times and just go look at the differences on the map. Yeah, that's fun, fun. Love that element of the game, so unique, so cool. So that's my Chrono Trigger rant.

Great. In my opinion, you're saying Chrono Trigger. In my opinion, Super Mario RPG has the best music soundtrack. Um, it's really, it's fun. It's, it's, you know, it's snappy, it's pumpy. I love it. Um, but looking out, looking at what's it, looking through the window at the stars, that song, can't beat it. Okay, number two, baby, number two.

So, number two, I have a game you've already talked about. It is called Final Fantasy 7. So, I'm just gonna throw it out there right up here. It is number two for me, um, because of that intro, man. I am all about intros. I don't know if you've noticed it, if everyone has. I've probably pointed it out a dozen times. Um, but I am so fascinated by the beginnings of games. At the beginning of a game, I have a lot to say. We're going through Alan Wake right now. I have a lot to say about the intro of that game. The middle, maybe not as much, and then I can, you know, jump back in towards the end. But the intro is where all the setups are. It's where all the symbolism is that you're going to be exploring that's meaningful throughout the game. Mysteries. It sets the pace, it sets the tone. You get, you know, you, you meet the characters in a way that the director is like, "Well, this is how I want these characters to first be entered into other people's minds." You know, you're given all the promises. Yes, yeah, all the promises from the, from the game. It's hype, but it's not pre-game hype. It's part of the game hype. Um, but Final Fantasy 7 delivers an intro on a scale that is mind-blowing. I mentioned FF9, and the reason I'm giving a little pause, but even back when I was, you know, just in this video saying FF9 has one of the best intros ever, is because FF7, I think, has the best intro ever. Um, it is something else.

Um, I also learned Japanese in part through Final Fantasy 7 as well. Um, I have the whole script for the game in both languages. I have flash card decks that's like a thousand flash cards, and it's just the game. Um, I, you know, you can, um, I, I more recently, I suppose, but maybe 10 years ago, actually, um, you can find playthroughs of people who played the game and read everything aloud in Japanese. And so I'm like, "All right, man, I basically have the game memorized, so I'm just going to listen to your playthrough and learn Japanese that way." I did that for Korean as well. I found somebody playing the game in Korean, um, and he said all the lines. I'm like, "Dope." Um, and then, of course, Advent Children as well was a big way, you know. I love it. It's good stuff. No, I can't remember it, actually. You know, okay, so Final Fantasy 7 is a game that I wasn't able to play much because I, I never owned the game until later. I think we got the game in 2003 or something. But you had the game, and when you showed me that game, I wanted to play it, but I couldn't. But I was able to Bogart the instruction manual from you while you played the game, and I had the box and the instruction manual, and I ended up playing the game later. But I would flip through the manual, and I still remember this to this day. Now, I may get this slightly wrong, but it's close enough. Tifa Lockhart's birthday is November 18th, or November 20th, or November 19th. We're gonna get, we're going to get fact-checked on this. Tifa Lockhart, it's November 18th, 19th, or 20th. And there's a reason why I remember that day, actually. Well, when it ends up being Yuffie, was it Cloud's birthday? That's, hold on, we have to do this now because maybe you misremembered it at the time. She told you, your girlfriend told you her birthday. Well, she told me and thought it, it matched. Um, this is so dumb. This Yuffie, Yuffie is born, Y- my goodness, I knew it! I knew it, dude! So I knew it was Yuffie. Yuffie's birthday is November 20th. All right, I don't remember all of it, but the fact that I remember the date, November 20th, because of other reasons, um, is this game. I read the instruction manual for this game. That's the point I'm trying to make. I read the instruction manual. I loved the game so much that I would, even without the game, I would just read the instruction manual and look at the pictures.

Cloud Strife's massive Buster Sword is the best idea any designer has ever had for a game. Um, that sword alone sold 9 million copies of that game, um, which is funny because you kind of ditch it after about, you know, an hour of gameplay. But the bombing run, the sword, his look with spiky hair. I remember my brother telling me too, he said, "You know, often in Japanese, the spiky hair just is meant to represent like messy hair, like he just has really messy hair." And I, that actually kind of ruined it for me. I was like, "Shut up! He has spiky, dope, spiky hair! Like, don't tell me that this is meant to be just like something dumb, you know?" It's like, it's cool, it's legit, super cool. Um, and also, once again, the Japanese element to Final Fantasy 7, um, really just absolutely fascinated me. That city, 'cause I was like, "Oh, it's in the future, but the future sucks." Yeah, I had never, like Star Wars kind of plays with the idea of a future that sucks, but it actually says "long time ago," so it's the past. So, never mind, Star Wars is like deep, deep history, right? This is the first time where I was exposed to a future that was like kind of cool, but also just total garbage, right? Like, how, how could this happen? Future is supposed to be like Star Trek. It's supposed to be all sleek and white and dope. Why? How is this a futuristic type of game, but everything's like not great? And of course, well, there's competing interests, and like you were saying, that that was something that really affected me. And then, of course, all the stuff that happens in the beginning of the game with the plate and, um, you know, with the, uh, like Biggs and Wedge, and just the whole course of that intro sequence until you leave Midgar is just the most, it's a, it's a pulse-pounding thrill run, is what it is, uh, to take a line from Alan Wake there. Um, and of course, you showing me some of the out-of-context scenes before I actually played them in the game really sold it for me. My imagination, I will admit this, my imagination does a lot of the filling in of gaps to get this game to number two on the list. But the game hinted at those gaps to be filled in the first place. And part of making a good game, especially back in the 1990s, is to give people some material to work with so that they can fill in the gaps. And Final Fantasy 7 did that to such an incredible degree, um, that I just, I don't know, I, it changed my life for sure. And, you know, it's affected, um, the way I play games and the games that I like from now on. And of course, Mario RPG gave me the primer to know what to expect for an RPG game. So while that was your first intro, I was like, "Oh, I've played games like this. What? I can't do timed hits? What the heck? This game's stupid!" Um, but, but, um, I had already kind of gotten over the "RPGs are weird" kind of bump. Yeah, and it was just pure awesomeness. Yeah, and that game is just so cool. The RPGs are weird, two-inch barrier. Yes, the two-inch barrier. Oh, no, some people, that's a, that's a rough barrier.

Um, but then one last thing is that also the humor in Final Fantasy 7 is probably the first in a video game that was, it was a little more rude, it was a little more crass. You and I had fun just kind of looking at them and just kind of like, you know, laughing at the inappropriate jokes, or Barret, you know, or the just like the scene at the Honeybee Inn. Just like, "Whoa, I, I didn't know games could do this, but this is, you know, like, I, I think that a moderation of things like that is absolutely fine." And especially as a teenager who's really kind of just like, doesn't know what's going on, but is suddenly very interested in these types of things, right? Uh, that game had just enough of it for me to like feel like, "Oh, you know, this is cool, this is interesting," sort of a way of discovering these new emerging feelings, figure it out. And then honestly, just playing the game with you too, and us both just having these hilarious inside jokes about just like, uh, like a Don, the Don, yeah, trying to rig the game with our save files such that we are the ones in the room and being like, "Oh, I can't believe we're doing this. Oh, this is crazy!" It just was so much fun. It was so much fun, and it was something if my parents were watching, they'd have been like, "Turn this off!" But that, I think it's good for kids, especially teenagers, to kind of, you know, play with things and experience things like this in a way that, you know, maybe isn't supervised, but also isn't over the top and ridiculous. FF7 was just perfect for especially that time in my life. Yeah, wonderful, good memories, dude. The whole, that whole, that whole, uh, sequence there, in which sector is it? Is it Sector Five or whatever? It's before you go on the sewers, right? Yeah, by the whole Honeybee Inn and like Don Corneo sequence. That was, that was wild, especially for the time. Uh, Wall Market. Yep.

Okay, number two for me is Terranigma. I am literally like dying for you to play Terranigma. Um, I can't wait. It's on the, the poll right now, currently for Patreon, for the next game we cover after Alan Wake. It also happens to be on the same poll as Metal Gear Solid 2, so it will not win. Oh, man. Well, next, there may have to come a day where I make an executive decision and say, "There is no polling. We're playing, we are playing Terranigma next," um, because I, I, I desperately want to share that game with you specifically. Um, so I spoke earlier in a Hyper Light Drifter rant about how there's a certain thing that appeals to me as an adult in terms of theme with a game that is different from when I was a child. And it kind of surrounds that theme of kind of like death, dealing with the, uh, the existential dread, facing the fear, becoming comfortable with that, but also how that gives you an appreciation for life, right? Um, like much more so than I think you can have any other way. Um, I will say no more than the fact that this game incorporates that theme too. Okay, and that's going to be why these two games I'm listing at the top are there at the top, over even some childhood nostalgia-type games like Final Fantasy 7 or The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time or something like that. Yeah, um, the reason why these surpass it is because these have been some of the most memorable, life-changing experiences that helped me reach that sort of like ability to confront my own mortality, become at peace with it. Yeah, and it has given me a new appreciation for life in doing so that I really lacked through my 20s. Unfortunately, when this is supposed to be some of the best years of your life, it ended up being some of the absolute worst, um, despite also there being great memories there. I'm not trying to like take away from, you know, the times that we spent together and things like that, but I had a real, real sickness here that I, I could not find a way to deal with appropriately, right? And, and, uh, Terranigma is so amazing because in much a similar way to Hyper Light Drifter, also there, there's dialogue and there's text, okay? But that's not, that's not where the real meat of this game is found. Yeah, it's found in images and sound. Oh, really? And there, there's just some really beautiful ways that they approached, "How does a sunrise or, you know, a moonrise or some beautiful image of scenery help you understand how sacred and amazing this opportunity that you have called your life, your individual one shot that you have here, how beautiful of a thing that is?" You just sold, you just sold me on Terranigma. It is unbelievable how beautifully they communicate these sort of unconscious, indescribable, impossible to articulate sort of like moments of beauty that give you this appreciation for this world and this time that you have in, in an environment, in a society that so often shouts at you all the reasons why it's terrible and why you should be fearful of it and why, "Holy crap, it's all going to hell!" And, "Oh no, if this happens, it's the end!" And like, we're, we're sitting here constantly anxious and afraid. Yeah, in this one chance we have to appreciate the beauty of this life that we have. Terranigma addresses, and, and goes, it goes all in on showing you why you should appreciate it. And I have not in too many instances been in tears at the end of a game. Yeah, this was one. Wow. I could not believe it. I could not believe it. And I, I told you this maybe last week or the week before, I can't remember when. I was just recently sitting on the floor in my living room with headphones on, listening to the ending theme of Terranigma. I was staring into, it's not a real fireplace, it's a kind of a false fireplace on my TV stand, kind of a heater thing. I was looking into the fire, fire is false fire, and listening to this music, and I just went, "This is the most beautiful message on Earth. The message that this game communicates is the most beautiful message on this planet." It's, it's, there's nothing better, except for maybe the one I choose next, but they're kind of the same. Yes, they're, they're, they're, they're driving at the same thing. And so, um, wow, like I also played that in my adulthood, even though it's a very old game, uh, one of, one of the games toward the latter years of the Super Nintendo, same time as like Super Mario RPG, but it didn't come out in the US and North American market. Oh, really? It only came out in Europe. So, so, was it ever officially localized, or are we going to? It was officially localized in Europe, I mean, in English for, for Europe, um, but it, it just didn't come over to North America. And of course, it was originally Japanese, so from Japan to Europe, but not to North America. And so I didn't play it until, gosh, if Tom was here, he was the one who suggested it to me. Really? And I played it alongside him, and, uh, that probably was about five or six years ago. And I did a retrospective on it, and, um, my goodness, is it good? And I, I'm, I'm serious, that is going to be covered this year on the, on this coming year on our podcast. I, I'm making an executive decision. If you guys won't vote on it, I'll just supersede you at some point and be like, "Listen, you don't get it. You don't, you don't understand what's good for you here. Like, I, I'm going to have to step in." But anyway, that's my number two.

All right, well, my number one, do you want to take a guess? It's Xenogears. It is Xenogears. That's the only one we haven't said yet. My number one is Xenogears, and it's only thanks to this podcast that I even know anything about Xenogears. Um, I would, this is not a game that I would have played on my own. Um, and the themes of it are themes that, while adjacent to many of the things that I was studying and learning about and interested in in my own life, um, were things that I needed to do a little bit of reading on in order to really sharpen up, right? It got me more into Jung. I've gotten Jung like four different waves in my life. Um, from like in high school psychology class, it was like, "Hey, learn about Freud and Jung and all of those guys." Um, and then like in my film school, and then another, like, it was Xenogears was like my fourth like big introduction into Carl Jung. And I had, I was familiar with him by this point, um, but I was not as familiar with him as I would become throughout that series. And I read during the course of the Xenogears podcast. I read Nietzsche, I read Freud, I read, um, well, Erich Neumann. I read so much stuff during that time period because it was so utterly fascinating to me. And a lot of the core of who I am actually does relate back to that game. And a lot of people say that sometime like in your mid-30s is when you, you, who you are kind of like solidifies, and you, you don't change much after that. Now, I don't know, we'll see, we'll see. Obviously, you know, people like you and I, we might be able to push that a little longer. Um, but for the most part, in general, people's opinions and all of this stuff, that it usually kind of solidifies around that time period. And Xenogears came to me as, gosh, I don't even know how to put this. The way it looks, perfect. It's my kind of game. Like the 3D plus 2D mix and sprites, the walls, my kind of game. Absolutely love it. Um, the way the battle system works, just amazing. The mech stuff, so good. I know there's issues, but like, it's really good, right? It's really good. Um, the, the settings, the world, the fact, sort of fantasy/sci-fi, the, the mixing of the maybe medieval type stuff with also these futuristic fantasy elements, you know. Um, you know, the symbolism was so deep. Um, Xenogears utterly changed the course of my life. It changed the way I think about things. It made me a lot more critical of a reader. It made me finally actually like, like really, really start reading books, not just for entertainment, right? Now, I had read many books before this. I'm not like, "Xenogears didn't do this 100%," but it gave me that final push where I had a list of things that I wanted to read for a long time. And once I got into the habit of just reading a lot, um, this was in between me learning languages, I suppose, otherwise I wouldn't have had the time. Um, it just was like a ball rolling down a hill. And I was like, "Okay, well, now I got to read this thing. Well, now, now I've got to like do the Joseph Campbell." I had read him before. It was a whole different experience reading Joseph Campbell again while we were playing Xenogears. It was a whole different experience. Um, and, you know, just preparing for each episode, and it, it just was something else. And there could be something to it as well that we did this on the heels of the 2020, um, the pandemic. Things were weird literally at that time, and that was just a weird time. And Xenogears gave me this solid like place to stand, right? It gave me this thing where, this is a funny thing to say about Xenogears, but it gave me something from which everything just made sense, right? But it really did that. Now, that that sense doesn't come easily. I had to really mine the sense out of it. Um, but once I got, once I understood what the game was saying, I, I realized how unbelievably valuable and important this message really is. And, you know, the more it keeps elaborating on, elaborating on that message and bringing in things from different places, you know, like everything I read now is different because of Xenogears. I have even talked to psychologists since then. I've, I've even told them about Xenogears. I've been like, "Well, there's this game I played. It like totally informed me on all this stuff. You should totally play it. It incorporates all of this stuff." Um, and, uh, you know, it gave me maybe an ability to do something like psychoanalysis on myself, we'll put it that way. Because I'm not an expert. I can't go out and, you know, psychoanalyze other people very well. I can't, you know, necessarily read the whole culture. But what I can do is look inside myself, and it gave me tools to do that that I never had before. And basically every game we've done since Xenogears, I have used those tools that I got from Xenogears in order to understand what these games mean. Uh, you know, it has, it has opened up new depths and new meaning to things, um, that seemingly bear no relation to Xenogears itself. Um, but because of the tools I acquired through that journey, um, gosh, like I'm going to be an old man and still using these tools that I never would have had if I didn't play this game. I don't know how I would have gotten interested enough to dive headfirst so hard the way that I did, especially something like Nietzsche. I was, I had, I was familiar with Nietzsche, but it wasn't until Xenogears where I was like, "Okay, I guess I'll read these books. See how it goes." You know, "He's crazy, like, let's see what happens." Um, and I never would have done that without this podcast and without, without the, um, that video game. So thanks to everybody, thanks to all of you for wanting that game to be covered. It's what we ended up doing. Um, and, you know, it, it, yeah, it changed my life. Yeah. Um, the degree of difficulty, I have to say, yes, degree of difficulty is so high that despite its flaws, it still pulls out a number one for me. Yeah, you're saying degree of difficulty in trying to execute such a story. It makes it permissible for its whatever missteps it might have. No, games, games were like not allowed to use religious symbolism up until Xenogears, basically. Like, and I know a lot of that has to do with Sony and the PlayStation. Nintendo kind of held a stranglehold over the market for a long time, um, and they were kind of saying, "Don't, don't do this kind of stuff." And Xenogears just broke that wall and shattered it into pieces, and, and using material that part of it I was already familiar with, and but introducing it in such a new way. Games were not allowed to do this, and they kind of like paved the way for this kind of thing. I know they borrowed a lot from anime and other Japanese influences, but for video games, like, this was really something else. So I had to throw that out there too. Um, this game had a lot of room to fall. It could have executed even poorer on many elements, and in my mind, it would still be number one. Yeah, absolutely. I think, uh, maybe some people would, would, uh, argue Shin Megami Tensei. Oh, sure. I haven't played those. I haven't either. And so either like one and two, Shin Megami Tensei one and two, which come before. But I don't know how, I don't know if they had, I don't know if they were big sellers or not. I don't really know. Were they in America? Were they? That's what I don't know. I literally don't know anything about the history of the early Shin Megami Tensei. But I do know that people consider them to be, uh, pavers of the road for like this type of thing that Xenogears took, and I think just like took to another level. Yeah, yeah. I'm saying, I'm saying that he, he never played the early Shin Megami Tensei games. But, uh, anyway, I, I think most people probably agree with that. Very good. Um, I just wanted to throw that in there 'cause I'm anticipating the comment, actually. It's totally fine. I look forward to playing SMT then if it's got that stuff too. We will. Was not in America. So, okay, so your point stands, um, because probably because of what exactly what you're talking about. Yeah, the censorship of that type of stuff was probably a reason why it was. Americans would do this. And Tetsuya Takahashi was like, "Yeah, let's see." And well, they didn't buy it. I guess the game didn't sell that well. But he tried, and sold, bless him, pretty well. It should have had a sequel, but Square was just dumb, and that was right when Yoichi Wada came around and decided to make a billion sequels to all their stuff instead of making cool new stuff. It's funny because that's what Disney did as well around that same time period. They were like, "Let's do sequels!"

All right, all right, number one, Mike, number one. There is no, no way that I can properly even begin to articulate why this is my number one game. I tried to in the podcast we did on it, and tried really hard, and it still just doesn't really explain it well enough. And, uh, well, the game is Outer Wilds. Um, without driving myself into a place where I'll probably get emotional and kind of like ruin the vibe of this thing, um, I had an experience, uh, with death that was, well, I was cresting it, just, we'll just call it that. And then I've had other separate experiences, psychedelic experiences, that felt very much like what death could maybe feel like. Who knows, maybe. Um, I guess you don't really ever know until it actually happens. But, um, uh, I alluded to this, I've had some serious, serious, serious, serious, um, mental health problems in my life. I, I, I always feel bad or like guilty for saying that because it's like, I always look at like other examples of other people. This is part of my particular depression, is like, "Your life is not nearly as bad as these people, and you don't have health conditions or like actual like, um, you know, like serious mental conditions that, that these people, people have. And so you should not be as seriously depressed or whatever as you are." It makes no sense. And there's almost a guilt with being given this great life and still feeling this way. So you feel bad because you feel bad, which makes you feel worse, exactly. Um, so anyway, I, I had a suicide attempt a few years back, coming up on three years, I think. And, um, I was in a really bad spot. I was in a psychiatric ward for five days, um, and yet still did not miss a single week of the podcast. That's wild, actually. Well, 'cause we used to record multiple, and we would have a backlog. Yeah, that was something else. That's wild, by the way. Still did not miss one week. We have still every single week, we have delivered since we made that commitment to do at least one podcast a week. Anyway, I was in a real bad spot. And, um, Outer Wilds, like Terranigma, like Hyper Light Drifter, sort of delves into this existential dread, this fear of death that every person has programmed into them, right? Right. And a big part, whether you put it off forever, or deal with it now, or deal with it in part now, but like work at it throughout your life, or totally ignore it and it comes for you all of a sudden, you just, that whisper over the shoulder, death is, is there. Whenever that happens for you, you're going to have to deal with it. And, uh, should I say I'm lucky? I don't know if I should say I'm lucky to have had the experience that I had, but I kind of in a way feel like that. Huh? Because I got a taste of what it's like before it was my time. Okay, that's valuable. And went, "Oh, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. This is actually kind of a beautiful thing. Why do I feel that way? Why?" Just spiraled my brain in all these directions, and I did not know how to structure or like deal with whatever it was that my, my mind was trying to take away from that experience. "Wait, this is actually a really bad thing that happened. You shouldn't think like that." I, I did not know. My brain was broken into pieces. There's a, there's a theme from, that a reason why I love that so much. Um, my brain was shattered into a thousand pieces, had no idea where to even begin picking it up and putting it back together. And there are many things that I have done to try to reconstruct my life and my mental health and my well-being, and I haven't fully done that. I don't think you ever will. That's part of the journey, not the destination thing we talked about earlier. Um, but Outer Wilds was one really key piece to it. The game is this like spacey sim kind of thing. It's, it's really creative. I love the scale of it, right? Like you think of space sims and you think, "Oh, how big can we make this?" Yeah, we got, uh, oh, shoot, what is it? Star Citizen? Not Star Citizen, the, the one that's, um, that, that people really hated on when it first released. No Man's Sky. No Man's Sky. Yeah, No Man's Sky. No Man's Sky, which is trying to make literally like infinite generation and just trying to make that universe so, so, so big, right? And that's part of what makes space so captivating to me. I've always been, I've always looked up at the night sky or into space and just been like, "Dude, how massive that is! That's crazy!" It just, "Whoa!" Overwhelmed, but in a good way for me. Some people get scared when they look at it, right? And I understand why. Yeah, vertigo almost. Yeah, like when you actually try to imagine those distances, it kind of overwhelms people in a bad way. For me, it just makes me all the more fascinated and curious. Um, so, but this scales it down. This, it's a solar system, but the planets are close enough to fly between in a matter of seconds, minutes, you know. It, it, it, it, it does this thing that we love in terms of video game abstraction that takes big things and makes them small, but still somehow so that you can go from one city to the next in an RPG, but it still feels big. Yeah, yeah. It makes your little character into like a mountain-sized man that moves across the map and gets over here, but it's still communicating a long distance, but doesn't make you actually walk for three days to get there, right? It's an abstract way of presenting that. Outer Wilds presents space, planets in a, in an, in that sort of abstract way where it still feels enormous even though it's small, and even the planets themselves. Yeah, yeah. So there's that element that I love. The exploration is really fun 'cause you're piecing together a really cool story and a really cool mystery. But where it really comes together, and I don't even want to say it because it, you got to experience it, but it's just, you have to look yourself in the mirror and confront your mortality. Yeah, and it does that in a way that is so beautiful and so profound, and to me, touched on an experience I actually had and helped me take at least that jigsaw piece of my shattered brain and fit it so nicely into this reconstruction project that I'm doing. Yeah, that clicked something for me that went, "I'm not afraid anymore. I'm not afraid anymore. Whenever it comes, whenever it happens, I'm ready." And it makes me appreciate every second that I have that I didn't rob myself of, right? More meaningful. And I had that epiphany as I looked into that pit, and they, at the very end of the game, right? And I leapt in. It was like that epiphany happened to me, and it was like, "Wow, wow!" Um, that fixed my brain instead of shattering it like so many things had in the past. And that's just an experience I, I can't hope to really communicate, yeah, in a way that does justice what that moment of leaping in there did for me. Um, but it was incredible, and that's why it's my favorite game of all time. Did I win? It's a great game. Did I win? Did K win? You have to make the call. Only you can decide. Tell us in the comments. We'll tally them up. We'll report again next week, uh, of who won, and, uh, and then we'll do a review, and we'll do, we'll do, we'll have to do a postmortem. Thank you guys for watching. We appreciate you. Yeah, thank you so much. And, uh, we will see you again next week. You got more Alan Wake here in a couple days. Look forward to that. Till then, thanks. Peace out. [Music]