Transcription
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So like everything in the occult that they do is like basically to mock Jesus. This stuff goes very deep in LA, and there's two common denominators. It's, you know, usually debauchery, like, um, either consensual or non-consensual, uh, fornication and Luciferian worship. And so I saw this stuff with my own eyes. But I noticed that the common denominator in all of this dark stuff was that these people believe that the devil is real. They worship demons. And in my, you know, atheistic mind, I'm like, wait, what? Like, Satan, that's a, that's a real being. I was very, very curious about this because I'm like, if that's real, then God has to be [Music] real.
Colossians 1, beginning at verse 11. We also pray that you will be strengthened with all his glorious power so you will have all the endurance and patience you need. May you be filled with joy, always thanking the Father. He has enabled you to share in the inheritance that belongs to his people who live in the light. For he has rescued us from the kingdom of darkness and transferred us into the kingdom of his dear son, who purchased our freedom and forgave our sins.
Gentlemen, let's begin by talking about how God brought us out of darkness. Nick is here. Well, you're, you're formerly known as Big Nick, yeah? Right. Have you left that name behind? Leave it. Recently, I'm now going by, um, my government name, Nick Kwani. And there's, you know, a few reasons for that. But like, God really, this is the first time I've ever talked about that publicly, by the way. Um, God really emphasized like how important it is for us to go by like our actual names, right? And I went by Big Nick for a long time on social media. But, you know, the Lord was really showing me like, he wants me to, uh, be more professional in the way that I present myself. Um, because, you know, obviously I have a desire to expand his kingdom, go to the nations, and everything. But I've been learning a lot about order in this season. And one thing that, you know, God had spoken to me specifically about order is to like change my, like, one social media stage name, I guess you could say, to my real name. Which has presented some challenges, 'cause Instagram's like, giving me issues changing the username. I had to make a new Spotify profile. I got to make a new Apple Music profile. So it's definitely been like, um, it's been a lot more work. But I know that God will, you know, honor my obedience for doing that.
So officially, you know, you guys probably know me online as Big Nick. I have changed my name to Nick Kwani. But I don't get angry if people come. Well, I, I even had, even when I did an interview on your podcast, I had tagged you, yeah, as Big Nick. And you texted me, said, "Hey, I'm actually using this name now." I said, "Okay, that works perfectly fine for me." There is something biblical in terms of name changes, right? This is true. And, you know, what's interesting with my name too, is, um, so my full name is Nick Hill Keswani. I'm just going by Nick because no one could pronounce Nick Hill in school. Um, and I can't get any usernames with that. I can only get Nick Kwani. It's all good though. God knows. But I was researching like, what my name means in Hindi, 'cause I'm Indian. And, you know, I didn't grow up Christian or anything. I grew up under Hinduism. But my name in Hindi actually means "complete word of the Lord." And so when I looked that up, I just looked it up out of curiosity. These are things you do as a, as a single guy who lives alone and has some time on his head, you know? Like, I'm curious like, what, you know, what does my name mean? And I found out it literally means "a complete word of the Lord." And when I saw that, I'm like, my goodness, this was prophetic from the very beginning. 'Cause now, like, what do I try to do? I try to preach the complete word of God, the complete word of the Lord. So when I saw that, and the Lord spoke to me about changing my name back to like, my original government name, I, um, you know, I couldn't hesitate. I just did it. You know? And, um, um, I, there's been a lot of things in my life where I've had to like, change for God's glory. And he's always come through and blessed me because of that.
So, and many would be surprised, especially if they were maybe consumers of your older content before you knew the Lord, right? At the change that there is now, and what you're now doing in spreading the word of God. Yeah, the Lord certainly did bring you out of some dark places. He did. Absolutely. I mean, my, um, my entire life was basically me not knowing God. Uh, I wasn't raised in church or anything like that. Um, so I was like, really deep in it. Some people, they kind of get into, you know, similar darkness, but they still have like, some sort of conviction because they had a foundation when they were younger. But me, like, I had no foundation. Didn't know anything about Jesus. I didn't really know biblical right from wrong. I was just using my own understanding, you know, which is not recommended in the Bible, right? Lean not on your own understanding, but trust in the Lord, right? And so I was just using my, um, understanding of the world to like, be able to determine right and wrong. And that doesn't work because we're in a fallen nature. We need God's, you know, we need God's word as a blueprint for our lives. It's like a mirror that really reflects our iniquity and our transgressions. That's why they hated Jesus because they hated him because he, his light testified of their evil deeds, right? So people who are exposed to that light as children, they had some sort of foundation where like, maybe they didn't go too deep. But like for me, I had nothing, right? So I was basically just a blank canvas for secularism to paint itself on it, you know? And, um, but God still had his hand upon me. And like the fact that, you know, I'm a born-again Christian, it still surprises me sometimes because I'm like, wow, I never thought that this would be my life. But I'm so thankful that it's my life, you know?
Contrasting our two stories, someone would definitely be able to see the differences, at least in terms of the natural. But in the spiritual realm, I was in darkness. You were in darkness. Ruben, Steve, we were all in darkness before the Lord. And so I find it interesting as you talk about your upbringing. You knew nothing about Christ, nothing about the scripture, nothing about the ways of the Lord. I grew up knowing the scripture, but not knowing Jesus. I was just as lost. In fact, I would say there's a grave danger in that sort of religious mindset because it produces this false confidence. Yes. And for me, one of the big issues was first having to humble myself and admitting that what I've had to this point was not the Lord. Yeah. It was my own reliance on my own works, depending upon what I thought was my good works to save me, right? And so coming out of that, really, was transformational for me. Because before meeting the Lord Jesus, there was demonic torment. There was, there was demonic visions. I would have nightmares. My mind was tormented, like depression, anxiety, hearing voices. This, this is a part of my testimony. I sometimes share. And so when I read this, you know, Colossians 1:13, talking about, "He has rescued us from the kingdom of darkness and transferred us into the kingdom of his dear son." We all may have come from different backgrounds, but ultimately, the Lord had to save each one of us because there's none righteous, no not one.
Ruben, I know you had an interesting testimony too. Yeah, I mean, not to go into all the detail, 'cause it, we've been talking about it for a while. But, uh, yeah, I came out of a place of, I know what darkness is. I know what it's like to be in terrible places at the terrible times. And coming from a background where a lot of my circle was into drugs and alcohol, all my friends being, you know, into that, and me being a partaker in that as well. It's, it's been a, it's been a crazy journey. Because, and the most cliche saying is like, "Oh yeah, I wouldn't be here if it wasn't for the Lord." Like, yeah, I testify to that. I wouldn't have be here. I wouldn't have been married. I wouldn't have a son right now. I wouldn't be a father. So it is pretty crazy to go from a background of being so selfish and only wanting what my friends and I want to going, "Yeah, let's go and, you know, go to this, you know, this, you know, concert show. Let's go, you know, go to this person's house and go drink." And, you know, my friends, you know, being involved with, you know, meth and heroin and stuff. I'm just like, man, this is wild. Such a contrast, day and night, to go, "Man, this is where I came out of." And it's like, it doesn't even feel like, um, it doesn't feel like something that's in the past. Like, I don't even resonate with that. Like, if I'm, if I were to even be around that, I'd be like, "Whoa, this is crazy."
And Nick, I know some of your testimony. I am curious to know from someone, you know, that has come, you know, I know you got saved, like, I want to say, what is it, a handful of years now? Um, you said four years. A handful of years. Oh, yeah. About like four and a half. Like, I would say, really, August of 2020. So, yeah. I'm curious to know, 'cause you've come in from a platform with a lot of variety, like, in the social media world, with a bunch of influencers. I'm curious to know what that transition has been like, social media-wise. Like, did you get a lot of backlash from, like, just people in your circle, like going, "Oh, no, you're, what are you doing? Why are you transitioning to this? Like, you shouldn't do this." Like, did you get also get any negative experiences from even Christians when, when you're, you know, coming to know Christ?
Dude, I got all of it. I mean, it was crazy, actually. Like, but it made me realize how real the gospel is. 'Cause like, the words of Jesus are being validated through like, real-life persecution. Like, when I first came to know Jesus Christ, and not a lot of people know, actually, no people do know, because I was persecuted pretty heavily online. I pretty much lost everything. Everything. Um, you know, there are people who, like, and because this is the difference between biblical Christianity and Hollywood Christianity. So the Hollywood Christianity is like, "Oh yeah, you know, praise Jesus, but we won't talk about sin. Praise God, but we don't need to talk about demonic strongholds. Let's just talk about love." And then, you know, on the weekends when no one's looking, we can smoke and drink. But, you know, we love Jesus. It's like, that's the Hollywood Christianity. Where most people, when they make a profession of faith, they don't really lose much because they're still compromised in their lives. So there's no substance in the spirit to their transformed life. Whereas with me, God like, just completely transformed the way I think. Exposed a lot of these things to me that he equipped me to go out and, you know, do his work. So when I first came to Christ, I was not, um, I was not trying to preach Hollywood Christianity. I covered controversial topics like abortion, you know, like the whole, um, you know, I'm going to reword this so YouTube doesn't flag, but the whole alphabet, you know, community and everything. Like, I really did, um, you know, with love, obviously, but with truth, right? The word of God. I didn't go out trying to just make a big stink and make fun of people. No, that's not Christlike. But the reality is, we live in a world that we're literally living in Isaiah's end-time prophecy of the last days, good being evil and evil being good. We live in this warped, perverted reality now where like, if you don't believe that a guy can put on a wig and go in, like, a girl's bathroom, like you're a bigot. It's like, how did we get here? You know? So you have to shine a light through the word of God in these dark times. And that was my intent, right? Never to upset anybody. But because I, I, you know, really preached with conviction, with boldness, the word of God, I mean, I got a lot of flack for it. You know, people online, they did persecute me. I had videos that went super viral, and like, it actually became a trend to hate on the ministry because it was getting recommended by YouTube so much. Like, people would have videos with like, tens of millions of views. So this became like a new, um, it became, and I say it, I say this confidently, because in the world, that is what you are doing technically. You are chasing clout when you're trying to hop on viral trends and stuff. Trends and stuff. Sorry. I mean, it was like a clout-chasing, um, mechanism that worked. And the reason why it was a clout-chasing mechanism that worked is because after one person did it and it blew up their channel, other people did it and it blew up their channels too. So I became basically like the face of the algorithm recommending like hatred towards the preaching that I was doing. And this affected my personal life. You know, I had close, um, relatives who didn't want anything to do with me anymore. They disbanded themselves from me. Um, I wasn't allowed at certain relatives' houses for four years. Like, I really lost a lot. On top of that, um, you know, I rejoice. Like, I'm not, you know, complaining or anything like that. The word of God says this is going to happen. And no matter what happened, I still honored every single person involved in every situation, right? Because that's the key. When you go through these things, the moment you slip into dishonor, now all that persecution that you went through, all goes to waste, right? Because now the devil can use that to accuse you. So I, you know, I never let my, um, I never let dishonor creep in or rejection or hurt. Although I did feel rejected by these things, I never let rejection take a hold over me to where it deterred me from the vision, right? The vision that Jesus Christ has given me. Um, and so I went through a lot. Lost like, pretty much everything I saved up in my bank account. Um, you know, God restored it all, praise God. But, you know, financially, relationships-wise, I was basically by the secular world, they tried as much as they could to humiliate me because they didn't have a grip on me anymore. And the stuff that I was preaching, like I mentioned, was not your Hollywood Christianity. It was biblical Christianity. Because that's what we're called to preach, not a watered-down, lukewarm version of the gospel. Jesus is not pleased with that. He spits them out of his mouth, the lukewarm, in the book of Revelation, you know? And so I really wanted to please God. I knew that pleasing God would come with consequences, but it always, it doesn't come with consequences with no reward, because he's a rewarder of those who diligently seek him. And I just kept seeking him despite the hate, despite the persecution, real-life people, um, you know, not wanting to associate with me anymore, losing finances and everything. You know, I've became so tunnel-vision locked in and focused to Jesus, to his love, that all of these things to the flesh were quite, I would say, perturbing to go through. But because I was just so invested in accomplishing God's will, being in the spirit, it's like these things did not feel real to me. It's not that I was numb to them, um, out of not wanting to deal with them, but I was numb to them because I was realizing how vain this world really is. Having everything, and then having everything stripped away from me the moment that I go from promoting evil to promoting righteousness. That's what I, that's how I realized like, all this world has to offer is vanity. So anything that I'm losing in this vain world, I don't count it as a loss. But God restored it all, which is great.
And from the outside looking in, some may have looked at your life and said, "He's popular on the internet, he's got resources and wealth, he looks like he's having a lot of fun." But all of that was a facade. Yes. It was a facade. Yep. And it wasn't until you met Christ that you found the true fulfillment. Yeah. So, was that a particular moment for you? Was there a series of events that led to this? And I'll actually pose this question to you guys as well, in terms of your coming to Christ, coming out of that darkness into light. Was it a moment? Was it a series of moments? And would you share about that?
Yeah, absolutely. It took a lot of research, honestly. Because I was a very stubborn individual. I was like, "I need literal proof to subscribe or believe in anything." And so I never really cared to look into God because I didn't have the proof of it. And so one, but this is how I ended up realizing that God was real, because God allowed me to see that the devil is actually real. Um, you know, we talked about this a little bit, um, on your, uh, Numa streaming platform, which guys, go check that out. I want to plug David's stuff for him, you know, take that. Thank you. You know, that you got to have that guy in your corner that will like, plug your stuff for you, you know? So I want to be that guy. But, um, you know, basically when I, I'll DM you later. Yeah, right. Oh, don't tell them about that part. You're supposed to make me look good here. Just kidding, kidding. Um, so a couple years ago, um, you know, I was in LA and I was in the music scene as well as social media. And basically, to make a long story short, I got exposed to seeing Satanic rituals in Downtown LA when I was just trying to meet up with a producer. You know, I thought I was going to, I just came there to get a beat. And next thing you know, he's showing me rituals. So that's an average night in LA. But, um, I go to this studio in Downtown LA. Like, it's actually ridiculous now that I think about it that, like, I really encountered that. But, um, you know, he's making me a beat and whatever. Um, we had a mutual connection who I'm still friends with. I actually ended up baptizing last October, so praise God for that. But he brought me to the studio. And the guy's making a beat, and I'm in this, you know, warehouse in DTLA. And he shows me, he actually invites me to these like occult swinger parties where they would do like, like orgies and Satanic rituals at the same time. And, you know, I wasn't really about that. He showed me a video of them actually like making a demo reel of it, really happening. And I'm in the same warehouse where the reel was shot. So I'm like, "Whoa, what the heck is going on?" Like, I saw very graphic imagery. Woman, you know, wearing black bunny ears, which I guess is a, a part of Luciferianism, the whole bunny ears thing. I didn't understand it at the time. Um, and, you know, they were like, in cages, cutting their wrists. I didn't know much about like, blood sacrifices and Luciferianism. So I don't know why they're doing these things. Afterwards, I studied it and I realized why they do these things. And it's really just a mockery of Jesus Christ. Like, in the occult, they're very big on shedding blood because it's almost like it's mocking Jesus. It's the same thing with the Freemasons, like when they, um, do like a mock resurrection for the 33rd degree, like it's basically to mock the resurrection of Jesus Christ. And Jesus rose when he was 33 years old. So like, everything in the occult that they do is like, basically to mock Jesus, without the people knowing that they're mocking Jesus, but the devil knows it though. Um, and so, you know, he showed me the demo reel of them doing these like ritual orgy, um, Luciferian worship parties. And I'm like, you know, I'm, I'm okay on that, man. Appreciate it. Um, you know, there was a lot of celebrities that he mentioned, you know, like Lil Pump, he said would come to this, uh, parties. The Black Eyed Peas, he said would go there regularly. Um, you know, and now all the stuff with the, the Diddy stuff that's getting exposed, they're even seeing that there was a ritual aspect to it as well. This stuff has been going on for a long time. Even with the whole, uh, Pacific Palisades tragedy that happened with the fires, not many people know that...
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...even with the whole, uh, Pacific Palisades tragedy that happened with the fires, not many people know that right under the Pacific Palisades, there's an underground trafficking network that used to be the Underground Railroad that they disbanded and don't use anymore. Um, and anyways, that's a side note. But this stuff goes very deep in LA, and there's two common denominators. It's, you know, usually debauchery, like, um, either consensual or non-consensual, uh, fornication and Luciferian worship. And so I saw this stuff with my own eyes. And, um, I was very disturbed by it, but I didn't really think much of it. And I was kind of a dark person back then. So, um, you know, I just thought it was like, people just basically, I was like, "These guys are weird." But it never clicked in me to look into that until a couple years later when a lot of politicians and celebrities got exposed big time for Satanic rituals, you know, doing unspeakable things. Um, you know, with children. It was absolutely heartbreaking to see a lot of this evidence. Um, so as I go deeper down that rabbit hole, I'm like, "Wait, I did see this stuff. This stuff is real." 'Cause I actually witnessed it. But I noticed that the common denominator in all of this dark stuff was that these people believe that the devil is real. They worship demons. And in my, you know, atheistic mind, I'm like, "Wait, what? Like, Satan, that's a, that's a real being." I was very, very curious about this because I'm like, "If that's real, then God has to be real." And then I have to start looking into who God is, you know? And so I was very determined to go down this rabbit hole. And I did for about five months. I learned a lot about occultism, um, you know, just Luciferianism, all of this dark stuff that, uh, you know, I didn't know why I was learning it. I didn't know that it was going to lead me to Jesus Christ. That was not my goal in learning this stuff. I just wanted to know the truth. But Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life in John 14:6. So if you truly stumble across real truth, it's impossible to miss Jesus at the end of the tunnel. Impossible. That's why like, a lot of people, um, like me, who get saved in the way they did, are so passionate about this because no one had to convince me that this is true. I was just searching for the truth, and I found out Jesus was at the end of it without anyone influencing me to do so. Which is why I'm, I'm so passionate that this, that he's real. Like, it, there, you know, some people have doubts with their faith, which I'm not shaming you if you do. But for me, like, I don't even doubt it for an instance because of the way that I got saved. It only could have been God. Anyway, side note. But yeah, praise God.
So as I, I love it. You're a preacher. Yeah. I love it. Amen. Yeah, the, the, the DeGraw Hernandez anointing is flowing in the room right now. I'm receiving the impartation. But, um, you know, after like, really studying these, you know, dark things, I was very convinced. By like, the fifth month, I'm like, "Okay, you know, the devil is real." The thing that actually made me realize that the devil was real is Bohemian Grove. Where, um, a couple years ago, I, I researched this, but in San Francisco. And I don't know if you've heard about this. You're from California as well, right? Southern California. But it's in like NorCal. But a lot of these politicians and celebrities, they go to this forest to worship Molech, which is like, Moloch. And I also found out in some of the leaked emails, um, from certain politicians, that they were also sacrificing kids to Moloch. And I'm like, "What's up with this Molech guy?" You know, this seems to be a common denominator in a lot of things that are getting uncovered. So out of curiosity, this was at the end of my rabbit hole in my research, where I'm like, "No, I know for sure Satanism is real now." Well, I should say Luciferianism, because they're two different things. We can get into that later. But I knew that Luciferianism was real. So I'm like, "What does the Bible have to say about Molech?" Because I'm like, "At this point, like, there has to be answers in the Bible." I just knew, one plus one equals two. If the devil is real, then Christianity has to be true. Because from my recollection, Christianity is the only thing that discusses this stuff. Which, yeah, it is. Other religions will try to like, touch up on it, but they don't really have an accurate depiction of it. Because the devil won't expose himself in something that he wrote, right? Whereas Christianity, it really shines a light on all the stuff that's clearly going on that I'm finding out. So I just searched up Bible verses about Molech. The first time I was ever curious about the Bible. And I see there's over like, a hundred of them in the Old Testament. I'm like, "Bro, I got to order a Bible ASAP." So I literally got on Amazon Prime. I'm like, "I need that KJV Bible here the next day." First Bible I ever bought. I still have it with me too, in my office. I always get like, nostalgia when I read out of it because it reminds me when I first got saved. But I bought a KJV, uh, Study Bible. And I just got to reading. And I got to researching about Jesus from then on out. And I would say after a couple months, like, I was very convinced that Jesus was, was real. But I was also like, falling in love with the nature of him through reading the word, through looking at testimonies. I remember there were a few people in my walk that really, um, I really received from into where I started to feel the love of God through these videos. Like one person was at Todd White's video praying for sickness. I remember I watched that during this journey, and I saw how God softened this guy's heart in real time. And I felt the love of God through that video to where my heart was like, changing. Um, I was even watching a movie about Jesus, and I was, uh, you know, studying his nature through the movie, which was scriptural. And I was just falling in love with like, who he is. Like, and, and I felt my heart in real time studying about him, just like my bitter, angry, cold atheistic heart, like God was removing my heart from a heart of stone to a heart of flesh. I felt, did, like that scripture. I didn't even know that was in the Bible until later when I got saved. I felt that. And I'm like, "I just felt love. I'm like, falling in love with this guy." You know? Um, and I couldn't help it. I couldn't resist it. I wasn't like, "Oh, why am I?" No, I was like, "What?" It's just like, his love is like a magnet, you know, to to our soul. So I was just so attached to like, the divinity, the personhood, the nature, the attributes of Jesus. Like, and I was just hungry. I wanted to learn more. I was reading the word, watching more testimonies until I actually became desperate to figure out how to get right with God. But I didn't know how because I wasn't Christian. I didn't know about repentance. I didn't know about the separation, the veil between mankind and God. So I'm literally like, trying to figure out how to do this. And then finally, I realized, like, "Oh, I have to repent of my sins. That's what separates the veil. Okay, great. Let's do it. I'm ready." Um, I remember I was so eager to have the veil being separated. Like, I felt the veil was there before I had repented, which is why like, you know, when you come to Jesus Christ, you do need to repent. It's very important. We're seeing a lot of false doctrine where people are saying, you know, "You don't need to repent. It's a work." Um, you know, "You just have to realize that you're in a sinful state and that's it." Like, well, no, I realized that I was in a sinful state, but I did not receive the Holy Spirit until I acknowledged that, you know? So, you know, there's a lot of false doctrine about repentance. But I'm so passionate about this because this is what I know for a fact separated the veil between me and my Father. And so eventually, I got on my knees one day. This was August of 2020. I said, "Jesus, I believe you're real. I believe you're God. I'm asking you now to forgive me of all of my sins that I've ever committed." Within a literally a millisecond, like, I received the Holy Spirit. And I, I didn't know it was the Holy Spirit at the time, but I felt it. It was crazy. Every time I talk about it, I feel it all over again, 'cause he rejoices within me, you know, whenever we acknowledge Him. Um, and I just received the most immense amount of love, joy, euphoria. Like, I did a lot of drugs in the world. This was like, this was incomparable. The Holy Spirit is incomparable to any temporal, temporary, I should say, pleasure or euphoria that you get. This was a euphoria that lasted with me forever. Four years ago, it still lasts with me today. But I felt the tangible presence of God. I started weeping like a baby, like a baby, because it was happiness. And it was like I was in the presence of my Father for the first time. And I literally, like, I was just childlike, like falling, weeping, had to get off on my knees, go blow my nose with some toilet paper because it was getting messy. I didn't know what happened to me. I was shocked. I'm like, "What the heck just happened?" I had no answers until I read the book of Acts. And then I was like, "Oh, that's what they call the Holy Spirit." You know, the part of the Triune Godhead. I didn't know that at the time, though. You know? But I felt Him, though. Um, and after I had that encounter, and I learned who that was, that that was the Holy Spirit, it clicked in me. This is 110% real. Like, it, it almost put like a, a lock on my faith. Like a very secure lock, one of those high-tech, you know, locks that you pay a lot of money for. To where like, I was so locked into the fact that like, this is my destiny to know God, to love God, and to tell the world about God. And from that day, I never stopped. And I always get excited thinking about it because, like, just to remember that encounter, just to remember that experience, like, it just overwhelms me still, you know? His power is, is eternal. It's timeless. His knowledge, his wisdom. Like, so no matter how long ago that was, I still feel the same sense of joy today that I did during that time. You know?
That's such a powerful testimony. When I hear when I hear my, you know, story out loud, I then go, "Man, what a crazy place to be." So my series of events, and that's what I can say is, it was a series of events leading up to, you know, my encounter with the Lord. It was very, "Okay, I'm at a place where I'm like, it's things are just dark. I'm somewhat of a teenager, young adult, have nothing going on for me. And I'm just hanging around the wrong people." But I did have people in my family, example, my cousin Jessica, who was Patrick's wife, always invited me to church, the Paramount building back in California. And always that nudge, "Come to church, come to church." And it's funny, I remember one time I went as a, as a, like, 12 or 13-year-old. I didn't really like it because my whole background was like, "I don't care for this person called God or Jesus. Who are they?" And I filled out one of those follow-up cards. And funny enough, DeGraw, I think you were on that team or something that would follow up to people. Wow. And now that I think about it, I go, "I think that was DeGraw that called me." And he called me saying, "Hey, just want to know if, uh, you're going to church this, uh, Wednesday or Sunday or whatever." Wow. And I was like, "Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure." And I hung up and I never went. But now I'm confident, I think that was you that was part of the. But, um, and then it was just a series of events. Like, I have nothing going on in my life. I would always get, uh, invited to church. I ended up going to church one time, um, and this was a different church. And it was all for the wrong reasons, going for for some women. Mhm. And just always being curious about, "What is it that people like about this?" Like, me, my, whenever I was at church, I was like, "This isn't real. What are these people worshipping? Like, these people are crazy. They have no life there. This is a cult." And that was my thought. But things didn't go well with this relationship. And then I was like, "Let me go try her church again." Years had passed. I was like, "Let me just go." And nothing crazy happened. I would go to church, hear Pastor Omar preach, and think nothing of it. Like, I would just, and I think Stephen was worshipping at the times too. I just wasn't like, thinking much of it. I was like, "Come and go, come and go. I'm like, let me try this out. What's the worst that can happen?" Um, there came times where even where you had your own services or you were the guest speaker, and you would have minister. And I didn't know you at the time. And I would hear you preach and people were just falling over. I'm like, "What is going on? People praying in tongues. You're like, you're praying for like, the fire of the Holy Ghost." And I'm like, "These are like terms I've never heard." And I'm like, "What's going on here? This is advanced Christianity." Yeah. I'm like, "Man, this is very crazy." But I'm just observing everything. And I remember one time at one of these particular services, DeGraw is praying for people, and I don't think he remembers this. He prayed for me. And I felt this overwhelming sensation that I now know is the Holy Spirit. It just come on me. Nothing crazy. I leave service and it's just, I leave with more questions. I'm like, "What was that?" Yeah. And for me, it was just a series of events, going to church, being intrigued, curious, "What is this?" And finally, just going, "One service, going, like, let me just give my life to God. Let me go to the altar call and give my life to the Lord and just see what happens." And I just give my life to the Lord. And nothing radical happens at the altar call. But I give my life to the Lord. And I just go on, continue to go to church, continue to serve. And to this day, not that I don't experience anything supernatural, to this day, I know I gave my life to the Lord. I serve Him faithfully. He's done amazing things in my life. He's touched people's lives around me in such incredible ways. And I go, "Man, this is a testament of what God has done in my life." Even though it wasn't this crazy supernatural encounter like I hear people go, "Oh yeah, I got saved and, you know, I gave up drugs that night and stuff." No, I still had struggles. I still had encounters with people that I shouldn't have met or been in contact with. But it was just a weekly thing, a daily thing, going, "Lord, I give you my life. I trust you with it. And you do whatever it is you want with it." So you placed your faith in Him, and He began to sanctify you day by day from there. Mhm.
Now, before Steve shares his, I'm curious. You talk about being in a dark place, and you're mentioning this thought of having this, I don't know if you use this term, but this is the impression I got, where you're describing almost like this hatred toward God, disdain toward God. Where did that come from?
I think a lot of my, my, I guess, I guess I can't say hatred and like, you know, despising this idea of Jesus or God existing. I think a lot of it stems from the fact that I didn't grow up in a, in a, in a household with, you know, two parents. I grew up with just a single mother. And I grew up always, you know, having some kind of hatred towards God because I was like, "Why would you allow this to my mother?" I also, I think it also stems from a place of like, "God, why do you allow bad things to happen?" Like, I had a friend who overdosed on heroin, and I hated God for so long during that time. And then one day, he just touched me, and I broke down and I forgave him. And I said, "Sorry for putting that, you know, hate towards you." And I grew up with all of this hate because I wanted someone to blame. But at the same time, going, "Why am I blaming him if I know he doesn't exist?" Which is pretty crazy to think about it now. So many people do that. Yeah. It's, it's wild. They're like, they're mad at God. "You don't exist." Mad at me too. That was literally me. It's so weird. I was mad at God for all these things to happen to me, but then I'm also like, "No, he's not real." So which one is it? 'Cause, 'cause if he is real, like, why would you be mad at someone that's not real? I'm not mad at Santa Claus 'cause he's fake, you know?
So I look at my life and, uh, definitely complete opposite of all you guys's, uh, walks and testimonies because as far as I can remember, I remember church Sunday mornings, Wednesday nights, uh, Saturday morning prayer. Like, that's all I've grown up in. But I look at it as a series of moments in my life as well, because I can remember looking back and all the times I could have just left the faith, right? I mean, even as a kid, I've, I've witnessed things that that scarred me.
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I've witnessed things that that scarred me. But I look, I look back and I think, "What kept me on that right path?" And I truly believe to this day, it was the prayers of my mom. Because throughout everything I've dealt with, all my struggles, and I know we've all had struggles in our lives, I always remember the first thing my mom would ever do before anything was always pray. So pray before sickness, right? Like, someone's getting a little sick. "Oh, no, we're going to pray." Or, or you're in stuck in traffic, getting upset. I would never see her get road rage. She'd be like, "You know what? Bless that person." She's the most kind, sweet person. And, and I look at my life and I really, like, look back and I start to think, "I always was on this path trending towards God." And I could never understand why. I thought, "Oh, maybe it's the favor," which I believe too, that and the grace of God, yeah. But I remember my mom always praying for my life, me and my brother, and my family's lives, always consistently throughout my childhood, throughout every situation I've been through, um, throughout every trial that I faced personally, I always remember her praying. Yeah. And I think that's so powerful, the prayers of your family and the prayers of your, your mother. I mean, my mom specifically, again, if you don't know her, she's so sweet. She's a saint. The kindest lady. Um, even when I did something wrong, I never heard her raise her voice, which is the craziest thing. Um, and so throughout my life and my journey, I always looked back. I look back and I think I was always trending towards God. I didn't know why. But I truly believe it was the prayers of my mom that kept me safe. 'Cause again, there was avenues I could have went down any avenue in life. Right? But again, I, I, I truly believe that her prayers and over my life and over my brother's lives, they kept, they kept us in the path. And my, my whole family at one point was in church. My older sister, my dad was on the worship team, my mom was on the worship team, my brother was on the worship team, my sister's on the worship team. So like, all I knew was church, church, church. Which is an incredible thing. And you always, uh, talk about like saving or not dealing with all the craziness in the world. But because you're saved, you don't, that's your testimony. And that was me. Well, yes, because growing up, you and I would hear stories, we'd have guest speakers coming in, and, you know, the ex-drug addict, the ex-convict, the ex-whatever this and that. And sometimes I don't think this way now, but I used to think this way. You know, I would, I would think, "Well, they have a testimony, but I don't." And so, what you're referring to is when I say your testimony is what God kept you from. Yeah. Because I think that's where you and I share some similarities in that we grew up in church, there was that religious mindset. So that does raise the question though, you know, you're on this journey with the Lord, you're consistently in church. Sometimes that kind of, of can blur the lines, right? Was there a distinct moment where you recognized, "This is where I surrendered my life to the Lord truly?" Or at least a season where you can say that that was so?
I can remember there was one key pivotal moment. For those of you that don't know, I have a brother that has, uh, it's muscular dystrophy. And it's a terminal illness. He was supposed to be gone at 20. We're, he's actually my fraternal twin. We're 33 now. Wow. So God extended his life. And he's still doing great. But I remember, um, I was sitting in my living room and he was sitting on the couch. And I remember him saying, "I just, I feel weird today." I remember looking, I'm like, "You look fine to me, bro. You're playing your video game, whatever." And I remember, uh, a moment where he started falling over. And because of the, the illness, what it does...
Is it tightens up all your muscles so it's hard for you to kind of move. He's wheelchair bound, yeah. And so I remember looking at him and he fell over completely and his eyes rolled back. And I look at him, I'm like, dude, is he possessed for a second, right? 'Cause that's all I knew. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he's not breathing. And so my sister, I run to get my sister, call 911. He's pretty much like passed out, yeah, can't breathe. Come to find out, he pretty much almost died. His left lung collapsed because of the disease. Wow. And so he was working on one lung the whole morning. And so I always joke him, I'm like, dude, how did you play your video games with one lung? But wow, it was crazy. It was a crazy moment. And I remember rushing to the hospital. They, they take him in the ambulance. We get to the, it's like a, it's like a movie in my mind. All my family ends up going. And they say, well, you have two options. You can let him die, let him pass, or you can save him. But he has to have a tracheotomy, which is again, it's pretty, pretty, uh, intrusive. They cut the throat open and they stick a tube down so he's able to breathe through a ventilator, a ventilation machine. Yeah.
And so again, my mom, calm as ever, always in prayer, she said, you know what? He still has his testimony to live out. He still got people to save. Let's save his life. Wow. And so my family gathered around. We prayed, like I said. And I remember he came out of it. So if you can imagine, in his mind, he was passed out, wakes up, searing pain in his throat, can't breathe on his own. He's on a ventilator, completely confused. And I remember looking at him, weeping in the corner. I'm like, I, I don't know if this, I, I can't believe. And that was a moment. And I call it the forking the road for my life. Because again, all throughout my life, I had these opportunities to go off the path, but God has always kept me safe. I think this was such a big, uh, fork for me. And this was the moment that I, I can clearly remember to this day. I look over to him, he's, he's shocked, weeping, crying. Yeah. And I look at him, I'm like, dude, are you all right? And he can't speak because obviously he has a tracheotomy tube in his throat. And he just looks at me and he's, and I could, I could hear whispers. And he says, why are you crying? I'm like, what the, I got so mad at him. I was like, are you kidding me, bro? Look at you. And he said, God's got me. Wow. And from that moment, I was like, oh, there's my fork. I'm going back this way. That was the moment for me.
That's so inspiring. Two things that are inspiring, your brother's words and the fact that your mom remained calm during that time because that's a true, that's a true test of her, um, of the fruits of the spirit is when your child is in danger and you still remain calm. Yeah, she needs to drop a tutorial for people. Something this sounds amazing. We should have your mom on the podcast. That would be something that would be great. Can we arrange for that? I would love that. And then she come and share some. Already coming up with new ideas. I remember, 'cause you, you either you called me or you text me, I don't remember, but you were giving me updates. And if I remember correctly, this was the turning point for him. After that, it was basically no more food, right? So what happened ended up happening is he had a gastronomy tube because he couldn't ingest food anymore or digest it. So they cut a hole in his stomach. So he was hooked up to just straight, whatever they gave him, just energy, right? The, the pouches, I don't know what they're called, I forget. But so he has the tube in his throat, he has the, the G-tube in his stomach. And, uh, yeah, it was, it was a crazy scene. I remember that. And for your family, that was just, it was, it was, it was, I mean, you, you summarize it all, you know, in a few minutes. That was like days of mental anguish. You summarized in just a few minutes. So it was, it was an intense time for you and your family.
And, you know, I remember one instance, I won't say who, you only you and I will know. We, I was in the hospital visiting one of our friends and one of our friends was having a a medical issue that had him in the hospital for like a good week. And I remember I was actually, I actually stayed a couple nights at the hospital with him so his parents could go back and get some rest. And so I was in the hospital with them, you know, helping with the food and if he needed something from his bag, you know, just basic things like that. And I remember just this, I understand when you're in a situation like that, so I don't want to seem insensitive that it can be difficult, but the attitude was not the best, you know, it was very like negative and very cynical. Yeah. And I was trying to be compassionate and encourage him and as best I could, but you know, I don't know if I would have fared any better in that situation myself. But we get like this as people. So no condemnation, shame there. But that was the reality of what it was. He was being very cynical. And I remember all these visitors were coming, different pastors, different friends, whole time, just cynical, cynical. And he's just kind of non-responsive to the encouragements they're giving. And your mom comes in to the hospital, his mom, Patricia, comes in, sits down at the bedside. And and she saw that he had a bad attitude. And so keep in mind, she was all of our Sunday school teacher, including this friend's Sunday school teacher years prior. And she looks at him and she says, you know, I, I understand you're frustrated that you can't eat food right now and it's been about a week. She goes, well, my son hasn't had food in years. Oh my gosh. And he'll never have another meal unless God heals him. Yep. But he has the joy of the Lord because he is encouraged. I know you're frustrated because you're in this bed, you can't get up and walk around on your own. My son can't even move his arms from the neck down. He can't move. And she's just encouraging. She wasn't saying it like in a condemning way, just saying, look, if he can do it, you can do it. And I kid you not, she walks out and his attitude shifted. God, from that moment onward, it shifted. And it was, it was quite a scene. And so, yeah, I think, I think your, my food afterwards. Thank you, Lord, for this meal. Wow. So it was, it was quite a scene.
So that's, that's when he talks about his mom being a woman of prayer, woman of the spirit. Very few people I can, maybe my grandmother, your mom, a few others who I can say, there's this very, they've reached this different level in the spirit that it makes you go, wow, that's something else. Don't underestimate those Christian moms, man. No joke. Yeah, they'll, they, they take their walk seriously. And those prayers, those mother's prayers, God really honors those too. Yeah, that's just, wow, that's it. People need to see like, people need to look at things through perspective. Like, my situation could be worse, right? Um, and I feel like a lot of the times we don't have gratitude because we don't really understand how good we have it. Even me, I'm blind in my left eye. And I, and I don't focus on, um, I went blind when I was nine. I don't focus on, oh, dang it, I lost vision in my left eye. At night, sometimes I would be so grateful that God at least saved my right eye. Mhm. Where I have the ability to see, people, colors, like, just see. Vision is such a beautiful gift. So when I look at how much worse it could be, I get ecstatic that God has preserved at least what I have. And I think that's the, um, mindset that, you know, many believers need to realize is like, hey, it could be worse. I mean, one of the reasons why I'm so thankful I got saved is because it could be worse. I could be in hell and I'm not, you know, so praise God for that. Like, but, you know, if we don't have that perspective, we kind of almost become accustomed and numb to the goodness of God. But sometimes you have to see how bad it really is to see how good he really is.
Nice. I say this completely like, like I say this respectfully, not to sound insensitive, but when you came to Christ, did that ever come to mind as a hindrance or anything? Like, oh God, why would you allow this in my life? Like, yes, you experienced the joy of the Lord, you got saved, but did anything, 'cause I know when I got saved, I would revert back to my old ways and go, God, I love you and all this, but like, you allowed this to happen, why? Did you ever experience or deal with any of that? That's a great question. Um, I thought about it from my understanding of who God is. I know that, um, it was not him that, because God, I don't, I don't believe that God just gives people cancer or makes people blind or does these things to people. I don't, I can't see that in his nature. When he came down in human form, all he did was heal and cast demons out of people. He was, he was the physician, not the one inflicting the disease, right? Even in the book of Exodus, he says, I'm the Lord that heals all your diseases, right? Um, there's this old song I love it. It's like one of the Benny Hinn songs, you are the guy. Well, no, it's, it's Dan, but then like they did a rendition of it. You are the guy that healed me. Like whenever I listen to that, like I just feel, um, and I know I'm one of those guys. I listen to the classic songs 'cause I used to go to a church that like, uh, would do those like classic songs and I would look them up 'cause I love them so much. So when it comes to like Christian gospel music, I'm like an old school guy. But, um, yeah, I love that song because like it just shows you the nature of God. Like he's always been here to heal. So studying God's character, his nature, who he is, I didn't, I didn't blame God for doing those things. I had questions when I, before I came to Jesus Christ, I did. I hated God for these things, right? But it, for me, it's like, it's in the past. If God wants to heal me of that, amen. And if it's not, you know, if for some reason God doesn't want to, which I'm not saying God doesn't want to heal, but you know how it goes, like if I go this whole life without ever having sight and my left eye again, amen to that too. Just like Paul says, I've learned to be content in every situation, whether I abound, whether I have lack, like I'm just content in Jesus. I'm not, I'm not content in what God can do for me, I'm just content in God. And I love that there's faith for the miracle, but also faith in God's sovereignty. Yes. And I think this is, as I often refer to when talking about why some are not healed, this is the tension that we have to balance between believing for the healing and also trusting God when it doesn't happen like we want to see it happen. So I say, trust God for the miracle today, believe he can heal me now, and if he doesn't, I just thank him that the miracle is going to happen tomorrow. And that's the posture of faith. And I see that in you. And I do believe that others will be encouraged and inspired by that posture of faith, my friend. Well, thank you for being here. And gentlemen, thank you guys for sharing such wonderful testimonies. And thank you for joining us for this episode of The Encounter Podcast. And until next time, remember, nothing is impossible with God.