Transcription
It is. And and look, the invitation's always open for Anna to come on my show. I've invited her to talk to me. I've had Jenk on to debate. I think the reason they wanted to go on yours. Um, it's because you guys have a massive platform and so they wanted some of that shine. Um, they want some of your audience, but I guess your audience already knew what was >> hated them. Like we got ripped. I'm sure that I probably, I mean, ri I don't read the comments often, but I did. Kylie was like, "Hey, you might want to go read these." And I was like, >> Gavin, I believe the people have been waiting long enough. We've been stoked. We we teased it even yesterday. We said, "Don't go anywhere, guys, because tomorrow we are going to react to good friend of the show, Francesca Fentini, going on the I've had it podcast." She had a great conversation with Jennifer Welch. And if you can believe it, folks, Jen Huger and Anna Kasparian came up not not too long into their conversation, pretty much immediately.
>> Yeah, that was what was crazy about this. It was like I figured at some point Franchesca would bring it up. I didn't expect Jennifer Welch to actually start the conversation by bringing it up, by addressing the elephant in the room, which is pretty wild. Um, and I'm really interested to see if Anna and/or Jenk respond to this themselves, who have now both been on I've had it, but this is wild. Jennifer Welch is taking the gloves right off and allowing Francesca to spill the tea. Yep. So, this is the the very uh, as Gavin mentioned, the very beginning of their interview. They did about 30 minutes with just Jen and Pumps at the beginning of the show and then unfortunately Pumps wasn't there for the conversation with Fran. Um, but do you have anything to add before we plow right into this?
Uh, not that not anything other than that I'm super excited to watch it with you guys. Obviously, Zach and I have become huge fans of Jennifer Welch, Angie Palms, I've had a podcast in general. I think it's one of the best newer additions to the lefty media scene. Again, just so thrilled by these ladies' presence on the platform. I love their style and obviously, you know, Franchesca is a friend to the show and I'm thrilled that she got the invite and the ability to talk about this on such a big platform.
>> But I want I want to get to something I think is really interesting. So, we had Jenk on the podcast of the Young Turks. >> We don't I don't f I don't listen to podcasts. I don't watch design shows. >> I don't whatever my job is. I don't when I'm off work do those things and I don't follow online personality drama and I oftentimes don't read a lot of the comments because sometimes they're not super favorable and I just think I'm going to keep doing this. So, Kylie was like, "Yeah, a lot of people didn't like Jank and blah blah blah." I was like, "Okay." You know, can't please everybody. Well, then we have Kasparian on and I went and looked at the comments and everybody in our audience [ __ ] hates hates her. I I've never seen the comment section like this. It's not one, it's not two, it's thousands upon thousands upon thousands of comments. And I was just >> Oh, yeah. I I'm wondering after even only hearing that much, I'm like, did did Jen Jennifer check out our video, too? I know whoever this Kylie lady is has definitely been recommended our videos before, but I do understand Jen said she doesn't get into the content creator drama. That means she probably has seen our videos and maybe selected uh to watch something else instead. But a pretty vitriolic condemnation from the comment section that just got relayed by Jennifer. Yeah. Again, it's crazy that she just openly addressed the the backlash that they got for having Anna on. And I actually, to be honest, I felt a little bit bad about the amount of backlash they got for having Anna on because of the fact that uh, you know, Jennifer specifically asked some really tough questions of Anna and she challenged her defense of, you know, people like Tucker and Marjorie and all this right-wing pandering, right? I thought she did a great job. You guys can watch our clip on that. She did an excellent job pressing Anna. So, I was like, you know, I don't I don't blame you for having Anna on. If you're gonna have a conversation, you at least ask some tough questions. That's your right. I'm not going to sit here and whine, but the audience was not having it. The audience had had it in fact with uh their decision to platform Anna and Jinx. So, very interesting that, you know, she saw that, she noticed uh she took it seriously and seemingly as a as a response invited Franchesca on uh and to give Francesca the ability to say what she's about to say.
>> They're like, "They didn't listen to us with Jen." And then they have on and on. Why the [ __ ] does everybody hate these two people? And you used to work with them. >> I did. I did. And um, you know, don't really regret my time, but uh, I this kind of dovetales with what I'm I've had it with. So maybe I can open with what I've had it with and that'll explain sort of why I've had it with those two and maybe some people in your audience have as well. So I have had it with centrists parading around as progressives and these can be anyone from Gavin Newsome to Hakeem Jeff to Nancy Pelosi, but also in the media, Bill Maher, Jenk Uer and Anaka Kasparian. These are, in my opinion, opportunistic slugs who whenever the chance arises, they will say the right things in order to basically break bread with the right, have them on their podcast and offer up as, you know, sort of a sacrifice portions of the so-called left that people think that they come from. That's such a great way to put it. You know, offering up like the trans community, for an example, as a a sacrificial lamb to get right-wingers to like you. You know what I'm saying? That's exactly what Anna does.
>> Is it bad that I don't want to see a dick in the women's locker room? >> Uh, >> is that bad? >> No. There's >> I just don't I don't want to see a [ __ ] in the women's locker room. >> And you shouldn't. >> Yep. And I feel like Fran does such a great job of threading the needle here. She comes off like an adult in the room. She comes off like somebody who isn't overly bitter about what's happened, but somebody who has a sharp criticism of these folks and is unafraid to give it right. She does think they're opportunistic slugs. Great word choice right there. Very memorable imagery, Fran. Love that. And I think that it's important, right? Because she gets to keep all of her credibility. She does not come across at all in this exchange like somebody who's pissed off that they got, you know, terminated or that they're no longer working with somebody. It's a very clinical, clear-eyed assessment of what has happened and she even does a good job to put a bow on it and be like, this is what I've had it with. Uh, so just, you know, nothing but flowers from that first response right there.
>> Totally. And also, it's it's not like, you know, Franchesca only started criticizing the Young Turks after getting let go by the Young Turks. In fact, she got let go because of the fact that she was criticizing them. Uh, so just in case anyone wants to say that, oh, she's just bitter, she's just being petty because she got fired. No, she got fired for [ __ ] standing up to her bosses and and that was downright heroic.
>> Dead ass. Last thing, you mentioned uh the sacrificial lamb of trans people. There was about a half a dozen other sacrificial lambs that they gave away to. >> Oh yeah. >> Unhoused people, undocumented people, all sorts >> entire former progressive audience. >> Exactly. of the so-called left that people think that they come from from whether that's trans people, whether that's people of color, uh, whether that's immigrants, right? Whether that's unhoused people, all of the issues that I personally care about as as someone who wants to see economic, social, racial justice in this country, um, they have no problem with and they continually get pushed into this category of, oh, they're liberal, oh, they're a left, oh, they're a progressive, Gavin Newsome, as if we didn't see him sweeping up homeless in encampments from these poor folks who don't have anywhere else to go. We don't see him vetoing on a, you know, California-wide level, harm reduction initiatives to actually help people, prevent uh them from dying from uh ODing. And so Jenk and Anna are squarely in that centrist category. And they hate being called that because they've spent most of their careers railing against Nancy Pelosi, railing against even people like Gavin Newsome, although they are actually to the right of Newsome on a lot of things. Um, but they get heralded as these liberals and they are everything but these are people who want to uh again have a beer with Charlie Kirk, you know, rip. Uh, they want to, you know, they literally will say that, you know, the left has gone crazy. They're out of their minds and because they're good on one issue or maybe two issues, everyone gives them a pass and they still kind of get to go through the world.
>> Well, not everyone gives them a pass. Luckily, at this point, not everyone gives them a pass as evidenced by the comment section that Jennifer referenced, right? So, you know, I totally agree with everything Franchesca is saying, but luckily a lot of people have caught up to the [ __ ] and they do smell the [ __ ] which is glorious to see because, you know, we've been saying it for a while. Um, but looking at that comment section was the first time that I was like, "Oh shit." Like, people actually understand and they're not just going to let this fly. They're not just going to let them get off with no accountability for what they've said and done over the last couple of years. And not to toot our own horn, guys, but this is why we do what we do. This is why we think media critique matters in the independent left. We have been covering the Young Turks' rightward lurch for five years, okay? And nobody gave a single [ __ ] about it until like 18-24 months ago.
>> Having said incredibly problematic and hurtful things in the example of Anna, as you mentioned, of course, your audience was pissed because she, which is ironic, she spent so much time saying culture wars are really a distraction from the main war against the 1%. It's like totally. And yet for the past five years, she has been on a slow decline into there should be limits on where trans people get to exist, right? She's against trans athletes, which is like, cool, you're against five people. Fun. Uh, you know, real popular position there. And she's, you know, lately talked about uh and really lied about things um like trans people in um dressing rooms, right? Trans people in locker rooms that actually there was a man in a locker room once and all of these things that actually really are and Jen, you know this, just straight-up right-wing Proud Boys like [ __ ] reactionary psychotic extremist [ __ ] to say because again, this is a permission structure to dehumanize people. Uh, and so it's trans people one day, it's immigrants the next day, it's unhoused people, it's people of color, it's women, it doesn't matter. This is what we call solidarity and we don't throw anyone under the bus. If you're a real leftist, if you're a real progressive, they sadly have Jake and I have an hour-long debate on my show, The Bituation Room. You guys can go watch that. You can go watch that, Jen, if you want to see uh a grown man yelling uh a lot and getting very flustered because he believed in this interim between Trump winning again and Trump assuming office that all we needed to do was come together with the right and find common cause. Well, that common cause again is often over the bodies of real people. people who are dying, people who are in the crosshairs, people who are being dragged off of planes because they have an alarm going off on their phone that tells them to pray. Um, so this is why it's >> so true. It's so [ __ ] true. It's so disgusting. Specifically now that we're in this illegal war with Iran, you know, killing untold amounts of [ __ ] innocent civilians because what did Jen do right after Trump was elected? Speaking of the late Charlie Kirk, he went out on stage at a TPUSA event that he was invited to by Charlie Kirk and he asked the crowd, "Uh, what do you think about what do you think about Dick Cheney?" And they all booed, of course, because Liz Cheney was like a Biden supporter or whatever. Um, and then he's like, "See, see, the Republican party is anti-war now. The Republican party is anti-war. Isn't this great? Isn't this [ __ ] great?" Uh, so again, obviously I do think the Young Turks at this point, they're doing pretty good commentary as it relates to the war. They're doing a good job of speaking out against it, but it's like, bro, you helped usher in this reality. You helped manifest this reality. You lied to your [ __ ] audience and told them that Trump winning represented the establishment being defeated and that his base was populist and and that he was anti-war and that's why they were picking anti-war people to be in the cabinet and all this crap. It was total [ __ ] journalistic malpractice. It was a total betrayal of his audience. And again, it was just a straight-up [ __ ] lie in an attempt to pander to some of the most disgusting people alive, like Charlie Kirk, who at least was alive at the time.
>> Who never own up to the fact that they're centrist. I don't have a problem with Gavin Newsome, but you're just say you're a centrist. Say you're a centrist. You like corporate Democrat. You like billionaires. You will not You will not approve a 5% tax on them. You are a centrist. It's okay. I just don't agree with you.
>> Um, okay. I think that was very enlightening and I just want to say to our listeners that were disappointed that we have them on this. I'm happy that Francesca is here to explain the problem. I too really get angry when um marginalized people are thrown under the bus or that we seed ground and allow the litter box crowd, you know, the litter box conspiracy theorists to make up [ __ ] uh and talk about trans people. And trans people don't want to be spoken about. They're sick of it. They want to exist. They want to live. Um, this is a huge problem with uh this is a huge problem right now in politics when people have pick me syndrome >> where they want to have the straddle of trying to find which way the wind is blowing. And I see this with Gavin Newsome and when he sat down with Charlie Kirk and then he sat down with J uh uh Ben Shapiro and then the uh billionaire tax thing, these things like I thought, okay, this guy's good-looking. He's I thought in my mind progressive and then you just see him committing suicide as a candidate and it's like >> yeah, don't forget about sloppy Steve Bannon, the guy who, you know, is probably as responsible for the Trump rise as any other person besides Donald Trump. It's not fun to beat up on Democrats, but the corporate democratic uh position has fed this whole vacuum of fascism in my opinion.
>> Yes. >> And road for it. >> I wish that Anna or Anna and uh Jen would The argument needs to be from our side when people start talking about trans people, whether it's Bill Maher or any of them, is why are you so obsessed with this? Why are you constantly thinking about people's genitalia? What is all that about? That's a really weird thought to have for such a minority of the population, don't you think?
>> Absolutely. And this is the give a mouse a cookie strategy. It's like, well, if we just seed ground on this one little cookie, they probably won't go after everything. They're going after everything. Are you kidding me? I mean, >> they went after Mike Pence. Ab well, absolutely. >> They went after Mike Pence. Like, that's what I try to tell everybody. like nobody's safe in this on the plan. But let me ask you this. So, as you and I are both in this space, like, is it right or wrong to have those people on? Like when I had either of them on, I never seated any of my ground, but I also probably was a little bit lazy that I didn't research what all the beef was on the internet at the time. But let me tell you what I'm kind of flirting with really quick.
>> Yeah, please. >> I kind of want to have Marjorie Taylor Green on. Is that a good idea or a bad idea?
>> Yes. Yes. Because here's the thing, Jenk loves Marjorie Taylor Green, but he has her on their show to glaze her up and down and to basically like show leftists, look, this is the person that you don't want me to make friends with. And look at her. She's so good on being anti-war and she's calling out Donald Trump, but someone actually needs to call her out.
>> I want to ask her everything else she's done. That's what I want to do. I want to say, okay, >> that would be incredible, by the way, just to chime in. I really, really hope that MTG isn't too scared to go on the I've had it podcast.
>> Yeah. I don't I don't I think she would go on. I think she would and I I think it would be sick because again, Jennifer can actually do what people what Jin would have done like 5 years ago, which is to actually Yeah. I mean, give her credit where credit is due. Obviously, that's the case with literally anybody you're going to have on. Like if if credit is due, give the credit, sure, but also don't just [ __ ] glaze them and give them nothing but softball questions like they're your best friend or whatever. Uh, no. Actually sit down and hash it out, right? Like be a good proper representative of the [ __ ] left and actually hold this woman to account. Not only for all the transphobic [ __ ] that she continues to say constantly. Look at her Twitter feed, but also for the fact that she [ __ ] ushered in this reality and we all [ __ ] predicted what would happen and now she wants to turn around and be like, "What?"
>> You've evolved on these issues. Awesome. It's incredible. Right. So proud of you, Marge. Like seriously, that's baby steps. Why do you care about Palestinian children, but you don't care about immigrant children in the United States? How do you morally do that? Why do you care about potential gay or trans Palestinians that Israel bombs with impunity, but you don't care about the ones here? I want to dive into all of that with her because the problem for me is the cherrypicking of human rights and quantifying which rights are the most important. And I see that Marge has evolved on a couple of issues. I'm also not the person to pile on a lot of flattery for having Captain Obvious style observations. You know, it's like everybody's like, "Oh my god, Liz Cheney is such a patriot. She saw that Donald Trump stormed the capital." and they kind of uh chat a little bit, but I think we have another timestamp that we can jump ahead to whenever you guys are ready. And everybody check out the full conversation. It's great. But >> oh yeah, definitely go subscribe to the I've had a podcast uh not only to watch the entirety of this, but also for their upcoming interview with Marjorie Taylor Green hopefully. I can't wait for that. But yeah, there is one more time stamp, Zack, towards the end here. Um, where the topic of the Young Turks comes up again. Um, but seriously, just shout out to Jennifer for doing this level of, you know, introspection after the comment section was unhappy. I don't even think it was like, I mean, she didn't have to. People, it's not like people were unsubscribing from the channel. Like, she's still just as popular as ever, but I really do think it shows that she cares about her audience um and about, you know, she took that to heart and she was like, "Shit, maybe I shouldn't have platformed these people. Maybe I should have asked tougher questions. Now I got to have Francesca on in order to set the record straight." I just think that's really mature and there's so many people with uh insane egos in the space that hate admitting that they're wrong or anything even close to that and yeah, I'm just really appreciate that from I've had it ladies.
>> Yeah, very rare in media as you mentioned too.
>> Tesca, I thank you so much for coming on our podcast. To my listeners that felt like we were out of touch with internet beef and didn't do enough research, you were right. We did not. And I apologize to you for that. We're learning and we're trying to be better. And I concur with everything Francesca has to say about the duplicity in the aforementioned guests. And I still think you should have guests like that on. I think I probably should have been armed with a little bit more questions. Um, but I thank you for enlightening me. I oftentimes text Emma Vigaland who introduced us like, "Hey, what's going on with this?" Because again, the Gen Xer, but you know what? I could ask Claude.
>> You don't you need you can be above. You can. Oh my god. Absolutely. Claude.
>> Claude, why did TYT fall off? Um, and it's not just >> Why does everybody hate Anna and Jenk?
>> You know, I think it is problematic. Oh, just lastly, the queer and POC contributors to TYT have all left by and large.
>> And I think that's a that's a huge red flag. Um, I hate talking about beef, but I thank you for giving me I didn't want to. I was like, I shouldn't. And then I was like, wait a minute, but I kind of want to [ __ ] about Centrist. this will be perfect or I've said >> and I I'm sorry I didn't mean to drag you into it. I like to be I kind of talked to her when she came on like, hey, you apologize for being a fascist recently. I mean, for being a fascist apologist, what's up with that? And so I am trying to be a little bit more hip and into this stuff. I don't think your attacks and they weren't even attacks. I don't think your statements were personal to them as much as they were, these are the moral duplicity issues that the public that wants to be an opposite.
>> I I'm hearing that we're the perfect podcast for Jennifer if she wants to brush up on the internet. Be if you want to make sure that uh, you know, you've looked over all of these receipts. You know, it seems like we have some mutual friends of the show. Old Francesca repeat offender over here on the Vanguard. Emma Bigland known to stop by on occasion. I don't know. Jen, you can check you can look out the door if you hear an ambulance. Uh, because we got the receipts on all that [ __ ]. Oh yeah, 100%.
>> Party has and I think those are important things to have because in these spaces um people, especially with how abusive the government is, they rely on us to like feel centered and feel normal. And then when you find out your guy or your gal is a hypocrite on something, it's pretty devastating.
>> It is. And and look, the invitation's always open for Anna to come on my show. I've invited her to talk to me. I've had Jenk on to debate. I think the reason they wanted to go on yours and kudos because they don't often go on left-leaning shows. So, that was a big of them. They usually go on, you know, Bill Maher and uh, you know, uh Tim P or whomever else will have them on. Um, it's because you guys have a massive platform and so they wanted some of that shine. Um, they want some of your audience, but I guess your audience already knew what was >> hated them like we got ripped. I'm sure that I probably, I mean re I don't read the comments often, but I did. Kylie was like, "Hey, you might want to go read these." And I was like, >> Oh my god, they're so mad at us. They are furious. And we already had you booked at the time and they're like, have Francesca on. And I was like, it's already in the works.
>> So I thought I'd ask you about it and I thank you so much and I look forward to future collaborating. The one thing I >> again, just so, so mature of Jennifer to I don't even think she needed to apologize. Like, I really don't. I mean, she asked tough questions of Anna, and it's people's right to chat with Jin and Anna. Like, I don't think you I don't think they should be banned from public life or anything. Like, you know, I think you should ask them tough questions, but I don't even think she really had to apologize. I think it shows a lot of maturity that she did and that she respects her audience that much. Um, but yeah, Zach, I guess my real question for you is, uh, what do you think Jen and Anna are going to say or what do you think they're going to think when they see this? Because they they definitely will. I'm sure people are already sending it to them. Obviously, they're going to be pissed off that Francesca is still out here criticizing them. Um, but I think they're going to take that very personally. You know, they both thought they had a great time with Jennifer and Angie and they probably felt very nice about themselves for getting the invite. Uh, to see her be like, "Nah, I'm on the side of my audience." Um, that's pretty that's pretty intense. I imagine Jen and will be none too pleased.
Yeah, I think that they're going to have a full-on crash out. That would be my prediction. I think that at least one of them, if not the both of them, but to be honest, I expect the both of them to have some sort of a shared crash out. One, because Anna's not going to be able to bite her tongue. And I think that Jenk will be both personally pissed off and defensive at the same time, which usually just leads to them feeding off of each other. So, everybody hit the like button, hit the subscribe button, hit the notification bell. We will be reacting to that in full. But I I completely sign off on your praise for both of these women. Two of the real powerhouses in the independent media space. Thank God Franchesca has moved on from the Young Turks. I'm so proud of her and the career that she's able to carve out for herself. Not that she needs our pride or shine, but I'm just saying a lot of people are so timid and they're they're very afraid to do what she did. They don't have the courage that she has. And for her to just like take off like a rocket, I think she has like 250,000 subs now. I think, you know, she's going on all of these massive shows. Very, very cool to see that sometimes making the hard right decision can be rewarded. So, you know, that's always great. And again, also, we love to see people who host giant shows take a little bit of accountability and not just talk down to their audience, not just talk down to the comment section. That used to be so posh in media would be like, "Oh, the the comment section, [ __ ] them." Like, "Fuck everybody that leave." I'm like, "That's your audience, dog. Those are the people that are trying to talk to you. Those are the people that listen to you every day. Maybe you should actually have some consideration about what they have to say." And one of the things I like about YouTube is if you look at it from the YouTube studio, I can see if these people are even subscribed to me, right? So, [ __ ] off if you're a bot that said that this is like the first Vanguard video that you've ever watched. You made your account 10 minutes ago. But if it's a member of your show that's like, "Hey man, you you pissed me off with this." It's like, "Well, I have to reckon with that. I might not change my opinion, but I'm going to think about how you sent me a message and you were pissed off about it or you left a long comment and I recognized your profile picture and I'm like, "All right." I totally agree. I think that you're right about Jen and Anna. They're going to crash out over this. They already crashed out over it. If you remember, someone brought up someone sent in a question about the negative comments under the Anakasparian I've had it podcast interview and Jen [ __ ] crashed out and he's like, "All these max left [ __ ] grifters, all these [ __ ] losers." Well, unfortunately Jank, it's going to be pretty hard to paint Jennifer Welch as some maxleft hysterical grifter. It's going to be it's going to fall just as flat as when you tried to call Sam Cedar a maxle left grifter. What do you call him? Gutter trash or something.
>> A low rent grifter.
>> A low rent gri and everyone is like, what? Like Sam Cedar really? Like what are you Tim Pool now? Uh, clearly Sam's not a grifter. You don't have to agree with him. But clearly he's not a [ __ ] grifter. And I think that the same thing goes with uh Jenn and Pumps. It's like again, you don't have to agree with them on everything. Um, but it's going to be pretty impossible for Jen or Anna to discredit them as grifters, let alone low rent grifters because clearly they're not. They're very sensible, normal people, right? Uh, passionate but normal, you know, chill. So, I I think it's uh it's going to be hard for them to respond to this without just totally losing it and becoming hysterical. Look out the door. If you hear an ambulance, the vanguard will be there, sir. The vanguard will be there, sir. The vanguard will will be there, sir. The vanguard. The vanguard will be there. The vanguard will be there. Be there. You better.