Tony Robbins's #1 Closer: "I Make Strangers Buy In Minutes!" Sell ANYTHING Without Pushing!

After doing like over a thousand presentations, I became a little bit smart. I worked for Tony started in 2005 and within a year, top salesperson, all that, you know, I mastered some of the Tony things. Once I got this, my sales exploded. And I always say something like this in my seminars. Anybody in business who can't make a decision is useless. I would have people saying like, I'm a decision maker. I'm a decision maker. And then pretty soon, I'm going to be asking them to make a big big decision. And they've been like, I'm the decision maker. Here you go, John. And so they're just like, and you see they kind of go crosseyed and it's a >> truth lays with those who know how to move words in their favor because words create worlds. >>

I interviewed people that were clearly very closed off like screw you type energy and then within an hour they bought. They gave me all their money, all their time to go to something they knew nothing about. And I said, "At what point in my presentation did you become open to buying from me?" And they said, "Oh, when you said, >> Mr. for Eli Wild, for those who don't know you, we're just saying like you don't really you haven't put yourself out there that much. Not many people know you, but people in the space >> Yeah. >> know you. Uh, how would you introduce yourself? Who are you? What do you do? What are you most known for? >> Really, sales psychology. I, you know, like most people get into sales or business, they're like, what do I say? Scripting and all of that. And my journey began watching Tony Robbins do what he did. Of course, Tony ended up hiring me, mentoring me, and I would get stuck, like many people do in sales, presenting, wondering why people weren't moving forward, and I would ask Tony or I'd see what he'd do in an intervention at an event. And I realized there was a whole another portal to unconscious communication, really understanding the needs, desires, and and why people do what they do, creating context, and circumstances to move people forward. So now we we really go deep into sales psychology um and how do we integrate that into brands, companies, events to to monetize. So that's my that's my jam. >> I love it. So I've got here. So you worked with Tony Robbins for 14 years, >> sold over hund00 million in products from stage, done over two and a half thousand presentations. You became his number one closer. He mentored you. You said you did crazy stuff in Vegas together. >> Yeah. Um, what I'm curious to know from being a fly on the wall with Tony for so long and being like really in there and and getting it done, what have you seen that makes most people actually fail when it comes to sales communication as a whole? Like what what's the what's the main thing I've seen you talk about or you've even said to me that a lot of people screw up even just the first 30 seconds. >> How how are they screwing it up? Well, I I think when you get into sales or speaking, you're so concerned with what am I going to say? And it's such a small part of communication because two people can say the same thing, get such a different response. And then to be in that, you know, we were talking before about the eye of the observer. It's what you're looking for. Understanding their needs and why people do what they do. And it's little things in order to to get them to a place of openness to feel safe to get to that deeper level conversation. And I think you know initially just people are trying to get something from the communication and it's kind of a double-edged sword. You want to you want to give but at the same time too not give discounts. You want to give them insights and really understand what does this person need from me as the communicator the person of influence and what do we move people people towards.

I you know I remember I worked for Tony started in 2005 and within a year top salesperson all that I lived with Tony's son Jerick and Scott and of course I had all these questions for Tony and Tony would communicate in these like voice notes before voice notes were a thing you get this weird little uh file come up on your phone and these were like flip phones so I don't know how they did it and it would be Tony or an email communicating just all the things that we didn't see because there were basic questions like what do I say why do I get this objection, how do I overcome it? And then Tony would kind of slow things down and really help us understand why people do what they do and what we're not giving them in that situation and how we make people feel. And so that was really fascinating. And based on those insights, I had more success. And then 2010, uh, Tony did like an internal training for the coaches, salespeople, all of that completely changed my life. The context of it was let's bring a scenario where you were in a situation with a prospect and you didn't close them and we'll role play it for the next couple days. And it ended up he just went so deep and he was doing interventions with us and with me and first time I've ever connected with him was then and uh he just kind of brought up his filter and how he sees it and what he's looking for and it completely changed my life. And in that situation towards the end of it, one of the other guys that had the same job as me, um, going to companies, doing presentations and selling people, he was like, get up and and do and close us. And Tony's feedback in that was fascinating. And he said, you know, all you guys speakers, FSRs are such tacticians. It's like you have the language. you you're so worried about what you say, but now you need to condition your presence and you need to condition this way of being. And when different people would all do like all the sales people, we all did our script, but it was a completely different experience. And there's so much of understanding our internal world and what we believe about the situation, which in itself changes the situation. And so it was kind of this fascinating almost tantric relationship that you have with yourself, the world, what's coming back to you and how you can, you know, shift that energy to produce these these buying states or these opening states or these resource states and then that's what we're shifting and that's really the target of our communication.

>> I'm I'm so curious to dive into this. So you said so Tony comes in and one of the biggest things you got was his internal filters. >> Yeah. >> Can can you break us down a little bit for us? So, cuz from what I just got from that is you're saying it's not as much as what you're saying, it's more what you're saying to yourself, your own presence or can Yeah. break this down. I I think when people get into a a sales situation Ernie is speaking or whatever they become self-conscious conscious of themsel and then there's so much that we miss you know and when Tony if anybody here has has listened to it I know you have listened to Tony's stuff really just looking at the basic tools and I mastered those tools and a lot of people were focused on what they were saying but I used the the tools like the triad really basic focus meaning and physiology and then you would see how Tony would shift somebody's physiology open them up, ask them a new question, direct them or create a new meaning. And so in that process, outside the script, he was doing things to shift our triad. You know, you if you go to a Tony Robbins event, jump up and down, say yes. That's changing their focus. That's changing their state. And then finding those disempowering meanings that would keep people from moving forward. And so even in a classic sales situation, you could even ask somebody, "What's kept you from doing something about this before?" And they're going to say, "Time, money, whatever." that's going to be the objection at the end. And so we can know what to look for, not just where we want to take them, but what we need to do to create a circumstance to put them in a state where we block them from the patterns that have kept them stuck in the past. And so a great sales or or enrollment conversation, an event or whatever, it's got it's got layers to it, of course, where we're taking them, but also subconsciously removing the things that have kept them stuck in the past because if we don't do that, that's what's going to come up in the end, and we've not done anything to change them.

So Brett, take us into the first kind of like 30 seconds of the approach. So you're talking to a girl at the bar, >> you're trying to sell something, you're going for a job interview. >> Um, like I know that there's there's people that I connect with straight away. There's people I can just meet straight away and I was like, I just like this person. And and I wonder if that's because we're just like each other or because they're really good at what they do. Um, and then there's people I've just met straight away. And I have a handful of people that I be like, I like the person, don't trust them. >> Because I like a lot of people, but I can I immediately I sort of think about it's like I have this internal ring that if I like and trust you, you're in here, >> right? Like like I love you. That's why when I came here, I'm like, I want to hang out with Eli, right? I like and trust you, but then there's people here who I like, but I I don't care to want to spend time with them. I don't trust them. >> Like I like you, don't trust them. And I couldn't tell you why. M >> there's just something about them that they've done. And a lot of people say um you know it's like people judge and and make an assumption of you whether they like and trust you within I think like 30 seconds to 2 minutes or something. So >> what what are most people getting wrong and what do we need to be focusing on about oursel and our own presence when we're actually going into having an opening for a sales call or whatever it might be? >> Yeah. Well, it's like that classic kind of NLP tenant. We like people who are like ourselves or how we want to be. And you know, it's interesting with desiring to be somebody or be like somebody. Um, you know, when Tony's on stage or you see a lot of these social media people, maybe it's the cars or the houses, we align with people based on our values. And so, you know, really getting into what's important to this person, who are they? And a lot of that is communicated subconsciously before, you know, 30 seconds, 2 minutes, whatever. A lot of times before based on how the mo person moves their own intention in the situation and you know going back all the way old school to you know how to win friends and influence people it's like really what makes somebody likable. It's it's another double-edged sword because it says to be interested in people. And you know, I've had people approach me, I'm sure you've had this, too, where they start asking me all these questions and they're genuinely curious about me, but it's like kind of annoying at the same time. And you know, I lived in Los Angeles for a long time and I would work out at Equinox and I would, you know, I I was around famous people all the time and I was an actor so I was around famous people all the time and I just I remember feeling just empathy for them because people like want something from them >> and you know I'd go to I was working at a gold gym and I'd see like the rock there and stuff like that and people like can I get a picture? They're like trying to get something from you. And we think that it's like good to show interest, but imagine how many times these people get asked the same questions over and over again. And so, how can we be unique at the same time? Show genuine interest, but also own ourselves. And I think that's what a lot of people lack in any influence situation. It's having a grounded floor and knowing who they are, what they're up to. Napoleon Hill talks about definitess of purpose. When a person is clear and their values align and they're congruent with what they say, we feel that. And congruency is, you know, your words, your thoughts, your beliefs, your values, your actions, all in alignment. And we've all got that filter where we're kind of sussing somebody out a little bit. Like, can I trust this person? Do I respect this person? And, you know, we we think about that, my business partner, Eli, and I, we look at that so much when we would break down sales calls. We're really seeing that the the receiver of that call, the prospect is really unconsciously asking when they hear somebody, do I trust this person? Do I respect this person? Am I comfortable being led by this person? And there was a famous speaker. I won't I won't mention his name, but we were going through his video where he was selling people and I said to one of the my team members, it was really good presentation. And I said to her, I was like, what do you think of this person? She's like, well, it's really good. I said, "What do you really think?" And she says, "I don't know if I would feel comfortable being led by that person." >> I was like, "I know." I sat with that, too. Like, why is that? Why? What makes somebody that if it's not what they say? It's something in who they are. And we communicate a lot of that subconsciously, just in how we're being.

>> Could she figure out what was it he did that made her feel uncomfortable? >> Yeah. It's kind of erratic behavior and it it's interesting because you know to be influential we see a lot of these people that are charismatic and then other people will try to be car charismatic and charisma is really just energy it's presence it's intent making people feel special. There's there's an energy there and a lot of people see that and they confuse it with just high energy but they come across across chaotic. So you can be energized and grounded and present. And this person was had a strong intent to sell and they were doing stories that weren't their own uh content that was somebody else's. And so you feel that even though it's technically very good and you know we've all got to start somewhere. We've all get a script or a presentation. We work on something. But what's the process of really owning it to go from regurgitating something to understanding something to having physical mastery where you are it and every ounce of your being just the sincerity it's just not fake and people feel safe in your space but they also feel uncertain and challenged. So there's a sense of certainty and a sense of adventure. I don't know what this person's going to do which makes people excited not bored because it's one thing to be grounded and present. People overplay that and then they're just boring and then some people want to be energetic like you need to do both and influence happens at this bridge between familiarity and excitement. So it's kind of like this I can this person reminds me of my father and maybe something like their father this person's a leader but they also care and we call this being care.

>> So h having a blend of congruence Yeah. >> right or authenticity. >> Yeah. Um, which that makes sense because when I say all the people that I like, they're authentic. And it's always my my thing. I'm like, if I was to talk about someone who I really like, I've just met, I'm like, I just really like that person. >> And it's because I'm like, there's just I feel there's no mask. >> They're just them. Um, so that's a good one. So absolute authenticity. But am I hearing it right? So you need completely sort of groundness, authenticity, but a little bit of uniqueness, a little bit of I guess novelty or >> Yeah, novelty. And that can come across in your tone just by the fact that I'm changing my tone a little bit here there. So like >> pattern interrupt. It's like so let's say for example it's the rock at the gym. >> Yeah. >> Someone comes up to him. He's already expecting this person ask for a [ __ ] photo. >> Yeah. >> And so you're saying a better opener would be something that's not, hey, can I get a photo? >> Yeah. And it's it's interesting. I you know I because I I had this first distinction when I was in Venice Beach, which is where Gold's gym is. I was with a, you know, a really pretty girl, like model, and she was like, you know, this guy's gonna ask me for my number. This guy's gonna tell me I'm pretty. This guy's gonna ask me if if I model. >> She's like looking at people at a bar. >> Yeah. Really? You know, just like the guys would come up. And I thought about it, too, because later that same evening, I went for a walk on Venice Beach in the boardwalk and I was like, "This guy is going to ask me for a dollar." You know, this guy's going to ask me for money. And people like, "Hey, where you from? Hey, I like your shirt, bro. Hey, those are cool shoes." and they're trying to get some rapport with me so that they can they can get something from me. And so you're kind of like, you know, I don't want to talk. And a lot of people are like that bum on the street when it comes to their business. They're trying to warm people up in their seminar, their presentation. They're trying to they're trying to make a connection so that they can get something. And you know, I I break it down to like these kind of these these three, you know, levels of of really, you know, connection. in order to connect with somebody, you know, a lot of people just try to connect. Hey, where you from? What do you do? But before, you know, and that energy can be really needy. And so, first you got to be like connected to your own sense of purpose, like why you're here, like connected to something bigger than you. It's like having a mission, connected to yourself where you own yourself, and then you connect with a person. So you're grounded in your sense of being and purpose and you're there and you're complete and then it feels nice to make a connection and you're just making a a connection and the connection it's not you know some people push some people disconnected and I you think about it like this when two people meet some people are like overly aggressive and it feels like you're pushing them and they naturally push back or they're like this there's no sense of connection but it should be you know if you could think about it just kind of like like that like there's just just a nice connection there like where it's you know not a brace just in that space where somebody feels comfortable and it's a little bit different for different people just like you know eye contact or you know standing some people stand like too close to me, you're like that's too much and some people have different you know ways where they feel comfortable some people it's like you need to touch them in order to feel a connection like they're highly kinesesthetic so but you got to you can see by their pupils their breathing all of that their tension like okay I'm standing too close or sometimes too you're not standing close enough. And it's the same ways like that's a that's a proximity like a physical proximity, but there's also, you know, because these people that are that are standoffish, maybe they're intimate with somebody and they do they do have the capacity to get close. And it's the same way with our language, just like in a sales call or presentations, sometimes it's too much too soon >> of asking these invasive questions and so somebody doesn't feel open enough. And so that's it's a little different for different people and we say, you know, read the person, not the script. So, what are we really looking for? Like, how do I know? So, I want to break apart an entire sales process before we sort of dive into it. If I've already [ __ ] up the first 30 seconds, I want to make sure we get this right. So, >> let's let's just say for because you mentioned the bum on the street cuz I'm hearing that I'm like, ah, it's good if he comes up giving you compliments and you know what, but you're anticipating what's about to happen. How could he have done that differently? Like I'm trying to dissect a good what a good opener would look like or the guy at the bar coming up to ask your girl for a number. >> How can these guys do it differently? >> I mean, what was your opener for the girl? >> It's always and you know it's it's fascinating too to take this context of of learning or even in sales or pickup or whatever people are looking for the tactic. But we always say a tactic shown as a tactic blown. And in a business, if you're scaling a, you know, eight figure, 10 figure, whatever it is, you know, coaching company, you need SOPs and standarding process, you know, where there is something like that's streamlined that everybody does so you can have a system. But to really be unique, you need to be to go off script. And the way that you do that in a pickup situation or a sales situation is to, you know, in NLP, it's called utilization. Noticing something, you know, unique in the moment. And so if we can bring that into the experience and if there's some humor there or something provocative or something new I it was like I was listening to a uh a call the other day and and Chase Chase Hughes uh you know I've seen him do stuff like this too be at a a line at a Starbucks and you know talk to a lady and she'll be like looking at a protein bar. He's like just put it in your purse. >> He said that and just like just to see what she do and he's obviously kidding but uh >> he's just he's just [ __ ] around having fun. Well, in the needs, it's, you know, basically escalating devian. So, there's what somebody normally does. And so, the fact that this is new, so now there's high novelty, like what? You're like, what? And it just and it's kind of like a joke and it's like just kidding, you know, type thing. So, that's like that immediate icebreaker. So the way of getting somebody open, whether you're talking to your Uber driver or whatever, >> when you when they deviate from their norms, >> and when you're selling people, if they've never done this thing before, we can install a sense of deviance where not that they're like a deviant bad person, but they're deviating from their own normal. And so like, you know, maybe even, hey, have you ever invested, have you ever done something like that really scared you? Like even asking that will get people to access times in their life when they have done something. Now some people when they've done something completely not normal, they experience pain. So sometimes we need to reframe the meaning of that. And so in that, we're we're looking for all these little cues on how we can get people into a place where they're willing to accept and step into a new normal, if you will, >> and associate some pain to their not just what they've been doing, but a way of being and give them the door to to open through. And so in this, you know, pickup situation or this, you know, initiating with a famous person, it's typically something unique in the moment that deviates from a social norm where they're like, there's a high level of interest here. And so, you know, I've seen people in, you know, even going back to like the the dating type example, I tell a story from stage a lot. I was at a Barney's Beanery, a bar in West Hollywood, and this girl I was with was a had a certain kind of guy she liked. And I ended up bringing the guy over, super good-looking guy, stud. And he opened his mouth, no attraction. Later that same night, guy not as attractive, introduced himself, and immediately she was attracted and it wasn't her type. And they ended up, you know, dating and all of that, but he was present. He was unique and he was just different and grounded. And the juxtaposition between him and the other guy who's attractive came down to his communication, confidence, eye contact, movement, presence, being challenged >> and not flinching. [clears throat]

>> This is one of the biggest things I've learned from Chase, right? So Chase who's friend of ours and I never forget the thing he he said to me because, you know, everyone's always coming up to him being like, "What's the secret? What's the script? What's this? Is this? And he's like, if you go into the cockpit of a of a big airplane and I give you a script, >> could you take that plane off the ground and fly? >> Yeah. >> Here's an SOP. He tells you exactly what to do. And most people, you know, if they have a brain cell, they'll say, "Not a chance." Why? Because what's missing is confidence. >> Yeah. >> And it sounds so simple because I think it's like self-improvement 101. It's like, "How can I become more confident? Everyone wants to become more confident." And and I thought I was confident a decade ago. I'm like, I've done that thing. So when Chase is like, you develop more confidence. I'm like, I'm confident. I speak on stage and stuff, right? >> And but now I start to think I'm like, well, what areas would I feel not confident? And and how I explain it to people now is absolute confidence is the complete absence of fears, worries, doubts, limiting beliefs, which everyone's got limiting beliefs. So I'll be confident here in a podcast interview. I'm confident on stage, but am I confident negotiating a billion dollar deal with a a board of corporate people? >> [ __ ] no. And that's where I get to grow and and that's why I keep improving going like, well, how could I feel? Because, well, why am I not confident in that? Well, I'm probably doubting myself. >> No. >> [ __ ] Who am I to be in here? Imposter syndrome is kicking in. And that's why I I would 100% agree because when I teach sales, um, I always joke with him. I'm like, I I'm not a I can't teach sales, but I'm extremely good at it. I just don't know how I do it. >> And and because I rely on probably 80 90% of just myself being calm and and actually just having a conversation and seeing if I can help. And then there's 10% probably a bit of skill involved. Um and I think last time we were talking I'm like I I think I said to you, you were like, "Yeah, I've forgotten it. I've gone back and started doing my own training again." And like I've done that. I've like watched trainings for myself. I'm like, "Oh [ __ ] that's really good." Yeah. >> You just kind of forget it. But it's because it becomes this sort of natural um >> part of who you are. So that's what I'm I'm getting that one of the most important things people looking for the script. How do I say? What do I say? But it you're saying it mostly comes down to who you are as a person. Hey, real quick. If you've been living under a rock these last couple of months, you might not have seen that we have now released tickets to Dreamfest. This is our annual entrepreneur conference I run once a year. This is the fifth year been doing it. Cody Sanchez, Brian Mark, Frank Grief, Toby Pierce have all been announced as speakers. And you can be joining us for two full days with a lineup of some of the best entrepreneurs to learn the skill sets and mindset you need to take your life and business to the next level this year. So, if you want to join us either in the room or virtually, hit the link in the description below and get your ticket today.

>> Yeah. And I think about it, you know, it's like this process of, you know, enrolling somebody. It's a transference belief. And it's not just like I believe they can do it. It's like these these micro beliefs about who we are, about what we want to transfer and releasing the process of of transference. You're transferring confidence and confidence just a feeling of safety. You know, there >> you know, it's interesting too in this high ticket coaching world. There are a lot of people out there who are very conf confident, but they're not very competent. And so, it's interesting a lot of people making big promises and they're like they think they're the best. I remember, you know, years ago this guy was in sales and he was talking about he was the best and so I, you know, I got his course and he had like a lower ticket course and I went just to bought a se and it was my stuff. It was like probably 60% my stuff, you know, 20% Cole Gordon, you know, the other 20% Jeremy Miner stuff, word for word. >> Wow. >> And so I, you know, it's interesting too, I think it's it's fascinating how people can be so confident in things they didn't create, you know. So yeah, it's like but we're all, you know, we're all kind of faking it till we make it and stuff like that too. But I think, you know, kind of putting your own spin on it things too and you can evolve things and even the best Tony Robbins obviously had a mentor and there's things that he, you know, modeled from his, you know, mentor Jim Ran, but he's clearly made them his own and it's own his own unique style and, you know, people they try to, you know, copy style and stuff like that. It doesn't it's just inauthentic.

>> Um, and I I love this phrase, uh, they can copy, but the paste won't be the same. you know, it's like it's something's missing. And I was actually, you know, on my drive the other day, I made a post about this. I was listening to some Grant Cardone, and I've never really checked out Grant Cardone stuff, but this guy, and I saw him speak a couple years ago. I went to go break down his presentation, and this guy says things from like a technical perspective I would never say, and it's completely crazy, but he's so charismatic. He's so likable, and he's just like such an awesome guy. And then I've seen people go through that training and they try to be Grant and it doesn't work like at all. And it's just it's a it's a train wreck because it's not it's not who they are and they're trying to be something they're not. And regardless if they're saying the same words, it just has no impact. And so it's it's interesting to see that. But but I was like this guy is awesome. It's his energy, his charisma. He's like, "This guy could sell anything." >> It really is. It's like cuz I got into a grand own thing once >> and and uh I was asking myself as he was selling I'm like what's this guy really known for? Like this is back in the day. I'm like he's he's a sales guy. >> Yeah. >> Now he's probably like just very business real estate wealth guy. >> Um and I was trying to I was probably doing the same thing. I like what's he doing? I'm like there is no skill here actually. He's just like had a lot of fun got people excited and he's just bam selling [ __ ] He's like look at this. This is what you're going to get. Like you know you why not? Like just bang bang bang. It's the whole con his whole identity and his whole context is very like forward like come on man you got to do this thing and he's just and he's just gonna going to push it which is you know kind of lacking all the you know one end of the spectrum they're just like hey just step up and do it and then you know Chase Hughes at the other end of the spectrum where it's very refined and reading the person and all the psychology and all the hypnotic you know all the all the really advanced stuff uh that's not Grant but he's like some people do they just need to take action they just need to like go And some people are trying to overly analyze things. You do need some skills in my opinion, but obviously the guy can sell. When I at this presentation that I broke down, he didn't sell anything, but I was hoping that he that he would. And I was thinking to myself at the end of it, I was like, if he had sold something, I would have bought >> just because I'm I'm open, you know, I'll buy something if it's good and by just to respect [clears throat] the performance. And it was it was fantastic.

So dive I want to dive into objections specifically because so my understanding is people will bring out an objection. >> Um but that's that's sort of like the face of it. >> Mhm. >> And behind that there's there's a fear because everyone's avoiding making decisions because they think it'll bring them towards something that's uncomfortable or whatever. So I want to break down how can we start to identify what's actually really happening inside of someone's heads. How can we see beyond the objection that they might have? >> The whole I don't have time, I don't have the money, >> I got to speak to my spouse, I have a boyfriend or I have a girlfriend, whatever that might be. Like, how are we how are we breaking past that? What are we actually looking for there? >> You know, a lot of these come up. I mean, some of them are natural defense mechanisms. A lot of them are just smoke screens. But, you know, it's interesting. You know, we did a training yesterday. Um Aaron Seed, who's like our head coach, is just phenomenal. And we were specifically we were drilling people on the questions and the questions are the questions. Each one of those questions was a bit we showed them how to customize the question in real time. But it's really these transitions. And so even if I'm in a sales situation and somebody tells me what's going on, I could say, "Oh yeah, and that that aligns with what I was sensing." We hear that a lot. So I just communicated that aligns with what I was already sensing when you said that. M >> so I just position myself like I'm I'm saying that I'm reading your mind and I'm reading you with you know without saying that and I say yeah, we hear that a lot that communicates that I've done this before like I'm a professional I hear it all the time it's not my first rodeo and you're in a safe space because I hear that all the time so I'm communicating a lot just with those two sentences and so we just we drilled on you know a hundred different ways to create context text around the question and then you know how do we transition? How do we give them what they need in the transition as we go to the next question and you can do that with how you diffuse or anything but it's this whole process of understanding how do we get somebody open before we close them and a lot of people you know will make the offer because it's just time to make the offer and they feel like they have enough but they've been having a surface level conversation not really an identity based conversation. Um, you know, we we we break down the levels in our our sales training that's launching May. You know, >> what's what's an identity uh based conversation >> is there's service, source, and self. >> Okay? >> So, people have surface issues, time, money, all of that. And then seeing what's the source, what you know, we we always teach to we teach people to ask the questions www. why without the why. Because asking people why like why why do you say that? It feels accusatory. Okay, I'm sure you have a reason for saying that. Could I ask what what's kind of driving that source? And so www. why without the why. So there's ways that we can even ask the questions to get people more open. But I didn't ideally we want to get people to a place of responsibility and ownership and realize that it's something about them that's caused this where they're not blaming time, you know, or they're not blaming money, you know, and the the classic stuff that people probably see on, you know, sales Instagram stuff. It's like, well, is that a problem or is that the symptom of the problem, you know? And so, where they're kind of taking them in a little bit, not not very artistically, but we want to get people to this place, peeling back the the onion, if you will, to uh a place of responsibility and ownership of their challenge, but also to feel powered enough to be able to do something about it. And, you know, we break down a lot of seminars and events, and we talk about like a throughine. And when I did the pitch for Tony Robbins at his event, um the throughine of that event was creating your own economy. There's, you know, the whole context of the event was around that.

>> What's the through line? Like a like a theme. >> Yep. Through like a theme. It used to be committing to mastery. So the the through line in this event was um there's so much uncertainty in the world. COVID's just happened. People losing their lives, losing their jobs. But there's only one way that you can have certainty in these times of uncertainty. That's to create your own economy. Now what does it mean to create your own economy? Means you do what you want when you want as much as you want. It means you live life on your terms. How many you want to create your own economy? So this process creating your own economy this through line that gets anchored all throughout. We're not you know that's enrolling people in a process that creates a need for a product. Some people are trying to drive to a product but we want to align them in a process that they have bought into in the context that's aligned with their values. When we say create your own economy what are we selling? freedom, which is a pretty high value, especially here in America when people's freedom is being taken away because of COVID and restrictions and things like that. So, it's really thinking through what do these people want? What are their values? Like, who do they want to be? And then everything gets anchored towards that. My my favorite one all the time uh that I've ever all time that I've ever seen is Ed Mlet. Brilliant speaker, amazing guy. Um and I've, you know, I've trained in his company. I've trained the people there probably 300 uh sessions. I' I've trained, you know, his his insurance company, um, gone in there and they'd let me sell my Tony Robbins tickets and things like that. But in Ed's event, he ends with this whole like one more, you know, theme. There's only going to be one more time that you see your father, one more conversation. We get only these one more, one more day. And it's like then he bridges it into anytime you see a family who's well off, no, they didn't start off that way. They struggled. They had hard times. They had to make tough decisions until the one showed up. in my family. I'm the one that made the tough decision. I'm the one that invested money when I didn't have to. I'm the one that had to take on responsibility. I believe you're here because you're the one. Everybody say, "I'm the one." So, when we get people to take on the ownership that they're the one that's going to make the change, we're inoculating against I got to talk to this person. The leaders, you know, if you're the leader, you're in you wouldn't be in this room if you weren't the one. It's like like chanted like I'm the one. And he has people fired up like I'm the one that's going to make a difference, you know? And so when you're the leader, so we're basically, you know, getting them to this place of leadership and autonomy and agency over their life. And so a really great context needs to do that where, you know, this sense of moral authority and moral responsibility. And I I say a lot of times too when I've you know done presentations and events and people you know if it's like a third day of my event and say I'm selling something um I'm like yes you might not have money yes not time but it's like none of that matters if you know this is what you're supposed to do if you know like do you believe this is what you're on the planet to do then we figure it out you know and so it's just at that point I got enough enough emotional deposits of making them feel good. They believe in themselves. I care. All those things. And it's interesting going back to the authenticity. You know, I've I've said these things a thousand times. I've seen Tony Robbins do it. And people think, well, if I'm scripted, I'm not authentic. You You get an authentic belief, but then you rehearse and you refine those moments because you care. So, it's an interesting thing. Just like when you see an actor, they're not really living in that experience, but we still feel the emotion. You know, part of really being authentic and caring means that you study your craft and you do these things over and over again and you say these things that are, you know, we're obviously producing an emotion in them, vulnerability that we care. And in that, I've got these, I call them, you know, there's limiting buying beliefs and then these magic moments. I I steal a line from Tony Robbins all the time. He says, "At the end of your life, you won't remember every moment. You remember key times with your family, your kids, whatever." I say in a two-day event, a 90-minute seminar, whatever it is, people aren't going to remember everything I said, but they're going to remember key moments.

And then how do I find those moments? How do I exploit those moments? How do I manufacture those moments? And after doing like over a thousand presentations for Tony, I became a little bit smart and I'd interview people that were in my presentation clearly very closed off like screw you type energy and then within an hour presentation, they bought. They gave me all their money, all their time to go to something they knew nothing about. And I said, "At what point in my presentation did you become open to buying from me?" And they say, "Oh, when you said that note, say that again." Oh, when you looked at me that way or you somebody was mean to you and you interacted with that person in that way, I feel like I could trust you.

So you've in so you interview your buyers and ask them that question. At what point was it that made you want to buy? Y >> and you keep doing that. >> Yeah. And I kept after a while I kept on I kept on getting that information. >> What were some of the the major things that come to your mind straight away? Like if you've had people because I mean to turn someone around in an hour >> Yeah. >> is very interesting. Uh what >> I did I did the same presentation actually for Tony 3,400 times. >> Fire out. >> And so like obviously knew what I was gonna say, but then I was really just shaping context and all of that and you know the the theme that came up and you know in our process and you've seen our stuff we call it the trust trinity but even before the trust recession that was our process before this became a punchline because we realized it's all about trust and in those conversations with people asking why they bought um the thing I heard the most was I felt like I could trust you. It's like, wow. But then, you know, as I went into that, knowing that they trust me, I could even say, 'Well, the reason why people trust me, and you know, I'm so great, but even something was missing. They needed to trust in

the process and the offer. But then the whole thing I saw Tony do so well was getting people to trust in themselves. And so, I think people overplay trust me. Here's my resume. Like, they're even a sales call, you know, and there's somebody I won't mention their name even inside their sales process as they're going into it. Well, after working with this many clients and making this much money, it's kind of like their pre-pitch. They're like giving their their resume. So, it's a logical thing, it creates skepticism. It doesn't actually move the sale forward. You know, we we can do it in a subtle way. And, you know, I I think of like why do people do what they do? And the way that I've seen it done just really really well is creating this environment that manufactures trust in people. And I think people overplay trust in me. I've done this much sales. I've done this thing. Do you know who I am?

>> And they might believe that you really are that. Most people are

>> better than believe in themselves.

>> Yeah. And then some people like the offer, discounts, guarantees, but I assume I assume trust and responsiveness in myself. And most people just ride the wave.

>> What What do you think is most important them? If you could really only nail one, is it trusting in the product, you as a salesperson, or trusting in themselves?

>> Oh, it's it's getting them to trust themselves,

>> right?

>> Yeah. because I'm asking them to do something they've never done before.

>> Yeah.

>> Or if they have done it and had a bad experience, now they're even more hesitant.

>> How have you found the best approaches to get someone to actually have belief in themselves?

>> Reframing the beliefs, you know, and some of those are explicit around money, around time or whatever. And so a great presentation process, we can look at that. And you know, I I need to credit Eli Sanchez, my partner with this term with like the, you know, the committed offer. the the processes are so amazing and he came up with this term building the buyer. So to take somebody from cold to sold, it's not like here's the offer, here's what it can do for you. It's a series of questions and frames that build belief. And I don't want to give too much away, but in one of them, you know, on this fitness offer, like we'll have some quick rapidfire questions, ask people like what's going on, you know, get some, you know, is this your address, this, that, whatever. We get them in that mode and then okay, what's your height? What's your weight? They tell us, okay, your BMI is actually at a 36, you're in the danger zone. We want to get you into the safety zone. So, step one, we label people with a dangerous problem that that increases, you know, attention right there. And if they buy into that frame, wow, this is really dangerous. I'm happy that we're talking. You know, we're going to talk about how we can get you back in the safety zone. Another one is something like um people have tried stuff before and this is in weight loss let's say sounds like you've tried a bunch of things before that's great and you've had some success you kind of go back I'm curious are you looking for just kind of a quick fix or more of a sustainable solution they always say sustainable solution so you see how them saying that moves them closer to getting accountability and support and coaching so we're looking for you know a series of questions and frames um that at at the most generic level are a series of binaries.

>> So the small bits of behaviors you'd want the ident so the identity you need them to have at the end to buy.

>> Yeah.

>> You're reverse engineering small behaviors that that person would have and then asking them

>> it's subtle. Yeah. So ideally subtly but there's even people that are really aggressive with it. You know, hey John, who's the type of person you want to be? Do you want to be the kind of person that does this for their family and really makes a difference? Or do you want to be this person of you that that struggles and has excuses? Who do you want to be, John? You know, and that can work, but that is binary attached to identity. And I, you know, I said years ago, you want to overcome the person, not the objection. And so to even think of that in terms of like spouse, whatever, you know, it's like, okay, I can appreciate you talk to your spouse, but who's the one that's ultimately responsible for the family's well-being? Isn't that you?

>> So, can I just pause for a second? So

>> you mentioned before the three the three things. First was surface. So surface would be

>> I need to speak to my wife.

>> Surface. Yeah. Just whatever it is general, you know, objection up there.

>> And so what would be source of that objection?

>> The source of it is the fact that they don't feel confident enough in their business to be able to make sure they never have to have that conversation. Okay.

>> So the source is their fear, their insecurity, their doubt. It's something. I don't have the skills. Whatever. Well, if you had the skills, could you do it? But ultimately being the type of person who figures it out. And it's not about, you know, it's it's always about making the right decision. But successful people don't focus on making the right decision because they know they have the ability to make the decision right. Because the fact is you will make mistakes. But the biggest mistake you can ever make is to be somebody who can't make a decision. And I would always say something like this in my seminars when I would do, you know, I go into a company and mind you, I'm going into a company as a Tony Robbins speaker to do a motivational talk for a company and they're not really expecting a pitch and

>> Oh, really? He's just pulling us out.

>> Yeah. A lot of times, too. They're like, "Hey, we have a speaker here today." And, you know, I would read the room, you know, pretty well, uh, even for back then. And I could tell I mean and I knew if it was commission only sales people that's a little different but sometimes be c customer service people or whatever or you know I'm dealing with just general business people and I might say something like this hey you know it's great to come into this company I can tell you're really successful when you guys are calling other companies if you're in sales or business you want to talk to the what maker the decision maker. So write this down. Anybody in business who can't make a decision is useless. Not as people but in the context of business. Do we all agree? Actually write it down. Anybody in business who can't make a decision is useless. You would never call a company, hey, can I talk to the person that can't make any decisions? No, we only want to talk to the what maker decision maker. And people like people who are like themselves or how they want to be. So in order to connect more decision makers, lead more decision makers, we need to be a what? A decision maker. And so I would have people saying like, I'm a decision maker. I'm a decision maker. I'm a decision maker. And it's like and I say and then I reinforce that and I you know I'm reinforcing it by saying like wow you know it's like you made a great decision to be here today. The fact that you came to work today where you didn't need to. You made a decision you know and you doing that you realize this is the place that you're going to be able to support your dreams and how you decided to show up here today has been outstanding. So I'm positively rewarding them for making decisions already

>> and then pretty soon I'm going to be asking them to make a big big decision and they've been like I'm the decision maker. Here you go, John. You know, and so they're just like, uh, and you see they kind of go crosseyed and it's uh, yeah, so I' I've got them in momentum when making decisions.

>> So, and so that's the identity level that you're talking about. So, so sources, their fears, insecurities, the reasons why they're

>> have this objection.

>> Well, this thing happened before. I've tried this thing. So, they have a a feeling and insecurity. There's a source of that emotion that comes from a past event. And we when we look at this kind of logic chain, results in life come from our actions which come from our decisions which come from our thoughts and feelings. And the things we think and feel every day come from what we believe. And what we believe about oursel, time, money, whatever, all of those beliefs come from our experiences. And so a great question to get people to tap into their experience and reframe it. I could say, who taught you to think that way?

>> You know, there's only two fears in the world. Fear of loud noises and falling. this fear that you've got, where did you learn that? Who taught you to think this way? What if it meant something else? The fact that you're still here means, do you buy into that idea? Do you agree with that? So, we're beginning to chip away at that. And so, sometimes I need to look at the source of that feeling, that emotion, that way of being, and just the pain pleasure thing, that thought, you know, and I got this from Byron Byron Katy. You know, most most people have heard this if they study any therapy, you know, is that true that you can't? Do you know like that you 100% can't? So, is is there some possibility there? Curious, who would you be without that thought?

>> What would be possible if every time that you had an opportunity to grow, you didn't go back to that significant emotional event, that trauma that has kept you from growing in your life, like let's just remove it. So, I'm beginning to disassociate. It's disassociative language. that thought the mind is not it's something else

>> you know and when we look at that line of thinking so now I can align with them on the same side of the table and we're disassociating from a thought and I always say you know and sometimes I make this joke I say you know business is just a system that provides value and you've heard this before we work on our business not in our business what I'm going to ask you to do is let's work on you by getting you outside of you and I love this quote from Jay-Z Z, you know, the great rapper. He said, "I'm not a businessman. I'm a business man." And so the business of you, like if you were a stock, would you be worthy of investing in when a company wants to go public, they they put a lot of process in place to make the company be perceived as more valuable? As I'm looking at your Instagram, as I'm having this conversation with you, there's some raw talent here. this you're like an undervalued stock but the way you're showing up the emotions that are driving you right now all those things are they driving up the value or they driving it down driving it down and the great news is all those things can be changed like they can take a company from a billion to 12 billion or get a 5x multiple or a 20x multiple by changing some things we're changing some things right here if you're open to it

>> you're you're amazing at reframing

>> so it's a lot of reframes these are all

>> yeah that's like you said like three or four just then

>> metaphors analogies things like that so there's layers and there's metaphors and analogies and when you see Tony speak he's open looping and there's stories inside of stories and it's quite hypnotic and so too I'm and the way to go back to your original question too I'm

>> and Chase talks about this a lot like we have a mask

>> and so how do I get people I know their their responses but I'm beginning to embed some things just like when I said about like how we transition and a question yeah we hear this a lot so I need to make them feel safe but there's things that I'm subconsciously you know communicating but I know like if I can get into this person's you unconscious mind a bit and guide them to a place could be kind of hypnotic how I'm asking questions how I'm guiding them how I'll interrupt their pattern like you know I'll interrupt them you know I'm I'm basically just kind of like shifting that thought over and over again

>> and it can become you know exhausted after a while

>> one of the best examples I've seen of reframing and being a master of words was Andrew Tate versus Pierce Morgan

>> interview number one I don't know if you've seen it or I think I saw part of it on an Instagram reel.

>> It was It was the first one when I I think now Pierce kind of like likes him because Pier Pierce loves just going viral and stuff, but this first one Pierce was out to attack him.

>> Yeah.

>> And And you can see this was like when Andrew was really coming up and Pierce was out to freaking game by the jugular and he'd get on and Pierce opens up with this with this big talk and blah blah blah blah reframe reframe but it's just like this and and I was watching I was like wow. Yeah. Andrew was like and I'm I'm swaying going Andrew he's got a point. That's one thing in my head. He's got a point. What do you think about that? And Andrew's like reframe ref. And I'm like wow. Yeah. True. Pierce. What do you think? And I'd done that for like 45 minutes and I got to the end of it. I'm like we got [ __ ] nowhere. Cuz every time one of you open your mouth, you were so good at reframe what the other one said. And we get to the end of it and and my conclusion on that was there is no truth in this world.

>> Truth lays with those who know how to move words in their favor. words create worlds

>> and I was so fascinated by that. I was like there really is no justice system because lawyers they and and Chase works with lawyer you know I mean it's like how do you sway the perception of people and from their perception that's what they make decisions in which leads me into my question which I'm curious to know what you think where is the fine line of manipulation and influence then

>> well you know the the classic line is that you know the difference between manipulation and influence is intent but you know I I talk about this a lot I and and this is from a conversation with Tony. Uh he said to me one time he's like at some level people, you know, we want to be manipulated. You go to a you go to a movie.

>> Really?

>> Yeah. You you go there to like, you know, they're going to mess with your feelings a bit. So we need that. And like I go to the chiropractor a couple times a week now and I had some back issues. It's called spinal manipulation. Somebody cracking me right back into space. And you know, we want to have a positive intent. But you're using metaphors on me again to manipulate my perception of manipulation.

>> So the also but even with a metaphor I'm using it to enhance understanding.

>> Yeah.

>> So think of it this way. You know it's kind of like this. So that's a bridge into another portal that can make the familiar connect with my point. So I'm borrowing from that metaphor to bring back into this moment. So I do it unconsciously at this point. But, you know, it's it's it's based upon, you know, because so basically what you're saying is there's there's no truth. There's only your truth and and who can communicate their truth, the strongest and the loudest with the most certainty is typically going to win. And I think I might have seen 10-second clip of that Pierce Morgan thing, but even when I've seen Pierce in some of these things, I mean, he's a brilliant communicator, but I I was pretty disappointed in some of the things he's like because he's on the attack in in this, which automatically lowers his status, if you will. And he's like, ah, you know, and he's kind of leaning forward. Um, where Andrew, I'm I'm not like a big fan of either one or not against either one. Andrew very intelligent, very confident,

>> very well spoken.

>> Yeah. and he will talk loud over people. He's got a natural voice, but he's also calm.

>> And then when he is like aggressive, there's a there's a strength to him. He's he's a very smart guy. Very very smart. I mean, I'm not I've consumed probably 10 minutes total of his stuff, but I was like, "This guy is sharp, guys. Sharp." Uh Pierce, I think he's doing like all these kind of, you know, Candace Owens, too. It's all this conspiracy, all this attack type stuff. I think it's low vibe, you know, low vibe, but that's but that's interesting for the drama on TV. So people people do it.

>> Yeah. So you've told me before about buying states versus non- buying states.

>> Break this down for us. What is a buying state? What's a non- buying state? First,

>> a buy, you know, it's like instead of saying they didn't buy because of the price or whatever, say somebody says, "I don't buy because it's too much money." Have you ever bought something before that was too much money? Everybody has. You know, people have credit card debt. They buy cell phones they don't need, car payments, all of that. So it's not the thing. It's like they saw a desire and they wanted it. So it's not just about getting people to do something. It's creating an environment internally where they feel like doing the thing. And so a state that we were talking about emotion, energy, and motion, it's a pattern of focus. And we can control their focus by asking a different question. You know, getting them to focus on a time in the past maybe where they did something that was unreasonable.

>> So what what emotion am I looking for? What do what do I want to try to evoke in them? So, I'm imagining bad states would be fear.

>> Yeah.

>> Skepticism, doubt, things like this.

>> Yeah.

>> What am I wanting to place them into a state of?

>> Well, you think about it, right? When people are about to buy and the checkout pages go bad, you know, people are putting in their credit card and the page takes like three seconds to enter and are like, "It's a sign from God." Yeah. You know, I'm not supposed to do it. You know, it's like something because they're always looking for an out. you know, they're looking for safety and the brain prioritizes, you know, what's safe, even if it's not comfortable, over anything novel. So, that's where uncertainty is actually the highest. And so, we want to flip that and get them to attach massive pain and uncertainty to their current situation, asking like consequence type questions, if you will, and get them to buy into the certainty of what we have. So, of course, there could be a guarantee showing them the structure. here's going to be the process and it's a little bit different for each person but ideally when I'm doing an event or I'm consulting on an event we want to get the logical the non-logical so that we want to get everybody and the way that I think of it is you know is we're giving people what they need and and once I got this my sales exploded uh you know I mastered some of the Tony things and even when I was say presenting the offer I had a certain type of person and the six needs you know certainty uncertainty uh connection significance growth uh contribution ution, all that stuff. But most people their needs are around certainty and significance. So when I explain the offer, I'm say right now your business is doing fairly well, but it's kind of like you built a house on a foundation of sand. There's no real structure. You have no predictability. And so with this process, you're going to get real scale in your business where you're going to know exactly what to do where there's no guesswork anymore. And right now, your brand is doing six figures. Part of that reason you're not getting the attention and the money that you want is because the perceived value of your brand. So the way we're going to show you how to communicate and present yourself is going to make you look like an eight figure brand which is more likely that you will get there. Does that make sense? So I'm basically saying I'm going to make you certain and I'm going to make you be perceived as significant in the eyes of your peers which is what this person might want. That's like 80% of people. How this is where um I don't know if you're like this or not or what's your perception on this. I know this stuff so good.

>> Yeah.

>> Um to the point where I know when it's being done to me.

>> Mhm.

>> But I still don't care cuz they put me in a good state or I feel good about it. How do you how can we people listening to this make sure that we're not buying things or doing things that maybe we don't really want to do but we're only feeling like we want to do it because we've been placed into that sort of emotion or that state. Um or is that even the right thinking? It's like if you're Does that make sense what I'm trying to ask you? like how can we be more aware of it when these things are being done to us and and sort of filter through it to go do I actually want to make this decision because I'm making that decision now or because they made me be in a certain state build this identity and now I'm doing something that maybe I might regret later

>> you know I think it's like I I I would sit with this and I think part of what's made me you know quote unquote influential is just knowing that I'm so easily influenced

>> like I think we all are and some People are like, "Oh, I'm not like this." And you know, I'm, you know, I'm so whatever. I'm just like, "Yeah, you know, it's like, man, I'm super like easily influenced and it's made me curate my environment and what is being exposed to." You think about it, you drive down the road and if you drive 20 miles up the road in any major city, you see something like5 billion dollars worth of advertising um you know, in a movie, the product placement, the billboard. And this that's not direct advertising. They just know having that little thing is getting into your subconscious. Okay? I mean, you can move to a tent in the middle of the woods and not have any interaction, but we're it's always there. And so, the way out of that, if you will, is to have a definite purpose to know what we want and why we want it. And then lock in with that morning and night. It's called writing down your goals. It's called being intentional with your time. Having some time blocking, you know, having some people like you, I've got I basically have some handlers like I've got an assistant basically. I I need to like not look at my email. I need to like not look at things. I need to not go on social media. Uh I'm easily distracted as it is ADHD. So, I've got to be hypervigilant with that, but I know I'm super receptive. And even when I'm actually coaching people that I love and they're like letting me know about this opportunity or like, hey, can you look at this thing? I'm like, I want to look at it so bad. But like, no, I can't. And so, I just got to be diligent. But where there there's no way out of it. And then even if people say, "Well, my mom was that way, so I'm gonna be like this." Even if you're different, that's a moving away from. It's still influencing you. I'm gonna move to a tent. That's that's fine. But you're still being it's still influencing you not to do it. I mean, it's a pain pleasure thing. So, you just got to be really internally clear with your compass. But there there's no way around it. And to know that every time you open your phone, hop on a computer, you talk to a person, there's going to be some formative manipulation. And you might be like with your wife or whatever and she kind of manipulates you a little bit. You're like, but you like it. And so there's people like I want I if I go to a Tony Robbins event and he tells me to stand up um say something, walk on fire, he yells at me and like I need somebody to be like that sometimes. And I think a lot of people too this this kind of double-edged sword of coaching, sales, like Instagram content, whatever it is people are trying to be influential, I I say this a lot. There's if you want to be a great coach or a person of influence, it's sometimes you need to yell at people and say, "Quit being a little [ __ ] and do it." Other times you need to say, "You know what? I see you. I understand. It's okay. I appreciate you. You are enough." The dance is knowing in who you need to be for that person at which time. Some people are all like, "Step up. Don't be a little bitch." And some people love being talked to that way. You love, you see a lot of these aggro tatted up dudes and they're just doing that. And the other men, they're just like, "Yeah, you know, I need somebody to call me out." And people love that. If there's a level of responsiveness and rapport and they want to be like that person because they drive nice car or whatever, they'll they'll, you know, transfer that that sense of trust because this person has something that they want. So that's that's part of it. The other side of it is making people feel enough. But sometimes people need to be challenged.

>> And I think that challenging people, you could call it manipulation, whatever, I think is a good thing. When I go to the gym and I'm capped out and then somebody pushes me, I'm like, "Well, that's what you're paying me for as a coach. You're pushing me." And I'm like, "This is a coaching conversation." And I and I actually got this from a a guy named Gary J. White, who I think is is brilliant. Um, you know, when you think of yourself as a a business owner in this online world, there's there's some skills. There's there's like basically I I think of it as speaking like kind of what we're doing right now. Speaking is sharing a message. Sales is just gaining commitment. So we're always selling, always getting commitments. Listen, I'm like selling you on the fact that you need to pay attention to me. So it's like we're always selling something, speaking and selling. And then there's tr like like teaching, which is sharing a framework. Training is a different energy. You've learned the framework. Now training, I'm like with you. I bring a different energy. Like learning how to do a barbell squat. Okay. I'm being trained in that or I'm I'm learning that training is like let's do it. So training when you people are being like you know mentored by you do it again do it again do it again. So it's a different energy and then there's um coaching and then consulting coaching very similar to sales in my in my point of view because the presupposition is in sales and coaching the answers are inside of you. So, in that context, when I'm selling or coaching, I'm wanting you to do something. I'm getting a commitment to move you forward. Whether it's to buy my thing or to do the thing inside my thing to get you to do the thing, I'm gaining commitments. That's what it is. Coaching and selling are similar to me. I got to sell you on doing the thing and reassociate to that all the time. And so, I also had the presupposition that the answers are inside of you. When I'm teaching, I have the answers. And at the highest level of all of this, what I get to do a lot now, it's consulting. Consulting, a lot of people say they're consultants, but you need a lot of experience to be a consultant and to be really good because consulting basically in this context, I'm just going to tell you what to do. Like there's no teaching. I'm not asking you lots of questions. I might ask you some questions, but I look at your stuff. Here's what you need to do. I'm consulting you. So there's like six skills, you know, it's speaking, selling, teaching, training, coaching, consulting. And so they're a little bit different. And I think people need to know how to wear those hats and where people are in the process. And so if somebody's not enrolled yet in my thing, I'm not like training them. And a lot of people want to move the free line. So they're doing all these free workshops and things like that. But these people aren't fully bought in yet. Maybe it's good to teach a little bit, train a little bit so people can get an experience of what it would like be like to be led by you. And I've I've seen there's people in my life right now like when I saw Chase I was like I would like to be coached and trained by this guy. There's things that he's doing obviously very good from a skill perspective but I was like I like who he's being like I want this people person to lead me in the context of getting better at understanding communication and all the things that he does. I was like I want to be led by this guy. If he asked me to do something or said hey read this I would just do it. He wouldn't have to try to convince me. And that's just you know his congruency. Who do you think is we should really pay attention to right now in the sales training space? Like who's really killing it?

>> Well, I mean it sounds, you know, pretty egotistical, but all of the top people that if you can name them, they've been through our stuff

>> and the students that have done most of the other stuff out there in our stuff, all the best ones. You know, there's some successful success companies that teach sales out there. I can tell you all their top people use our stuff 100%. Use our stuff and then when I teach when I learn from people that are like top closer stuff like that, they get hold of our stuff and their minds blown and their sales go up. Um, so it's different and I think people need to learn the basics from all these people, get a script, all of that. But there's there's so much more. And so, you know, obviously Chase Hughes, Eli Sanchez, who I think is the best sales coach ever, and myself, um, we're creating a new sales course, NCI sales. So, it's under Chase's umbrella. We'll have a new YouTube video and the event, the first event's going to be May 15th in Austin. Um, so yeah, we're really excited about it because we've just got, you know, based on data, we just committed coaches that's doing, you know, eight figures a month. The company's just over two years old. It's the fastest growing coaching company in the history of Earth.

>> Oh, that's hectic.

>> Yeah. Fastest growing coaching company in the history of Earth. and we we just have all the data and then all the best sales trainers, a lot of amazing sales trainers out there are coaches inside the company.

>> So we have their calls, their recording, their data and with AI we can clearly see what works like it's not it's not opinion and then there might be a thousand hours of calls that will go into the data on changing one question in the script one question. So we just have all the like and then a test group this question or this question and okay this person asked the question but it didn't you know didn't get a result let's look at it okay it's because they didn't do this or they did this weird thing so it's just data at this point and it's amazing with AI but uh you know with the things that we're doing to help the person you know would chase this stuff to really integrate the person of influence the salesperson or the leader um and then understanding how we can really create a process not just a closing question and offer but an entire process process that absorbs, you know, within the person's unconscious and makes them touch, move, and desiring change and change now. So, we we've got some good stuff, but I'm I'm friends with all the other, you know, top sales trainers out there, too. They're my good friends.

>> They Yeah. Yeah. We we've we got testimonials from most of them. Yeah. And Yeah. We we um people are always when I do a webinar and show, they're like, "How have I never heard of you?" We just we don't really market much.

>> Yeah. You're the ninja behind the scenes.

>> Yeah. It's it's been I've been really blessed, you know, and Tony Tony and I sat down 2019 about creating a sales course together and we had whole process for it. Then I got busy and he got busy with Dean and all of that. But it's something I think, you know, we'll revisit at the end of the year

>> with

>> Yeah. Depending on how this goes with Chase because I'd love to bring us into that because Tony's business mastery is is great, but the sales process, if you've been to it, is is the it's pretty much non-existent and there's like so much we could we could show him. So, I'll uh I'll ping him on that. So, I want to get I want to be able to show him some some data before we do. So, that's that's something I'm manifesting, if you will.

>> Love it, man. Um, dude, we got to wrap this thing up, but where can everyone find you on social media? One moment before we wrap up this episode. If you haven't got your ticket to Dreamfest yet, this is your last chance. Hit the link in the description. Get your ticket and get your spot and be in the room with us for our fifth year and see people like Cody Sanchez and Brian Mark and the rest of the lineup of guests. It's be freaking killer. Hit the link. See you there.

>> Eli Wild_sales is my Instagram and then just Facebook and the website is wildinfluence.com. Uh I'm not on social a lot, but we're starting to we're going to do a whole thing. We got a whole plan. I actually film content in the studio. Content HQ by the way. And um yeah, so Instagram is the easiest place. And then if people go there, there's links and then we got freebies for like hypnotic language and opening in my favorite NLP frames and all of that, they can just message me and get a bunch of free stuff.

>> Love it, man. All right, final question. If you were to go back to your 18-year-old self and give him 30 seconds of advice, what would it be?

>> Man, it's like I read that book, Think and Grow Rich, and that definitess of purpose. I I think just this whole concept, it sounds so cheesy about believing in yourself and really creating daily rituals that install belief. And I would help that young man uh get out of his head. And in order to do that, you need a vision and a mission bigger than you, something to go after because I was so self-conscious, conscious of myself, trying to work on myself. But what allows you to do that is really having a target and a mission and an aim and you grow in the process. So I would align that young man with that.