Transcription
Sam Shimone recently responded to some comments of mine where he argued that faith in Jesus is not enough to get us to heaven, but there's extra good works we must do to be saved. Now, I'm going to show you some of his comments and then respond to each of the points. Here we go.
Stickman stick figure was talking about the Bible says you are not justified by works. Let me show you why this guy is a tool of Satan. This guy is a son of Satan, a dog until he repents.
>> Wow, he speaks about me so nicely. But guess what? The sign of a failed argument is someone giving personal attacks at homonyms. If Sam had good argumentation, he wouldn't need to resort to this. But let's keep going.
>> But to the one who does not work but believes upon him who justifies ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness. Now, when he speaks about works or works, he's talking about the Mosaic law doing the works of the Mosaic law because he's dealing with Jews who are saying the only way you can be faithful is to do the works of the law of Moses. He goes, "Baloney, you need to believe on the God whom justifies and makes people righteous, who meets people where they're at in their ungodly state, and will then justify them, make them godly, and then you have to let him tell you what he requires of you in order for him to make you godly and make you righteous."
>> Where did it say that in the passage? Now, it's a very clear passage. Romans 4:5. It's one that defeats the idea of any sort of works salvation. He says, "And to the one who does not work but believes." Now, Sam says, "Oh, this work is only work of the Mosaic law." It doesn't say that, Sam. That would be to add into the text something that's not there. In fact, the immediate context, Paul's making the point about a principle of works. He says, "Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due." This is not now to the one who works the Mosaic law. It's just saying if you do work at the end of the day when your boss gives you your wages, he's not giving it to you as a gift, he's given to you because he owes it to you. This is the context of what Paul's saying here in Romans 4. And so when he says to the one who does not work, same word and and the word work just means deeds or actions. If you don't do deeds or actions, but you just believe in the one who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness.
Notice Sam wanted to say that God's going to then tell you all these righteous deeds that you need to be doing in order to be made righteous. That's not what it says. It says your faith is counted to you as righteousness. Because Paul's point is that if you are justified before God by your works, it gives you an opportunity to boast. Have a look. Chapter 4:2. For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. See, if Abraham got made right or counted as righteous because of deeds or actions he did, whether it was leaving his homeland or being circumcised or any other deed, offering up sacrifices, then he would have a reason to boast. He could say, "I'm right before God cuz look what I've done." Gives them a reason to boast. But if we see what actually happened with Abraham, next verse, what does the scripture say? Abraham believed God and it was counted to him as righteousness. There was no deeds or actions that Abraham had to do to be counted as righteous. He just believed God. Believe what about him? Well, God gave him a promise. And it says that Abraham was fully convinced that God was able to do what he had promised. And that is why his faith was counted to him as righteousness. No deeds or actions required on Abraham's part to be counted as righteous. So it wouldn't make any sort of sense for Romans 4 to be talking about works of the law anyway because Abraham was before the law.
Now it's true in chapter 3 Paul did say that people are not justified by works of the law such as Romans 3:28. For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law. And so he's directly combating here the idea that many Jewish people had that doing works of the Mosaic law is what made them right before God. But notice what he doesn't say. He doesn't say we hold that one is justified by works just not works of the Mosaic law. Mm- He says we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law. So he tells us what we're justified by. He never says that we are made right before God by our deeds or our actions. So in order for Sam to make the point that well it's actually all these extra works that we have to do in order to be justified whatever God commands of us in order to be justified would be to undermine Paul's entire point.
Does God want you to be able to boast in his eyes? No. 1 Corinthians 1 speaks about how God's chosen the nobodies in the world so that no human being might boast in the presence of God. So if God is letting you into heaven because wow, you've got baptized. Wow, you've shared the gospel. You went to church every week, you'd have a reason to boast before God. And Paul's argument in Romans 4 hinges on justification being instantaneous thing. Because he makes the point in Romans 4:10, how then was it counted to him, was it before or after he had been circumcised? Now, the circumcision he's talking about here is not actually the Mosaic law work. This is the specific command that God gave to Abraham in Genesis 17, which was still 400 years before the Mosaic law. So, he's not talking about works of the law here specifically. But his point is, was Abraham justified before he did the work of circumcision? So, before he did an act of obedience or after? And his point is it was not after, but it was before he was circumcised. Cuz if it was after, people could say, "Ah, that's why you're justified, Abraham. Look, you got circumcised. Of course, that's why God justified you." And so, glory goes to Abraham. But instead, Paul's point is he received the sign of circumcision as a seal of the righteousness that he had by faith while he was still uncircumcised. The purpose was to make him the father of all who believe without being circumcised so that righteousness will be counted to them as well. So justification is an instantaneous thing of you being made right before God and it's not on the basis of you obeying any set of commands of God which means it's not even based on baptism which is what so many people wrongly think and that would give you a reason to boast. In fact, many people see that baptism is the fulfillment of circumcision. And so the point is that circumcision never justified a person in the Old Testament. So why would baptism suddenly justify us in the New Testament? Salvation's always been the same way anyway. Old covenant and new covenant, it's always been by faith and never by anything extra. So therefore, to suddenly add extra works on would be to undermine Paul's point in Romans 4. He tells us that we are just simply to share the faith of Abraham. If we have the same faith Abraham had, one that just trusted God's promise, then we too get counted as righteous. He says that's why it depends on faith in order that the promise may rest on grace.
Notice what many people do. They say, "Look, okay, it's not circumcision that gets us into heaven because that's the Old Testament stuff. That's old covenant." But that's actually not specifically the argument Paul's making here in Romans or in Galatians. His argument isn't, "Oh, that's old. Stay with the new." There's New Testament commands you've got. His argument is it's not grace if you add extra acts of obedience to get you to heaven. Think of Galatians 5:4. He says, "You are severed from Christ. You who be justified by the law, you have fallen away from grace." So the issue with adding anything extra on means that you're not believing in a grace-based salvation. Grace means undeserved kindness or unmmerited favor. So as soon as you say, "Well, I've got the grace of justification because I got baptized or I've done this good deed or that good deed." It's no longer grace because it's no longer undeserved. It's now deserved. If I tell you I've got some pretty cool glasses here and I'll give them to you as a free gift, but only if you clean up my house first. Now, as much as these glasses are really cool, if you have to clean up my house to get them, these are no longer a free gift, you're working for them. And the issue is is that if you make, I got baptized, I shared the gospel, I cleaned up my life, I'm not sinning as much, I go to confession, I go to church, you are making your salvation dependent upon what you're doing. It's no grace anymore.
>> Let's now argue the way need a facelift.net does. Let's assume by works of the law. It means any and all kinds of works. Not just the works of the law of Moses. If he's right, work is to be defined by any righteous deed you do. Not just the law of Moses, but any commands of Christ. So if I think by obeying Christ and getting baptized that will justify me, then I am trusting in my works. Okay, let's say he's right. What this dumb satanic does not address even though it's in my series. You see here, but believes upon him who justifies ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness. Note what your faith is believing on God, right? But did you know that Jesus said, "Believing on God is a work that you must do." Yeah. John 6:27-29. Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God that you believe in him whom he sent." Now, we got a problem. Jesus says, "Believing in God is a work you must do." But according to this butcher, the way he defines work, belief cannot be a work you do because he interprets work not the works of the law Moses but any and every type of work which means yes Paul contradicting Jesus because Jesus says believing in him is the work that God requires. He thinks that believing in Jesus is a work and he goes to John 6:29 to support that when this verse doesn't actually support his case. Have a read of it very carefully. This is the work of God that you believe in him whom he has sent. Now, this is not saying this is work you need to do. He's saying this is the work of God. This is God's work that you believe because God is the one who's instrumental in making us pay attention to the gospel and raising up laborers and even softening our heart to hear the good news. It's the work of God. It's like this. If I said, "This is the work of the electrician that you now have lights on in your house." Am I saying that you're the electrician and that you've done the work of the wiring in the house? Not at all. I'm saying this is the work of the electrician that you now have lighting in your house. And this is what Jesus is saying. This is the work of God that you believe. God is the one who brings a person to faith. That's the whole point of John 6. God is the one who grants a person to come to him. So his whole argument is being knocked down on its face if he thinks that believing is a work that you need to perform.
Now he goes here because Sam already believes in a worksbased salvation. He already believes that trusting in Jesus is insufficient. Even though Romans 4:5 says to the one who does not work but believes, Sam's like, "No, that's not enough." So, in essence, Sam doesn't want to believe in a grace-based salvation. Paul says here, "If it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works. Otherwise, grace would no longer be grace." So, as soon as you add even one work, it is not gracebased salvation. So, Sam, you can't say it's based on some of your works. And also you want salvation do completely by grace. You can't have your cake and eat it too. Now many will say, "Oh, look. It's just gracious that God allows us to do these works to get us to heaven." But that's not grace. It's like me saying, "Look, it's so gracious that I'm allowing you to clean my house to get these glasses. That doesn't mean that those glasses are a free gift if you still have to clean my house." So if you add any extra requirements on, you don't have gracebased salvation. This is very clear. So he's telling you, see, it's not trusting in your works, your baptism, your your confession. No, that's not what Paul is talking about. He's talking about it's not the works of the law. That's the context. But if he's right, it's no righteous work you do, be it baptism, confession, eukarist, charity, well then it can't even be believing that will make you righteous. Just notice that he did agree that those are works. Baptism, confession to the priests, taking the Eucharist. He agrees they're works. So, I really don't find it helpful when Catholics say, "Oh, we don't believe in a worksbased salvation." They do. Even Sam admitted that those works are required to do to be saved. That's a worksbased salvation. When we say works based salvation, we don't mean that you just think it's works, but you think works at least play some part in getting you to heaven. That is still a worksbased salvation.
>> It's not that works will not be rewarded for immortality. It's that the works that the Jews were insisting you must do to be rewarded immortality is the works of the law. Paul says, "No, that's not it. It's whatever works God requires of you at that time. During Moses, you have to do the works of Moses. Now, you must do the works of Christ, what Christ has commanded through his church." Hence the sacraments.
>> Wow, that is really revealing to see what Sam is trusting in. Notice he's saying that the way to be in right standing before God is to do the commands, the works that God is commanding you to do. And he's saying, well, it's not for us the works of Moses, not circumcision and things like that, but now it's the other works, the New Testament works. Well, he says to be perfect. But Sam makes a massive blunder here in saying that how he thinks people were made right before God in the Old Testament was by doing the works of Moses. The whole point of Romans 4 is to show that justification has always been the same way by faith and by faith and nothing more. So he gives Abraham as the example. He came before the Mosaic law. But then he gives David as a second example and he's during the time of the Mosaic law. And have a look what Paul says in regards to David. Just as David also speaks of the blessing or the one to whom God counts righteousness apart from works, Sam saying that those in the Mosaic law period were justified by doing the works of the Mosaic law. David says no, you don't get counted as righteous by works at all. Not even by works of the Mosaic law. And so Sam, if salvation has actually always been just by faith, trusting in the promises of God in the Old Testament, why would it suddenly be now by works? It's not.
Paul makes that case after mentioning Abraham and how he was justified by faith. He says here in verse 23 of the same chapter, "But the words, it was counted to him, were not written for his sake alone, but for ours also. it will be counted to us who believe in him who raised from the dead Jesus our Lord who was delivered up for our trespasses and raised for our justification. So based on what Paul's saying here is that if we simply believe in him who raised from the dead Jesus our Lord that same righteousness will be counted to us. Notice Paul doesn't add works on he doesn't mention oh doing the sacraments is how you're going to get counted as righteous. doing confession to a priest just says believe. This message of the gospel is so simple and yet people miss it. Sam misses it. It reminds me of these people in 2 Timothy 3:7 who are always learning and never able to arrive at a knowledge of the truth. Unfortunately, that sounds like Sam at the moment where he's not even 100% sure if he's going to go to heaven when he dies. Always learning. He may have to cite different passages here or there, but hasn't arrived at the knowledge of the truth. A knowledge of the truth would be how I know I'm going to heaven because my savior died for me.
You see, on judgment day, what do you want God to look at when he looks upon you and he says, "You're okay. Welcome in. Come to heaven." What do you want God to be looking at? If you're depending upon your sacraments, your charity, you're doing nice things and avoiding mortal sin, you're really wanting God to look at you and your own righteousness. When what the Bible clearly teaches that you don't want God to look at what you've done, the filthy rags, the sins, even your greatest deeds will probably have sins in them. Instead, wouldn't it make sense for when God looks upon you, he doesn't look at your sin, he looks at the perfect righteousness of Jesus? Because what happened on that cross is that all of our sins got counted to Jesus. He got treated as though he did all of our sins so that we could be treated as though we lived Jesus's perfect life. And this is clearly what the Bible teaches. It says in Isaiah 53:11, "Out of the anguish of his soul, he shall see and be satisfied." Talking about Christ here. By his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant, make many to be accounted righteous, and he shall bear their iniquities. See what's happening on that cross. Christ bore our iniquities, all of our sin upon him. And what he also did is he accounted us as righteous. So even though we're guilty, even though we've done many sins, God was happy to treat us as righteous. even though we've done many sins in our life. This is the message of Christianity. And if anyone is telling you that that's a bad idea, that you shouldn't believe that, they're wanting you to trust in yourself. And what does trusting in yourself lead to? Being put to shame.
>> So what gets you into heaven? Obedience to Christ, obeying his commands. Well, in the parable Jesus gave to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous. So relying on their actions, not simply what Christ did. What do we see happen to the person trusting in himself? The one who says, "Lord, but I've done this. I've done that." He's the man, Jesus says, that does not go home justified. But the one who comes to the end of himself realizing, "What could I ever offer to God that would undo my sins?" As the hymn Rock of Ages says, "Not the labors of my hands can fulfill your laws demands. Could my zeal no restbite know? Could my tears forever flow? All for sin could not atone. You must save and you alone." The Judaizers thought that they could keep the Old Testament Mosaic law, at least part of it, for their acceptance before God. What so many people today think is that keeping laws of the New Testament is going to be part of their acceptance before God. Same error, same location where they'll end up. So don't be like them. Rely on Jesus. Jesus is not happy to be a part savior. Either you have all of him and only him and therefore don't trust in your works and actions to save you or you have him entirely. Where you say nothing in my hands I bring but simply to the cross I cling. And when you do then you can know I've come to the knowledge of the truth. I know I'm going to heaven. My savior died for me. Sam would be struggling under the weight of his own sin. He talks about it quite regularly. He's not sure where God's going to send him. Very similar to Muhammad where Muhammad said he didn't know where he's going when he dies. So lift up Sam in your prayers that he may come to the knowledge of the truth. But also may he not be influencing people to believe a message that cannot save.
[music] >> For all of the glory of God and are justified by his grace [music] as a gift through the redemption that is in Christ [music] Jesus.