Straight Black Men are a Cancer???? the Men’s Table

Is the river. Keep on, just keep on, keep on. You keep on, you can. I keep. Yes. Yes. You can never be what you want. You can never be able to keep on. Heat. Heat. You keep on, just keep on, you and gentlemen.

It has now come to the time that we have a conversation. I've been saying for years on this show that black men need to have a conversation. Black men alone. We have got to figure out what is going on with us. This is not something that black women can help us with. This conversation does not include black women. Black women stand down and stand to the side. Black men need to have a kumbaya amongst themselves. And I'm gonna niche this out a little more. And it's heterosexual black men. I'm going to catch a lot of flack for this, but I'm going to say it out loud with my whole chest. Straight black men are the cancer of the black community. That's where it starts and that's where it stops.

Ladies, I'm here to tell y'all something. All this [ __ ] that y'all got going on, some of y'all, not all of y'all, with the gays and with the trans, let it go. Your issue is not a trans woman. Your issue is not a punk or not a [ __ ]. Your issue is all of our issue. Straight black men. Straight black men are the enemy to the gays. Straight black men are the enemy to the trans. Straight black men are who are causing harm to the girls and the women. That's where it's at.

Now, y'all can shoot the messenger. Y'all can call me all type of [ __ ] on the shade room and all the other blog sites that's going to pick this up and I eat it. But you'll never see a situation where girls and women walking around saying they scared of the gay boys. They scared of their life for the gay boys. They don't want to be around the gay boys. It ain't nothing.

Tasha K, we've been good since Spoon's wedding. Somehow or another you got a wild hair up your ass and decided let me pick [ __ ] with Funky Da and why when people can't access you physically they will try to access your emotions. Try to keep my peace with you, okay? But Tasha K, I want you to know this and you can put this on record, okay? You can put this on record. The next time I publicly see you, I am going to walk up to you and I am going to [ __ ] the [ __ ] out of you and then I'm already just throw my set up and be ready to your husband. And the sad part about it is I actually like your husband a lot. I have no problems with your husband. You on the other hand, Tasha, you're the same raggedy [ __ ] that every time you see.

So Atlanta people, how come every time somebody driving crazy, it's somebody with a floor? Don't talk like that, [ __ ] Put some goddamn bass in your voice.

"Straight black men are a cancer to the black community."

"Straight black men are the cancer of the black community."

"Black men are the cancer of the black community."

The comment that I dropped was that I agree and reporting for duty.

I understand why my name wasn't mentioned. It was recently brought to my attention that some dude obviously looking for attention, so I won't mention his name. And honestly, I appreciate it because what that tells me is this. There's an awareness that if black people are directed to my platform, they're going to encounter something very different from the typical conversation. They're going to see a body of work that is rooted in data, context, and balance. A platform that holds everyone accountable while also ensuring that black men are accurately represented, not broadly mischaracterized. So when my name isn't said, I don't take that as disrespect. I take it as validation. Validation that the work I'm doing over here matters. Validation that the message carries weight and validation that when the full picture is presented, when the truth is laid out clearly, it challenges narratives that some people, some black people would rather leave unexamined. So for that, I'll say this directly. I appreciate you, Dandre Whitfield, because not only saying my name confirms something I've already come to understand. When the truth about black men is presented in a complete and balanced way, it doesn't always get amplified. Sometimes it gets avoided. And you refusing to tag me or mention my platform is exactly why the black community feels comfortable calling straight black men cancerous.

"Straight black men are the cancer of the black community."

"I agree. And reporting for duty."

In what world would any group of people accept being labeled a cancer to their own community? Think about what I'm saying here. What rational person hears that and agrees with it and yet somehow it gets normalized in the black community? Go figure.

"Straight black men are the cancer of the black community."

Because accepting language like that and encouraging others to accept it, that's absolutely not progress. In fact, it's embarrassing. It's embarrassing to black men. It's embarrassing to black leaders, black fathers, black sons. The word cancer is not casual language. From a real world standpoint, especially from someone with the background in health and dealing with cancer within my own family, that is a very serious term. Cancer represents something destructive, something invasive, something that needs to be removed. So when you apply that label to a group of men, your own black men, you are not making a critique. You are making a dehumanizing statement. And I'm not here for that. I don't trust most black leaders to speak on the behalf of black men because too many of you don't know black men. Too many of you are afraid to look at the facts and the statistics to see what your fellow black men are doing. That's why I don't trust you all.

All right. All right. All right. Welcome, welcome, welcome to another episode of The Men's Table. I'm your host, Jeff St. James from Ask a Brother podcast. I'm going to introduce our guys and then our special guest for this evening. I'm going to start with the business bully himself, Dave Anderson. Welcome, good sir.

Thank you, brother. Always happy to be here. Yes, indeed.

Uh, then we got Mr. uh Smooth over there. He got the new uh portrait approach. Got a front facing for the first time. So, I'm like, this is gonna be a good show. Darwin McFersonson. What's going on, bro?

What's what's going on? Can you hear me?

Yeah, I can't even hear your phone.

Cool.

All right, then we got Mr. Mumia Obsidian Ali. What's happening, good sir?

Good evening, everybody. How are you doing? Great to be here.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then last but not least, man. Uh, the the accomplished actor, uh, uh, the the actor who's acted his entire life. Welcome to the Men's Table for the first time. Good brother, the comp, the incomparable Mr. DARE with it. What's going on, man?

My brother, life is good.

That's what's up. That's what's up. Now, for starters, before I before we even jump into the weeds of what we all thought about all those different clips, um, I'm just going to say to everybody that's currently watching, uh, regardless of whatever channel or platform you're watching from, please make sure that you're subscribed and following all the gentlemen that you see on the screen. And if you're not a member of any of our pla, our channels or platforms, please make sure that you become a member. At least me and Dave, we got some cheap memberships for sure. And thank you to everybody that's been supporting this brand, supporting this new um approach and panel that we've been building and putting together. It's all thanks to you all. So, make sure we say again that you subscribe, that you like, and that you send to at least two, three, four, even five people. And if you have a particular question, comment, or remark that you want us to highlight over the course of the show, make sure you hit that super chat button so that we do not miss it.

Oh, man. Well, uh, Mr. Whitfield, I'm gonna start with you, man. Uh.

You have, you, you have to.

Uh, so it, it was wild for me to see that initial uh video from uh, uh, what's his name? Funky Geneva.

Funky Diva.

Yeah, Funky Deneva. And um, I had a lot of competing thoughts in my head about why he narrowed down so specifically on black men being described as a cancer in the community. When I think about all the different issues that's contributing. Um, and then I was even more shocked when I looked down in the comments and said and saw that you was checking in. So, I was like, man, I can't wait to hear this brother's response. I knew he was going to have to have one after cuz I knew.

Yeah. So, so for you, when you first saw that, how did you take it to warrant that reaction and why did you do a follow-up, uh, you know, more fleshed out explanation?

Yeah. So, first, what we have to, we have to be able to to define certain terms. Um, in my book, Male Versus Man, I talk about how males look to be served while men look to be of service. And unfortunately, not very many people understand the difference between those two. But we have to be able to understand where people are coming from. Just because someone says something doesn't mean they actually mean what they say. Many people speak this language, but very few people have command of it. So when he made that statement, I understood exactly what he was talking about. Unfortunately, black males look like black men. Why? They got hair on their face. They got pecs. They seem to uh carry themselves in a certain manner. They got the same physiques. But we are two completely different people. But in understanding what he was trying to convey, like I said in the post that I made following up on it, black men step up and take responsibility for things that we don't even break. So when I talked about those things, I was being very specific about us as black men. Yeah. We take responsibility for those things. things that we have no responsibility for. Now, the responsibility that black men do have is that we have to help our young black males and sometimes older black males matriculate their way into manhood so that we can become the the servant leaders that we were intended to become when we were created. So, when I spoke to that, that was a very specific thing. Of course, I know the blowback that comes behind that, but that now opens up the conversation. What is meant by that? Our black males aren't a cancer that we have to obliterate, but their behavior is very cancerous. That cancerous behavior kills so many things that are inside our community. It harms our women. It harms our children. So, no, we don't have to annihilate our black males, but what we have to do is we have to annihilate the behaviors that are cancerous to our our community. And how do we do that? Again, giving them information and instruction that allows them to matriculate into manhood. Because black men aren't the cancer of our community. We are the canteen of our community. Our community is dehydrated of manhood. And that manhood is the thing that resuscitate and restores our community. So when I said, "Yep, reporting for duty," it was because that's what men do. We've we report for duty in order to take responsibility for things, even the things that we aren't responsible for.

Um, I definitely want to know everybody's thoughts on even the response and explanation from uh Dandre, Mr. Whitfield. Uh, I think I want to start with uh Mr. McFerson first. Darl, you're on mute.

Okay. Sorry about that.

Mhm.

So, I guess I guess my only question. So, whenever I hear stuff like this, I got a lot of questions because some of these clips, they just they move so fast. You don't get a lot of context. Uh, rarely do people elaborate because the algorithm is best suited for videos within 120 uh seconds. So, one of the questions I had and I think I'll pose it to Mr. Whitfield if I can. Uh, when you say it's the behavior that is cancerous, which which is worse, the cancer itself or the one the author or the person who orchestrates the cancer?

Well, your your cancerous behavior can be determined or deemed a cancer to those who are falling prey to it or falling victim to it. So, those are really semantics. What we're really talking about are behaviors that harm our women or that harm our children. And really, that comes on a on a number of different levels, right? So if uh if a young brother doesn't have a navigation system in a man that gives him the kind of information and instruction that he needs in order to comport himself in a specific way that helps our community be what it's supposed to be, then those behaviors can be quite harmful. And so subsequently, those kinds of behaviors can be cancerous and to some people who who endure it, it can be deemed as a cancer. So what we're really talking about is one and the same.

So, so the, is the navigation system already given or is that something that had to be passed down?

No.

Something that got to be trained or educated or or conditioned?

It has to be trained on. You know, there are a bunch of us.

So, right, so, so my point is, if we're send, if we're sending black men out or young boys, because I would argue that it starts before they become a man. If you're sending them out into the community, out into society to interact with women,

who are calling these men or or whatever that is calling these men cancers,

you're sending them out without the navigation system.

How do we penalize somebody who is mal-equipped? Shouldn't we shouldn't we also, you know, throw in the uh, the responsibility of those who are who are responsible for these young boys?

Yeah. But, you know, it's, it's interesting. You know, my father went to prison. My father kidnapped me when I was 6 years old. My father went to prison for manslaughter when I was 13 years old. I have two biological children. But, as I stated in my in my post and speaking about this particular topic, even though I only have two biological children, I have countless bonus children. And many of those children are young males who didn't have a navigation system because they were fatherless. And that's not their fault. So again, as I said earlier, men take responsibility for things that they didn't even break. I wasn't responsible for creating that that young man or excuse me, that young male who doesn't have a navigation system. But I do take the responsibility of giving him the information and instruction that allows him to be able to show up like the man that he was created to be.

Right. I, I agree. I think that's very fortunate that you're able to do that. But if we're speaking for the totality or majority of black men, they're just not fortunate. And I think it's just, I think it's uh unfair to call black men a cancer based off of their behavior when we're not elaborating on how that behavior was configured. Again, we can't, we can't ping-pong this, right? So, I just explained earlier that certain behaviors can be cancerous to our community. Now, what someone else chooses to call that, and again, as I said, I understood exactly where they were coming from. And as I said, as I stated right from the beginning, we have to really be able to determine what people are trying to get at. Just because someone says something doesn't actually mean that that's what they actually mean. Some people don't have enough command of the language in order to be able to express themselves properly. So when I talked about furthering this conversation, the conversation is how do we get to our young males in order to give them what is necessary for them to be equipped to help our community be resuscitated and restored. And that's going to come off the backs of men like us that have the information and instruction and to be able to take those young males and to say, "Hey, listen. This is how your behavior can be harmful to our community and this is who you were destined to be. I understand that you don't know what that is because you didn't have the benefit of having a navigation system that allowed you to be able to matriculate into manhood. And now that we know that every single man in our community has the ability to grab one. We heard the expression each one teach one. Unfortunately, too many of us are not playing our position. Too many of us are not are uh answering the call of our divine assignment."

All right. So, I'm going to yield to uh, I guess the next speaker, but hopefully we can get into the details into specific behaviors that would trigger uh a narrative like this in in the future of this conversation. But go ahead, Jeff.

Yeah. Yeah. I want Dave to come in next, but I want to read a couple super chats. And guys, if everybody's currently still watching, please make sure that you hit those super chats to support the brand, support the panel, support, you know, all the different things we're trying to build, and especially if you have questions or comments. Um, Quasi Samson writes, thank you for $4.99. Talk about how gay men try to claim a higher level of morality than straight black men. We we'll definitely have a conversation about, you know, the origins of that particular comment and some of the trends of of men that happen to not be heterosexual having very strong opinions about heterosexual men. For sure. Uh, Doldis Jenkins, thank you for the $2. Society wants black men and our boys buck broken. Yeah, we we gonna have a conversation relating to that too in terms of this particular. Thank you for Mr. Philip for Sadi for the $5 as well. And then last but not least, Mr. X-Ray, thank you for the $10. What are the behaviors? I'm interested to know if it's criminal behavior or masculinity. Appreciate Brother Whitfield showing up. We'll definitely tap on that for sure in terms of what some of the concerning behaviors are, but Dave, why don't you uh go ahead and expound on what you've heard and seen so far.

Yeah, but before I do that, Jeff, uh DAR, I just want to tell you a few things. The first thing I want to say to you is God bless you, brother. Um, I have been a big fan of yours since you were Robert on the Cosby Show. Um, my mom and Bill Cosby grew up together in the Richard Allen Projects. Um, I love the majority of your work. I even love your taste in wives, bro. I am a huge fan of. Respectfully, I'm a married man. Like people tell me my wife is beautiful all the time. What I'm saying is, see, that's the problem. Jeff, you and these sound effects, we're going to stop being disrespectful. We're going to have a nice, clean, orderly conversation. Sally Richardson Whitfield is one of the best directors,

one of the best actresses, and one of the most dominant women in Hollywood, but people don't give her her flowers cuz y'all keep going, "Damn, she fine. I saw her in Posi." Be respectful.

Be respectful.

But no, in all seriousness, brother, um, I, I really appreciate you being here because this is not an easy room to be in. So, first of all, welcome. This is easy for me to be in.

Not yet. I'm. This is easy for me to be in, my brother. Well, I.

I'm glad you feel that way. I have so many questions. Um, the first thing I want to ask you is when you saw that particular clip of Funky Dinea contradicting himself, um, after saying that black men are the cancer and the sissies and his words, not mine, the sissies and the gay boys are not black women's problem. But he goes on to physically threaten, demean, and degrade a black broadcaster by calling her all types of raggedy [ __ ] and then saying that he is going to slap her when he sees her and then square up and fight his fight her husband. Um, do you think that that behavior in and of itself is cancerous? And if not, why not?

Absolutely. Hold up. First of all, let's let's take a pause here.

And and and and I want I want all of my brothers to get this. And Jeff.

Mhm.

I need you to redirect this room.

Okay.

Because I am not speaking on behalf of Funky Dyna. I'm not Funky Diva's attorney.

I'm not Funky Diva's advocate. What Funky Dyna said about bringing harm to.

I found it, I found it, uh, the the irony of a person talking about how um black males are the cancer of the community and accused us of having that cancerous behavior and then actually displaying the very thing that is cancerous.

Because I, I am certain not one of us in this room has ever threatened to slap a woman.

That was absolutely crazy. So I don't know how we got to this space of me being the one that is now speaking for Funky Da.

Oh, let me be clear. I'm not asking you to speak for him. I'm asking as. So let me put it a different way.

Or or even speaking on his behalf.

Not at all. First of all, you're your own man. Funky Doniva is his, her. I don't know his pronouns. Um, his own person.

Uh, but what I'm saying is, do you have a daughter?

Absolutely.

I have two. Okay. One is 26.

The other one is 11.

Mine is 21.

Right. So, you know what it is navigating that space from being Superman to being the father who has to watch his daughter go through life.

No question.

Right. And how um even at our level, very handcuffing that could be cuz all the Hollywood, all the money, all that stuff cannot stop her from the hurts that the world has for her.

Right. I am asking as one brother to another who happens to be a father, when you saw that individual who gave you a clarion call that you responded to voluntarily say something that is reprehensible, reprehensibly diametrically opposed to what he said because he said straight black men are cancerous, but he's delivering the very cancerous behavior that he accuses us of. I'm not asking you to speak for him. I'm asking you as a father of an adult girl or adult woman, how did that make you feel and how do you respond to that? Because I condemn those comments outright. That's not me speaking for Funky Da. Me standing in the gap and making sure as a father, as a black straight man who is not responsible for it, but now it's my duty to fix the thing that I did not break, which is standing up for a black woman who is being threatened and it's on some on-site type stuff. I'm asking you specifically, not as his representative, not as his lawyer, not as his attorney, but as a father looking objectively

at someone threatening some other black man's daughter with physical violence and calling her out of her name. Am I in the right room?

Am I in Jeff? Am I in the right room? The way I'm hearing this way.

The way I'm hearing this question, listen.

Go ahead.

My work as a black man and an advocate for black women and an advocate for black people as a whole. is you, you can, you can look for for decades.

It's not up for questioning. Hold on.

It's not even up for dispute.

It's not even a. So to ask a question like that of me with a wife that you so generously highlighted in the beginning of the comment, that we've been together for 28 years.

Yes, sir.

I have a 21-year-old daughter and anyone knows

that in the defense of the women in my life that somebody's back would absolutely be broken in half

if they even thought about threatening

a woman in my life. That kind of question I take great offense to. Let me just say this.

Okay.

But to answer your question,

I was more than offended by that comment and

and absolutely his behavior was beyond cancerous. And like I said earlier, I thought it was quite ironic

that the person who started the question about straight black men

would then go on to do what he did. So emphatically, let everyone be clear about that and I, I hope that the conversation gets redirected or repositioned because I, I really don't understand why that question would even be posed based on what my stance has been about black women and the black community. I'm, I'm very confused by it.

It's not. I think I think there's a there's a disconnect in the question in and of itself and how you're receiving it. So, I apologize. Let me, let me be clear. What I'm saying is, right, this individual, it, it's kind of like if somebody, like, I'll give you an example. When I was 561 pounds, I wasn't telling people, uh, go work out. I went and did the work before I gave anybody any weight loss advice. If an individual gets on God's internet and says, "Hey, straight black men are a problem." And then there is a clip of him being the very problem and he's not straight, but he is a black man. And the same way that you took it upon yourself, and again, I'm not holding you responsible for what he said. Let me be clear. All I'm saying is, I can divorce myself from somebody's negative comments, which are extremely harmful, poisonous, let what's the word? From cancerous to straight black men who are doing the work, who are standing in the gap. I can say Funky Dyna may have a point, but on this particular issue, I condemn it. That doesn't have anything to do with your countless decades of work, your dedication, your fatherhood, your manhood, your husbandry. Absolutely not. I'm saying on the record for people who have asked us in mass through our DMs, through our emails, through our private messages and our phone conversations because they knew you were going to be here. Are you going to be as emphatic in your condemnation of those particular hurtful, cancerous comments as you were when you were reporting for duty? That's not even the crux of the conversation, but I want to get that out of the way so we can have the real conversation. Let, let's also take into account for God's internet.

Timing. These comments made by him are quite fresh. I didn't make my post with regard to what was said on the same day that he made his post.

I often don't. There are often one or two days when something breaks before I actually post a response, a retort, a reaction. Um, so I want everyone to be quite clear about what timing is.

And again, I think it also speaks to what men do. A lot of people who lack manhood simply react. Certainly.

Before they think.

And get clear about creating a response.

And so when you hear a response for me,

that usually means that I have great clarity about what that situation is before a response is posted because I'm not a boy. Boys react. So, we have to be very clear about what those things are.

And and and and be clear about how we're supposed to maneuver ourselves on God's internet.

I agree.

I want to um, just a couple couple super chats and then I'm going to give my thoughts and response to everybody including you. Um, Mr. uh Dandre, perception is reality. Uh, at my high school campus, I teach at the old school brothers. Had to take a step back on some things. LBG, LBGTQ brothers, I feel have more pull on the campus. Interesting. And he says, "What's your thoughts on black men who have been mentors and teachers and are burnt out feeling the hard work isn't paying off in the community?" Man, that's definitely something I think we're going to touch on because I've been there and I've kind of seen that as well. And then last but not least, appreciate the others who have also given um as well. And then Mr. Tristan Smith, agreeing with the bent risk coalition is wild work. It's bad enough we get disingenuous hate from the real sisters, but now it's coming from the Sedo sisters as well. We can't tolerate it. Um, man, I'm gonna give you my my thoughts. Uh, because I actually, you know, I actually,

especially hearing you explain it more and watching that original clip that you put out in the response and then seeing how you've been responding to Darwin and um, uh, Dave so far, it makes sense to me. You're you're looking at it through a line of consistency. Um, right. Um, he does something wrong, you, you think that's cancerous. When we do something wrong, you think that it's cancerous. So, in your.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, that that helps me a lot. I think the issue was for me, uh, geocentrism. You know, for the audience and people that's watching it's something that we discuss a lot about a lot of even men don't know examples and the effects of geocentrism until somebody like points it out. And I think um, uh, what's the name, Funky uh Diva.

Yeah, Diva's initial comment, his initial remark that black men are the cancer of the community.

Straight.

Yeah, no. Sorry. Straight black men are the cancer of the community. If you wanted to know potentially whether or not the reason why maybe many of us were so accepting of that statement or just being like, ah, that's fine. And whether or not that's coming from an objective place or maybe leaning more in a geocentric mindset is if you took out straight black men and you left the sentence alone and you put in gay men. A lot of the same people that said that they were fine with the statement about straight black men being the cancer of the black community. If someone was to say out loud, "Black women are the cancer of the black community." If they said, "Gay men are the cancer of the black community." Do we know and fully understand that the reaction and response from the people that overwhelmingly was fine with it being said towards our direction would have had the opposite reaction and response. And the reason why is because they would have seen that as dehumanizing if it applied to gay men or women. So my question is, if you know we're going to be like consistent. I'm not upset with your response cuz I see the consistent statement. But I wanted to know your thoughts about me seeing it that way. Cuz I think a lot of men on the other sides probably saw it like I did and was like, "Hey man, if if we use that same exact language and use the very groups that's pushing this up the most, they're going to try to get people canceled, fired, um, call them a bigot, you know, say that they're using dehumanizing language, get them deplatformed." Me saying out loud like gay men are the the the the the cancer of the black community. That sounds insane to say out loud, but when we're in a geocentric era where we're kind of looking at things primarily through a female lens, it makes sense to me why I think a lot of people couldn't have seen that comparison and how much more damaging it would have been to say that about anybody other than us. What do you think, brother?

Yeah, you know, this is uh and here's the nuance of where we should really be looking at this.

Because as a, look, I am the leader of my house. Not because I tell people what to do.

Because I show people what to do. That's what makes a leader.

Mhm.

Leaders actually take on the responsibility of creating an umbrella of those who they look after, who they are in service to. There are things that my wife is incredibly capable of doing within the confines of our marriage and in our family. But there are certain things that she will react emotionally to that could get us into trouble from time to time. And I have to make sure that I am not acting out of my feelings but examining the facts and then making a decision that allows us to be able to traverse whatever it is that we have to navigate. That is the difference between the men, the women, and the children. So this conversation has to be looked at through the lens of as men, what do we take responsibility for even when we haven't had a hand in breaking it? And are we going to respond in the same way that the women respond, that the children respond, even our brothers who happen to be gay respond?

Okay.

I think I can answer that question.

Yeah.

I think this is a good place to uh to jump in. Um, good evening, Doc. Mr. DeAndre Whitfield of um, I can't say that I'm as familiar with your work as my my colleagues. I've, I came to know of your work through Queen Sugar. Um, watched uh several uh seasons of that. Um, I am also familiar with your off-camera work. Um, so this isn't the first time I've been aware of your presence. Funky Divine statements. Very interesting because on the one hand, the black community wants to promote or foster a kind of new masculinity discussion. So we're talking about a gay black man, very outspoken. I've noticed over the past few years, outspoken gay black men in various guises inveighing on, for lack of a better, let me just be honest here. They're not really known as powerful political commentators or powerful sports commentators. Really, what they discuss is black love issues. And to put a finer point on it, straight black love issues. They never talk about gay black issues. They never talk about lesbian black issues. They only talk about straight black issues. Now, that's interesting to me. Why only straight black men? Why don't THEY TALK ABOUT GAY BLACK MEN? Gay black men don't have issues and love issues. They don't. Well, as it turns out, I'm asking a rhetorical question. They don't. We know that when we look at gay marriage, lesbian marriage, straight marriage, that the least domestic violence, the least infidelity, the least uh uh divorce is actually among gay male couples. So, it makes sense. You're not going to get much clicks and views talking about gay black issues because to be brutally frank, there's nothing to talk about. There, there's no drama. There's no there's no fighting. There's no, there's none of this stuff. And if you talk about lesbian marriages that have the highest divorce rates, the highest infidelity rates, the highest domestic violence rates, you just might get cancelled. YOU JUST MIGHT GET CANCELLED. SO, IT'S EASY to talk about straight black marriages, the download, you know, uh uh uh uh grifting off of black women's fears about the download. There are actually black gay men who make their daily bread ginning up fears of black women about download black men.

That is some nasty work. So, the fact that we're here right now rolling off the lead of a black man talking about other black men being a cancer while at the same time threatening with violence a black woman. And we're supposed to answer the call to that. Seriously, you know, I represent an alternative black masculine community, too. It's called the black manosphere. And we brothers uphold ourselves to a code in five years of operation, no domestic violence, no violence of any kind, none of it. And so I say to Mr. Funky Deneneva and anyone else who finds themselves in league with that, simply this. Why does he care so much about what goes on between black men and black women given that he's a he's a gay black man? And he needs to answer that question honestly. Why does it matter so much? Why do these gay black men CARE SO MUCH ABOUT WHAT STRAIGHT BLACK PEOPLE ARE DOING? DON'T THEY HAVE ENOUGH GOING ON BETWEEN THEIR OWN SELVES? They need to answer that question honestly.

Yeah.

I'll leave it there.

Yeah. Yeah. And and now that I've heard everybody have a little bit of, you know, different back and forth and and my own thoughts listening to Mr. Woodfield and now we can actually get into reacting and responding to things in general. Um, I although I, you know, obviously disagree and and like I said, I, I do think that that language does appear to be something that's uniquely acceptable for heterosexual men, I understand your argument that we're built to take that in a way that everybody else on the other side can't. Um, and I, I actually get and understand that for sure. Um, I wanted to show before we touch on the next question I wanted to throw out to each of you guys about, which is how can black men actually step up to protect a a lot of the community that kind of has this type of attitude where they feel like black men are untrustworthy. They don't want to listen, follow directions, receive feedback from black men about almost anything. How do you actually lead and protect people that don't want to be led and don't want to receive feedback? Um, but what I wanted to show real quick, this was at my wedding and this was actually my side of the wedding party. And two of the gentlemen in this p picture um alongside of me were actually gay friends of mine that I've had since I was over 20 since I was a freshman in high school along with the ladies. So, I'm obviously very progressive. Um, I could have got guys, girls on my side. These are the people I've known almost my whole life. And like I said before, they're both openly out in the open gay. So, this was like a strange subject matter for me because I deal with a world of gay people where they can definitely understand a visceral, nasty, misandrous attitude that's kind of just out there towards straight black men. And you know, I'm like, I think we all can kind of sense and acknowledge that that's happening for black women, too. But I still think it's new territory when it comes to these questions about how do black men lead? Why are they so far behind? Why are we the bottom of the rung? As far and in in our community's eyes, in the world's eyes, we're at the bottom of the rung of a lot of things. Um, I'm going to play this clip and then I want us to answer that question. And how can black men actually protect women?

So if men don't like hoes, can somebody explain to me what's going on here? Her chart looks exactly like the same chart I'm seeing people pass AROUND A MEGAN ESTALLION ONE. YEAH, I DON'T SEE ANYBODY GOING UP TO TRAVIS KELCE CALLING HIM A SIP. I DON'T SEE NOBODY TALK ABOUT TRAVIS KELCE ASKING THEM WHY DID HE PROPOSE to a ranth through woman. RANTH THROUGH CAT IS RANTH THROUGH CAT. WHEN TAYLOR SWIFT GOT PROPOSED TO BY TRAVIS KELCE, WHY DIDN'T WHITE MEN GO AROUND MAKING A GRAPH LIKE THIS of Taylor Swift? No other group of women gets disrespected by their own community on this scale the way black WOMEN DO. AND Y'ALL WONDER WHY BLACK WOMEN act the way they act.

Now notice she notice she's saying ran through cat is ran through cat. She specified that because she knows that Taylor Swift does not behave like me the Stallion. She knows that Taylor Swift does not behave like Meg the Stallion. Presentation is everything. And so what black women believe is that their presentation is good no matter how bad it is. So what Amber is saying is that get married. In other words, black women should be able to get because men want hoes. Now keep in mind, I'll say this again. Black men have asked black women to fix their mouth and they've said no. Black men have asked black women to fix their attitude and they said no. Black men have asked black women to stop wearing someone else's hair. and they said no. But now Amber is saying, "But because men, including black men, want, then we'll oblige that. We won't listen to nothing else, but we'll be host." Isn't that convenient? How convenient is that? How convenient is it for black women to disregard everything black men says, a black man says, but then when it comes to her believing that he wants to, oh, they can do that. They can be hooked very well. I'm going to say this again.

I want to know y'all thoughts about that, man. Because um, I think that what Mr. uh Whitfield said earlier about we at men by default have to take responsibility for things that they're not responsible for. That typically we we do that initially in our own households and then we extend that outside of our homes. But we're dealing with a group that's I think a little bit larger than a small percentage of women now where a lot of the things that the lady, the young lady said in that clip that he was kind and and also what u Mr. black was saying as well. He's saying if you if you got a group of people out there, men or women, that's making it very clear, we going to do what we want. F tradition. We don't we're not thinking about the community. I want to do what I want, what makes me happy. Yes, the community overall suffers, but how do you lead and protect people with that mindset? This is open without popcorn. Anybody can jump in.

I think to ask the question is to answer it, right?

What do you mean? I don't think uh I don't think you have a responsibility to lead anybody who's not willing willing to look at you as their leader or listen to you.

I wouldn't ever put myself uh or sacrifice myself to be a leader or protector of somebody who's going to move by their own beat of their drunk and deviate and do whatever it is they want. There's an alarming rate of black women who are intentionally positioning themselves in society to be able to absorb themselves from being led by men. There's this thing called self sustainability, careers, financial uh sustain, uh stability. All of those things are really uh packaged so that the women don't have to cooperate. So I think leadership and protection should only reach as far as those who are willing to get under a man's covering. And we've seen in many occasions where a man have attached himself to a woman and going out in public and a woman be uh begin to act belligerent and do whatever it is that you want to do and put the man in harm's way. Now this man got to go out and defend her, end up getting beat up or even shot. So it's really, really hard to protect somebody who doesn't cooperate with you. I don't see any benefit in protecting or leading anyone who is unhinged. That's just my opinion fundamentally.

Mr. Whitfield, hold on a second. U Mr. Obsidian, um Mr. Whitfield, can you jump in and let me know your thoughts now that we've heard like both both both those different viewpoints?

Yeah, I think it is to the brother's point. It, it is extremely difficult to lead someone who uh does not want to be led. But that doesn't absolve us of being the leaders that we're we're called to be. Now, I said earlier that I am the leader of my house and very seldom do I actually tell people what to do. In particular, my wife. I don't say, "Hey, do this or do that." The quickest way for me to get my wife to behave in a certain way that I'd like her to or to do certain things that I think that she should do, is for me to model what I want her to mirror.

And often we mistake leadership for telling people what to do. And quite often you can see it even when you when you're dealing with your with with our children. Children don't just learn by listening. They learn more by looking. So

this notion that we can't lead because people aren't listening to us. Yes, it does make it difficult. Yes, it does make it more challenging, but it doesn't absolve us from being the leaders that we're being called to be simply because people are having a tough time listening. They literally will learn more often by looking than they will listening.

Well, I, I got a, I got a little bit of pushback. I understand exactly what you're saying.

But this this called to be, I don't know exactly where that's coming from. I don't know if you're coming from a spiritual lane, a religious lane, but I do know when a woman has a boss and she's being led by him. Uh, we don't have all of these nuances is either you listen or you going to get your ass fired. You know what I'm saying? There's a thing called consequences that we really can't even inflict. Not.

Saying that we supposed to be abusive. Not saying we're supposed to be violent. I'm just saying there is no way to if we have a woman under our covering to be able to correct her if she decides that she don't want to cooperate. And let's not act like it's just it's always justified reasons. And I'm not saying a man is not abusive of his leadership. I'm just saying fundamentally there's no way to inflict any consequences.

For example, let's do scenarios. Let's say that and this is hypothetically. Let's say my wife wants to go outside with a string up her ass and her cheeks hanging up below her shorts saying, "Hey, look, I'm going out with the girls at 8:00 and I say, "You know what? I don't appreciate you dressing like that. I think you should go and change. I appreciate if you put on some more clothes to be more modest because without me being around, I can't protect you from god knows who out there." And if she decides to say, "Hey, look, it's my body. It's my choice. I'm a woman. I'm I'm a grown woman. I'm going anyways. What can a man do? I do remember my uh one of my older uncles, he just passed away, I think at 89. He said back in the days, they slap him on the side the head. Not not trying to encourage, but today you have no there's no consequences. The only thing you can do if you're able to put yourself in a position to be a provider is perhaps maybe cut a credit card off or something like that. But you you really ain't there's nothing you can do.

Oh, >> so I'm saying like I hear about the calling, >> but there's there's something in my mind that's telling me, look, >> some of that some of that needs to be elaborated or substantiated so I can get a better understanding because right now just sounds like a little BS. No disre disrespect to you. >> Sound like Mission Impossible if they don't want to work with you.

Well, first of all, what we have to also um begin to truly understand is that this is one of the reasons why it is necessary for us to have information and instruction about how to be a man. And one of the things that we need information and instruction about is how to choose a woman. If we are choosing women that are to your point, and I I I I get it. I'm sure it's it's an extreme example, but if your woman is threatening to go out with a string up her behind and showing her cheeks and you say, "Uh, I need you to change and I don't want you to go out like that." And she chooses to, that's that's that's not your woman. So this is one of the things that we have to and the consequence is no longer being my woman and subsequently no longer being under my covering.

>> So two things can be true at the same time. One, I can model behavior that I want my woman to mirror and if she is my woman, she will eventually do that. If she goes the route of doing something as drastic as the example that you're talking about, then she finds herself in the position of no longer being my woman and subsequently no longer being under my covering. So, you can be true at the same time.

>> You know what? I I believe you. And I also believe what you just exposed I I believe what you did was you just potentially exposed one of the first domino effects of how cancer can be developed. If that's the solution, because there is no other consequence legally, you can't touch them. If that is the solution, every time you hit a wall when it comes to cooperation between a man and a woman is to break up the family, can't we connect the dots and see how over time that can cause f uh families to break up, uh blended families, even kids to be raised without a father, and on down the line. We have to be able to do enough triage to be able to connect the dots to see how that solution that men have today. It's not viable.

>> It's just not. I get it. She not my woman. But every time I hit a wall with a woman when it comes to cooperation is I got to break up. Can't you see that a lot of guys in this position actually don't want to break up their family? They just want to correct that [ __ ]

>> Yeah. But we're talking about now we got to we got to put certain things in categories. Mhm.

>> If you like sourdough and your and your woman likes rye and you don't want rye in the house and she brings and and and she brings that other brand in the house, that's obviously not reason enough to break up the family, right?

>> So there are certain times where we these are nuanced conversations, right? So every single time our woman doesn't agree with us or or or goes another way that we may not necessarily be feeling fond about is not reason enough to break up the family. And simply because she doesn't agree with everything that we suggest doesn't mean that it's reason enough for us to say, "Hey, you know what? I can't do this anymore." So now we have to really bring nuance into the conversation, right? Because everything doesn't fall under that category.

And look, this is probably one of the bigger challenges that we face now. Yesterday year our fathers, grandfathers were in a position where they were the ones bringing in the money in the house. Subsequently, a woman was defined by the kind of man that she chose and she had to follow everything or every direction that he gave her because he was stabilizing the house financially with what he brought in. Now we're finding ourselves blending our family and blending the financial contribution because black women are black women are now the most educated demographic in the country. So it stands to reason that some of us may find ourselves in a position where our woman is out earning us. Okay. So how do we lead now when we are in this blended financial contribution?

>> I think it's deeper. I think it and I get I think and I'm giving it to you Dave. I think it's deeper than that. You hit the money that now they able to absorb themselves for from such okay so they don't have to re rely on us for survivability like they had to now because they able to self sustain but I just call it just substituting us for a boss now that you got a b you have a boss now. So your boss pretty much absorbs you from full cooperation to the black man. And I know that I don't think when whenever we were allowing these laws to pass, and I'm not like an anti-feminist and anti-equal rights for women, I don't think we thought it all the way through to where our woman would come up out of this situation and pretty much turn their their ass to us and say, "Hey, look, I don't need a man." Because that's essentially what it leads to.

>> I get it. It's it's really hard to get a woman's full cooperation when she has to contribute. But see, this is this is why we have to we we have to start training our young males to understand what the interview process is with a potential partner, a potential woman. What are your views on your financial contribution to our prospective household? And how do you view my leadership as it pertains to the leadership that you get from your boss? How do you see that? Because now this is a different dating and interview process.

>> Well, and I'm gonna let you have it, D, but I >> information and instruction is so necessary.

>> Yeah. I don't uh I'm I'm a I'm cut from a different cloth. My wife can't have a boss. She work for me. I'm her only boss. And I and I would just give you one fundamental example that you might be able to agree with. It's going to be quick. Let's just say that my wife works and we're at home and we're we're hanging out. We watching Netflix, chilling and stuff. And her boss calls her and say, "Hey, look. Hey, somebody had to call out sick. I need you to come in right now. It's an emergency." Is she going to ask me can she go or she going to tell me, "Hey, my boss said I got to go to work." She's probably going to tell me that she got to go and hey, look, I'll see you later. But if you flip it and I said, "You know what, baby? I want you to come home. I want to spend the rest of the day with you. You know, I got some stuff to do." And I call her and I say, "Hey, look, come on home." Is she going to ask her boss to go? Uh, can can she leave?

>> Or or you get where I'm going? She's not gonna she's not going to tell her boss, hey, look, I got to go to my husband. She's gonna ask, can she go? So who has who does she submit to? She don't submit to me.

>> Well, if she wants the revenue she generate, >> if she wants her check, if she wants her position, this is something that the two of you have talked about, >> then then that that answer is is obvious, >> right? I'm not sure. >> That's why I'm saying that dynamic wouldn't work for me because I don't believe I don't want my wife submitting to another man.

>> Would Would it be okay if she submitted to another woman? man, woman, regardless.

>> You consistent. You You definitely consistent, Dave.

>> Yeah. One second. Um, we're gonna I'm gonna let Dave and then, um, Amia, go ahead. Come in. Go ahead, Dave.

>> Couple of things. I just want just for a point of clarity. Um, for me, it's very important when we say things that we are basing those things in actual facts. Not our feelings, not our interpretation, but the actual facts. Because what happens is we continue to perpetuate these myths because they sound good. It's like when people say this, oh well, most black men are gay or in jail or gangbangers. It that's a falsehood. Black women by and large are not the most educated group in America. They are the most enrolled group in America. They are also the group with the highest amount of student loan debt. But beside all of that, what I want to get to is understanding the importance of leadership. Uh Dandre leads his house, Darwin leads his house, Jeff leads his house, I lead my house, and our wives I know um submit to that leadership. Unfortunately for us right here, statistically speaking as 1 2 3 4 1 2 3 4 five versus the community that we have to your words not mine step up to fix that. We did not break. When it comes to the majority of the community and the majority of our women remain unmarried, the majority of our women, especially when you start to get to the ages of 26 to 54, are single mothers. Um, how do you propose we lead that group outside the marital confines? Because like you said, you got thousands of of bonus sons. How do we fix the community that statistically since 1965 has run from a matriarchal perspective basically making our leadership obsolete? How does that exactly work?

>> How do we lead single wh women women in our community? How do we lead our if the majority of our community when we're talking about protecting our women from a leadership perspective and they are not Sally Richardson Whitfield, Jana Anderson, so on and so forth, how do we lead women that do not submit to our brass ring? Because you said it's our responsibility as men to fix the community. The biggest leader in our community for the past six decades have been black women. The majority of black women between the ages of 26 and 54 are single mothers whether they have degrees or not and they tend to fall under what the CIA proposed when it came to feminism. Gloria Steinum all this has been documented have created the whole you don't need a man you are a woman first then you're black. How do we then after six decades of indoctrination that we did not create but we now have to fix. How do we fix that if we're not married to all these women? We're not polygamist?

>> And so I'm trying to understand how you see it because you you've you've taken on the mantle and I'm very proud of you for this. I'm trying to figure out how I can assist you in this to fix that part of the community that is not our wives.

>> Well, unfortunately there are certain things that we can't fix but can address. The thing that I'm addressing is the child because the child is impressionable. So when they see bonus uncle come along and I give them the kind of leadership that they by the way all children are begging for it >> certainly >> they're begging for it because many of our children are being neglected on on many different levels that men can only fill that particular hole right so we have to come in we have to fill that so if that child sees I'll give you a Perfect example. It's a brother friend of mine who passed away a few years ago.

>> Mhm. Left behind two daughters. Every week I just showed up. Now, my intention was to be a bonus father to these young ladies, but I certainly couldn't tell them that. they wouldn't even receive that because they're still grieving over the loss of their father.

>> But my intention was to be a bonus father.

>> All I did every single week was show up just to take out the garbage cans >> to put them on the street. Next day show up just bring in the garbage cans. Didn't say anything to anybody. All those two young ladies saw was a bonus father showing up every week to cover them in this small but gigantically significant way. What began to happen after a couple of months was they began to reach out to me seeking my cover, seeking my advice, seeking my direction. And now, now we have the kind of relationship that just two weeks ago there was a a father and daughter dance >> that one asked me to be a part of. That is how we fill in the gaps. That's how we address certain situations >> that need our fixing. So when I said, "Hey, I if I would have gone up and I would have said, "Hey, listen.

>> You need to have a bonus father."

>> That never would have worked. All I did was showed up every single week. Just show up.

>> And then eventually >> they began to say, "Hey, I know exactly what I need. I need this."

>> And so now what I'm actually going to do is I'm going to actually ask for what I see I clearly need.

>> Okay. And I love that. I do. What what I'm what I'm trying to get at is right. So, you've been in this industry as long if not longer than I have. Right? You know who controls what. You know who the gatekeepers are. You know who who runs absolutely everything. You know who controls our image. And it usually is not us. The last guy who who tried to control our image, well, we know what happened to him. What I'm trying to get at is if we cannot control our messaging in the media because we don't own any of the messaging in the media. If we can not um beyond being the bonus father, which again I admire you for, but if the majority of the people who are currently in charge of a broken community happen to be this group of women who are unmarried, degreed, and have children and feel as though they are empowered regardless of whether we exist or not. How do we then if we're reporting for duty fix that part of the community, the children notwithstanding? Because there are people every every Sunday who find themselves having hedonistic ways and then going to church, hearing a sermon, hearing the call of God and giving their lives over because adults can change at any given time. How do we show up to help our community leaders who are not us, who tend to have ovaries and breast change so that we fix the community that we all agree has been broken and irreparably harmed to such a point where we don't know what to do. I'm asking how do we report to duty when it comes to our women?

>> Why do we have to report to our women in order to report to for duty? I'm not saying report to or what I'm saying is how do we fix the leadership when it comes to our society? versus, for example, if the the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff is Bozo the Clown, and Bozo the Clown goes gets Crusty the Clown, Ronald McDonald, and Wendy from Wendy's, and they're running our military, and everybody who comes into the military also puts on clown makeup, big floppy shoes, and then we go to war, and the people we're going to war against are so busy laughing at us because we're clowns. Wouldn't it require some type of regime change? Isn't there a solution to address the clown behavior in our community when we need to be able to step up? How do we fix something that we did not break given though? I'm trying to operate in your parameters when it comes to that. If the majority of the people who have been in charge for the past 60 years um are women in a documented matriarchy. If the majority of the um households are single mom households, if the mentality has been from a marketing, a media, and a messaging standpoint that um you don't need a man, I mean, we could go all the way back to no romance without finance. I don't want no scrubs, you know, so on and so forth. There's a been a much uh documented media campaign against the stability and the sustainability of black men even in sitcoms with very few exceptions and you and I can both name them where the straight black man is a mumbling bumbling buffoon who has absolutely no power and does not control his balls in the house. If that is the permeating message that has been going on for six plus decades, how do we fix a community that we all here agree is broken when it comes to us stepping up as leadership and reporting for duty?

So, what's interesting about this when you when you mentioned the uh the sitcoms and and the family situation, I actually addressed this when um Jeff and I uh originally had our discussion and I was the one >> I was the one who said you can't name one where the black man isn't being fixed by his woman, his children, or his parents or in-laws. What we have to start doing is we have to Hey, listen. If if the the women are doing their thing on that side, we don't need to actually work with that side in order for us to be able to lead. What we can do is exactly what we're doing right now. We've assembled men just like we're assembled right now. We assemble and then we go out and we go and we get the children and then we function and operate the way we need to. That in and of itself is leadership because what we're doing now is we're modeling what we want the rest of our community to mirror.

>> Yeah.

>> So, we don't actually NEED TO TELL THEM ANYTHING. WE DON'T ACTUALLY NEED TO HAVE them go, hey, listen. I need you guys to go lock step in what we' No. What we need to do is we need to assemble ourselves. What we need to do is to make sure that we are in lock step because when we are in lock step like as I said at at the at the beginning of this was our community is dehydrated and we are dehydrated with the kind of manhood that takes that kind of leadership that allows our young males to in a healthy way with information and instruction to metriculate into manhood. And by the way, our our young ladies need to be able to see that because once they see that, once they feel that, once they get under the covering of what manhood is, they will then be able to uh choose men to partner with. Because why? Because they see that, they feel that, they understand exactly what manhood is because they've been under the covering of it. But if the only thing that they see, if the only thing that they feel or get impacted by are the males that have that kind of disastrous uh uh behavior that hurts, that harms them. That's what they're their representation of what manhood looks like. AND SO SUBSEQUENTLY, THAT'S ACTUALLY what they begin to choose. That's actually what THEY BEGIN TO PROCREATE WITH BECAUSE THEY THINK THAT THAT'S WHAT MANHOOD IS.

>> You know what's what's interesting about all this and I've dealt with Funky Den earlier. We'll put him to one side and we'll deal with your statements. Uh Mr. Dandre uh with Phil 10 years ago, I had no idea what I was doing on YouTube. I did a podcast called Why I Refuse to be the Cleanup Man and it unwittingly went viral. It was my very first time going viral. Got over 100,000 views. Kind of put me on the map as a major voice. Lots of But to this day, I get black men telling me all the time, you know. Yeah, man. That that podcast you did, man, that really says something to me. And what it what it was about was, let's just get right to this. Many black women have a singular talent for choosing the worst types of black men not only to have sex with. That's one thing. But then to bring on the next generation of black Americans. Things invariably go bad as we've heard of the numerous events of last month. And then all of a sudden the call goes out for other black men to come and clean up the mess and pick up the pieces. Now going to your point about reporting for duty. What makes our country great and what we learned coming out of Vietnam is that we have a stronger military when it's voluntary, not a draft. I'm down for service when I choose it, not when it's imposed on me.

>> Okay? I'm down to sign up and serve when the cause is right. When I feel compelled in my soul to sign up, but not when it's imposed from top down in a draconian net. To serve those who would mock me, TO SERVE THOSE WHO WOULDN'T PISS ON ME, TO PUT ME OUT IF I WAS ON FIRE. NO. NO. I hold myself up to a standard. I ain't got baby mas running around. I never beat a woman. I never been uh mistreating a woman. Been with my lady for 17 years. She ain't seen a bill in 17 years. Not one. Never cheated on her. NEVER BEAT HER. NEVER MISTREATED HER. I refuse I refuse to extend my gentlemanly courtesies, protection, empathy, care, expertise, protection to those who wouldn't put me out on fire if I put would piss on me to put me out if I was on fire and actively mock me. No, >> I'm not doing it. I reserve it for ladies. Key word there, ladies. Not feral females twerking at Kla's uh presidential campaign event. I reserve my the best of me for women who have proven themselves worthy of it. And I get to make that call. I GET TO DECIDE who is worthy and who is not. Who will go on a date and WHO DOES NOT? WHO WILL BECOME A WIFE AND who does not? Who gets to get uh get their groceries taken out the car and who does not? I refuse. If this was a draft, I would be Muhammad Ali because I WOULD BURN MY DRAFT CARD, SIR.

>> [ __ ] DAMN. DAMN. Uh Mia, you coming at it like that?

>> THAT'S THAT'S THAT'S where it is. I I have no problem with every black man has a right to determine what he will do with his life. I will never knock a brother >> if he chooses to do what Mr. DeAndre Whitfield is suggesting. That's his choice. But that's the key word, choice, >> not draconian drafts.

>> Real quick, I want to hear uh DARE's re reaction to that because I actually understand it from both sides and it makes sense. If we don't have men that think like DeAndre and actually do things beyond their own households, nothing ever will improve. But if we don't have more men that think like Obsidian and Dave and and and and Darwin to a degree, I could see a scenario where men are getting abused, taken advantage of, doing thing, overextending themselves for people who don't appreciate it, don't want it. uh you and the the image that I cannot get out my head right now is outside of what we're doing now which men and women can watch and you know they can join the groups and different things that we all have set up for people I can't get the image out of my head of when I found out about Kevin Samuels dying and seeing how these ladies move some not all ladies obviously but a lot of women laughing and joking famous women's too famous women too And then also seeing whenever a black man gets accused of something, it's the instant assumption of guilt when it comes to us from our very own women because they do the whole sisterhood thing and the Me Too movement. And I'm like, when you got when you got people that don't know you and you don't have a relationship with saying things online or maybe even your face about seeing you like cancer, uh, believing the woman you uh, in a situation that they don't have any information about um, or even laughing or mocking your death in a case if they don't like your messaging of how you talk about these type of topics when Kevin Situation, I understand why. I think I don't think men are being cowards for re-evaluating where to extend that leadership to uh Dandre. Tell me if I'm off.

>> Um so to you know to uh brother Mumia I'm first I didn't want to interrupt him but two syllables. Dandre

>> Dandre. I'm sorry. My bad.

>> No words. No worries. Um and and and look, the truth of the matter is is everyone has the right to choose how they show up and if they show up.

>> If if my brother if if if my brother chooses not to show up, then then that's on him. as the man that I am. I'm thinking about my grandmother. May she rest in peace. I'm thinking about my father. May he rest in peace. My father didn't have a man, his father in his life to teach him how to be a man. And so subsequently he didn't show up as one and couldn't give me the information and instruction about how to metriculate into manhood myself.

>> Mhm.

>> My father would have become a great man had he had that information and instruction. My father would have become a great man had he had someone like me in his life to help give him that information and instruction. So, as far as I'm concerned, men show up to resuscitate and restore our community no matter what. Because as far as I'm concerned, above and beyond everything, that is my divine assignment. Now, look, I am not here to get anyone to come outside their own individual lane. Everybody ain't built for this. Everybody ain't built for this. I'm gonna say it one more time. Everybody ain't built for this. If you choose to stay home and not participate, I salute you. This is how I'm built. And the brothers that I know that I'm in lock step with, that's how we're built. So, if you choose not to do that, by all means, do what you need to do. But there are going to be men that show up in order to do what is necessary to help resuscitate and restore our community. And if that's a bad thing, then then that's a bad thing as far as you perceive it.

>> But remember, perception is not reality. Mhm.

>> Hey Dandre, I let first of all I want to give you your flowers on being a man to step up to actually try to do something, try to make a change. I'm 100% with it. And um I think your perspective is based off of what you see the problem is and maybe you know what I'm saying, you pushing your energy and asserting yourself into the situation to fix it. You know, that's that's great. But I do recall you saying we as men need to get ourselves together. You need to fix ourselves square. I said don't we don't have to collaborate. We don't have to go over there. We don't have to worry about what they doing. Just like you said, we can come together like this. We can get ourselves together and get the ball rolling. But I think where I just where I kind of lost it and maybe you can kind of reconnect it for me is you stated that when we do that, you know, at some point the women, you know, they'll get in line. You know, at some point it'll have an impact on their discernment cuz then they'll know what type of men to to get covering from. I wholeheartedly uh understand that. But based off of my own expertise, you probably don't know me. Most definitely don't. I was I had a small channel. Uh but over a course of maybe 1,000 maybe 1,500 hours of working and consultations and stuff, I discovered that the women specifically black women in this case are targeting a fraction of men and they're ignoring a great deal of men who would actually be suitable for the relationships. Mhm.

>> So if we if if I told you that if we got more men together, good men that are capable of being leaders and leading relationships and building building families and there were the the fraction of men that are bad, you know what I'm saying? They probably got the charisma. They probably hit the genetic lottery, but they just they just popular by, you know, the taboo. I would say that women would that that actually that fraction would shrink, but the women would still target them. I do not I have not figured out in my line of work how to undo that. I don't know. I wouldn't call it hypergamy because it wasn't a status thing. It's just that these guys have the charisma. They have the charm. Now, you got a group of men that are good men. They're just socially awkward. They might not have the height. You know, they might not, you know, it might be out of touch and other things, but they're good men. the the women, they're just not gonna go for those guys. So, this I don't think it'll have the significant impact on the discernment as you think, but I'm willing to have the conversation to figure out how we can connect it.

>> Yeah. I you know, it's so interesting. When I was uh when I grew up in in in Brooklyn, what was taught to me about what manhood was was actually the metrics of masculinity and not necessarily the metrics of manhood. The metrics of but it was presented as the metrics of manhood. And that was the three Ps. paper, pecs, and penis. So, we were taught how much money do you make, how much paper do you get, pecs, how strong are you, can you fight, penis, how many women have you slept with? Those were presented as the metrics of manhood and really they amounted to the metrics of masculinity. Now, can masculinity be a part of manhood? Well, we all know the question, the answer to that question. Absolutely. But the metrics of those things which really amount to the metrics of masculinity have not only been presented to us, they've also been presented to many of the women in our community. So, subsequently, they have learned that those are the metrics to manhood also. and subsequently they begin choosing guys who are drenched in those three areas. So when I talk about us getting ourselves together in order to fix our community, when we fix ourselves, we also begin to fix what the metrics of manhood look like not just to our brothers but to our sisters also. And so slowly but surely, those things will begin to make a turn. Is that going to happen tomorrow? Absolutely not. Look, it didn't it didn't take one day for us to be broken. It's not going to take uh one day for us for us to be fixed.

>> So, >> so it sounds like you're h it sounds like you're hinting at like a regime change type thing like Dave Anderson uh kind of stated when he was talking about military and

>> absolutely. But just a quick but just a quick question. If if we're talking about influence and impact, which would which would probably be significant in this situation in order to be able to get people to maybe part away from the direction they're going to go in a different direction, is it safe to say that in 2026 that if two candidates was was positioning themselves to be the activists,

>> I'm sorry. If two what? two candidates,

>> okay,

>> were positioning themselves to be the activists or the spoke or the face of the black community to lead our our people or let's just say our women because we got to try to let's just say our women. Do you think that they would walk behind uh today's Dr. Martin Luther King or Megan? Being honest, who would our women walk behind? So, so

>> this is a good question.

>> So, so watch this. I I wrote a book called Male Versus Man, right? And I talked about how males look to be served while men look to be of service. So, if we can talk about how we have black males and black men, we can also talk about the fact that we have black females and black women.

>> That's true. That's true. Keep keep it going. Keep it going. I like that. Continue it.

>> So if if if the if if black males look to be served, what do black females look to be? To be served.

>> Yeah. Yeah.

>> A black woman, if a black man is one who looks to be of service, what is a black woman? One who looks to be of service. Mhm.

>> So, yes, you are going to have black females following those that are of a ratchet uh nature, but the black women are going to follow behind those that are looking to be of service because they too are looking to be of service. So what we have to do is we have to begin to identify who is actually on our Remember back in the day when we played ball and we were looking to to start up a game. What did we do? We chose teams. I got I got Oh, I got >> We got to start being able to identify those that are looking to be of service. We got to start identifying our women and start weeding out the females. You are not going to transform a female who is looking to be of service to herself. And let's be honest, let's be honest.

>> If we really being a thousand right now,

>> it's not just the sisters are looking in the wrong spaces or wrong places for uh guys to or men to be partnered with. Some of our brothers are looking in the wrong places too.

>> Yeah,

>> we are looking at the wrong things. Yeah,

>> we are looking at a behind

>> and going, "Oh, this is going to be my woman cuz look at that behind."

>> You know what? You right.

>> Madre, it's it's it's just just quickly. It's not against it's not against your brand to go on the record and and actually choose whether it's my uh Dr. Martin or Megan Stallion. I don't want to put you get you in trouble. Now,

>> I'm good. And listen, I'm listen I listen, NOBODY CAN GET ME IN TROUBLE EXCEPT ME. MHM.

>> SO, I'm I'm I'm good. That's why I said

>> Yeah. I just don't I don't want nobody clipping it up. He said that we follow.

>> THAT'S WHY I SAID TO BROTHER DAVE, uh if you remember in the very beginning, he was like, "YOU VERY COMFORTABLE." I SAID, "BROTHER," I SAID, "I'M COMFORTABLE. I'm I'm good. I know exactly where I stand at all times. I I'm good. We got to start making sure that we teach each other what this is why it's so important for us to receive information and instruction about what we should be looking for as men in a partner.

>> Yeah.

>> Certainly.

>> We can't just look for the the the the fatty.

>> We can't just look for it in that way because that's what we were. We were like, "Oh man, look at that right there." Okay. Now, I'm going to attempt to build a family behind that right there.

>> And the truth of THE MATTER IS, YOU KNOW WHAT THAT'S THE EQUIVALENT OF? If we were looking to buy a a vehicle,

>> you looking you you go out, you look for this vehicle. It's it's a used car and you go out and you look at this car and the paint job is beautiful,

>> right?

>> You open up the door, leather seats, it's immaculate. And then you say, "All right, man. This right here, this is the vehicle for me." And you go and you pay the money that that is being asked for you to purchase that vehicle. What's What's the critical mistake that you made?

>> You didn't look at the Carfax.

>> You You DIDN'T LOOK UNDER THE HOOD. MHM.

>> THE ONLY THING THAT IS IMPORTANT IN BEING ABLE TO CHOOSE THAT VEHICLE

>> IS TO UNDERSTAND WHETHER THAT VEHICLE GETS YOU FROM POINT A to point B.

>> Absolutely.

>> Don't fall FOR THE PAINT JOB AND DON'T FALL FOR THE LEATHER SEATS.

>> Does this vehicle function the way it's supposed to function? Now there are people, are you comparing a car to a woman?

>> No, I'm comparing.

>> It's a metaphor.

>> It is a metaphor because in actuality, my woman is actually along with myself. We now make up the vehicle that allows us to get our family from point A to point B. I know who I am as a man, but now I got to make sure that my woman actually functions in the way that complements everything that I have in order for us to function as the vehicle that gets our family from point A to point B. That's how we stabilize a family. And truth be told, too many of us are making the wrong decisions based on aesthetics.

>> Absolutely. the paint job and the leather seats.

>> I'done been there. I done been there.

>> Listen, listen. But we got to be on Earth. Okay. Um, when I was 17 years old, I met my wife. And when I saw my wife, she had a dress that was so tight like it looked like somebody sewed her in it. The one thing I did not say at that time,

>> I don't know if you need I don't know.

>> No, I didn't. I'm talking about the dress. So, I've said this publicly a million times. She good.

>> Okay.

>> The one thing I did not do was say, "Oh my god, look at the morals on that girl." It's important. I'm sorry. That's what gets you on the lot. The problem is I've seen all of your women and none of them unattractive. The reason we act like a a cover does not matter is because it's a cool thing to say. But there are entire publishing departments that have art departments that focus on the cover. Now, you don't stop there. But the truth of the matter is we live in a world where if we're going to continue the car metaphor, the majority of the cars out here look good, but they're all lemons. How do we stop the lemons from coming off the lot in mass? Because you and I all know, everybody in here all knows. If I'm wrong, please correct me. The majority of the people out here are females and beta males sent manginis. So, how do we stop the lemons, the the sloppy jalapes, the uh the ones that have the odometer rolled all the way back getting all of their miles uh falsely accused, meaning that their numbers have been grossly misrepresented when they all look so good. How do we get under the hood of all of these in mass? Because choice is one thing, but if there's only a few to choose from, how do you find them out? Like Ali famously said, um, if there's if there's if there's a bunch of snakes, if there's 10,000 snakes and a thousand of them snakes mean no harm to me, they want to protect me, they want to love me, I got to close the door cuz I don't know that they're just all going to converge to the front. I'm printed. Like at at what point do we not buckle down in reality and say there's a level of accountability that has to happen that does not happen no matter how good we are no matter how much we show up no matter how discerning we are when the majority are ratchets slack jaw North American big back strong independent women who do not need a man for anything. I'm I'm just curious.

Well, you we you gotta just like you would do in finding that that used car, >> you got to be diligent about checking underneath the hood. And by that I mean take your time.

>> Don't just throw Don't just throw your your your piece up in there because it looks good. But shouldn't we shame the But shouldn't we shame Shouldn't we shame and condemn and put big old warning stickers on the majority of these lemons so that we have some identifiers because that's what's not happening. And that's the part throughout this whole conversation that I feel like we've been we've been accountable and everybody else has been accountable, but we're somehow glossing over >> the responsibility of those who have had the ball >> for 65 years in our community. Okay? So, watch this. If you see that I am spending time with a woman >> and I am spending time with her obviously as a prospective partner, >> right?

>> And I walk away from that woman. You respect me as a man, >> as a man who uses great judgment in choosing an appropriate partner. If you see that I walk away from that woman, wouldn't that throw a flag up to you to go, "hm, this is curious. I wonder why if this woman was a woman of value, why would this man of value walk away from her if she were a man of value? If she were a woman of value and virtue?"

>> Yeah. Yeah.

>> To a certain extent. My uncle was married to to one of the most beautiful women I ever seen in my life. And when they got divorced, I said, "But she's smart. She's got a degree. She's beautiful. She's funny. She does all these things. She can cook this, that, and the third." And he said, "David," I said, "Yes, sir." He said, "No matter how fine a woman is, no matter how good a woman is, no matter how sweet a woman is, there's always one man somewhere who's sick of her shit." Doesn't mean that she's a bad woman. It just means that that don't fit. That happens. M

>> IF YOUR WIFE

>> WAS NOT who she pretends to be in in Hollywood and throughout her career, you wouldn't be with her. You're clearly a discerning man.

>> But I guarantee you before you came along, respectfully, there's somebody who's sick of her [ __ ] I know for a fact there's somebody sick of my wife [ __ ] THERE'S THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS. That's not necessarily an indicator of you walking away that that makes that woman a bad woman. She might just been a bad woman for you. I'm talking about the overwhelming majority of these thought pocket ratchets who are educated, who are strong, independent, who who check all the boxes on paper. And you're not going to be able to look under the hood of 4.3 billion jalapis. Well, you can't look at 4.3 billion because you're not gonna go on a date with 4.3 billion.

>> Exactly. So, how do we

>> You go on a date four. We gotta be You know what? This this this strikes up a a very necessary conversation about our own discipline.

>> As there's a huge difference between males and men.

>> Yes.

>> Males don't have discipline. So by virtue of the fact that we know that males don't have discipline, as a man we have to be disciplined. So, if a woman comes into my cipher and I am thinking about choosing her as a prospective partner

>> and I'm trying to figure out whether she has the values and the virtues that I need as a woman that I am potentially going to be building a family with, I got to be disciplined enough to see past the aesthetics that might have me temporarily mesmerized. facts.

>> That's the difference between me and the males in this environment. So, I can't fall for the okey do. All right. But how do we fix the culture of how do we fix the Well, let me try it a different way.

How do we fix this culture of ignorance that makes us? Because let's just be honest, everybody in here, including you, bro, are playing in the margins. We are the exceptions. We're not the rule. You did not go out when you were when you were dating and you were single and you threw a stick and hit 50,000 Sally Richardsons. You found one and you did what you were supposed to do. I found one and I did what I was supposed to do.

How do we fix a culture that rewards ignorance, insubordination, disrespect, um, vacuum doctor behavior, Plan B, um, acquiescence? How do we fix that? If we're going to make sure that we take control of our communities, we got to fix it one I've been answering. We got to fix it one person at a time. Hey, listen. This is what this is supposed to be. This is how we line up. This is the difference between a male and a man. Now, you can be a male if you want to. You can actually go out here and pick based on aesthetics, but it's going to be a very painful experience. Now, the problem is is that it's going to feel really good for five minutes. The experience is going to feel really good for five minutes, but once you ejaculate, it's going to become very expensive and very painful.

Now, just to clarify, uh uh Dandre, you could have said at least 15 minutes to get a brother a little grace. If we being if we being honest out here, it don't take you but five minutes to go ahead and get you what we talking about. Hey, DAR. DAR, keep it at 100. Anything over five minutes, you just trying to make sure she get hers first. You just making appearances. So, this dude is You trying to make You try to make sure she get hers first. That's why you got five minutes.

Now, now we talking about semantics, right? So, so now when I'm talking about to the young brother that is really misguided and misled and misinformed, I'm shooting him the facts. Look, you gonna sit here and you're gonna lay up with her and inside of 15 minutes, Jeff, so you feel good about it. Inside of 15 minutes, once you get done, once you get done with that part of it, you're going to have 15 minutes of fun and 15 years of failure. Because if you get her pregnant and now you got to deal with the ramifications of you not choosing an appropriate partner, you had 15 minutes of fun and 15 years of failure. Which one you want?

What you just said, Whitfield, and I now hear something I didn't hear and all the time and you've been saying it over and over. Accountability for women is us not choosing them. Period. Accountability. Mia has said this a million. We've all said this in our own varying ways on different shows and platforms. He's been insanely consistent all night. If we work with the boys, if we work with each other, if we hold each other accountable, we're going to decrease the chances of our guys selecting wrong. And as a result, you know what's going to be the cyclical effect in terms of when more and more women aren't being selected for anything, including sex, including one-night stands. You're going to see, you're not going to see 100% change in anybody as far as a group, but you are going to see a shift in the women that start recognizing, realizing this isn't working. And watch what else is going right right now. Right now, and just then come and then tap back in. Right now, what's happening is there's too many males. There's too many males. We're seeing videos of women doing false allegations. We're seeing videos of the same women jumping from athlete to athlete, artist to artist, high-profile guys. We're seeing them talk about women on the podcast claiming, "Yeah, I'm hearing that I got a bad rep and bad name and everybody's saying to avoid me and the NBA's telling their players to avoid and they're still hanging out with them." Why would she change her behavior when her behavior is being rewarded, bro? So, I This is where I'm at. Why would she change her behavior when her behavior is being rewarded? Way too many of us.

Well, here's here's the problem. So Richard Nixon once famously talked about the silent majority and that's what we have going on with with with this situation here. So the majority of black men are single and childless. The majority of black men are middle class. We have more black men going to and graduating from college, both academic and professional training, as well as trades and technical training. That's always left out of the equation. We have more black men getting educated, certified, trained than at any point in the history of the union. Um, we have more black men desirous of marriage or long-term relationships than black women. I mean, that you have we have more black men doing all these different things. There is a smaller percentage. You talked about professional athletes. I think there's just over 20,000 total NFL players, not even 10,000 in the NBA. I think it's like 6,000, something like that. We're looking at a very small percentage of black men that are doing the outsized percentage of siring of children. And once again, we're always going back to the guys who aren't the problem. We need to start taking the aim at the guys who are the problem. The guys who are siring all the kids, the guys, the pookies, the ray rays, the switch, switchblade mic, the one-pump man. Those are the guys who are the problem. We need to aim the fire directly at them. If if the argument is they need to develop discipline and all the rest of it, that's where the aim needs to be. The aim doesn't be need to be at Brandon the quarter-zip guy or or or Joel the brother with khakis.

Yeah. Hold on. Causing a problem. What's the problem with the quarter zip? What's the problem with the quarter zip? He wear and guess what? He wearing a quarter zip right now ain't the problem. He wearing a quarter zip. I got on the quarter zip right now. Exactly. The brother with the quarter zip on and the chinos and khakis going to work every day. He's not the problem. It's the other dude with the drip. Uh uh. One-pump Paul. That's the problem.

Crazy. I I I I feel you and I kind of understand everything everybody said. And Da Andre po he uh posed a good question. Why would a woman stop if they get rewarded for it? So that bring me back to my original ideology of desired outcomes. Why would a female change? Yeah. Am not woman. Well, I female change. Okay, then I I I hear you. Why would a women change if her a female change if her desired outcome is to get around those guys, be a groupie, and get to the bag, and get that temporary satisfaction, whatever it is. It's a it's a it's a it's a uh it's a game. It's a it's it's just a route that a lot of those women are taking. There's a market for it. There's a market for many things that we don't all morally subscribe to and champion. We just and and and like you said, you said it was one person at a time. That's that's it's going to take a while, but it's necessary, but we can't forget in this state. Right. We we can't just fold over and just say, "No, we we got to do what it do." And I think for for the most part a lot of the brothers mo all of us sitting here are a representative of a good model that you know some people can follow if if we're making a change. So it's not like we're just you know just throwing [ __ ] out of our ass. We're actually living a living example speaking from integrity uh in way and showcasing ways that we can be uh straight black man and not be a cancer. So, and just to try to reel it back in to the original topic, I this might be an unpopular uh take, but I think our people is desperate to figure out the problem and we we can't figure it out. So, we have to try to assign it to a villain. We have to pick a villain. And I think the best villain is the black man. Yeah. Uh, and I think somebody said earlier, you you can get canceled for uh making a villain, anybody within the LGBT, how dare you. So, the only safe route is to go is the black man. And what it does is it absolves anybody who has share responsibility whenever the whenever the cancerous behavior became began to develop because there had to be a timeline and how this blossom into something that became destructive. But the conversation doesn't start there. It kind of just starts at, okay, now he's an adult. He's having an impact in the community. Let's call these guys cancerous. And if we call him cancerous at adulthood, everything that happened before that, we can ignore it. And I and again, I think it's unfair. And I and it's no point of just circling back to it. Right now, we got to we got to run what do they call it? Triage. Your words. We got to run triage and try to fix it from a reactive uh standpoint and then a proactive instead of a proactive.

Let me let me let me tell you something. Ain't nothing fair about leadership. Ain't nothing fair about leadership. Leadership is going to be questioned at all times. At all times. I don't care what kind of leader you are. It is going to be called into question at all times. It it let's look at someone like let's look at someone like a Barack Obama, right? Sure. This black man represents excellence on so many different levels. It's it's actually funny. You can't find 10 people that will be in agreement about him being a spectacular leader. You can't find it. You're going to find two, three, four people out of 10 that's going to tell you how he was an awful president. How he didn't do that. He didn't do enough for black people. He didn't do enough for white people. He didn't do enough. He didn't do enough of that. He should have been this. He should have been that. He should This man is exemplary on so many different levels. And yet he has been under fire on so many different levels about so many different things. There is nothing fair about leadership. So, as a black man, this is what we have to really condition ourselves about. When you step up into leadership, you are going to catch strays all day, every day. Not just from people outside YOUR HOUSE. THERE ARE GOING TO BE TIMES WHERE YOU CATCH THEM FROM PEOPLE INSIDE YOUR HOME, INSIDE YOUR FAMILY, INSIDE YOUR COMMUNITY. If you listen, there is nothing fair about leadership. THAT'S WHY AIN'T EVERYBODY FIT TO BE A man because all day, every day, you are going to catch strays. Everybody ain't built for this, bro. Everybody.

You know what? My fear, my fear, my fear is that at at some point in time, and I might not even be here no more, but we're going to fix this [ __ ]. Yes, sir. My fear My fear is if black men are the only ones that can fix it. My fear is that when we do fix it, they're not gonna even give us the credit for it.

Hey, you know what? Let me tell you something. You Hey, let me tell you something, Darren. You might be you you might be right, my bro. You you might you right. You might be right, my bro. Watch this. Every day as a as a as a as a man, as a black man, I just do what I know is necessary. Not because I'm waiting for somebody to Listen, let me tell you something and and I'mma prove this point to you. If you try to make a reservation for Mother's Day in 2026, you call any restaurant, they'll be like, "My bro, you trying to make a reservation for 2026? You should have done that in 2025." For 2026, try to make a reservation for Father's Day at any restaurant. You could make it the same day. They'll be like, "Oh, yeah, NO PROBLEM. HOW MANY IN YOUR PARTY? 26." "OH, DON'T WORRY about it. We can accommodate you."

You know, it's interesting that Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Hold on. The contribution of the black man is so underestimated and underappreciated, it is ridiculous. But it actually comes with this job. It actually comes with this job. Like I said, nothing fair about leadership. And again, if we are the leaders that we say we are, and we know we are, that's what comes with this, bro. That's why we got to be on our game. That's why conversations like this and us empowering each other void of the black woman is necessary because we know how difficult this job is. That's why we need each other.

You know, it's interesting um Mr. Whitfield bringing up former president number 44, Barack Hussein Obama Jr. because I don't I don't very it's a very difficult spot he's in because former first lady Michelle Obama whom black women I think rightly greatly admire her for good reason. Princeton Harvard Law uh was doing very well in the private sector in the early days her and Barack Obama got together so on and so forth. side. I take nothing away from her, from her accomplishments. Um, but it it was very I was very disturbed by her. I would go along if it was just a one-off comment. I Everybody gets grace on a one-off from me, but these are sustained comments over the past year or so that she has made about her husband in public. And and you know it just it just it it really it bothered me because of Barack Obama's sterling character. We could debate his his political views and so on so forth. No his his his character as a man is above reproach. No scandals, no no untoward behavior. They even called him in the White House no drama Obama. Uh that sort of thing. I mean, he's he's second only to Jimmy Carter in terms of being a good man, right? Hillary Rodom Clinton, went on record when asked what would be her role in William Jefferson Clinton's White House and she said, "What am I supposed to do? I'm not I'm not going to be up there uh baking cookies and stand by your man." Then turned around when it became known that her husband was in a number of trips with a number of women, one in particular, Miss Jennifer Flowers, and she ended up sitting right next to her man on 60 Minutes when he when he was revealed in Flagrante with Monica Lewinsky, she once again went to bat on the on the Today SHOW TALKING ABOUT A VAST RIGHT-WING CONSPIRACY. Hillary Wadam Clinton repeatedly stood by her man even though everybody knew William Jefferson Clinton was grabbing him by the fill in the blank. But we have Miss Michelle Obama saying on record that THERE WERE YEARS, NOT one year or one day or a weekend. We've all had an argument with our significant other. We we understand that. Mhm. She said years plural where she didn't LIKE BARACK OBAMA. THAT THREW ME FOR A LOOP. NOW my thinking is this. If black women, in this case, former first lady Michelle Obama, cannot get behind a man LIKE BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA JR., FIRST EVER LAW PRE PRESIDENT OF THE HARVARD LAW REVIEW, HARVARD LAW SCHOOL, COLUMBIA UNDERGRAD, NOBEL PEACE PRIZE WINNER, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, AND LEADER OF THE FREE WORLD TWICE. IF YOU CAN'T GET BEHIND A MAN LIKE THAT, WELL, GODAMN IT. WHO CAN YOU GET BEHIND? WHO? HE'S THE BEST OF US. IF HE CAN'T GET A WOMAN TO GET ON CODE, WHO CAN DO IT? Who damn, man?

That I don't even know answer for that question. I I do think that it's a combo of the woman that you have, the season that you're in, and who you're willing to be in that season. As shockingly as it is, and I don't think that's going to satisfy people, I think the the harsh reality, we are dealing with human beings. We're dealing with people. And you know, we're no none of us are looking for perfection in ourselves, let alone the women that we're trying to do life with when it comes to us getting along and you know, being allowed to lead and them knowing how to follow and everything. So, I I will acknowledge that I was definitely bothered with what you said and and seeing that as well. And I never even thought about that as a symbol of kind of this whole discussion. Um, but I'm not going to get away from the very very beginning with uh um what's the guy's name? Uh Funky Denva. in thinking about acknowledging that just because I wasn't a big fan of how he framed black men doesn't mean that my frustration with the framing and some of the in my mind dehumanizing language that they wouldn't use for anybody else doesn't take away from my acknowledgement of the the elephant in the room when it comes to men and it comes to black men in regards to homicides and and the violence and stuff that's happening in the community. I like medium men, you know, we've come across a very extremely small percentage of men that are actually offenders that are actually doing a lot of these homicides in comparison to the overall population of men that are not. Um, but there was a story that a couple ladies who were commenting were angry about my post in the last 24, 48 hours. They mentioned a case that I heard nothing about. some guy named David or something or DV4D some David the the R&B singer. Yeah. Yeah. Never heard of him. Didn't know anything about him. And I felt like in this conversation with us having Dandre on more than anything when we're talking about how to lead, how to take accountability, how to change our dynamics with the women who were not in relationships with versus with their children versus with other men. I'm not going to lose sight of this particular situation.

Hey, Rihanna had that tattoo, too. Rihanna had THAT TATTOO. THERE ARE PICTURES CONFIRMING THAT THAT WAS HIS GIRLFRIEND. There are literal messages WHERE SHE HERSELF SAYS THAT THEY SLEPT TOGETHER. There are pictures of him paying these kids off. There is a leaked song named Celeste, where he NAME DROPS CELESTE TWICE AND SAYS THAT HE LOVES HER. Celeste, the girl with smiling tattoo on her chest. I'm obsessed. I love you. There are videos OF HER CARESSING HIS FACE. That [ __ ] likes keys. That [ __ ] likes kids.

So, what I looked into this case and seeing what this brother is going through in terms of court, uh I don't know that I don't think he's been ruled uh guilty or innocent or anything like that. So, I'm going to leave it to everything's alleged. Uh that young lady was 14 at the time of her death or 1314 more or less. They may have found her right after her birthday actually. And there is a subculture where men may be aware of certain things may maybe have seen certain things and whether they didn't intervene themselves or intervene in getting law enforcement involved. I get the anger and frustration for a lot of men in this community that felt like a lot of our women are very disrespectful, doesn't trust men, they they're jaded by men, that they're super aggressive, they're super independent, all the negative adjectives you want to claim. There's also the reality of it's not just their own decision-making that turned them into that. Sometimes there was violations that happened. Sometimes there was guys uh drugging women at parties. Sometimes it was guys going too far and us acting like we don't see what we see. And I'm not saying every guy has to be a Superman, but what I am saying is is we got to acknowledge that it's possible that there's a lot of us that probably could do more than we're doing now because we're so rooted in only what's happening in our home. And the one caveat I'm going to have when I say that is I would pray that any man that saw my daughter in a situation that her life was at risk at baseline acknowledge that you see it that you're present that you're a witness and that you're calling the police. That's better than I think the whole ain't my business focus on my own life. focus on my own household because I do think that that slows down our ability to prevent unnecessary trauma attacks, vulnerabilities, and turning the dating market further into the cesspool that we all a lot of people are often complaining about. Um, I'm going to start with Dandre and then, you know, you guys can work your way around that video and finding out the case of what he's being accused of. They found her body in his vehicle after he had paid or uh had her transported and I think there was a potential accusation allegedly that she was pregnant. So this idea, man, that there's no reasons why women or gays should feel anything, I'm not saying they should get to the point of dehumanizing us and using dehumanizing language when it comes to their fears and concerns about what men are capable of, especially straight men. But this idea that men got we don't have anything to acknowledge about things we need to be more on the lookout for and aware of and responsive of. I'm going to tell you my personal personal I don't know a single man that's a deadbeat father. Don't know one and I know a lot of people. If I did know one I wouldn't continue to know him if he didn't want to address that. That's my personal code of ethic. I grew up where there were seasons where me and my dad wasn't on good terms and I can't imagine what it was like for a guy that has the ability, has the capability to be there and chooses not to. I cannot do life with you. If we're seeing guys doing the things that we know are contributing to what the relation the uh the community being what it is, what's your thoughts about varying levels of intervention or doing or saying anything at all? So, let's start with Mr. Uh, Dantree.

Yeah, I don't this, you know, the notion of like the bro code. I don't I don't have no bro code. Um, and when I let me get very specific about that. Mhm. Let's say if you know if if we we know we knew a brother and and he was doing something that was in violation of his relationship with his you know, with his woman or in violation with his his child. That's not to say that I would go to her and say, "Hey, here's what this this brother is doing, but I would certainly bring it to my brother's attention and say, "Yo, fam. Um, what you doing right here is nasty work." And as a man, I would expect you to actually operate on a different level because that's what I thought you were, which is why we are friends. But if you continue to choose to live this way, you and I can't be we can't be friends because we stand for something completely different. If if I can't trust you in this situation to treat what's in your home with respect, then I certainly can't trust you to treat what's in my home with respect. Damn. So if I can't bring you in my home, then I can't have you in my life. What's the point of our brotherhood? We don't have any.

No, man. We got to we got to start holding each other accountable in that way because it is it is vital to our community being healthy. And watch this and this brings us full circle to all of this. If our men are not healthy, our community is unhealthy. Period. Because everything starts with us. And again, when I talk about who we choose to procreate with, we got to get healthy in order for us to make healthy choices. The healthier we are, the healthier our choices are. The healthier our choices are, the healthier our community is. So again, we become the standard. We become the gold standard of what our community becomes. Like it or not. Listen, if you notice all of the cats, all of the dudes who were talking all of THAT NONSENSE, HOW DARE YOU, most of them are living living in a very unhealthy way. And don't choose to be held to that specific standard. Don't choose to be held to account. So, I already know who the fire is coming from. That don't bother me at all. None of the men really had anything. Hey, I'm I'm just trying to Where you coming from, bro? So, when you say that, what do you mean?

Okay, I get that. I I agree with you, my bro. We We become the standard of our community. Our community can only be as healthy as we are because it comes back to our own choices. Are we choosing the females? based on their aesthetics or are we choosing the women based on their their their values, based on their virtues? And if we choose in that way, that's how we restore and resuscitate our community.

No, no, no, no. I I appreciate that. Um because at the end of the day, we each of us literally do only have control of ourselves. And I do think sometimes people may feel hopeless about that because what does that means as it translates to the community and changing the world and all of the stuff but I think we do forget our influencing factor. Um the same way we can influence a culture when we're super negative, super pessimistic, super violent. um we can probably influence the community in a whole host of ways when we're working with it's very hard to do it on your own, man. But when you are working with other people, I mean, I started my podcast last year and we've had we've been maintaining our virtual men's um uh self-improvement group now every Tuesday like clockwork and these guys are from everywhere. And I'm like in my head, I never knew a year ago I was going to be talking to men from around the country. And now with this platform, I'm like, I can only imagine if I keep doing more stuff like this with you guys, we may be doing our our version of the last uh what's it called? The tonight's conversation where we on stage having these type of conversations. Dandre going to definitely be showing up if we do that. And I'm realizing, man, that's like just what I'm seeing tonight and even what I've started on my own and seeing what you guys have built, I'm going to be realistically optimistic listening to this conversation. Realistically, uh, you know, I I I heard all the energy from the ladies who had so much to say about me saying, "You can't dress and send a certain image and be shocked with the energy that you get in return." And and them being like, "It doesn't matter." And I'm like, "This is why I got to talk to the women and not the females." I'm talking to the w man. I'm telling you, this stuff is sticking with me. And I wanted to throw this last thing out to you guys because I know it's getting kind of late. um what the real cancers are and what the real cancer is. Uh I'm gonna say this and and this is a representation of me and not the other gentlemen on this platform for anybody that's currently watching. I want our women or the women in the community and I want the individuals that are part of the gay community. I want you guys to be very very very careful about the ways in which you try to talk to and at and about heterosexual men that you need to lead and to reproduce in this community that you need to lead and that you need to reproduce. Because when y'all kind of click up too much and y'all start supporting each other's behavior when it comes to throwing these lobs and attacks in the in the straight heterosexual male direction, be careful with going to that lane because I'm not sure that alliance is as strong as y'all think it is. We just saw at the beginning of this clip what happens when a lot of the gentlemen that's of the same orientation as Lucky Geneva gets upset. There's nothing they won't say. There's nothing they won't call you. And then when it comes to black women, what do a lot what's one one of their number one tactics and strategies when they want to attack a man because he doesn't line up to their views, their opinions, he deviates from what they when he starts saying what he likes or wants is different from what she expects. One of the first lines of attack is calling out his sexuality and call him gay. They're using a slur to come at a black man they're upset with for hate and they're using a slur as a description of your lifestyle.

Hold on. Wait, wait. I don't think I don't think that word is a slur no more. I think that's acceptable orientation. Hey. Yeah. When it's when it's correct when it's accurate. And my argument is I think we all need to look at what DARE said. We need to look at each of how we're contributing to this situation versus like Darwin said, we're just trying to pick a boogeyman. It may start with men. It needs to be led by men. I promise you ladies, every man is not Dandre, every man is not going to have the patience to, you know, help your son and you and others in the community. Some men are going to be one and done. Some men not going to try at all. Some are potentially going to date out. So for the men that are still interested in dealing with and working within our community, imagine if y'all started to hear feedback is not automatic uh attacks. Because feedback from black men that actually cares, it could be lifesaving. There was a clip that I'm just gonna play and then we're gonna wrap things up where um this young lady I just happened to stumble upon her thing today, but I wanted to make sure we played this real quick before we close out.

Being disrespected, you're being corrected. And I had to learn that myself because correction isn't always disrespect. You just don't know the difference. Every time your husband or partner tries to check you, correct you, hold you accountable, or tell you something you don't like, you take it as disrespect. And that's the problem. And it sounds like this. He might say, "I don't like when you make decisions without asking me first." And instead of you hearing a man asking for partnership, you hear, "He's trying to control me." He might say, "Every time we need to talk, you keep shutting down." And instead of you receiving that as accountability, you turn it into, "Oh, well, now everything's my fault." He might say, "Watch your tone when you talk to me." And instead of you fixing how you're coming across, you get defensive like he's attacking you instead of correcting your action. And see, that's where a lot of women get it wrong because correction isn't always disrespect. Sometimes it's accountability. Overall, you want a man to lead, but you don't want to be told what to do. However, leadership does come with correction. You keep calling it disrespect when really it's correction you don't want to

acceptable for me to say not all women are bad. But the moment I say not all men are bad, it suddenly sounds like I'm excusing bad behavior. If one statement can be accepted as fact, why does the standard change when we are talking about men? Yes, there are men out there doing terrible, truly horrible things. And there are women who have experienced real harm. That's very valid and that actually matters. But acknowledging that reality doesn't cancel out another truth, which is not all men are bad, just like not all women are bad. Lately, there's been this growing trend of constantly villainizing men. And honestly, it's quite exhausting. Everything becomes men this and men that. And at some point we have to ask are we being fair or are we just reacting? I recently saw a video where someone kept saying men men right and while her experience was serious it made me reflect on how quickly we generalize. Two things can be true at the same time. People can be hurt and we can still choose not to label an entire gender as the problem. So let's keep it simple. Not all women are bad. Not all men are also bad. and that shouldn't be controversial.

And I appreciate both those ladies and their perspectives because I think it zeros in on why maybe a lot of people were offended about this whole situation to begin with. I do think as as leaders and as men, we do have to be careful about people who may have agendas that lead much more towards all y'all straight men are bad or all men are bad. Um Dandre, you didn't feel that energy from from uh Lucky Den. I did, you know, and and looking at some of his previous statements and comments. Um, and of course you have your respectful view and I have mine, but my more spread out view when it comes to accountability and uh, you know, things that we all need to address as far as potential quote unquote cancers. Obviously, the homicide rate being what we lead in the most, right? Um, the domestic violence, which is often birectional between both sexes, um, as it is the highest amongst lesbian couples at that. Um, we got to acknowledge I don't know that there's a greater cancer than Planned Parenthood in the black community. Thank you. We could talk about the rape, the molestations, the homicides, and everything else. Nothing compares to the 20 plus million people who all of which were not here for life-saving reasons. That's the elephant in the room. And the same way I'm not going to demonize all women with that sheer that's a nation gone. And I'm not going to demonize all women because of that and their different circumstances for leading to it. And I'm not going to keep accepting a narrative where everything that's wrong is men. Everything that's evil and vile is men. And it's shaping a world where our daughters and our women are being conditioned into thinking that's true because that shows up in relationships. That shows up in arguments where they don't apologize and don't and only can see what he needs to do to make her happy. That shows up in the divorce proceedings when countless people are one side of the aisle tends to focus on, well, I'm just not happy and they can't think of a worldview of what it was like for the other party. So, there are legitimate issues and cancers and and things in each respective group. Uh, including Lucky Denva's reaction in response to uh Kendra G at the beginning of the video. We have our moments. We have our group issues. And if we're going to frame this as a a unified thing of things we need to do differently, ladies, just know that if you expect all men or men to just start getting better and you thinking you don't have to, you're going to be one of the ladies that does get overlooked, that is a real reality. Um, uh, Dandre, then Mia, then Darwin, then Dave to close us out.

Uh, we closed out. Uh I think you know um everything that that needed to be said you know as my my grandfather would say anything that understood don't need to be explained. Uh we done we done we we have definitely circled the wagon um I feel like anyone who doesn't understand at this at this point is choosing not to understand. Fair. How about you Mia? Very good uh discussion. uh very candid but also uh inspirited but also very um respectful and civil. Once again, the men's table has demonstrated the ability of black men to hash these things out in a spirited yet humane and civil manner. Uh hopefully this will uh go far and wide um so we can kind of counterbalance these um more uh less than flattering portrayals of black men in the media. Thank you so much. What you doing? Uh I appreciate us being able to get uh or whoever pulled that. I guess that was you Jeff right able to get Dantree over here man. Appreciate you coming. Um, I mean, I can't tell you how hard it is to get people to come over here who got an unpopular take. You know what I'm saying? That coming I'm talking about coming into the the manosphere. Yeah. Oh [ __ ] Can we Can we Can we be mature? Can we Can we just Never mind. Coming into the manosphere, you I'm I'm pretty sure that you know, you know what I'm saying? you're not a stranger to uh you know, we straightforward. I mean, we we're objective, you know what I'm saying? We we don't we don't go with the flow, you know what I'm saying? We challenge everything. And for you to have a opinion like that and just coming in here, you know what I'm saying? And take it on the chin, pause, you know what I'm saying? means a lot, you know, to be able to have a conversation and we're we're showcasing as men that we're able to talk about these sensitive matters without having to throw ad hominem attacks and and and go to disrespect. I'm pretty sure that some people anticipated that that probably would happen, but I think it's just a misjudgment of our character and I appreciate you being able to hold on because I sometimes I probably interrupted you and you was like, "Yo, this dude is on my ass." You know, yeah. That's like what is wrong with you, bro?

Hold on. This at this point I think I think Hey, at this point I think Dave, close us out, man. We We just want to gloss over the fact that Darwin has created at least five pause infractions in less than five minutes. That's crazy. That's crazy. Little wasn't even accidental, bro. Like, come on. Wow. That that we good though, man. We here. You know what I'm saying? We we got it done. We got the conversation done. I would have loved if we had the other side. No shade to calling the other side. Okay. Whatever his name is. What does it say? Funky Delila. Funky. Delila. Funky. You've been calling him Lucky for the past 20 minutes. Jeff, you just You called him Lucky like eight times. I was like, man, I ain't heard of this dude before last week. My bad. Yeah, me neither. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't wouldn't dare uh have this conversation. I don't think he would have been able to intellectually have a conversation with us without, you know, getting emotional. Just just that initial stance is just like like a lot of logic and a lot of substantiation. So, but uh yeah, man. This was a good conversation. I appreciate everybody in chat who donated. Sorry we weren't able to get to all of the chats. We got some big hitters out here that's giving a 50 $100 super chat. Shout out to all of y'all, man. man. And I'm a year to Dave.

Yeah, um Dandre, thank you for being here. Really appreciate you coming through and um you know, answering some questions that I'm sure um aren't the most easy to answer. Um so again, I appreciate your time on that. Uh what I do want to say when it comes to this particular situation of using expressions of Dave Anderson are not necessarily those of anybody on this panel but my black ass. Um I I want to be clear about a few things, right? My grandfather who had a sixth grade education would say, "Let your yes mean yes and your no mean no." Words have impact. Every religious book talks about what you say has power. Regardless of meaning, the words you speak mean absolutely everything. So, let's be grown. Do I think black men need to do better? By and large, absolutely. Some of us need therapy. Some of us need discipline as we talked about. Uh some of us need uh to take some accountability for the fact that we are out here like Nick Cannon with a bag of Viagra. Uh we got to take accountability for the promises we don't keep and the excuses that nobody asked for. I have always been an equal opportunity [ __ ] caller outer. But what we don't get to do is take the failures of a very small group of black men and diagnose all black men as a disease in the words we choose to excise. That's just intellectual um dishonesty. And that's the problem with keeping podcast mics at such a cheap rate. Uh black men are not anywhere near the cancer of our community. We did not create slavery. We did not create redlining. We didn't create mass incarceration, underfunded schools, the wage gap, bank deserts, food deserts. We did not create this media machine that uh keeps people like Andy Cohen and Leor Cohen and uh let's see here, uh Jimmy I in the billions. Uh we did not create this narrative of us being monsters. So absolutely, I think we are not above accountability, but let's not make us the emotional landfill that everybody decides to build on, even though we are the backbone of what built this country. And loving black women does not require hating black men or throwing black men under the bus. Because public humiliation of us is not a way that we heal our community. That's dysfunctional. There's too many of us who are broken who need therapy. There's there are some of us who are dangerous. There are some of us who need correction. But what I don't want to get lost in this conversation is that there are a bunch of us who are dads. Good dads. Husbands, good husbands, workers, builders, protectors, mentors, coaches, pastors, professors, entrepreneurs. um people who get up every day with no credit, no applause, and they're literally holding their lives and the lives of the people in their charge with duct tape and overdraft protection. We ain't the cancer. A lot of us are the immune system. A lot of us are the scar tissue. A lot of us are the unpaid security, the unpaid Uber. A lot of us are the therapists. A lot of us are the last beam of a house holding it up while we're being criticized for why the house is leaning in the first place. M. So, I'm not going to report for duty respectfully under a lie. I'll report for duty to build. I'll report for duty to lead. I'll report for duty to correct men who are wrong. I will report for duty to protect women and children. I'll report to duty to rebuild families and confront broken systems. When we have people like David, when we have people like R. Kelly, when we have people like Diddy, I condemn that situation immediately. But I also condemn Clive Davis. I also condemn Leor Cohen. also condemn Andy Cohen, Scooter Braun, and everybody who is in charge of perpetuating this thug, gangster, nonsensical uh mythos of black men that becomes the standard as opposed to the exception while also elevating a soft beta male scent menina mentality that does not serve us when it comes to our communities and would not be tolerated in anybody else's community. I will not report for duty to slander black men for applause, clicks, clouts, or likes. Not talking about DARE because he's not doing that. But for the general record, I want to make it abundantly clear. Yes, we're flawed. Yes, we're wounded. Yes, we're accountable. Uh but above all, whether you like it or not, whether you think we need to do better or not, we are necessary. We are not the cancer of the black community. By and large, we are a huge part of the cure. And I think it's time that everybody got themselves a dose.

Listen, man. I'm going leave it at that. I don't have too many more words. I think that we'll let the conversation be what it is and let everybody that's watching and going to watch this um let us know in the comments what you guys think. Uh DA Andre, man, you are more than welcome back to any future panels and discussions as relevant stuff pops up. If you got new projects and things, you're definitely welcome because one, I respect the fact a I don't know how these conversations go when we are going to go when we have guests. We're going to ask random tough questions. Um and I appreciate the fact that you were able to sit there, hear it, stand on your truth, and explain yourself extremely well. I was like, brother, your acting skills, man, it's it's kind of paying off a little bit. I I give it to you, man. Um, but I really we really appreciate you. And for everybody that's currently still watching, please please please make sure that you subscribe, that you follow every single man that you see on the screen, and feel free if you can to become a member of some of our respective platforms and channels. We're going to go because it's already getting kind of late and I'm hungry and I have not eaten dinner yet.

Yeah, you and me both. You always hungry. I don't like to eat beforehand cuz then I'm have to use the bathroom. So that's why I like I like to do this on empty stomach. But listen man, I really really appreciate you coming through. Of course, the panel, we appreciate you brothers. We may have to make this panel bigger and bigger over time because when these conversations are flowing, I I always want to hear even more and more perspectives because a lot of stuff um Dandre you said tonight has definitely made me re-evaluate some of my harsh belief systems where it's like I I think I have grace, but is there room for more grace? We're still with still with wisdom of course and that's a space that I think is necessary when it comes to these types of conversations. So um the funky denre made me put some hollow tips in. I had regular bullets. So the funky dena man there actually isn't any hate. it's more concern uh for the type of stuff that you're putting out there and knowing that if the roles are reversed, I don't know that you or black women would be as comfortable if we were to say that you guys are the canceller of the community. Um so just kind of keep that in mind. Um like as you and if you are watching the people that's connected to you on a burner account, we'll do it on a burner account. We talked a hell of a lot about what to do different, what to change, what to take accountability in, what potential strategies we could do in our own homes and amongst the community. We didn't spend an awful lot of time minus the first 20, 30 minutes or so of this 2 and a half hour plus show. We actually focus way more on what we need to do different as men. Um, and that's really the goal of this type of stuff. So, thank you to everybody that watched, that tuned in. Like we said, we appreciate all the super chats and everybody that gave and showed love. And listen, we going to see y'all right and early next week. Enjoy and take care.