U.G. Krishnamurti - Who Are We? What is Reality?

Who are we? What is reality? Is their reality? What do we experience as reality? Is there a God? Is there love? Age-old questions, but we ask them today to U.G. Krishnamurti. He comes from India, has written widely, has traveled widely, has lectured widely, but has a very unique view on the world. I call him the great debugger. Whatever you believe, you'll find a reason for you not to believe. Whatever you see, he will tell you it isn't there. A man that pushes you back into yourself, and some of us even start doubting who we are. I don't today. I come from a position like most people, where I believe in a God and I believe in things, but that doesn't make you, G. Krishnamurti, not less fascinating because he doesn't. So, to start with the first question, and welcome U.G., God, I think there is such a thing as direction and a God. You don't. You have described me as Adi bunker, throwing all those questions at this debunkers. Such questions which people have been asking for centuries is a reflection on your intelligence. Well, maybe I'm not intelligent. That's enough. But are you really interested in finding out the answers for those questions? For centuries, people have been telling us that God created us and God created this world. And those who do not believe that God is responsible for the creation of this world, they claim themselves to be the persons who know what they are talking about, what they have discovered as scientists, you know. And why do we accept the assertions of the scientists? Whether God created this universe or some great Big Bang in nature created this universe, it doesn't really matter. But we are not ready to accept that a universe like this cannot come into being without some cause or with some something, you see. So we cannot accept anything, any happening in the world outside of the field of cause-and-effect. So we have to find out the cause of everything. We have so far not succeeded.

I was telling a few minutes ago, I was made to believe that God created this universe. Those who have lost faith in God, those who have tremendous investment in the scientists who you think know what they are talking about and what they have discovered, they said, "Just a happening in the universe." All right. And I was told when I was a student that there is order in this world. I was a little boy in the school. I asked my professor, "Not that I'm a lecturer, I don't see any order in this world. Why are you talking of order in this world?" He got a Nobel Prize. And another joker arrived on the scene and said, "There is chaos in this world." Then I started looking at the same universe. That bastard said there is order in the universe. This joker tells me that there is chaos. I don't see order. I don't see chaos. Then what the hell they are talking about? The third arc arrived on the scene and said, "He sees both order and chaos in the same frame." All the three got Nobel Prizes. I don't see any order. I don't see any chaos. I don't see order and chaos in the same frame. Why are they telling us that they know how the things are happening in this world? There, God created this world, or some happening in this great Big Bang. I am not interested. See, but most people are. As you say, there is a need to find this first cause, this first certain. What do they need? I don't see any need to know who created this the world. I don't even know who created me, you know.

I want to tell you some story. My grandson was brought up by Catholics, and they were telling him that God created you and God created the world. And his father said, "Your grandfather is the only one that can answer that question. Go and ask him." And he called me one day on the telephone. "You don't come and spend much time with us. We would like to spend some time with you, Grandpa. We have very serious questions. And we have been told by my grandmother that God created us and God created the world. And my father says that you are the only one that can answer that question." And then I said, "I am a very crude man. When your parents make love next time, insist that you and your sister should be present. Then you will know who created you." And my son got on the line. "What is it that you are telling him? We are already having a lot of problems with my children. You are putting these straight ideas into their heads." "Then we will talk about who created God later on." Those kids, seven and five-year-old kids, asking the grandmother this question, "Who created God? Who created God?" So they were not in a position to answer that question at all. So then she will deal with that question later on. I have a lot of people. I am talking to them. And then every year he came and asked me, "Who created God?" And was not in a position to give any satisfactory answer. And I took some money from my pocket and gave him $1,000 to keep him silent. And then every time he came to see me, "You have not answered the question." And my granddaughter came, "You are very partial to your grandson. I also want money." And so I had to give another thousand. Every time they came and threw that question at me, "You have not answered that question yet." So I had to double it and triple it. Being very critical, you answered the question about an illusion, about a belief system, about God. You answered it by giving them a thousand dollars, which is another belief system. Realistic thing that is the most is a solid thing that it's also belief system. I believe money's not a belief. No, not at all.

When I was 40 years old, you see, 2+2=4, they said. I was a very troublesome guy to all my teachers. "Why should 2+2 be 4?" I asked him. And then he brought some marbles and said, "Two marbles, two marbles. He said, this is 2+2=4." No, I don't accept that. The only thing I accept is money. Two rupees, give me another two rupees, put them together and count their four rupees. And that was kind of a strange approach to all the problems they tried to create for me, you know. If you don't accept one, there is no two, you know. And the ultimate analysis, even mathematics is mysticism, you know. The whole story of mathematics, say 1, 2, 3, they stop there. And then the Arabs entered the picture, and they moved it up to 9. They are the stop for centuries. One day, Bertrand Russell and Radhakrishnan, and the very famous philosopher, he was the President of India, brilliant fellow, they both appeared on the BBC. And Bertrand Russell made a statement that India has contributed nothing, nothing to the scientific thinking of man. And when his term came, Radhakrishnan said, "The only thing that India has contributed, nothing." He said, "Nothing means zero." And that created the problems for us all. So I add one, zero, zero, zero, zero, zero, zero, and nobody is able to handle me because I go on adding zeros and zeros and zeros, you know. So he himself admitted that any mathematics, in the ultimate final analysis, is mysticism. It is very strange that they have found out that the Hungarians are the top mathematicians in the whole world today. So even there, you can't be sure of anything, to see. Everything. If there is no one, there is no two. But why should there be one? They create all this mess for us, even in this field where we have to deal with them in a realistic way. Let alone this video.

Two questions: Who created the world? Who created the universe? And if you don't believe in God, and if you don't believe in great Big Bang as the scientists are asserting is responsible. I am not interested in this. I am here, living in the midst of all these things. I never asked any questions like, "Who created this universe? Who created God? Who created me?" You know, what for? Okay, then we live in a black box, and we shouldn't care about what's outside a black box or what's inside the black box. Black box. They were like that box. We create belief systems. Money is one. God is one. Love is one. Money is all that matters in this world. Nothing else matters. That's all. I discovered the diamond when I was an egg boy, you know. They asked this idiotic question, "What do you want to be when you grow up?" Let me grow up. I see what do I want to know? I want only money. Money. Nothing else. I know money can buy anything and everything in this world. When I met in a circus statement like this in one of my interviews, that lady asked, "Making money by love?" My God, that's the only thing that money can buy. The love. You may not have a particular lovey-dovey, but there are so many people there. And money, what is it that money cannot buy? Leslie, you know. So you don't have any belief system. But but does that make you live a little bit empty? If you don't believe in these things, you see.

Why I want to assert, and I have time and again, it's at at this point that there is only a belief. There there is no believer. So you are that belief. What you call you, it doesn't matter whether you believe in God or whether you believe in the assertions of the scientists, or really even the assertions that the President Bush makes time and again, "I will see that Americans will have the same standard of living forever." Huh? You invest your faith in that guy, see, because he is asserting, you know, like that. So there is no believer. There. You don't have to take my word, you see. There is only a belief. You are that belief. What you call you is that belief. It doesn't matter what that belief is. Whether you believe in God, or whether you believe in love, whether you believe in this, that, and the other. So if that belief comes to an end, you, as you know yourself, and as you experience yourself, is coming to an end. When I die, my shitbox dose goes first. Before that, what you call clinical death cannot take place, cannot occur. So if that goes now, you will drop dead at this moment. What will remain after that is not your interest, is not your concern, because you are not going to be there to tell yourself that you are dead. So those who say that you are dead and define it as clinical death, use their knowledge and tell you that you are not breathing, you are not responding to the stimulus, there is no pulse. They are using the knowledge and they say that you are dead. But the fact that you are dead is something which cannot be experienced by you, or even by them, or even by those once. What the experience is not the death of their dear near ones, but the void created by what you call death makes it impossible for them to live the same kind of her life forever, you know. So for all practical purposes, there is no such thing as death for the body. But then death is a simultaneous process. The moment you are born, you have to die, you see. But is a definition? Death is a definition. Health is a definition. Disease is a definition. All these are definitions. We swallow all the definitions. We think that they know what they are talking about. They don't know nothing, nothing at all. So they assert based upon what they think that they have found out through their research projects or through the beliefs that it's passed on to us from generation to generation. So the assertion that there is no believer, but there is only belief, cannot be accepted by you. If the belief comes to an end, you will comprehend it. So you cannot but replace one belief with another belief, you see.

The question that people ask in the Western countries is that, you see, when once you have all that you can reasonably ask for is already there, the question arises, "Is that all?" Is that question that created a market for all those people from the Eastern countries to come and exploit you and tell you that we have answers for your questions. They don't have any answers, see. You have everything. "Is that all?" That is all. And then that the question does not at all arise, you know. So you are terribly bored, living day after day, day after day, same kind of a life. Go and work for a living. And it becomes, I'm sorry to use that word, but that's the most effective word, a terrible bore. So you invested a thing called love, you understand. You have invested, found out this misused so many words, and he binds, sweetiepie, sugar, bugger, and by. What is that to get? This has become a bore, a terrible bore. I'm not saying anything against pleasure, you see. So through the help of thinking mechanism, quote-unquote, we have turned that, you see, a necessary thing for the continuity of living organisms into a pleasure. So those who deny themselves that pleasure, the spiritual guys, the priests in the churches, all the holy men, all the enlightenment telling you that they are practicing celibacy. Why they have to break this alibi? See, it is something that is very essential for the continuity of the living organisms. Every form of life depends upon this for their continuity. The human bodies, you know, all the flora and the fauna that is there inside millions and millions of living organisms crawling on this body. You have no business to take baths for purposes of cleanliness. You are killing millions and millions of them, you know. That mosquitoes depend upon you. Your hemoglobin for the continuity of the mosquitoes. Only female mosquitoes bite because they need that hemoglobin to you continuity to the mosquitoes, you know. They don't bite me anymore. They sing songs, and I enjoyed them better than Beethoven's Ninth Symphony, Fifth Symphony, Mozart, Bach, and all those because such a melodious thing. Probably my hemoglobin is not productive, you know, for them. For whatever reason, you know.

You make me go between my doubts on belief system. You say religion, love, all those things are illusions. Yes. If you are, you say that you say belief, why do you even question? Why do you in doubt? You see, if there is, if people believe in God, huh, it's fine with me. But you want others also to believe in God, you see. That is a pleasure. I say you have to share with somebody else what you believe, what you like. Even you force people to eat piccata, you see, the bread from Italy. Force everybody to eat that. I don't like it. I detest that one. So unless you also enjoy that, they don't feel the pleasure. Sharing is very important. You go out for a walk. Look, look, look, how beautiful is the sunset and sunrise. I don't even want to look at that, but he forces you to look at that and share that pleasure. So when once they don't have this pleasure, they turn food into pleasure. Why do they have to eat 25-course meal? All those spiritual people there in the market field, they eat like pigs, hogs, and swine, all rolled into one. They don't need any tables to put your computers and then, you know, they don't need it. What do they have to eat all that stuff? There's also a professional. I'm not saying anything against that. So why do we even ask these questions? That is why I say that those who believe in God, you believe in God, and I don't want to believe in God, and you want me to believe in God. All right, no. I don't want you. Call me an atheist. You call me any theist. You call me this, that, and the other, and feel so good. Why do you want me to believe in God? And so why haven't you invented all this nonsensical stuff that they talk? Cosmological, ontological, teleological proofs of the existence of God. If there is a God, let it be there. I am not interested. God is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. It does not mean that I'm an atheist or I don't believe in God. If you believe in God, believe in God. It's fine. Yet, there's a this, and even the atheists want to convert you and free you from your belief in God. Where do they want to free you from your belief in God? You believe in God. I don't believe in God. That's the end of it, as far as I'm concerned. Whether God is there or not, it doesn't matter to me. God is irrelevant, you see. I don't need God for any reason in my life, you understand. I don't want to pray to. Whether he exists or not, it is of no interest.

I was telling you, I was in the Masonic movement, and I used to tell myself, if that God has created this imperfect world, he needs my help as a mason to use me as a mason to perfect the imperfect world. He agreed. All right. When we put money there, we have to tell ourselves and tell everybody, "I am hereby divesting everything I have, everything that I possess, everything I have. I put ten rupees." And repeat this nonsense. So I walk it out, do you understand? So you have to somehow force others also to believe in all your beliefs. And if you have lost belief in anything, you must also want to free them their belief, you see, or want them to believe that there is no God. So whether God exists or not is of no importance to us. But anyway, millions and millions of people use that existing or non-existing God to make a living. Jesus created a chance for millions and millions of people to make a living preaching that, you know. And so why you have to believe in God, you know? I thought I was very original when I made a statement when somebody threw a question at me, "God," I said, "God is a jumble spelling, huh? Dog." So now I thought that was very urgent. Well, nobody is original. Nobody is at all. We don't quote the source. Now you press, take the computer and ask the question, "God," and then press the button. Jumble spelling. God is the jumble spelling of dog, you know. So why are we interested? Why do we have to find the cause of everything? We are functioning in the field of cause-and-effect relationship. You can't conceive of the possibility of anything happening outside the field of cause-and-effect. Not only there, our relationships. Why do we have to write the stories of our lives? Why do we have to place them before us, although religious teachers, as models, and tell everybody that you must live like them, you see? When tomorrow, the day after, or you see 20 years after, the Indians have invented a thing called reincarnation, you know. Why they have invented reincarnation? You did something terrible in your past life, that is why you are suffering in this life. Make a virtue of your suffering. In the next life, you will be amply rewarded. Boy, what kind of guys they are? And then they say, "When I was an egg boy." I don't know if it is interesting forever. Self and for others. This interview. I was a 7-year-old guy, and we attended the Golden Jubilee of the Theosophical Society in Madras. My grandfather was one of the earliest members of the Theosophical Society. He knew all the leaders of the Theosophical Society. He contributed so much of money for every cause. For example, Annie Besant started the beginnings of Banaras Hindu University, proclaiming to that country, "This college will produce future leaders of the world." Not one came out of that college. No leader, you know, came out of that college. And so when people came, there were 3,000 people from every part of the world. When they met, instead of introducing themselves, "My name is U.G. Krishnamurti. What is yours?" This is how we see introduce ourselves when we meet. First, they introduce themselves in a very strange way. "I was Queen Victoria in my past life. What were you?" "I was Giordano Bruno in my past life. What were you?" And then I found not one historical figure, not one spiritual person, not even stars were left for me, you know. Sympathy star. Thank you. So I lost my faith in reincarnation. Enough, you know. What for? Nothing. Nobody is left for me. So why should a very incursion? That was how all the strings shattered. There were such big shocks for me. So you have to accept all that for what? We can't live together, you see. If we don't believe even in our homes, you know. They force us to eat the same kind of a food, huh? Why you have to bother about, you know, the, you know, nineteen vitamins in whoo Martine? And even toilet papers have vitamin E now in Chicago. I mean, sorry, in Switzerland. Very expensive toilet papers. My explanation is very simple. Vitamin E activates the sex gland. When you rub that after sheeting, it activates probably the sex glands. You feel some sort of a pleasure. And then the razors, what is that they use? Mam'selle. And then, you see, vitamin E, probably you don't have to kiss or touch it. And you rub it with the vitamin E and shave, even. And then you feel probably. But what kind of an interview this? Yeah.

Well, I want something. We are talking about belief system, and sometimes you call like a religion a glove. For some reason, you took off the glove, or the glove fell apart. I didn't take off the glove, you see. Life, you can give hundreds of definitions. Life is something. Whatever the word life means, cannot be captured and contained and given expression to. Our problems, you can talk of life, the meaning of life, the purpose of life. They are all meaningless. But what we are interested in, and what has, what is creating problems for us, is living. We cannot live with others, you know. Living, the living is the problem created by the whole culture or the society or whatever you want to call it. This is how you should believe. This is what you should believe. This is what you should do. This is what you should not do. That was my problem even as a little boy. I was not interested in spiritual enlightenment and all that. God realization, realization. Imagine a little boy. I rejected because I didn't see that operating in the lives of the people who are there around me. The claimants to all the highest spiritual states, they were also like anybody else. "Do as I say, but don't do as I do." Something wrong. That was not interested in that. I was not really interested in my want. Whatever I want, they didn't want me to want. My family members, my teachers, everyone. "You should want this and not that," you know. So to please me, they use the money by giving and denying to make me, forced me to want what they wanted me to want. I was not interested. Or money is already acceptable to me because there's the only thing that I need. And I know, if I know of anything else in this world, money is all that is necessary for me to survive in this world. Nothing else. So even today, money is the highest. Top. Food is at the bottom of my needs. And when once that is the case, you don't care for money at all. You'll be so surprised. Whatever I don't need, I don't keep it, you understand. So this is not a spiritual state or any such a thing. If I want anything in this world, I have the means to get whatever I want. It is already with me or in his pocket, and I pick it up and ask him, "Please don't call me a big pocket." So it is not a spiritual state. My goals and needs are the same. If I want something, I have the means to get whatever I want. Not only that, in that area, but in every field, you see. If I want to reach the top, this is any profession. I wanted. I could have reached the top in that area. As a speaker, I was considered to be one of the most brilliant speakers that India ever produced when I was 21, you know. So I knew how I became a speaker. Is he choosing some models and and practicing? And after all, you see, it is an order to be practiced, you see. How I practice, how I memorize, and how I reach the top, I knew very well. So anything I wanted. So this is the only instrument I have. As a boy, I am telling you, an ink boy, this is the only instrument I have. What you call intellect. I have to use this to achieve my goals. All right. And then you have to take into consideration, there is somebody who is more intelligent than I am. How am I going to handle that guy who is supposed to have more, whatever that intelligence means? This was my questions, not God, God realization, spiritual. No. How am I going to get whatever I want? So far, it has not helped me not to achieve whatever I wanted, to get whatever I wanted through the use of quote/unquote intellect. We understand. So you have to take into consideration somebody who is more intelligent than I am. All right. And then don't talk of intuition. Don't talk of all that thing. This is the only instrument I have. This has not helped for me to achieve my goals, to reach the top in any area of my existence. And if I am ready to use the other thing, crooked means, I have to take into consideration somebody who is more crooked than I am. How am I going to handle those crooked guys? This was my basic approach to the problems, not the spiritual solutions that they offered me. Because I found that those who are around me, all the pontiffs were there around me. Here you have only one pontiff. There are hundreds of pontiffs, each one claiming to be. See, whatever he claims to be. See, no, no, no. It's not operating in your life. I'm not interested, you know. So this is the only way to reach my goal. How am I going to? He's more crooked than I am. Would you call that approach rationalistic or materialistic? Or you see, sir, to call that materialistic or condemn people as materialists has no meaning now. Cause they have all found out there is no such thing as matter. Why call it TC? It's an excuse for us, you see, to feel good that you are condemning them. You see, they are materialists. The spiritual people, where do they go? To the church. What is the demand? At least here, they are not interested in enlightenment. They are not interested in all that kind of a thing. But here, they go and pray. What do you want? Material goodies. That's all. Happiness, content. What do you mean happiness? What exactly do you mean by happiness? If you translate a particular sensation as happiness, you call it happiness. A particular sensation that is there, you separate yourself and use that knowledge about the happiness that is put in there and translate that and tell yourself that you are happy. The moment you, it is a sensation, you understand. All sensations are very short-lived. They can't last forever. So the moment you separate yourself from a particular sensation and tell yourself that you are happy, the demand to keep that going longer than its duration of life is inevitable. So what all you are doing to stretch that and keep that going on and down has turned that into the opposite, unhappiness. You are stuck with unhappiness. Same is the case with the pleasure. If you say that it is a pleasure, you want to be in that state of pleasure all the time. It is just not possible. So you are turning pleasure into pain, you know. We are not ready to accept it. And all those religious jokers tell us, "We have some ways. We teach you the techniques of meditation, yoga, this, that, and the other, and you will be in a permanent bliss." The demand for permanence in every area of our existence is called, is the cause of human misery. There is no such thing as permanence at all. The permanence that is what we are all interested in. They say, then the future. We are talking about. I ask people, first to tell me something about the present. This is the present moment you are living in. The so-called present. Tell me something about the present. Anything you tell me about the present is the past that is telling me that this is the present, you know. So there must be a present. Before you demand future. The future you are interested in is what you didn't have in the past. I don't have good health. I want to be healthy. I don't have money. I want more money. I am in poor health. I want to be very healthy. What I don't have now, I want in the future. But the instrument which I am going to use to create the future I am interested in is the same interest that created the past. So the future is not going to be any different from the past, but probably a modified continuation of the past. So there must be a present. The present does not exist at all. If the present is not there, there can't be any future. You can't jump over from the past into the future. You have to go through the present. What tells you that this is the present? In describing the present is the past. So for all practical purposes, there is no such thing as future. You are wanting to have create a future different from the past is the one that is responsible for your problems. So there is no such thing as future at all, only a modified continuity of the past. This goes on all throughout life. Go on and on and on. So that misery has got to companion before what you call death takes place, you know. What you call death? There's no such thing as death for the body. It cannot tell itself that you are dead, you know. I know a lot of people who created organizations, the near-death experience and all that kind of a thing. I address them. They close down all the near-death experience organizations in Australia. How can you have a dialogue with the death? I want to know. When you are given anesthesia for certain operations, you're going to be a strange state, and then you don't think you are having a dialogue with your death. Death does not exist at all. Sorry. You don't even know that you are alive. If you ask me that question, "Are you alive?" My answer would be, "Yes, I am very much alive." Why I'm making that assertive statement and give the answer as I am alive? Because that question is born out of the knowledge how a living being functions. So I am using the same knowledge that is there which created that question, which has made you to throw that question at me, is bringing out the answer. But the fact that I'm alive, sorry, can never, never be experienced by me or by anybody.

Well, I'm still wondering, yeah, with what you say, in a way, is the emotions, believe they're all. You don't need them. There's this, you don't need them. But isn't that the same what the old Vedic sages said about detachment? You know, don't get attached to your beliefs. You see, there is no need for anybody to detach yourself from anything, you know, at all. Why attachment is a problem? The attachment you are made to believe is the cause of your misery. So detach yourself. The only detachment is to walk up, walk out on your wife, walk out on your children, and become a sannyasi, wear orange robes, change your name into some other name, and believe that you are now detachable. Not at all. When I went on BBC, the guest of the week program, they could not handle me. The usual interviewers, they invited a professor of philosophy from London University. The first question he asked me was, "Sir, you are tearing apart everything India has stood for centuries. Why you have not changed your name?" I told him, "Only criminals and holy men change their names. Holy men change their names more often than criminals." I can understand criminals changing their name, but why holy men should change their names? You wear orange robes and then you create a new identity with the new name and you hold on to that name. And those people who gave names, those religious people gave feminine names to men and masculine names to women to fool everybody, see. So when once you identify yourself with the new names, it is difficult for you to go back. The identity with the name is the most important thing with us. So my answer to those questions is, you know, I have a telephone number. I have a number for my apartment, street numbers, and then bank account number, a passport number, a PAN number. My favorite number is 49820. I repeat it all the time. It's easier for the computer now. The computers can come out with the names also. In the beginning, there were a lot of problems. They had to handle only the number. Now you can put the names also. So we are no different from the computers. But this is something extraordinary. You can't imagine the human computer. This is what I am telling all those experts who come and brag about what wonderful computers are and how it's going to be of great help to us all. I tell them, "The moment you put selectivity and censorship in the computers, their usefulness will be finished." And there will be used the way the society and the leaders of mankind are using our thinking mechanism, which is nothing but selectivity and censorship, and destroy that. Are used to destroy everything. Their usefulness will be finished. So what all is there is a selectivity and censorship. You should look at this. You should not look at that, you see. You select this, not that. So that is the one that has created a major problem for us. We're all caught up in that. The choices. So we are doomed. It is not a pessimistic assertion that I am making. All right.

Why do you have to go to the church and pray? The prayer is only to get what you don't have. All those prayers are materially secured. Not like the Indians wanting enlightenment and moksha, liberation, freedom from births and deaths. But here, they go to the mosques, they go to the temples, they go to the churches. They want only the materialistic things, not spiritual. They talk of moksha, liberation. There, you know, the prayer. With my grandmother, very sharp woman, she was not a spiritual woman. She used to give me this example of a thief hiding in a bush, praying to that God, "Oh God, I am going to break into that house and steal everything. Please see that I don't get caught." That was his prayer to the God. Got it. And then the, the owner of the house, where so much their wealth and all that, praying to the same God, asking himself, "See that the thieves don't break in and rob everything." And whose side do you think God is? God should be on the side of the thieves because he is struggling and he doesn't accept the fact that if he's as rich as he is today, he's robbed, huh? And his robbery and his thievery, and if I am kind, my own word stealer is accepted by the society, and you condemn the other guys. If there is a God, he should be on his side, not on my side. What do you think, sir? I have said enough. Yes, I think so. U.G., as usual, you have, you have shaken my black box of beliefs. Replace it with the other box. Think box. You are using a refined term and call it black box, but they're also the same boxes. They're all that they have put in, created mischief. Some great philosopher, now famous philosopher, is writing a book on U.G., calling it "The Philosophy of U.G." The philosophy boom. That is the statement. Their own thought. The U.G., the man who, for many people, shakes their belief systems, their existence. And as a paradox, I think there's a very good thing. Thank you. Bye-bye.