Transcription
The Trump administration's immigration crackdown is really being felt in Georgia. Hundreds of federal officers raided a massive Hyundai electric vehicle plant that was being built in southeast Georgia. This happened yesterday, not too far from Savannah. In all, 475 people were detained in what is being described as the largest operation in the history of Homeland Security Investigations. Several agencies were involved.
And on that same day, hundreds of miles north in upstate New York, dozens of workers at a family-owned business that makes nutrition bars were arrested during an ICE raid. Joining us now is former acting director of ICE, John Sandweg. John, it's good to have you with us.
And we look at, first of all, this raid in Georgia. Again, a multi-agency raid. We learned from officials a short time ago, this was really the result of a long investigation. Of the 475 people who were detained, they were largely Korean nationals. It's actually more than a third of the workforce at this plant. When it comes to a raid of this scale, how does it all come together? We talk about a month-long investigation, but where does that actually begin? Is it a tip?
Typically, yeah, I think this is something that's really reminiscent of what we saw a lot in the George W. Bush administration, where I did a lot of these large worksite raids. Typically, it begins from a tip. You know, really, what happened here is the administration said, we want to restart these raids with a total, they decided, the criminal investigative side of eight months ago to start looking for appropriate targets. ICE then uses a number of tactics. It could be tips. It could be looking at payroll records for anomalies. It could just be what's called the I-9 audit, where you go in and you look at the immigration forms we all fill out when we get a new job. Either way, ICE gets a lead on the employer.
Now, we know they had a criminal search warrant, so they had to go to a magistrate and demonstrate there's probable cause for a criminal investigation. Typically, the target of that investigation is the employer. But let's be real, the benefits are twofold. One is they make 400 arrests. They like that. They would like the civil immigration side. It helps them meet that quota. But then the second piece of this is this deterrent message, Erica. And what we're seeing throughout all these immigration actions is that kind of the subtext to it is putting, you know, driving immigrants to leave the country. Whether that's scaring employers to try to eliminate jobs or just putting people, making people fear that they're not safe at work. You know, and you can't lose sight of that implicit message here, which is trying to encourage that self-deportation.
Does this, when we when we couple this with the fact that there was a separate raid at this plant in upstate New York yesterday, does this signal to you a shift in the strategy at all?
I think it's part of the strategy. Again, I think we've seen this on a much smaller scale in LA. We've seen a little bit of this across the country. ICE likes these types of operations because they can arrest large quantities of people. You get to a worksite, you get to the lower wage, where there's lower-skilled employment. You're going to find large numbers of migrants. What's different with this raid in Georgia is it's a very large operation. It took months of planning to get there. And Erika, I think we're going to see more. There are undoubtedly more of these that have been in the planning stages, than in the planning stages since they really the beginning of the Trump administration. They're going to start coming out. But I think it fits into this larger puzzle.
Of course, Erika, the problem with these raids and the reason why these raids were de-emphasized during the Obama administration is you don't find criminals. They're not the 13 gang members, you know, who might have infiltrated the U.S. They don't work in these factories. That's not who you arrest there. So it's more about the volume of people they arrest, but not really about public safety.
Yeah, we're hearing about a number of people may have overstayed their visas, for example. There are also, I mean, it's also fascinating to you mentioned that if this was a month-long investigation, they could have been looking for an appropriate site. This site in particular, the fact that there was this EV battery plant being built. The president touting Hyundai's investment in the United States back in March, specifically highlighting its efforts in Georgia. Typically, what would the communication and or even the coordination be between the administration, you know, letting the president know, for example, and Homeland Security or ICE, when it comes to a raid like this?
Yeah, typically, this is not always as typical in this administration as with other administrations. Typically, though, you would try to divorce those two things, right? You would not want the politics to be driving whether it's an appropriate target. There could be communications. You could alert the White House that such a large, high-publicity operation is going to happen. You would need to do that carefully through White House counsel, through appropriate channels. I don't think this is driven so much by the politics, though, as it was by the opportunity that they thought this presented to make a large number of arrests. But again, difficult to say.
Right. And also because we had, you know, conflicting or shifting comments, I should say, from the president over the summer, announcing that farmworkers, for example, would not be targeted, and then, you know, taking that back just a number of days later. I also just want to get your take. You let you go in Chicago. So the city itself bracing for this potential deployment, maybe of the National Guard. I spoke with the lieutenant governor of Illinois a short time ago. She said they are expecting increased immigration actions, likely to begin tomorrow. Based on what we have seen in Los Angeles, even the crime efforts here in Washington, D.C., some of which have resulted in some immigration action. Is this, in your eyes, is this an effective immigration tool for this administration?
Look, my concern with this is we're pulling FBI agents, we're pulling Homeland Security Investigations agents, and we're pulling ICE officers off of what they would otherwise be doing to focus on these kinds of operations. To date, in D.C., what we've seen them arrest are your run-of-the-mill economic migrants, not the people, not those gang members, not those convicted felons who have posed, you know, posed a threat to the U.S. And the problem is, it's not just, is it worth getting those people, but what are we losing, right? We're pulling agents off of cases who would be investigating export control, stopping the illegal export of weapons technology to North Korea or Iran, or engaged in complicated, you know, cross-border drug smuggling investigations or money laundering investigations. Or pulling agents off that beat to do immigration enforcement, but not against the high-value targets.
Look, we'll see what happens in Chicago. I understand why they're drawn to Chicago. There's this political element. Chicago, Illinois is also the sixth largest state when it comes to undocumented immigrants. And Cook County has had a very sanctuary city policy that limits ICE's access to the courts. But I think the answer to these questions will be seen by what are the results of this operation. Who are the migrants they arrest? And I do think there are legitimate questions. Is it worth it? And is America safer overall when we're pulling these agents from these other responsibilities to do that kind of work?
John Sandweg, really great to have your insights and your expertise this afternoon. Thank you.