Transcription
Hello, and welcome to a new interview for Mid-Max. I'm Ben Hansen. Mid-Max is a Patreon about games, friends, and getting better, and today our interview guest is the one and only Sid Meier himself. It's an honor to be joined by Sid Meier to talk about his new memoir, Sid Meier's Memoir: A Life in Computer Games.
In this interview, we talk about why he chose to write a memoir, the importance of preserving that history, what he's learned from looking back on his own life, the nostalgic bits in there, what he's learned about running a studio like Firaxis, and a lot of Sid Meier life advice packed into this interview. So thank you so much for clicking on this if you're watching on YouTube. If you want to unlock the podcast version of this interview, all of our past interviews, all of our future interviews, and the podcast versions of The Deepest Dive—which is the best discussion about games on the internet—huge community game clubs, we're doing Super Mario 64 next, and we could use your input and insight to read on the show. Also, you get early access to the Midnight Show and exclusive shows like Min Facts. There's a lot of bonus stuff if you support us at patreon.com/midmax with two Ms at the five-dollar tier, but support us at any tier and you can jump into our community Discord, which is a wonderful place to hang out with some wonderful people and meet new folks to play games with.
But without further ado, the one and only Sid Meier. Sid Meier, welcome to Mid-Max, sir.
Thank you. It's great to be here.
It's an honor to have you. Is this a glimpse of your house behind you?
This is actually our living room, yeah, where, you know, it's a time when we spend a lot, a lot of time at home, and uh, yeah, what, what more comfortable place to chat than in our living room?
Yeah, it looks so cozy. Uh, how's your life been recently? What's been, what's been going on over there?
Life has been, we, you know, we're making the best of things, I think that as a, you know, designer and a programmer, um, I've worked most of the time by myself, so I, I'm able to, able to do my work from home with actually fewer distractions and interruptions than than normal, I guess. So, and I can interact with people, uh, you know, over Zoom, or I can connect to our network and update things, so it's actually been um, not as bad as it, you know, it might have been. We're, we're adjusting; we're hoping; we're making the best of things. I've been doing a lot of reading, and you know, our company is sponsoring free Netflix for all of our employees, so wow, binging on some TV shows. So just a different, you know, different set of things to do.
But you're making the best of it.
Yeah. Back when you were in the office—I don't mean to make you too nostalgic about, you know, six months ago—but back when you were in the office, what is the right level of interaction for you per day? Like, do you like those days where you can just walk in with your trench coat, go right to your office, close the door, and just program all day and then leave? Or is it like, "Ah, I should chit-chat for maybe 10-15 minutes and then really get to it?"
I, um, my days kind of fall into two halves. Like, I'll, I'll come in in the morning with a bunch of ideas, so at that point, I want to just jump right on it and, you know, program those, try them out, see what's going to, see what is going to happen. Um, that will go depending, you know, whether I had a lot of ideas or not—so many, you know, a couple of hours probably till lunchtime. And then, um, after lunch, I'm a little more relaxed; I've kind of maybe run out of ideas, or um, I'm ready to talk to people, ready to kind of get some feedback and things like that. So it's a little bit of each, but I definitely try to keep my morning times uh, focused, and then I can schedule my meetings or other things uh, more in the afternoon.
And you're tinkering with your own prototype engine with these ideas, or what is, you know, your tinkering process in the morning actually look like?
Well, um, I, yeah, I'm generally working on a prototype of some of a new game idea, or you know, an add-on to something that we already have, and I will, uh, strangely enough, in the shower, I get a lot of my ideas, so I'll write them down, you know, bring, come into work with uh, with a piece of, no, paper with seven or eight things that I want to do, and uh, sit down and, and I program them, try them out, you know, if they work, uh, leave them in; if they don't work, I'll try and fix them; if they don't work at all, take them out, try something else. Sometimes, um, you know, a new idea will pop into my head at that time, but uh, somehow, you know, overnight things kind of percolate, and in the morning, I tend to have uh, solutions to some of the problems that I might have been facing the day before and some new ideas for making, making the prototype better or adding a new feature to it.
Yeah. And without, you know, spoiling any top-secret stuff you might be working on, can you give like a level of, or just the scale of some of these ideas? Is it just a programming trick, or is it a level of like, "Oh, you know what if we change this number here, it'll impact gameplay this way?" Or like, what scale are these ideas that you come in the morning with?
They are basically features, like, you know, "This ability is too powerful, but it should work this way," you know, or, "I've been meaning to figure out uh, how to make this part unique, and here's a thought about that," or, "This is, it's overpowered. How do we keep it fun but not, you know, but, but nerf it down a little bit?" Or, "This is boring. How do we, I never use this thing, you know, how do I make it interesting enough so that I'm going to use it more?" Or, "I always use this thing, so how do I make the other things more attractive?" So, you know, I'm always about those uh, interesting decisions. So it's kind of looking at the different parts of the game and saying, "Are these things that, you know, I'm intrigued to go in all the different directions?" Or some of these just boring, and I would never, I would never choose them, so I might as well get rid of them.
Yeah, I like the idea of you draining all the hot water in your house, just taking a super long shower, staring at the wall, coming up with these ideas.
Yeah, I haven't gotten to the extent of, you know, like a waterproof whiteboard in my shower yet. I have to retain them all in my head.
Oh, hey, keeps you young. That seems great. At a certain point, I once thought about like having a, a little tape recorder in the shower, but um, so far I haven't had that many ideas that I thought I couldn't keep track of them.
Yeah, it's like seven; you can juggle that in your mind. That checks out. Um, well, hey, uh, thank you for writing a memoir. Uh, so few people in the game industry have taken this leap. Do you want to just talk about that process of what compelled you to write this?
Well, I think I realized that um, I have been around for quite a while making games. I really, you know, was so fortunate to be there some of the very early days and to, to keep doing it, and I've, I've seen, I guess, um, the evolution of this industry and, you know, from almost from beginning to, to where it is today. And uh, you know, realizing that uh, today we have every piece of information we would ever want at our, at our fingertips with the internet and wiki, etc., but for about the first half of that journey, uh, we, we weren't recording every waking moment in some cloud somewhere. So, um, some of these stories, some of these, um, the background, this is kind of in a way our origin story, you know, starting with the 8-bit computers with the 8K of memory and, and up until today. So I thought it might be worth uh, kind of writing some of things down. These are a lot of the questions I'll get asked sometimes about different games and uh, specifically the, the stories behind the games, because a lot of times you'll play a game and you kind of assume that was the way it was always supposed to be, and that was the way the idea from the beginning, and that was the design, and it was just a straight path from point A to point B to make the game. Um, seldom is that true. They're often many uh, blind alleys and, and in moments of inspiration that kind of lead to the final, to the final game. So, um, putting those down, kind of talking about uh, the process of making those games, um, often I'm asked, you know, "How do I, how do I get into the gaming industry? How do you design games? I want to be, you know, I want to be a game designer." Um, I think these are a lot of um, fairly instructive uh, incidents, things, you know, we talk about some of our game design rules, and hopefully they can spare somebody from making some of the same mistakes that, that we made along the way.
Yeah. Why do you think so few other game developers have written books, have written memoirs, have chronicled this stuff? Do you think you just have an innate love of history more than them, and you appreciate that aspect?
That might be part of it. I think I, you know, I've been really fortunate in being able to focus on game design uh, for my entire career, and this industry is pretty volatile. Uh, companies come and go; opportunities come and go; and I think it's, it's perhaps not that hard to kind of become uh, discouraged or, you know, kind of um, no longer have the enthusiasm for the, for the industry. I mean, we have lots of uh, young designers doing great things, um, um, but I might be one of the few old designers trying to still do great things, um, and uh, you know, I think that, that, that might be part of, of the reason. Um, you know, there's kind of enough, enough to fill a book at this point, so, um, [Music] I can't really, you know, answer for some of the other folks. I'd love to read their, their books as well, but um, that's why uh, we made this book.
Yeah. Well, I hope yours kind of serves as a catalyst to get some other people in a more reflective mood, even just to preserve some of their history in their gaming history, or just to write books. It's so frustrating; there's so many great minds out there. It's like, Mark Cerny, get some things down on paper, please, before something horrific happens. We need this history preserved.
Yeah, I don't know that we think, you know, as game designers, I'm not sure we think of books as like a thing so much. These, you know, that every, everything we do is on a computer, and isn't, isn't every piece of information that's ever been known already out there somewhere? You know, what, what can I add to that? Because, um, you know, a book, what, what's that like? It's something I can download onto my iPad, I guess, but books are not front of mind all the time for us.
Yeah, that could be, which, you know, begs the question, did you ever think about an interactive uh, biography?
No, no, I, um, I shudder to think what people would do to my life if they could mess with it, so, um, I'll just, I'll just stick with my story.
Okay. Not even a choose-your-own-adventure. Let's keep it nice and simple. Uh, I love that you call it Sid Meier's Memoir; it's the perfect name. Are there any weird—I mean, you own your own name, right? Is there any level of like ownership of your name by 2K at this point?
It's, you know, it's kind of a joke and not, not a joke, but it's, it's amusing to me that I have this kind of dual life, the uh, you know, it's almost like Batman and Bruce Wayne and Batman, um, that I'm a brand, uh, I'm, you know, my name on, on a video game box or website, um, referring to things that I've done in the past, and there's another me which is in the present doing things focused on the future. So, um, it's a, you know, I have to smile when I, when I think about that other Sid Meier because he, he almost has his own life, his a separate life, um, and it's a weird, it's kind of a weird situation sometimes, but you know, I, I, I appreciate and I value um, the path that has brought us both here, and uh, it's just, it's kind of a fact of life right now for me, so yeah. There's, there's it in their city. It had to be really funny when your name kind of became a brand, and imagine your family had a real kick out of that, like, "Oh, reading Sid Meier's Thanksgiving meal. Look at this!" It has to be a common joke.
Yes, it became a little bit of a joke after a while.
Yeah, I'd imagine your parents were proud though.
Yes, they, they have been. Yes, they've been proud. They're, they are very supportive, and um, they've always encouraged me to be creative and, and try things and, and really, you know, have been supportive in that way that has kind of allowed me to, to explore, experiment, and uh, and become a game designer, I guess.
Yeah. So with your name, there's a legend that Robin Williams was connected with getting your name on the actual, you know, boxes back in the day. Can you tell that story, dispel it, walk us through how this whole thing happened for your name becoming a brand?
Uh, I can tell you a couple of stories, a couple of different stories about that. Um, the, the Robin Williams story uh, comes from Bill Staley, who is my partner at MicroProse, and he was the business guy basically, and I was the game design guy, and um, uh, as he, I, you know, I hope Bill writes his book so he can, he can tell his side of the stories, but, but that is what I've heard from Bill, that he was at a dinner with Robin Williams, and the idea, you know, directors are known by their names, uh, actors, comedians are known by their name. Why don't we know who these game designers are? Apparently, Robin Williams was into games quite a bit. Uh, in fact, one of the prototypes that I worked on, um, I was informed that he would be playing it, and we, this was SimGolf, and we, we put his, his kids' names on all the different lakes on the golf course, just for fun.
Oh, that's amazing.
Story that I remember. I never met Robin Williams, so I, I don't know uh, that, you know, that any of the details of Bill's story, but um, the story is, I remember it was uh, I had done a number of uh, kind of military vehicle games—F-15, Silent Service, F-19—and um, I wanted to do a pirates game. I thought it'd be fun to do a game about pirates and kind of do something a little different and do kind of give our take on the adventure genre, and I, you know, I said, "Bill, I wanted to, want to do this pirates game." "No pirates; no. We need more airplane games. People want more airplane games." Um, I said, "No, I really want to do a pirate game." And, "Well, we'll put your name on the pirate game, so people that like the airplane games and the submarine game will maybe say, 'Okay, the same person, so this could be a good pirate game.'" And Pirates turned out pretty well, so you know, once something works, you keep doing it over and over again. So that was, that was the first game that had my name on it was Pirates, and that's the reason I believe uh, that happened.
Do you want this to continue? Do you want your name to be a brand moving into the future in a Tom Clancy-esque way?
I, uh, I probably don't have a lot of control over that, but I, I do not object. Uh, I, you know, I'm honored um, to have my name associated with uh, with those games, so uh, no, I, I, I'm happy with that. I mean, it's uh, I wouldn't be too totally sad if it didn't happen, but um, again, it's kind of a parallel person that, you know, we hang out every once in a while.
[Laughter] Just bizarre. Uh, do other developers within Firaxis ever bring up the idea of putting their own name on one of these games? Like, was Enemy Unknown ever pitched as Jake Solomon's X-Com at some point?
Not to me. I, you know, I wouldn't, I wouldn't uh, object to that, um, but for, you know, it's a, it's a good question. I don't know why that hasn't uh, come up more frequently, um, even at other companies. I mean, it is fairly um, unusual, quite, quite unusual, I think. I mean, one, one thing that, that strikes me though is one of our philosophies is that the player is the star, that, that um, it's kind of one of our, our fundamental rules is the player is the star of the game, and uh, often when a game's not working, we'll ask, well, you know, "Who's having the fun here? Is the designer having the fun, or is the player having the fun, or the computer having the fun?" You know, if it's not the player that's having the fun at this moment, then something is wrong. So, um, putting, putting my name on the box actually kind of contradicts that philosophy of ours, where it's really about the player and their story and their path through the game. So, you know, perhaps um, we're, we're sticking more rigorously to our philosophy now than than we did back in the, in the day of Pirates.
Yeah, it checks out. I love that idea of the developers being swept away and they're having the fun here instead of the player. You think that happens a lot in the industry? Do you have to beat that over younger developers' heads of like, "Just focus on the player; don't try and be sneaky and have a little developer fun with the design here."
It's, it's, it's very tempting, you know, to uh, if you're, you know, kind of impress the player with your deep knowledge about the topic, you know, whatever it happens to be, and you know, you play the player, say, "Wow, that designer really knows all about this." Unfortunately, I don't, and I'm not having any fun. Um, so I think that, yeah, I think that that the temptation to overdesign or, you know, is something we, we always want to kind of be uh, cautious about. Uh, not to say that that, you know, we want great designs, but it's about uh, the player having the fun, and the designer providing the world and the, and the mechanics to allow that to happen.
Yeah. So when tackling the memoir, looking back at your life, uh, did any unexpected themes emerge when you're looking at this thing as a whole? Did you stop and think like, "Oh, there's these connections I never realized before. It turns out I keep recurring to this theme." Anything stand out in a big way?
I think two things that are that are kind of related: one was how much things have changed over those years, and the other is kind of like how little things have changed. And um, to think about making games in over the course of three or four months to make games, you know, in the, in the, in the amount of memory and colors and all that, all that stuff that we didn't have back in those days, uh, it makes you really appreciate how, how much things have changed. Um, but on the other hand, these rules of game design, for example, that we talk about—making the player uh, the star, doubling it or cutting it in half, easy to start playing, hard to stop playing—those are still very valid today uh, as when we first kind of stumbled upon them. So, um, you know, the fact that Civilization is still a viable uh, franchise these days and people are still playing Civilization, um, it's kind of a, you know, an indication of how, how much um, you know, how much continuity there is. So there's, there's those two threads really that are that are brought out is like how, how far we've come, you know, in some ways, but in, in other ways, how the core of what we do still is valid, still works: the interactivity, the, the engagement, the storytelling of the player, you know, allowing them to own uh, the story, replayability—all those things that we, you know, we really worked to put into our early games are still very important today.
Because you think you tap into some larger, just basic game design themes that could go back hundreds, even thousands of years of when they're designing Go. It's like, "Hey, let's try doubling it or having it and see how it works."
Probably, probably true. Probably in the shower too. That was clean.
Yeah, absolutely. Uh, yeah, what was it like going and writing this memoir to kind of sort through your own history? What was that process like for you?
Well, I worked with Jennifer Noonan, who's an uh, an author, and we had some very, very long conversations, and she would kind of put all that into a readable, interesting form, and, and she actually did a lot of research, you know, about things that were also happening at the same time or, um, you know, kind of some background things that I may not even been aware of at the time. And uh, so it was a collaborative process, and uh, you know, the two of us together kind of made it happen, just over, over the course of over a year of talking and trying to make, you know, trying to bring back memories and, and uh, talking about the good old days.
Yeah. Are you a nostalgic guy?
Not, not primarily. I'm, I'm, you know, more interested in, "What new thing am I gonna do today?" Um, but it's, you know, it's, it's certainly gratifying to look back on, on, on the work that we've done, especially talking to players. You know, that's the time when, when it, it, it's easy to get nostalgic, talking about somebody who played Sid Meier's Civilization I and has these memories, or Pirates, or whatever. You know, I mean, that's kind of when I realized that the games that we had such fun making also were fun for people to play and, and created, you know, some very positive memories for them, but they're now passing along to their kids. So, you know, it's a, it's, it's doubly gratifying to see that happen.
Yeah. Uh, so I visited Firaxis and uh, ran the video equipment for interviewing you back when I was at Game Informer during the XCOM: Enemy Unknown cover story. Um, and what struck me visiting that studio is how unbelievably friendly it is. I think it's the friendliest studio I've ever visited. I wonder if you can share some lessons you've learned along the way about just maintaining a healthy, friendly workplace environment like at Firaxis.
Well, I think the bottom line is if, if we're not having fun, that it's hard to, to make fun. I mean, our goal is to provide a fun experience to the players, so if, if we're not enjoying the process, if we're not having fun doing this, it's going to be hard to, to fake it. So we do try to create an environment where um, we're enjoying our work, where people are allowed to be creative. Um, I think when people come to Firaxis to, to program or to, to test or to do sound or art, they kind of know uh, what our company is about, you know, in terms of the types of games that we make, and um, so they're, I think that they're pre-inclined to enjoy that environment, enjoy those types of games, and enjoy the work that uh, that we're doing. So I think that that's part of it. We're also um, located outside of Baltimore. Um, it's not the kind of Silicon Valley, "Look over your shoulder and see what everybody else is doing" kind of environment, maybe. I, I'm just presuming, um, but we are uh, focused on what we do, and we're not uh, too concerned about what else is going on at the company next door. So uh, I think those are some of the things that, that allow us to uh, to be, to be friendly and happy and enjoy what we do.
Yeah, just have you maybe some more senior staff that are ready to, you know, have a nice place of their family and not worried about jumping from job to job, job in the, in the Silicon Valley area.
Yeah, I think, and Civilization and XCOM have become um, these franchises that we can count on, and you know, we have a community of players, we have our fans, we, we think we kind of understand why the games work and, and what we can do to, to add to them or uh, you know, keep them going, but um, we're not um, in, in a situation where we feel that um, you know, there's, there's, there's danger, we have to worry about what tomorrow might bring. Uh, there's a certain stability in having uh, these games that there's an established um, player base for.
Yeah. Um, can you talk about studio culture a little bit more? Uh, you know, were there lessons that you learned early on about how to maintain a healthy workspace? I'm sure at times it's, you know, been somewhere on a spectrum of, "Okay, this is a good vibe," versus, "Uh, this vibe's a little bit shaky." You know, mistakes you made early on, anything like that you can impart to other studios out there?
Well, I think we, from the, from the earliest days, felt that uh, happy people make happy games. I guess I'm kind of saying the same thing. Yeah, um, that it was, it's not an industry where you're working with like a three percent profit margin where, you know, every dollar you spend has to be totally justified. You know, if we want to have a blowout Christmas party, let's have a blowout Christmas party. You know, if we, if we can pay some bonuses, we'll pay some bonuses. So it's, it's the philosophy that um, making, being profit, you know, profits are not the primary; profits are good, but they're not the primary uh, you know, day-to-day determination of whether this has been a good day or a bad day. It's, it's, you know, "Have we made a better game? Is our game better today than it was yesterday?" And the rest kind of works out. Uh, you know, that's always been our feeling is if we make um, the best games we can, a lot of the other stuff will kind of work itself out, and so far that has tended to be true.
Yeah. Uh, I'm curious what you've learned about your own limits, finding your own happy spot within the studio. I think you're an amazing lesson in knowing what you're great at and focusing on that and staying consistent throughout all these years. It seems like a lot of other people in other studios can get carried away with what's called the Peter Principle, where they're hired beyond their area of expertise. Um, is that just natural to you? Did you have to learn this over time to find what level you like to be happy at?
I, I'm not sure if it was deliberate or, you know, certainly in hindsight, I recognized that I, that I did a few things uh, intelligently. Um, I've always worked with partners that complemented what I did. You know, we didn't intrude on each other's territory, but between the two of us, the three of us, we kind of covered all the bases that needed to be covered, you know, starting, starting with uh, MicroProse and working with Bill Staley and later at Firaxis. So I've, I've never felt a need to kind of get involved in those areas that I'm probably not that good at. I, you know, kind of tried to always kind of create situations where I could focus on making games, and I didn't have to worry about the other parts of the, of the industry. We've always worked with um, you know, very supportive publishing partners. Again, the same philosophy that what we do is make games. Um, there are other folks that are great at marketing and publishing and things like that, so let's stick with our strengths, you know, as a company and personally for me, to stick with my strength as a person, um, and not kind of think the grass is greener over on, you know, on the other side of the fence. Uh, I can't imagine a better job than being a game designer, so I never really had uh, the, you know, that idea that I've got to try something different or I want, I want more responsibility, I want to do what that person is doing. I'm happy, you know, doing what this person is doing.
I think it's such an amazingly healthy attitude to have, and I feel like a lot of other developers, as you know, if they're, especially if they're names on the box for Chrysler—I mean, that's huge—and they would just feel like, "I need to be in charge of marketing. I need to up this. I can tweak that trailer. I can, I can manage these tweets," and they can just spin out. So it's an amazing uh, you know, selflessness, or I guess just, you know, immunity to uh, an inflated ego. And I'm wondering where you think that comes from. What, what is it in you that has maintained that healthy level of uh, the right level of ego throughout your life here?
Well, I think that um, [Music] I really enjoy making games, and so I think my uh, my management of my time, I guess, is, is based on, on those things. So I, you know, I understand that anytime I would spend expanding my role into marketing or other areas would be time taken away from, from game design. And actually, have the experience of the very early days of being uh, not only the programmer but the artist and the sound designer and the manual writer and, you know, back in, in our early days, I did all those different things because I was basically the only person there. Uh, so I, I, and it says I've kind of been there and done that.
Yeah, found that that's not what I enjoy as much as making the game itself. So I guess I can check those boxes off and say I've done that, and now I know what I like to do, so I'm gonna keep doing that.
Yeah. Uh, I heard you mention in another interview how you've been—this is very particularly to my interest—how you've been getting into video editing recently with your church. I would love to hear you talk about your thoughts on video editing and what it's like to get into it, uh, you know, now.
Yeah. Well, it's the joy of discovering something new, I think, you know, uh, we're all, we all love technology, and uh, before this, I, I, you know, I really had no uh, idea what was involved. I mean, I could imagine, but uh, you know, editing, cutting shots, transitions, um, I'm also working with, with sound and what can be done with uh, uh, you know, taking some pretty raw sound and, and add a little reverb, at, tuning up here, you know, uh, think about the structure of a song and then to edit some video to bring that to life. It's, it's kind of uh, another aspect of creativity to me. I mean, what's been fascinating to me about computer games is the combination of the technology, which is very, you know, a C++ instruction, you know, exactly what it's going to do, we're combining that with a game that starts as a very nebulous concept and, and gradually forms into something uh, fun. The same idea with it, with a video: you have some kind of general ideas of how you want it to look, and then you kind of get down into the weeds and figure out what shot you want to use and how you want to, what happens on this part of the screen, what sort of transition you want, kind of um, again, I think the uh, the idea that uh, resonates with me there and I think also ties with video games is like, I feel every day I've gotten a little better at it, like, "Okay, I learned a new trick today. I got more efficient." Uh, I think in, in games uh, it's the same thing, but you um, I've learned something new; I've gotten better at this game; I'm, you know, you see that progress, uh, and that's what keeps you wanting to do, you know, that one more, one more turn, one more video, one more song, whatever it is.
Yeah, I like the idea of you editing videos and kind of finding the game aspects of it, like, "Okay, it's more powerful; I use this music here and then cut here. I can really gamify this entire editing software."
Yeah, I guess that, that's, that's a good way of looking at it. I don't know; it's not really, but thank you for humoring me. But I'm curious, um, your faith, um, I don't know how comfortable you are talking about how big of an impact on your life has your faith had. Do you mention that a lot in the book?
Um, a little bit. You know, I think it, it, it um, you know, maybe part of the reason that I can be calm and focused and not need to, to have a bigger job or whatever, have my name bigger on the, but I think in the same way that our philosophy of game design is to let the player be the star, it's, it's um, it's not something that we, that we play up in, you know, that I play up in in design, for example. I think that, you know, it's the, we're not, we're not trying to uh, you know, promote a particular uh, political philosophy or a particular religious philosophy. You know, the games are about having fun, but um, you know, we talk a little bit in the book about how nobody ever dies in, you know, in, in all of our early games
Brand new game in Minecraft. You know when it came out? I just spent a lot of a lot of time just loving that game. Yeah. Um, but more recently, I've been playing uh, Overland. It's a little, yeah, uh, kind of fun little uh—I'm not sure what that genre would be—but it's uh, turn-based roguelite, I think. Yeah. And I've always liked racing games. Um, I uh, Gran Turismo has kind of always been one of my favorite, going back to two or three; I forget which which one it was, but I got hooked. Um, and uh, there's a little game called The Fl—Flame and the Fire, I think it was, or Slamming the Flood—little adventure game, survival. Okay. Again, I just uh, Flame in the Fire, I'm not sure exactly, but um, I have I have the uh, Xbox Live subscription, so you can, you know, perfectly sample all these games and try them out and see uh, see if they're fun. And a couple of them have really uh, really stuck with me.
Have you checked out the new Microsoft Flight Simulator? It seems up your alley.
I have read about that, and um, yeah, it sounds incredible. Uh, I mean, there's there's a story. I remember playing Microsoft Flight Simulator on the IBM PC before I even started making really making games, and and I guess it was one of the games that really opened my eyes to what the potential was. I was like, wow, you can do this on a computer. Maybe you could simulate the entire history of civilization on a computer someday. Might be worth a try. Yeah. And then eventually model the entire Earth. And the new Microsoft Flight Sim—it's a perfect circle.
Yeah. Yeah, that's an amazing amazing product.
Well, hey, anything else you'd like to say about the memoir or give a tip for where people can find it?
Well, um, I'd just like to thank our our players, our community, all the all the folks that have made um, Civilization uh, what it is, have supported Firaxis over the years and in play of all of our games. Uh, we wouldn't, you know, we wouldn't be here without the players. We wouldn't be able to do this work, which is uh, you know, I think the best job in the world. So thanks to all of um, all of you. And uh, if you are interested in some of the stories behind the games, uh, you might find the book interesting.
See, it's just humility again. You gotta you gotta hype the book, Sid. Here we go. This is hey, Sid, uh, thank you so much for all your hard work throughout the years, and uh, thanks for writing this book. We really appreciate it.
You're welcome. It's been a pleasure.
Absolutely.
Cool. Thanks so much for watching or listening to this interview. We appreciate your time as well. Take care, everybody. Bye.
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