2026: THE WORLD IS FALLING APART — A MIRACLE IS COMING! | David Hoffmeister (ACIM)

There's a darkness to this world. I felt there had to be a deeper meaning. This book is not from a human being. This is a scripture that's coming directly from divinity. Just opening the book, I felt like a tsunami of love. And I felt like whatever my trajectory was in this world was changed in an instant.

I did start to use the book initially as an oracle. I've had three revelatory experiences where the whole world disappeared and I pierced the veil. Then everything was gone. He said, "You're just not ready for sustained revelation. If you had sustained revelation, the body would not long last. If your mind is powerful enough to forget God, it must be powerful enough to remember God."

Jesus is teaching a completely different view of forgiveness. This is just so deep because he's saying you don't forgive someone for what they did to you. You don't forgive someone for what they didn't do that you think they should have done. You forgive your brother for >> Wow. >> When that lands, oh my god, >> for those that haven't come across um a course in miracles, what do you say to them that a course is?

>> Well, I think it's like a modern-day scripture. But a lot of times people know that the Bible and the whole Judeo-Christian uh you know genre is has been around for for thousands of years and I know uh you've had Aaron Abkkey on and and had some great uh talks about that but I think it's a modern day scripture that I'd say it's like 1% principle but you have to really study to get that principle down really good and then it's 99% practice. But I would say it's a it's a spiritual psychotherapy for uh waking up for enlightenment, self-realization.

It's interesting because it uses a lot of um biblical references, but it it in some ways it couldn't be um it's almost like got a polarity to biblical um. I mean, maybe we should start with the fact that God didn't create this world. Can you unpack that for us? Like that has some serious implications straight out of the gate.

Yeah, that was one of the things I always pondered about like because if you look at the history of philosophy, they they wrestle with you know, good and evil and if there is a God, how did we end up with this world and so forth? But yeah, the course is just saying that God is eternal, eternal life, eternal oneness and uh and who we are is eternal oneness. But but this world is uh is a tiny mad idea that we forgot to laugh at and we took it seriously and then it you know gave us a a a world of time and space a big bang and uh so it's time and space is temporary. We know that for sure. And what is eternal? We don't have anything in this world that's eternal. But we're told that eternal life is actually reality and that this world of time and space is a is a projection of error.

Yeah, >> it's interesting that projection of error because I am still trying to reconcile and find within my head and heart whether a Course in Miracles is life affirming or not because it's a and pardon me for you know coming that way but I mean when it seems very deeply present in the course that well I should probably ask you and let you speak about perception and illusion before I go further with my question but it does seem like it implies that the world It's quite illusory.

>> Yeah, there's a lot of uh ancient Chinese, lots of the Indian ancient Indian philosophies that talk about maya and illusion. And so yeah, this is a very non-dualistic course pointing at oneness that's that transcends opposites. So I think one way we could talk about it being illusory is it's it's a projection of opposites. It's a projection of a split mind that plays itself out in terms of images and time and space and it has opposites and reality we're told is absolute oneness uh without end. And so these opposites put a veil of illusion over or a maya over the top of uh of reality. So it's it's different than a lot of new age teachings that talk about different realities and you create like new age you create your own reality. A course in miracles is definitely not that because it's saying God is the creator of reality and we can only accept reality as God created it. We cannot make it, change it, invent it, twist it, do anything uh to it because because it's eternal or what Byron Katy sometimes calls what is and what is is is eternal.

>> So, but on one hand, you've said God created this reality, but on the other hand, one of the teachings is God God did not create this world.

>> Yeah. Well, God creates reality in a sense that spirit creates spirit creates spirit. So God is pure spirit. Christ, people associate the word Christ or Christos with Jesus. But but the man was an illusion because everything of time and space is an illusion. But he was pointing to an I am presence before Abraham was I am. He was pointing to the Christ, which is the same identity that you and I and everyone shares. But it's a divine I amness. It's a spiritual I amness. So yeah, the course is definitely not saying God uh creates anything that's temporary. God only creates the eternal. And uh that everything that's temporary is just a projection of of a belief called ego. It's it's just a projection of error.

The Bible has this concept of a fall. And I think course and miracle has a a parallel concept um but with very different underpinning meanings. Can you describe what the fall really is then from a course of miracles um point of view?

>> Yeah. Jesus has one sentence. He says into eternity where all is one. There crept a tiny mad idea at which the son of God remembered not to laugh. And in one sense, he kind of reinterprets uh Genesis for us very quickly.

>> I mean, can you unpack that a little bit further for us? Cuz there's there's humor in there, there's levity in there, but also life can be quite serious for some people that Yeah.

It's like there's a whole non-attachment piece. And there's so much in there.

>> There's a lot into it because he's basically saying that that the world will end in laughter. He does say that at one point and that's very different from our doomsday, you know, end of the world, last judgment associations with Christianity. But I think the most important thing is that he says there's a correction for the error that that correction has already been applied. It's already complete. And he does at one point say this world was over long ago. Um and he also says we are but looking back at a point in which the world ended imagining we're still making the journey and and looking back on what has already gone by. So it's like we're viewing a movie that is already like the old theaters, you know, it's already in the can. It's just it's got the old theaters had the projectors and you're just watching something that's a film that's already been uh made. It's all it's done. You're just watching it. But when we're in there as an audience in the movie theater, we go into the movie. We see ourselves as being there inside of the movie, rooting for the characters, rooting for the good ones, and uh warning about the bad ones. And you know, it's like we we make an imaginary reality that isn't reality at all. It's a it's a fiction kind of like Walt Disney, you know, he he drew a mouse. He drew a mouse and he called it Mickey. And then he drew another mouse and he called it Minnie. And then he came up with animation. He just flicked those images fast enough in a repetitive way that they look like they were actually moving. And they do look that's what animation is. when we watch Pocahontas or Lion King and Jesus is saying the same thing with the world we perceive we it seems very real but I think if you looked at there's even a majority of scientists around the world now that are saying it's the world is some kind of fiction it's some kind of a matrix the word that the scientists use they say simulation and I know you have scientists on and and you know when you get into quantum physics this is a a very sophisticated simulation and while we believe in it, we call it reality because it does seem to be the only thing going on. were, you know, if you have mystical experiences, which I've had three revelatory experiences where the whole world disappeared and it was just absolute abstract light and I was like stunned that what is this? Because it was like I pierced the veil three times and then when I I pierced the veil then everything was gone. That that was the world. It disappeared like Gary Renard's book. It disappeared for me three times. And then I just came back to to go deeper into what I need to do to have that be a consistent constant experience.

I definitely want to speak about that. Um, it's really fascinating because uh well background as an astrologer I can't help but consider there's this you know like I think it's called a quark which is where a a star has already passed away in the night sky and already imploded in on itself and it's it's actually in real time no longer there. Yeah. But the light of it is still traveling to you. So you still see it as it's ever present. You know, it's like oh yeah, there's that star there. It's like, do you know if it's alive or if it's actually, you know, cuz it takes light years >> for the light to travel towards us.

>> Really fascinating. The question still stands though, is because so sorry, this gives us permission to actually ask the question. There we go. Thank you. Um, life affirming or not because I mean in some ways it's it's saying that everything around us is illusory. Everything around us is immaterial. Everything around us is not eternal. um and don't buy in to that story. So, does that not create a create a distance between the individual and the experience that they're having? And then, you know, some tantric teachers will then be like, that's not life affirming, you know, because then to go into the whole thing is to like like do you get where I'm coming from?

>> Yeah. Yeah, I do. I think cuz I was I was raised Christian and I spent 10 years full-time in university and went into science and everything. So, I I had a real well-rounded background, but when I got to the Course in Miracles, I thought, you know, this is a total inside out look at everything because I maybe the way I had it was outside in. But, but what it's saying is the kingdom of heaven is within and that our very being, who we are, is the kingdom of heaven because it's our Christ identity. But that's pure light. So what I saw, what you're talking about is is I said, "Well, I just need to maybe admit that I was wrong about my definition of life. Maybe my definition of life was biological and maybe I was completely wrong about that because it is temporary. Uh and and there's something in us that wants even our love songs, we want forever love. We're not interested in something that's going to end. You know, we are unsatisfied with endings and beginnings. And when I read that line from Jesus before Abraham was I am, you know, I can only imagine how that stirred uh things up uh 2,000 years ago because the the Jewish tradition and the Talmet and everything,

>> the blasphemy of it,

>> it was blasphemy. That's when they were ready to stone him and chase him, push him off the cliff. But I I've come to see now that I mean there was one time I was listening to a course in miracles teach. I was doing the dishes and I had a cassette on at that time way back decades ago. And somebody in the audience said, "What does a course in miracles say about life on other planets?" And the teacher said, "The course says there's no life on this planet." And I was just doing the dishes. You know, you gotta picture me doing the dishes. And I'm going okay cuz then the more I read the course I was saying it's a it's a redefinition of life to being eternal like without be beginning or end. And we're accustomed to life as being biological with birth and death as cycles. So and all of our astrological signs and everything that we use you know is is got that assumption of of life being in form. At one point Jesus says uh love is content and not form of any kind. So you really have to go into the question of okay what is content then? If if you know we grew up about form and content if if love is content and not form of any kind then maybe these mystical experiences are pointing us towards a a vastness that is not contained in time and space or bodies. I think this is the perfect juncture to have a look at what the course tells us about perception.

Well, it says perception is is an invention that there are there is no perception in heaven and perception always involves form and perception is temporary by definition and perception is what we perceive through our five senses. So that kind of gives us a start with perception. But then suddenly when we read Jesus's words, he's teaching us that there's there's just two kinds of perception. One is fragmented perception. Separate people, places, things, objects, stars, galaxies, black holes, quazars, so forth. And then there's unified perception. That's something like maybe Muji might call it unified awareness. Uh, but unified perception is perception without judgment. So it's just almost like if you were watching leaves blowing in the wind and you didn't make any distinction about any of the leaves blowing in the wind. You just saw leaves blowing in the wind. That's unified perception. What Jesus called judge not in the Bible in the sermon on the mount. It's just perception without judgment. And then he goes on to be more specific. He says, "The body's eyes will continue to report differences, but the healed mind will put them into one category. They are not real." So he's he's giving us two different perceptions. One he's saying is the Holy Spirits, which is purely non-judgmental, just purely acceptance, holistic perception of the world. And then there's personal egoic perception which is fragmented which would teach us that you and I are different people on different count in different countries across the Pacific and having a conversation here over the internet. But that's what he calls fragmented or distorted perception.

>> I feel so honored to be able to do this podcast to be honest because there's just even just the research material for your podcast today. I mean, I picked up somewhere along the way, uh, the ego is the thing that is operating to try and keep us safe from dangers. However, ego is the danger. It's like, wait, what did you just say? like you know these these pearls that emerge are so and I definitely want to speak to you about the light that appeared to you three times but also one of the key questions that I think arrives at this juncture for the listener tuning in is hey like you're basically turning my awareness of my senses and you know how to trust reality you're basically inverting it completely ones are turning into zeros and zeros are turning into ones right if it's if it is binary right which it's it's non-dual Whoops, already erring. But anyway, you what? There's so many questions here and maybe you can take your pick, but one of them is like why would we be given this perception that is inverted from our true nature if that is our true nature and what role in service does that play? But I think that can probably quickly end up philosophical. I mean, what was going on for you potentially, David, when cuz you said my I I had a moment where it was all inside out. What was going on for you personally that you felt the need to sort of invert your entire experience or potentially even open to the inversion?

>> Yeah, >> I think I I just grew overwhelmed and and weary and uh just felt like there has to be more. And if there is, what what is my part in that finding more or extending more or getting in touch with what that more is? And so I was in university for 10 years full-time and ended up, you know, leaving a a a graduate program on a full scholarship and and kind of jumping off and going off to a hermitage like Henry David Thorough or one of the transcendentalists often by a lake by myself in a little trailer going, "Okay, what's give it to me straight." You know, like Henry David Thorough, just tell it to me straight. I'll publish it to the whole world. If it's dark, give it to me straight. If it's bright, give it to me straight. And then uh A Course of Miracles came to me at a a humanistic psychology conference in La Hoya, California, and I opened a book and I felt like a tsunami of love.

>> How old Sorry. How old were you?

>> Um, this was by I was about 28 years old.

>> Cool. Thank you so much.

>> And now 68. So 40 40 years ago. Four decades ago. Just opening the book. I felt like a tsunami of love and I felt like this whatever my trajectory was in this world, whatever I had intended to do with my life and whatever was changed in an instant in the twinkling of an eye and I just I didn't know what that meant even but I thought wow what is this and then I did start to use the book initially as an oracle just praying and having questions and popping open the book I thought randomly but being answered as if there was like an oracle talking to me and answering my every question. And then eventually that led into uh these mystical revelatory experiences where I I was kind of shown the light beyond this world that the veil of this world was covering. And I also was told that revelatory experiences were were very very rare. uh and that that the the scribe of a course of miracles had had one revelatory experience and that it was mind-blowing because she was a research psychologist at Columbia Presbyterian uh medical center and so it was a a a mind-blowing thing and that's how I felt it was but also it showed me like it showed me experientially the aha uh that that was even beyond the big picture of this world. It was just a it was like a touchstone with reality. Uh, but a real quick glimpse, you know. It just it just I couldn't I lost track of time completely in that experience.

>> Why didn't you just write the whole experience off if it happened so briefly?

>> Well, it happened a second time and then it happened a third time and believe me, the ego was wanting to write all three of them off like get serious. And it's I did go to a lot of NDE near-death experience uh conferences and the people were saying the same thing when they had this experience of the light. They couldn't tell their family, their friends. They were closet NDE experiencers, you know, and then they sometimes go to a conference and come out of the closet. So I I did a lot of traveling and teaching and occasionally I would just very rarely share the experience and somebody would wait and when the crowd left come up and go, "Oh my god, you're the only person I've ever heard talk about." And I had one too. And so, you know, it was kind of an interesting phenomenon.

>> David, could you speak to us of devotion and what that means to you personally? Um, I mean, you retired at 34, gave your mind, body, career, everything over to Jesus. Jesus at some point says you won't have a career. It's like, sorry, I shouldn't laugh. Sorry, that's really, but I mean, it's it's like it's a lot for the little mind to comprehend. Pardon me. I can't help myself. Luckily, you said that quote earlier from Jesus. Touch it so we can excuse my bedside manner. Might have to actually put that on the actual channel description. Anyway, I'm digressing. Your your relationship with devotion, I mean, what does devotion mean to you?

>> Well, I always thought of devotion is is to something greater or more. And I saw that as God. Although,

>> but why was it important? Sorry to interrupt. It wasn't important.

>> It just felt like I equated I was searching for meaning, you know, like a lot of people have read Victor Frankle's man's search for meaning, you know, and all the concentration camp experiences,

>> beautiful, deep, small, short,

>> point,

>> philosophical. I was searching for meaning. And then when I started to have these experiences, they were so profound that I just thought, "Oh my gosh, I think I'm on the cusp or getting a little glimpse of of meaning." Because I think with this world, the fragmented world, people fall into meaninglessness. You know, that's why there's so such a high suicide rate. That's why uh depression is rampant. or even in Japan, you know, groups of teenagers going out in a a van to commit group suicides and things, you know, it's there's a darkness to this world and I felt there had to be a deeper meaning and I kept being told by all the great spiritual masters that that meaning was inside. And I said, "What does inside mean?" Uh, it can't be inside a body. It it must be maybe inside my mind or my soul or something. And how do I access that? How do I get in? And I was told prayer and meditation. And that can even get very repetitive. You know, we can have repetitive prayers. But he was talking about something deeper like the prayer is the the altar of our mind or the desire of our mind. And then I read one line from Jesus where he said truth will be returned to your awareness by your desire as it was lost by your desire for something else. So when I read that, I just went, "Oh, wow." Whatever that desire is, that if that's in my mind, and that's got to be very powerful, that it means it's in some sense, I must have wished for this world almost like a a fairy tale. I must have wished for something more than everything. And and then this world is the answer to that wish. But Jesus is saying fear not. It has been already corrected. But you have to accept the correction and your sole responsibility is not the error. Don't get caught up in analyzing the error or trying to figure it out because you'll be stuck in that error. It's a tricky error. But you're you're not responsible for the error, but you are responsible for accepting the correction. So I I devoted my life to what Jesus calls atonement. He says that's our sole responsibility except the atonement. Not atonement in the the biblical way where we're atoning for sins of the past but just in terms of correction purely correction.

>> Can you can you unpack that further because a lot of people tuning in will still be thinking of sin as you say that.

>> Yes. Yeah. I think when I look at the word sin, I go back to the Aramaic word, what what did Jesus mean? And it was missing the mark. Now, sin took on a connotation is like a black mark on your soul. You're born a sinner and everyone's a sinner and you have to say the sinner's prayer, you know, like karmic karmic tendencies. Yeah. Really deep place to take something. But but what Jesus is teaching us is that the atonement that that the error has been corrected. That sin is an error to be corrected. And he's teaching us that it actually already has been corrected. And that that's why if you follow this path of atonement, you have a life of joy, of happiness, peace, harmony, full communication, no secrets, you know, no deceptions, no distortions. And to me, it's like, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm I'm willing to devote to that. And then when I actually did devote to it, I was just as surprised as anyone because I I thought, well, there goes what's if you let give up your career, you know, what what are you going to fall back on? Uh, you know, what what good is your your diplomas if uh if you don't have a career and a job? You know, what good is that? And Jesus was speaking to me at that point. I could start to hear his voice very directly. And he was saying, "I'll take care of everything that that does not matter if you'll just focus on what matters." And I said, "What does that mean?" He said, "I'll take care of time and space." Time and space. All your physical needs, your emotional needs, your mental needs. I'll take care of everything. You need something to eat, a place to sleep. I'll handle all the things that don't matter if you'll just give your devotion to following my instructions and and give me your full devotion. That was the that's what I was offered and I actually said yes to it. I I mean I was in my 20s but I was like

>> I love how surprised you are by the fact love yourself too.

>> I was like I was surprised I said yes because because I I did have a few discussions with him. I said, "You know, you can't go out in the tree in the backyard and just pick $20 bills, you know." I was trying to explain to him how it is on earth. And he was just saying, "Yeah, I'd been there." He was very lighthearted. Yeah, I've been there. I know that. And but he was telling me that he would arrange time and space if I would open myself to be devoted to miracles. And I said, "Okay." Then the actual thing was when I went out on the road for Five week, five and a half weeks, six weeks at a time it was happening and every single day it was happening. I didn't even know where I was going to sleep from day to day or where the food would come from and I where the gasoline would go for the petrol for the car, you know, I had no idea with any of that. So, it turned very quickly very mystical to me but also very practical because I'm, you know, I gotta I want I believe I have to eat. I believe I have to sleep. I I'm not going to be sleeping out under the stars every night, you know. I just that's too much. Uh, you're going to have to show me. So I said, "You show me." And he did. The first trip, the second trip, the third trip. And then he started to do it with worldwide trips. You know, here you're going to Argentina. How am I going to Argentina? A friend comes up. I never met the guy named David. and he says, "I I won a a Latin America uh airline." It was like a a promotional thing for for one the grand prize was 1 million frequent flyer miles and the guy said he won and then the guy invited me to come with him and bring two guests and go to Argentina. And I'm like, "You're kidding." And he's like I said, "Don't you need one of those thingamajiggies?" And he said, "It's a passport, David. It's it's called a passport." Cuz I I really had no wishboard or whim to go traveling around the world. But then off I go with donated frequent fly miles and it just went on for years and years and years. So it's an experiential thing for me. It's one thing to theorize about these things, but it's another thing to just say yes

and say, "Okay, you say you're going to take care of things, then you're gonna have to show me because I'm not just going to take it on blind faith." Uh, you're going to have to demonstrate to me that this this will actually work for me in place of a career and all the other stuff I learned.

Hey there, inspired souls. I wanted to take a moment and thank all of you that are subscribed to this podcast. Everything you see around here, like I like to say, touchwood, is powered and empowered by your subscription to this podcast. It costs you nothing. It's completely free. There's a button down below. It lights up in the colors of the inspired evolution when I says the word subscribe, subscribe. And if you can hit that button, hit that bell notification icon. It's completely free. Gives you the opportunity to support the channel so guests like this can come on and share their insights, share their wisdom. Every week we do two episodes a week. And once a month we actually gather with the guests um inside the inspired evolution community circle here. If you start to fall in love with the content just know that's the space for connection around the content. It's the inspired evolution community circle. We affectionately call it the circle. Um, the center is empty. It's not about amate. I'm just one of us. And once a month we get together and we run kind of like a podcast where you guys ask the questions of the guests when they come on. We also gather once a week. I guide meditations. There's community sharing circles. if there's astrological updates, um, there's breath work, there's a bit of yoga, there's all sorts of cool stuff happening inside there and lots of people meeting people in person as well. We've done our best to make several live interactive connection oriented so it's less there is text-based connection absolutely but it's this opportunity to really connect um especially as we move into this Aquarian age. Yeah, we're going to need Aquarius rules community. We're going to need more community. Um, it's about the eye and the wei. Pisces had the fish schools of sort. This is all shifting under our feet right now. So, as we're looking for tribe and connection, inspired evolution community circle. Come on in, give it a whirl. Yeah. And just see if it's for you. And it really supports the channel as well. So, thank you so much for all of you that are part of the community and supporting the channel and this work doing the things that it's doing in the world. Really, really, really sincerely appreciate you all. And uh, we'd love to welcome those of you that are inspired to evolve on the inside. And I'm mentioning that as well because today's episode goes super deep. Yeah. And it's conversations like this that we're having inside the circle amongst a community of peers. So if that sounds inspiring to you, do check us out inspiredevolution.com/circle.

It's interesting that 1% and that 99% that you referred to earlier. Um, the 99% being it's actually a practice, you know, is 1%. And then I mean even for so many people like picking up the picking up the book, this 1% can seem so dense. I mean uh even myself like I've tried motoring my way whole through the book. It doesn't happen. It just does not happen. There is no motoring through this book. Um, it's like colons on colons on colons on col you just Yeah. I had a friend when I went to Australia. I went there seven consecutive years to Australia. And during one of the events, she just turned to me with the biggest smile on her face and she said, "You knew this book before you came."

She said with the biggest smile on her face, like somehow you were just super ready like like a soul incarnating with like really high readiness cuz she said, "You just read this stuff and you it sticks in your mind. Most people can't remember the paragraph that they just read and you are talking about the content of the paragraph like it's the back of your hand. And she's like, you must have you must have already know this this before. And then I think as soon as I really was really grasping it and feeling it and having these huge heart openings and experiences, then I just was like, "Okay, what's best here on planet Earth?" And Jesus is like, "Well, the people are into movies. They like movies. They like music. We have to go for things that they enjoy. We have to unpack it in ways in parables and music and types of things that they will absolutely be attracted to because you know ancient scriptures you know people will spend their whole life trying to decipher you know yoga spent time and different ones you know with these ancient scriptures but he said I want you to to use it in new ways where people can go aha and and and then I started doing movie gatherings And and people I reported to me that they went into their first mystical experience in their entire lifetime, not through LSD or psychedelics, but through the movie gathering I was doing. They they were just their mind just went right in with me. Like The Matrix or, you know, there's so many great ones. Truman Show. They would just go, "Oh, I love that movie. Can I watch it with you?" And I said, "Sure." And then I kind of set it up. There was an elderly couple. I said it. They said, "What's this movie in the Matrix everyone's talking about?" I said, "Have you seen it?" They were both in their 70s. They No, we haven't. Can we watch it with you? So, I went in, I set up the Matrix, using a lot of things they could understand. And these 70 year old people with white hair, they were like, eyes were wide open afterwards. They were like, "Oh my god, I would have never seen all that stuff if you hadn't been here." So, I'm like the guide that's taking them almost like an angel. And that's what I do pretty much most every Saturday with like now with a worldwide audience and we all go diving down together and it's delicious. You know, people really can't wait. they they get their chairs ready and they're in different countries and we have different language translations now because Zoom has improved so much. So we have Japanese watching and Germans watching and

>> so it's it's just Jesus using what people can relate to because admittedly many people pick up the course and it's just it just seems too thick like I can't I'm not I don't know what I can't read this book. seems like such a miracle in and of itself that it seems so transparent to someone like yourself. But on that note, you also did spend

>> eight hours a day for two years straight reading the book too. There is just just so we don't make it sound there's like a light just switched on.

>> There was also again devotion. I asked the question there's an awareness to it. It's um, it's interesting because we are living through quite an interesting time um at this particular moment in time it was seen I mean but um I mean some part of me wonders if you would just say time is an illusion I don't know but um you've also been teaching deeply on the importance of presence maybe I'm conflating these two things all at once but some part of me feels intuitively the case to be so is it an interesting time that we're in right now and why is presence. What is presence? Why is it so important to connect to presence at a time like this?

>> I think of of presence is like it's what unifies our our mind that unifies our awareness. So we try to make sense of a past, present, future world. And it was one thing to be told that that God just creates eternally and and God only creates the eternal. But then Jesus unpacks it and he says the ego invented linear time and the ego invented past, present, future and it tries to force continuity onto them. And I was like force continuity. So So it's trying to convince us that linear time is real and that the present moment is this tiny little blip that's covered over very quickly. and and Jesus is saying, "Yeah, that's that version of of time is is a trick." But now we have to come to practicalities. And so that opens for me up to the topic of guidance because when people say, "Well, how's it been for you?" Okay, it's one thing to have revelatory experiences when you were maybe in your late 20s or early 30s, but what about what about the practicalities of day-to-day living in this world? And I would say, well, as soon as I started to tune in to the spirit, the Holy Spirit to Jesus, then the guidance started to come like downloads and it was where to go, what to do, who to see. um start a nonprofit. Uh, you know, these are logistical things that that have now uh been helpful symbols like nonprofit is is a helpful symbol u because I wasn't planning on having a career. So with Jesus leading me this way. So it it turned into real practicality in motion that inner guidance that intuitive guidance. So, I've been teaching people that it's actually possible to be 100% intuitive and 0% analytical because only the ego analyzes. The Holy Spirit accepts.

>> Yeah, I'm imagining that's quite difficult for the audience member that's tuning in to sink into.

>> Yeah, it was hard for me. I was in university for 10 years and I was in engineering and urban planning. You can only imagine when I started reading the course.

>> Oh, I can. I was an engineer for 15 years.

>> What? Trust you for what? You know,

>> let go of what? You know, it it just was like it just seemed like huge leaps of faith. But the funny thing is when I did leap then I was like, "Oh, you were right." You know, I I couldn't have

>> even taken it in before. But then some of these leaps of faith through the experience and the practical application that's how I was shown.

>> That is that is interesting because the question started with presence and then you landed us in guidance. Um, and it seems like yeah, there's maybe a helping hand that's helping you land within it's almost like guidance is holding space for presence in some way. um is presence one of the many practices from you know the 99% that you were referring to or is it the central practice um in your opinion?

>> I think it's the central practice that's that's really what I'm devoted to and I I look at someone like Eckhart Tolle and you know that he's been quite consistent over his his decades at

>> he's been present to presence. Is that what you just said? Yeah, he's very dedicated to that. Every every talk is the same thing.

>> And I like that because whereas he he had that park bench experience uh in London, um I had my revelatory experiences, he was not able to function for a long time, months after that that experience because it was so far beyond anything he'd ever experienced. And for me the the revelations were were that but then I I did come back and say okay now what I know now where do I go from here and that's where the guidance really came in big time.

>> Do you think there are people that are experiencing revelations potentially to this podcast um and you know are probably trying to pick up the pieces on the other side. What do you offer into that space? Like how did you navigate when you had a breakthrough experience?

Yeah, I think I think it it's comes from such a deep part within us that we we we must be ready and we must allow it because it's it's very uncommon. It's very rare. And yet what Jesus was teaching me, he didn't call his book a course in revelation. He called it a course in miracles because he said you're just not ready for sustained revelation. If you had sustained revelation, the body would not long last. you wouldn't need it. You would you would be casting it aside quickly because it just there's no need for it. But you need miracles to prepare your mind and and make yourself ready. And he said under the Christ's guidance, it can take you into a state of revelation readiness. And that's that's what all of us want. We want to know thyself like the ancient Greeks said. We want self-realization that yoga talked about. We want self-actualization that Abraham Maslow talked about. We read the books. We we read those terms and we went, "Woo, that sounds delicious." And Maslow said, "Well, there's a whole hierarchy of needs you have to work your way through first before you get up to self-actualization." And Yogananda would say the same thing. And Jesus is saying the same thing. So, he's he's very practical. He just meets us where we believe we are and then says just connect connect in with me and and go up up the ladder the imaginary ladder.

>> It's interesting because when we start talking about like hierarchies and pyramids and and journeys it seems like there are levels. Um, and then it's interesting to consider the word levels when the teaching is oneness. Isn't that a bit trippy?

>> It is. I I read the course for years and years, decades. And then Jesus said, I want you to make a website and I want you to call it levelsofmind.com. And so I okay. So I put all my diagrams, all my exercises, everything that he had taught me in one website. And what it was was he was saying, "Think of your mind as like concentric circles." And I said, "Oh, I love diagrams. I always like school the girl diagram. So I I drew concentric circles and he said at the outer ring is your perceptual you asked me about perception. That's your perceptual realm. So everything that you perceive through the five senses is really your mind perceiving the outer ring. He said but what's I said what's underneath the outer ring? He said, "Glad you asked because the inner rings cause the outer rings and you need to get into the inner rings to change the outer ring. You mean I can change my perception of the world if I can get into the rings underneath?" Okay, I'm excited. What's What's the ring right under perception? He said, "That's your emotions." and and a friend of mine, she you know got me an article on the the ones who invented Vipassana. I think they were in Thailand. They would meet every year the the founders of Vipassana

>> going

>> would meet and they would say how are you doing? They said I went really deep in my meditations but I hit a ring of fear. All of them hit the same ring of fear. And Jesus is like, "That ring of fear is is right underneath your five senses, your perceptual realm. If you go into your mind, you're going to first hit the ring of fear." I said, "Well, what what causes fear?" He said, "Your cognition, your thoughts. That's the next ring. Perceptions, emotions, cognition, your thoughts." Oh my gosh. So, my thoughts are producing the fear. Yes. My thoughts are producing the fear and the perceptions I see with my five senses. He exactly what's under cognition. What causes the thoughts? He said your beliefs. He said you can believe things about your thoughts that aren't true, but they generate your thoughts. So you mean if I have underlying beliefs that I'm not even aware of, they're generating my all my grievances, my opinions, my attack thoughts and producing my emotions and producing the world. He said, "Exactly." I said, "Okay, this is getting deep now. What is under is there something under beliefs?" He said, "Yeah, that's the core. You come to the core. You come to the altar. Your desire, your desire is at the core and your beliefs arise out of your desire. You have to desire forgiveness as he's teaching it to change all the cognition, the emotions and the perception to reflect love. You have to you have to desire the truth, you know, desire the truth and know the truth and the truth shall set you free. you know, knock and the door shall be opened. You know, all the oh my gosh, all the stuff he was teaching in the Bible, but he was giving it to me in modernday psychological terms because if everything's one, why do I need to know about the levels? And he said, everything is one in heaven, but you you desired something more than heaven, and now you believe in separation. Only a person could desire more than heaven.

>> That's right.

>> Sorry.

>> We We always go, "How how do I have to be such an idiot to want more than everything?" You know, but we know how it is with humans, too. You know, you you get all the buzz and the w all the things of time and space and you want more. You know, you want

>> It's neurotic. I'm just going to call it out.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's it. But then I started to understand the levels when he was talking about level of the mind and basically he said even with those five rings he said I can simplify it. You need to get in touch with your mind because your mind is where the causation is. But when you're asleep and dreaming you put causation out onto form. In

Physics for every action, there's a reaction. You know, we have causation in terms of form. Look at our relationships. You know, we have to conform to our beliefs about cause and effect, or you know what? You forgot our anniversary. Don't you love me anymore? You see, we're so caught up into cause and effects in form that we don't realize that it's the mind. We're not in touch with the power of the mind.

>> How does one authentically, authentically shift beliefs then? Is it to come down into that layer of desire? Like, how do you authentically? Because I mean, some part of when people go, "Oh, I'll choose to believe." You know, make a choice, and it's almost like you're faking it till you make it to some degree. But how do you authentically shift a belief?

>> Yeah. I think it's, it's through a life of deep devotion. Like, you, you desire the transcendent, you desire the infinite, the spirit, call it God, call it whatever you want. Atman, you know, it doesn't matter what culture, what tradition. But, but by having a desire for that, you're really saying you have a desire for peace. And if you have a desire for peace, and you stay with that desire like a torch, like a bright torch in your mind, then, then those beliefs will get exposed. And, and they do, they do get exposed. You know, they may be hidden in the unconscious mind, but if you desire truth, then they come up and they do get exposed, and then you can release them once, once they're exposed.

What if people believe they don't have that desire? As you said, they might be hidden. Like, what if some people tuning in go, "I don't have any sort of desire like that to devote myself to anything?"

Well, what Jesus says is, you take your little willingness and you put it with the Holy Spirit, and that kind combines into a power surge that begins to set your mind free. Just your little willingness combines with the call, an internal call back to truth that's so strong. It's like a magnet, like, "Beam me up, Scotty." You know, it's, it's, it's going to really go beam us up if we have a little willingness. So, I think at the very beginning, if you don't have that desire, it's like, sure, that's, that's the way it can seem to be. So, but you can have a little willingness. And even when people do the workbook lessons, I just say, "Just hang in there and just, just keep, keep at it with your little willingness." And I do everything I can to kind of inspire and bless and help and resources and tools and puts things on the web and do whatever I can to help take that spark and help that go into a flame, 'cause it, it, it usually starts out with most people as just like a tiny spark.

>> What are some of the transformative or more transformative experiences you've experienced for people that have attuned themselves to the work?

Well, I think, I think you become, I mean, for me, it's like more telepathic. Um, I know I watched when Aaron Abkkey was on, uh, on your programs, and he was talking about the Nazarines and the time in around Jesus, you know, the way they lived. And I was very inspired by the way the Nazarines lived. So around, uh, the early, was it like, kind of the 1990s somewhere, I decided I want to do that. 'Cause I've heard Aaron say on your program, he would like to maybe have a spiritual community one day, and certainly, you, you have one. Uh, it's amazing. And so I thought, I want to have a spiritual community. And I, because I think that would be a symbol that would be helpful that the spirit could use in a, in a beautiful way. But then I decided to go radical, like the Nazarines. We're going to share property. No personal ownership. I mean, let's go like the Nazarines. Let's, they've set the tone. Jesus and the Nazarines. Who cares if it's in the 2000s? Two 2000s now. I, I'm not interested. I started off in the 1990s. I was saying, "Okay, let's do a spiritual community. Anybody in there with me?" So, I, I formed a nonprofit, uh, 501c3 nonprofit, and I said, "This is it. We just share everything and we're going for God." And then that evolved over the years, and we still, it's still going, uh, decades later. Our little Nazarene-like community is still going with the same basic principles.

Do we have like ten commandments we follow? No. We only have two guidelines for the whole community. Only two guidelines. No people-pleasing. Like, say what you mean, mean what you say. Don't hold back with your feelings. Don't dance around anything. No people-pleasing. Really speak from your heart. And no private thoughts. Let's not have secrets. Uh, I think if we don't have secrets, we'll open up faster than we ever would. Only two guidelines, not ten commandments, just two guidelines.

>> That sounds hard enough to do with just one person. There's hundreds. There's thousands of people in this community. What are you doing? What are you doing?

>> I know. If anybody wants to try it out, imagine it. Just try and doing it because the ego doesn't like that. It's going to try to destroy that, crash it down a hundred different ways and everything. But amazingly, like three decades later, it's still going. And, and what, what it is, is it's beautiful because then people can be very prayerful, very devoted, very intuitive. Like, you have different skills from your background, astrological skills and, and communication skills. Imagine if you have people coming together in kind of an umbrella under an umbrella of communal living, and they don't have to be concerned about, uh, who's going to pay the light bill, because it's part of it all is get, has all get handled. We still have to handle that. You still have to do every, everything that the, the government or the world requires, but you just, it's communal. So it's not on any one person's shoulder. So then your, your skills and abilities are freed up to really expand. And we have people that have great musical skills, composing skills, you know, engineering skills, uh, all kinds of skills that they've had. Instead of having professions where they're earning money individually, those skills get used and kind of channelized in a devotional life where everything is shared. And, and then the emotions come up. Of course, all the dark that Carl Jung talked about, the shadow. Will the shadow come up? Yes. But we've got our Course in Miracles and Jesus constantly telling us, release the grievances. Let the darkness up. Don't stuff it down and repress it and deny it. Let it up and let it go. Let it up and let it go. So, it's, it's quite, I called it an experiment, but the experiment is still going. And, and now I, I'm getting a little more mystical than I was before because I used to, I used to eat before, but now I'm, I'm kind of down into like a liquid diet. I'm not yet to the bretharian phase, but quickly zooming there with my liquid diet. You know, I, I have a nice container of liquid to follow me around where I go. But, but, you know, it, it's kind of just the joy is very strong. There's a lot of trust and joy and connection and free flow of communication. That's what your program is about, is about free flow of ideas. Let's not try to put anybody down or judge anybody. Let's just have invite people to come on and share their ideas. And you have, you know, astrologers and different ones that from different fields that come, and that's what we have in our community. Uh, but they're also very devotional. They, they, they are deeply into prayer. It's, it's getting, it's getting super telepathic, actually, is what it's, uh, it's coming into.

>> Yeah. We have this beautiful corner in our, um, Inspired Evolution community circle called the Prayer Space. And, uh, we had, um, one of the teachers we had was Lynn McTaggart, that did The Power of Intention, and that work. And they got, um, some of the people that measured Joe Dispenza's work and all that sort of stuff behind Lynn's work as well. And they measured that somehow when, uh, eight people or more collect behind an intention, they saw like more deeper ripples in material manifestations. And I was like, "Wow, you know." And so we've got this little prayer space, and everybody sort of tunes in. And once you've added to the prayer, your own thoughts and intentions, you can just hard it. And so you can sort of see, "Oh, this prayer has like, you know, 30 people behind it, you know, it's kind of, it's got a vibe. It's got a vibe."

>> It's interesting, the, um, the, I mean, my question, which I was surprised by myself, why is the symbol of community important? Because you used the word symbol before. I mean, the, the intuitive question to ask would be, why is the experience of community so important? But let's maybe honor the, yeah, the symbol of community. Not even sure why I'm asking that.

>> Well, let's just say that what Jesus is saying is that the ego projected the world of time and space. So, even these words we're speaking are symbols, and everything in the cosmos is symbols. So, what Jesus is saying, what if there is a purposeful intention or use for those symbols that will set you free from the symbols? It's actually using the symbols to set you free from the symbols. And, and in maybe in the East, in Buddhism, they might call it mindfulness, for example. You know, being very mindful, tick-tock, you know, very focused like that. That's what Jesus is doing with us. He's saying, be very focused and use the symbols, but don't take them to be reality. Because as soon as you identify with the symbol, then you have something to defend. Uh, anytime you identify with something of time and space that the ego made, you can quickly become defensive. Because you, you use the word "my community," you know, it, it gets, it's very subtle. So, what he's saying is, if you allow the spirit, the intuitive part of you, we'll call it the Holy Spirit. If you allow the spirit to use the symbols, it will channelize all the symbols in a direction that will set your mind free. And what is that? You go into communion. And communion is, I'll call it vertical. It's, it's, it's a vertical connection with spirit, instead of the horizontal plane. I always say the cross is like a, where the, the vertical and the horizontal intersect. The vertical is the Christ, and the horizontal would seem to be Jesus, the man, in, in Nazareth, back 2,000 years ago. So, the goal is always communion with source, uh, and not to try to freeze down into identifying with, with the symbols. Just allow the symbols to be used in a very joyful, intuitive way, which is what we're doing with community, where there's not a sense of ownership. You know, we, we do podcasts, we do audios, videos, and Spotify, and all these different things, and, and yet we don't have any personal ownership. So nobody's really wanting to toot their own horn. Just want the communion experience of, of connection. That's what we're desiring. We're not interested in the, the trappings of, of kind of misidentifying with, with pride comes in. You start to identify with the personhood, and then, then that takes you into pride, and then there's jealousy, and greed, and possession, ownership. I mean, you get all the other things that come in with the ego as soon as you try to identify with, with the personal perspective. It's incredibly profound. Um, it was quite intentional. I mean, as you're talking about symbols, it was quite intentional that, you know, the Inspired Evolution community circle, we called it the circle, right? Because the center is empty. And is like, you know, the Inspired Evolution podcast, as me here as a host, could very easily become Emirates community, you know, and it's just like, mate, I'm not in the middle. I'm standing around here with all of y'all.

>> Yeah.

>> Arm in arm in the circle.

>> Whether we've got our hands together in prayer or our hats out begging, I don't know. I'm here right with you.

>> Yeah. Yeah. That's beautiful.

>> But the, the, the poignancy of symbols, like, it's actually, um, yeah, it's, it's really interesting. Really, really interesting. But what I heard from you as well is,

>> the symbols are necessary crystallizations along the way which can give us a bit of a grapple, but don't get overly attached, and then make sure you keep flowing, keep moving, keep moving. And community actually helps us feel that as well, because community is different every day. You know, it's like, and that's also one of the most affirming things I found is like people being able to share their experiences and where they are. So, I'm collectively feeling like this a little bit. You know, that tuned me into astrology really deeply. But, um, but, you know, there are these collective archetypal fields and energies that they, that people feel collectively as well. And, and it can be so healing on, in and of itself, um, because you're also willing to release as you're watching people, you know, release as well. It's, um,

>> yeah, it's incredible. Such a gift.

>> Because I think like with any community, right away people will say, "Okay, you're into practicality. How do you make decisions?" That's a, that's a valid question. You know, how do you make decisions in the community? And I think I like your analogy of the circle, and then there's the space in the center where that joining and connection is. To me, that's like a symbol of prayer. So we're very much into prayer. So when we have people come together and we pray on something, it's like we don't have an outcome necessarily set in mind. We're not voting on an outcome. We're coming with an openness to to pray and be shown. And sometimes something that none of us have, have even imagined, you know, or thought of, something comes in and lands, and everyone goes, "Ah, yes." You know, it's like a given thing. And it's a very different way of decision-making through prayer. But prayer is our desire. You know, we're going back to the core of, we want connection. We want for the good of the whole. We want to feel expansiveness. And yet, you have day-to-day decisions, like, uh, a pipe breaks, uh, or a car won't start, or, you know. And so it's almost, we have to have a culture of, of prayer and devotion where instead of trying to jump into an analytical way, which is the old way, you know, "Okay, car won't start. And okay, who can do this? And who do we need to call? And this and that." It's more just joining in prayer. And we've had times where people join in prayer, and then the car starts. I mean, just through the joining in the prayer, that they don't even have to call the mechanic. Because that's the way it works. Uh, the power of intention, the power of the mind, the power of connecting, you know, is that strong. And, and that's kind of, I mean, Judy Schotch passed away, but she was the publisher of A Course in Miracles. And I was, I had many dinners with her and her husband. And one time she said, uh, she said that the, you probably have heard of the Urantia Book.

>> Yeah, I've got it.

>> Yeah.

>> Well, it's got me actually. I don't, anyway. I don't know how this is,

>> is even bigger than the Course. Yeah, it's a lot. It's a big book. But the founders of the Urantia Book, the foundation came to visit Judy Schotch, who is the the publisher of A Course in Miracles. And they said to Judy, "We're really interested. Your Course in Miracles is really expanding in all these nations and is getting translated in all these languages. Would you mind sharing your business plan with us?" And Judy laughed and said, "We don't have one." And they said, "But it's massive. You guys have been doing this since like 1975, and, and my God, you don't have a business plan." She said, "N no, we, we just pray." And, and Judy and I laughed because I said, "Yeah, that's how we started nonprofits. That's how we start anything is we pray, but we don't necessarily have a business plan for the, the development, growth. We leave that to the spirit." It's very different from the world's way of looking at things. It's like, "I'm not in charge. There's one within all of us that's in charge." But, but we try to, you know, leave the symbols to that one to show us and guide us.

>> Is this an important way to learn to live?

>> I think so. I mean, I feel like throughout human history, there's been utopian ideas and there's been attempts at utopian communities, but the ego is so clever and so insidious, and it's, it's a death wish. So, and it's mostly unconscious, too. So, I think that's what sabotages a lot of these attempts to live together in that way. I don't feel like there's any particular form that's better than another because I'm, I've done a lot of couples counseling and a work with communities. I went to Brazil and I was in S. Apollo and three different spiritual Course of Miracles communities. The leaders came to me and they said, "Can we meet with you privately? Because this is, we're struggling, you know, it's hard when things fall apart and divisions come and, you know, inner conflicts come." So I spend like a couple hours with them talking about just prayer and devotion and keep steadfast devotion and really keep it really sacred, you know, this devotion, keep it very sacred. But I feel there's many people now that are doing like you and I with our communities, where, you know, some people, it's too far out, you know, it's, it sounds like something out of the 1960s, you know. And I'll say, "Oh yeah, the '60s were great. Let's, let's do an encounter group with no agenda, just come together with wanting nothing from each other, but just to see what the spirit wants to show us." You know, "Let's have a, an encounter group like in Berkeley in the 1960s." They're like, "Oh, David, my God, what era? What is your mind living in? This is like 2026." But I'm, I like, I learn from experiences of people that have really tried this. I've, I've visited hundreds of communities all over the world to just learn from them what works. Such an incredible time to think about that era, that time though, as well. We've had, um, Robert Thurman was on the podcast recently, um, the Tibetan Book of the Dead and the Dying. And he talked deeply about his experiences with Ram Dass at, you know, in those institutes. Uh, today's podcast at the time of this recording was, um, Richard Tarnas, yeah, Richard Tarnas, and, uh, Cosmos and Psyche. And just, yeah, just looking at how much, I mean, even that conversation of itself was, I mean, obviously I'm biased 'cause I was in it, but Richard's pursuit, dude, was completely depth psychology. His whole thing is depth psychology, and he landed in astrology. It's like you're going all back to your symbol of like going inner on the rings to change the outer. It was like he was trying to go as far in on the rings, all the way to desire as possible, and then he found like astrology in the manifest world out there, and like the influential.

>> I mean, it's, it's, it's incredible. It's incredible what happened at that time. Um, one of my mentors,

>> here in Australia, Daran, he, um, he goes, many people say, "Oh, nothing changed in the '60s," like some people say that in, in passing, you know, to him. And, uh, he said, "No, but before that, like, it's, it's actually everywhere. It's actually everywhere. You, you people don't notice. Before all the cars apparently were black and white." Black and white. And then after the fact, colored full cars started coming. Like, a lot changed in the collective, in the collective awareness and consciousness at that time. Yeah, it's fascinating to follow the links and the connections because like the scribe of A Course in Miracles was her name was Helen Schucman. She was a research psychologist in New York City. But the more she got into scribing the Course with her, her boss was William Thetford, the more she started to look at it and read it some, and then she had questions like, uh, she had questions for Jesus, like, "Wait a minute, what does astrology and the movements of the planets and the spheres, how does that relate those movements to the lives of men and women? Like, why is there a connection?" Asking Jesus Christ, uh, like the one who's transcended time and space, some really good questions. And I was reading it, and Jesus said, "Good question. Your mind is so powerful that it's moving all those billions of people on planet Earth around. And outside of that, it's moving all the spheres and the planets around." I just about fell off my bed. I was in bed, really, because, you know, to hear Jesus Christ tell me the connection between astrology and the lives of men and women. And I can only imagine Helen was just like, "Oh my God," like not expecting that answer. But it's just showing how powerful our mind is, and that if we believe in the error, then we can, we can invent in with the imagination in many ways. Hey there, inspired souls. Today's conversation's been an absolute, oh my God, so grateful. Now, if you want support in reading your own chart, understand yourself better through the lens of astrology, or even have a look at what's coming up at this time for you, or both, you can book in a reading with myself, amandu.com/reading, amandu.com/reading. Touchwood, it would be my absolute honor and pleasure to support you with that awareness at this time. If you feel the goal,

>> if we take it back far enough, Jesus is saying, "Just see how powerful your mind is. And if your mind is powerful enough to forget God, it must be powerful enough to remember God. If you believe you can separate, you must also believe that you can accept the correction." And that just takes it away from an interpersonal perspective where, you know, I can see with your show, people are curious about that, what's happening in 2026, big shifts happening right around this time, you know, April, May. People are interested in that. But then deeper down, when they start to introspect, it's like, "Okay, and how does that relate to my mind?" And Jesus is saying, "It takes a lot of mind training, but, but you can start to see that there's no accidents. Nothing is is out of sorts, and that you're just perceiving the world." Just like Freud talked about wish fulfillment, that that your dreams are wish fulfillment. Jesus is saying, "What you perceive as your everyday life is also a dream."

>> Dream, which is a wish fulfillment.

>> And it's still wish fulfillment. It's still all your time is spent in dreaming, both nighttime and, and during the day. But there is an escape, which is he calls forgiveness. But it's very different from the forgiveness that you and I were raised with. When we were raised, you know, if somebody said something or did something or harmed you in some way, or, or that they didn't do something that they should have done, there was a grievance that formed. And we were taught, you know, "You need to learn to forgive these people in your life." And Jesus is teaching a completely different view of forgiveness than that. I mean, when I first got into it, I thought, "This is, this is just so deep." Because he's saying, "You don't forgive someone for what they did to you. You don't forgive someone for what they didn't do that you think they should have done. You forgive your brother for what they have not done." And I was like, "What? Say, say again, forgive my brother, my sister, for what they have not done." And what he's teaching us is that...

>> WOW. Dive friends. Oh my god.

>> You see how massively different that is? I was like, "Holy, holy, holy, my gosh." Because what he's teaching us is...

>> Bro, that is hu. Sorry, I got to mute myself. That one landed. Boom. It's so huge. 'Cause then it's not, we're not letting them off the hook. We're letting our mind off the hook. We're letting our consciousness off the hook. Uh, we're, we're setting ourselves truly free as God created us. You know, you see, it's a massive...

>> Sublime, divine, intervene. My God.

>> Oh my.

>> Sorry. I don't even know where the pieces of my brain are left to pick up in this conversation. I'm so, and I, and I'm so eternally grateful. Touchwood. Wow. That just com, I mean, it doesn't just flip the script on forgiveness. It, it, it requires a complete flip on script of your perception and living felt sense awareness.

>> Yes.

>> Um, to which come to from. But then, I mean, how do people start this? Like, is it just carrying that awareness and everything just trickles in downstream from there? How does this practically get laid in?

>> I think it came to me, it's like, we get drip, drip-fed moment by moment in terms of guidance. So, all these out-of-pattern experiences, just like when your podcast, you get to meet these amazing people and telling their amazing stories and amazing miracles. And Jesus is saying, "Yeah, that's, that's what guidance is meant to be. It's the constructive use of symbols. It's not just symbols for some kind of personal motive. It's like, that's for the, you're doing this podcast for the whole universe, and you can feel it with these guests, you know, you can feel the connections, how big it is." So, I started to feel like, "Wow, my life is not my own as I've known it." And that's why when I first found the Course, I just had this feeling like, "Nothing's going to ever be the same." And then it hasn't been. But also, like you're saying, it has to be a felt experience. It has to be, you have to be aware. There has to be the connection that you let go of the misperception that judged their behavior. Somehow we started to to put so much weight on behavior that we got away from what is their essence. You know, back with Ram Dass, you know, it's not hard to tap into his essence because you read his book and you see him, his eyes, and he's "Be Here Now," and you know...

>> But he also, but then he also says things like, "I don't wish the stroke upon anybody, but I wish them the grace post-stroke upon all." And it's like, it's hard not to feel the essence.

>> Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's, but I think, I mean, the part I like when he was describing when the stroke was happening, you know, he, he said he was laying on the tiles, laying on the floor, looking up at the ceiling tiles. And, and he just says, "Look at this. Mr. God is having a stroke." You got to love the humor. There was a detachment there. Who, who says that in the middle of the stroke, you know? And...

>> Well, the kind of person that forgives their brother for what they've not done.

>> I mean, the, the essence was shining through right there, like, "Mr. God is having a stroke," 'cause, you know, he's so prolific with, you know, "Be Here Now" and all the books and the business, his guru. But I feel like that's, that's why we're just unpacking true forgiveness because you can see it's so different from this polarity in the world now of who's right and who's wrong, and who's who's liberal and who's conservative, and who's progressive, who's spiritual. You know, we, we have got to really see there's something deeper than the labels because labels are just symbols. And if we stop at the level of labels, we're going to be rejecting. We're going to be caught into, "I accept you because you're my friend. You think like me," and "I reject you because you don't think like me." And Jesus is like, "No, true forgiveness goes much, much deeper into the mind. It goes to the core. It goes to the essence." Yeah. Why is reality doing anything at all? What's going on? Why are we, why is this going on?

>> Well, again, I think one of the most succinct expressions of forgiveness, Jesus says, "Forgiveness is silent and quietly does nothing. It looks and waits and watches and judges not." That that says a lot. It's like presence is like, is like the witness self. It's like, it, it witnesses without judgment. But I can't tell you how many retreats I've done over the years called "Undoing the Doer." Because when we identify with the person, with the body, it sets up, uh, it's a misidentification because we're really spirit. But it sets up an anxiety. It sets up a, a guilt. "Have I done enough? Uh, could I do more? Uh, did I do well? Uh, could I do better?" You know, it, it sets up a guilt situation. So, I would say for me, practicing the presence has been coming into a realization that I haven't done anything. And with that realization is, that I, I am not the doer. I am the being. And, and with that realization comes, "I have not done anything right or wrong." So, it's not just trying to escape from guilt by saying, "I've never done anything wrong," but it's also saying, "Or right." Because our mind is abstract. It's very vast in its natural state. Even consciousness, most people talk about consciousness as, as similar to the mind. But, you know, I've studied many great teachers and, and still there can be some confusion. But Jesus clears up the talk about consciousness when Jesus says, "Consciousness is the domain of the ego." I was like, "What? Consciousness is the domain of the ego?" Because he says, "Consciousness has levels and can be training, but spirit, I-ness, presence, it, it transcends consciousness. It's, it's literally, 'Whoo, that is like, I am that, Nizer Gadada,' you know, like, 'Oh, whoa.'" And so, Jesus, we have to remember, he's teaching us from the Course. He is the master teacher. He's transcended time and space. So, as soon as he said, "Consciousness is the domain of the ego," and of course, we want to release the ego, then that means we can seem to do miracles and climb into higher and higher states of consciousness. But there must come a leaping off point where we see we were wrong about it all.

>> You transcend consciousness itself.

>> Transcend consciousness itself. And that's that, "Before Abraham was, I am." So...

>> So, is the entire game a game of self-recognition for the one?

>> Yeah. It's like, that's, that's divine. I call it capital Self-realization, or self-actualization, self-recognition. And "Know thyself." The Greeks said that. That's, that's just the aim of everything. And, and if that's my sole responsibility, then you can start to see that the ego set up this world to get us hooked onto false responsibilities. We believe we're responsible for the body. We believe we're responsible for the actions of the body. Let's say the body is like a puppet. We believe we're responsible for that puppet. And Jesus is like saying, "No, there's something deeper. You, there's a correction prior to making the puppets. There's, there's a state of mind that you are, and you are responsible for accepting that that is what is." So, but he explains it like, he'll say, "I would say, 'Well, how, how do we get into right action? Is there any, I thought I thought the Ten Commandments were mostly about right action. Thou shalt not kill. Thou shalt not steal.' You know, and he said, 'Yeah, most of them are about behaviors, but thou, even thou shalt not commit adultery.' But then he started saying, 'If you have lustful thoughts for a woman not your wife, you commit adultery.' He, he started to say like, one of the commandments was, 'Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife,' and he said, 'That's in the mind. Coveting is not a behavior. Coveting is lusting after, wanting something that that originates in consciousness.' He said, 'That's where we have to go for the correction.' And I said, 'So, you mean the behaviors in the, in the end are not that important?' And he said, 'They're, they're stepping stones. They're symbols of the thoughts.'"

>> I said to him, I said, "How does this work then?" And he says, "What you do comes from what you think." And you need correction at the thought level before you can escape. Like, he said, like the Golden Rule, he said, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." He said, "But you have to perceive yourself and others correctly before that rule really applies." And I said, "So, how does this occur then?" He said, "You have judgments, grievances, and attack thoughts in your mind that are part of your consciousness. And you have to purify your mind. You have to empty your mind, like all the saints and mystics have said, empty your mind of all everything it thinks it thinks, and and come unto the Lord thy God." And so, to me, that's, that now is now the whole focus of everything. It's, I'm working on purity of thought because as long as I'm holding on to grievances of any kind, then I have not forgiven. Uh, forgive your brother for what he has not done. As long as I'm holding on to the grievance in my consciousness, then that's the block. That's my block to knowing my Creator. I have a very dear friend, um, obviously respectfully, I'm not going to name her, just 'cause this podcast goes to a lot of people, touchwood. Um, but her mother, um, passed away. And even in her passing, you know, there was some, it wasn't a smooth transition between her and her mother as her mother passed away. But then also throughout her life, her mother had, um, favored other children, um, different era girls, boys, all this sort of stuff, right? And, yeah, she, it's, it's been a lot, um, for this individual to process that one's mother was that way towards them. And what they, and all the, you know, guilt and sadness from, like, "Hey, like, I wanted to feel more this." So embroiling, so embroiling in a space like this when the rubber hits the road for someone. Um, part of me wants me to send her this podcast between you and I, but then I'm also curious as to what she'd really get from it, you know? Like, what are we going to say to someone like that that's practically in the front lines, on the trenches, you know, been struggling with this for better part of a year plus now, you know, um, and, and, and it seems to just continue to hook in further and deeper, touchwood, rather than actually release in some ways.

>> Yeah. I, I have seen this this example come up many times. And, and I, I go back again to when Jesus said, "Who is my father, mother, sister, brother? He that does the will of my Father in heaven is father, mother, sister, brother." So, what Jesus is teaching us is that when we fall asleep in this dream world, we, we really, we don't come as like a happy little soul and land and incarnate. We actually, he says, "When you come to this world, you bring the whole world with you. It's entirely holographic." So, everything we perceive as our self, our parents, our siblings, our culture, our language, everything is all holographically unpacked, almost like our little soul head, like a little backpack. And we go, "Okay, I'm going to have an Earth experience." And we throw out the whole Earth, the whole cosmos. We throw out our parents, pre-arranged contracts, you know, it's all, it's all just as we prefer it and wish it to be. And then there's no equality because it's, it's a, it's a, a backpack of separation. It's leaving God and, and throwing out this, this form. So, what I learned from Jesus is, he said that you have a real self, which is called Christ, and then you have a make-believe self-concept, which is your personality self, and all the persons that you surround yourself with, and then the cosmos and the world, it's the whole thing. So, like Carolyn Mace said, you have soul contracts before you come in. You've already pre-arranged all this. And we pre-arranged it because we wanted these characters to act out separation for us. And then we hold grievances against the characters for what we, we handed out the parts at a mind level, at a consciousness level. We say, "Hey, you're going to play the mom. You're going to be, you're going to have favoritism. You're going to favor all the other ones, not me. And I'm going to have old grievances against you for for being that way." But then when he says, you know, "Everyone's just acting out like an anomaly, like in The Matrix, a belief, and they're just acting it out perfectly. You should be giving them standing ovations and Oscars for how they, how Mom acted that out." But, but we have to get deeper into the mind to the wish to separate because we, we only can forgive when we start to realize that we chose hatred in our mind, and then we chose to have the world act out that hatred in various different forms, like, like for example, a mother. So, what we do when we go much deeper is we start to undo our self-concept. You know, the David, the Emirate, the, the cultural conditioning we had, the, the background, the parents, the families, you know, the cultures. There, there is a point where we actually start to transcend that. But, but while it's happening, we need to start to realize that these, these characters are acting out thoughts in our consciousness, and that we have a, we have the ability to release those thoughts because they're grievances. And that brings it back to how empowered our mind is. And that undoes the victim, uh, mentality because that's the, that's the biggest problem. Where to believe in the ego is to believe in abuse, mistreatment, victimization, unfair treatment, injustice, you know, all those things are are projections of, of the ego. And Jesus is showing us that we're, we're not that ego. We're, we're free if we, if we choose to be. So, not everybody's ready to hear it. I went through similar things with my parents. And then at one point, my, my father, my biological father, he just said, "Uh, Dave, I'm sorry. I really was not a very good father." And I just looked at him and smiled. And I said, "Listen, that game of differences is over. You did the best that you could do based on what you believe. I did the best that I could do based on what I believe. Let's call it quits. Uh, let's not hold any more grievances against each other because we were just oper, these characters were operating out of our belief system, and, and those beliefs aren't true." And then he, he just smiled at me, and wow, what a, the rest of his life before he passed away, you know, we were buddies, we were like equals, buddies. "Where are you off to to teach next, David?" and, you know, and all this. And so, even at the end of his life, he, he went into a coma. And I was traveling and I came back, and my mother and my sister said, "You know, your dad's in intensive care and he's in a coma and everything. And you want to go and visit him?" I go to visit my dad in the hospital. He comes out of the coma.

>> Stop talking.

>> He came out of the coma and he's like, "Dave," and, and we had a regular conversation. But he was, before I got to the hospital, he was, he was laying there in a coma, and you should have seen the look on my mother and my sister's face. So, I've, I've had these, I had a raising the dead experience, too. Actually, believe it or not, I actually was, I was doing my Course workbook lesson. And I was just diligently devoted to do my Course workbook lesson. But the lesson of the day was, "There is no death. The Son of God is free." So, you know, this is not something that we're used to, you know. But I was actually, I was going to a grocery store to visit, get my grandmother some salad, and I walked into this, I was guided to go to another grocery store that I usually don't go to. I walk in, and I look, and there's some woman laid out on the on the floor of the grocery store, and she's not breathing. And I look, and the paramedics were trying to like revive her, you know, and then the, they didn't, they couldn't, so they backed off and they went away. And I went back, and I, I had this lesson in my mind, my one lesson I'm to concentrate on for the whole day. "There is no death. The Son of God is free." So, I'm layered like that, and then I go back, and I'm leaning my hand against the frozen foods, and this energy is going through my third eye and through my heart. And my lesson of the day is like a, a rolodex. My, "There is no death. The Son of God is free." And I'm watching this body. It's just laying there on the floor. And then I look, and the diaphragm, uh, of the body starts to move, and, and she, the woman starts to breathe again after the paramedics have already left. And this was my me doing my lesson of the day from A Course in Miracles. And Jesus is saying, you know, "It's death is an internal belief. It's, it's the ego." And he was just showing me that the ego doesn't rule your mind. And he was just using the symbols 'cause I, I didn't make a big deal out of it. I just went and got my, my salad and paid for it and, and left. And more people came around the woman and, you know, to attend to her. But that was for me. That was for my mind, not, not for David.

>> Why do I feel like the podcast needs a bit of a disclaimer at this point? Because then that's interesting to talk about, right? Because there's probably some fear in there. Um, because there's probably some people tuning into this podcast that would, you know, it can be quite the, yeah, just stability of the mind to sort of consider that absolutely every single thing that is happening externally in my reality is a projection of exactly what's internally happening within me. Some people may not be ready for that, David. Right? Or am I just kidding myself and that everybody needs to go there? Like, there's a, there's a, there's a disclaimer of sorts here, isn't there?

>> I do feel that way. I do feel like I was aware that everything that I was going through was was my lesson, and that it was not for everyone. And I do feel like we've had to talk about that when we talked about victimization and abuse and everything, because the power of the mind, I think, is, is kind of, it's a scary thing, um, because we seem to be able to have nightmares and perceive all kinds of things. But I think I was prepared for it a little bit. Like, most people, I, I don't think would, that would have been just freaky, uh, for most people. But, but there's a, Jesus has 50 miracle principles at the beginning of the book. And one of them is he says, "You can heal the sick and raise the dead because you made sickness and death and can abolish them both." So, I'd already read that statement. But that is like a very deep statement, you know, that this book is not from a, a human being. This is like a scripture that's coming like directly from divinity. And, and we know how people have had issues with the Bhagavad Gita, with the Bible, with many, many scriptures. And then I think to me, A Course in Miracles is such a direct pathway to God that, yeah, I agree, it, it has to be, there has to be a readiness for it. I even tell people, I said, "The Course in Miracles is is not for everyone," because because there are so many thousands of pathways to God, and they're all very valid. And this is just one among many among thousands. And yet, wow, it, it is so, so direct that, that, yeah, I feel like I say that all the time. I think Jesus even said that 2,000 years ago when he would walk, he would, his first words would usually be, "For those that have the ears to hear, let them hear." He would preface his his talk with those words because I think he knew that what was coming out was going to be like otherworldly. So, you raised your dad from the coma. Sorry, still getting over that. And also, like Jesus, did you do you think Jesus walked on water? Like, do you think that practically actually happened?

>> I think, I think in the perception of the apostles, he was working with them closely, and I think they were out in a boat and there was a storm. And, and I, I think that those kind of things which seem so beyond anything we can think of, I think because perception is just a, a reflection of mind, that I feel like probably because he was working with the apostles in such an intimate way. But

That that may have been shocking, but I think it was more shocking when he came back, um, to the upper room and and visited them, like the ranch book. I think you said you have it says he appeared in a maranche form, like 23 times, I believe. And and I I imagine those were all, each one was probably like, I just there is a a movie too that I show. I don't know if you've ever seen it, but it's called Risen. And the movie is from the perspective of a Roman centurion, the same Roman centurion that took the spear when Jesus was bleeding on the cross and jabbed jabbed it up in his ribs.

But then as you follow the movie, at one point he's told by Pontius Pilate, you know, you've got to find this body of Jesus because otherwise the apostles are going to make up a story and the Sanhedrin are worried that they're going to say that he's he is risen. We don't want that to happen. So he went around trying to to find Jesus, the body of Jesus. And finally, u he does find the guards and the stoners roll away. But then he's he's looking then for the apostles. He wants to find out about the apostles.

But there's one scene where he comes up to what they call the upper room. Here comes a Roman centurion, the one who' already seen Jesus die and has seen him die. And he goes up to the upper room with his sword in hand. He pushes open the door and he sees Mary Magdala and he sees the apostles and then his he just starts spinning. He looks and this Jesus is there and you can imagine the that's where you have to question what's real because you know in perception in this world dead is dead and gone. you know, it's not dead and back again. But Jesus is in the room smiling and he's scanning the room and then he does a double take because he has this flesh in his mind of this bloodied dead body that he watched and now he's seeing a smiling Jesus with the apostles. It's one of the most powerful scenes I've ever seen in cinema. you know, is called the movie is called Risen, but it's it he has to do like a double take because it it it just overthrows everything that he ever thought he knew about the world and human life.

We were talking about that at the beginning. Just that's even more shocking than uh than raising the dead, you know, is coming back from the dead. It almost is is showing that the world is only symbols and and that they can be seen again. You know, it's it's it's one of those moments I have to replay when I watch that movie Risen because it's I just I have to pause the movie every time I see that scene of that centurion going up into the upper room and seeing Jesus alive after he, you know, put the sword in his ribs. to take part in in killing him. You know, it just it was a total flip we talked about of upside down perception and then suddenly like, oh my god, what is this? That's that's very strong.

>> I often reflect on whether it's a propensity for the western mind or the eastern mind or just mind in and of itself that is seeking miracle. Do you know what I mean? It's almost like there's a yearning for something inexplicable to occur to me please. So I may pop through that this is not all that there is. The yearning for miracle and the mind's relationship with miracle cuz if it has a revelatory experience and it goes well it's almost looking for something to convince itself just again the consciousness living within the ego structure looking for something that tells itself about what's beyond itself. It's it's quite the thing the mind and its relationship with miracle. I've sat with it for a bit just in contemplation of even just picking up the book just like Maryanne Williamson was on the podcast talking about the book. She goes, "People have this on their coffee table for years and don't open it. Don't stress, hun. It's like a crystal."

>> Yeah. I know. I've met a lot of them.

>> Yeah.

>> That made me feel a lot better. make me feel a little better.

>> That's it.

>> I think that's why I think there's a part in the course of miracles where Jesus says miracles should not be used as spectacles to induce belief. That's an interesting thing coming from Jesus. Cuz you know when we think of miracles we sometimes think of these fantastic out of pattern kind of experiences raising the dead and healing the sick and healing the blind. But I think the more you study a course in miracles, you realize that that Jesus would say things after someone seemed to be healed and of blindness or leprosy or whatever, he would say by your faith you are healed. He would always bring it back to the power of the mind and by faith. Because often times people say, why why are some healed and some not healed? And Jesus is slowly teaching us how powerful our mind is and and that that uh even in the course he says um even at the point of death you could rise up and say I have no need of this at all. He's just always encouraging us to see how powerful our mind is and our and therefore our beliefs and thoughts and asking us to question that. So, he's really not into spectacles. And in the Bible, he would sometimes say, "Tell no man." Like, when a blind man could see or something, he would just say, "Tell no man." Like, he wasn't trying to get a a big uh ministry going. Oh, hey, this guy is healing the sick and raising the dead. His message was heaven is real and you can experience heaven and that is even transcends all these experiences on earth. He wasn't trying to uh make spectacles. I mean even without trying he seemed to stir things up plenty.

>> I mean I'm I'm too deep in a com in a place in this conversation with you. Even as you're using the word spectacle, I can't reflect on I can't help but reflect again. Reflect on the word perception. There we go. Perception and then spectacle and eye and lens and and and spectacle and miracle. Anyway, it's revelatory. Absolutely revoly. There is I know we are coming up on time and that is like I can't be sad but I am. Oh, but anyway, stop. But there is um the fearing. We talked about belief and then coming into desire and how to actually work with belief. Thank you so much for your response to that. For us, those of us that are coming from perception down into emotion and then we hit the ring of fear. There seems to be like quite a trampolini kind of liinal edge here that we can sort of and many of us probably know it that are looking to do the work. Um how do we work through this element here, this ring of fear?

>> Well, I think that's that is a like a lifelong calling just like with the vapasa founders. you know, once they hit the ring of fear, then they share their notes. But but I think that's where faith comes in that that faith and belief can combine into a power Jesus says that can surge power surge that can move mountains. So, so he's asking us to go more into our intuitive guidance to go become more intuitive and more intuitive and as we do our perception of the world changes and we don't put the faith, we don't put our belief in credence into appearances. uh because for the ego appearances are very important beautiful ugly attractive unattractive you know, it's it's paramount but the more we go into faith it's more like coming into the prayer of the heart for purification like that biatitudes uh the like the sermon on the mount blessed are the pure of heart for they shall see god they shall see the light of heaven so I I think this is what I call mysticism. You know, this is where we we enter a realm of devotion where we realize, oh my gosh, the whole point is to know our creator. And in order to know our creator, we are going to have to transcend fear. And we've had plenty of great movies that have shown us that. Even Raiders of the Lost Ark, you know, you know where he's got to cross the the canyon. It looks like he's going to step off and go dropping down to the bottom of a canyon while his father is is suffering in a nearby room. But he he just says looks at his little book, Leap of Faith, his little symbol. So he puts the foot out and it lands on something that from his angle is not visible. And then he he walks across the canyon just like Jesus walking on water. He walks across the the canyon and then he throws stones back, you know, like for the next person so they can they can

>> But he needed that faith. He Harrison Ford, you know, what a beautiful scene. He needed that faith to put that foot down

>> where all of his past learning was telling me he's just gonna topple into the canyon, but he doesn't.

>> And I think that's where faith comes in. You know, we

>> meet fortune favors the bold. Yeah. Yeah. Universe rewards courage. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It comes up to meet Yeah. Its hand comes up to meet your foot in some ways.

>> Exactly. It's touchwood. But but there is an impulse that's required from you. Um, which is it. Anyway, I am so looking forward to listening back to this podcast. My goodness, David. I am okay. Thank you so much for your time, energy, and presence here today.

>> Yeah. Yeah.

>> Um having said that as well, um, it's ever evident that yeah, today's conversation stands on a body of work that is not just even I mean it's your life. So thank you so much for being here, being present with us and sharing yourself so openly and abundantly here today. Um, and ultimately from all of us here at the inspired evolution, touchwood, thank you so much for you. Really appreciate you.

>> Thank you, Emmett. What a joy to come together. I first time I saw your podcast, I felt, hm, that sounds like a delicious podcast.

>> Thank you so much. That means so much to me. It's, um, yeah, I mean, to your point earlier, um, just, you know, following the calls, following the nudges, following, you know, the engineer in me still wakes up every day going, "Am I a what?" You know, I still find myself when I'm telling people on the street, it's like, "I'm a podcaster." and I find myself getting all like contracted before I say it because there's this fear of what their judgment's going to be and it's like oh I'm just so comfortable being the engineer but um to your point about what you said earlier you know allowing the courage to show up to be different inspired again and get inspired to evolve daily you know it's been a whole journey um and continues to be as you said um towards the end of your response as well there um thank you so much again really really appreciate it

>> thank you

>> you made it through to the end of Another really incredible episode. Touchwood. Thank you so much for your inspirations to evolve. It is such an honor to be your brother walking this path by your side. To all of you that are subscribed to the channel, thank you, thank you, thank you. Everything you see around here, it's all powered and empowered by you championing this podcast cost you absolutely nothing. It's absolutely free. Hit the subscribe button below and it supports love, positivity, and wisdom like this being spread through the channel. Thank you so much. Thank you for your support. It really goes such a long way. Cannot thank you enough. To all of you that haven't yet subscribed, please do take a moment as I'm saying the word subscribe. The button below is lighting up in the colors in the inspired evolution. Please join the community. Join the movement spreading love, positivity, and wisdom like this around the planet together. Thank you so much in advance for your incredible support. It cost you absolutely nothing. It's completely free. Just hit that subscribe button. It helps power the entire movement. Thank you. Friendly reminder again, we have if you've inspired by this content and you want to forge it into real connection, we have the inspired evolution community circle, the circle online as well. You can check it out, inspire evolution.com/circle if you feel the call for more community in this Aquarian time like this. And on screen now for you to dive in even deeper on your journey of the inspired evolution, the next best episode. So go on, take your pick and make your click. I'll see you in the next one. I'll see you there.