Transcription
Hi.
Hello. So, where would you like to begin?
Um, well, I had a lot of thoughts today cuz I wanted to make the most of this session and like I'm really glad to be here. Um, so like I basically um I've been thinking really long and hard about like the core of why I'm still like miserable in my life because like I've been self-aware for like three and a half years now and I've worked through a lot of things but there's still these things that really really bother me and like I wanted to run that by you.
Sure.
Yeah. Um I'll try to remember the best I can. I do have them written down.
Um.
Let me just think. Um, I think one of the things that like I want to understand, why I experience this is like why no matter what I do in my life, no matter how I try to feel in my life, it feels like nothing really like sticks in my core. Like just for an example, like last night I had this really um emotional in-depth conversation with my ex and like he was very emotional and I was and there was a whole situation there, but like when I woke up this morning, it felt like it almost didn't happen and like nothing really like hit it. Nothing really like no matter how emotional things are, it just never really feels like it sticks or like it like does that make sense?
Um.
I'm starting to understand it better, but maybe you could help me understand it more.
Okay. Okay.
Is there a question that you have?
Not yet. Just.
Okay. Um, it's just like I I I feel like a lot of times like I'll go through these things and like I feel like I'm connecting to somebody and I feel like I'm outwardly expressing things, but then like in the morning I wake up and I still feel empty and like bored and completely alone for the most part. And like I haven't really like it's hard for me to like feel um alive, I guess. And like that causes me a lot of like suffering, I guess. Um, but even that feels muted. Like I I feel like I should know it's like I'm suffering a lot, but even then like I don't really feel it. So like I don't know. I'm I'm trying my best to describe it. It's just like feeling like hollow no matter what I do. I I feel like I'm trying to like.
Mhm.
Um I don't know. It seems like you're saying that there's something that is very hard to describe or at least you're worried that maybe doesn't come through fully.
Yeah. And and on how I almost want to like read it cuz like I I really wanted to if you don't understand what I'm saying, I just wanted to make the most of the time that I have.
You seem to really worry that I may not understand what you're describing to me.
Yeah. I guess I I went I went a lot of my life just feeling like no one would never ever understand me. Yeah. That's a familiar experience that people don't understand you at all.
Yeah.
Can you say more about that?
I just feel like um from the time I was four years old, I just felt alone in the world and from then on I don't think I've ever really felt understood. Like it was just my whole life.
So you people do never understood you since you were four.
Yeah. It felt like a lot of times that was the case. I mean, I I feel like in my most recent years of my life, that's gotten better. Okay.
But it's still really hard to trust that because like even though people say they understand me or like they say they're connecting to me, I don't feel that.
You don't feel it. So then it must be confusing if they say they understand.
cuz it's like they only see like I feel like I have a million layers to me and like no one ever really sees the core of that.
Okay. Even now like all I wanted to do in this session was just finally tell you like how it feels to like I I feel like I've been suffering for so long and there's certain things I can't like overcome. It's like this mountain I can never climb and I just wanted to put it all out there but then I Yeah. I feel like I I I can't. It's like incomprehensible.
You really really want me to understand you?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then what what's what's the hope? What will what will happen if I do understand you?
If you want me to be honest, I I was hoping that you would like I don't know. I I kind of have doubts about this too. Like but like you presenting something to me that would help the suffering or like I don't know maybe provide me with a perspective that I don't have. But at the same time it's like I I doubt that somebody can.
and that stresses me out too. It's like I'm the only one that can do that.
That must be a very unsettling experience. You're trying so hard to be understood and but you're really doubting the people who ever will.
Yeah.
Yeah. Or will maybe they won't be able to help. And in other words, maybe I can understand you and maybe I can't offer you anything that will be helpful.
Yeah. It's like it's very hard for me to.
I just I already I I just like intrinsically already rely on myself because I just don't expect it.
Yeah.
Like at the same time, I just get so upset like like just like you know it's hard sometimes. It's like.
it's frustrating.
Yeah.
Being understood is a very very important experience for you.
But it's very hard to find.
Yeah. But at the same time it bothers me because like when I feel understood I suddenly feel like well if I can be understood then am I not really like that interesting? So being understood is also.
it's like if you can comprehend somebody they're not very fascinating or interesting they must be I guess like it's just like oh I got you down like you know it's like simplicity or something I don't know.
how so can you help me understand that.
so if somebody can be understood then they're not.
well it's like it's like yeah I almost I almost like fear losing that mystery about me too. Yeah.
So it's like a battle. There's so many of these battles that I face that I have faced like between like a choice.
Yeah.
Between like for example like I'm I realized like how alone I feel and like I also realized um cuz I had a near-death experience that like I only have this life to live.
and I wasn't enjoying it.
and it changed my entire perception of like everything.
and then I was like well I want to enjoy my life so how do I do that? And I found like a lot of the answers led towards things that like I didn't want to face.
like uh the choice between like choosing to connect to people but then yeah as as feeling like you know um.
I know you're saying a lot you're saying something about near-death experience and I would like to ask you about this but I'm curious about this dilemma that you described like being understood is also something that you don't want because it's too tricky. What if it means that you're not special?
Yeah. I don't get my brain like it stresses me out cuz like I have like this is why I just sit here sometimes and like.
you know cuz like I don't know what's worse. I can't choose. I can't make a choice. I hit these roadblocks all the time. It seems like no matter what I've done, I can't like get out of like what I call I call it like Groundhog Day. It's like waking up every day. It's like the same thing. No matter how hard I try to escape. It's like for example like uh throughout this trip I have had like fans on my Instagram. I've met them in person and like they've been so nice and there's been so much like love there and like acceptance and like um praise and like all these things and like I I feel it for just brief second but every morning I wake up empty. Every morning I wake up hollow. Every morning I wake up bored.
It's like it's so weird to me. It's like I I should feel satisfied. I should feel alive. I should feel all of these things and I don't and I don't know what the answer is.
Who says those things that you should feel this and you should feel that? Where is that coming from? Are you feel the way you feel? Why you should feel differently?
cuz I know this can't be what life should be.
You know that.
Yeah. Cuz like I I don't think I should have to spend my life this way. I don't feel like I deserve that. I feel like it sucks.
You deserve better.
Yeah. Yeah. And I And I know that, but I don't know how to get there. And And that sucks, too. And I feel I don't like blame myself for that, but I feel like it's this this mountain like this hurdle that I can't ever climb.
You feel trapped and you feel powerless to change the way you feel or get to the other side of this.
Yeah. I don't know how I don't know like I don't know how it's like a it's like a tangled mess in my brain. If I if I'm just connecting the dots here for you, is it does it mean that you're hoping to get to this this other place where you feel differently because you will be understood?
Is that how that part of it?
Okay. What else is part of that?
Um I've always had this this is going to sound I don't know. Uh, I've always had like this dream of like just waking up one day in my bed and suddenly like I feel this is gonna sound like okay like I feel like a real person and like I feel like I'm in my body and like I don't have to.
worry anymore.
I don't have to like try to think so hard or like I just feel like my I just feel like I've reached this level of like.
Mhm.
I guess perfection, but also just like my life is just like like I feel safe knowing that no matter what I do, people like my life will be successful and like that I'm just like enjoying that and then I get to live in bliss for the rest of my life. Um, and I I I doubt that now. Like I don't know if life will do that anymore cuz it's shown me time and time again. And that just made me depressed. And then like when I get depressed, I feel like disillusioned and like angry and like I hate existence. And I'm like I I have these thoughts a lot where it's like, well, if something had to exist, if life had to exist, why does it have to be this? Why does it have to be like so disappointing? Why does it have to be so, you know, like I I sometimes I look at the world and every place I can imagine, every person, every topic of conversation seems boring and I'm like, that's it. Like this is all there is. Like there's this perpetual just like, you know, and I don't know how to explain, but like this does cause me suffering and I and I don't like it. And like I used to just like hate the world and think like, "Oh, it's the world." Like, but like now I'm just hoping it's something that I can have agency over somehow because like otherwise then I'll just have to live like that because the world actually does suck that back.
So it's confusing. You can't figure out if it's the world, if it's you, if it's a combination.
Yeah. Yeah. I guess I I almost hope it's me just because I don't want that to be reality. Like I was so disillusioned by that.
Mhm.
Yeah.
So it since the world is so disappointing, what would you like this world to be?
Um, it just feels I I I mean the best I can describe it is like I have this image uh this like dream I guess in my mind and I've written about it before where like it has to do with high school for some reason, but like uh when I was in high school, it would have been all different. Like I would have had like different parents. I would have looked like I do now cuz like I hate my past self. I think they were the worst. I wish that I I hate I feel like my childhood was wasted by them.
Um but like I would have to I would get to go back and like I always have this image of like walking to high school as like me now.
Mhm. And I'm like, perfect and I'm happy and beautiful and like I have tons of friends and everyone loves me and like I always remember it's like fall time and like the leaves are falling on the ground and I just feel at peace and like and then like I go to school and like it's just like I don't know like it's this other life that I feel like I try so desperately to reach but like the feeling of that but I can't ever do it. And then like I realize how many years of my life were just like dumped in the trash and like that depresses me too. like literally 18 years plus of of just like [ __ ] and that I can never go back and I and like relive that and it's over and like that was my life.
Can you so maybe we can maybe you can tell me a little bit more about you said something about your childhood. You did you wanted to have different parents and you said something about wasting so many years of your life. Can you.
say a little bit more about any of this?
Yeah. I mean, I don't feel that much anymore about my parents that way cuz like they I had a moment with them where my dad apologized and some other stuff. I just wish that they were different, too. Like.
Uh-huh.
In what way?
I just wish our whole family was happier. Uh me and my siblings have no connection to each other at all. No, no one. It's like there's just an emptiness in the family, too. And I know I I noticed it and I wonder what it would have been like to grow up with like a differenti environment and like a different vibe. And like sometimes I see siblings like having fun like on YouTube or Instagram and like I'm like oh you know u but anyway like my childhood was just something that really bothers me is that like I wonder where things went so wrong and I can trace it all the way back to four years old and that really like [ __ ] me up because I'm like.
what happened there?
My past self as I call them I refuse to be that person. They um they felt alone.
and they started to delve into fantasy like in a really weird disturbing way that lasted like years. I'm talking like 10 plus. Like they would go to school and just come home and delve into fantasy because they didn't want to live in reality. They didn't want to live as themselves. There was always this thought of like I don't want to be me. I want to be someone else.
Um, and I'm like I uh when I think about how bored I am sometimes when I think about like my motivation that I I can't seem to find like passion in a lot of things. I try to trace it back and find some place where like I did have that and even like at four years old it's like what was wrong with that kid? You know like they were only interested in like fantasy and [ __ ] like they never developed like they like a normal child. I don't get it.
Are you noticing that you're saying sometimes pronoun I and sometimes using pronouns they?
No, I'm sorry. I've probably dissociated so much. I was like cuz I'm trying to make sense. People don't usually talk about themselves like that, but genuinely I do not feel like that was me. And that [ __ ] me up too because I look back and I'm like.
it wasn't.
No, I don't want to.
So you do feel like it's like a different person.
Yes. But that's weird too because then it's like I feel like this bizarre disconnect of like all these years of my life that were lived.
Mhm.
You use a lot of language that sounds like judgment or criticism and I'm wondering if that's your experience thinking about yourself.
About my past self? Yeah.
How so?
Oh, I 100% think that they were ugly and worthless and cringy and embarrassing and everyone showed them that constantly. And uh they deserved it. And I don't know, I'm glad that they're gone, but at the same time, like I I hate that that was my life. And like I I I think to myself, okay, you're still young. You're still young. you have a chance to like heal or whatever and you can live the rest of your life hopefully in that state that you've always wanted to live in like a better like more happy more whole state of being but like I got to get there first so that's when I get frustrated. Yeah. But like I have hope like I do I do I feel like a powerful person a lot of the time but then sometimes I'm just like I don't understand how to unwind stuff because it's just so confusing.
You're trying to be a different person.
Not anymore. I I'm like pretty.
You used to.
I used Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Every day.
Can you say more about that process of becoming a different person?
Um yeah, that's hard for me. Um.
is it.
just cuz it's so it's like.
um there was Okay, so you know how I talked a lot about my past self being obsessed with fantasy?
Yeah. There was a lot of like obsession over like powerful characters who were like confident and like beautiful and like and that was like an escape like to you can almost imagine them as yourself. If you don't have to live in the reality at least you got to go to school but then you can come home and just like immerse yourself in that. It's like that's not enough cuz one day you have to go out in the real world. You can't just live at home forever. You've got to be an adult. You've got to like take on things as somebody. So, there was one day where I remember like my past self was like playing the Sims or something. It's like this ridiculous game where there's all these little.
you know what the Sims is?
It's like, it's a electronic, it's like an online game where you can be, you can put all these little characters in a house basically and watch them interact and then you can edit their behaviors and their appearances.
And there was this thought like, well, what if like I did that to myself?
What if I became the main character finally? What? Why do I have to live constantly like not in reality when like I could make this my reality?
Yeah.
And it was just this intense like thing where like I took agency over that for the first time and like my sense of identity honestly was so messed up at that point and that's what worries me cuz I feel like even at 4 years old it already was and that stressed me out cuz I don't even know where to start if I want to like feel more whole. But um at that point it was like I was searching for something like how to like be acceptable and perfect and like loved and like get the admiration that like I constantly saw like all my peers getting at school like going on dates like having friend groups like being the the center of everything and being like laughed with not laughed at like all these things. It's just like how do I get that? How do I have that for myself when like you live as this like you wake up every day in this like worthless disgusting body? It's like how do you get here from like here? And I one day I found like this video of this celebrity like this girl who like I literally instantly thought like oh she's like actual perfection. Like that's it. That's that's what perfection looks like. And like my past self became obsessed with her.
What made her perfection?
the way she moved and talked and walked and laughed and like the way people looked at her and.
um she was just so cute and like lovable and graceful and like yeah but like it made me feel like I had something.
to latch on to and then like I uh it used to just be like obsession but then it turned into like I I don't want to be her. I want to be better than her. I want to take her traits and be better than even her. Just like some other like level of existence than her. And then um now I almost come back to it as a comfort. If I feel like my sense of self is like falling apart, I go back because like it makes me feel like I I'm somebody real.
God.
So it was a What was that? You said, "Oh god." I just realized that I said all of this like I I dissociated through half of this stuff and then I like realized that you were a real person listening to me saying these things and then like I had a moment.
You refer to dissociation a couple of times.
I do. What is that about? What is dissociation?
I think I have several forms of it. Um some of them might not even be like what other people experience cuz I had that near-death experience. So I think like that gave me full-on just like PTSD.
Mhm. which I developed like depersonalization disorder and I was out of my body like depersonalization derealization.
like 11 months I was just like floating like everything felt unreal.
you were.
that was scary.
that's just one type though there's another one where like I feel like I exist in like fragments and bits and like it's confusing.
a lot of times I get stressed about that stuff but um what was the question oh dissociation yeah or sometimes when I'm in a situation where I'm interacting with people like I'll feel internally so different than I present externally. And that's a weird disconnect. Like.
yeah. So, that must be confusing for you.
Oh, yeah. I want to fix that so bad because I never get to enjoy anything. Like, I went out with my boyfriend and this girl and like I I was stressed the entire time or just like disconnected. I didn't have any interest in her. It was so bizarre. And but then like my boyfriend said I came across as like charming and like interested and engaging. Well, the entire time I was convinced she could see how disingenuous I was. And there was just this weird like disconnect. And the point of it that bothered me the most was I didn't enjoy myself at all. I wasn't present. I wasn't there.
you know, like I'm not even living my own life.
And is it a disconnect in your own mind or is it you don't know? So you in that moment your experience is not the same as the experience of other people of you.
Yeah.
So other people experience you differently from how you experience yourself internally.
Yeah. And it's so it's so like I I almost feel I used to think like oh you're just like I like I feel like a fraud because like but I don't think that anymore. I genuinely think that part that like presents is a part of me too. It's just disconnected from all the other parts and I don't know how to like get them to.
work together so I can like feel like I'm actually enjoying my own experience like I'm actually presenting feeling the emotions that are presenting like I don't know why there is that disconnect.
That's one question but what I also hear is that you have this idea that things should be really different and then you look at different celebrities for example and you imagine that they have very different lives.
Oh yeah. Yeah, I do. In fact, like one of the things I get really bitter about is like my celebrity as I call her. She's like she's all of those things that I described and she's also like genuinely like emotionally connected to people, like present, all these other things. And I'm like, wow. So, she gets all of this and that.
you know, and sometimes I get like bitter.
about that. And I do think her life's very different.
Bitter because.
cuz she like she never had to do what I had to do. She never had to live through what I did. She just got to be herself every day.
You know.
and people loved her.
You know that.
Yeah.
How do you know that she never had to struggle with any of this?
I don't think she's like me.
How do you know that?
I don't know. Um.
you seem to have a lot of ideas about how her life was and is.
And.
Well, I don't I guess I don't.
I'm curious. I don't know. Maybe you do know, but I'm not sure how.
Okay. Well, I guess Okay. Okay. Well, she's a celebrity, so I guess I I can't know for certain, but I highly doubt she went through what I did.
You doubt that?
Yeah, cuz.
why is that? I mean.
I don't think most people go through what I do.
Well, it may be somewhat different, but you don't. You're basically judging her inside based on her outside. And that's your concern about that example that you gave me that your boyfriend had a different impression about you. And internally, you had a radically different experience.
Yeah. but like.
well that bothers me because I'm not enjoying myself.
But then it means that outside may not match inside. So how do you want it to?
Yeah.
If it did, I would be screwed. I would No one would like me.
Well, that's about you. But when it comes to that celebrity, you seem to think that they match.
Oh man. Um.
Oh, okay.
What do you think about this? I don't know. I mean.
no, no, that just actually threw me for a loop. Um.
say more. What's occurring to you about it?
Um, I just maybe Oh, man. Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Um, you're saying I think what you're saying is like uh I am thinking I know about her inside by seeing her outside.
It appears to be but I don't know that.
No. Okay.
I can't know that. But.
yeah, I guess I might have been. But like you know what's weird? You know what stresses me out though about that is like if she was not as she seems on the outside, I wouldn't like that. Kind of ruins everything for me.
It does. How so?
I don't know.
Say more. What does it ruin?
Cuz like she's uh I had this like well um cuz then she wouldn't be I don't know like she wouldn't be this perfect mostly perfect I guess like person that I looked up to. She would just be like not that.
You look up to her.
I No, I can't do that.
You can't do that. No, not anymore. Okay. I would say that like I went through a transition phase where uh my past self did look up to her, but it's so far beyond that now.
Okay.
To me, like I can't. It's a bizarre relationship that I have with that.
for sure.
Well, she's very important to you.
Yeah. But then like I don't know. See, the thing is I never connected to her more than just like a a model of things. I never think about her otherwise. It's interesting. I don't know.
Okay.
Like her life or something or like I just want to know how she presents, what she does, how she does it, this and that. That's it.
So, you want to kind of be like her, maybe better than her, like you said.
Yeah.
But you don't really want to think about what's behind this, what's her private experience, and not quite think about her the context of all of this.
No, I don't know why.
Why not think about those things?
I don't know. I don't know.
You don't? Okay.
No. Should I know? I don't know.
I mean, but I do know that you do think about those things when it comes to yourself.
Well, yeah, cuz I'm miserable. I'm like, I don't want to be like this.
So, it's a little bit different way of thinking about yourself and and her, I guess.
Yeah, I guess. Yeah.
Yeah.
There's a difference here.
Yeah. Um, yeah.
Early it looked like it like like you said it threw you for a loop thinking that maybe there's a different inside that you imagined and maybe it's hard to think after that realization.
Yeah. Like hard to think in general because.
right now it's hard to kind of put your your thoughts together. There's something very.
Why would that happen? I don't Yeah. I don't know. Um.
well.
I was kind of hoping you would like.
that what.
continue the Yeah, it is hard right now. I don't know why.
I guess it's just hard. I don't know why. We Maybe we will come back to this and maybe it's going to be clear later, but I think it was a confusing realization for you.
Yeah, that definitely I I It's so crazy cuz I always go into situations and I'm like I don't expect things to happen like where like I get thrown for a loop, but then I do.
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
So, that does happen. You get thrown for a loop.
sometimes.
Sometimes, but like I never expect it to happen. I'm like, I probably already I get a like a thought a lot that's like, oh, you're already like mostly healed or like, oh, you already know mostly everything there is to know about like yourself or like the world or this or that. It's like.
yeah, I was actually stressed about I get stressed about that sometimes cuz then I'm like, oh no, I've healed too much. I'm not interesting anymore. I can't like be.
fascinating anymore. No one wants to hear about like a normal healed person. and like they want to hear about like an outlier. So then like I get all these thoughts. That's another battle I have. Do I want to heal? Yes. But then no.
You really seem to trap yourself in this.
How are you supposed to get out of that? Both of those. Like.
how are you supposed to get out of this?
I I don't know. It's like I can't choose that. I would rather not I would rather die than be seriously than just be some normal person that's all healed and not and boring.
So being normal is not something you aspire to be.
It sounds like you're just like everyone else and then that sounds like you're replaceable and like there's a million of you and why would anybody even look at you?
Yeah, it's true.
Just could look at other one of those other millions of people.
You're not special.
Well, yeah. I guess I don't know.
It's kind of like you want to get better, but you're too scared to be normal because it's you fear you're going to be replaceable and not special.
Yeah. Like the only people the only reason people even watch me I feel like is because I'm like fascinating in some way.
They don't want to watch some normal person that like.
So being not normal that's fascinating and being normal is not fascinating.
Yeah. And like I feel like I'd lose all my followers. Like they don't want to watch somebody that's just like not an outlier. Like who would want that? Like so boring. Like people just immediately log off and go watch someone else who's like more interesting or.
so you want two opposite things at the same time. You want to get better.
That seems like a pattern.
Why do you say more?
Why is that a pattern?
Say more about this pattern.
I just seem to not go anywhere because there's two choices that I can't make. But maybe this is an opportunity for us to talk very openly about both of those motivations that you have that you want to get better with which is this is where you started talking to me. But you also want to be famous and special and recognized and.
Yeah.
And those are and that's something to be open about.
Yeah. I I just I I I think that like.
I'm sick of that though. Like I like that but that's like that's all there is. That's that's another Oh my god. Like that's.
Wait a second. You're saying you're sick of this? What is this?
What do you mean.
being that like all there that I care about? And then.
that's all you care about?
No, I don't want it to be most of what I care about because I'm bored. Like I'm bored with that. There's only so many times like I'll give you an example like last night.
and the in the past like five days so many people have like said, "You are so beautiful. You're so pretty. Like you're so strong. You're changing the world." After I hear that a certain amount of times, it becomes old and then I get stressed because like that's not enough anymore to feel good. And then I'm like, well, [ __ ] now I'm just bored with that, too. Like, it's terrifying. And I don't want to have to like it's like there's nothing left. The feeling of like nothing left is terrifying. And I don't I'm sick of that being the only thing that like gives me anything uh emotionally mostly or like and then when I am emotional like with my ex.
Mhm.
it doesn't stick. Like why that sucks?
So you're saying kind of that it doesn't stick. Nothing stays. Nothing remains there.
Like it's like a bucket with a hole in it. So nothing can stay in that bucket. However, you're also saying you're getting something out of it. What are you getting out of it?
Um feeling like um how do I describe feeling okay?
What is feeling okay? Let's talk about this. What is feeling okay?
Um, like I belong in this world, like I'm powerful, like I like I am important, like I'm not somebody who just should go in a bedroom and just die. It's so dark. But like, you know, like I have like a place here and like I am somebody and I am worth something and I am like I have big I have a big destiny like and that comforts me. That's like something to live for.
So you feel then you feel you have big destiny and you feel like you um you feel recognized. It's it's a different experience with something is happening for you in those moments and you like that.
I feel so safe. I feel like I'm not going to fall apart.
Yeah.
I feel like I know who I am. I feel like that person is great and I'm okay and everything's okay and I'm not in danger of like feeling uh like yeah.
so can you help me understand what experiences give you that feeling that you are great that you're okay.
anytime that like I it's a million things I don't know like like being in a group and like making a joke and everyone laughs and it or like being with a like partner and like I I I don't know like they're they're like looking at me in a certain way where I know like I'm attractive or valuable or like or like uh realizing that I have fans that haven't forgotten about me if I log off for 3 days and that terrifies me. I can't even. That's something sometimes I want to take a social media break, but I can't because I feel like the moment I log off, everyone's going to just go to other accounts and they're going to forget about me.
And that's scary because.
cuz then I'd fail.
Then like everything that I care about like I I think a lot about losing my social media presence and how bad it would affect me.
Mhm. So.
your sense of well-being and sense of safety is dependent on how other people respond to you and how many people are, you know, friends with you on Instagram.
Yeah. Well, it's not just online stuff, but basically it's.
so it's it's external. There are external things that help you.
There's nothing else that exists. There's you can't just like sit in a room and be worth something. You're not giving something to the world. You're not being something. and you're not doing something like no one should give a crap about you at that point. I know it sounds really harsh, but like you're not you have to give things and be things in order to like that's the only thing that matters and how will you know if you're being those things unless people tell you that you have to check in with people.
So that seems like something that it's important for you is to do things. But it's also looks like your self-esteem is very dependent on those external factors. It's as if there's nothing internal that gives you sense of worth and well-being.
See, now that's something that I've always wanted to understand. What would do that? What do you do?
That's a good question. So, that's not a familiar experience that you have an internal experience of well-being and safety.
No, it's not. But I wonder like like I always look for evidence. It's like okay, tell me what gives you that. Why?
It's a good question.
Yeah, I would like to know. Based on your question, I understand you don't have evidence for that to be the case for you. You don't have that experience.
I can't imagine how you could just sit and like do something for yourself and then like feel good about it cuz like then you've just done something in a vacuum. No one's seen it. You're just sitting there with whatever you've done and then you're just like.
eh.
So, you have to be seen and recognized to feel that to feel safe and uh good about yourself. And if that doesn't exist, it's kind of like you feel empty and bored.
Oh my god. Yeah. No, I was going to add boredom in there because that's the worst part. I like.
even the other is not enough.
It's still boring.
It's never enough.
Yes. It's still [ __ ] boring. So like I am done with that too. I don't want that to just be my existence. I want to constantly be stressed and chasing things and this and that. Like.
and I don't know how to do like to get out of that. Like I just wish I could like punch through like if it was a wall like just like break out.
Yeah. You feel trapped in this. So what happens? So when somebody gives you that feeling of safety and recognition and and then what happens? You're saying it doesn't stick. What what's your understanding? What makes it not stick there?
I've thought about this a lot and I have like several theories and I actually really wanted to run them by you. One of my first theories is just fragmentation.
Okay. And since I'm not just like in one self state that's like a coherent thing that like I can't hold on to anything because every other day or so it's like I'm in a different like.
mindset or like self state. Like some days like a great example of this is like some days with my boyfriend I feel like very genuinely just warm towards him and another day I literally can't stand his presence. He's annoying. he's going to see this. He's going to be like, "What the fuck?" No, but like he already knows. He knows I I do that sometimes, but like it's like how the, you know, like totally different feeling about somebody the next day or like and it's like, okay, well, so if if it's like that, then maybe the reason that I can't like consistently hold on to stuff is because like that I I I need all of those pieces of me to like feel good and some of them are left behind. And then like another theory I have is just.
that that's only satisfying like some sliver of me and then there's another one that's neglected.
Yeah.
And I want to figure out what that neglected side of me wants but like at the same time nothing interests me. So like I don't know where to like you're sitting there and you're just like okay all these things bore me. Doing them feels like a chore. I'm just doing it to like look like I don't know like I'll post I I update my fans on every aspect of my life but like it's like that's the only reason. So if I just sit there with something and I'm like be interesting, be interesting. It's like there's a key that's missing and I don't know where it is and how to find it and like unlock that because I can't make myself be interested in these things to fulfill another side of me. I don't know why it's all so disconnected.
You feel like the answer has to come from others.
No, it probably comes from inside me, but I don't.
You think?
Yeah, probably because that seems to be a trend in the like past three years.
Uh.
yeah.
But I don't know what key that is or where it's hidden inside me. I don't know how to reach it.
Like you're looking for something that will kind of change things for you. Unlock it.
Unlock the cycle of of Yeah. Like the key to open that door and run and be free.
Mhm.
That is a beautiful image, man. I just imagine like being trapped in a little dark room and you you unlock and then you're just like out forever like running across the hills and like it's beautiful.
And that may be a hopeful image to have that there is something that could be unlocked and you could just be like a.
Yeah.
could be like you're not trapped anymore.
Yeah. But for now, you're left with all those really hard feelings and it's hard to sometimes understand what's that about.
Yeah.
Right. And so you're looking for more and more and more from others, but it doesn't stick.
Yeah. But when I look inside myself.
Yeah.
nothing calls to me saying, "Let's do this."
What do you see when you look inside yourself?
Um, I was going to like close my eyes and like actually like think. [ __ ] Um, honestly it differs sometimes. I think most of the time I see something missing and I don't know. I don't see nothing, but I do see that something's not right. I've always felt like something's not right in there. Like a little twisted.
What's not right?
It doesn't fit. Like like if you imagine like a jigsaw puzzle, like the pieces aren't fitting properly. It doesn't feel good.
Yeah. So that's a tough experience.
Yeah.
Yeah. So, how do you feel about our discussion today?
I think it was amazing. But like I I and I I didn't expect you I hoped that you'd present something to me that was just a the key, right?
You thought I'm going to give you an answer.
Yeah. But you didn't. But I I still I still felt I almost felt I don't know a bit seen maybe. I'm just like.
You're not sure about that? I think maybe they felt like you were understanding me at least a little cuz like well why is it so hard to just say like man like I feel like it's so hard for me to just say like yeah I felt understood. I don't know. I feel like I did a lot more than I'm used to and I appreciate that and like the questions you asked I really appreciate.
Okay.
And I do wonder if you have a key. I'm still wondering like if there's anything that you could tell me that like could like help me face this stuff.
You're really dedicated to that search.
Should I stop? I I feel like that's the vibe you're giving me is like, "Hey, you need to just like chill out." Like, stop searching.
You seem to think that I have an answer.
[ __ ]
What do I do then? What do I do?
Let's just face what's happening between two of us right now. that you feel like that there is an answer that I have about you after talking to you for an hour.
Okay. Do I have it then? Do I have an answer?
I think that's the journey that you are on that you're trying to figure out if there is that answer that fix and what is that answer you're looking for?
Oh man. Okay. But you but you have you seen people make it on their own journey?
Yes, I saw people making it.
Man, that's like everything. So maybe that's an answer that you can have too.
Yeah, that actually like.
sometimes you're losing hope that things can change.
Well, now I'm mad that they made it cuz I wanted to be the first. I'm like, get back in here. No, I want to be the first out.
Well, maybe that's a different way of being special.
I always had this vision that I'd be the one to figure it all out and then like guide people there and then Oh, man. But that's a different way of being special.
That's not being special because of the difficulties, but special because you figure something out.
Yeah. And then like how inspirational would it be to go guide other people then for me to be the one to do that like.
and you could be also very powerful.
Yeah. I think it would be incredible. I mean, I had a fan that has similar struggles that I do met me and like I gave her this thing to try and she did it and like I saw it changing her like before my eyes and I was like.
it was a good feeling.
When I was at the beginning of my career, a very wise man said that the struggles that we have are universal, but the solutions that we find are very unique to each one of us.
Damn. Okay, that's powerful as hell. So maybe it's time for me to leave you with that answer.
That's a good answer, though.
And we do have to stop for today.
You're amazing. Okay. I'm so happy right now. That was good.