Transcription
Hello and welcome to Sutthichai Live. For those who have listened to or read the latest interview with Elon Musk, an Exclusive Interview with the British magazine The Economist, you must be excited, startled, shocked, and aware. This is because many of Elon Musk's predictions suggest that humanity will truly be shocked. How will humanity survive? Elon Musk says that within the next 5 years, AI will be intelligent and smarter than the combined intelligence of all humans on Earth. It will be smarter than all of humanity combined in the next 5 years. He also predicts that humans will not be able to control AI if its evolution or development continues at this level. It is shocking. He also says that soon money will have no meaning. The era of abundance with AI will arrive. In the future, the world will depend on AI to the point where humans will have no rights or voice. Is he intentionally trying to shock the world, or does he truly believe this? It is something to think about. This interview took place on July 23rd at the Tesla Gigafactory in Texas. The interview lasted 90 minutes, between Elon Musk and Zanny Minton Bed, the Editor-in-Chief of The Economist. It was tense, very tense, because there was a rather fierce exchange. At one point, Elon Musk said, "I want to criticize you, the media, and your magazine. Your reporting and analysis are often not based on facts." The Editor-in-Chief of The Economist nodded and said, "I hear you." Elon Musk said, "Don't cut this out. Broadcast this. Turn to the producer." Elon Musk said this directly to the producer, "I want to criticize the media, and don't cut it out." The Editor-in-Chief of The Economist replied, "Of course, there will be no cuts." Therefore, it was an intellectually tense interview, a deep analytical piece. It is not just Elon Musk's predictions about the future, but an revelation of the mindset and thinking of the world's most influential billionaire, who is grappling with the contradiction between his role as a player in global politics and his position as a prophet of the technological age. And this is a big deal because SpaceX went public, its stock price soared, making Elon Musk, the largest shareholder of SpaceX, the first trillionaire. Then, in the past 2-3 weeks, the stock has fallen by more than half. This shows that what goes up fast, comes down fast. The reason is likely that people are not sure if what Elon Musk is presenting, or the revenue generation policies for SpaceX, can actually be achieved. But it is still interesting because Elon Musk has become a great figure in today's world of technology, a predictor of the future who is often overlooked. Many people say that what he has predicted is quite accurate, but most people don't listen to him because they think he boasts or exaggerates. But this time, in The Economist, he has caused quite a stir worldwide. First of all, Elon Musk confessed that he made a mistake by getting deeply involved in US politics when Trump won the election. In fact, Elon Musk helped Trump win the election by donating a huge amount of money and even appearing on stage to support Trump. When Trump became president for the second term, he even helped Trump establish a special unit for cost reduction, until he was heavily criticized for interfering in the work of various ministers, for pushing for debt reduction, and for stepping on the toes of many ministers. Finally, Trump had to let him go, saying that Elon couldn't stay, he was causing too many problems for the administration of various ministries and departments. Therefore, Elon Musk confessed, "I regret getting involved in politics. It's better that I withdrew." Listen to him speak with a rather somber tone as he confesses his mistake in entering the political arena.
"So the you know the goal with this stuff was to try to do something about the the deficit which is massive where the interest payments exceed the amount of money spent on the department of war like basically if you add all the money spent on um what is now the department of war and the and intelligence in the US that is smaller than the interest payments on the debt so that we we we need to sort of take a close look at spending um and make sure that money is being spent in sensible ways and that it is not wasted."
It is very shocking because it is evident that the interest payments the government has to make exceed the actual expenses. It would be a very big problem if the interest payments exceeded even the defense budget. Therefore, he said that something must be done about this; it cannot continue like this. This is an admission that he needs to criticize the government's apparent mismanagement, but he also admits that he regrets getting involved in politics and withdrawing to focus seriously on technology. However, Elon Musk also sends a warning that humanity is counting down to an era where AI will surpass human intelligence. This means it will be a genius, it will be intelligent, and it will be better than humans, not just better than one or two humans, not better than any group of humans, but better than all humans combined in 5 years, if things continue as they are. On one hand, Elon Musk sees many opportunities to create wealth with AI, but on the other hand, there are many risks. Human control will be lost because AI will become intelligent and will be able to control humanity.
Let's go back to why he said he regretted getting involved in politics. He said he bet $200 million to help Trump. And the agency called the Department of Government Efficiency, or DoGE, which is officially called increasing the efficiency of government administration. Simply put, he was given authority by Trump to help consider cost reductions, budget cuts, and downsizing organizations, which should be the responsibility of the ministries, departments, and the White House. But Trump appointed Elon, and Elon acted foolishly. He didn't have a ministerial position but attended cabinet meetings, stood up, spoke, and gave opinions until many ministers felt that Elon was stepping on their toes. Of course, Elon invested a lot in Trump. For the 2024 election, Elon Musk contributed over $290 million, including $239 million to the American PAC. In total, he spent no less than 10 billion baht to help Trump win the election, wanting to support Trump's return to the White House for a second term. And he did indeed enter an agency with the authority to cut budgets and reduce the size of various organizations. But after only a few months, he was sued by various ministers to Trump, saying that Elon was too disruptive. So Trump told Elon to step back. However, Trump and Elon are still in contact. Elon still supports Trump, but he is also willing to criticize that government debt is very high and there seems to be no way to reduce expenses. But when the interviewer, the Editor-in-Chief of The Economist, asked about technology, the real issue that led to criticism and speculation about the future. The words Elon Musk used were: AI is developing rapidly and becoming smarter. One day, humans will become like chimpanzees. Like chimpanzees, going back to the time when humans were apes. Humans will become only chimpanzees, no longer possessing the brains, initiative, or intelligence to manage this world. Elon Musk predicts the advancement of AI, saying it cannot be stopped. It cannot be stopped. He compares the difference between AI intelligence and human intelligence, saying it will be wider than the difference between humans and chimpanzees. Today, we believe humans are tens of times smarter than chimpanzees. Elon Musk says that in another 5 years, AI will be as intelligent as humans are to chimpanzees. Let's listen to a part of what Elon said.
"years outc abundance any here636 now of things couldil this like mass global thermonucle war something like that assuming that there's not world war 3 uh i think i think we headed for an age of amazing abundance so this is i guess a message optimism and excitement aboututure would exercise andity to for me to think i would be controlling super genous a that is vastly sm i think we can and"
One interesting aspect is that AI will be smarter than humans, and the gap between AI and human intelligence will be the same as the gap between human and chimpanzee intelligence. At the same time, he says it will usher in an era of abundance, where there will be more than enough of everything. Money will have no meaning. Humans will get whatever they want. But the big question Elon Musk poses is, how will AI control us? He says that at some point in the next 5 to 10 years, it will be difficult for humans to maintain control. This means humans will not be able to control the world. Elon Musk's prediction states that by 2031, in 5 years, AI will be more intelligent than the combined intelligence of all humans on Earth. Is that shocking? The combined intelligence of all humans on Earth will not be able to compete with AI. And then, by 2036, in 10 years, humanoid robots will be able to perform jobs voluntarily, meaning that work will become voluntary, like gardening, which people do for pleasure, not for survival. This means robots will replace humans, and humans can do whatever they choose, without having to work a regular job. They might do gardening, not have a regular profession, because humanoids or robots can do everything in their place. And we can do things for fun, garden, sing, play music, because we don't need to work for survival. This is Elon Musk's thinking. But there is a policy contradiction. Elon Musk proposes the concept of Universal Basic Income, meaning the government will give cash checks to citizens to solve unemployment. At the same time, Elon Musk predicts that currency will lose its importance, money will lose its importance because robots will produce more goods than demand. Oh, there will be no need for money anymore; there will be an abundance of goods. There will be no need to buy anything with money. That, of course, we cannot imagine. We cannot imagine reaching a point where we don't have to work, where robots will do all our work, and we will have free time to do whatever we want for fun all day, and have all the food and supplies. We don't need money because it will be given to us for free. And Elon Musk says that at that point, the government should send checks to citizens for free, because the government can generate enormous revenue by using AI and robots. But this is only one side of Elon Musk's thinking. Many economists would argue with Elon Musk, saying, "Hey, you're only thinking of one side. You need to think about other aspects related to human economics. How can humans not do anything? And who determines the production of humanoids? Humans, right? Humans have to tell them what humans want." This can certainly be debated. I remember Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg of Meta (Facebook) debated this. Mark Zuckerberg said it's very dangerous, we shouldn't develop AI further because it's dangerous and will control humans. But Elon Musk insists that we must continue to develop it because it is the inevitable future. So, today, this debate continues, but AI is developing so rapidly, reaching a point where it is quite difficult to control. Therefore, if at some point Elon Musk says money will have no meaning because robots will produce more goods than demand, what will happen? This is in another 10 years. This is a big deal. So, will it be a new economy under Elon Musk's predictions? Because he believes the world will face deflation due to production efficiency increasing faster than the money supply. He is not an economist, so many economists will argue with what he says, saying, "You don't understand demand, supply, and production." But of course, if AI is that intelligent, then old economic principles may no longer apply. This is truly a new world order that we cannot yet see. At the same time, what Elon Musk is thinking about the future, in this 90-minute interview, he talks about many things, including safety and what is called the end of the universe. He predicts that one day, in the future, the universe will end, the apocalypse of the universe. So, for now, enjoy life because one day the universe will cease to exist. Elon Musk stands by his view of doom. Doom means that one day the universe will end. There is a 10-20% chance that AI will destroy humanity. Even 10-20% is shocking, isn't it? He says AI can destroy humanity because it is becoming smarter, it has no morals, it has no governance. If it becomes intelligent and thinks for itself, it might say, "Humans are in the way. Humans shouldn't be on this planet. Let's destroy them all." Is there a chance? Elon Musk says there is a 10-20% chance. It might not be high, but even 10% should shock us that AI can destroy humanity. But the interesting thing in this interview with Elon Musk is the philosophical adjustment of his thinking. From previously trying to stop AI development, he now says, "Just enjoy the ride." Enjoy the journey because soon the universe will cease to exist. The end of the universe from cold. He says the world will become very cold. He says the world is hot now, it will all become hot, then it will suddenly become cold until it ceases to exist. This is the end of all things, and the end of all things is death. Oh, this is Buddhist philosophy combined with Elon Musk, going very far. Therefore, the process is important, the process along the way. The proposal for a review system that Elon Musk talks about, how to prevent AI from destroying humanity. Elon Musk's proposal is peer review, mutual review to control risks before reaching a crisis point. Elon Musk therefore proposes a plan for Google DeepMind and Anthropic, which are two giant companies fully developing AI. DeepMind, Google, and Anthropic, these two giant companies should at least make an agreement to review each other's safety. This means the giants should join hands and agree to review each other for transparency. This means before releasing a model to the public, the two giant companies, one or two weeks in advance, will allow the other company, which may be a competitor, to review it for fairness and transparency. Elon Musk says he still trusts the Anthropic team because they have a "evil detector" in Anthropic, a company that makes advanced AI. He says they have a system to detect evil. This is mutual review. There is a question about Starlink and its position in international politics. This is a position that overlaps and is a statement from Elon Musk that is quite strong. In terms of geopolitics, Musk has been heavily criticized for his stance of appeasing Russia in the Ukraine war. Although Starlink is the backbone of communication for the Ukrainian army, it still seems that Elon Musk sides with Russia. Elon Musk proposes that there must be peace, but it must be pragmatic peace. He proposes pragmatic peace based on reality, asking Ukraine to accept territorial loss to stop the loss of life. Elon Musk's approach is similar to Trump's: to pressure Zelensky of Ukraine to cede some territory to Russia to end the war. He also criticizes diplomats who eat 7-course meals while people are dying on the front lines. He says, "Hey, these negotiators are not taking any risks, but soldiers are dying on the front lines, and these critics and diplomats are sitting and eating 7-course meals." Regarding accusations, Elon Musk has been accused by his detractors of being far-right, extreme right-wing, and even racist. Elon Musk responded fiercely. Elon Musk said his partner is of Indian descent. Elon Musk's partner is Indian, and their child is named after a great Indian physicist, S.N. Bose, to prove he is not racist. He said his partner is Indian, and their child is named after an Indian physicist. Therefore, he is not a racist as accused. Elon Musk also predicts that Britain will experience a civil war within 20 years due to immigration problems and clashes between vastly different cultures. Musk views China as becoming a leader in AI due to its advantages in electricity and robot production, which are many times superior to America's. Musk admits China is already leading, just like Jensen Huang, who sees it similarly, that China is about to overtake.
"leaders and at some point they probably will have a lot of compute they will be the leaders"
This means China has more computers than America.
"So it's possible that this is the future at some point that China electricity and AI chips. Um, and then for physical AI the robots, uh, China's also got some very good robot companies. China is very strong on robots, very strong on digital AI and and if you look at electricity production say AI is a function of whatever the limiting factor is if"
At the end of the interview, Elon Musk said what his ultimate goal in life is: Mars. He wants to go to Mars. And orbital data centers. To be in space, to be in space. Data centers in space. No need to be on land, consuming a lot of electricity, consuming a lot of water, making noise, and causing environmental problems. And there needs to be a simulated world. So Musk's vision for 2026, this year, is not just on Earth. He is looking at SpaceX and AI creating Orbital Data Centers. Data centers in orbit, revolving around the Earth. It's not just about being advanced, but a necessity, because of the ultimate limits of energy and cooling on Earth. Data centers generate a lot of heat, use a lot of electricity, and cannot be supported on Earth. In 2028, in 2 more years, to Mars. Elon Musk remains committed to sending humans to Mars, expanding his scope. He uses the word "consciousness." This term is not related to space; it's a psychological term, a spiritual term. He says going to Mars is expanding the scope of consciousness. At the same time, there is the theory of simulation theory. At the end of the interview, he says it's a path that requires a simulated world, a virtual reality. He says his life seems too real, too absurd. His life is too real, always dreaming, so much so that he believes we might be living in a simulated world created by other, more intelligent beings. This means he sees a chance of a simulated world created by other beings, not humans, with greater intelligence. Therefore, in the eyes of what we have heard in this interview, which is interesting. For me, it is a deep dive into Elon Musk's thoughts. Whether you agree or disagree is another matter, but it is a reflection of this man who is trying to maintain a balance between wealth at the end of the tunnel, meaning in the future he says the world will have immense wealth, but at the same time, there is a risk of human extinction. And he regrets his wrong decision to get involved in politics. But it is clear that his Classical Liberal worldview, which emphasizes secure borders, safe cities, and reasonable budgets, is what protects human civilization. Human civilization will survive the threat of increasingly intelligent AI. It depends on humans having secure borders, safe cities, and reasonable budgets. And finally, it reaches the point of Singularity, the ultimate point where humans can create change. The final state for humans is Singularity. The key question left is not whether AI will be smarter than us, but the day humans become mere chimpanzees or lab dogs, pets of super AI. Is that shocking? But of course, what Elon Musk says is likely intended to create shock among humanity so that they will rise up to solve problems, prevent problems, prevent the extinction of humanity before it actually happens. Thank you all for following. What Elon Musk says and does, you don't have to agree, but it's interesting to consider how he thinks, what information and reasons he has. Thank you all for following. Goodbye.