Orthodox Loses His Cool: Scripture or Church Fathers?

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Hey, thank you for that. We're going to now get into your questions. If you have any questions you want to ask, pop them in the chat. Uh we're going to do a question time right now. We'll do some Bible trivia, some gospel chats, even viewer chats where you can call in, ask any questions, even debate or whatever it is you want to ask or talk about. That'll be coming up later on, including a Kahoot game at the end. But let's get straight into the questions that you've already put into the chat.

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All right, let's get into it. First question from Nicholas. I watched a guy that you debated before whose name's Noah on a YouTube short and he basically implied if you're not Catholic, you aren't saved. Why do people put any church above the blood of Jesus? Wow. Okay. Yeah, I'm not sure if I've seen that short, but that is historic Catholic teaching. Let me show you this. This is Pope Bonafice Unim Sanctum giving an infallible uh dogma here. Consequently, it says, quote, consequently we declare, state, define, and pronounce. Notice how this is like four different things. This is like the criteria they use to determine whether something's like defined infallibly. If it's like we declare, we state, we define, we pronounce, like that's really like kind of making it a supposed infallible statement. So uh we pronounce that it is altogether necessary to salvation for every creature to be subject to the Roman pontiff. O, the Roman pontiff being the pope, it's talking about here. Wow. Now, there's nothing in scripture, nothing in the Bible that ever says anything about a Roman pontiff, nor about having to be subject to him for our salvation. Notice, necessary to salvation. The Catholic Church makes so many things necessary for salvation and therefore goes clearly against scripture when it says that it's only by grace through faith that we're saved, not based on anything we do. And so when they say subject to Rome pontiff, it means including having to agree with any of his papal pronouncements that he defines infallibly, things like that. And that's not scriptural.

Now, the problem you have though with the Catholic Church is that you got a statement like that which is an infallible statement which it cannot be reformed because papal infallible statements can't be changed or reformed later on. And yet look at Vatican 2. Vatican 2 says, "Those also can attain to everlasting salvation, who through no fault of their own, do not know the gospel of Christ or his church, yet sincerely seek God and moved by grace strive by their deeds to do his will as it is known to them through the dictates of conscience, those too may achieve eternal salvation." Wow. There you go. So this supposed unchanging church has now got a direct contradiction in their teaching. They say no one can be saved unless you're subject to the Roman pontiff. And now they're saying, look, if you just don't even know about God or the church, if you just like basically be a good person, do some good deeds, then you too can achieve eternal salvation. Yeah, that's contradictory and also another unbiblical statement. Both statements I brought up were unbiblical. No one can attain salvation by their deeds.

Now, people's consciences on judgment day are going to accuse them of sin. Here is what Romans 2:14 and 15 talks about here. For when Gentiles who do not have the law by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves. Even though they do not have the law, they show that the law of the they show that the work of the law is written on their hearts while their conscience also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them. So on judgment day, we see people's consciences are going to be like, even if they didn't come in contact with the Bible, we'll still know I've done things I shouldn't have done. And on that basis alone, that's already enough for them to deserve the wrath of God. So yeah, I think Catholicism largely is a big contradiction. They have some some statements that say this, some other statements say the opposite. Which one are you going to believe? Yeah. And so some people side with that and also some people side more on the ecumenical side and they say, "Look, you can be a Muslim and you're still saved. You can be atheist, still say." And because you can find statements that support exclusivity of their church, but then also statements that talk about that's not really exclusive. Yeah.

Um, NJZ, are you going to have a discussion with Trent Horn? I vaguely remember hearing something about that. We were going to. He's now postponed it twice and he and it's like he hasn't put in he hasn't specified a new date. Uh, I think he's trying to really back out of it. Um, cuz his whole purpose was he was trying to put me in a trap in the conversation cuz he wanted to ask me about how to go to heaven. And I'm like, "Yeah, I will talk to you about that." But I think he maybe he's like, "Yeah, I don't want to get the biblical gospel out there to people." I don't know. But we'll see. Maybe it will happen in the future. Um, I'm praying for him. Praying that God saves him, that he may put his trust in Christ alone, no longer in any of his cooperation in order to attain his eternal life, but just in Christ alone. And we'll see if if a conversation happens in the future about that.

All right, next one from Byron's. Who told you that St. Matthew wrote the Gospel of Matthew? You can only use the Bible. Um, I assume I wonder if your question is coming from, hey, if you hold to sola scriptura, which means scripture alone, how can you know that Matthew wrote Matthew? But let me just make clear, sola scriptura doesn't mean you can't rely on stuff outside the Bible. Think of the Greek language itself. The Bible doesn't contain a grammar. What do words mean in Greek and Hebrew? The Bible doesn't tell us necessarily the definitions. And so you can go to external writings to figure out how Greek works. So sola scriptura does not mean you can't look at other writings. And that can you know that because other writings can help inform even our interpretation of the Bible, such as knowing the historical background, what's happening in the first century, what's happening in history with the Romans, with the Greeks, with the Meo-Persians, like that's helpful in even in biblical interpretation with certain parts of the Bible. But that's that's not against sola scripture. Sola scripture simply means that scripture is the only infallible rule of faith. It's the only thing that's infallible, that has no errors, cannot make mistakes. And so therefore, we check everything with the Bible.

Yo, now in terms of how we know Matthew wrote Matthew, there's a couple of indicators. First, you got internal evidence based on the other uh yeah, there's some internal indicators of who wrote some of the books. Now, it's not as clear as say like Paul's writings where he says Paul an apostle and then like he says like he wrote it. But there are some things like John, for example, saying like the one whom Jesus loved, and you can deduce it from, okay, it's not Thomas, it's not it's not Matthew, it's not because you can see those other people are mentioned in the rest of the letter and you you're left with John basically. Um, and you can do similar things with Matthew. But I think the big a huge way of how we know Matthew wrote Matthew is the manuscripts themselves. The manuscripts that we've discovered of the book of Matthew have as their titles the Gospel of Matthew. So that's a massive indicator that Matthew wrote that. That's what the manuscript evidence it says itself has. And then out and then you can also go to outside sources as well from from early Christians to see uh their writings about the book of Matthew and they also affirm that same truth. So there's not really any dispute on who wrote the Gospels. It's very clear. This is like more of a Muslim argument when they try and bring up these sort of things.

All right, next one. Any difference in weight of the words of Jesus, the so-called red letters, and the rest of scripture? Some people live or read the scriptures as though I live by the red letters, not the black ones, just the red ones. That's not good. That's not good thinking. Yes, we affirm that Christ said those words and we should live by every word that proceeds in the mouth of God. But what's come from the mouth of God is not just the things that came out of the mouth of Jesus, but it's the entirety of sacred scripture. All of scripture is God-breathed, not just the red-letter parts. So some people say, look, okay, yeah, you know, you rely on what the apostles say so much. Why not just rely on the words of Jesus? Well, because Jesus affirmed the apostles as being mouthpieces of revelation, right? We see like particularly Muslims and some works-based salvationists hate Paul. They really hate Paul. And so sometimes you'll have some professing Christians who like say they don't believe Paul's writings at all. Problem is, you've now got to get rid of like pretty much most of the New Testament. Then not only because Paul wrote 13 books out of the 27 that are there, but also because you have Peter affirming Paul's writings as scripture in 2 Peter 3:15 and 16. So you got to get rid of Peter's writings then. But then Luke also affirms the conversion account of Paul and affirms him as an apostle. And so you'd have to get rid of Acts. You'd also have to get rid of Luke, cuz Luke wrote both letters. Um, and so then you know that you're getting rid of pretty much most of the books of the Bible. And what are you left with? You know what I mean? Yeah. Uh, so basically the point is, no, the words of Jesus in the Bible are not more authoritative than say a letter of Paul. Both are equally as authoritative because both are the word of God. And let me show you a verse that would prove that. 1 Corinthians 14:37. Paul says this. If anyone thinks that he is a prophet or spiritual, he should acknowledge that the things I am writing to you are a command of the Lord. Paul is not saying this is just my personal opinion, but it doesn't really matter. No, he's saying what I'm writing to you are a command of the Lord. So therefore, if someone is to disregard or disobey even anything that Paul wrote in his letters, they are sinning against God because he's writing as an inspired apostle.

All right, next one. Matty's asked, "Why does the Father satisfying his justice on Jesus and raising him from the dead feel like it's less Jesus' work?" Romans 4:24-25 clears it a little, but I wanted to hear your side. So, Romans 4:24-25 just talks about how he was delivered up for our trespasses and raised for our justification. But the first part of your question is, why does the Father satisfying his justice on Jesus raising him from the dead feel like it's less Jesus' work? Okay. Well, let me make clear. Yes, the Father raised Jesus from the dead, but Jesus also raised himself from the dead. Remember, we see in John's gospel, Jesus says, "Destroy this temple." This is a good argument for JWS, by the way, if you're going to speak to them. Let's bring it up. John chapter 2:19. They've asked the question, "What sign do you show us for doing these things? You just cleansed the temple." Jesus answered them, "Destroy this temple, and in 3 days I will raise it up." The Jews said, "It has taken 46 years to build this temple, and will you raise it up in 3 days?" But he was speaking about the temple of his body. So not the physical stony temple that's there, which by the way, again, is this another example of Jesus speaking in figure of speech, metaphor. All right. So many people like, this is my body, so it must literally be his body. Okay. Destroy this temple and in 3 days I'll raise it up. The unbelieving Jews, unbelieving Jews thought he's talking about the physical temple. They were taking his words literally. See that problem there with you can't just necessarily take his words literally, you got to see is he giving a figure of speech? Is he? Because throughout his throughout his ministry, he does, you know, think about when, um, "I am the bread of life." Is he literally that? "I am the true vine." "I am the door." All these different things. Or even when he spoke to the woman at the well, the water I give you'll never be thirsty again. Oh, can I have that water? She's thinking literally. Stop thinking literally. It's not about actually having some water. And you not you still will be thirsty physically. Ah, it must be something else. Spiritually, being satisfied, having our thirst, spiritual quench, our spiritual thirst quenched is what Jesus is talking about. But anyway, so he's talking about his body here. Look who he says is going to raise up his body. "I will raise it up." Jesus says, "I will raise it up." So yes, we can agree that the Father raised Jesus from the dead. He was involved. We can also agree that the Holy Spirit was involved. How do we know? Have a look. Talking about Jesus, how he was declared to be the Son of God in power according to the Spirit of holiness by his resurrection from the dead, Jesus Christ our Lord. Um, through whom we've received grace and apostleship. Yeah. And so we see here declared to be Son of God according to the Spirit of holiness by his resurrection from the dead. And so we see that the Holy Spirit's involved. We see that Jesus says that he's raising himself back up from the dead. So all three persons are involved in the resurrection. It's not just the Father involved. Similarly, would be with the cross. It's not like the Holy Spirit's missing in action or something like that. He's around. The the Father is there, the Son is there. All three persons are involved. But yes, it was the Son, God the Son who was bearing the Father's wrath upon himself. And so it's not it's not just the Father acting here. Yes, the Father is pouring out his wrath, but it's the Son who's receiving it, bearing it on our behalf.

All right, next one. Do you know about the Ethiopian Orthodox Church? Yes. So the Oriental or or Ethiopian Orthodox Church, they unfortunately reject the biblical gospel as well. They hold on to a form of salvation by faith plus works. They think baptism is a requirement for salvation, which would deny the gospel of grace. They also have unbiblical views of Mary, thinking it's okay to pray to Mary and all those sort of things. And so notice that all these different branches, you got Eastern Orthodoxy, Oriental Orthodoxy, which includes, you know, the Ethiopian, a Coptic, all those sort of people, uh, Catholic, just different branches like that. They all seem to have the same problem, adding works on as a requirement to get saved or stay saved. Compared to the biblical gospel, grace alone, faith alone, Christ alone, not of works, so no one can boast. And that you can't even lose your salvation. That's a really important point because if you think you can lose it by future sin, you don't think you currently have it purely by grace, but you think you might have it based on obedience.

Next one. Hey, I used to be happy when I hear, oh, this man believes Jesus, etc. But now, even when I hear it, I can't be happy, but worry whether he believes in a works-based gospel. Is this normal? Hey, that's that's not necessarily bad. Like, yes, we can rejoice when somebody truly does come to understand the gospel. But just because someone claims to be a Christian, that's not in and of itself a reason to rejoice if you haven't checked or someone hasn't checked with them about the gospel. Right? If someone just comes along and says, "Oh yeah, I was I'm Christian." And then like, you don't haven't done any checking questions with them, don't presume that they are. Don't presume that they are. We've seen that, haven't we? How many times we connect to people on Yumingle on those chat platforms where they they oh yeah, I'm a Christian, I grow, I go to church, I grew up Christian, things like that. Almost all of them don't know the gospel. Almost all of them don't know the gospel. It's rare that you encounter someone who does. Jesus says that will those who are saved be few? He was asked and he says, "Enter through the narrow door." But let this encourage you then to go and share the gospel or check with the person. Go check with them. Hey, can I ask you for a reason for the hope that's in you? What is the reason for the hope that's in you? Oh, you're a Christian? Great. You could even ask them, um, what is, yeah. Well, you could ask them their kind of their testimony. That might get you into it. You can say, "Oh, great. So, when did you become a Christian?" Yeah. And they might tell you when and so on. And then you can say, "All right, so yeah, what what would you tell God if God asked you why I shall let you into heaven?" Something like that. And it gets to the heart of what their trust is in.

All right, next one. What's your favorite book of the Bible? Bible 10 has asked me. I love Romans. I think there's so many good books in the Bible. It's hard to say like my favorite, but if I had to pick only one, I'd probably say Romans just because of how clear it is in the gospel, God's sovereignty, and then also Christian living all throughout that. What do you think about the Pope going to a mosque? Was that true? Yeah, he just did recently did that in Algeria. I put up on the stream on the uh I showed you a screenshot the other day of one of his tweets where he says, "We got the communion between Catholics. I mean, the communion between Muslims and Christians is all under the mantle of Mary." Come on. Under the mantle of Mary. Like it's always got to go with Catholics, it's always got to be back to Mary. Mary's their singular focus rather than Christ. Um, yeah, it's often even when you go to like the Philippines, places like that, they have more statues of Mary than they even do of Jesus. And uh go to the shrines that they have in their own houses, massive statues of Mary there. But yes, uh, I did see that and I think I wonder if that's part of the ecumenical movement where they want to say that Muslims worship the same God as Christians do, and that's just not the case. They reject Jesus as God. So therefore, they don't believe in the same God that we do.

We've answered that one about is did Paul hijack Christianity? I've answered that just before in terms of the answers no because he's affirmed by the other apostles. He's affirmed by Christ himself. So there's no hijacking. Paul didn't hijack Christianity. He's just a mouthpiece of revelation that Jesus has appointed in Acts chapter 9. And Paul's writings do really help us have a richer understanding of Christianity. But his teachings are definitely not contradictory. Paul does affirm faith alone time and time again. Romans 4:5. To the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness. But so does Christ. Uh, and this is in Acts. So, John 4, John 6:47. Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life. So, this is the same teaching. Believing is how you have eternal life according to Christ. And that's what Paul taught.

I was, I was, Beck made an interesting comment last night to me when she's saying we're listening to some some sort of discussion someone was having on, um, on baptism and she made an interesting point. If baptism because some we're listening to someone who was trying to teach baptism is required for salvation, which is obviously false, but if baptism was a requirement for salvation, why do you have Jesus never telling or giving a command to get baptized? Have you noticed that there's not a single command from Christ given to people, go get baptized? Now, baptism is something we should do, and you can say there's an implication in the Great Commission, but the command of the Great Commission is not to the one getting baptized. In the Great Commission, it's given to the Christian, it's given to the person to go make disciples and then to baptize those disciples you have. But there's actually no command given by Christ himself to go and get baptized. None. And so if this was like some sort of, like we talked to the Lutheran yesterday, he's like, baptism is how you get regenerated. Why does the why does Jesus never speak about that? If that was the case, why does he never speak about that being required for salvation? Never once. And no, born of water does not refer to baptism. There's nothing in the context that indicates that. That's kind of telling, isn't it? You see, these people think that the Bible is just so replete on saying baptism, you got to get baptized to be saved. Okay? Give me one time when Jesus even commanded baptism. When he told a person, "Go get baptized." Not once. Not even once. And where does he ever make it a requirement for salvation? No, not once. Yeah, it was a good chat with that Lutheran. And Jamie says, "Hopefully he changes his mind." Yeah, that's what I'm hoping as well. I think he, there was a lot of things in that chat. He's like, "Oh, I don't know what to say to that. I got to do more research." Um, so which surprised me a bit because if you want to hold on to that Lutheran position of baptism being a requirement for salvation, you'd expect that you've kind of dealt with all these different texts that were brought up. But often they hold to these perspectives because Luther said this, this person said that, which is almost as bad as, well, the Pope said it, so I got to believe it. Luther said it, so I got to believe it. No, you don't. Just go to the Bible. Jesus never teaches baptism being a requirement. Neither does Paul. Neither do the other apostles.

All right, next one. Any tips for remembering scripture or parables? Yes, repetition is definitely a key. Spaced repetition. So, you don't just say, "Okay, I'll spend some time uh learning something or revising something today and then, oh, maybe in 3 weeks time I'll revise it." No, you forget it between now and 3 weeks. You got to do it every day. And then as you're getting it more into your longer-term memory, it now doesn't have to be every day. It may be like every couple days and then every week, right? For the stuff that's more in your longer-term memory, but the stuff that's still fresh, every day, revise it. Otherwise, you'll forget it. Um, I would encourage if remembering if you're trying to remember a verse, always aim to remember the the reference to it as well. That'll be helpful for recall and just practical use. you can be like, "Oh, it says here in John 14:6, you know, He's the way, the truth, and the life." That's helpful rather than saying, "I know Jesus said this somewhere." But then you're like, "I don't know where it is." It's good to have the reference on hand as well. But I've made a very helpful app for this. It's free. It's on our website, needgod.net. And what you can do, let me show you guys. Maybe I haven't shown you some of you guys this says. Uh, sorry. Me share this again. All right, here we go. So, this is the Bible trivia. No, this is not Bible trivia. This is the Bible verse quiz. See this? And there's some new features. There's a new learn mode which will help you memorize verses. Okay. So, learn modes down here. Press that. And let's say you wanted to memorize. I'll pick Psalm one. All right. Let's say you wanted to learn Psalm 1, for example. You pick the reference here. Psalm one. There's only six verses. Okay. Let's do it. >> Psalm one. Blessed is the man who walks not in the counsel of the wicked, >> nor stands in the way of sinners, >> nor sits in the seat of scoffers. >> It's the accent that's putting her off. That's funny. Sorry. But so it reads it out to you and you say, "Okay, you ready to learn it?" And now it's going to break it up into different sections. Okay? So it's going to be you're going to now learn the first section of it. Blessed is the man who walks not. Okay? Blessed is the man who walks not. Now, it hides some of the words. You press X, it hides some of the words. Blessed is the man who walks not. Blessed is the man who walks not. Now, if you're not sure, like, what was that word again? You can actually press on it. Man. Okay. To show it or hide it again. See that? Okay. Blessed is the man who walks not. Blessed is the man who walks not. Now, I'd ask you some questions on it. What is the third word? Blessed is the. It's the word 'the'. What word in this part appears after blessed? Uh, blessed is. Okay. What word in this part appears before the word who? Blessed is the man who. So, it'd be man. Okay. This is helpful, isn't it? Is this getting it into your brain? Now, it's just fully blanks. Okay. Blessed is the man who walks not. And then, yeah, I got it right. And then it'll give you the next phrase and things like that. Uh, you can if you want to like learn a bit more than just that small phrase, you can press combine with next phrase and it adds a next phrase and you're learning that entire section there. And then once you've done the whole thing, um, it'll and you do maybe the next verse and then the next verse. It'll allow you to keep reviewing it, going over it either in order or in random order. So this is really helpful. Uh, I would encourage you guys if you want to learn some scripture, this is a really helpful way of doing it. So this is simply on our website. It's all free. You can install it as an app even. So if you go to this on your phone, it'll come up at the top saying install as an app or if it doesn't, you can go press the settings button and there's an install app to home screen button there if you do it on your phone. Yeah. So I just want to share that with you guys. Uh, that is a really good way of uh learning verses and revising verses because there's the learn mode, but then there's also the quiz mode. Then you quiz yourself on the stuff you've already learned. I do that every day, by the way. That's how I um retain a lot of the verses that I've memorized. I quiz myself on a small selection of them every day. And you can do that with testing yourself on all the history that you have of the verses that you've learned or quizzed yourself on. So, it's all on that app. It's all free. Definitely install it. Um, you'll love it. Do all audios have the same accent? I think I know what I'm going to do today. Well, there's two different. You can have a there's a male voice and a female voice. So, that one was Kristen Getty. You might have heard she's like does some songs and stuff like that. Um, that's the female voice, but there's also a male voice who doesn't have the Irish accent. It's the Aussie accent, but I know the American accent. But, um, yeah, there's just change in the settings if you want. But Nick says, um, why are some words different colors? Did I miss that? Well, it's just to make some words stand out. Some of the bigger words are in different colors to just make it stand out, just visually can help you to retain those words. And Josh says the music is also very helpful. Yeah, it's true. Like we got one on someone. So you could listen to someone with the music and then even use that as well and it'll help you to memorize it. It's good. Uh, yes. So, thanks Harm's put the put the link. That's the direct link to it to that quiz I just showed you, which is different to the Bible trivia quiz. By the way, you can install both of them as separate apps on your phone. You should. I've got them on my home screen. You don't install through the app store, but through the website. Okay.

Next, Jacob says, "What would you say about the Jesus birth contention in Matthew and Luke where there is an apparent 10-year gap between them?" I'm not actually sure what you're referring to. So, the Jesus birth contention in Matthew and Luke H. Okay. I'm just trying to think what you were asking about. So you're maybe talking about who was reigning at the time. I assume that's what you're asking about. So you got Herod the Great reigning in Matthew's gospel, but then in Luke's gospel, Luke's very detailed of who's reigning. He's mentions that it's Quirinius who's the governor of Syria at that time. And Quirinius governed about 6 AD. Six. Yeah, around about 6 AD. But then Herod the Great died about 4 BC apparently. That's what history shows us. So then what's that mean? Is that a contradiction? Well, I think the key to explaining this, you know, because how could they both be reigning at the same time if one died 4 BC and the other, you know, was after in the ADs? I think Luke 2:2 is the key. "This was the first registration." So remember how it says the whole world had to be registered, the census. This was the first registration when Quirinius was governor of Syria. So I think we have Quirinius reigning or governing twice. You have the more well-known census that happened in about 6 AD, but then there was an earlier census registration that is the time when Mary and Joseph had to go to Bethlehem. So I don't think there's any contradiction there. Okay, good question. Uh, next one.

Okay, this one. When it comes to good works, how much of it is God and how much of it is ourselves? Also, what about working and occupation in the same respect? Okay. I think with good works, good works are prepared in advance by God for us to walk in. So, that's Ephesians 2:10. And so, don't praise yourself when you do good works. Praise God. Thank you, God, that you allowed me to do this. This is not me. It's it's you who's allowed me to do that. But it's still you doing the work in a sense as well. You know, you don't just sit passively by and as if, okay, if God wanted me to do good works, he'll make me do good works. No, you are to pursue good works. We are to stir one another up to love and good works. That's what Hebrews 10:24 says. And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works. So yeah, you know, when you got like Jamie in the chat and other people in the chat saying, "Get into your Bible." He's stirring you up not for trouble, stirring you up for good works, right? When we when people we encourage you to evangelize, we encourage you to join training, we encourage people to, you know, say no Bible, no breakfast, those sort of things. We are encouraging people, stirring them up to love and good works. Now, it is interesting in Romans 15, Paul says, "In Christ Jesus then I have reason to be proud of my work for God." Right? So Paul had reason to be proud of all the things that he was doing for God. And yet he then says, on the back of that, "For I will not venture to speak of anything except what Christ has accomplished through me." So all good works are what God is accomplishing, but he's still doing it through you as the means, which is why God can even reward you in heaven for those good works. Now, even after everything you do, remember this in Luke's gospel, even after everything you do, you've spent 50 years, 70 years, whatever, 20 years serving Christ. Jesus says that we should still call ourselves unworthy servants. There it is. Luke 17:7. Will any one of you who has a servant plowing or keeping sheep say to him when he has come in from the field, "Come at once and recline at table"? Will he not rather say to him, "Prepare supper for me and dress properly and serve me while I eat and drink, and afterward you will eat and drink"? Does he thank the servant because he did what was commanded? And the answer implied is no. He doesn't even thank him. So you also when you have done all that you were commanded say, "We are unworthy servants. We have only done what was our duty." So even after spending years upon years, decades upon decades serving Christ, have this humble attitude of I'm still an unworthy servant. I didn't even have I didn't even deserve the privilege of serving Jesus. I just did what was my duty, whatever he wanted. I didn't even go above and beyond. So even any amount of good deed you did, gave up your body to be burned, whatever it is, gave away all you had, none of that went above and beyond what God expected of you anyway. So clearly your good deeds can't play a part in your entry to heaven. But God can still reward you for those good works if you did them rightly with good motives and all those sort of things. And God will test our works. First Corinthians chapter 3 talks about that. If our works stand test, they remain after the the judgment, we will receive a reward. Now, I think this is a great humble attitude because you have John the Baptist, for example, when he talks about Christ, his attitude is one of great humility, right? He says, "One who comes after me ranks before me because he was before me." He even says, "I'm not even worthy to untie his sandals." Now, the job of untying sandals was often done by slaves. Slaves or servants to a master. It's considered like a very low, very low job. You know, you have to get touch somebody's sweaty and dirty feet, right? But in Mark 1:7, this is what John said. "After me comes he who is mightier than I. The strap of whose sandals I am not worthy to stoop down and and untie." That is a beautiful attitude. He's not even worthy, he says, to untie the sandal strap of Jesus Christ. Let's have that sort of attitude. Jesus, you want me to be your witness? You want me to tell people about you? I'm not even worthy of that. You want me to serve you in whatever capacity. I'm not worthy. But thank you, Jesus. Yes. Let's have that sort of attitude where we willfully, humbly go and serve Christ, knowing what a privilege it is. He could have given the job of proclaiming the gospel to the world to the angels, but he gave it to us. And so, we have this treasure in jars of clay. Let's go proclaim that message to this lost and dying world. Get some tracts, gospel tracks. Lead them places. Put them in, you know, you can put them on a park bench somewhere. Someone can pick it up and read it. I've heard stories of people finding some of our tracks in different places and they get saved from that. You never know. So easy. Just when you someone serves you at the at the, um, the fuel station. Thanks so much. Here's something to read when you get a chance. Right. So you didn't even necessarily have to have a conversation with them, you know, because that may take 20 minutes, half an hour, don't have time, they don't have time to talk to you, but you can leave them with something which they could read later on and God could save people through that. And you can get some of those tracks, by the way, at our website. They're free there. Okay. Uh, next one.

Josh has asked, "Do Catholics really believe that the Godhead actually comes down and bathes them since they consider it's not their own work, but God's?" Yeah, this is the same as the Lutheran chat I had yesterday. Oh, look, it's not our works, it's God's work. Okay, well, is God getting baptized? No, no, I'm getting baptized. Okay, so then it sounds like it's not just God's work. Sure, we can affirm God's doing stuff. We're not denying that. But how can you say it's not also your work in any sense? In any sense. Right? It's clearly both. Even with the Lutheran, I asked yesterday, I said, "Is it an act of disobedience if a Christian doesn't get baptized?" And he said, "Yes." So, is it an act of obedience if he does get baptized? The answer is yes. So therefore, if you make the an act of obedience be the basis of your acceptance before God, then therefore you're trusting in your works yourself rather than the finished work of Christ.

Next, uh, this one. Hey Ryan, what are your thoughts about a pastor who humiliates a member on a live church service because of a misunderstanding? Shouting, humiliating, and threatening. Huh, that seems very strange that a person would do that. That wouldn't be good. Maybe what you'd do is I'm not I'm not sure the context here. So like without further details, I can't really full speak on this. I'm just more speaking generally rather than your specific scenario here because obviously there is time for church discipline which maybe this is what I was talking about like they've gone through the all the steps and they're up to the last step where they're telling it to the church. But shouting, yeah, threatening like that sort of stuff is weird, that's not right. Yeah, so it just depends what the context is going on here. But if there is a misunderstanding, if there is something which you're like, pastor shouldn't have done, go talk to him. Go have a conversation. Don't write a threatening email to him. Emails are very impersonal. Go speak to him face to face. At least voice over the phone maybe, but not by text. Text someone cannot understand the tone of your voice. They may think that you're angry with them and that may not be what your intention is whatsoever.

Uh, Eric's asked, "Hey, Ryan, is making a decision such as choosing to put your faith and trust in Jesus a work?" No. To the one who does not work, but believes. Romans 4:5. Believing and works opposite to each other. Now, believing leads to works, but they're still opposite. Romans 11:6. If it's by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works. Otherwise, grace would no longer be grace. So if God wants salvation to be by grace, how many works does he require us to do? Zero. Which means faith cannot be a work. Romans 4:16. That is why it depends on faith in order that the promise may rest on grace. See that? God wants salvation and the promise to be based on grace. Therefore, it cannot depend on works. That's what chapter 11 said. And that's why it only depends on faith. Their faith, not works.

Hey, we got a super chat coming in from Loving Life. Thank you so much for your kind support. Appreciate that. >> There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call. One Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all. All right. Loving Life says, "God bless you, Ryan, and the team. Have a question about the four horsemen of the end times. I was told their colors are the same as all Islamic nations flags. What are your thoughts?" I have heard that idea as well before. Uh, but I don't think that's what I just think that's probably a coincidence. Maybe potentially a coincidence rather than the intention of the book of Revelation. I don't think the writer, I don't think John was saying, okay, flags in the future going to be like this, you know, all that kind of stuff. Uh, because these horses represent different judgments rather than specific nations. And yeah, I'm not sure maybe if some of the flags, some of the flags may not even exactly match those those colors. Plus the pale horse who's known as death, it's pale, which is like a more of a greenish, like a very light green, which isn't like those Middle Eastern countries. The green that they have is not pale. It's much more darker green. So, sure, it may be interesting that there is some sort of connection there in terms of the colors look very similar. I don't think that's the point of the book of Revelation, though. And plus the green doesn't match up. But yeah, thank you for that question and that super chat. Appreciate it. Uh, Timothy Brown says, "I ordered some John Fireball gospel tracks today, Ryan." Oh, very cool. I love it. Glad you guys are getting your hands on them. Eevee says, "Give them give it to them in the elevator." Sure. If you're going up and down up and down a building, you give a track to somebody. Hey, here's something to read when you get a chance. And then you go about your day and you can find out in eternity what God did with that tract that you handed out to that person. No chat is in vain, nor are any tracks in vain. Hey, that's a new one. No tracks are in vain. I love it. That's good. Um, see bird of prey says, "There are four horsemen in the book of Zechariah with different colors." Oh, interesting. Yeah. Okay. Thank you for that. Appreciate it. Uh, okay. Uh, there was also a question. Can you explain to me superlapserianism and infralapsarianism? Thank you. O, okay. Good question there, uh, Laura. Now, this is in regards to God's election of people. Okay. And this is we we now scripture is very clear that he elects people before the foundation of the world, before they even are born, before they exist. But in the mind of God, does God have in his plan? This is basically about the plan of God before he created anything. Did he did he plan the fall first and then a plan of redemption as a result? That would be infralapsarianism. Or superlapserianism is the idea that he planned a redemption first and therefore he needed and then he planned for people to fall. Do you see the difference? It's all about what did God plan first? Which I actually don't think is very helpful because like the Bible doesn't tell us what God planned first. What is he planning first? Well, how would we know? Scripture doesn't tell us. But that's the difference. Did he plan the fall first and then a redemption as a result? Like in regards to time, it's simultaneous. But just in regards to his thought process, in God's mind, what thought did he have first? A plan of a fall first and then redemption, or redemption and then

Fall? I'd say we can wait till heaven to find out. I don't think like that's almost like debating over how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. Like, what? Who cares? And like scripture doesn't tell us that. We'll find, we can find out some of those sort of questions in heaven if God wants to tell us those answers to that. All right. Uh, okay. Thank you. This is a super chat from KL. Appreciate that.

"Christ came into the world. He said, 'Sacrifices and offerings you have not desired, but a body have you prepared for me. And burnt offerings and sin offerings you have taken no pleasure. Then I said, 'Behold, I have come to do your will, oh God, as it is written of me in the scroll of the book.'"

And just before I look at that, Ethan says he knew it all from the beginning. So, wouldn't it be both? Well, no, but it's not this did those two different views of infra versus super. It's not about what did he know first, but what did he plan first, which again, I don't think we really have information about that in scripture.

All right, KL, thank you for your super chat. Said this, "When Jesus told the rich young ruler to sell everything, was he using the law to expose him as a sinner in need of grace, or revealing that surrendering all to God is required to be saved?"

Okay, great question. I would say the first option is predominantly what he was doing. I think he was also revealing this man's love of money and his idolatry. Therefore, but I think the first point is what he was doing is exposing the man's sin, using the law to bring the knowledge of sin. So, for example, Mark 10:18, "Rich young ruler has come up says, 'What, what must I do to have eternal life?' Good teacher." And what does he say? "Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone." So, he's already, Jesus has made very clear, no one's good but God. Right? That's a clear point. And yet we're going to see this man basically proclaim his own goodness.

So, Jesus says, "You know the commandments. Do not murder. Do not commit adultery. Do not steal. Do not bear false witness. Do not defraud. Honor your father and your mother." Okay, these are just some of the Ten Commandments that he is listing there. Now, the man's response should have been, "Okay, Jesus, I've done some of those. I've broken them. How can I be saved?" But let's see the man's response. "Teacher," he doesn't say good anymore. He just says, "Teacher, all these I've kept from my youth."

So, this man was self-righteous, very prideful. Jesus just said, "No one's kept the commandments. No one's good but God." And this guy says, "I've actually kept them all, Jesus. You forgot about me. I've kept them all." Pure pride dripping from this man's words, his lips here. And so Jesus looking at him loved him and said to him, "You lack one thing."

I think almost you could say like this. This sounds sarcastic. You know, scripture can speak sarcastically. Paul speaks sarcastically sometimes in his letters. It's almost like Christ is saying sarcastically here, "You lack one thing." I don't think Christ is affirming this guy's kept all the commandments. I don't think he has. But the fact that he gives him one more to show that he's actually broken them all. His love of money. "You lack one thing. Go and sell all that you have and give to the poor and you'll have treasure in heaven and come follow me."

Now, sometimes people read this and say, "Okay, so that's how you go to heaven. Give everything you have away and then you're going to go to heaven, right?" No. Because even if you gave away everything you have, it doesn't get rid of your past sins. God's still going to have to throw you into hell for your past sins. The way to heaven is by having a perfect savior who bears the punishment for you, Christ alone. Receive him by faith.

And so what happens with the man? "Disheartened by the saying, he went away sorrowful, for he had great possessions." And Jesus looked around and said to his disciples, "How difficult, difficult it will be for those who have wealth to enter the kingdom of God." And the disciples were amazed at his words. But Jesus said to them again, "Children, how difficult it is, it is to enter the the kingdom of God."

Why is it so difficult to enter the kingdom of God? Because you've got to become like a child, realizing that you bring nothing to the table. This guy was like, "Hey, Jesus, I've been pretty good. Look at my record. I've kept all the commandments since I was a boy." He's not coming as a child. He's coming as a self-righteous person. You had to come as a child. Children have no accomplishments. Zero. All that they're just super dependent upon their parents for everything. They don't have achievements they've done themselves. Everything they possess is from their parents. We got to realize I've got nothing. I bring nothing to the table. I should be in hell. Not only are we undeserving of heaven, we're all deserving of it. We deserve the opposite. And so we got to get to that point of brokenness, emptiness to depend on Christ.

And so he says, "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle." That little hole where you put a thread through in a needle, that's the eye of a needle. It's very tiny. No, no camel can fit through that. But he says, "It's easier for that to happen. A camel, which is massive, to go through that tiny little hole of a needle, which means it's impossible. But it's easier for that to happen than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God."

And and he says rich, not to say, "Oh, poor people can definitely go to heaven easily." No. The point is the Jews thought the rich are most likely going to heaven, the poor probably aren't because they're not really blessed by God. But the rich, they are blessed, so they're probably the most likely candidates for heaven. And so Jesus is saying, "Look, the ones that you most likely think are going to heaven, they're the ones who it's it's easier for an impossible thing to happen than for those guys to go to heaven," is his point.

Which is why the reaction of the disciples is astonishment. They were exceedingly astonished and said, "Then who can be saved?" Because the point was, if even the ones that we think are most likely going to heaven can't be saved, well then who can be? Definitely the poor can't be. And Jesus' response is, "With man, it's impossible. But with God, all things are possible."

So, salvation is not achieved by man. Salvation is not by lawkeeping. Salvation is not even by giving away your possessions to the poor because it's impossible. Even if you did that, still got your record of sin. Still going to go to hell. You need God to do something. And God has done something. Christ living the perfect life and dying for our sins, crediting us his righteousness. If we put our trust in Christ, and even that putting our trust in Christ would be uh initiated and brought about by God himself. God is good.

So, yes, he's using the law to bring the knowledge of sin. And unfortunately, the man didn't want to have a bar of it. He had a what we call a Felix moment. Acts 24:25, we get it's from the governor Felix. Paul's speaking to him. He's reasoning about righteousness and self-control and the coming judgment. So, Paul's basically trying to share the gospel and the law and sin and things like that with Felix the governor. And what happens? "Felix was alarmed and said, 'Go away for the present. And when I get an opportunity, I'll summon you.'" That rich young ruler in Mark 10 had a Felix moment. He felt convicted, alarmed, and sorrowful over the fact of what Jesus said. Jesus bringing up the law. And he should have gotten on his knees saying, "Jesus, what must I do to be saved? How can I be saved?" But unfortunately, he just went away sorrowful.

All right, next one from Loving Life. Appreciate your super chat. "Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins. He sat down at the right hand of God, waiting from that time until his enemy should be made a footstool for his feet."

Yes, thank you so much for your generosity, Loving Life. I really appreciate that. Uh, yes, I'm back. "Why does God command killing in the Old Testament but preach love in the New Testament? Curious if God is all knowing, why does he test people?"

Okay, good question there. All right, so we see that God does at different times command the people of Israel to slaughter the pagan nations around them or like those residing in the promised land where they were to live in and so for and so on. But God also commands love in the Old Testament, too. You know, like "Love the Lord your God with your whole heart, soul, mind, and strength. Love your neighbor as yourself." That's actually in the law. That's how Jesus summarizes the Old Testament law because the Old Testament law gives that command as well. That's not just a New Testament thing. That's an Old Testament command.

So, why was God able to say, "Slaughter these people?" Because the wages of sin is death. And God could judge anyone. God can judge anyone at any time, wipe them out. He can send a global flood to wipe out humanity and he can also then allow certain people to be that instrument of judgment. That's what Israel was for those nations who were evil. And it's also what governments are today, executing serious criminals for their crimes. They are doing it on behalf of God. Romans chapter 13 talks about the government being an avenger. "For he is God's servant for your good." Talking about governance here, rules and authorities. "But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer."

So, if we don't have any issue with governments carrying out God's wrath on the wrongdoer today, then we equally shouldn't have any issue with God allowing Israel to be the avenger back in the Old Testament against these pagan nations who were sacrificing their own children, who were committing gross idolatry and other things like that. Now, you might say, "But sometimes Israel was doing that too, right? And sometimes God judged them for that. But also sometimes God showed mercy. God can show mercy when he wants to. But he can also judge rightly when he wants to judge. And he will judge the world in righteousness. There is a day to come." Which is why people need to flee to Christ while they still can.

Now, the second part of your question was, "If he's all knowing, why does he test people?" It's not to find out new information. God knows the end from the beginning. Just like when you pray, you're not informing God of new information that he didn't already know. But he wants to test us in order to demonstrate our faith or grow us in our faith. The difference between a testing and a temptation is important. Satan wants to tempt you. God doesn't want to tempt you, but God is happy to test you.

When your teacher at school gives you a test, the test is not designed to make you fail. The test is designed for you to showcase your knowledge of the subject matter and to maybe even encourage you to study. So, to further grow in the subject matter. And so God giving tests to us grows us in love for God, dependence upon him, but it also allows us to demonstrate our trust and faith in the Lord. That's why God tests people so that all creation, the angels, believers can praise God for the different things. Like Abraham, for example, him going and sacrificing his own son, being willing to do that. We can all look at that and say, "Wow, God tested him and he succeeded. Praise be to God." Now, if that instance never happened, we would never have that opportunity to praise God for that specific thing. So, that's why God allows those sort of tests to happen.

You got James talking about this as well. It says, "Count it all joy, my brothers, when you meet trials of various kinds, for you know that the testing of your faith produces steadfastness." See, it produces something. It's like if you want to get be a good soccer player, football player, but you never actually play any games. You never verse any opposition. You never have any challenges, then you're not going to actually get much better at the sport. You need to practice. And it's like with anything. If you want to get good at music, you want to get good at a video game, you want to get good at so whatever it is, you need challenges. If it's too simple, it's often too boring. You're not having to stretch yourself. You're not having to really exert your skills in any sort of way and therefore not grow your skills in any way. Same with your faith. If life was a bed of roses, nothing bad ever happened to us, then your faith's not really being tested and it's not really then maybe growing as much as it could be. So, that's why he tests our faith to produce steadfastness. And it says, "And let steadfastness have its full effect that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing." That's why God tests us.

Thank you for your generosity also to Ross Walker. Appreciate it. "For those who fear him have no lack. The young lions suffer want and hunger, but those who seek the Lord."

All right, Ross says, "Hey Ryan, what do you think about Nero being related to 666?" Uh, yes, I have heard that before. I don't have an opinion on this. I choose to with a lot of the stuff in the book of Revelation because a lot of it's like, okay, it could relate to that. That's that's a definite real possibility or it could relate to something future. I just choose to not really have any firm opinion on it. Uh, I think we'll find out. I think we'll find out in heaven. And I don't think we necessarily need to try and figure it out all now. The main point is stay trusting in Christ. You will be persecuted, but it's worth it to hold on to Christ to the end.

Um, some manuscripts have 616, which also could spell out Nero with in I think that's in Latin. In Greek, it's it's Nero 666. Uh, so that could relate then to something in the first century or it could also relate to something in the future. In fact, sometimes with prophecy, you have initial fulfillments and then you have final fulfillments. So, could it also be the same thing with the book of Revelation? Could be. Could be. We'll find out.

You see with prophecy, it's difficult to predict exactly how it's going to be fulfilled. But once the prophecies occurred, we're like, "Ah, that makes sense." Think about if you were living back in the Old Testament days when Isaiah is predicting different things, Daniel's predicting different things. You're going to be like, scratching your head a little bit. Okay, what does that relate to exactly? I'm not sure. Get some vague idea, but you're not going to really know 100% what's going on. But hindsight is 20/20, isn't it? Hindsight is 20. Foresight, not so much. Foresight cloudy. It's like one of those glasses that you haven't cleaned for a long time. It's got all this dirt and skin cells and stuff all over it. You can't like it's all right. It's it's everything's blurry. But then, you know, you clean it. Oh, it makes sense. So, so once the prophecies occur, we look back, we like in heaven, we like, "Okay, now I see exactly how the 666 related to this and how it related to that and it had initial fulfillment. There was a final fulfillment there. Perfect." Like because God will have explained it to us. I think as well, God can explain those sort of things. But right now, it's like we look into a mirror dimly.

Uh, super chat also from uh Steven. Thank you so much for that. "I am the Lord. I have called you in righteousness. I will take you by the hand and keep you. I will give you as a covenant for the people."

"Hey Ryan, tell me, how do you respond to Matthew 10:22? 'The one who stands firm to the end will be saved' in regards to standing firm to the end to earn salvation?"

Whoa. Earn salvation? No, no, no. We don't earn salvation. Salvation is received, not achieved. It's not something you earn. And it's a free gift received by faith. But I agree, "the one who endures to the end will be saved." The one who endures to the end will be saved. Meaning not everyone who claims to be a Christian is a real Christian. And so many people who claim to be Christians give up halfway through when trials, tribulation, persecution. That's the context of Matthew 10, by the way. He's saying persecution will come. You're going to be delivered up before kings and rulers and persecuted, potentially martyred for your faith. Those who are genuine stay trusting. Those who are fake don't. That's all it's saying. So, it's not whoever does enough good deeds to the end will be saved. It's just whoever endures to the end. Enduring in what? Faith. Because faith is how you are justified. Good question. Thank you for your super chat. By the way, this one from uh Jaw, who's asked, "Is the early church important to us Christians? And if so, why or why not?"

The early church in terms of the apostles, the days of the apostles, that's far more important than the days of say the 500s, the 600s, the 200s, and things like that. Why? Because you've actually got living apostles during those time, during the first century, and their words are inspired. The words of a second-century, third-century, fifth-century, tenth-century person, not as important, not an authority for us, not something that we have to believe because they've said it. But anything that an apostle said, we have to believe because they have said it. Do you see that? Because they're inspired of the Holy Spirit in their writings there.

So, when people say, and I was having that chat with that Lutheran yesterday, it was a really interesting conversation. He he brought up John 3 and he's like, "But the church fathers or early Christians believed it was this." He tried to link it up with baptism in John 3:5. And I'm like, "What's that got to do with anything? They're not our authority." Now, you can read what they may say. Not saying you can't read them, but they're not your authority in terms of you have to believe them. They could be wrong in what they teach. They could 100% be wrong in what they teach and how they interpret. So, you got to actually let the scripture itself be your the authority. Sure, you can hear different interpretations, but then check it with the Bible. Yo, and you'll see that John 3 has got nothing to do with baptism there. Nothing at all. Uh, so don't go to the early church to find your beliefs. If you're meaning like second, third, fourth, and fifth century, go to the earliest church to find your beliefs, the apostles. That's that's early. It's far too late to rely on later people. People in the second, third, fourth, fifth century. That's too late. Go to the early church, which is the apostles. Let's go to them.

Uh, fear God's ask, "How can the Eucharist be symbolic when in John 6:55 it says, 'His flesh is real food and his blood is real drink.' In 1 Corinthians 11:27, Paul says, 'It's a sin to take communion in an unworthy manner.' Neither of those things go against the Eucharist being a symbol. And by the way, you should come up for a viewer chat later on. We'll have a conversation about it if you're interested. That'd be great. We have friendly chat together. Um, we could talk about this.

But the reason why when he says it's real food and real drink as part of his metaphor, you don't take John 6 literally. No one except cannibals take John 6 literally. Do you think Jesus in John 6 is wanting the crowd to come up to him and take a bite out of his ear, out of his toe, out of his arm? Is that what Jesus is wanting? No. No. No. Not literally in that sense. Oh, so you don't actually take Jesus' words literally either. None, none of us do except cannibals who literally think you should go and eat human flesh. That's not us. And and neither the disciples who actually had their faith in Christ, the 11 disciples, neither do they go and take a bite out of Jesus. If he's telling them, "Go and eat my flesh. It's really true food." They didn't go up and eat his arm because they understood he's speaking in figurative speech.

When John uh when yeah, in John chapter 6 verse 51, Jesus says, "I am the living bread that came down from heaven." Are we to interpret this him as ah he wasn't a human then it was just some bread walking around? No. He's giving a figure of speech. "If anyone eats of this bread," so if the first part, the bread is a figure of speech, then the eating of that bread must also be a figure of speech. "Anyone eats of this bread, he'll live forever." Is that literal? Do you mean does that mean no one's you're not going to die? Oh, you can't interpret that literally either. You still are going to die even as the apostles have all died. They didn't live forever in a literal sense. "And the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh." So, is this meaning in a literal sense? Okay, he's just going to divide up his body and just like pass it around. People start chewing on it like we saw in the book of Judges where that woman was cut up into different parts and distributed to the 12 tribes. No, don't take it literally. See the point? No one takes this literally unless you have just the craziest view ever and you think that they should have started eating Jesus literally, right? No one takes this literally.

So, when he says that, "Oh, my flesh is true food and my blood is true drink," still part of the metaphor, right? In fact, if you keep going, people go to here and they don't read to the end. Go read 63. "It is the Spirit who gives life. The flesh is no help at all. The flesh is no help at all. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life." So, he even tells them that he's speaking spiritual truths, not fleshly ones where they should start eating on him, eating his flesh physically or anything like that. He's speaking spiritually. If you believe he's speaking spiritually as he says he is, then you don't actually believe believe it's um purely 100% literal. You also think it's symbolic.

Now, in terms of 1 Corinthians 11, it's a sin to take communion unworthily. Absolutely. If you just treat the meal as a common meal where it's not about Jesus, then that's eating it unworthily. Or if you eat it if you're not a Christian, that's unworthy. That's you're eating unworthily. But it doesn't have to be literally his body or his blood in order for someone to take it uh eat it in an unworthy manner.

All right, Steven sent in a follow-up for his question. Thank you for that. "He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved son in whom we have redemption." Is Matthew 10:33, "Whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven," is that a law verse? Seeing Peter had faith but still denied Christ. Is there evidence this is a law verse?

Yeah. Disown me or deny me before men, I think means deny to the point of not putting your trust in Christ. I don't think that's talking about Peter's denials. Peter did deny Christ. But did Peter stop having faith when he denied Christ three times? Answer is no. He still had faith and so he was still saved at that moment in time. But this sort of denial seems to be by the fact that it leads to your denial before God must be a denial to the point of that you don't have your faith in Christ. It doesn't say "whoever has belief in me and denies me that are going to be denied by my Father." It just says "if you deny me," which must be then to the point of you just don't want Jesus at all. You don't want Jesus at all. You don't have any trust in him. Well, guess what? You're going to be rejected by him before the Father on judgment day.

Uh, fear God's got a response. "No, you have to understand what he's saying. He's saying he is the living bread from heaven. Also, he says, 'Man shall live by every word that comes through the mouth of God.' Jesus is those words. He is the word. I think you've misunderstood that. Matthew 4:4, 'Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from God's mouth.' Is not talking about Jesus specifically there. Living by every word that proceeds from God's mouth is talking about living by what everything God has said. It's quoted from Deuteronomy chapter 8:3, which is talking about how we to live by obeying, like live by everything that God has said. God's word is precious. It's not specifically talking about Christ there. So, I think you've made a false connection. But as I said, fear God, come for a viewer chat later on, we could have a friendly conversation together."

Okay, now to give opportunity for those viewer chats coming up in a bit. We might progress to our Bible trivia. We'll do some gospel chats and then we'll get the viewer chat started after that.

>> Need God.net. Who can get it first? Are you ready yet?

>> Jamie had a good comment as well. Um, John 4. "Meanwhile, the disciples were urging him, saying, 'Rabbi, eat.' But he said to them, 'I have food to eat that you do not know about.'" Is he speaking literally here? No. Because he goes on to say the food that he has is just to do the will of his Father. Right? So, just because Jesus says something is food doesn't mean it's actually literal food. It's just his mission was to do whatever the Father's will was. And that was to reach those Samaritan people at that moment in time. There you go. I may not agree totally with your views, but thanks for answering kindly. No worries. Yeah. And that's why I think our chat later on, if you come to viewer chat, I think it'd be a friendly um, good conversation together. Um, all right, let's now do some Bible trivia, though. I want to test you guys' knowledge on certain things in scripture. So, we'll get that started. Here we go. We'll bring it up. Here it is. Okay, let's start a a trivia trivia on categories. 10 questions. We we'll do five easy and five medium. What do you think? Let's do that. Okay. Five easy, five medium. Here we go.

Which Egyptian official was hanged just as Joseph had interpreted from his dream? Was that the chief guard, the chief cupbearer, the chief baker, or the chief steward? Edson, what do you think?

>> B.

>> The chief cupbearer is not right. He was the one who was restored. Try again.

>> Um, the baker.

>> The chief baker is the correct answer. Hang the chief baker as Joseph had interpreted to them.

Next, "Who said, 'Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting me?'" Let's go to Harmony.

>> Um, the Lord Jesus.

>> That was Jesus. Nice work.

Rachel died giving birth to which of her sons? Was it Benjamin, Napali, Dan, or Joseph? What do you think there, Phil?

Oh, I actually don't know. Um, Rachel died giving birth to which of her sons? Let's go. Who's the youngest?

>> Benjamin.

>> Benjamin.

>> Right? Benjamin is correct. Nice work. And could you remember who was um who else Rachel gave birth to? Joy.

>> Uh, sorry, can you repeat?

>> So, who else did uh Rachel give birth to?

>> Who else? The other 11 sons. No, because remember how Jacob had two wives and the other largely gave birth to most of them.

>> Oh, yeah. Leah, right?

>> Yeah, Leah. So, but who did Rachel give birth to?

>> Joseph.

>> Joseph.

>> Nice work. And Benjamin.

All right, next question. In what place did Jesus pray deeply while his disciples slept? Was it in Gethsemane, Golgotha, Capernium, or or Bethesda? So, what place did Jesus pray deeply while his disciples slept? And the passage is Matthew 26, if that gives you a hint. All right, Joy.

>> Gethsemane.

>> Gethsemane. That's right. Just before he was about to be arrested by those soldiers.

Next one. Who was the beautiful daughter of Saul who loved David and married him? Was that Marab, Muel, a a hinim, or Abigail? Let's go to Edson Mall.

>> Nice work. Okay, let's check the results. 80% on our first quiz. So, which Egyptian official was hanged just as Joseph had interpreted from his dream? Harmony.

>> The Baker.

>> It was the Chief Baker. Now, let's go. You guys did well, I think, on on uh easy mode. 80%. Pretty good, I'd say. But we are going to now go to medium. This is going to make it a bit more difficult for you guys. So, let's see if we can beat 80% or at least maintain 80%. Well, but we'll see. We might get under. We'll find out. Oh, here we go. We start off with an emoji quiz. All right. And so this one was going to go to Phil. Let me know if you need any hints with the give hint button, but go for it, Phil.

>> Uh, couple of old men and a sheep and a goat. This way or that way? Uh, it's a desert scene. I don't know. Um, Genesis 13 is about as Oh,

>> I can press give here just to give you

>> Yeah.

>> the older Abraham and a younger Lot. Yeah. So, I mean that's Lot and Abraham, right? So, we agree with that. And is it something to do with like the promised land?

>> Yeah. So they left Haran, didn't they? To go to the land of Canaan. What do you think?

>> Yeah,

>> maybe.

>> Or where's the sheep?

>> Yeah, too many sheep. And cows for one camp. That giving you a hint? Yeah. So there's there's the options there. Abraham. Yeah. Ham and Lot separate.

>> All right, let's do it.

>> That is correct. Abraham and Lot separate. So they had too many sheep and cows for one camp. So they split in opposite directions. Abraham stayed in the dry land while Lot moved toward the city, setting up their respective camps with their camels. All right. Okay, we got that one. Nice.

1st Samuel 26. In what wilderness did David spare Saul's life while Paul Saul was sleeping in his camp? Was it the wilderness of Sin, Piran, Zin, or Ze? Okay. Uh, Joy, what do you think? You got this one.

Well, so um just going to take a guess unless someone knows.

>> My this is what I'm I'll tell you what I'm thinking and you can tell me if you would agree. I think it's probably Piran is my guess,

>> but I'm not 100% sure. So that's just what I'm

>> Okay, let's try it out. Let's see if it's Piran.

>> No, it's not Piran. Oh, okay. Well, at least we got one three options now.

>> Ze.

>> Ze. Okay, let's try Ze.

>> It is Ze. Wow. That's not a very common wilderness,

>> is it? Because I know Sin and Zin were ones where the Israel went as just after Sinai or you know that time in the 40 years they're in those regions. But yeah, wilderness of Ze is not one that I really heard much about.

Where was King Hezekiah's tunnel built to bring water into the city during an Assyrian siege? Was it Jerusalem, Samaria, Hebron, or Jericho? Edson, what do you think?

>> Jericho.

>> Okay. So, King Hezekiah built a tunnel into Jericho. Okay. That's interesting. Let's see if it's Let's see if you're right.

>> It's not Jericho. All right. Guess again.

>> Wow. It's interesting. I talked to someone about this last week.

>> C.

>> So, Hebron.

>> Okay. Jerusalem.

>> Yeah. I thought it'd be Jerusalem, right? Cuz that that'd be where the king' expect him to be. And let's see if it's Jerusalem. Yeah, cuz Hezekiah, he's a king of Judah. So, yeah, it should be Jerusalem then.

>> Yes, it is Jerusalem. A nice So, he he made the pool and the conduit and brought water into the city. There you go.

Who asked, "Please, Lord, how can I save Israel? Behold, my clan is the weakest in Manasseh, and I am the least in my father's house." Is that Jeepa, Gideon, Ehood, or Samson? Okay. What are you thinking, Harmony?

>> Um, I think it might be the first or second one. Um, probably Gideon.

>> Yeah, cuz remember he was a bit hesitant, wasn't he? He had the fleece and stuff like that. So, I'm thinking it's Gideon as well. Nice. Yes. Good job.

Okay, God questions Job asking if he gives the horse its might and clothes his neck with what? Is it? A collar, a mane, a yolk, or a chain. What do you think? Is this a suit question for you there, Phil the horse rider?

>> Yeah, I hope it's not a trick question. I mean, the the man goes on a horse, comes with a horse, but I just reread it. Hang on. Good question. God questions Job asking if he gives the horse its might and clothes its neck with what? Yeah, man. I'll go with man.

>> Mane.

>> You are correct. Nice work.

Let's check the results. Hey, 60%. Not bad, right? That's um a little bit less down from our last our last quiz, but it was a harder difficulty. So, I want to say well done you guys. You did awesome. Let's check the ones we got wrong. In what wilderness did David spare Saul's life while Saul was sleeping in his camp? Joy.

>> Uh this.

>> Yeah. The wilderness of Ze.

And where was King Hezekiah's tunnel built to bring water into the city during an Assyrian siege? And this is for Edson.

>> Jerusalem.

>> Jerusalem. Well done. Well done. Okay. Now, we are going to do a lightning round. I know you guys like that. We'll do that shortly. And one of you guys going to have to be brave enough to do that. Let me get the other quiz up, though. I want to test you on some where some things are in the Bible. We use our other quiz. It's on our website. Uh, here we go. We're going to do a game quiz. Five questions on anywhere in the Bible. It's going to play a verse for us and you guys need to guess where it is. Are you ready?

>> "Solomon brought Pharaoh's daughter up from the city of David to the house that he had built for her. For he said, 'My wife shall not live in the house of David, king of Israel. For the places to which the ark of the Lord has come are holy.'"

>> Okay. So, is that passage in Judges 1, Joshua 11, Psalm 133, or 2 Chronicles 8? Okay, let me see. I'll try to do this one for you guys. So, we got Judges is too early. It's talking about Solomon. Joshua is too early. Psalms is unlikely. So, I think it's going to be 2 Chronicles 8:11. Here we go.

>> "When she came to him, she urged him to ask her father for a field. And she dismounted from her donkey. And Caleb said to her, 'What do you want?'"

>> All right. So the references possible options are Judges 1, Zechariah 5, Amos 6, or Ruth 4. Okay, let's go to Harmony. What do you think?

>> I don't know. I'm thinking of Caleb from like Moses's day with like Joshua. Um,

>> which is still the book is Judges time, isn't it? At the start.

>> I was thinking that, but then I was thinking maybe it was like quoted in a different section, but yeah, I'll go with Judges.

>> Judges 11:14. Let's see if it's right. Yes.

>> "Would you therefore wait till they were grown? Would you therefore refrain from marrying? Know my daughters, for it is exceedingly bitter to me for your sake that the hand of the Lord has gone out against me."

>> Okay. Is that Habac, Nahm, Ruth, or Micah? Phil, what do you think?

I don't know. So, no, my daughters, it's exceedingly bitter to me for your sake that the hand of the Lord has gone out against me. Is it like Habacook? Would it be like a Habacook story?

>> I'll give you just a quick hint. Um, who renamed themself to a word that meant bitter?

>> Yeah. So you're looking for Ruth then?

>> Ruth,

>> right? So, yeah, Naomi renamed herself.

>> Is it Mora?

>> Mara.

>> Mara.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah. Cuz remember how

>> her two sons died and Ruth was like, "Even if I had more children like today, are you going to wait till they're grown? Are you going to refrain from marrying someone else?" You know? No. Like go basically go find someone else is what uh Naomi was saying here. And then Ruth's like, "I'm going to cling to you." Yeah.

>> Okay. So, Ruth won.

>> "Hey, I am a Jew born in Tarsus in Cissia, but brought up in this city, educated at the feet of Gamaliel, according to the strict manner of the law of our fathers, being zealous for God as all of you are this day."

>> Okay. So, is that Acts 22, Second Timothy 2, 1 Timothy 2, or Acts 25? This one's for Joy. Could it be Acts 22?

>> Yeah. So, give us the thought process.

>> I know that it's Paul talking and he could be um like when he was brought to the I'm not sure what it was. It was like a court or something and he was defending himself.

>> It was in Tarsus.

>> Yeah. There's a few different times when Paul gave speeches before different governors and rulers.

>> But I think I I think you are right about the Acts 22:3 because this is the time when he's been the mob's been like beating him up and then he's like says, "Can I speak to the crowd? The Romans have come and arrested him. Can I speak to the crowds?" And so he sounds like he's addressing the crowd as being zealous for God as you all are this day. So I think you are right. Let's check if that's the case. Yes. Nice work.

And of these again you shall take some and cast them into the midst of the fire and burn them in the fire. From there a fire will come out into all the house of Israel.

>> Got a hard one for you, Edson. Is this Isaiah 32, Ezekiel 5, Habac 1, or Hosea 14? You'll love it. It's Old Testament, so what do you think?

>> Isaiah.

>> Okay. Isaiah 32. No. Try again. Hosea.

>> Hosea 14:5. No. Try again.

>> Ezekiel.

>> Ezekiel. Yes. 54. Hey, well done. We got 71.4% accuracy, which means five correct guesses out of seven total guesses that we had uh in that Bible quiz. Well done, you guys. Uh, that was fun. Now, you know what time it is? It's time for our lightning round. Okay. So, who's turn? I think who did it yesterday? Oh, yeah. Brandon did it yesterday. That's right. So, who's ready for the next time? Because I know all of you guys have done at least once, right? So, we need one of you guys to volunteer for doing it the second time.

>> So, we got some people saying Edson. Edson says Jamie saying Phil.

>> Yeah, I think you definitely do it alphabetically.

>> Ah, alphabetically. Okay, here we go. So, is that you Edson first?

>> Yeah, go.

>> So, while he's getting that ready, just a reminder what this is, he's trying to answer 10 Bible trivia questions correctly, 100% correctly in under 30 seconds. That is his aim. Very difficult. But definitely possible. All right, you can do this, Edson. So, you'll share your tab and then Phil says he's still practicing. Okay, good.

>> Can you see it?

>> Here we go. Um, oh, my hands are sweaty. The pressure is on it.

>> Let's see. Um, quotes. Okay, let's see. Let's make sure it's all right. Is my blessed Jesus remember me your kingdom criminal? Uh, Isaac, the woman, Adam, Nick, Job, job, let him was without Jesus. Uh, so no wise man. Okay. No.

>> Wow. Very fast. Good job, man. 32 seconds. That is amazingly quick. So, you're getting a lot quicker. Just a couple inaccuracies there. Um, but that was so quick. Notice how it is possible. One of these days, one of us will get it. This is fun. Well done. Uh, there Edson, thank you for for doing that. So, I think that's the quickest that's happened on stream so far, right? 32 seconds. Very quick. Very quick. Bethany says, "Extremely fast at the beginning." It's true. All right. Now, what we're going to do is Harmony, you're going to encourage us with a song. After that, we'll get Phil to pray for us. We're going to get some gospel chats started and then the viewer chats will start after that. Sounds good. May God be glorified.

What shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He did not spare his own son but gave him up for us all. How will he not also with him graciously give us all things? Romans 8:31 and 32.

>> Yeah, praise the Lord. All right, let's all pray. Father God, uh, we thank you, Lord. We bow our hearts and our head, our minds before you, Lord, and give you all the glory, all the praise for this day, for your creation. We thank you that you blessed us with these times that we live in that we can uh look back and see how our savior came and died on the cross for our sins. We thank you for that, Lord. And we thank you for the privilege it is to share this good news with people. So, we thank you for yeah, these times again that we live in that we can uh share this good news around the world far and wide with the internet that you've given us um the tools. Just help us with our skill and our our compassion for people. Help us to overcome any fears. Um, help us with our recall, our knowledge. We give answers and reason with people. Um, but yeah, ultimately, Lord, we want you to be glorified. We want your people to be saved today. So, if it be your will, connect people with uh with Ryan that he'd be they'd be openhearted and uh being willing to change their mind and trust in Jesus Christ today. Um, but yeah, we want you to be glorified again. So, we pray for this now and we pray in Jesus name. Amen.

>> Amen. Thank you so much there, Phil and Harmony. Well done. Okay, we're about to head on to the virtual streets of Yumingle to go and talk to someone about Jesus. This is lots of fun. So, if you guys can be praying for this person I'm about to witness to, but also put your guesses in the chat. So, we're going to see who can win today's round of guess location. Put your guesses of where you think this person's going to be from. Guess a country and also a state in America. A country outside of America and a state in America. Lord, please save this person in Jesus name. Amen.

>> Hey there, can I ask you a question?

>> Hey, can I ask you a question?

>> Of course you can, my darling.

>> Thank you. My question is, uh, do you believe that there is a heaven after we die?

>> No. Okay. Do you believe that there is a God?

>> Not in the sense that you do.

>> Okay. Uh, what about like a creator?

>> I think God's more of a dictator than he is a savior.

>> Okay.

>> There is many forms of gods and goddesses.

>> So you to say that there is

>> Interesting. Hey, a question.

>> Sure.

>> Thank you. My question is, do you believe there's a heaven after we die?

>> I do. Yeah.

>> Yeah. Same. So, what do you think we've got to do to make sure we end up in heaven?

>> I think we got to do as God wishes by

>> like like obey his rules. You're saying?

>> Yeah.

>> Okay.

>> Now, would you say you've done that pretty well yourself?

>> No. But I think it's a journey. I think we're all trying to be on that path, right?

>> I think that's what counts for it, you know? It's the journey.

>> Always uh

>> Yeah. Asking for forgiveness.

>> Yeah. Now, let me ask you though, in your life, have you ever told a lie before?

>> I have. Yeah.

>> Me, too. Or ever used bad language?

>> Of course.

>> Yeah. Even this one, have you ever been angry or rude to somebody?

>> Yeah.

>> So, if God was to judge you then based on

These things, do you think you'd be innocent or guilty?

I mean, I'd probably be guilty. Yeah. Because I have done those things.

Yes. Same. So, should we then get a reward or a punishment? Uh like based on God. I feel like we shouldn't like it should be based on how valuable our ask for forgiveness is. Like if we're trying to be on a better path, it's not whether you've done it or not done it, but it's whether you've asked for forgiveness.

If you're trying to be on a be on a better path, think of it this way. Imagine if someone stood before a judge and in a court of law and said, "Judge, I robbed the bank yesterday, but I'm sorry. I won't do it ever again. Please forgive me."

Yeah. Would the judge let the criminal go free?

Probably not enough.

Right? Because justice needs to be upheld. And if a judge did let the person go free on that basis, it would be actually an unjust judge. It' be a bad one.

That is true.

God's not going to be bad. Which means it's good to change. It's good to apologize. It just doesn't cover our past sins. Does that make sense?

That is true.

So on judgment day, God doesn't judge us based on are we improving. He's judging us on have we broken his law. And if that is the basis, do you see how we would all be guilty then?

Probably. Yeah.

Yeah. And deserve not heaven but hell.

Right.

Yeah. Now, thankfully, there is one way for us not to be sent to hell. And that would be if someone was kind enough to actually take our punishment on our behalf, right?

Okay.

And ultim ultimately that was what Jesus did. Have you heard about how he died and rose from the dead?

Yeah. Yeah.

So if Jesus gets 100% of your punishment, how much punishment would then be left for you to still get?

None. If he took a 100.

Yeah. So with no more punishment, then where would you get to go when you die?

Yeah. Heaven, probably.

Uh would you say hell or heaven?

Heaven.

Yeah, heaven. Correct. Yeah, you'd get to go to heaven. So based on this logic, why do you get to go to heaven?

Cuz if supposedly someone took all my punishments, then I'd probably

Yeah. Jesus, he he was the one. And you just need to accept that by trusting that he's done that for you, taken that punishment on your behalf. What do you think about this concept?

Interesting. Yeah.

Okay.

Interesting.

Yeah. And does it make sense that that's how we're going to get to heaven

On paper. Yeah.

On paper. Okay. But you don't think

But do you think it's going to work or not?

It could. Yeah.

Okay, cool. Good. So then let's say today you do trust that he died for you, but then tomorrow you do five more sins and then you died.

Yeah. Would you go to heaven or hell?

Depends if you still trust.

Yeah. Let's say you are still trusting in him. Where would you go?

Uh I'd say uh let me think cuz you still did this in does it feel like uh it would depends on how like you're still trying to be a better person now like even if you do trust in him you still try to be a better person

But but remember we aren't going to heaven because we're trying to be a better person.

Yeah.

We're going to heaven only because he died on the cross for us and he paid for both past, present, and future sins.

Okay.

Yeah. So then you probably go to heaven.

Yeah.

Yeah. You got it. Doesn't mean you want to sin. Sin is still bad. We definitely try and avoid it just out of like gratitude to him for what he's done for us.

What is the repercussion of doing a sin?

Well, first of all, that it made you deserving of hell initially and but now that you trust in Jesus, it doesn't if you if you do trust in Jesus, you don't end up in hell, but it just meant that Jesus had to get that for you. But there can also be earthly consequences for your sins.

Okay.

Right. That are very negative because sin doesn't help you. It often hurts you.

Yeah.

Right. Wow. The consequences are they like based on the people around me that kind of puts that like for example the law.

Yeah. Okay. That's one aspect. Okay.

But it's not just that. It's not just like you could get in trouble by the government or

you could have people just not trust you if you lie for example. You could break relationships if you're doing terrible behavior. But not only that, it could also be discipline. The Lord could discipline you. um maybe cause some sort of negative thing to happen in your life to get you to change your mind about a particular sin that you've been doing.

So that also possible too.

So what would push me away from doing a sin is the okay the world aspect of consequence I mean the world consequence that could happen to me either based on the people around me or the lord

and also the discipline that you don't want to receive because that's not going to be pain that's not going to be pleasant that's going to be painful but I think one other so there's some big reasons but I think another big reason why we want to avoid sin is simply out of gratitude and love to god for what he's done to save us Okay.

Yeah. Because he's he's given us a new heart anyway. If we put our trust in Jesus, we have a new heart with new desires. We love to do what's good and we hate to do what's evil.

Yeah.

Yeah. Okay. But what if you don't trust that he died on the cross for you? Then where would you end up?

Uh if you I mean Yeah. You'd probably end up in hell if you

Yeah. And so since that's not where you want to go to, when should you start trusting that he died for all of your sins?

Like uh as soon as possible.

Yeah. Exactly. So if you stood before God today and he asked you, "Why should I let you into heaven?" What do you think you'd say to him?

Because I trust in God.

H trust what about him?

Um his selflessness, his gratitude to me. I mean my gratitude to I mean yeah basically mostly his selflessness to us.

Yeah. But I guess my question is getting what has he done in order to save you from going to hell?

Like he's uh taken our sin upon himself.

Yeah, that's exactly right. So that's what we should say. Well, you don't even need to point to I trust in you. It should be

he's taken my punishment. That's why you know you've you've taken my punishment. That's why he can let me into heaven. Um, and that shows that your trust is in him to save you rather than yourself.

Okay. So then does doing good things play any part in getting you to heaven?

No.

No. You're right. Uh, we just do good things now out of love and so on for God. So, are you now believing this that he's done that for you?

Uh, yeah.

Great. Wow. That's awesome, man. That's that's so good. It's such a joy knowing uh that your sins are forgiven heading to heaven. So, how sure are you right now out of a hundred that you're going to heaven?

Uh if it's fully based on uh like my trust in him, it' probably be 100.

Yeah. Yeah. It' be 100 if your trust is in him because it's not based on how many sins you've done or not done. And it's all based on what he's accomplished

in your place, which is so good.

Okay. So, Oh, sorry. What were you going to say?

Yeah, I was going to ask. So, like my like the chance of me I mean the me believing that I go having kind of like lies on me trusting. So, if I have unwavering trust, I'd be

more confident. But if it wasn't like 100% trust, then it wouldn't be as confident.

Either you should be 0% sure you're going to heaven or 100%. I don't think you can be anything in between just because either he's paid for all your sins or he's paid for none of them.

Okay. So, even if you have like a small doubt, then that kind of puts me off. Like,

Well, it depends what you mean. Like, I think doubts can pop up in people's minds. But I think what faith is is that we should just be fully convinced that Jesus will keep his promise that he has died for me and he will take me safely to heaven through what he's done.

Right? We we should just trust him. Otherwise, we're saying if we say I'm only 90% sure it's I'm going to go to heaven. We're really saying he's 10% trust not trustworthy. You know, we're distrusting him then. See that?

Yeah. So, just having that small amount of distrust kind of puts you out the fault of going to heaven.

Yeah. If you think that he's not enough, he's an incomplete savior, then I don't think he'll save you. You got to believe that he is he is truly the way, the truth, the life. No one goes to the father but through him. Um, and if usually when I ask people how sure they are, they're going to heaven. If they're anything under 100%. Usually it's because they're still trusting in their own actions to save them. They're thinking I've got to be a better person to be 100, you know, higher shore. Um, and so that's it still fundamentally shows a misunderstanding of what they should be relying upon to save them. You see that?

Okay. Yeah. Okay. Like my thing is how does Okay. Like he did mention like oh the only reason why like sins that I commit here is for my repercussions right here like yeah I think oh if I do more sins I would be closer to God that would make me more eligible if that makes sense to go to heaven

Right and that shows that you're still thinking that heaven is almost like a reward for the righteous but it's not it's not a reward for the righteous It's a gift for the guilty.

Heaven's not for good people. It's for forgiven people.

But what if I ask for forgiveness? Isn't that showing trust in God? Like uh every time I do a sin

And I ask for forgiveness like whether or not I did the sin.

I think that that's fine to do that. It's a good thing to do that to confess your sins to God when you do it. But just know that it's not going to get you forgiveness just on that basis because it's like confessing to a judge and the judge's going to say, "Look, you confess it. I'm going to have to punish you. I'm not going to let you go free." So that's why the sacrifice of Jesus is the key. If he pays for your sins, you don't have to pay for it. But if you don't believe he sacrificed for you, you pay for every one of your sins.

Okay?

Right? That's that's the key. So many people trust and they're asking forgiveness to get to heaven and they will be sent to hell because they're trusting in the wrong thing to save them.

Sure.

Yeah. But do you understand that if the standard for heaven's perfection, whether you try and clean up your life, do less sins, do you meet the standard of perfection

On this basis? No.

Right? And so that's why you're not more eligible for heaven compared to somebody who hasn't cleaned up his life because either way neither person deserves heaven.

Okay?

Right? It's all just that free gift that he offers to anyone who would believe,

Which is an amazing um thing that he would do that for us.

Now, I want to ask you, let's say a friend of yours told you that he's going to heaven because he's a good person. Would that friend go to heaven or hell?

It depends on his uh trust.

No, right? That's true. Based on what he said though, was he trusting in Jesus or was he trusting in his own actions to save him?

Probably his own actions.

Yeah. And so therefore, he doesn't have Jesus paying for his sins. So where does he end up

In hell,

Right? You got it. Um, but what if he had someone else who said, "I'm going to heaven because Jesus died for me and because I do good things." Where would he end up?

He did say and so that this going to take into the fact that oh because I did good things I also end up in heaven.

Right. So it's basically like trusting 50/50 isn't it?

Yeah.

So therefore he thinks that Jesus is not enough to save him. So Jesus won't save him. So where does he end up?

Oh in hell.

Yeah. You got it. So think back at the beginning of this conversation. What did you think was going to get you into heaven?

Uh like forgiveness. So like always coming back like that was what I

Yeah. So you're trusting in basically your own actions then to get forgiveness. Um, and so if you had died where would you have ended up?

Uh on this basis though

Yeah, but if you died this very moment where would you go?

Uh saying it with certainty like I mean obviously I do have to have more conviction I mean like as in more sure like assuress in myself if that makes sense but

Yeah, but that trusting is like it comes from within and

I see

Having that Yeah. So having that like yeah that trust I guess it's like something like if I'm told something obviously I would have skepticism to things so I'd have to have more conviction. Obviously if something makes sense I'd still like

Have to have that feeling as well because it could intuitively make sense but having that feeling as well

Okay

Is also journey.

But you would agree it makes sense though.

Yeah. Yeah. On this basis. Yeah.

Good. Good. So it makes sense. That's a key thing that it checks that box off. Um, but I think it also more than just that it makes sense. I think it's what we need and that you got no other thing that you can rely upon to save you. Like are you are you do you agree that even if you improve, change your lifestyle around to be a much better person, do you agree that that's not going to get rid of your past sins?

Um okay so like coming back because you you also did give the u the analogy of like going through a judge and then having the punishment for it. Like if I was to go through a punishment for something or like do actions for something, would that make justice applied? Like is justice applied when I have done those things? Because at the end of the day, I like if I did end up uh going to court and I did something that I was convicted of and I went through my presence my present my prison sentence or I went through community service or whatever based on the judge, I would have on paper like like justice would have been uh

Oh, I see what you're saying. Yeah. Like if you do the time then justice Yeah. that is a way of justice being satisfied. And so in relation to God if we go to hell forever that is God's justice being satisfied in in hell. It's just that we don't want that. We don't want to have to do the time in hell forever.

Okay. Yeah.

Because you never get out. Like if you get sent to hell, it's just permanent. You never get out of there.

And that's why the only option you have is not to clean up your life cuz that's not going to fix your past sins.

Prayers won't fix it. It's got to be someone bears it in your place.

Okay. What if someone was on paper who never committed sin? Like would he have to trust?

No, he wouldn't need to trust that Jesus died for his sins because he would have no sins.

It's just that there's no one like that.

Yeah, that's true.

Yeah. So, it's like this. If you were stuck in the bottom of a a well and you couldn't get out and someone says, "Look, here I'll throw a rope down. I'll pull you out. Even though you don't know if the you haven't tested the rope, you haven't done all these sort of things because it's your only hope of getting out of the well, you'd rely on that to get you out. You put all your weight on that weight on the rope to get you out. So, same thing because we know that we're on our way to hell. And there's no other option of us being saved from hell but by Jesus taking it for us because no other religion has anyone taking our punishment.

You may as well just put all your weight and trust into Jesus. Because it's a choice. You don't have to have 100% knowledge of something to trust it.

Yeah.

Right. So, you just choose to trust I am going to heaven because of one basis only. Jesus dying on the cross for my sins.

Okay.

Yeah.

What do you think? Do you think you're going to do that?

Yeah. I mean, it's very like an I mean, it's very interesting like the point of view 100%. And I yeah I'll definitely like reflect upon it and yeah like uh

But there must be some sort of hesitation though you haven't

I guess is that emotional like I mean obviously like

Yeah, like as I was saying the emotional aspect of it is something that I do have to like get with.

Yeah.

When you say emotional what do you mean by that?

So like if so like for example if I was obviously not a good example if but if I was like doing a math question and I was told this is the way and like it it makes sense like it's on paper it's math it's 1 plus 1 equals to two but if I just had that emotional like thing like oh I feel like it shouldn't be two cuz of some unknown reason then I just wouldn't like fully trust that it is two.

Okay but then

Okay let me ask you this. If you were to die right now, where do you think God would send you?

I mean, on this basis, definitely hell. Yeah.

Yeah. You said on this basis. So, are you convinced 100% that you do deserve hell and you would be in hell if you died right now?

On this basis. Yeah.

When you say why do you say on this basis? What's what's making you say that?

Like,

So like if like hell and I mean hell and heaven is true and like all the like predetermined races that you said.

I see.

To this point.

I do. But you do believe in heaven and hell, right?

Yeah. But uh I feel like for many people like hell and heaven like really for example if I was to ask a Jew here I mean okay they don't believe in hell and heaven like if I was to ask a Muslim if I believed in hell or heaven they would give a different answer of what hell is and what heaven is like knowing whether one or the other was what was the right way to go to heaven and what punishment is the right punishment for each person

Like it would be different. So

Even if someone has slightly different small detail differences about what hell or heaven is like,

There's still the same concept of a place of punishment and a place of no punishment.

And we can just recognize even without looking at any holy text, we can just look at

I've done wrong. I'm in someone else's universe, not my universe. So it makes sense that I should be punished for all those bad things that I've done in my life.

Yeah. And like the punish like depending what hell is the punishment would be different. So like for example like for Muslims they have it so that if I do a punishment and I do I think it's if I do get for if I do ask for forgiveness like having that act like that's I feel like right now what I realize is the difference between like different

And I understand so other religions have different ideas on how to be saved from that punishment. So Muslims will say do your prayers, do your pilgrimage, do these sort of things

Or I mean I guess more of like what

Like what is justice I guess if

And that's why I think we have a sense of justice already inherent in us. We understand like that's not right. If a judge has let someone go free just because the person's done more good things later on that doesn't cover the crime.

I don't think it's about the good things. I think it's more about realizing that you have done bad things. So the bad things if you have done bad things and you just continue doing bad things and realize that you can always go back to like being good and you're you will be I feel like that's being forever forgiven because okay God is the most forgiving.

It's part of his attributes.

What makes you think that?

I think it's part of being good. I think like having all goodness would be maximizing on every good

Think about what the most forgiving um person or judge would be. Would be someone who forgives everyone, doesn't punish anyone. Now, you don't want a judge like that. Judge who says, "I'm going to let all the criminals go free with no punishment no matter what they've done."

It's actually that that's a that's the most forgiving judge. And God's not most forgiving.

Like most forgiving in the sense where it against that person. So if for example, not like if I did it to someone else. So if it was to do something bad against this person which doesn't implicate anyone else in that

What about God? God is the one who's offended mostly when we sin. It's not other people. Sure, they may be affected in some ways, but our sins are primarily against God. And that's what's so serious about our sins. It's cosmic treason. And so if God just forgave you at the expense of justice,

If he was the most forgiving, forgiving everyone with no justice being satisfied, that would make God evil. And God's not evil.

Why would that make him evil?

Well, the same reason why if criminals have broken the law, done some terrible crimes, or whatever the crimes are, whether they're against the state or whether they're just against another individual. If a if a judge just says, "Look, I'm most forgiving." So, all the criminals, the murderers, the rapists, the tax frauds, this, that, all of everyone's walking free. No punishment for anyone. That is an evil judge. A very terrible evil judge. Even though he's most forgiving, he's most forgiving.

Yeah. But I would say it's evil because a lot of other people have to take our like uh what do you call like so if I did tax evasion, I'd be stealing money from someone else and the judge like in God's scenario, I'm doing something against God himself. So if if I was to give forgiveness of

So that would be bad then, isn't it? If you go and let's say you you cut off the judge's toes, just cut off his toes

And he's the judge in that court case.

That would be still an evil judge who just lets you go free if you and gives you no punishment if if justice is not satisfied.

I would

That's an evil judge and a good judge will say that is wrong what you've done and that injustice needs to be made right. I Okay. Well, I I would probably see it differently. Um, because Okay. I think having that I think forgiveness is a Okay. For for example, if someone was to punish me right now

Because you're not a judge. You're not a judge. That's very different. You're talking about a judge.

I'm talking But I'm talking more about about the act of forgiveness. So if I was to

Yeah. In terms of interpersonal relationships, you can forgive a person and in fact that's what God calls us to do. But that's because you're not a judge. A judge should not forgive a criminal at the expense of justice. When when people do stuff against us, we can forgive them because we are not their judge. Um the government has judges and then God is the ultimate judge. And so this is why Islam has a def really deficient view of salvation. Really deficient view. Um and so do other religions. They just think, okay,

If I just pray and I try and do better,

Problem is they don't realize that they're they're still going to do sins. They think they're doing better. God says sins are things that even happening in the mind. If you lust after a woman, you've already committed adultery with her in your heart. Even just thinking those thoughts,

That is true. And I think they do. I mean, I would assume they would like Okay. What's another um

Cuz let me ask you about yourself cuz

In regards of other religions just more you personally your own personal beliefs and understanding. So

You you said like cuz I think what you're coming from is you think you're not too bad of a person. Is that what you're thinking?

No. Uh but I would want to be a better person and that uh and I think it's not about the destination but more about the journey. So like always trying to be a better person but not because if I really didn't regard like anything in this world I I don't think that would make someone so it's it's about though your actions. So on judgment day God looks at your actions. Have you ever broken his law? Not just the actions I'd say. I mean like okay if I did this if I I could have sinned a hundred times or a million times. I don't think it's it's about how many times you sin. It's about how many times you've asked for forgiveness.

Why do you think that matters?

What are you getting that from? Like are you basing on a religious text or what you

No. I mean, I think that's like how I inherently feel, I'd say, because I feel like asking for forgiveness is showing that you're acknowledging something is wrong. And wrong and good, good and wrong kind of like acknowledging that something is good and something is wrong has worth, I would say.

Okay. But it doesn't undo the crime that's been done, sin that's been done. So, shouldn't there still be punishment dished out for the wrongdoing that's been done

If on this earth? Yes. But, uh,

So you think God is going to be less just? So, you think an earthly judge will make sure justice is done, but God is less just

And he'll just ignore what they've done.

Our definition of just is where it kind of like deviates, I guess, because for me, like you said, if someone is all forgiving, then he wouldn't be a good judge. Yeah, I guess I I wouldn't I wouldn't know how to like uh have a conversation on that point like how would we like have a proper understanding of what justice cuz you did give me scenarios but I would like for example you gave me the cutting toes of the judge. I would say that if he forgave you for like on the basis that you do acknowledge that oh okay for example I mean I'm putting myself in the head of a judge but I don't think I'd ever be able to replicate being in the space of God obviously if I was to say oh this guy came to me he cut my toes and I know for a fact that he really uh like he like he's not the same person he realized that it was wrong took my toes and he how do I say this? He in his heart he knows that he he's I mean he's asking for my forgiveness and he's also acknowledging that it's wrong and he's putting steps into doing something which is better for him. I would not hold him up to like oh yeah whether or not you care. I mean I don't really care about how you feel about what you did but you did do that thing so I will punish you for it. Um, yeah, I think what should happen is that even if the this is what often happens, uh let me give an example with the Charlie Kirk murder.

Um Erica Kirk, who's the hus who's the wife of Charlie,

Um forgave the perpetrator,

But that doesn't mean the perpetrator is not going to court. Like she still understands he should get you know the rightful punishment from the government for the crime that he's done but she personally in her heart has forgiven her forgiven the criminal and so I think even you know even in that scenario like the person the victim's been has forgiven the perpetrator the rightful thing for a judge to do is to still punish the perpetrator for the crime that's been done or the injustice I' I'd say that that law is there cuz the victim himself is dead. So no one can hold like justice up cuz you can't forgive someone. I mean someone can't forgive someone if they I mean there's no way of him knowing that the victim like uh the actual victim forgave him. And that's Yeah.

What do you mean? That for like Charlie Kirk was the person was the ultimate victim because he was the one who got killed

And

But notice notice that even on even if a person is to forgive another person for doing a terrible atrocity against them

That person still can rightly and should rightly get punished by the government for their crime.

Even if the person has personally forgiven them, doesn't hold a grudge or something against them, they should still get what they deserve. Like to me like I'm not sure where you're getting your ideas from. Like what sort of religious background do you have yourself?

I I mean I've been in a community full of a lot of different So I've been around Christians. I lived in Malaysia. So there was a lot of Muslims, Christians,

Hindus and a lot of different people. So

So you kind of combine them all to to get your own ideas.

I mean just to have a big idea. Yeah. Just to

Okay.

Comparative. So you you're like you want to rely on you're asking forgiveness to hope that God will forgive you on that basis

Rather than

For me that just

Jesus.

Yeah. I mean yeah I mean intuitively it just makes me feel like I mean it feels like it makes more sense for me intuitively.

I don't see how it does because following your logic. Yeah. If someone no matter how like let's say an Adolf Hitler, right? He's murdered millions of people and yet okay I just ask for forgiveness. Okay, all no punishment for anything you've done.

But

Would that be justice?

It wouldn't cuz it implicated a lot of different people. All of those people were affected by it.

Yeah. It doesn't matter like whether it affected a lot millions or or he's done terrible things and even if mill all those millions of people have forgiven him justice still means he should get a punishment.

Okay. Yeah. I mean yeah I guess that's where we kind of deviate I guess because for me like

Do you have a basis like because like I just think do you have a logical basis to say what you're saying?

Yeah. So like for me sins would be against God and I think having I mean a relation between a human and uh uh God is a personal relation doesn't implicate anyone. So no one is at loss except God who is forever giving forever.

Where do you get this idea from? You're getting this god. Where are you getting that from? Because you can only get that, you can't get that from creation. You can't get that from just looking at nature. God must be all forgiving. You can't get that. So you must be getting that from some sort of religious text because you don't get that from creation.

Like my understanding of what good is I guess like what is wrong, what is good is

Okay. Okay. But where do you get your standard of goodness? I agree that we can have a you know we have God's law written on our hearts in some sense but that doesn't mean God must be all forgiving to everyone like that's not

Like cuz following your logic if you want to say God is all forgiving or most forgiving the most forgiving one

Then he wouldn't even need to forgive on the basis of

Someone asking for it he'll just automatically forgive everyone even the people who don't want to ask forgiveness that's someone who's most forgiving and all forgiven But even under your view, you don't hold to that position. So you don't think God's all forgiving.

I mean to a certain like he's all because there's also different attributes that he has to uphold which uh shouldn't be in contradiction.

Okay. So what what attributes does he have to uphold?

It's also being all just and that also ties within being all forgiving. But it

And what does it mean to be just?

Yeah, that's the thing. I feel like we're having a lot of uh like understanding what

Do you agree with me that justice is getting what you deserve.

Yeah.

So when there's a punishment dished out like if someone does a crime there's a rightful punishment dished out for that crime that's been done. Right.

What is that punishment like? What do you deserve on what?

Well, I think we deserve God's rightful punishment for breaking his law. You agree with that?

Yeah. Yeah. But what is that that I mean what is that punishment that

Hell place of punishment you know eternal suffering whichever way you describe it. It's not a nice place to be in.

Okay.

You agree with that?

And why is it eternal suffer? Like why is it?

Sure. Okay. I'll tell you why it's eternal. Because we sin against an eternal God. And so therefore our sins against an eternal God are not small. They are massive. And therefore we deserve an eternal punishment. Maybe this analogy could be helpful. If you were to go and punch uh your classmate at school, nothing much is going to happen. He might just punch you back or something like that.

But if you go ahead and then punch the teacher,

What might happen to you?

Probably a lot worse. Yeah.

Right. You might um be on detention or something like that. But then let's say you go and punch the principal. What might happen? Yeah, probably a lot more worse,

Right? You might get expelled. If you then go and punch a police officer or a judge in a court of law, you might find yourself in prison. So, it's the same action in all those scenarios. But to whom it was done against was different. And as the person's authority increased, so did the punishment. And so, whenever we sin, we are primarily doing it against God. And so therefore, since he's all authoritative, eternal, all those amazing things, therefore, sins against him warrant an eternal punishment.

Okay.

See that?

Does that Yeah. Okay. Does Does the How do you get information on what the eternal punishment looks like?

Yeah. Thankfully, we've got someone who's died and risen from the dead who can tell us about this, and that was Jesus. Like, he rose on the third day. And he described hell as a place where you're weeping and nashing your teeth. It's eternal. He says, uh, the fire is never quenched there. And he said it's better to lose anything, even body parts, now to not end up in hell when you die because it's that bad.

No,

To go there.

And so, do you think you deserve to go there? Like honestly on your opinion

Like my current state probably not but I think uh

That's why I think you're struggling with this. I think it's because you have this still high view of yourself that you don't really deserve that. It's like somebody if I'm trying to tell somebody, hey look, here's a cure for a disease. And the person's just not convinced they've got the disease

Or it doesn't matter how amazing I tell them that the cure is, they won't take it unless they realize they have the disease first.

And so I think what I did when I asked you earlier on about like, have we lied and used bad language and looked at women with lust and swore and done all that sort of stuff.

That was my way of showing you that you've got this disease, so to speak. You got this problem that you should be in hell like I should be in hell too

For my sins.

Um, and so I think we should come to terms with that that God is a holy God. You said he's all good, all just. Okay. Well then that means he doesn't tolerate even one sin. If you do one sin against him, you rightfully should get his punishment.

Yeah.

You see that?

Yeah. And if if you stand before him, he's going to see all those secret thoughts that you thought that nobody else knew about. He'll bring them all up on judgment day. Doesn't matter that you may have asked for forgiveness for them. Doesn't matter. He said, "You violated my law when you knew you shouldn't have. You willfully did all these things."

How do we get all the how do we know all the attributes of God? Like what constitutes God? Like where do we

Yeah, it's a good question. I think one way we can know some things about God is through looking at nature. We can realize how powerful God is because he's created such a big vast universe. All right. Some of his invisible attributes like that.

Um, but in terms of more specific things, you would have to go to scripture for that. You'd have to go to the Bible, which the Bible's shown itself be true. And the Quran is not true because it contradicts itself in numerous times. Because the Quran affirms the Bible to be true in Surah 5:68 and then contradicts the Bible in numerous points throughout it. And so therefore that has a fundamental flaw in the Quran. Either the Quran is false when it affirms the Bible to be true or it's false in every part it disagrees with the Bible. Either way something in the Quran is false.

Okay?

Right? But compare with the Bible. The Bible's consistent. It fulfills the prophecies that were predicted 700 years before. um and things like that. And so I think and plus if Jesus rose from the dead, we got every reason to trust him. And he clearly described who God is, the standards of morality and also what heaven and hell are like.

Okay. So it comes down to I mean like fully understanding what God is and all his like fully understanding him really depends on uh I guess. Yeah. Uh like scripture.

Yeah, I think scripture is going to be the clearest way that we're going to find out information from God.

Uh, so, but at the same time, we can already know just apart from scripture that God exists.

Yeah.

And that we've done wrong

And therefore we should rightly get punishment for that. I think we can know that even apart from scripture.

I agree. Yeah. That if Yeah. You should get punishment for the things you've done wrong. Yeah,

I would agree.

So, does that worry you that you got punishment coming your way for the wrong you've done?

100%. I think everyone should should be worried about punishment. Yeah.

Okay. But a moment ago, you said you weren't really convinced that you deserve to be in hell for your sins.

Uh, can you repeat? Sorry.

So, a moment ago, I think you were saying that you like maybe maybe I'll ask you this. So, are you now convinced that if you died, then God will have to give you justice for the wrong you've done and that would be hell forever.

Uh, for the start. Yeah. And when you said for hell forever, that's where it really like u I mean, I guess I'd have to trust scripture. And

What makes you think it's temporary?

Because I think the like the all the facts of what hell is should be I don't think it's temporary. I just don't know hell.

Okay. So, let's say you don't know the duration doesn't Okay, that's still okay. You don't have to necessarily agree on that at this point. Okay, you're not saying it's temporary. You're not saying it's you're not making any comment on the length of time. Either way, you still got the biggest problem and that is I've done wrong. I should be in that place of punishment.

Yeah, I don't disagree. Yeah.

So, are you So, you're convinced that that you should be there.

I should Yeah, I should get punishment. Yeah.

Good. All right. I'm glad. Okay. So, then this is where we need

This is why we need a savior who can get that punishment.

It's so strange that you have an aversion to that. Why do you have an aversion to someone taking a punishment?

Because I'd say because you Okay, you're saying the only way for me to avoid that punishment is if someone else takes it. Um,

I guess fully wrapping my head around it is probably

Sure. Picture it like a fine. If you were to break the law in society, you got given a $1,000 fine, um, you could write letters to the government saying, "Look, please cancel my fine. I'm sorry. No, you still got to pay your fine. You break the law, but you don't have the money to pay for it. And so maybe they're going to throw you into prison because you haven't thrown you haven't paid your fine. But then someone's like, "No, mate. I'll pay your fine." And so he generously pays your fine on your behalf,

Right?

That satisfies justice because a fine's paid for. And so and yet you've been shown mercy from your friend who paid that for you and so you're free.

And so we have a fine that we owe to God. And if we haven't got it paid off by the time we die through Christ paying it for us,

We have to end up in God's presence for all eternity after we die.

Yeah.

So, do you see why it makes sense how Jesus could pay it on your behalf?

My question would be in this I mean what makes the fine like what makes it so that I can't pay the fine? Like what why isn't the fine payable? Like

Well, in a sense of you you can pay for it in hell forever. That's your option. Okay.

It's just that you've done what you've done,

The only option.

Well, because for the f for the crime that you've done, the sins that you've done, the punishment due to you is the wrath of God is eventually, you know, you going to hell.

So, the only way that that can be paid off is either you going to hell, getting that wrath, or someone bears that wrath for you. There's no option of like bribing because it's almost like you want God to be able to be bribed

Which actually would make him not all good.

Yeah. I wouldn't say bribed I'd say cuz some fines are like in real world scenarios some fine art are forgiven on some basis like for me I guess yeah just w

Justice being done in that case. I mean, if there's a proper reason for it to be forgiven, for example, if uh I mean, there are different different reasons. But

No, hold up. That would only be if they were unjustly fined or something like that. Like, let's say it wasn't actually true or something. They didn't do the crime. But if they actually did the crime, even let's say there was a a you

know, government that just canceled it or whatever, justice actually isn't being done. Sure, there's mercy being shown, but there's no justice being done. And that's why you need God is going to make sure that none of his attributes are violated. He wants to show mercy, yes, but he doesn't want to do it at the expense of justice. And so the only way justice and mercy can work hand in hand is if Jesus pays for it and we get mercy. Your solution is mercy, but no justice. No one's actually getting punished. So that's not justice.

>> Yeah. I mean, yeah, for me, I guess just coming down to wrapping that those are the only two two uh two uh solutions for for this.

>> What other what other option have you got?

>> Cuz you did say like I wouldn't say it's fully removing just from it because I say I mean yeah all it comes back to what just is I guess but yeah

>> give me any other any other option. No, like I'm saying, I feel like you would still be just if like for example, the law does like forgive someone on some of the that's not justice.

>> That's not justice. Remember, if we both agree justice is getting what you deserve. There's a punishment that's dished out for the crime that's done. We both agree that's what justice is.

>> And there's no justice being done. If there's no punishment dished out,

>> if the if the government agrees that you you've already done enough that you deserve you don't deserve this punishment, then

>> they would remove

>> whatever it is, they would remove the the punishment.

>> No. Done. Like what? Like that's not still it's not justice. If it's like this is what the law says,

>> you break this law, this is the punishment. If someone's like, "Hey, but that person donated to a soup kitchen."

>> That's not justice because it was this is the particular punishment, not don donating to a soup kitchen.

>> It's like it's bribery. It's like judge, judge, I did do the crime, but hey, I did donate to the soup kitchen. Oh well, may as well let you go free cuz you donated money.

>> Come on. Like that's not justice.

>> So you're saying the law is stone cold. So if you do this, you get this and if you do that, you get

>> Exactly. That's what the law that's how the laws is written and that's how justice works.

>> It is you can't just arbitrarily change it. Oh, look. It says this punishment, but I'm going to actually give something completely opposite of the law doesn't prescribe.

>> No, that's not

>> the law changes all the time. So, like if we're comparing if we're comparing God's law to human law, human law changes every single time.

>> What do you mean human law doesn't necessarily change? Like sure, politicians can change human law,

>> but how a judge to be enforcing the law, it should actually be consistent. If it's not consistent, it's a probably a bad judge if he's not showing consistency in how he judges.

>> Yeah, it could be consistent, but it could also be like flexible. Like flexible in the sense where it's not uh like outright saying that this is um like this is

>> look but look what you're trying to cling on to, man. You're like you're being offered this rope to be pulled up out of the well. like, I don't think I need that rope. If I just yell enough times, I'll just pop out of the well by myself.

>> It's not going to work. Like, like honestly, you haven't provided an adequate reason

>> for why you think God is going to ignore all your sins, all the terrible things that you've done in your life. Just ignore it because you've asked forgiveness. That is you haven't provided an adequate reason for why that's going to work.

I mean, I think I like I generally think the problem is our understanding what just is like,

>> but can you give me one reason why you think God's going to ignore all the bad things you've done just because you've asked forgiveness?

>> I wouldn't say he's ignoring it. I'd say he's considering everything else that takes into place. So like there's many factors into into that punishment and it's not just a stone cold rule that if you do this,

>> what's he taking into account?

>> I think all the different factors within yourself. That's

>> the fact that you've stopped sinning. Have you stopped sinning?

>> No. But

>> okay. So that that's So you're continuing your rebellion against God every single day of your life.

>> So why do you think God's going to show you mercy if you're still continuing your rebellion against him? Because it really dep you're saying it only the the rebellion but there's many different factors like if if I choose not to do this if I'm trying to do something better it is trying to break that rebelliousness

>> it's not if you still sin every day you're continuing your your rebellion

>> a different if I

>> different way like okay yesterday I robbed the bank but okay judge I won't rob the bank today but I will murder that person well either way you're still the judge is still going be not happy with you if you're continuing

>> murdering robbing a bank.

>> Comparing murdering to robbing a bank.

>> But notice this. Notice this. You don't again, you're always lowering. This is the issue. It's it's your pride. You're lowering your your actions. Think I don't really do too many bad things. I'm not like those people over there.

>> Man, your actions are abomination in God's eyes. And the soon the quicker you recognize that, the better. If you keep this popped up view of yourself of like, "No, I'm not too bad." God's going to take into account all my actions or how I'm trying to change,

>> man, God's going to show you on judgment day how just how wicked you've been. If you're not willing to acknowledge it now,

>> he'll show it on judgment day, but it's going to be too late on that day.

>> Yeah.

>> God's offering you mercy today. And you're like, I don't want God's mercy. I don't want his provision. I want my provision.

>> Okay.

>> You'll get your provision. you want to be judged on because there just one thing just before you say so if you want to be judged on your works

>> on judgment day

>> God will give you what you deserve based on your works it's just not going to be heaven it's going to be hell

>> okay would you say sins have a different like weightage in the go of in the eyes of God

>> sure I think some can be worse than others but even if you had to count how many sins you've done in your life how many do you think you've A lot. Yeah, probably a lot.

>> Like innumerable.

>> H.

>> So you couldn't even count how many, right?

>> I probably couldn't. Yeah.

>> Yeah. So if you've done that many sins against God,

>> it

>> doesn't matter the weightage. Even sinning a countless amount of times against a perfect God who doesn't tolerate sin whatsoever. He's not going to forgive you, man, on the basis of you changing a little bit here and there. and yet still continuing in rebellion to him.

>> I feel like that's where we disagree. But

>> give me a reason. Have you got a reason? You just say I disagree. That's just like you basing on your feelings. We need something more concrete than that, man.

>> Give me an objective reason. Objective reason.

>> You gave me a You gave me a claim where whatever I do, I will never get forgiven. I I I don't agree with that claim.

>> Okay. But can you give me an objective reason why you disagree with that? So, okay. You like you said any single uh sin I do will eventually cause me eternal punishment. Like uh if no one was to help me.

>> I I need I mean I need uh what do you call it? I need proof for that.

>> But you're the one who's saying you disagree. You're the one who's saying no that's false. So what reason do you have to say that's false? But you gave a positive claim which but you're making because you've made numerous claim throughout this that this is not going to happen or you don't believe it's going to happen. So why what's the reason?

>> Cuz I don't see why it would happen. Why your positive claim would happen that

>> but then but then okay so if you don't actually disagree with what I'm saying you're not disagreeing at all.

>> I disagree with the fact that if I did a single sin

>> and why do you disagree? Because if you were unsure, you wouldn't say, "I disagree." You'd say, "I don't know. Maybe that is the case. Maybe that is actually the case. I got to find out more." But you're saying you disagree, which means you're making now the assertion that it's not going to be that. So what reason do you say it's not going to be eternal punishment for your sins?

>> Cuz I would say I don't where where would you get that information?

>> That's different than that's that's not disagree. When you say you disagree, you're saying it's false.

>> I get what you mean.

>> Yeah. So, are you saying you don't disagree?

>> I'm I'm unsure.

>> Okay. You're unsure. All right. Well, then if you're unsure, then this is uh reasonable, right? That this can happen. Yeah.

>> And so, even on the point of if you're unsure,

>> then you should be like, okay, well, it's actually quite reasonable that I could receive that eternal punishment for all the wrong that I've done

>> and I've got no reason to say it's not eternal. So then I should because this is such a serious topic I should treat it as though that is the case right so that I can think of what can I avoid what can I do to avoid that right

>> yeah I like the okay so the possibility that it could be true would make me search more I guess and I feel like that's what I'm doing by asking more questions

>> also like I mean I guess being over doubtful is always not always good. But I feel like always asking questions and also

>> I don't think you're doubt I actually don't think you're ever doubtful about all topics. Maybe on this on about Christ, but notice you weren't very doubtful about your idea that God's going to forgive you because he's going to like because you've asked forgiveness. You like seem to be set in stone on that position.

>> Yeah. Because Yeah. That's like what I was about to say was like what makes me believe the things that I feel and seeing if it has valid uh like valid.

>> So is there an objective reason why you think God's going to forgive

>> just because you ask for it? Like I would say I mean yeah it's it's that's based on social um like what we're told about uh like different people telling me things and I feel I resonate more with oh him being forgiving than him being uh this oh if you do this you're gone.

>> Why? Just because it makes you feel like people people do the same thing when they think that there's no hell there's no punishment at all. They resonate more with that because oh it makes them feel better. No punishment.

>> Yeah. I mean, we don't base things on our feelings.

>> You know what I mean?

>> We don't base things on our feelings like that. What resonates with our feelings.

>> We want to base things on what's objectively true.

>> And now we both believe God is forgiving.

>> You're just hoping God's going to be forgiving while not satisfying justice with no punishment being dished out.

>> And we come back to

>> when I think God is forgiving.

>> Yeah. But only if punishment is also dished out and assist upon Christ. So the difference is in Christianity God remains just while showing mercy. In all these other belief systems he becomes unjust to show mercy.

>> I think that should this common sense should show which one's right out of that.

>> But it comes back to what just is which yeah we've been through this quite a few times. like what just is like I what justice for me is different to what is here you like and that's what makes me

>> I actually think we have the same definition of justice but you are simply just wanting to change the definition as soon as it relates to this if we both agreed it's the dishing out of punishment receiving of punishment for the wrongdoing

>> what punishments what punishment have you received from God for all the sins that you've done in your life the countless amount of sins you've done

>> okay wait before before could you sorry repeat.

>> What punishment have you received from God for all the countless amount of sins that you've done?

>> Uh I wouldn't be able like tell them maybe there's a few things that he has put in my life that could be set as a like worldly punishment that I may have faced.

>> Okay. So you got no nothing to really can point to to say this is definitely a punishment from God because punishment only works if you know you're getting punished and what you're getting exactly punished for. So clearly we haven't received our punishment for our sins if we don't know we're getting punished or what we're getting punished for specifically.

>> But at the at the start you did say that uh like if I was to do sin in this world I would like God would uh

>> it's discipline. I was talking about discipline which is different to punishment.

>> When you you know discipline is like to try and correct someone's behavior to make them

>> um change their mind about something but Punishment is punitive. So we haven't received

>> punishment yet here.

>> So if we both agree punishment needs to be dished out,

>> well then wouldn't that mean you still having to get punishment after you die then?

>> But we would have to agree that we didn't get punished in this in this earth.

>> Well, okay. Well, what evidence do you have to say that you have been punished for all your sins here?

>> I don't have uh arguments against it either. Like it's just un So you got no evidence to say that you've been punished here.

>> So then why would you think that there's not a punishment after you die?

>> Like some people would say, "Oh, I've been like if something bad happens to them, they would say, "Oh, I've been punished by God for doing this." How would they know?

>> But how would they know that? Yeah. How would they know that's a punishment from God and not just merely a consequence of their own action?

>> There's a difference between punishment and consequence. So, like if you cross the road when you shouldn't cross the road, like on a green on a red line when you're supposed to cross on the green or something like that, and you get hit by a car,

>> you getting hit by a car is not a punishment for crossing the road when you shouldn't have. That's more of a consequence.

>> But a police officer can still come along and give you a fine for jaywalking. That's the punishment,

>> right? And so, and when they dish out a fine, the person is fully aware of why they're getting it. And so when God gives his punishment, it's not arbitrary. It's not like we don't know if we're really getting punished or not. We're going to be fully aware because again, punishment only works if you're aware of that you're getting punished.

>> Cuz if it's supposed to be punitive,

>> you're getting what you deserve for what you've done. If the person hasn't been shown that this is what they're getting as a result of something they've done,

>> then it's not punishment,

>> right? What would it be corrected? Because then

>> again, you didn't know what you did wrong to be able to get that.

>> So, you can't even improve.

>> Okay. But what if I made felt like, oh, I've been punished for this cuz I did this. Like if I like

>> But how would you know? But how would you know that that is actually the punishment for what that action?

>> By a vision.

>> By what?

>> By a vision. Like a vision from God.

>> A vision from God. Are you claiming you got a vision from God? No, I'm setting up a like a like what if that happens?

>> Well, um Okay, but even if it was for that specific sin, what about all the other sins that that person's done?

>> Every time they've swore, every time they've lust it, have they got punished for those sins yet?

>> Yeah.

>> I think the most common sense is that punishment begins after we die. That's why we call it a day of judgment. after we die, there's a day when God makes us give an account to him for everything we've done. He looks at every action, sees if we've broken his law. I just don't think it would be reasonable to say, "Oh, you've already got your punishment now. When you die, heaven, um, no punishment's to come, but God's offering terms of peace with you now. Just know that you don't know how long you got left, man. You could die at any time. You may not even wake up tomorrow. I hope you do have a long life, but we don't know how long we have." and know that you've had an opportunity in this conversation to hear the way to get to heaven. Hear about what Jesus has done.

>> And if you put your trust in him, what he's done, you get to go to heaven. If you don't,

>> doesn't matter if you cry your eyes out before God, he's still going to throw you into hell for eternity. He's not going to show any mercy on judgment day. Your only offer of mercy is now if you put your trust in Jesus.

>> So hopefully you think about this, man.

>> Yeah, I definitely will. I really appreciate the conversation you gave. like it really like u you know gives me a better understanding on like things but yeah thank you

>> man and definitely read through the Bible if you got one at home

>> uh not at home no but I can definitely get one yeah I definitely

>> yeah get one get you physical copy from anywhere um or even you can download one on on your phone as as an app

>> maybe start in the book of John's a pretty good place to begin it gives you a good summary to the life of Jesus what he said what he did

>> start there um

>> and see that Jesus Jesus is it's reasonable to trust Jesus because he's proven himself through his miracles, through his resurrection from the dead. U Muhammad, like for example, he doesn't do any miracles according to the Quran. He doesn't do anything like that to prove himself. Neither did Buddha, but Jesus did, so we can trust him.

>> Okay. Well, I'll definitely check it out. Second half of John. I'll read that down actually.

>> Yeah. Thank you very much. It was very insightful.

>> Yeah, good chie. My name's Ry. What was your name?

>> Uh my name is John.

>> John. Hey John. That there you go. They remember that pretty easily.

>> Um and you can check out this. I got a Tik Tok, YouTube, Instagram needgod.net. Just some helpful content that you might find useful to in your journey.

>> And my hope is that yeah, you

>> you'll find the the rest and the peace

>> with God that you can have your trust in Jesus. Because under all other systems of religion, there's no real certainty. It's all like, I hope I'll go to heaven. I hope he forgives me, but we'll find out in the end. This is I know I'll go to heaven because of the provision he's provided of Jesus dying for me.

>> Okay.

>> Thanks, man. Appreciate the chat.

>> What's your name, by the way?

>> Sorry. Ryan is my name. Ryan.

>> Ryan. Nice to meet you, Ryan.

>> Yeah. And definitely copy down needgod.net if you can.

>> Yeah. Wrote that down. Thank you very much. God bless you, man.

>> See you. See you.

>> Hey, praise God. What a good chat that was with that gentleman. Let's um let's pray for him. Heavenly Father, thank you so much for that good conversation with that man, John. Lord, we pray that you would cause him to have his mindset change, realize his own sinfulness, to not justify himself, but to see that he desperately needs Jesus. That no amount of asking could get him forgiveness, but a sinless savior is the way. So may you trust in Christ. In Jesus name we pray. Amen. Reminds me of that song Rock of Ages. Remember that hymn Rock of Ages? Good my tears forever flow. All for sin could not atone. Um you must save and you alone. Rock of ages. Even if you could ball your eyes out before God asking for forgiveness, that is not going to satisfy justice. We need a savior. Christ is that savior, isn't he? Yeah. Rock of ages. Thanks guys for praying and the encouragement. God is good. Thank you. By the way, John sending in a very kind super chat for us. God bless you John. Behold your king is coming to you. Humble and mounted on a donkey on a colt. the fall of a beast of bird.

>> Wow. I want to say uh big thank you to you John for your uh generous gift there. Thank you so much. John says 1 Corinthians 2:2, "I decide to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified." Amen. That's what we proclaim, don't we? We proclaim Christ and him crucified. He's the only way. Okay. I've put the link in the chat for our viewer chats. So, it's right there. If you'd like to uh come up for a chat, just click on that StreamYard link. Make sure you got a question or a topic. Even if you disagree with me, you want to have a discussion on that point, feel free to come on up. We will get these viewer chats started now.

>> It's viewer chat time here on.net. Yo, get excited.

>> It's viewer chat time here on.net. Yo, get excited.

>> Viewer chat time. That's right. So, who's going to be first in line? Click on that link if you want to come up and ask any questions. You have a topic you want to talk about. Want to say thank you to Art Butler also for sending in your super chat. Appreciate your kindness as well. Say to the daughter of Zion. That's the triumphal entry, isn't it? Where they're spreading their cloaks on the road and they're saying, "Hosana, praising the Lord." And if these people were silent, even the very stones would cry out. I love that the stones would cry out in praise to Jesus Christ. How can JWS think that Jesus is not God when you got verses like that around, you know? All right, I'm going to give you a um trivia question while we wait for our first person. I was fleeing to Tarsus when a great wind caused the mariners to cast me into or mariners mariners to cast me into the sea. Was that John, Paul, Peter or Jonah? So I was fleeing to Tarsus when a great wind caused the mariners to cast me into the sea. And the answer is Jonah. Jamie getting that first in the chat. Missy. There we go. Okay, let's bring up TH. Hello, TH. Welcome. Hit the unmute button just so we can hear your sound. You can th There we go. You're unmuted. Hello. Now I can hear you. Welcome.

>> Hey there. You have to repeat what what is the uh what is the question one more time.

>> Sorry. Yeah, good to hear you. Um well I was asking did you want I was actually welcoming people to ask their own questions if they had any but

>> if you don't have any I could ask you one but if you wanted to ask one go for it.

>> I I absolutely do. I I wanted to I was just curious as to where where your interpretation of the scripture comes from.

>> Okay. My interpretation would be based on reading the text in context, which means reading the the entire book, reading the rest of scripture to see what the rest of scripture talks about it, and then coming up with an interpretation. Now, you could read other people who have written about that text or listen to pastors, preachers, so on who may give their interpretation. But then we don't just blindly trust a person because they've said this is the interpretation. But instead we see if it fits best with the text itself. So the text is the authority. And just like with any piece of text, any writing or any even speech like we're speaking right now, we have to interpret it. So I had to interpret your question, you had to interpret my response. And we can do that cuz God's given us a mind to be able to interpret uh language.

>> Okay. So here here would be my question. H how does it how do you how do you determine objectivity from subjectivity?

>> Okay. So I would say that we can even like your question right there. I am using my subjective mind to come to what you objectively said or asked in that question. Right? If someone says, "Oh, my wife's cooking some Anzac biscuits right now." Anzac cookies. Okay, so she told me that I can smell them. Um, and so I'm using my subjective senses to conclude the objective truth that she's making baking some cookies right now, right? Um, that's just how we do it. That's the only way we are subjective people who use our senses and our brain to perceive objectivity. So would you say would you say you believe uh in that there is objective truth?

>> Sure. Absolutely. Yeah. Like Jesus is the way, truth, and the life. No one goes the father but through him. That's an objectively true statement.

>> Absolutely. Absolutely. So, so that that there's there's an exclusivity to that statement too. Would you agree with that?

>> Exclusivity. Yeah. Like there's no other way but through Christ.

>> Yes. Yeah. No other gods, no other no other no other path one way through him.

>> Right. So we're both using our subjective mind to interpret these objective truths.

>> Yes. So as it relates to like the New Testament, you know, I I come from an orthodox background. You're clearly Protestant. Um, you interpret the scripture as being, you know, you where I'm getting at is you interpret the scripture from a subjective standpoint through a Protestant lens, which is that

>> like through a Protestant lens. When you said through a like I'm like, okay, what is the Protestant interpretation of this? I just read it as it's written there and I seek to interpret it faithfully.

>> Gotcha. So, what I'm what I'm getting at is that that would be then subjective because there's history attached to that those texts that go back 2,000 years as I'm sure you're you may be aware of that those letters in the New Testament. When you interpret those things, those were written to specific specific churches. Some of them are still in existence to this day. And they weren't uh uh uh First Baptist uh Church of Springfield, Missouri. They were uh they were written to the church objectively that Christ founded.

>> Okay. So, just to respond to something there. Okay. So, we have those very letters that Paul and the apostles penned to these different groups of people, these churches at the first century. and we can see that we can seek to faithfully interpret them. And so it's not you wouldn't go to, okay, let's see if there's somebody living in that same region today who we can go to who can tell us what to believe. No, I'd rather go to the letters that the apostles penned rather than even listening to a person who may have been in the audience who who heard it read out to them. I'd rather go to the letter itself. Um, but if you go to history, you have to subjectivity. You have to use your own subjective mind to interpret history or church father writings and things like that. Either way, you don't get away from subjectivity here. You're just adding other sources of information to base your subjectivity and your beliefs on. You're not getting around the fact that you've still got to use your fallible subjective mind to interpret any piece of text.

>> So that's where it that's when it it devolves into being relative. And that's the Protestant western western quote unquote Christian mindset is is that my interpretation of scripture reality whatever the case may be is relative to the individual. You would say well I believe in Jesus Christ. I believe in the trinity. I believe that he is the way the truth and life. But then that can quickly the deeper you get in to the layer peel back the layers of the onion that can easily become subjective and then the concept of Christ becomes very becomes a individual Jesus removed from a a Christ that is objectively true where there's a law.

>> I disagree. I think that's completely straw man of our position. I think we can use our subjective mind which I think you agreed that you everything we any inputs whether you're reading the Bible or you're reading the church fathers or you're listening to your priest you have a sub subjective uh mind with subjective senses that inputs all these things and you just come to understand hopefully what's true that's our aim is pursuit of truth. It's not to become a relative and say there's no truth. No, we 100% know what truth is and truth is was found in the pages of scripture.

>> Where Sorry to come.

>> I would say this. I'd say all of scripture is true. And you agree with that, correct?

>> Uh all of the scripture all of the script uh all of the scripture depending on what what what Bible interpretation are we talking about? Are we talking about the entire scripture of canon? Are you talking about

>> I'm talking about all of scripture is true. Like do you agree with that or not? Uh I believe I believe that the and the conclusion of the new the New Testament are true as far as the the doctr that is is commonly found amongst many protestant denominations and the you know the several you know uh you know there's I don't even know how many different variations of the of of the scripture that there is. But if you're asking, not to get too technical, but if you're asking,

>> is is all of scripture true? When Jesus says, "Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes to the mouth of God," or where Paul says, "You've been acquainted with the sacred writings which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus."

>> Yeah. Yeah.

>> Are they affirming scripture to be true or is scripture false?

>> Yeah. But you you're if you're trying to back me up into a wall saying,

>> I'm not backing you up anywhere. It's just an honest question. Do you believe scripture? But but in order in order it's

>> it presupposes something that not true. The fact in there is where did the scripture come from? Where did it come from?

>> Okay. So you agree that so you agree the scripture is true. And so then our aim is to believe whatever scripture says. And so that's why we have to read it. Read it every day compared to what the Eastern Orthodox Church says that people shouldn't certain people shouldn't read the Bible.

>> I believe I believe the scripture is true. Yes. But but I'm asking I'm asking you a question. I I answered yours. Yeah. Well, no. Well, actually, you're missing my whole point here. So, scripture, all the scripture is true, but then writings of say church fathers, people like that, could they write things that are false? Would would the well that then that would apply to the people the the same individuals including St. Paul who who composed most of the New Testament canon as false because the church fathers assumingly

>> it was a question though I asked could the church fathers write anything that was false in their writings.

>> Uh write anything that's false in their writings.

>> Yeah.

>> Yes. But then that would prove solar scriptorra incorrect. So then if I don't see how that would follow, but if they could, if scripture is always right, everything that's penned down in scripture is 100% right, never false, but the writings of church fathers, we both agree, can have false information on it. It makes sense then that I'm going to go to scripture as being my ultimate authority, then fallible writings, which we both agree could have mistakes, which is church father writings. So that but then then that applies to the individuals who who comprise the scripture which would prove solos scriptorra incorrect because the church fathers were also the individuals who comprised the scripture itself it didn't comprise scripture

>> where do you think a different word the wrong way you're trying to maybe say compiled rather than compile let's let's if we can back back the back the compile compiled Well, just on that point, I didn't I didn't interrupt I didn't interrupt you. Don't interrupt me. Okay.

>> Okay. Just you haven't answered my question yet. So, if you're going to go on a different answer, please answer my question. That is

>> No, hold on. No, hold on. Hold on. No, no, no, no, no, no. I've seen you do this multiple times throughout the channel, steamroll other people, and you expect them to answer your questions, but you never answer anybody else's questions.

>> Have I answered any of your questions so far in this conversation?

>> You have not answered. You have not. You have not. You've answer You've You

>> Ah, I've not You've asked questions and I haven't answered a single thing of what you said. Now, is that a lie?

>> I read your I read your rules in the Discord. You lie. You cut the individual.

>> You cut You're doing it right now. You have the rules in your Discord that said do not interrupt the host. You've asked questions and you're saying,

>> "Listen, man. It's a double standard. Somebody comes on and and we can't interrupt you." Yeah. You come on to my stream

>> and the host of the stream is going to actually dictate what the guests can do. It's like going over to someone's house. If I went over to your house, I'm not going to say I'm going to rearrange things or do something.

>> Hold on. Hold on. That's not Abraffect your That's not That's not That's not Abrahamic. No, that's not Abrahamic. That's not That's not talked about.

>> That's not biblical. You're supposed to be inviting to the

>> Calm down, man. Hey, man. Just calm down. Just chill a little bit.

>> No, but here's the deal. Don't Don't gaslight me. Don't Don't Don't gaslight me and don't talk over me. Follow the same rules for everybody else.

>> Let's go back. Let's go back. Let's go back. Don't gaslight. Hopefully hopefully you've read the view of rules. The viewer rules says very clearly that um do not interrupt Ryan the host while he's speaking. That's rule number two. So hopefully you've heard rule number two.

>> Are you a

>> do not interrupt Ryan while he's speaking. That's how the rules for this for this show. Okay. So now in terms of if we both agree that scripture is always right and never false but church father writings can be false and we both agree that they could be have falsities in it in terms of what's a better thing to rely upon would it not be scripture as opposed to the writings of the church fathers

>> am I am I unmuted

>> go for it yeah what do you think

>> it Again, you're you're trying to presuppose something that's not factual. You've taken the history completely out of play and you said, "Oh, no, no, that's subjective." History by definition is factually it's not it's not subjective. It's objective.

>> Where did I asked you a question? You haven't answered yet. Where does the You're reading?

>> Where does the scripture come from? Where does it come from?

>> So, you didn't answer my question. So, which is a better authority? Here's the deal, man. I've as I've I've answered two of your questions already. You've answered zero questions.

>> You didn't answer that one. You didn't answer that question at all.

>> All right. Here's the deal. I answer this question. I answer this question. You're going to answer the next question.

>> I'm happy. I've been answering your questions already. But man, you don't come up here saying this is the deal. I'm going to do it as if you're setting the terms. You don't come into someone else's house and dictate this is what's going to happen. You're coming on to my stream. I'm going to claim to be a Christian determine how it's going to happen.

>> Is it is it do I get the place of honor? is is being the guest in your house as it would be in the guest as a child.

>> It doesn't mean that you have the right to change where the bedroom is, where the kitchen is. You don't have the right to do that, man. And so, please just show respect. Show respect in this conversation. Instead of getting angry, instead of getting mad, we're having we can have a respectful conversation. But I just find very commonly people for Eastern Orthodox, they don't come with kindness, courtesy, and love. It's more like I want to fight. I want to debate. So, so gaslighting, gaslighting, hypocrisy, uh violating your own rules, double standards, that's completely fine, too. Don't Don't gaslight me. You do you do this to everybody that comes on your show and everybody will have a respectful conversation cuz I'm happy to take you down if you don't want to have a respectful conversation. But I I'd be happy to answer your questions,

>> but apply follow the own rules of which you of what you set up and we can have a very respectful conversation.

>> All right, let me read out the rules. Okay, these are the rules. Okay, I'll read it out to you. First one,

>> you follow your own rules.

>> Get to your question. No, no. These are the rules that for that viewers have to consent to when they come on. Ready? Rule number one, get to your question quickly. Come prepare with a clear question or topic. That's rule number one. Rule number two, do not interrupt Ryan the host while he is speaking. Number three, Ryan will determine if the topic is worth talking about or when it's time to move on. Number four, if Ryan mutes you, do not unmute yourself, which you just violated before. Number five, come with a humble heart, ready to learn, not with a rude or combative attitude. And then number six, no self-promotion or promotion of other channels. Now, this is very clearly stated. It's in the description of the YouTube video. So, by you coming up for a viewer chat, you consent to all six of those rules. Okay. So, let's have a reasonable conversation. So, then can you answer that question? What would be a better source of authority? A scripture that's in that's has no mistakes. We both believe 100 100% true or church fathers who we both agree can write wrong things. Which one would be a better source of of our ultimate authority?

>> Which one is going to be the source of our ultimate authority? The church fathers or the scripture? Is that what is that what your your question is? Am I understanding you correctly?

>> Yes. In terms of Yeah. Which is better. One's always true, one's not necessary. It's going it's going to be it's going to be both, not one or the other. They're not mutually exclusive.

>> Except what if they do contradict scripture? Who then is right?

>> What if they do contradict scripture? Which one is right?

>> Uh name one that's contradicting scripture. I'm

>> saying if they do, which one would be right? I I don't know of any who have.

>> You don't know of any writing of a church father that's contradicted scripture?

>> Not in any way, shape, or form.

>> Wow. Okay. It's interesting. So then, how would you know that you're saying that everything the church fathers ever wrote was always accurate? There's nothing they said that was false.

>> Uh, that's interesting. How much have you read of them?

>> I've read a good bit. How much have you read?

>> Yeah. Because in what they say they various ones contradict each other. For example, in terms of even how they interpret who's the rock in Matthew 16.

>> You mean like James and Paul?

>> Wow. You think James and Paul contradict each other?

>> I I don't I don't. But that's that's a that's a common argument.

>> But this is No, this this is actually different interpretations on different things. So for example, who's the rock that's in found in Matthew 16:18? Who is the Who is the rock?

>> Yeah. Who's the rock found in Matthew 16:18?

>> On this rock that I will build my church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it is what you're referring to, I'm assuming. Yes, if I remember correctly.

>> Yep.

>> Uh so who's the rock?

>> Peter.

>> Okay. Do you realize that only 20% of church fathers think that the rock is Peter when 80% think that the rock is either Christ or the confession that Christ

>> uh that Peter made of Jesus being the Christ son living God.

>> Yeah. Yeah. There's there's there's Peter or the apostles in general. There's there's two points. I don't once again I don't think that that contradicts in any way, shape or form. I every

>> apostle then

>> can I let me ask you a question. Can I can I finish the thought without you interjecting? I won't I won't talk over you. Can we Can we have a respectful conversation as you've requested?

>> We are having a we're having I think that you've calmed down now. I think we are having more of a respectful conversation. So, I appreciate that.

>> I get a little You'll have to

>> Is it Peter or is it the church or is it um is it Jesus or is it the confession? Which which one's right? They have different interpretations of that passage. Let let me let me let me explain because it's it's it's not that it's it's Peter. They're not contradicting what they're saying uh in that that interpretation again. It's it's it's an understanding that those individuals are the apostles or or the disciples or in this case the saints aka they are one in Christ. So whether or not it's Peter or it's or he was talking to all all 12 of them it's they're all one in him. So it's not just it's not just one individual. It's it's all all of those who are in Christ. So as if as as they're as they are uh uh uh uh giving the interpretation of scripture, they're it's not contradicting what the official teaching has always been of what the rock of who the rock is. They're not going to say that that uh Peter if it was Peter, Peter is Christ. Christ is Peter. If it's if it's

>> Christ is not Peter. I mean like they're different. Peter is not Christ and Christ is not Peter.

>> No. Yes. That's That's blasphemous. If anything, man, if you're thinking Peter is Christ.

>> No, no, no. Yeah. I'm saying I'm saying Peter's in Christ. Peter is part of the body of Christ being Peter being Christ. And so either the rock is Peter or the rock is Christ or the confession of Jesus being the Christ. Right? So church fathers have a difference of opinion on that. Church fathers are not unified on most things. Let me give an example. Clement of Alexandria argued that the first sin in the Garden of Eden was actually lust. Not eating the fruit, it was lust. And the serpent was a metaphor for sexual pleasure. So yeah, that's what Clement of Alexandria thinks, but that's not what other church fathers think. It's definitely not what Genesis speaks about, but ETH interprets it as lust. Is he right?

>> Yes. There's there's an element of truth to that. Uh where scripture say this where let me ask you let me ask sin you don't think the first sin was eating from the tree it wasn't like disobeying God and that it was lust where did you get this idea from lust who are they going to lust after

>> let me ask you a question because I can give you you I can go two ways with this when number one I can I can explain to you so that you understand the proper context of what it is that you're quoting there and taking out of context or I can also

>> putting anything here

>> summary of Alexandria.

>> Yeah, this is not a quotation. I didn't give you a quotation here. I'm saying this is what he's teaching in this in this part of his writing.

>> So,

>> does the Bible teach that the first sin was lust and that the serpent was simply a metaphor for sexual pleasure?

>> That's a that's a part

of the understanding of who the serpent was and who the enemy is. It's an unveiling of.

>> I would say that, uh, my friend, where do, who do you think these are? The individ this was the second century was Clement of Alexandria. Alexandria, where, where do you think the letters that they were being written that had been written that were comprised of the canon came from? It came from these individuals.

>> St. Ignatius of.

>> Clement of Alexandria doesn't say that the canon came from Clement of Alexandria.

>> But the point, my question was, where does the Bible ever teach that the first sin was lust and the serpent was a metaphor for sexual temptation?

>> The, the, the understanding and the interpretation of, of the, of the fullness of fulfillment of the truth came from these church fathers in the early church.

>> Where? Let me ask you a question.

>> Other church fathers, they don't agree with this. They don't think that the first sin was lust. In fact, many of them actually agree with the Bible and say the first sin was the eating from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

>> Do, do you? Okay, so to apply to, let's just go back to your, your thing. Uh, let's go back to Sola Scriptura. Do you understand that that Paul and Paul and Peter disagreed? That's in the scripture. They didn't agree on everything.

>> Uh, there's nothing that they disagreed in in any of their writings. You can go through and you don't see any disagreements. So, okay, I think I'm sorry. There's more things I can bring up.

>> Did Paul, did Paul and Peter not disagree?

>> Did Paul, did Paul and Peter not disagree? And Barnabas had had to get in the middle.

>> They didn't disagree on teaching whatsoever. In none of their writings, in none of their teaching, they disagreed.

>> On the Juda, on the Judaizing, Judaizing issue. They did not disagree. That's 100% not factual at all.

>> Right. They didn't disagree. They actually, they both agreed. They, they absolutely disagree to the, to the point that they had to go separate ways cuz Barn, Barnabas had to separate them. It's in the scripture, my man. Read it.

>> Sola Scriptura, am I right?

>> No, that's not. You're confusing a whole lot of things here, my friend. Um,

>> Hold on. Hold on.

>> Book of Acts. Book of Acts.

>> Book of Acts. So, you can go read all 28 chapters, man. You're not going to find that.

>> Instant. So, you're saying, you're saying right with a straight face that Paul and Peter did not disagree.

>> Yeah. Yes. Yeah. So, yeah, you're confusing a couple stories in the Bible. That's not at all what happens. You do not see Peter and Paul having to separate ways because they disagreed with each other on something. You don't see that anywhere.

>> You're going to have to chat GPT that, man. It's not there. But let me tell you what you're getting confused with.

>> Peter, Peter sitting, Peter, Peter sitting with the Jews. I'm, I'm not in any way, shape, or form. It's in the book of Acts. Peter sitting with the Jews. Paul coming around and correcting Peter. They, they disagreed with each other. Barnabas had to break up, break up, break up the issue. Uh,

>> 100%.

>> Chapter and verse. Chapter and verse. There's not there, man. You're not going to find it anywhere. Maybe you got a different book of Acts. It's nowhere in the book of Acts, man.

>> Galatians 2, uh, 11-14.

>> Check that.

>> Oh, is that the book of Acts? So, you've had to Google something. That's not. And plus, by the way,

>> that's not the. We're breaking up something here.

>> We're doing. We're doing petty. Gotcha. That's not very charitable.

>> No, it's just that you're lying, asserting things that are just completely factually untrue.

>> No, you just don't like it when somebody corrects it. It can go both ways. And I know you play it off very well and you know how to debate very well.

>> You haven't corrected me on anything here so far. I'm happy to hear correction if it's valid, but at the moment, you haven't been bringing up something. Let's read Galatians 2. And you're not going to see, you're not going to see Peter.

>> Wait up. You made the assertion that Barnabas had to break up Peter and Paul because they disagreed with each other. Let's go have a look. But when Cephas, that's Peter, came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face because he stood condemned. For before certain men came from James, he was eating with the Gentiles. But when they came, he drew back and separated himself, fearing the circumcision party. And the rest of the Jews acted hypocritically along with him, so that even Barnabas was led astray by their hypocrisy. Forgive me, but well, how be darn. Look at that.

>> And the whole Barnabas part, my friend. Your argument falls apart.

>> So,

>> I'm not sure if you're just being dishonest here, but did, did you read the verse?

>> You're reading it, man. Here comes the here comes the subjectivity again. Oh, now it's subject, now the scripture's subjective.

>> So, where does it say Barnabas broke up this fight between Peter and Paul? Tell me where.

>> That even Barnabas was led astray by their hypocrisy. And I believe, I believe it's what he's talking about in here. There's a part about this in Acts. I don't know where specifically it is, but you're reading it right here. Like, sounds like you're just trolling me there. Like this is just like pure troll or something. Like this is just.

>> It does not say Barnabas. Where does, where does it say Barnabas broke up a fight between Peter and Paul? I'm just, I'm waiting for it. Where does it say Barnabas? Doesn't say it.

>> What does it mean to be led astray by their hypocrisy?

>> Oh, wow.

>> Even Barnabas was led astray by the hypocrisy. Led astray.

>> Barnabas was with Peter.

>> Meaning he's doing what Peter's doing. He's separating himself from the Gentiles and acting regard, regardless.

>> Like the rest of the Jews.

>> Regardless of willing to admit that you were wrong on this? It just, it just, you are, you willing to admit you were wrong on this? It just, it just, it just saw that the people inside the scripture that you hold, you hold to the highest regard disagreed.

>> Wow. Okay. So, are you willing to admit you're wrong on this? Yes or no?

>> Are you willing to admit that you're wrong on this? Yes or no?

>> You're acting like a child right now.

>> No way. Everything's acting like you're acting like a child.

>> No. No. I'm acting like I'm reflecting back to you exactly what you do to me and everybody else.

>> You realize you're going to have to give an account. Objective until somebody.

>> You have to give an account to God for this conversation. Right.

>> Now, in this, so. No, no, no, no.

>> Wait, wait. I'm breaking the rule again. Let me.

>> But you're not God, though. You're not.

>> Okay.

>> You make the law.

>> When you consent, when you consent, I agree that you, by, by coming for you consent to the six rules. By you then violating the rules, you are sinning against the word that you consented to.

>> And that, do you care what God, what God says? If you say, "I'm going to do this. Let your yes be yes and your no be no."

>> You say yes. I will consent to these rules.

>> You're not like, I never said I never said I never said I was going to consent to those rules.

>> By coming for chat. Then otherwise this video chat's over. If you don't consent to, when you, when you violate your own rules.

>> Yeah.

>> When you violate your own rules, it goes up. Look at that. Acting like a complete child. Complete child. He should be terribly ashamed of his behavior right there. Look at that. By coming for viewer chat, you consent to the six rules that you agree. I'm going to consent to those rules by coming for viewer chat. He's like, I don't have to. You're not God. Doesn't God say let your yes be yes and your no be no? When you say I will do something and you then go ahead and violate your word, that is a sin against God. Complete sin against God. And yet for this Eastern Orthodox man, he couldn't care less. He couldn't care less about his word. He doesn't want to let his yes be yes or his no be no. Because as an unregenerate person, they don't care. Often many, many sin Orthodox don't care about morality. They don't care about it because if they don't hold scripture as their authority, their ultimate authority, then they're not going to care what Jesus says. Let your yes be yes and your no be no. But let's go back to this in Galatians 2. What it says here, we don't see Peter and Paul disagreeing here on a point of teaching or doctrine. All we see is Peter being confronted by Paul about bad behavior about withholding from the Gentiles, but not that he was they disagreed on some sort of teaching. He mentioned that they disagreed on the Judaizer issue. What was the Judaizer issue? That was, does someone need to be circumcised and keep the law of Moses to be saved? And so let's see, did they have any disagreement on that? So for that, we go to the book of Acts. So we didn't see Barnabas breaking up some sort of fight. It's like this guy made up his own history of things that are not in the Bible. But if you go to Acts chapter 15, so Paul and Barnabas are having a dissension with some people from the circumcision party who thinking that you've got to be circumcised, otherwise you can't be saved. That's the, the, the Judaizer heresy issue. So Paul and Barnabas are disputing with these people, these works-based salvation people. And they even decide to go up to Jerusalem to the apostles and the elders about this question. And then they go, they meet the, the apostles here. They gathered together to consider this matter. After there had been much debate, Peter stood up. Let's see if Peter and Paul are going to disagree here. If they are on opposite sides about this Judaizer issue and said, "Brothers, you know that in the early days God made a choice among you that by the mouth, uh, but by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe." Notice that believing is how is the response of the gospel. And God, who knows their hearts, bore witness to them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as he did to us. And he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by what? Circumcision? Nope. Baptism? Nope. By faith. And so, we do not see Peter siding with the other people. Those who think that circumcision is a requirement for salvation. Peter sided with Paul. So did James. So did all the apostles. They were all on agreement. All in perfect agreement here at the Jerusalem Council. He says, "So Peter's advice is now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear? But we believe that we'll be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they will." Not by circumcision, not by keeping the Mosaic law, but by grace through faith. Very message that Paul proclaimed. So there's no disagreement in teaching and doctrine between the apostles, between Peter and Paul, contrary to the made-up history that that Eastern Orthodox guy just made up. Oh, they had disagreements on their theology and they had a fight and Barnabas had to break them up. That's just h. I thought he might be getting that confused with, um, when Paul and Barnabas split up.

>> Yeah.

>> Because it was just, that was about not doctrine. That was about whether they should have John Mark on their next missionary journey. But again, if, if he has such a low view of scripture, which he does, Eastern and Orthodox have a such a low view of scripture, it doesn't, it makes sense he doesn't know scripture and he's just heard certain things here and there or maybe his priest has told him some wrong stuff or he's been reading church fathers who made, who told some wrong stuff. But the Bible itself is not wrong. If you have a low view of scripture, you don't read it very much. You don't care too much what it says. But if you have a high view of scripture, an appropriate view of scripture, you'll read it daily. You want to see it as the thing that you live by, every word that comes from the mouth of God. Why would you want to live by every word that comes from the church father, which Clement of Alexandria thinks that sexual temptation is what the serpent was and the first sin was lust? What? Adam and Eve are having lust over each other? Sexual desire in marriage is fine. So why would Adam and Eve, why would that be an issue? You know, Adam knew his wife Eve, that's not sinful. They're married to each other. So clearly Clement of Alexandria is wrong when he says that. Irenaeus is wrong when he says that Jesus died when he was between 40 and 50 years old. There's nowhere in scripture says that. Scripture implies he was 30 when he started his public ministry and lasted about 3 years. That's not 40 to 50, right? He claimed that this was some sort of apostolic tradition that he'd received that he affirmed it from someone who got it from John. See this? I'll quote it. For it is between the 40th and 50th year that man begins to decline towards old age, which our Lord possessed while he still fulfilled the office of a teacher, even as the gospel and all the elders testify. Those who were con, conversant in Asia with John. So people who hung out with John the disciple of the Lord, affirming that John confirmed to them that information. So, they're claiming it came from John, which they must be false on that because John wouldn't make that mistake. John would clearly know that Jesus was not between 40 and 50 when he was still alive on this earth. Um, you got other things. You've got Origen teaching that human souls pre-exist their bodies and that you don't, that you and I don't come into existence but simply get assigned to bodies. Do you believe that, my Eastern Orthodox friend? I don't. Scripture talks about creation out of nothing. Like God speaks things into existence. You don't have pre-existing souls and then we get assigned bodies after that. That's, it is Mormonism, actually. That's a good point. That is Mormonism. What about Tertullian? He believed that those who are unmarried should postpone their baptism until they're married because of the difficulty of obtaining forgiveness of sins after baptism. Oh, I remember that. Yeah. Yeah, the Bible talks about wait till you're married before you get baptized. No, it never says that. You see the absurdities of relying on church fathers. What about this? Hilary of Poitiers in his commentary on the Psalms argues that Jesus's physical body was incapable of experiencing pain because he was God. And though fully man, his divinity superseded the physical reality of his incarnation. Ah, so apparently Jesus' physical body experienced no pain. That is unbiblical nonsense. Unbiblical nonsense. So I'm going to rely on what scripture says. Scripture is always clearer. Always clearer. All right. And I was happy to have a reasonable conversation with that. He's an Orthodox, but it's just he wasn't willing to respect the rules. Let's bring up our next person. Who we got here? We got Steven. Hello, Stephen.

>> Hey. Hello again, Ryan. Um,

>> Hey, man. Good to have you here.

>> Yeah, good. Uh, good to be here. All right. So, for the, I, I had a question earlier. Let me just see. And just quickly, just before you, while you're thinking of your question, I just wanted just to deal with, um, this, um, comment from,

>> Arma. He says, "Ryan, that's a lie. I've been to an Orthodox liturgy and all of them have deep love for scripture." He says, "Um, I know what the Orthodox are like." Well, I'm going to their official statements, their official statements. When I say it's a, they have a low view of scripture, I mean they don't treat it as the ultimate authority. If you don't treat scripture as your ultimate authority, you have a too low view of scripture. You do, you're treating it as subordinate or you're treating as not the pinnacle, as like everything should be tested against that. And also besides that, their view is that, and I mentioned it in that last chat, they tell you that people shouldn't read the Bible in the common language. That the Bible should be reserved for those who are maybe more educated, maybe those who are priests, bishops, those sort of things, but it should be read by the unlearned, by those who just like the ordinary Mary plow boy who's on the street. The people who aren't the scholars. No, the, the look at Confession of, uh, Dyotheus on that point and it says, let me bring it up for us here. Yeah, this is, this is from question number one of the Confession of Dyotheus. Should the divine scriptures be read in the common language by all Christians? Now, this is an accepted Eastern Orthodox confession. Ready? Answer. No, they should not be read by all the Catholic Church because they call the Orthodox Church the Catholic, meaning universal. Um, the Catholic Church, knowing by experience the damage that can cause, forbids them to read scripture. To read some parts of the scriptures, and especially of the Old Testament, is forbidden for these and other similar reasons. That is the Eastern Orthodox position that you're not allowed to read the Bible in the common language, not by all people, all Christians. They'll say maybe the educated ones, the priests, the bishops, the scholars, those sort of ones, but just the general average ordinary person. No, they're saying you shouldn't read it. They have a far too low view of scripture. Anyway, what's your question?

>> Yep. Um, yeah. So for, I, I sent a super chat earlier, uh, about the, um, the Matthew 10:33 verse.

>> Oh, yes. Yeah.

>> Um, uh, but whoever disowns me before others, I'll disown before my father in heaven. So that one. Tell me how I can respond to that in a, cuz the Bible's direct about it. I initially thought.

>> What was it? What verse were you saying?

>> Uh, Matthew 10:33.

>> Oh, 22. Yeah. Here we go. Yeah.

>> Yeah. Uh, no, sorry, 33. So scroll down.

>> Oh, 33. You want 33. Whoever denies me before men, I also deny before my.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah. And, um, yeah. Tell me how I can more, yeah, I can address that verse, uh, with people like asking. It's come up in a debate once and I initially thought it was a law verse, but I guess, uh, yeah, I mean, yeah, how can I address the verse? Uh, yeah, and be able to show heaven.

>> Good question.

>> Yeah.

>> All right. So this is on the back of him saying, "We don't need to fear. All they can do is kill your body." Matthew 20, Matthew 10:28 talks about. And then in verse 32, so everyone who acknowledges me before men, I also will acknowledge before my father who is in heaven. This clearly is implying you put your trust in Christ. And you have your trust in Christ, even though you may receive like persecution, you may even receive martyrdom because you are a Christian, if you got your faith in Christ and your faith is one that's genuine, you're going to be acknowledged before God in heaven. Contrast that with if you deny me before men, which I think would be you deny Jesus to the point of you just say that you're not a Christian. You tell people that you're not a Christian whatsoever. You don't want anything to do and in your heart you don't have faith in Christ. Well, then you are going to be denied before my father who is in heaven. Denying not just to the point of I wasn't bold enough to speak up and and share the gospel with somebody, but denying to the point of you just your heart doesn't have any trust in Christ and therefore you're publicly telling people you don't trust in Christ.

>> What, what was the purpose where he's like, uh, where it says before men? Because when I read that, I see like, okay, so if you acknowledge, um, God before others, uh, which I agree, like a Christian would. But like, if you acknowledge, uh, God before others, then he'll acknowledge you in heaven. And if you deny him before others, he'll also deny before, uh, the father in heaven. Like, that's directly saying like, before men. So, how do we, yeah, how do we deal with that?

>> Yeah.

>> I think he's really first of all, he's encouraging people to not be timid in their faith. Right. That's the first point. Like,

>> Don't fear those who can kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell. So, if your fear of men is holding you back from having Jesus, just remember all they can do is, they can't kill a soul. But someone can kill your soul and your body, and that is God. So you really should be fearing him. Therefore, if that's fear of man is holding you back from having Jesus, it sometimes happens with Muslims. They're afraid of their family disowning them or maybe killing them if they become a Christian. And so some of them don't become Christians for that reason. They just don't put their trust in Jesus for that very reason alone. And he, and for those people, they're being denied. They're denying him before men. And so they're going to be denied before God.

>> Right?

>> But on the other hand, if those Muslims say, "No, I'm going to give up on Islam, put my trust in Jesus." And even if they, you know, they put in scenarios where they have say, "Yeah, I am a Christian. I'm not a Muslim anymore." And they might get killed, you're going to get the appro, even though you got the disapproval of people of your family, you got the approval of God before the heavenly father. That's what's most important. I think that's the point he's making here in these verses.

>> Right. Right. Yeah. Because we see with, um, yeah. We see with Peter, he did it and he did it out of fear.

>> Um,

>> Well, with, yeah, with Peter, he did, he did like deny that he knew Jesus. But I don't think that was him stopping having trust in Jesus. Like, even Jesus makes that clear. Peter, I have prayed for you that you, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned again, strengthen your brothers. So Jesus prayed that his faith would not fail. And it didn't fail. His faith didn't actually fail. He didn't stop trusting in Jesus. It just temporarily wavered a little bit. He wasn't, he, and he sinned in that. He was sinning in that. Um, but then he strengthened his brothers. The Lord even restored him with those three, "Do you love me?" in John 21.

>> Right. Okay. Okay.

>> And it could be like as an evidence as well, like introvert says, could this be a general evidence of our true faith? Yeah, I think someone's boldness, willing to speak up, even in the face of persecution and not willing to give up on Christ is a general evidence of salvation. I think so. Yeah. But at the same time, you can have people who hold to a works-based salvation who may die for their works-based salvation, but that doesn't mean that they're saved if they hold on to works-based salvation.

>> Yeah. Yep. Gotcha.

>> Yeah. Is this verse is, is this verse in any way concluding that someone with true faith will never deny Christ or can we make that.

>> In a, in a complete sense, Christians can have a temporary wavering of where they don't speak up. You know, like they could be.

>> In a classroom, let's say, a teacher's like, is anyone a Christian here? And let's say the Christians don't put their hand up.

>> Well, that would be a wavering. That would be something, an opportunity they should have spoken up. Yeah, I'm a Christian. And stood up for their faith. But maybe they were silent. But that doesn't mean that they've somehow stopped having trust in Jesus just because they were silent at that point.

>> Yeah. They're just.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah. They're just not declaring faith out of fear or whatever.

>> Right. Yeah.

>> Okay. Um, okay. And then for when it comes to people, so I, I would, when I talk to people about ultimately you're saved, uh, purely through faith alone, right? A big thing I would notice is that they would, some people would have a, a big problem just believing that, um, that someone can be saved by faith and then still willfully sin. Um, and so then I would try and explain to them, it's like, you, you've will, like I've willfully sinned, you've willfully sined. That doesn't disqualify us from heaven. I think they just, they just have a bias to like higher level sins. Like this sin is so bad. And like, okay, it's fair enough. Different sins have different consequences and are, are worse off than others. Um,

>> I find what they would do in order for them to think that they don't do willful sins, they have to say all of their sins are accidental or they have to say that those actions they do aren't sinful.

>> Um, I've seen that numerous times. Um, and people comfort themselves by thinking that they're not bad as bad as someone else. At least I'm not doing that. At least I'm not doing that. But remember, Jesus said that's the, that's the whole point of the Sermon on the Mount, or that part of the Sermon on the Mount. He's talking to the people who comfort themselves by the fact that they haven't committed adultery. You have heard that it was said, you shall not commit adultery. But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart. So he's like, you guys have heard this and you may be thinking, oh, at least, at least I haven't done that action. Those people, they deserve death. But then he's like, you've done it. You are the man, right? You are the person who's done adultery just by lusting after a person in your heart.

>> Yeah.

>> And they have to say, "Oh, look, it wasn't willful." And they try and, you know, explain it away, that sort of thing. But it was a choice. You still made the choice to even think that thought or continue thinking that thought. It's, uh, yeah, most sins we do are willful, and Christ pays for both willful and accidental sins that we may do.

>> If you trust in him.

>> Gotcha. So, just kind of like, uh, having that point down. It's like, no, it's like ultimately you're, you're sinful. Um, I'm sinful, or at least trying to get them to understand that. Um, and then, um, and then leading to how the gospel fully saves them.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah. Thank you, Stephen. I have good questions. Um, yeah, I appreciate you coming up and I want to give.

>> Oh, okay. Yeah. A quick one. Uh, yeah. So,

>> So I had, I think last time you had, uh, talked with someone about, um, uh, about the gospel and then I think they were dealing with drugs or something like that. Um, yeah, tell me, what's your process of like sharing the gospel that you've, uh, yeah, what's the process of you sharing the gospel that you found effective? And then potentially later down the conversation going to good works and faith? Um, yeah, just because I tend to get stuck in that, in those sort of areas.

>> Honestly, I, I recommend you sign up for training because that will give you a really good rundown of how, how to share the gospel clearly, boldly, and overcome. Because in the training, we offer like a role play where we can kind of give you like, if someone's this perspective, what would you say? If someone's that perspective, what would they, what would you say? So, that can be useful. If you would be interested, send us a message. It's all free. But, um, yeah, I just share the gospel like I, you saw me probably do on the Yumingle chats earlier on. Um, and then once they understand the gospel of grace, that's when you explain this is how it's going to change you. It's going to cause different desires, different actions, new practices, new disciplines. Uh, yes, you're going to fail, but God's going to be growing you. But I really keep the Christian living part for that later section of the conversation. Don't bring Christian living in too early because then the person's probably going to think that Christian living is how they're going to get saved. So really get them to see if they understand the gospel of grace first.

>> Because initially I was. So what I would tend to, uh, what I can may do is like then take the Christian living as to, no, it's like, you're not just going to wait, like, you're not just going to be continuing in your sin. But I guess that isn't that helpful. Um,

>> Well, yeah, we, yeah, Paul says, "Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?" And the answer is no, um, by no means. And the reason is because you've died to sin. So when you became a Christian, you've died to your old slave master. You now have a new slave master, God himself. His way is always better. And so let's consider ourselves dead to this. And so if we're dead to that old way, let's live in light of that new thinking that we have.

>> Right.

>> Okay. Gotcha.

>> Yeah. Thanks for coming up, Stephen.

>> Training online.

>> Sorry. Training online. Yeah, you just send us a message. Um, either message us on our website or on Instagram and we'll get back to you.

>> All right.

>> Thanks, man. God bless you.

>> Let's give a chance for a couple others because we're running out of time. I'm going to give, uh, got Daniel and Demetrius. Let's see how we go with this. Hello, Daniel.

>> Oh, hello.

>> Darn.

>> Welcome, man.

>> How are you doing?

>> Doing well. Yeah. What would you like to ask today? Uh, I feel kind of nervous. The last guy had a lot of good questions. No, but actually my question is actually about, uh, your other YouTube, uh, channel there, the, the, uh, the music one.

>> Sure. Okay. Yeah, go for it.

>> Right. Um, my question was, well, more or less, I guess my statement is, when I, whenever I watch one of those, it makes it through the end of that video and then I have to sit there through a commercial and then I get, I get to watch another little video and then it's another commercial. And so I was wondering if maybe you might be willing to combine them all into like one long video and put that on there.

>> What's better? Um, like that's, that's a possible option. Appreciate the suggestion, but what may be useful is you can just go to our website, needgo.net, click on the music page, and you can play all the tracks there for free, even without any ads. There's no ads. And you can even install it as an app on your phone, which is what I've got on my home screen. Um, so one of the apps here is a music app. I open it up. I press on it, and it opens directly to the music. And I can just press on it, press on any of these songs, and then it opens directly to the video and plays it. And then it automatically goes onto your next tracks. Um, you know, without you having to do anything. So.

>> But I wouldn't be able to.

>> I wouldn't be able to do that on a TV though, would I?

>> Oh, if it's on a TV, if, yeah, if your TV has internet access, usually TVs have like browser access.

>> Then you just go to ngo.net, uh, on the music page, press on it. That might be an option.

>> Uh, but yeah, I haven't thought about combining all of them as one, as one all the songs in one v long video.

>> Okay.

>> Here we go. Someone says, "I do it on my TV too." Oh, there you go. So, it works on the TV.

>> With the website. Cool.

>> Great.

>> Thanks for letting us know, Brad.

>> Um, well, all right. That was, that was really my only question that I had for you today. Thank you.

>> And there's a shuffle button and that the benefit of that is that it can then be in different order.

>> Yeah.

>> As well because it shuffles them compared to if it's one long video, then they always are going to be in exactly the same order.

>> Yeah. But that's true. Hey, thanks for coming up.

>> I'm glad you're enjoying the songs.

>> Yeah.

>> Cool. All right. See you, Daniel.

>> Yeah. Yeah. So, if people aren't aware of that, install it as an app on your phone or even if just using a TV or computer, you can just go to the. So, how, how you do it, you go to the website needggo.net, click on the music page, and if you want to install it as an app, there'll be a button right there. All right, Demetrius, hello. Welcome.

>> Hi. Can you hear me?

>> Hey, good to have you here. Yeah, I can hear you loud and clear.

>> Okay, perfect. Um, I had a question and they, um, tried to help me with it in the chat, but I had a question about, um, Acts 17 with the Bereans.

>> Acts 17:11. You thinking of?

>> Yes. I used to use this as an example to check things with the Bible before you believe them. Um, but I kind of got caught up in the, what about what if you're supposed to believe something and check it just in case, but like, not withhold belief, like, you see what I'm, do you see the question I'm trying to ask?

>> Okay. So this passage, I'm not fully understanding the question. I'll maybe get you to rephrase in just a moment. So this passage is the Paul's just spent some time, uh, in Thessalonica and then he's getting persecuted and so he was sent away by night to a town called Berea and he goes into the Jewish synagogue there and there's a commendation of these Jews that were there describing them as more noble than those in Thessalonica because they received the word with all eagerness. That's good. I love that eagerness. Examining the scriptures daily to see if these things were so.

>> So they are having a better reaction to the word that Paul's preaching than those in Thessalonica by one having eagerness, but two checking it with the Bible. Yo.

>> Okay. So I think this is a great passage that would show that it's a great principle to check everything with scripture that if someone comes along with some sort of teaching, which Paul is doing. This is new teaching to these Jews because it's not found like spec, he's not quoting just from the Old Testament. He's bringing some new teaching about Jesus.

>> And so they're saying, well, let's see if what he's saying is consistent with our scriptures we already accept.

>> And that's a wise principle. It's good.

>> Okay. Excuse me. So, would you say that it's an example of checking it before believing it or like, what would you say about that?

>> Um, I would say that don't accept any sort of new teaching, new ideas except with or as in adopt them as beliefs except if it's found in scripture. Scripture is our authority. Okay.

>> Now, in those, in their day, in the apostles' day, they had the written scriptures, but they also had the teaching, the verbal teaching office of the apostles, which they were to also, um, follow.

>> Okay.

>> So, but now that we, we don't, we're not living in that day when we actually have living apostles with us. So the only thing we can go to are the scriptures. And if someone brings an idea that's not found in scripture, don't accept it as being true.

>> Okay. Thank you.

>> Is that reasonable? Like, do you agree that makes sense?

>> Oh, yeah. I agree. Because scripture being, you know, infallible is the, is the standard for truth. So, yeah.

>> Yeah. It's the standard. It's we're supposed to live by every word that comes from the mouth of God. And there's no reason to accept say a pope or an Orthodox church as being our authority because the burden of proof, just like with that Orthodox guy we had, the burden of proof is actually upon him to prove that why we would need to listen to his church and listen to all the church fathers when they contradict each other. And there's just no reason. And we saw that with the errors that the church fathers teach, but there's no errors in anything scripture teaches because that's inspired of the Holy Spirit. You can go to something like 2 Peter 1:20, which says, "Knowing this first of all, that no prophecy of scripture comes from someone's own interpretation, for no prophecy was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit."

>> Okay.

>> First Peter, second Peter.

>> That's, that's second Peter 1:20 and 21.

>> Okay. Now, I want to ask you, Demetrius, how sure are you out of a hundred that you're going to heaven?

>> Um,

>> Pretty sure.

>> Okay. When you say pretty sure, sounds like you're about 90%.

>> I mean, if I really think about it, I think I'm sure.

>> Okay. And why are you sure?

>> Because.

>> Like, is it, yeah, what is it? Is it, what's the basis of why you think God should let you into heaven?

>> Uh, I mean, I know Jesus did all the work. So that's kind of a thing. So I mean, that's all I could really say, right? A big part. Yeah. Yeah, he done all, he's done all the work. Now, what made you a bit hesitant to say 100% sure initially?

>> Because I thought about like, what if I've committed the unforgivable sin and stuff like that. So that was kind of why.

>> Sure. Okay. So, you might have committed the unforgivable sin. Well, it based on how it's defined in the Bible, it is defined as people seeing Jesus and people saying that Jesus was possessed by an unclean spirit. Right? That's Mark 3, verse 29-30. Whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness but is guilty of an eternal sin. For they were saying he has an unclean spirit. So this is done by people witnessing the miracles of Jesus with foreknowledge, ascribing his miracles to Satan. So this is not you. You weren't living in that.

>> Oh my gosh. Wait, you just made me see that differently. Wait. Oh my gosh. Thank you. Actually.

>> Thank you.

>> Yeah. A lot of people get worried about it and they just, just go to the verses that define it and you'll see, oh yeah, I kind of done that. That's why you actually see, never, never once is this sin, never spoken about after the time of Christ. You never see Paul talking about it, Peter talking about it, John talking about any of their letters, right? If this sin, it's such a serious sin, if it was something that would could be done by people after that time, you'd be like, "Make sure you guys don't do this sin. It's a really bad one." You don't see it ever talked about. It's only done during the time of Christ because you have to have seen Christ in the flesh. And plus, if you're a believer, how much, how many of your sins did Jesus die for?

>> All of them. Every single one of them. There's not one that he failed to pay for. Says he forgave us all our trespasses, all our sins. So that's why a believer would never have done the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. But you can know that every one of your sins are paid for when Christ died for you if you come to believe in him.

>> So I have a question. Um,

>> So it's saying like, whoever speaks against. So like, does that mean anything bad you say?

>> Like instead of, cuz you said, um, "for they were saying he has an unclean spirit."

>> As an example of what the unforgivable sin was. But what if, is it just anything bad you can say like about, you know.

>> Notice who's saying this. Remember, go to back to verse 22, the scribes who came down from Jerusalem were saying, "He is possessed by Beelzebub and by the prince of the demons he casts out the demons." This is what. So these are people back in Jesus' day, religious leaders who should have known better, who are hearing and seeing about what Jesus is doing and with full knowledge, having such a stubborn and hard heart that they not only just don't want to believe in Jesus, they want to slander Jesus by saying that he's demon-possessed. Beelzebub, like a name of a demon. Um, this hearkens back to 2 Kings 1 when you have Ahaziah, king of Israel, when he fell down, he got, he fell through a lattice, he got injured and instead of going to God, going to a prophet like Elijah, he goes to Bezole or Bezub, depending how you translation pronounce it, which is like a demon to try and find out information. And so these scribes are saying, you know what, the wicked, just like that wicked king Ahaziah did, Jesus is actually possessed by Beelzebub. Such slander against Christ. And they will, they know that he's doing the miracles. That's why they're not even denying that he's doing the miracles. They're just trying to give credit to Satan instead of to God for it.

>> Okay.

>> Yeah. So, yeah, blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is done by speaking. It's not done by just rejecting the gospel. Many people think it's just done by rejecting the gospel. It's not. Um, it's these guys were speaking, saying he has an unclean spirit. But again, it's not done ignorantly. Even if someone was to say this about Jesus today, that doesn't mean they've committed that sin because they're not seeing Jesus in the flesh and knowing, knowing with full knowledge that his miracles are genuine and from God. How do we know that it has to be of full knowledge? Because like the example given is where people have full knowledge, but the explanation of what it is doesn't say that. Well, but who's the "they"? The "they" is the people who have the full knowledge.

>> Yeah, the people who have the full knowledge. Like the, I agree that the example given is, um.

>> Actually, let me give an example.

>> Remember Jesus' brothers?

>> Mhm.

>> Were they initially believers in Jesus?

>> Uh, I don't know.

>> And the answer is no. They weren't. They, they, um, they rejected Jesus initially. You might remember earlier on, John 7, feast of booths, we see that they're like, "Jesus, go up, go up to the feast, if you know, show yourself to everyone." And the reason why they were saying that because they didn't believe. It says here, "For no one works in secret if he seeks to be known openly. If you do these things, show yourself to the world." And then it says here, "For not even his brothers believed in him." Jesus's own brothers did not believe in Christ initially. But do you remember who wrote the book of James and the book of Jude?

>> No.

>> Who they were? They're brothers of Jesus. Earthly brothers of Jesus. So they came to faith, initi, like after a while, after the, the resurrection, they came to faith. But they didn't believe in Jesus when they were here on this earth. Uh, when, so when Jesus was here on this earth and when they would have, you know, they're talking about his works, so clearly they're probably seeing these works as well, the miracles that he's doing, but they didn't believe initially until after the resurrection. But there was something that they said about Jesus, they slandered Jesus at one stage, like they're kind of mocking him here by the way they are mocking him, "Come on, if you really are true, show yourself to the world." They're just, they're trying to pay out Jesus. But there's another time when it says it's, it's in Mark's gospel where it says that his own just brothers, his own family thought he was out of his mind.

>> I know what you're talking about.

>> Do you remember that?

>> Another part. Mhm.

>> Let me see if I can find the exact reference for us here. Yes. It's Mark 3:21 is the reference. It says, "And when his family heard it, they went out to seize him." Talking about Jesus. For they were saying he is out of his mind. So they are slandering Christ right now by calling him out of his mind. But notice they mustn't have committed the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, right? Because they came to faith. His family came to faith in him. See?

>> Okay. So.

It seems to be these people who, uh, have full knowledge. But then also, it's about scribing his works to the evil one to be eligible to Satan, the evil one.

Okay.

And so, it's not just even if someone has slandered Christ's speech or Christ in the past, if they put their trust in Christ, they can be saved. But for these people, they'll who've done the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit back in Jesus' day in Mark 3:30, those are ones that would never come to faith in Christ.

So, a good way of thinking of it, a proof that you haven't committed the sin, besides all the things we've been talking about so far, which already should calm your nerves. But one final thing I'll just say is the fact that you came to Christ at all and put your trust in him is the clearest evidence you've never committed an unforgivable sin. 'Cause those who do that would never want to come to Christ to be forgiven.

Okay.

Makes sense.

Yeah.

Cool. Great. Well, um, and do you have to do good things at all to get to heaven? No, because your works can't save you.

All right. What about baptism? Do you have to get baptized to be saved?

I don't think so. But I'm kind of, if I'm being honest, I don't know what the purpose of baptism is.

Um, yeah.

The Bible actually doesn't give us full details of the purpose of baptism. We have to kind of imply it from just what how it's used. It doesn't say, "This is why people get baptized," and then gives like five reasons or something like that. We don't have that sort of thing. But we just see baptism being done, being commanded, things like that. Not as a requirement for salvation, but just more as a way of identifying yourself with Christ. It's a way of publicly proclaiming, "I'm a Christian." And it's quite a symbolic, humbling act. You have to get wet in water. And it's symbolizing dying to your old self and being alive in Christ. That seems to be implied in the scripture.

Okay.

Yeah. But it doesn't wash sin away, doesn't save you, not a requirement for salvation.

Okay.

Things like that.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Good. Thanks for coming up, Demetrius. It's been good talking to you.

You too. Bye.

Bye. Okay. Wow. Great viewer chats we got to have. I want to say thank you to Matt, who says, "I love how Ronald exposes these lies from Satan." This is regards to the Orthodox chat we had earlier on that they themselves then lie to defend. I know he claimed the Orthodox guy claimed I'd not answered a single question that he had asked. I was like, "Just replay from the start and see that you asked a question and I directly answered it." But yeah, I don't think that Eastern Orthodox was interested in truth. He wasn't coming up with a humble, teachable attitude. It was like he wanted to fight. Um, okay. So, yeah, they can't defend the lies. They sure do try. Squirming worms. Thanks, Matt. Appreciate your super chat. Now, we love Orthodox people. They're not our enemy. We love Catholic people. We love Muslim people. We love atheist people. We love people of any background, but we just want them to find rest in Jesus. So, not to see it as a fight, but to see it as hopefully they're in a pursuit of truth. We're in a pursuit of truth. We want others to be in a pursuit of truth. And so, we want people to find rest in Jesus. That's the most important thing. You know, philosophy is not the most important thing, but knowing about how to go to heaven is the most important thing. It is even the demons being subject to you because of the name of Christ is nowhere near as important as having your name written in heaven. Right? Having your name written in heaven is the most important thing. And yet, for Orthodox, Eastern Orthodox people, they don't find that as a major priority. And they even say that you can't know if your name's actually in heaven because they make it very much based on your participation in the divine liturgy, in the life of the church, your confession, and all this sort of stuff, your works. As Eevee says in the chat, "Have hope in Christ." Amen, Eevee. But we pray for him. We do. Yeah. Pray for him now. Heavenly Father, do pray for that Orthodox guy and all the other chats we've had today as well. Lord, may you, um, bless these people in regards to, uh, if they're not yet trusting in Christ, may they put their trust in Jesus alone to be saved. We want that for, um, many, all the Eastern Orthodox that we encounter that are in the world and the Catholics. May they come to find the peace that we have in Christ. In Jesus' name, we pray. Amen. As ever, be for him says, "We're just messengers, not fighters." Exactly. That's why it's so surprising when they come up with as if they want to have a fight. I'm not here to fight. I'm here to contend for the truth, but lovingly try and share the truth and point people to Jesus. And often, I didn't even get to with these Orthodox. If I tried to get to the gospel with him, I doubt he'd be like, "I'm not answering that question." They always want to stick on more like epistemology, philosophy, those sort of things rather than, "What must I do to be saved?" Imagine that Philippian jailer comes up to Paul, which it happened. Acts 16:30, "What must I do to be saved?" And Paul's like, "Let's talk about epistemology. Let's talk about theosis. Let's talk about philosophy." No, he just says, "Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved." That's far more important than any amount of worldly philosophy that people love to hold on to. And with Eastern Orthodoxy, it's all, it's very much about philosophy. Nicholas says, "Does anyone know where where Ryan talks about the parable of the unforgiving servant?" I haven't done a video on that one. I want to. I've got an idea of doing a video for that in the future. Just quickly, what I'll say though to you on this is that parable is not specifically interpreted by Jesus. But the point I think we can still get it from that parable is you ought to be forgiving, right? Forgiven people forgive. Forgiven people forgive. If you've been forgiven much, let's now forgive much because what people have done against us is small and minor compared to what we've done against God, which is major, very major sins against God. And so therefore, don't be like the person who he just had a big debt in the parable forgiven and then he wasn't able to forgive a guy owed him like a hundred bucks, $100. Don't be like that. Be someone who recognizes I've been forgiven lots and therefore you'll love lots and you'll forgive others lots. So forgiven people forgive. But I don't think it's making the point that if you ever have a grudge or unforgiveness in the future, therefore you're going to hell. I don't think you'd get that from that parable because that would imply Christ forgot to pay for a sin, a sin of unforgiveness, which he did pay for. He paid for every sin for everyone who believed. It's just encouraging forgiveness. All right. Thank you so much. God is so good for your super chat. God bless your patience. Hey, to God be all the glory. All right. Um, Steph thought he put a comment earlier on. I thought going against my conscience was blaspheming the Holy Spirit. Yeah, a lot of people have some interesting ideas and what they thought that that sin was, but I think once we go to the text, it kind of clears it up what it's referring to. And it can't be unbelief because we all had unbelief before we were saved, didn't we? We all didn't. We all rejected the gospel before we believed it. So it can't be unbelief. And it can't be unbelief till death because these guys had done it in Mark 3 verse 30. And they weren't dead yet. All right, let's bring up before we do our Kahoot game. We got an enjoyable song and that is Colossians 1. Is this Colossians 1? No, this is First Peter 1. He was foreknown before the foundation of the earth. This is a great one. Let's enjoy it together.

Therefore, preparing your mind for action and being sober minded, set your hope fully on the grace that will be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ. He was foreknown before the foundation of the world but was made manifest in the last time for the sake of you, who through him are believers in God who raised him from the dead and gave him glory so that your faith and hope are in God. As obedient children, do not be conformed to the passions of your former ignorance. But as he who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct. Since it is written, "You shall be holy, for I am holy." He was foreknown before the foundation of the world but was made manifest in the last time for the sake of you. Through him are believers in God who raised him from the dead and gave him glory so that your faith and hope are in God. And if you call on him as Father who judges impartially according to each one's deeds, conduct yourselves with fear throughout the time of your exile, knowing that you were ransomed from the futile ways inherited from your forefathers, not with perishable things such as silver or gold, but with the precious blood of Christ like that of a lamb without blemish or spot. He was foreknown before the foundation of the world but was made manifest in the last times for the sake of you. Who through him are believers in God who raised him from the dead and gave him glory so that your faith and hope are in God. Having purified your souls by your obedience to the truth for a sincere brotherly love, love one another earnestly from a pure heart. Since you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable through the living and abiding word of God. He was foreknown before the foundation of the world but was made manifest in the last time for the sake of you. Through him are believers in God who raised him from the dead and gave him glory so that your faith and hope are in God. He was born before the foundation of the world was made in the last time for the sake of through him in God who raised him from the dead and gave him glory, that your faith and hope are in God.

A very enjoyable song, wasn't it? You guys love that one. Um, you guys can listen to that any time of the day or night at our needgod.net music channel. Make sure you're subbed on there. But it's also accessible through our website, the music page, but also on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, other sort of platforms that have music. Just search for Needgod.net Music, you'll find it there. All right. Now, Glenn is our great game host today for our Bible trivia Kahoot. So, let's bring him up.

All right, strap on your Kahoot devices. Um, I don't know why I said that, but I did. Yeah, the game pin is 9421899. If you're in the YouTube chat at the moment, you should see a link, um, where you can click the link. It will take you to kahoot.it and, yeah, you'll just be able to pick your name and pick an avatar and you're in the game. Uh, otherwise, you can just go to kahoot.it on your device and then it will be asking you for a game pin. Put 9421899 in. I'll say that again. 9421899 and then you'll be able to put in your name, pick an avatar, and you'll be in the game. What is Kahoot? It's a trivia platform and we do Bible trivia. So, it's going to be about eight questions, uh, to do with the Bible and it'll be multiple choice or true/false or, um, sometimes it'll be type and answer kind of questions. And, yeah, the faster you respond, the higher points you'll get. And obviously, if you get the answer right, uh, you'll get points. And so, yeah, see if you can make it first on the podium. Currently got 41 people in this game. 42. So, if you're fast enough and if you know the answers well enough, then you might be first. But even if you don't get first, hey, it's a fun way to learn more about the Bible. And so I'm going to hit the start button in a few seconds. I've still got people joining and I'm up to 45 people. Wow. One day we'll crack 64 in an instant. That's the next goal. 64. Well, still going up. Team Jesus is in here. Not Schnapper is here. By His Grace is here. Whole lot of other people. I'm going to hit start about now, but it's not too late to join. Um, join late. Enjoy the last bits of the trivia. Looks like a Winter Olympics themed trivia here. Uh, first question. God gave Moses what on Mount Sinai? Was it a vision of heaven, staff, Ten Commandments, or new clothes? Ah, yeah. Moses needed some staff. He would have been a busy man. He needed to do some delegation. So, was staff the right answer? Or was it a vision to help him? Or was it some special new clothes? Not at all. It was the Ten Commandments that was given to him on Mount Sinai. And so, scoreboard, no one got a perfect 1,000. Um, but just Roderick, you are first. Uh, characters of a language I don't understand, you're in second. Math boy Anthony, you're third. Be is fourth. And Mike is fifth. All right. Question two. Jesus came to seek and save the holy, lost, sad, good, or cats. Woo. There's 53 people in this Kahoot and you've all answered the questions already and you all got it right. Came to save the lost. Of course, that question was maybe a little bit too easy. Clay Cup, well done. You've moved up into fifth and up 21 places is Schnapper. You're the highest climber. Well done. Third question. After he was born, Jesus was placed in a field, shoe, manger, bed, or a cat? Wouldn't be very nice to be put inside of a cat. So, it can't be that answer. Right answer is a manger. And yeah, some of you are confused. You probably think I'm going crazy, but I already know. Jos Rodrik, you're maintaining first. Well done. Bethany is in second. Thursday is in third. Three characters of a language I don't understand is in fourth. And Mike, well done. You're fifth. Up 12 places is Ross. You're the highest climber. Well done. Question four. Jesus fasted how many days? Was it 114? 40 or five? 52 of you have answered. 53 of you have now answered. The answer was 40. So, let's see if we've had any change. Notchnapper is up into fourth and Mike is in fifth. And six participants have reached an answer streak of three. So, if that is you, well done. Question five is a true and false question. John found a place to baptize people because the water was plentiful there. Is that true or is that false? Oh, the poor kitty. Cats don't normally like water falling on top of their heads. Such a cool photo. Oh, that's a real mix. Um, yeah, that was a good question. Uh, the answer was true. John found a place to baptize people because the water was plentiful there. True. Okay, you all have learned something today. Thursday is in first. Just Rodri is in second. Not Schnapper is third. Camper is fourth. Schnapper is fifth. Oh, we've got Notchnapper and Schnapper on the scoreboard. And up 20 places is Melanote. You're the highest climber. Well done. Question six. How does Jesus describe the separation when he judges people? Is it sheep and goats, pigs and dogs, wolves and sheep, or lions and lambs, or cats and dogs? They are your choices. And if you're looking for the cats and dogs one, that was not actually an option. That was just me being silly again. The answer is sheep and goats. And scoreboard. Thursday's maintaining first, not snapper second, camper third, snapper fourth, math boy Anthony fifth. Combo breaker. Six participants just dropped their answer streak of five. Don't give up. Penultimate question is a type your answer. Jesus took Peter, James, and who up a mountain? Oh, cute dishes. Are they dishons? Oh, they got little camping camping things on their backs. Their little teeth or their little sleeping bags or whatever. Are they dashes? Maybe not. Can't tell from this angle. Uh, you got 7 seconds. Jesus took Peter, James, and who up a mountain? Peter, James, and Answer wasn't Paul and it wasn't Cat. The answer was John. Let's do a quick review. No. No. No. No. No. Johnny Boy. No. No. Paul. Luke. Elijah. All right. It was Johnny Boy. Well done. See the scoreboard. Thursday is maintaining first. Notnapper is in second. Boy Anthony is in third. By His Grace is fourth. And Joseph, you are fifth. Well done. Up 12 places. You sister. Sister, you're up 12 places. You're the highest climber. Well done. Okay, get your clickers and your tappers ready because this is the last question. A double pointer. What book comes after Genesis? Is it Judges, Joshua, 2 Kings, or Exodus? I'm going to do that. What is the next book that comes after Genesis? Judges, Joshua, 2 Kings, Exodus. 48 of you have answered. Some of you have given up. Everyone who answered got that right. It was Exodus. Let's look at the podium while Ryan quickly wolfs down the last of his, uh, lunch. Ryan the Wolf. Is he a wolf or a rhino? Math boy Anthony. Third place. Well done. Second place, By His Grace. First place with 8,743 points. Notep. Well done. Fourth place, Thursday. Fifth place. Fifth place, Joseph. And that's the trivia for today. Over to you, Sir Ryan.

Thanks, Glenn. Yeah. And, um, Glenn, what what song have you been enjoying recently on the Needgodnet music channel?

I listened to it last night. It's my absolute favorite song of all time, and it's based on Luke and Isaiah. Um, "Taking the Blind Out of the Dungeon." That one, I don't know the name of it. That's a good one. "Open the Eyes That Are Blind." Such a good one. I enjoy that one as well. Thanks, Glenn, for sharing that. All right, we're going to now, uh, pray and after that, we'll do the outro question. Heavenly Father, thank you for, uh, the stream, allowing it to go on, sustaining the technology and our voices and things like that. Thank you for the opportunity it was to speak to different people across the world. Help us to love you more, get to know your word better, and to live in accordance with what you have to say. Thank you that your word helps us in every way. May we trust you more and pray for loved ones, family, friends, and others who don't know you. May they come to know you today and give us a good, all a good night's rest this evening. In Jesus' name, we pray. Amen.

All right. All right, if you agree with that prayer, feel free to say amen. And we'll now do the outro question. So, outro question. Math Boy's got one for us. What book of the Bible is most interesting to you? Most interesting. That's an interesting one. So, not just like what's your favorite, but like what's most interesting? Something that's maybe stood out to you like, "Oh, this is got me thinking." I think Proverbs is a bit like that. Proverbs gets you thinking when you read through it. So, goodbye from Ryan. Say hello from Paul. Yes, Ryan. I was going to say the same.

See from Glenn. Ecclesiastes. Easy.

I'm New Testament. I'm Acts. I love that story. All, you know, all the stories in Acts. It's a good. Bye from Phil.

Yeah, I have to go with, uh, maybe Revelation. It's a bye from Spencer.

I cannot get enough of John, especially John 17. I just mentioned the other day. It's a bye from Eevee.

I think I'd agree with you, Phil. Acts has been super interesting to me lately because we're going through it in the Bible study and we're also doing a Bible study on it at our church. So, it's been fresh on my mind. Goodbye from Brandon.

Yeah, this is really hard to pick. I'm busy in the Old Testament at the moment, but I would have to say Genesis just in terms of interesting stories. Uh, yeah, bye from Breeze. The Lord won't. We'll see tomorrow from Andy, David, EJ, Edson, Elad, Ethan, Yen, John, Kevin, Nathaniel, Nathan, Nick, Pearson, Stephanie, and whoever else that may have served today or will serve. Um, I, it's so hard to choose honestly, but, um, I think as I'm going over the Psalms more, I just see more of Jesus in them and it's blowing my mind. So,

Hey, thank you for your answers. Bruce gave a harmony answer. They all are. Uh, we got Genesis, Job with an S, uh, Leviticus, Revelation without the S, which is correct. Uh, Jonah, Proverbs, and what else? A few more people saying Revelation. Actually, Bethany is saying all of them. Psalms, Ecclesiastes, Habakkuk, Romans, James, and Jude, Judges. Hey, I think we got about 15, 16 books of the Bible mentioned in this answer. Someone said Daniel. All right. Well, thanks guys for hanging out with us. We're back on again tomorrow, Lord willing, at 7:00 p.m. Eastern, which is 9:00 a.m. Brisbane time. Be great to have you back. And until our next stream, go serve your King. And make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always to the end of the age. To the end of the age. And behold, I am with you always to the end of the age.