ItsMeSpkn2U Ep. 140 The Legendary Popin' Pete

Everything, everything, going to be all right this morning. You ready? Yep. Let's go.

All right, ladies and gentlemen, off to the races once again for another installment of It's Me Speaking to You, your ever faithful host, Mr. Jeffrey Wilson. Man, this is just one of those episodes. It's just, it's just does good to me, man. It does good to me. I feel like I know this cat already, even though I don't. And I feel like I met him when I was 12, but I didn't. But he was on the silver screen in an '80s classic film called Breaking. And you know, he's got way more to his resume than just that. And the fun part about all this, man, doing the kind of the deep dive I've done. We've had to kind of recalibrate, reschedule a couple times because he is just like stacking the frequent flyer miles. What he was in China not too long ago. Came back home. Went back to China. Then to Bali, heading back to China soon, teaching this dance, this genre of dance, this style of dance that popped off, no pun intended, almost 50 years ago. Man, you talk about staying power. I cannot thank him enough for his time. He's probably still a little jet-lagged 'cause like I say, he's been flying all across the pond. Popping Pete is joining us today. What is up, my friend, man?

You know, chilling, man. Relaxing, you know, happy to be home. I'm happy to be in my own bed and, uh, and all that, all that stuff. As much as I love traveling, but, uh, and no place like home, you know, Wizard of Oz. Click, click, click. My without a doubt. Slipper.

Well, like, you know, you, you stay busy. So, when you do get that downtime, man, how do you like to spend that downtime?

Man, I sleep, dude. I rest. I watch a lot of, you know, I love television, music, but I watch a, I'm a sports head, you know. I watch a lot of sports. I'm watching the Olympics, of course, like a lot of people are doing. Uh, but yeah, mostly, man, just relaxing. Sometimes catch up with, you know, definitely not sometime catch up with friends, you know, and stuff like that. But yeah, but mostly relaxing and, and, and chilling out, resting that body, resting that body 'cause like, you know, he's been doing it for, doing it for a hot minute. Doing it for a hot minute.

But man, I mean, like any origin story, man, we got to go, we got to go back. We got to go way back, back into time, as they say. And man, I mean, most people, most people think, you know, the popping style, boost style started in LA, and that would be incorrect. That's what I thought. But a couple clicks north in Fresno, California is where the story begins. And correct me if I'm wrong, if I'm wrong on the address. 16340 Cusco, Fresno, California. Is that close?

No, no, that, that's Compton. That's Compton. Okay. That's when I lived in Compton. Okay. My bad. My bad. Fresno was, uh, uh, 53 East Garrett, West Side, Fresno is where I was living and reside.

That's what's up. That's what's up. So, I mean, it's, it's crazy to, you know, this story goes so deep and it really begins with your brother, man, Bugaloo Sam. Talk to me about it. We're going like the mid-'70s here, ladies and gentlemen. Again, this brother is out here teaching, traveling for a dance style that, that was created 50 years ago and mad staying power. It's transcended geographical boundaries and, uh, but it all started right here in the mid to late '70s in Fresno, California. Talk it up, man. Where do we start here, man? Talk about Bugaloo Sam and how it all began.

Well, you know, I mean, you know, growing up in the, you know, especially in the '60s, you know, we, we come from a, a dancing family and stuff. And, um, and Sam, you know, Sam was the, the third, uh, third oldest. No, second oldest, sorry, second oldest. And, um, and, you know, just all my siblings dance, my, you know, my parents dance. So Sam was just this, this person who had this, uh, always had a very, you know, dope approach to dance, even if he learned whatever, uh, style or movement that was going on in the, in the '60s and, uh, and ironically, Sam was shy, Sam, you know, but when he did dance, he would put extra or something different into something that we, you know, that's out, like be the funky chicken. And actually, he'd do, do approach it, uh, and have some extra, uh, little things that he'd do within the dance. Um, and that's something I found interesting, too, bro. Not to interrupt, but like things like you just said, like the funky chicken or the jerk or the twist. It was from your parent, you know, the parents and everything, but he put his own little stank on it. I thought that was very fascinating.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that's the thing. Yeah. Because, uh, you know, his, uh, you know, growing up in that era, like you said, and Sam was three years older than me. So growing up, uh, and was seeing these other dance styles that the older generation were doing, or, you know, the aunts and the uncles and the, you know, the older cousins. So Sam grew up around there and plus Sam, you know, grew up around, uh, you know, some of his relatives taking him to the, to the juke joints back in the, in Fern, you know, and, and being around, just being around dancing and then adapting and then understanding how to, uh, take something like the, the jerk and the twist and, and adapt it into to his movement and then, you know, but doesn't, but it, it doesn't look like the jerk and he just takes it up and rearranges and stuff. So that's how the whole popping, you know, as far as, and again, you know, let me make this clear. We as the Electric Boogaloos are originally called the Electronic Boogaloos, you know, the Fresno. I'm Electric Boogaloo from Long Beach. That's when I moved to Long Beach. But Sam had a prior group before I got in the group of the Electronic Boogaloo Lockers. And those guys were the, uh, along with Sam, were the architects of the, of the Eie style of movement. And again, you know, Bay Area had their style, whether it be Filmore, strutting, posing, you know, different things. And Fresno, and then they have also have a boogaloo, you know, and then we have what we call electronic boogaloo style, origin, that's original name changed to Electric Boogaloo style. Uh, Sam, you know, using the, you know, the, uh, the twist and then just, you know, his how he moved his legs and ropes and stuff like that, isolation. So, and this is stuff he was doing as a field because it, it was never the situation like say, Boogaloo was this thing he got. The, the name got attached to his movement because people, it just meant in some black community, especially down south, it's, it's, you know, again, history and the, the, uh, Boogaloo is a different dance style than what we do and what the Bay Area does 'cause original is the Latin Boogaloo, which came out of, came from New York in the '60s, in the late '60s and stuff. So the, we just borrowed the name. The reason why the name got attached to Sam and how Sam got my brother, Boo Sam, got his name is because people just see how he moved and said, "Man, you know, the older people who unders using the word said, 'Well, do that, Sam. Do that, Sam.'" So, which means just like you getting down, you getting busy. And then the name stuck with what he was on. He didn't just go, "You know what? Let me do this thing. I'm going to call it Boogaloo," right? It was just the, the older people around him. That's, that's how he got his name because they kept saying, "Do that Boogaloo, Sam." So they start calling him Bugaloo Sam.

Yeah. It's crazy. Go ahead. Sorry. Go ahead.

No, go ahead. No, I just, as someone, I'm from, I, when breaking and all that stuff was so huge, man, I was a Midwest kid from Iowa. Davenport, Iowa. Yes. Breaking, you know, got there, too. But I just, I didn't know the background, brother. I swear. I was just, I saw people doing all these moves and I thought it was just kind of everyone's just borrowing from different random moves that people did. But I was just sleeping on the fact that there was so much methodology to this. I mean, Sam had talked about it. Almost reminds me of a martial art, like 14 different styles that are within this style that make this style, etc. And it's just, I don't know, man, just learning. Like I said, doing the deep dive I've done on the interview today, I just got so much more of an appreciation. Even at 50 years old and as old as this, this genre is, I'm still learning. And like I said, it reminds me of a martial art because there's so many layers to this and so many disciplines to it. I find it very fascinating.

Oh, yeah, of course. I mean, that's, you know, that's the thing. How we even approached it back then, you know, uh, because in the, like I said, the 14, 'cause it's 14 moves and styles under the Electric Boogaloo or Electronic Boogaloo umbrella. So it's not like it's the, the mis, the misunderstanding about it. They, everybody think popping is the umbrella term. Popping is just one singular style within, uh, you know, other genres of style where you have waving, cutting, kicking, scared, puppet, you know. So, uh, so these, these moves, you know, within the Electric Boogaloo that we ourselves, uh, created or did, was we have, um, you know, eight moves and six styles. So that we do under, like, we don't, I mean, I can wave, I can touch, but those are not considered Electric Boogaloos because we didn't, or electronics, we didn't, um, had any hand at creating that. It was just stuff that other people did moves. So, and like something I've seen like 10 trillion times but didn't know it had a name for it. The old man, like it's one of the most basic moves in Boogaloo, but it's like, you know, there is a story and an origin to these moves. It's again, it, it gives me a deeper, deeper appreciation. And, um, you obviously, you know, even according to your brother Sam, man, you were a quick learner with this stuff. By the time you first started getting into it, and honestly, I, I find it fascinating when, uh, listening to Sam being interviewed, talking about how he was telling you about it, about this new dance, and he's like, I can hear him on the phone trying to tell, he's telling you're telling, he's telling you about how you like popping your body, popping your muscles, and something like, he can hear you on the phone like trying it as he's explaining it to you. I thought that was pretty cool.

Yeah. And that, that's so funny because the dude, you know, when I saw that interview, you know, because that's the same, I, I tell the same interview, same, same situation through my perspective of what happened. And that exactly. But, but what I was doing and what I saw him do later, uh, what he came to visit, you know, came, you know, to see us, was totally different. It was like, you know, my interpretation of it. And he, exactly. I was on the phone and I'm sitting there trying to, he said, "You got to, you got to snap your, you know, your, your muscles or you got to pop your muscles." You got to do. And I'm sitting there like, you know, I'm trying to do it, but it's not what he's hearing is me attempting, right? What, what I was doing was totally, totally, totally different. What I do. I said, and even, even when I was doing it, it didn't make any sense to me. And it was because I was doing it all wrong. So, in my mind, I was going, "This, this is whack, Bill." Like, this, what, what is this? But I tell, but I was saying to him on the phone like, "Oh, okay." Like I had it. I'm going, "Yeah, yeah, yeah." Then he told me about Boogaloo, man. He said, "Make your body, you make your legs roll and your body isolation." And I'm, man, what I wish I had a camera back then. You was, it would have been like, "This is what, what are you doing?" And when I saw him actually do it, my mind was like, "Wait a minute. My jaw hit the floor. My eyes bucked. Oh my god." It was, we were not in the same realm of what I thought and what he did. And it's, I mean, it's so, I mean, obviously you got way better, you sker rabbit. I mean, it's just amazing. I've always, man, I've always, and not to mix the language, but I'll just use it as a generic term, like the popping. I've always, I didn't mind break dancing the floor, top rock, and all that. I thought that was cool as [ __ ] too. But there was just something about popping. And especially Boogaloo, what you guys would do in, like, not just hitting the beat, hit it, boom, boom. But what you would do in between beats with your legs and your body, it was, it was so clean. And the precision how you guys would hit those beats, just so next level, man. Sker Rabbit, you, I mean, all of you guys were just clean as hell. And it was just aesthetically so pleasing to just watch. You know what I mean? It was just so dope how you guys would just master that art. And, you know, it's interesting how you guys start feeling yourself, if you will, and realize like, man, we're on to something here. And talk to me about, talk to us about that trip. You're like, man, we need to go get discovered. We need to go to Hollywood and get discovered. And how that whole process went 'cause I think it's very fascinating how you guys hopped the train or hopped the, hopped the bus from Long Beach to basically what you thought was Hollywood and Beverly Hills, wound up in East LA, and how that whole thing did, still change the trajectory of you guys' life and how that got you guys into the Soul Train realm.

Yeah, you know, you know, once we started, you know, and I started like March of 1978. So, uh, I was 16, you know, and again, Sam, you know, me seeing it and then trying to learn it, it wasn't, wasn't easy, you know, as much as, you know, I called on. But I, I still wasn't even like Sam and the original guys. See, that's something like the, we talking about Darnell, which is Twist D, Kicking Wheel, uh, Toyman, Ski, the Skita Rabbits, and my other cousin named Ski. All these people already on the level, you know, they 15, 16, 17, already on this, this amazing level of the dance. Like Sam, here it is, me, my brother, and other people in the neighborhood of Long Beach, we're just learning it from this, this baby inception. And it was hard. It was like, I practiced every, every day, whether I'm going to, I'm in, I'm in high school at the time. I'm, I'm at school. I'm walking into school. I'm in the grocery store with my mom. I'm trying to pop my arms. So when I, again, just going back, when I saw popping and Boogaloo, two separate dances, right? I gravitated towards popping. Boogaloo style was way more difficult. And, and people say, well, because popping is, is more seemed to be more energetic and stuff. I said, "Well, yeah, it was hard, too." But Boogaloo was this, this precision roll, isolation, timing, groove, got out of a bunch of stuff. So, a lot of people didn't gravitate towards learning popping. Um, I mean, learning Boogaloo. Popping was the more, uh, uh, dramatic, uh, dynamic, uh, um, dance that people seemed to be seeing the jerking of the muscles or the popping of the muscles, but, but didn't understand within that, there's a groove, a feel, a flow, even with popping. So now, once we started learning and, and, um, which is like, our first gig was, man, I think I, I think I was only five months of learning and we ended up getting an audition. Now, how we got the audition is, one day I'm, we're sitting around. Now, we, we had formulated the group. Uh, it was me, Robot, name Puppet Boogaloo, Sam, Creeping Sid, and Scarecode Scouting, you know, we, Long, all these long cats, and we would do stuff locally, you know, uh, we actually had our own show at, uh, one of the high schools, Poly, Polytech High School in Long Beach. That the city, we went to the city and they, they let us, um, uh, rent a, rene, uh, gave us the, uh, the, the auditorium that we can do the show in. We put together this variety hour show that we had other dancers or stuff, and we sold tickets. So, which is way after us learning. Now, now, once we started becoming locally, you know, recognized and be, we called ghetto celebrities. And actually, the first television show we did was with Shabba Doo, and it was on a show that he was featured on called Real People. Which this TV show called Real People would go out, they would do interviews with people. So they did a, they wanted to do a segment on him. He wanted to do it in Long Beach and then he featured us within it. And you can actually, it's, it's, it's online. Got it. It's sometime, Shabba Doo, Real People, and you'll see Young Popin' Pete, Sam, all of us. We did a little section at the, at the rec center that we used to always go to called the Hutch in Long Beach. So now, doing all that, and then, uh, um, and then this is what I'm saying. This is prior to that. I'm sorry. One day I said to to everybody, "Hey, man, we live in Long Beach. Hollywood is not that far. We should go get discovered 'cause now we know we ghetto celebrities. We just, you know, everybody knows we have house parties, you know, we at the rec centers and stuff." And again, this is before the Shabba Doo thing. I should make, make that note. So one day, you know, I'm 16 and, and actually Skival was there, but Skra wasn't in the Electric Boogaloos. He was just kind of like the, we, he was the, the guy that carried the radio and, and was learning, but he wasn't actually in the group yet. Just, uh, the B-Dane, Sam, and Creeping Sid. I think it was me, uh, Ski who came along, Robot, Dane, Sam, and I think my little brother Chicken Deck came. So, we, I said, "Man, we should go to Hollywood." And we asked our father, "Could we use the car or the van?" We had a, a van, and he said, "Nope." So, we said, "Man, we got to get on the bus." So we ended up f, you know, finding a bus route from Long Beach, which now we got to stop in downtown Los Angeles to make a transfer. We, you know, we, and we doing this all, uh, calling, you know, calling the, the, the bus hotline to figure out how to catch the bus. But we ended up figuring out the bus route, the numbers, culture bus, taking us two hours to get to what we considered Suns 'cause all we knew is like, you know, Sunset Boulevard. It wasn't Hollywood Boulevard, even though Hollywood, but Sunset Boulevard was like, "Hey, you saw the movie, saw all that's where all the stars hang out at and drive down." So we, we getting it up again, get on the bus, get to, we get to Sunset. We saw Sunset. We pulled the, ain't no day. You pull a little cord on the bus. Bing, the bus pull over to whatever the next bus stop is. And we get off and we look around and we was like, "Wait, is this?" We thinking Hollywood is paved with gold and, and all the, you know, the, the, the expensive, uh, shops up there. And we like, "Huh?" Like, we, I'm looking, what is this? And it says, we look at the, the street sign. Is this something? We like this. So, we walked into a shop. We asked a guy, like a Mexican man, to say, "Hey, is it, uh, Beverly Hills, Hollywood?" You know, we, He said, "No, you're in East LA." East LA. He said, "Beverly Hills is, is about, uh, 10 miles or so down." And we going, "But this is Sunset." He said, "Yes." Our naive, uh, selves was like, "That's a long road. That's a long road, but there got to be, this is Sunset. So why would we not?" So we don't know if they, these stars or people don't come all the way down to this end of the Sunset, right? So what we going to do is not get back on the bus because we don't, we don't, we don't want to miss our opportunity. So we walked from East LA to Beverly Hills, 10 miles, almost. It's probably, it was definitely 10 plus, and it taken us a couple hours. And then every, every, we walking, and every time we see a limo, we on a stop on a corner or whatever, we on a, we started dancing and just like looking at the thing like, "Man, look at us." We don't know if it's a, a wedding, a funeral, a bar mitzvah. We don't know what's going, what's going on inside of there. They could be, you know what I mean? So, and then it'll move on, and we keep walking till we got to the 9,000 block of Dhini and Wilshire, and we saw a big, tall, black building, which is still standing, still black, and is still there. And we said, "That looks important. It's all black. It's got to be somebody that's going to discover us." And, and it's so funny, the years later, that's what they used to, they used to, they had, that's where Hustler magazine was housed in that building, um, at one time. Little Larry Flint. Yeah. Yep. Larry Flint was on the build. Yeah. Larry Flint. Yep. And we, so we went to the building, saw the marquee, and you seen it had, you know, entertainment things and agencies. And we, we pressing the button in the, in the intercom. Oh, yes, may I help you people? Come on. Yeah, we, we, uh, want to, uh, you know, we don't, we don't know what, you know, kind of like, we, we want to be, uh, can we get signed with you guys? We dancers. And, and he was like, "Oh, we're not looking for dancers." Then we hit one, one button, and a lady came on, and she said, and we said, "Yeah, we, you know, so we saw agency." We said, "Yeah, we dancers." And, and then she said, "Okay, come." You know, she buzzed us up, you know, told us what it, then we went up to the, to the floor, went to the office, and she said, "So, what kind of, you know, what, what kind of dancing you guys do?" And we said, "We do this new dance called popping and Boogaloo and scarecrow and all this." And I remember we in the office and I, and I'm up dancing. She looking at, you know, start popping. She looking at me like, "What in the alien, uh, what the hell is going on?" Then she asked, "Do you guys have, you guys ever heard of the Lockers?" We said, "Oh, yeah, we, you know, like we see them on TV, that, you know, those, you know, we, you know, that's what we grew up on, you know, at that, that time." And then, and I'm sorry about the, was the Lockers at that time a group or was there, she was talking about locking in general, but was there a group called the Lockers? The Lockers? No, we talk, no, the group they were called the Lockers. Okay. That's the original group. Yeah, the Shabba Doo, I mean, Don Campbell, Don, uh, Redman, Hoof Slim, Penguin, all them. Okay. Yeah, the Lockers. So, and then, uh, we say, "We don't know them, but we, you know, we, we like them. That's, that's who we like." And I guess she, that was before she, we, I started dancing. She, you know, we say dancers, we, yeah, we, we, you know, we do this new style. There was no thing called, yeah, we doing this thing called hip hop or we doing this thing called street dance. We just say we dancers or new style. So we did it. She was kind of like, I don't know what that look. What the heck? Then she went to the back and then she came back and she said, "Well, do you guys, you know, have, uh, any, uh, I mean, have you done any, uh, television work?" "Oh, no, no. We, that's what we trying to do." And then she said, "Do you guys have a resume or pictures?" We, and she said, "A resume?" We went, "A res, who?" Like we had never, we had never heard that word before. Resume? What? I remember somebody said, "What is a resume?" She said, "Oh, it's like a thing where it shows all the work you have done, like a history of thing." He said, "No, we don't even have pictures. We don't have a, we don't have a, a risk. We know what that is, lady." So, she was like, "Oh, you know, well, you know, if you got, you have to have that, and then, you know, if you get that, you can come back." 'Cause you, you know, it wasn't like, "Here's, you have a tape, a reel, or, you know, electronic press kit." Yeah. You, none of that, right? So we left out and, you know, we kind of like disappointed. And we tried a couple other places along Wilshire Boulevard. And again, we on Wilshire and Dhini, uh, Beverly Hill, uh, Beverly Hill Drive, couple of streets. So, we, which we didn't know at the time, but we on, but we still in Beverly Hills. So, we ended up being hungry and went to a place, what's the name of this, uh, restaurant? It's, it's the funk now. Uh, shoot, I can't think of the restaurant, but it was, you know, it was kind of like, like it looked, you know, was feel like a, like, uh, IHOP style, but it was in Beverly Hills. And we walked in there like we walked, you know, like, "Let's go eat." We only had like $20 between four or five of us, enough to get back home. And so we walked, you know, walked in that restaurant, sat down, got the menu, and we got the rude awakening that you guys are have not quite made it yet. When I, we, you know, and this is not going to shock a lot of you guys out there, but in 1978, when you look on the menu and a hamburger at this time was, uh, $3.50. That's, we was getting hamburgers for 75 cents, 50 cents in the neighborhood. So, a $3.75 hamburger and shakes. Again, it's 1978. This is not shocking to us now. Right. Right. But a, a milkshake was $2.75 or 50. What? Like, wait. And we were all sitting there looking like, and the lady didn't put water on. I tell you what, we all, we, "Boo." A round of waters, please. Thank you. A round of waters. Thank you. Yeah. Like, like we, we count, we said, "We ain't got enough money 'cause we talking about hamburger, fries, and a shake. That's all already about almost $10 each, right, of that time." So, we, everybody made this conscious decision to to sneak out like we did some criminally, uh, uh, uh, act in there 'cause we sat out and drunk and, and was drinking their water. And we all was like, "Oh, go down. She ain't looking." Like, that's how either, either was done because we was embarrassed and we was young. I was 16. Sam was 19. Everybody else was between 17, 18. We these young, young black, um, you know, men. And we all got out of there and we went to, we saw a, a, a liquor store, which I mean, not, and I'm not talking about hood liquor store. I'm just talking about we talking about the, you know, the liquor barn, the, with the, with the. So we walked in there and we bought a, one bag of a big bag of potato chips and two cans total 'cause they was pretty expensive in there. We, we were only talking 75 cents for a can. But in my neighborhood, we talking about 35 cents and 78, 40 cents. So, we, 75 cents. We bought two cans. We shared the cans between four, four or five of us and a bag of chips and we sat on the bus stop to go back home disappointed. And the struggle was real, ladies and gentlemen. The struggle was real. Real.

So, we sitting there and as we saw this lady walking across from the same liquor store walking across towards us, but, you know, and she saw us and, you know, and I remember I had actually, I had on Boogaloo Sam's one of the their costumes, uh, they satin pants with a cape. I was walking down the street looking probably look like a black vampire. I don't know. But I was like, like had this costume on and 'cause I love the costume. And she looks at, you know, like, "Are you guys, are you guys, uh, did you guys come to see or saw Jeff Kutach?" And we said, "Who is Jeff Kutach?" He said, "Oh, he's a, he's a producer, um, dance producer, you know, he do this and that. He's a choreographer." And where were you guys at when she approached you? Where were you?

On, on Wilshire and Dhini. Just on the street. Okay, cool. We were, we was on a bus stop. Okay. We was all sitting on a bus stop to catch the bus back to Long Beach. We going to take the same. Now, we ain't going to walk all the way back to, to, shoot, Sundown, Sunset again. We know better now. We don't need to go all the way back to, to East LA, right? We going to catch this bus from here. So, and we didn't even know we, you know, no, no, actually, we had a, we had a bus, uh, uh, route map and that, then we looked at and say, "Take this bus, channel all that." So, we knew got to take this bus. So, she came and she said, "Do you guys, you know, know or you seen this man?" I said, "No." He said, "He said, 'Well, his office is in this building,' which we were standing on the side of the building, but we don't know." She was assuming that's what we know since we were dancers and he's a dance producer. So we said, "No." She said, "But what's, okay, what's, said no 'cause she said, 'No, you guys dancers?'" He said, "Yeah." He said, "You," she definitely said, "Then she said, 'What style of dance you guys do?'" And I remember Sam said, "Oh, we do what kind of deep boys, we do all popping and Boogaloo and ticketing." And she was looking like, "What?" Like, "What is that?" And she said, "Is it, is it like locking?" She, we said, "No." And then Sam said, "Pete, show her." So I was sitting on, like on top of the bus, back of the bus bench, you know, with my foot on the seat. I'm then I jumped up, jumped off the, the, the bus bench and I just start, you know, popping and just really more just put power and it really all everywhere. I'm, I'm because I'm extremely skinny. So I'm just, and she was like, "Oh my god. Oh my god. This is, wait." Then she said, "Jeff, Jeff, Jeff, he has to see you guys." And I think somebody else did some, did something. And she gave us his, his business card. And we, we didn't go in the building 'cause I think it was closed. So we, we ended up, uh, taking up, you know, it was because it was a weekend. It was like a Saturday. And we ended up going back home and we called Monday and she had already just talked to him and she, he said, "Uh, yeah, she told me about you guys and, uh, uh, I want to see you guys if you can come to, to Beverly Hills to the, a place called the Coronet Theater on Wilshire Boulevard." And we was like, 'cause that's where we'll be rehearsing. 'Cause I'm, I'm producing a show called Dance Class. It's a, uh, and I, you know, variety of, it's a dance show and we're going to Lake Tahoe, Nevada. And I'm going, like she said, you know, "I want to see you guys. You come down. Can you come down to audition? Can you, can we come down and let us see you?" And I remember we, we went to that, to from Long Beach to Beverly. This is, this is, and it's the, the, the theater is still there to this day. It's right down the street from, um, uh, the Beverly Center, the mall. And they, um, so we walked up in there and we seen, you know, all, and they rehearsing for the show. And this is the first time I seen Shabba Doo. When we walked in there, was in the show, the, the Lollipop, who Anna Sanchez, live, she's in the show, uh, Steve Ntorial, who the young lady you just mentioned, I'm sorry, say her name again, uh, Anna Sanchez, where her dance name is Lai Pop. Okay. Was she the, she was the Electro Rock female component, correct? Yeah. Okay. Yes. Yes. I've been, yeah. Yeah. I've been doing her since I was, met her when I was 16. So, here we are. These young, we got on and we got on costumes. We, we went to the, the thrifty stores and, and bought, we saw some, they was, I guess some old baseball pants that look like, you know what I mean, the, you know, and my mother actually turned them into knickers, like almost like locker style. And we had red, it was red with black and red stripes. We had on black shoes, long black and white, black and white socks. We look like like lockers and we had on vests. Some of us had on black vests and some had on white, uh, cream vests. So we walk in there and these, you know, all the dancers, they is probably like 20 dancers and they're doing the show. They looking at us like, "Who and the circus, various Greenland brothers is this coming through this door? Like, who are these young, you know, we got these afros." They walking in and we see Shabba Doo. We go, "That's coming from the Lockers." You know, we, we know, we follow the Lockers. So we know. And we like, and I think Shabba, at that time, Shabba was like 20, 25 or so. We was like, I'm 16. And I'm going, "Oh my god." So, and, you know, and they stopped a rehearsal and they, and the man, Jeff, it was a Jewish, Jewish man, Jewish white guy said, "Yeah, we got, got this group, what's the name of your group?" We said, "Uh, we were second edition of the original name with Electronic Boogaloo Lockers." That's what we went under 'cause that was Sam's original group name. So, we went under that banner. And they said, "Oh, okay." And I remember we said, "Lock." We said, "Lockers." I remember Shabba Doo looked like, "Huh?" Like, "What?" Like, they all 'cause it was a dead locking in the show also with other, all the other dancers. So, and we had our, uh, the set gave him the, it was a record. Who knows? Might have been, might have been vinyl. So we gave him the money, I mean, the record. And we, we did, we did two performances. I mean, get downs. We, What song was it? Do you remember? Do you remember what song you used?

Shoot. I can't remember. Uh, probably was a Bar-Kays song.

So, uh, and then, and then we did the second one, which we had the nerves to do a, what I, you know, our rendition of locking and a popping routine together. So, and, and I remember we started locking and I remember the, the people, the dancers who, you know, they giggled 'cause we, we wasn't good at locking like that, but we thought like, "Okay, we saw the Lockers on TV and we going to do our arms." So we did, we finished it, and then they did a huddle. They know who, you know, they was, uh, uh, deliberating over there in the corner. It was the Jeff Kutach, Shabba Doo, other dancers, the other, uh, assistant producer of the show, and all these people. Then he came over and he, and I mean, they, when we was popping and Boogaloo, oh, they was, they mouths was like, like, "What the, what is like they were tripping." And when we did the, the backslide, and then when Robot Dane, he did a, he vibrated, and they was like, "Whoa."

Can I, and I don't, again, I hate to do this, but go ahead. Go ahead. When you, when you say backslide, people got it twisted back in the day thinking the moonwalk was originally called the moonwalk. The moonwalk, you, or you've shown it. It's a walking like you're on the moon. The, the backslide was originally that what Michael Jackson did and everyone did. They kind of twisted the, the vernacular, but I'm sorry, that's disqualifying.

Yeah. And, and also, and we also twisted the vernacular because it originally is called a tap slide, but we didn't know that because that's why you see you in the, in the '50s, you see, uh, I think it's, I forgot the name, Bill. It's on, it's on YouTube. And that was the, it's called a tap slide. The tap slide was a movement that a move that the tap dancer would do at the end of their set to get off the stage. So it was, so we didn't know that. Somebody showed me the, showed us the move. Actually, one of the guys from original Electronic Boogaloo was the first person I seen, Tony Mansk. He said, "Pete, I got to check out this move." And he started sliding going backwards all around the room. Where when he came back, I, when he came back around to me, I actually grabbed his foot, lifted his shoe up, and thought he had wheels on his shoe. Say, "How did you do that?" When you talk about the person who, is it, it's not Bob Fosse, is it?

No, no, no, no. I'm talking about in my group. No, I just say, who, who started the original tap? Now, Bill, now, Bill, now Bob Fosse did a, his was like, um, I mean, he, 'cause the tap slide, you know, he was around, but he didn't do it, okay? 'Cause I know Mike, I know MJ borrowed some stuff from him. And I, that's okay. I'm sorry. I got.

Oh, no, no, no. Michael Jackson didn't see. Michael Jackson, even know, because Michael Jackson, I'll get to that part. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. We're getting the mic. We're getting the mic. Yeah. Yeah.

So, but anyway, so we got the, we, uh, when I saw it, so we did that. They went crazy. They deliberated, came over, and offered us the job. Said, "We want you guys to join the show." Which they were in the middle, they already, the show rehearsals had been starting. And the show, I think this was August or September. No, no, no. It had to be before that because it was still summer, and I was, I was in high school. So I had to, you know, beg my mother, parents, could I be in the show? 'Cause I was young. So I was only 16. So he offered the, offered us a job and, and then gave us a contract. What, on, on this? Yes.

Well, you couldn't sign a contract 'cause I had to, 'cause I wasn't old enough. Only Sam was old enough. Everyone else was under, under 18. So, uh, so we had to take the contract. And then on the contract, you know, 'cause Oh, before we got to the contract, he said, "Yes, I want you, want you guys to join the show, but you guys' name is too long." This is a Jewish man, Jeff Kutach, 1978. Said, "Your name too long, and besides, you guys are not Lockers." And, uh, and he said, "Yeah, you know, we going to, got to change your name." Then this man went just like he sit there. He was thinking. And he turned to all of us, all five of us, and said, "Electric Boogaloo." That's who named us. Jeff Kutach named us the Electric Boogaloo. We did it. We was called Electronic Boogaloo Lockers. A Jewish man named us Electric Boogaloo. Not Boogaloos. That's a different story. Yeah. Not plural. Yeah.

So, what did you, I mean, at the time, I mean, obviously, you know, when you're young and hungry, you're willing to make certain concessions and compromise on this and that. What did you guys think? Did you guys think you compromised too much? I mean, you guys still got the essence of your name, essentially, Electronic Boogaloo or Electric Boogaloo. What did you guys think about somebody coming in and switching you guys up like that or trying to switch you guys up like that?

No, we all looked at Sam. Sam was a leader. Sam one started the group. At him, and then he said, he pondered, you know, we didn't use that word back then, but I guess it's appropriate now. He pondered and said, um, "Okay. Okay." I once Sam said, "Okay," and we, we, he's the one who made all the decisions. He's the one made all the routines. He's the leader. So, we don't have a say so. We don't, it wasn't no, you know, uh, democracy anyway, right? So, which we respected. Makes sense. Said, "Yeah, we became Electric Boogaloo." And then he offered the, the, the contract. And we said, "We can't sign it." Say, "Yeah, you get your parents." Because, you know, those got their, sen, old enough. There's contracts. And they show us the money. We making $400, $400. I remember we sitting there and they brought the contracts over and they said, "$450." Uh, you know, and it was like, "Whoa." You know, this '78, you know, it's a nice chunk of change. Yeah. If you, you know, we thought, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. In '78.

So, what was that $450? Was that just like a signing bonus? What was that? What was that the terms of that?

Now, that's the, that's what that was the, that was the terms of the contract, what we get for performing. Oh, okay. And, you know, and then you, you're saying, you know, 'cause then, uh, hourly wages for regular job was $2.25 an hour, right? $3.75. So, we going like, "Man, I can't even work at Mac." That's what I said. Said, "Whoa, I can't make this much when even if I got a job at McDonald's 'cause you know, you only, you only work part-time 'cause I'm in school. So you, you make a hundred, $100." But we did, once we read the contract a little closer, close. It was $450 a month. And we were like, but we still, even we found out it was a month, we still, because everything we, we didn't, we didn't know entertainment value. I only know hourly, hourly working wages value as a job, right? I went to work at, you know, I'm, I'm only equated to that. So I said, "That's when I said, 'Well, I can't make this much money a month at McDonald's.'" And that's the only thing I could, McDonald's wasn't like, no, working McDonald's is where I only place I was figured I can go work at at 16. And, um, and we were talking about only making like, you know, $175, which is, you know, a lot of, you know, you can, I mean, '78, you know, that's money. But $450, we jump. Now I'm talking about we were outside once we walked out of the thing and finished. We was in front of the theater jumping and screaming like we made it. Like we even had, we, we was poor. So we, a costume, we had some, we had some hats that we bought at the co, the costume place, were just made of like cardboard, but, you know, they had glitter on them and they styled, but they was, they was, we threw them on the ground and stomped them. They, they was only like $2, $3 for the hat. We like, "We get down, we can buy a better, better costume." Crush it. Went home, told our parents. We, they was like, well, they, everybody was happy. They said, "The show starts, rehearsal is going on 'cause it's actually have to be in June, July." Told the rehearsals going on even when school starts. And I had to, you know, convince my parents that to let me do the show. And the other member, his name, uh, Puppet Boogaloo, parents said no. There was a meeting of the parents. My parents say, "Okay, I'm going to let you do it." Sam was already old enough. So it was me. I'm okay. I'm going to let you, you know, do it. Then we were trying to, they were trying to convince Puppet Boogaloo's parents to do it. And they had a, be, it was like.

They, they, his parents, was steadfast on no, so he didn't get to do. Yeah. So, and I, and so my mom, I said, "It's only till October that I can, I can, um, you know, sign up for school in October and catch up." So she was like, "Okay, that's what you got to do," cuz she knew we, you know, she, you know, I wanted to dance with my brother. Yeah. And I wanted to do that.

So anyway, we, I, we ended up doing, we, we replaced Puppet Boozer with, uh, a me, a guy who became a member, Scare, Scally, who, who got in the group because, uh, Puppet Boo couldn't go. So it was five of us. Anyway, we get there, $450 a month each, but we had to pay for our own lodging. Oh. Which the, we had, we had a, we had a four-bedroom apartment that they got. It was $500 a month and we had to pitch in $100 each. We was making $450. That's before taxes, right? So I, I ended up with like, you know, I'm 16, so I don't, you know, I even lied about dependence. And I, I didn't know what a W2 form was. They said, "Oh, just put dependence on there." I put on, I had dependent cuz they say you get bigger tax breaks if you put more dependence. Well, I had 15 kids at 16. I'm doing my thing. I started when I was one. I'll start when I was one, you know.

So, and, uh, taxes came out, you know, like 235. That $100 come out, you got 1330 something. Food come out of there. Yeah. So, at the end, we was there three months. At the end of each month, I probably had $75. But, but dancing my ass off every night, enjoying myself, getting standing ovations. It wasn't about the money. Even though we thought like, "Yeah, this is cool, man. Yeah, we, I got $75." But I mean, looking back on it, I mean, this is a part of the story arc, the hero's journey, if you will. It, what you guys had to go through these hard times and just go through this the grind, if you will, to really begin to appreciate, you know, where you guys wound up going or where you wind up going. And it's just kind of, you know, paying your dues, you know what I mean? For lack of a better term, you guys had to pay your dues. Yeah.

I mean, yeah, but also when, yeah, but when you find out years later that that the person, uh, sold your act to the, uh, in the package as we was supposed to be getting a around $600 a week, take all the money that we didn't know cuz we was dumb, young. Yeah. And so, yeah. So, when I say that, the paying the dues, it's just learning, you know, hindsight's 2020. You now learn how, you know, this game is s, you know, record industry rule number 480, record company business is shady. And it's, you learning that lesson. And that's why I always say I talk to people about business, make sure your paperwork is right. But when you're young, like you said, in Hungary, you, you know, you go $450 a month, you go out and, you know, celebrate with your friends, you don't realize that there's some, there's some effery going on there. But again, you wind up learning the game through learning what kind of not to do, I guess.

Well, I mean, and that's the thing. And but it taken somebody who just kind of snitched and said, "Do you know what he did?" I said, "What do you do?" Uh, he did this. Uh, and I'm older now, you know. I'm, I mean, I'm, I'm in my, you know, I'm 16, so I'm in my, I'm like 20. So, and I, if he had not said that, I still wouldn't, you know, we wouldn't have known. Our value was based on what he was paying us. So, we didn't know to say, you know, "We worth this." We thought $450. Cool.

So, so when you do learn and I understand what you're saying that that it's just the thing that's why now when people, you know, I'm very honest. So that helped me to tell people, "Look, man, you know, it's hard to go, you know, it's hard to tell. I mean, it's hard to to get the truth." Even if somebody could be some honest people or not honest, but how you going to, you know, go in and say, "Well, uh, we going to pay you five, we going to pay you $1,000 a week." "Oh, see, I know you getting 2,000, you just going to pay me that thousand." You know, it's hard to to do that. So, everybody paying dues is going to happen. It's just now you got, once you know your worth, once you know your worth and say, "Well, how much you going to charge?" Or this, "How much I charge now?" Well, that's on you. If you said, "Uh, I charge $450 a month." Well, that's what you going, that's what you're going to get. Yeah.

So, but, but despite all of that, the the experience, you know, now here we are, you know, I'm 16. I'm now I'm in a, I'm in a a different state that's like a world away. Ain't nothing but right over Nevada. Ain't nothing right over California. But hey, I don't, I'm there. I don't have parents. Sam is the oldest. Uh, I got my own room. I can, I eat what I want. I'm paying bills. Even all that we were saying, yeah, we now we we feel like we grown. We we adults now. I'm 16. So, cuz I, I got to pay a, uh, bit of the rent and then buy my own grocery. I get to buy and my own grocery, eat what I want to eat when I go in the store regardless if I don't have a lot of money at the end of that month. It did. We, it was so bad, bro, that we performing like sometime, we the first month we, we would, um, run out of like money cuz we, we had to pay our own tap to the to and from. If you take the cab from where we stay to the casino where we perform, it's like a 10-minute drive. So, we're on California side of Nevada and there's casinos on Nevada side. And to, when sometimes we wouldn't even have money to catch cabs. We would walk. Now, this is about a, about a 10-minute cab turns to a 45-minute walk to the to the place. The show is over at 11. We got out at about 11:30, almost 12, and you know, undressing and doing that and then walk at 12, 12:30 back home and you know, on the side of the road, four, five young black men walking back home cuz we don't have enough money to catch a cab. Not even between the five of us cuz we got to cuz we saving money to eat. You can't take cash cuz you got to now you got to eat.

So again, ladies and gentlemen, the grind is real, man. And the grind is real even in the 70s. And this is before you even, I mean, this is pre-Soul Train, right? This is pre-Soul Train. Soul Train, this is '78. October, Soul Train came '79. Uh, uh, so probably like February of '79, okay. So again, through, through this, through this insane aligning of the planets, you guys taking this bus to East LA and like, "What the hell is this?" And, but meeting this person started was the catalyst of this larger journey. Being on the show with, meeting up with this guy in Reno, you know, doing that show and then into the Soul Train. Let's talk about Soul Train. How'd that happen? I know. Yeah. Tell me about that. How that started.

Soul Train was, you know, again, going back to Soul Train was was a highly, you know, everybody watch Soul Train. Came out of '72 when they moved from Chicago to LA. I'm, I'm only like 11, 12 years old. Watch Soul Train religiously. Every Saturday morning, come on at 12. After you watch the cartoons, you, you, so everybody sit and watch Soul Train, you see. And you, not only for the artist, but the dancers was that was it. It was a dancer-driven show. We watching the dancers for the moves and for even for the fashion. Of course, we appreciate all the artists. So we watching it. So again, it's '72. Now here it comes. I'm now '78. Now we still watching. Soul Train still on, uh, early part, I think early part of '79. So we going to say, I think it was March when we did it. So round about end of Feb, uh, February, we, we happen to be watching Soul Train and then again, we start seeing people on Soul Train attempt to do the style we're doing because now it's starting to get around. But they're doing, you know, because again, there's no classes, no internet, so you only can you see it one or two times, your interpretation of it, and you trying to figure it out. I call it the figuring out era. And so we start seeing they are like they have featured some dancers on Soul Train and then the the host Don Cornelius would ask like, "What is it?" You know, "This kind of movement?" "We a new style called Popping, Boogaloo, we Electric Boogaloo." And we see people, we said, "How many saying our name?" You know. And then one particular Saturday, we watching and they was, he was interviewing a dancer, uh, Cleveland. And he said, "So, uh, yeah, you know, doing the Electric, the the Popping and Boogaloo, Electric." Said, "Oh, yeah. Yeah." Then he turned to the camera. The host turned to the camera. This pre-taped and said, "Yeah, next, um, uh, next week or son, we're going to have the Electric Boogaloo company on on the show." We're watching a pre and we all sitting there going, "What? What?" Like, "Ain't nobody called us. We don't know." Like he said it. And then Saturday, so Monday morning, one of the members, uh, Dane Robot Dane, called to the to the Soul Train, uh, production company, to the to the company. And and he said, "Yeah, my name is, uh, Robot Dane. I'm in a group called Electric Boogaloo." And the secretary was like, "Oh my god, we've been looking for you guys." Because when Don said your name, uh, uh, last week, uh, or even even on the taping, because the taping is two weeks before you do it. So you do it and then they put out that episode two weeks later. He said, "We've been looking for you guys for almost 3 weeks." There was no way because it's not like you don't, it's not, "Hey, you got the email." Was no email days. So if you didn't know somebody that know somebody that know somebody that know somebody that have our home number, you ain't, you know, you can't catch up with us. You can, they would search, like, "Do y'all know?" "We don't know." "Well, some people say they live in Long Beach." "What you going to do? Drive down?" You know, you got to do all that. "Y'all know, let your book loose." Yeah, they live over there on on Salt Lake Street, you know.

So when we called, the lady was, she was so happy. And then when they line it up, you know, to say, "Well, we want, he want you guys to come on and perform on the show." Da da da. And we went into, you know, show mode. Oh, we about to do a this routine or use this song and we going to do this and we going to get these costumes together. And we went. And my mom actually, the first time we was on there with the black and silver, my mom, uh, made those, uh, costumes out of, uh, karate black karate ghee pants. And, yeah, those that black is a karate. And she, and the s, and the the silver lame vest. She, she sewn for us. The the, we, you know, this is, uh, a year and some change. Two years at most when you first started. This is now, this is this is less than a year, pretty much. Okay. Okay. I'm trying to be less. Wow. Less than a year I was performing. Now, I was already performing on with the in that show in Lake Tahoe with Jeff Hut. I had only been dancing for practicing for five months. My man's got my man's got gifts. He's got gifts. Oh man.

No. I look back on the, when I look back and see the performance, I say, "You suck." Cuz it was like, and we, because to other people, it looked like, "Wow." Because no one was doing what we were doing. But if I compare myself to even the original Electric Boogaloos from Fresno, I was on a, we were the Long Beach crew, we were on a lower level because we was just learning. But, but we're the crew that got the job. They ended up doing, we, you know, then Sam, we later pulled some of those members in and they did a, uh, same show we were doing in Lake Tahoe. They, they did a another show, a same show in Chicago. And Sam ended up leaving our show to go with two of his original members, uh, Toy Man, Ski RL, which is Crystal Fleck, Don. They went to, um, to, uh, Chicken Will. Yeah. They went to to Chicago and did that same show. They did, you know, had a same show in Chicago, same show in in Lake Tahoe. So those members got to be on stage. But the original, but the, the ones that the name was changed to Let You Boooo, Long Beach, we the ones. But our level was still lower than theirs. So people seeing, so when I see that performance, I go, "Woo." Now, because I know I was just learning, right? So Soul Train was probably like, I was 10 months. I got a little better by by time, uh, Soul Train came on, just a little. So just a little better, you know.

But, um, I mean, looking back, say, when that came. Go ahead. I just looking back on him like you like say it was terrible. I'm looking, I was like, "During my show prep, I'm like, 'Geez, if I could even do that today.'" You know what I mean? I'd be quite happy. But I mean, everyone's, we're our own, you know, worst critic to some degree. But, dude, it's, man. Yeah, of course. Well, from that, from that, I mean, that's what I was thinking, man, '78, '79, if you can encapsulate it, if you will, um, that time until you, I'm not saying you when you really broke out, but like Breaking was like the huge breakout for like break dance and pop and the whole nine, the whole genre, you know, really kind of overtook pop culture. In whatever, when Break come out, '83, '84? What was that? '84. '84. So from that time, from from from your Soul Train, and I know like I said, your resume is thick, what were you doing from the Soul Train until you got into Breaking? And what was that? What was the audition like that got? I'm sorry.

No, no, was no auditions. See, we, in those days, there was there wasn't even when I started, there was no dance agencies. There was no, uh, if you want to get into the business, you had to go get the Hollywood trade paper and then see if they doing something or you knew someone that was doing something. Like we did a lot of our work from Tony Basil. He was doing a lot of stuff or even Shadoo, who was featured on TV show. Tony Basil from Mickey fame. "Hey Mickey, you're so fine." Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. From the Lock. Well, originally from the Lockers family. And originally she's a, she's an original like, uh, the dancer from that. She, she did dance performance in movies with with Elvis Presley. And, uh, she's featured on like her resumes cuz she, and, you know, back in them days in the 60s, she was, she was one of like, hot, hot, you know, like what they would call video vixens. Now, she was that. She was one of them it girls in Hollywood that was getting all the dance jobs or acting, uh, dance jobs. That's honestly, I, I don't know why I saw this recently, but I was, you know, a kid, you know, skating rink, a Mickey, you know, she was huge in the 80s. And I like to do the "where are they now?" But even look, and it's not has nothing to do with age, clearly, you're crushing it. She's crushing it. She was in her late 30s, 40s in the 80s, so she had been around for a hot minute. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She started. She's actually from Las Vegas. She, she started in the business at 17, going to, you know, going to Hollywood, doing all these things in the 60s. And when I met her, and that's another thing, when we, we were introduced to her, uh, and, and 1979. And from Shaboo introduced her because of course, she used to be in the Lockers, the group. So, and she, at this time, she was in her 30s, 35. And I'm, I'm only, again, I think I'm 17. She's 35. Thought she was old. Like, "No, that lady old." You know. And now we still around. She's 82 now. Still crushing. Yeah. I know. It's crazy, you know. And, and we've been friends since. That's that's my girl since then. That's who we got a lot of jobs through of Hollywood. She, she's the one taught me the Hollywood business. He taught me how to perform on now, uh, me being on stage with Jeff Gutach and all that and performing. Tony Basil, uh, is the one who who made me understand. She said, "You are," she said, "back then I was 16, 17." She said, "You are like the the black British call. You, you have something." And she said, "Project that when you dance, with your head up, dance with with confidence, perform, move, do this." She's the one who, who, bottom line, lot of what who I am. Sam taught me the style. Uh, Tony B taught me taught me the the performance of of the style. That's awesome, man. That's really excellent. Yeah. She's the one who. Yeah.

Well, and, and like you said, there were no auditions for Breaking, but, you know, that that movie was obviously so huge. What was it like, you know, set life? You know, it's funny. I, I watched it the other night and I had no idea you guys of the beat scene when you guys are first, the beach scene when you first approached those guys on the beach when they're dancing. There's a stand-in of you. There's a dude standing dressed just like you with the Pink Floyd hat on. Like, that's not Pete. Like, I don't know if they were trying to cut pay for that day. You know, I don't know if you saw that or not, but there's like an outtake or just there's a dude dressed just like you, black and with the same outfit you come up with later. Anyway, that doesn't matter. Um, sorry.

No, no, no, no. It, no, no, no, no. It does matter. It, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I just, it does matter because that the that day when, so, you know what I'm talking about? You know what I'm talking about. Yeah. When you see, when you see Pop and Taco come out and and battle Shabadoo and all that. Yeah. And and then later with the beginning, you see me going, "Turn them out." Yeah. That that's an insert. I wasn't there because I read my call sheet wrong and I'm sitting at home and chilling like, "I don't have to go. I don't have to be on set today." And the production company called, call called me. I'm living in in Compton at my girlfriend's, at my like my girlfriend's mother house was soon, you know, after it became my mother-in-law. I'm at her house. I'm staying there. And they called the production, call and said, "Hey, uh, Pete, this is, you know, Globin and Globus, uh, production. Uh, did you know you were?" "No." He said, "Where are you?" I said, "Oh, I'm at home. I don't, you know, she don't, you didn't, you supposed to be on set today?" I said, "No, my schedule is not doesn't say." And I had a schedule. I had a, I looked, I went, I misread the line. I thought it was the next day that I supposed to show up. And she said, and it was already done. They couldn't do nothing cuz I'm, I'm, I'm like to get to business from where I was. It was going to take about an hour. And they had already started. So they had, so they had that, who this, my friend, I knew him. They had him. He was in the, I was skinny, way smaller than him at the time. He was thick. So they, that's why they had a the Pink Floyd hat down. And I didn't know that. I didn't know that until I actually seen the movie. They didn't say they did. They just said, "Oh, we shot the scene." But they didn't say how it. So they did the retakes of me. Cuz when I, when I did it, they only had a few extras. It was me and Taco in front of the camera on the beach. When nobody else there. When no, and then I just said, "Go turn them out." And that, then they, that's crazy, dude. See, I knew there had to be a, see, I'm, I'm not, whatever it is, what it is. I'm been done some acting stuff, been in SAG since 2009, so I like set and how it works, call times, call sheets, and all that [ __ ]. That's hilarious that that's the story of why that person. I thought they were trying to cut cost and [ __ ] cuz that's how it is with movies, man. As much money they can save, that's what's up. That's wild. That's so wild. See, that's why I wasn't there. When when people say, "Hey, that's Claude Van Damme." You know, later, know who he was. Even nobody knew even then. And how he got in the, how he got in as an extra. He had just signed with the same, uh, movie company, Globus and Globin, as this action hero. His first movie, I think, was "No Retreat, No Surrender." I think, under the same. Yes, he was. They had not even started shooting that yet. He had came, you know, came to LA, da da da. And they say, "Hey, we're, we're shooting a movie, uh, you know, called Breaking. If you want to just go down this be, you just go down and be, you know, have fun and be, you know, and and again, nobody." Yeah. And nobody at the time, cuz he wasn't on, he wasn't on television yet. I didn't me watching the movie in '84 didn't know. You know, I seen all the extras, seen him, seen because I said, "Oh, the dude clapping off be with the red short shorts." And not until like probably like five years after that. And then I said, "Wait, that's Carl, man." And then we found out, uh, how he got, how he was put in the, how he's put in that scene and came down. And he was watch, they say he was there to watch the movie. He just jumped into that scene. But he was there practically all day. They said, "What's interesting hearing the kind of story behind the story, uh, like how, you know, Electric, you know, Breaking 2, Electric Boogaloo, they clearly, I didn't know this until recent, you know, to learning about you guys, that that's literally, you know, the name of your crew, Electric Boogaloo. But even, uh, Miracles and Breaking 2 was kind of a metaphor for the, uh, Radiorotron, which they were trying to save from Breaking 1." So they were kind of, you know, overlapping real stuff. Obviously, art imitating reality. But any more stories about life on the set during that movie, man? That's just, it's such, so iconic. Yeah. The, Oh, man. So many things, man. I can only imagine. Like, okay, even, even the, the, the Radion thing, the Ra, the Miracle and the second one is a, that's a totally different, uh, you know, place. That wasn't had nothing to do with, uh, radio. Radion was just the club that we would battle at. Miracle was the, the, the, the place where rec center where people. But, but I heard the story of them trying to save Miracles was basically a metaphor for what they were trying to do with Radion in real life. They were trying to save that. Okay. Is that [ __ ]? Okay. Cool. [ __ ] Okay. The thing about this, it wasn't even called Radion. The, what happened, that the place is a, was a real place, is called the Radio. The Radio, uh, uh, the history of the Radio was a before it became a, what we consider what you see on, what's there, it was a, it was a, a hippies, uh, hangout that played, um, hip-hop music and and underground music in the, the 80s, early 80s. We talking about 1988, '81. Where it, it was, uh, located in on Ethan and Alvarado, downtown LA. But it was a underground club. And only, which again, they played the, when, when all the UK music was coming in, and then, and the hip-hop music was. But only people was in this club was hippies. Were were the white guys who would, you know, they, "I'm here, I'm going to go to this club." We found out about the club through this other guy, this man, his name Jeffrey Daniels. But he used to be in a group called Shalimar back in the in the '80s and '90s. He used to go to the club and he said, "Man, it's a club. They play good music." When we went, we went, and there was no dancers. This was a club, I'm talking about, full of of hippies back, that's what they called them back then. And they would just play the music. So, we started going there dancing. Then every, a lot of people, we start telling people, and everybody start finding out eventually what happened because, you know, fortunately, you get these street people coming in, street dancers coming in, they, and, you know, it's called a caused a division. So those people that was coming there who was spending a lot of money on liquor and socializing, they all faded out cuz they, you know, now you starting to bring in, fortunately, sometimes you bring in some, some situations that they wasn't used to, right? And they, and the dancing thing took. So they sold the Radion to Radio to, uh, someone else. Well, I think, I think the guy, it was a Mexican man or something. I just forgot his. But he, so they moved it from that location, still around the same, in the same area, to another building where, where the movie was made. When the movie was searching for locations and clubs. So they heard, they people, "Oh, it's a club, uh, uh, hip-hop, uh, street dance club called the Radio." So they went to them and said, "Can we, can we, you know, use your place as as one of the locations or, you know, things for the movie?" Yes. And we said, "But we're going to, you, we're going to call it in the, in the writing. It is, you know, they saw Radio. So they did it. Say, "We're going to call it Radion because they can, now they don't have to actually pay for licensing to because it's their real name. They they just rented the place. We're gonna name it Radion." And what happened was the owners, you know, said, "Well, and once this movie come out, this going to this this place is going to be, you know, this this fictitious name and place on this movie is now going to be locked in to people's memory." So he said, "Okay, but I, I get to use the name Radion even after." They made, they made the, you, you can, you can call it. And that's how it became the Radion because it was called the Radio before that and it became Radion. And that's a lot of people see the movie and say, "Oh, Radion." "Oh, Radion." Before that. And then the movie came. No, the movie name that was in the script, not from them. So that's how that's that's how that happened. Uh, and I tell you what, man, if when I really want to take a trip down memory lane and, you know, I'd love to throw on the movie. But the Reckless knocks to this day. You throw on Reckless and I dare you not to get some little pop or something in your step. I tell you what, the song. And for the record, Electro Rock won battles one and two. No disrespect to Special K and the whole crew, but let's let's keep it a buck, man. That was a that was a wrap. Okay. You want you want some back stories? I'm about to back.

So in the movie, um, again, we do the first battle, uh, and script wise says, you know, we, we won. And actually, there was not, there was no choreography. We was we was going in. We just, that's we was going to do what we do. Uh, interesting. The, so the second battle, and I remember Joel Se, Joel Seberg, where the director came came to me and said, and this is, I don't tell this often because sometime, you know, I was like, uh, some maybe other actors or Shaboo or any people would get offended. So, right. This man came to me and said, "Okay, Pete, uh, we're going to, going to be shooting the second battle. So, you know, the," he said, "in the script, the second, you guys lose." After, you know, you're going to lose. And, uh, and this man said, you know, "Hey, and he's a Jewish man. He was, no, it wasn't no dancing. Wasn't he's like, you know, for me, you know, you guys are better than them." He said, "But that's my opinion. So you got to, but you got to lose, you know, because that's in the script." So, and I said, "Oh, okay." You know, so I went to Taco and Pop. I said, "Taco, I just talked to Joel, you know, and this and the script, we, the second battle, we lose." And, and we're, we're on such a real time in our heads. We're like, and I said to him, "Look, man." I went just like this. I said, "F that. We getting ready to get off. We go, man. We going to go off and do." Okay, now what's what I'm about to tell you is going to make more sense. So the battle starts, you know, this filming starts, we getting down. So when I, when, when I come out on my scene, and if you go back and look, when I first come out, you see me go down, then you see them cut to the to the crowd and the extra, then you see me. Then the next cut, you, they showing everybody else and they see me flip. But before that, I went ballistic. I'm doing ground, I'm doing ground moves. I'm popping hard. I'm doing all kind of. They had to edit around my my get down to make it seem like, well, he did less than what, because you, you see, uh, you go back, you see, they, they showed, you know, and my rights, you know, showing Taco because, you know, uh, get down from that point and, you know, from what he was doing should have been shown. But what I had done, they had to make it like, well, one of them, we got to cut around. Because if we put both of these, uh, get downs on on screen, people going to not only, you know, even people say, "Well, I think y'all won." No, we, we were going ham, ate them up. Even when we, even when we brought Lollipop out, that was like, we, we practiced that route. We, we choreographed all our own stuff. We practiced and we, it was like, like we was going, like we was really battling. As even the scene where Shabadoo pushed me was unexpected. I got mad. Like, I didn't know he was going to do that. That's some ad-lib. I would, I didn't know nothing about ad-lib at that time. That's crazy. He pushed me for real. And after we cut, I walked up to the shop. I said, "Don't you ever push me again." Oh, [ __ ]. And he said, "Oh, no, no, Pete, man. It was, you know, I was just, you know, just act, you know, make, you know, just making the scene real." I said, "Well, man, you got to make sure you tell me. I was prepared. You see my my neck snap back almost get a whip, whiplash." Right. Right. Right. It makes for good drama, though.

But, and, and I don't want to be remiss, man. I don't want to gloss over, uh, uh, your boy Taco, Popping Taco, Bruno, Popping Taco, Falcone, rest in peace. And he was a part of your crew, like you, you were talking about earlier, the different evolutions and iterations of the Electric Boogaloo crew. He was one of the second or third, if I'm right, just to qualify our boy here. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. But I met Taco when he was 16. I started teaching Taco when of popping and stuff. And, and he was taught by this other guy that actually, that was Sam taught when, when this other guy who created the style, snaking people, uh, people think it's called Cobra, but it's called snaking. He, the, the dude's name is Daryl Jean Cobra. He's the one that, he was 13 years old, one of the first people that also that Sam start teaching in Long Beach. And I was 16, he was 13. He created a style, that style when he was 15. And Taco, I started hearing about this guy named Bruno from my little brother who went to the same high school. They said, my little brother was going, "Hey, man, this is Mexican dude at my school is doing this weird stuff with his body, man." I said, "Is it kind of popping?" He said, "No, it ain't popping. It's something else. I don't know what it is, buddy." So I, so I ended up going. It was homecoming at the school. So open campus homecoming. So we went up to the campus. I, somebody said Bruno wasn't Poppa Taco yet. Bruno, I think it was King Snake, dance name, first dance name. But Bruno is over there or whatever it was. So me and Sam walked over there and we seen this mex, this skinny Mexican kid with a hair slick back. Uh, and we saw who, who Daryl, who we knew, but we hadn't seen in a couple years cuz we had moved off that block. And we like, "Oh, what's up, Daryl?" And he like, "Oh, what's up, people, Sam?" And we said, "I said to to Bruno, I said, 'You Bruno?'" Bruno, he said, "Yeah, yeah." You know, with a smiling, friendly, always been. And I heard, I said, "I heard my brother said you can get down. You be doing it." And I didn't know that Daryl created the style. I'm only talking to Taco thinking, "Okay, man, what's this new, some new style you doing? Let me see it." And I'm being condescending, like, "Really? Like, oh, let me, I'm hearing about this, let me, let me see what you talking about." My, what my brother was saying, man. I'm standing there, me and Sam, and, and Brun stepped out and he just started folding up. And I'm, and I'm looking at it, but I'm looking at him with this, my face is like, "Whatever, man." You know, cuz I'm on my arrogant right. And then, but my mind is going, "What the [ __ ]? What the [ __ ]?" But my face is is looking at him like, "Yeah, whatever." And then he finished. And I said, "I was like looking like, okay." I said, "Well, can you pop?" And he started popping. I went, "Oh." Then I said, "And I said, 'Who taught you how to do that?'" And he pointed at Daryl. I said, "Daryl said, 'Yeah, I made up that style.'" Say, "Wait, you made up that?" And then, then I said, "Let me see you." And I'm already was like, "Whoa, Taco was doing like, whoa." Yeah. When the creator did it, it was on a whole another level. That's what people don't understand. A lot of people have never seen the original that creator do it. And he did it, and it was on another level. And this was the Cobra. The king, what do you call the king? What, what's it called? King Cobra. King. Cobra is a creator, but snaking is the style he created. He started doing it. And you saw it's like, it's like me doing the Boogaloo and then Sam's doing the Boo. You go, "Oh, that's the Boogaloo." Mhm. And when he did it, I was like this. My eyes were like, both time, even when Taco was doing it, but I went, "Oh, you are the creator." I, dude, I remember as a kid watching you watching Electro Rock. And again, you guys won. And I've always had that affinity towards like popping. And then more Boogaloo style. But watching you both were nice as hell, don't get me wrong. But I don't know. Some Taco had that little bit of like shine with his little Mexican Jerry curl going on. It was helping Papa everything. I mean, it's just was everything. Like I was saying earlier, the precision in which you guys, I mean, obviously you, you perfected your art, but just, it's so awesome to watch, man. The aesthetics of it to watch it even back then or even now. When ladies and gentlemen, please go to, we're going to get his social networking stuff, but go to T or go to, I'm sorry, not Taco, go to, um, Pop and Pete stuff. He's traveling the world doing it. But anyway, keep going. I'm sorry.

No, no, but, you know, but yeah, but getting back to the movie. Yeah. So that's why when Taco did that that iconic get down, and I understood it when I saw it, I went, "Yeah, I see why they kept that." Yeah, because it's something that was different than what we all were doing. Even though he can pop and boo, but that, the two things in that movie that's I, that stand out. And when people look at, not just the battles, is when Finn did the broom. And when Taco did his get down. Those are the two most remembered scenes in the movie. Everybody, "Oh, Taco, what he did in the jacket and all that." Oh, man. That was that was emulated 900,000 times around the world. So every, every, but then I start, people started thinking that I was, because, you know, I, I didn't get the real shine like that. Even though my solo was was insanely crazy. And I say it was, cuz I was going, I was going batty. And they had it. And then, but, you know, uh, you know, to look at it after all these years, I go, "Oh, yeah." But a lot of people thought I was an actor trying to dance.

Well, I mean, even just as a kid watching you, like, I didn't know that they had held bucks edited so much out, but you could just tell, man, there was so much in your chamber because you were just, I mean, even the little bit that they showed you doing, I was like, "All right, this cat's like, I said, and I've always been all about the popping and stuff, but yeah, you clearly, you know, they didn't quite show the full pallet of, uh, the array of your weapons, if you will."

No. And then if you want to know, and for the, and for, uh, people who are listening, the music you seen us dancing to was not the music we actually danced to. That's all over. That's what that's all over. What were you dancing to? All over. We dancing to Cameo. We danced to Prince. We dancing. It was a song called, it was just [ __ ]. We danced Cameo. We dancing to Barcades. Whatever. The glove because the DJ was live. The glove was playing live. Even, even Ice T was rapping live when you, when that's overdub of him narrating battle. Crazy. We didn't, we couldn't hear him. The music was the music was loud. So it was just like a club. So you guys weren't dancing to Reckless? You guys were not dancing to Reckless. Heck no. Wow. I, when I, when that song, when I saw the movie in 1984, I was in Lake Charles, Louisiana performing. We went to the movies and that when I'm telling, "Oh, man, we dance to Cameo, we dance to Prince. Wait till y'all see us getting busy through this stuff." And when that overdub music came on, I'm looking like, "What the hell is going on here?" And I heard that, I heard that song. Yeah, dude. That's my joy, dude. That's what I was saying earlier. Dude, I love Reckless cuz I thought that was the the battle jam. I'm sorry to tell you. Damn, Pete, you ruined my childhood, brother. Trouble. I'm about to ruin it. That song stuck. When I heard that song, that's not the music we ever, I would never dance to that type of, wow. Popping was never popping was. We from the, I'm from the punk era. What do they say sometimes, ladies and gentlemen? You, you never want to meet your heroes, cuz they just ruin your whole perception. They ruin your. Oh, I ruined. Hey, I have ruined so many people around the world. I'm just messing with you. Talk about this movie. But no, no, but seriously, people say, "Man, that's, I said, man, that movie sucked." They, you like, "That's one of your, I hate that movie." Really? I was going to ask you, dude. I was going to ask you, what are your thoughts on that and one and two, but just generally speaking? Okay, cool. I, I wanted to know that. One, one, I mean, two sucked. And I'll tell you the reason why. I wasn't in two. One, because it's is because I'm coming from the real deal. Yes. We never, we never, I would never wear a Pink Floyd hat because I'm a person who, you know, I'm going to make some waves. I'm going to make some thing. But I'm like, okay, this is a movie. So they said, "Oh, put this hat on." The wardrobe, cuz all them other clothes, everything else in there, because it was a, uh, it was a non-union movie. So they didn't provide, uh, total, uh, uh, wardrobe. Only thing that they that they made and they had was the Electro Rock jackets. That's the only, everything else was my clothes. My hair, dude. We had to do our own hair. They had makeup there, but I did my own hair. But, you know, I think they had hairstyles there, but it was a, it was a non-union movie. Uh, didn't know that. So, so when they, when the wardrobe lady came out, said, gave us a jacket, I said, "Oh, cool." You know, like this is cool. You know, a little corny, but cool, you know, cuz the writing on the back. I said, "Ah, this is not how we would." Cuz they were, because I, the problem I had was, we're in LA, but we're we're trying to be a New York feel. We got this graffiti style. I, I know that was the the prominent thing. Everybody looked at hip-hop as cuz that's where hip-hop come from. But, and, and I even had a, I even had a, a problem with the title of the movie, Breaking. Like, what, what are we? Are we breaking into the business? Or y'all using this as because the word, because again, there was no such thing as break. Well, people say break. Break dance is not even a word. It was a, that's a media-given word. So when I hear people say, I be like, "I wanted, it seems like the generic term they use to kind of capitalize on this kind of thing for the moment." You know, it's obviously lasted way longer than what they thought or, you know, because like I said, you're out here teaching it 50 years later. But that little window of, you know, like in, no knock on Lucinda Dickey, Special K. They tried to do this kind of pimping of the culture, which they do often, quite frankly. When I say they, just general marketing, advertising people who take something that's dope and then they kind of cheapen it with Electric Two Boogaloo and that kind of the nonsense. But, well, at that, at that point, we didn't know. I mean, we knew, but it's like since this, because, uh, there's so much about that movie that that people need to know. Um, even when, you know, even when I got, Okay. How me and Taco got in as as principal or actors or rivalries, rival to them was, they needed someone. We weren't originally written into this. This wasn't on the script originally. Taco was working on a set as an extra or a part of kind of like a part of the, uh, Shaboo and, uh, uh, you know, Ozone, Turbo, and Ozone crew. So when they suggested that they need a adversaries and to battle in this scene, Shaved said, "Well, Taco and get Papa Pete." I was living in Fresno. I wasn't living in LA. I had just gotten back a few months later from London. I was in UK in '83. And we got back December, uh, 21st, cuz we was over there trying to get a record deal. Uh, we, I was in a dance singing dance group called Eclipse. So we was trying to get a record.

deal. I was over there for about five months. Then I got back, you know, it fell through. We came back December.

We start hearing about this movie in '83 because they were in pre-production and all that. They started shooting in January. By the time February came, I got a call saying, "Hey, this is so-and-so from the movie. We're calling on regards of we're doing a movie called Breaking In. I don't know if you heard." I said, "Oh, yeah, I heard of it."

"Um, we, we know, uh, you've been suggested, requested to, to because we're looking for, uh, two dancers to be the dance rival of the lead characters." And I said, "Oh, okay."

"And you, you came highly recommended. So we want to offer you the job." Okay. They told me, "We have you have like, you know what?" And then they told me, "You have to be here." And I think I had to be there in like a couple of days. They told me, which they didn't offer no nothing to fly me in. I had to, I had to borrow my father's, uh, station wagon.

What? He had an old, he had an old station wagon. And I had a little money that I got had made when I was in London. And I asked him, could I, told him, you know, they was happy for me. And I said, "Cuz we had two cars." I said, "Dad, can I use the station wagon?" I'm talking about this like this is so, this is '84. The station wagon got to be like a '74. So I, I, I gassed that up when gas was only, uh, 79 cents a gallon, somewhere around there.

Yeah. 807. Damn. Jumped in that, jumped in that and drove. And I called Taco and I said, "Can I..." Oh, that's on, uh, no, I didn't stay with Taco. I stayed with Taco and I did Captain Neil. So I, and stayed with my, my, uh, girlfriend's mother at their house and did. And that's how I got the, that's how I got the movie. And I had to pay for, I, you know, other than eating on the on the set there was no per diem. So I had to, the little money I had, I would, you know, I would eat at my, my mother-in-law's house. But that's that non-union. Not that I'm the hugest, uh, singer of the song of SAG, but I am a SAG member. But that's that non-union [ __ ] for you, bro. I was a SAG member. I was a SAG member at that time, too. But, you know, I was like, I'm, I got to do this.

And, um, and I think I made, I only shot for, I think, a month and a half. Really? I think I made, yeah, that was only a month and a half. That movie.

Oh, let me, oh, man. Okay. There's another thing that y'all that y'all need to know out there on this thing. The movie, we, the movie was shot. The movie taken, like I think almost three and a, only three and a half months to shoot. Um, at one point when we were shooting, and I remember the day, at, we were shooting the first battle scene, uh, the production people came, you know, gathered us up and said, "Hey, uh, there, there's another movie they're shooting in New York." I said, "Huh?" We say, "Yeah, uh, beat called Beach Street." They was actually shooting two dance movies in LA at the time. Fast Forward and Breaking In. Fast Forward. That's right. And Beast Street was shot. And and they said, "What we..." I remember, you got to understand, when you do a movie, as you've been in the business, you do the movie and it be, you know, it can be a, you know, done. It be a year you doing. They doing promo, they doing whatever they doing, post. Everything. We shot the movie. We were doing dailies, editing and dailies as we're shooting because they said they're trying to get the movie out before Speed Street. We, we wrapped in March of 1984. The movie was out in June of '84. That's unheard of. Post-production, editing, etc. ADR, post-production, editing.

And if you go and watch the movie, you'll see the continuity is, is, is the worst ever because we were shooting, you know, like we shoot the, you know, even the battle scenes and it taking a couple days, you know, cuz they shooting the extras, they shooting this, they shooting from this angle, that, that. So we had to come back, you, you know, wear the same clothes, fix your hair as closely as you can the same way or whatever it is. But they tend to had forgotten to tell the extras to wear the same clothes on different scenes. So there's scenes in there in the battle of editing where you see a group of extras behind us with different clothes. Cut to Ozone Turbo. Those same dancers behind them with different clothes on. You see, um, there's a, a extra that everybody, all he's a, is a guy had a big afro. He's, he's on both sides. There's a girl standing on both sides, different clothes. You talk about the guy, the kind of muscled up guy with the fro with the shades on, looking bodyguard style. No, no, not. Yeah, he, not him. He's on both sides, too. But it's a, like a, a shorter guy with a, he looked like a, we on the set we just call him, you know, he was like a, a goober, but he had a big afro, like a skater, like one of them dudes. But anyway, nothing wrong with being a skater, but he was like, he was like, you, you, you're not the person that would be in this kind of club. But yeah, I know you want that, you know, you're extra, you need that money, I get it. Yeah. But he, continuity, he was all over the place. Two, three dancing. I'm talking about that, that you watch it and you go, whoa. Even the dude with the glasses, same thing. This all over the place. So that all over. Yeah. The movie. Oh, yeah. Because they were trying to get the movie done. We was like, said, we was watching, uh, post-production and dailies every day.

And then when I said, I was, I almost got fired twice because I didn't want to, cuz I told them, "We do not dress like this." You know, in a sense, they gave me that hat. And we do not speak like this. That dialogue was, was, oh my god. And don't forget to bring that girlfriend. You're a dancer. Dude, you're going to need a shoulder to cry on. I almost got fired that day. Really? We was in, we was in table, we was in table reading and we were practicing it. And I was sitting there and they said, "You know, this your line, Pete." You know, my character, I'm going, "You know, let your rock two or whatever." I'm going, "Oh yeah, bring your girlfriend the dancer." I went, "Dude, we don't talk like this. Why, why, why do you guys have us talking like we some nerds or some people we, we're, you know?" "Oh, well, Pete, it's, you know, it's not a curse word in here. No, it's rated PG." I said, "What?" I'm like looking at them like, "Dude, we don't, we don't say, 'Hey, bring your girlfriend the dancer.' We say, 'Bring your.'" And I say the word, "B." Yeah. Right. Right. You say it here. It's all good. Like, "Man, bring your [ __ ]." And they like, "Huh? No, you can't say it." I said, "Man, this is, I said, 'Man, this is this sucks. This this ain't real, right?'" "If you don't want to be on a movie, you know, we can replace you." I said, "I don't care."

That's what I'm saying. When I watch it now, I watch it in the context for what it is. I mean, it's a Hollywood movie, so you're going to get all the, you know, very palatable language. Everything's kind of corny, you know. And even when like Turbo goes into Bruno's dance studio and he's like, this street music. I mean, it was all very, I don't know, just kind of. We love it for almost the corniness. The corniness is almost part of the novelty and why we love the movie. And but that doesn't knock you guys' performances at all by any stretch, bro.

Well, I didn't see. That's the thing. Back back then, I didn't find any humor in the corniness. What I, what I, because here, I get that. I get that. You know what I'm saying? I'm, I'm more, and again, I'm had only been, we, we talking, I only started in '78. So we only talking, like I've been dancing six years in a sense. But the authenticity of where I come from was important to me. So I'm going like that. Yeah. If y'all, if y'all, if they would have done this movie on, and they actually, even when they wrote the movie, they didn't write, they didn't really collaborate with any, you know, they asked people, but they didn't collaborate because the writers are definitely wasn't from the streets and wasn't from the scene. They just want to write a movie. Yeah. You can tell. And you can tell. Yeah.

So, so this whole thing, even when, when, when we was rehearsing, uh, practicing the scenes for the, and you know, with the Lucinda Dickies, and we in rehearsal, and she's trying to learn how to dance those those moves and stuff, she had just learned, pretty much. There was no, like, we don't get, let's, you know, let's really give her, you know, train her a month before this, like they would do a martial art movie or somebody's training to learn. She learned those moves literally in a, say, we in there for eight hours, and she's going over this stuff. And I, and, and man, I was so, I was so appalled and mad. I was, because I'm this, I'm this fiery 23. I'm so humble now. But at 23, I was like, "What are, what are y'all? Why y'all over here taking our stuff and then making it look so corny, right?" Like when she was in rehearsal, I used to be looking at her and I, I never helped her like they, you know, of course they was Shabadoo and Tob. That's a sheer stars. Y'all, y'all train her. I ain't training her on nothing. And I would not. They said, "Pete, could you?" Nope. For one, you guys are not paying me to train her. What? What are you? You're not even paying me as a choreographer. Y'all paid the other guy who wasn't even a street dance choreographer who was choreographing his thing. He was a dancer that was in, uh, uh, what's that movie called? Um, he was, he's like a '60s dancer back in the day. Um, and he's the lead choreographer because he's the one who's just choreographing the, the, the, um, you know, the jazz scenes and stuff. He, you know, that's, but he still got the title choreographer. Like, he choreographed all the street dance stuff. We choreographed our own stuff, but we didn't get paid as choreographers. So, I was like, I'm not doing, I'm not training her, you know, pay me to train her. I'm not doing that.

I mean, even, and again, and I, I like that, you know, from the mainstream kind of palatable standpoint of trying to introduce just dance culture, I guess I get it. But I mean, from the purity of what you're talking about, I so get it, brother. I so get it because it just bothered me. That's why it's like, really, electro, electro lost battle to like, come on. Like, I don't give a [ __ ] dude. Your girl who you mentioned a lot. But the reason why they, everybody say, cuz we, we went, we, I told, like I said, I told Taco, "We're not losing." And I remember even the, the director was mad at me. He was like, he wasn't like, he just like, "Yeah, I remember." I told, I said, "I know, but this the battle in me. I don't, I know this is a movie, I get it, but I don't get it, sir. I'm sorry."

Well, no, and I appreciate and honestly, bro, as, as you tell me, is you telling me how the sausage was made on this iconic show. And I, I mean, I, you know, get my own subjective interpretation when I see the behind the scenes stuff. What you're saying to me kind of rings true because I can't imagine like all you guys were necessarily cool with how they just kind of hijacked something you guys had worked so hard for and kind of just pimped it out a little bit just for mainstream pal, pal, palatability. But I got to move on, man. You, um, worked with Michael Jackson, man. So moving on from Breaking In, you guys had an opportunity. You and Bruno had an opportunity to work. You were in Beat It. I just found this out yesterday. I thought it was all Captain Eio. But talk to me about how you got introduced to MJ and how it all played, man, and what it was like working for the King of Pop.

Well, um, I go back. This is again in the early '80s. Um, and, uh, again, doing Soul Train and all that. And not knowing. And again, well before that, the guy who taught Michael the, the backslide, the original moonwalk, was, uh, this guy named Casper Jerome Candidate. And, um, uh, and Cooley. Um, Cooley was his partner. That, that's in 1980. So looking at that, of course, uh, then here, then those guys, we end up being in the same singing group, Eclipse. Uh, we all stay at, um, Jeffy Daniel's house and up in the Mulholland Drive up in the hills, whatever. And, um, you know, and one day we was just, you know, there at the house and the phone rang and I picked up the phone and it was like, "Hello." And then some lady said, "Uh, yes, uh, I'm calling from MJJ Productions, Michael Jackson. And he, um, he wants, I'm calling on behalf of the, he's doing a, a video, a music video. He wants this Electric Boogaloos members, you know." I said, "Uh, yeah. Uh, he wants you guys to be in a, in the video."

So, I'm on the phone. It's like, probably actually wasn't even original members. Only me and Dane Sugar Pop was there. He was like, '81, 17 or so. Casper, no. [ __ ] And then, you know, we all sitting, you know. So I said, "Hey y'all, somebody, somebody on the phone talking about they from MJJ Productions, Michael Jackson." And I said, "MJJ, his name ain't no MJ? What does J stand for?" Like, I'm seriously, I didn't know. I said, "Somebody, somebody just only playing." So I got back on the phone cuz my hand is over the, the rece, you know, the talking receiver. I mean, the part. And I said, "Yeah, yeah. So what's going on?" And I remember, verb, where, what's going? She said, "Oh, yeah, we do a video." I said, "Okay, right click." I hung up in her face. Stop being people pranking. It's Michael Joseph, baby. Michael Joseph. His daddy's name. Didn't know that. Didn't know that. Oh, did not know that. I didn't know his name was Michael Jackson. Then when somebody say Michael Joseph Jackson, don't know.

So she calls back and I said, "Hello." She said, "Yeah, something we got disconnected." Said, "Oh, yeah, yeah." Then I, and she start again saying that, you know, Michael Jackson want us to be in this video called Beat It. And I said, "Beat It?" And I said, "Which I hated that song when I heard it on the album." I said, "What the hell?" I said, "That's what I thought it was really a joke." I say, "Why would he want dancers on that song?" That's all.

Can I ask you? Can I ask you? I, I remember hearing you say that because I remember hearing you were part of that and you didn't care for, like, the Electric, like the guitar mix. Like you didn't care for that song at all. Did you not? What was it? What was it about that that you weren't with? Cuz it was heavy metal. I didn't, wasn't. I thought it was like, it was just some experiment that he was trying to do when I first got the album and I'm putting on the stuff, hearing every Thriller, all the stuff, girl. You know, PT. Like I said, "What is this?" Oh, we were not having that. I'm, I'm, I'm sorry. I'm.

Well, even the dancing I see you do in the background, a minute. Michael Peters, God rest him. He was the head choreographer. Um, I mean, it's like it was definitely different from what you normally would do. But they did throw in, I forget the guy's name with the glasses, and he did do his like vibrating. That's Robot Dane. That's Robot Dane who called. Oh, okay. Okay. Okay. That's the. Yeah.

Well, okay. We, I'm going to get to that part. So, we ended, you know, so the lady said on the phone and I said, she said, "Well, who am I talking to?" I said, "Uh, this is Popping Pete." She like, "Oh my god, PP Pete, what's going on?" I said, "Well, somebody must know me." And I said, "Well, who is this?" She said, "This is Sher Song." When she said that, I said, "This is real." Cuz Sher Song was the, uh, only original Korean, uh, dancer on Soul Train with the long hair. Oh my god. That was my wife back in the day. That's her name. Yes. Cheryl Song. She was at the recording when we were performed on Soul Train. Like if you see us doing an interview of the of the second one, uh, that I made, the first one, she's, she's standing, heard another dancer standing in a, in a foreground by the po, by the stage, the the riser. And and when Don says, "Popping," I said, "Popping." I pop. Everybody started clapping and kind of, she's clapping her hands. So, you know, after we, you know, we, we finish performing the Soul Train, ain't going back and bringing it back up. We meet her. We cool. I'm, I'm, I'm in awe because I know I seen it on TV. Like, I'm a fan. And that's what I said. She said, "I said, 'Sure, what is up?'" I said, "This is real." Cuz she said, "She, I work for." She said, "I work for MJ Productions." I said, "Oh, I think I even said, 'What does MJJ?'" She said, "Michael Joseph Jackson Production." I didn't know that. So, and then she just said, "He wants y'all to do the video." I'm like, "Now I'm telling everybody." Got my hand over the thing. He goes, "It's real. It's real. It's real." Everybody, everybody attention like, "Dang." Okay. What's going on? And they, as she asked me, she said, "Show me the details." She said, "Do you guys have an agent?" I said, "Uh, anybody a manager?" "No, it's a manager." I said, "No." Cuz what a dance agency was even happening then. I said, "No." She said, "Well, how much do you guys charge to to do the video per day?" I said, she said, "It's like a 8 day total, eight days, you know. Uh, I think Friday, four or five day shoot, three day, I mean, five day rehearsals, three day shooting or whatever it was. I didn't know. So I'm like, so I said, "Excuse me." I said, "Hold on. Put, how much we charge? How much we charge?" Everybody, "I don't know. I don't know. I don't know." And I said, "I'mma ask for." And I, and I did a big goat. "$500 each a day." And everybody said, "Oh, man. Oh, wow." So I got back on the phone, nervous, playing the manager said, and I said, almost reluctantly, uh, "five, $500 each a day." She said, "Okay." And I got, and I put my hand on the phone and said, she said, "Yeah." She said, "Yeah." And then some, I forgot who it was, said, "We should have asked for more." Wait, when I should always talk him down, then $8,000 a day. No, we can't do that. All right, let's go to 675. All right, let's go f, you know, talk them down. You know what I mean? But no, it was, hey, that $500 cuz we all start calculating goes back to that, you know, $450 a month. What? Hell yeah. Come on. Come on. We done made it, man. We done made it.

So anyway, so we, we agreed. And then, you know, she gave us the particulars. And then she called back about a few days later and said, "Michael, Michael wants to meet all of us in person before the shoot." So, we ended up, they told us to go to Third Street, uh, studio by in Beverly Hills by Beverly Center. And we all arrived and we waited in the studio. And the door opened and we, this old man walked in, which I recognized as Bill Bray. He's been his head security since day one. I said, "That's Bill Bray." And then the door opened again and then the lights went low and the lights started like flickering and smoke, uh, fog or whatever. The door bellowing and then Michael Jackson walking in real slow like he was floating. I don't know what the hell. And I was sitting at the piano that was in the studio and my mouth is wide open cuz this man came in like, ah. [Music] I'm going like, "Oh, whoa." I know. I caught all kind of flies. And my mouth was open like, "Ah." Right. Right. Then he came and and said, "Oh, I'm glad you guys are going to do, you know, I'm so happy you guys going to do my video. You guys are incredible dancers and I've watched you guys. I've saw tapes of you guys. Oh my god, you guys are." And he came around asking, you know, and do your name? Oh, so-and-so on. So guys at me. I'm still sitting on the piano. Don't know how to play a piano. Hands on the keys like I'm, I'm Liberace. And then key, he say, uh, uh, "Pete." He said, "I like to meet you, Pete." Then he used to say the speech, still talking about it, you know, videos. Then he, then we all talking. Then he sat next to on a piano bench next to me. And he said, cuz my hands are still on the piano keys. He said, "Pete, do you know how, do you know how to play piano?" And I said, and I shook my head like, like in the no shaking hair. And I couldn't even say anything. I said, "Uh-huh." And he, he started giggling and laughing cuz he was like, cuz I couldn't, he know. He said, "This man is starstruck." Oh, Jesus. Well, you would do, you would said, even, uh, I think it was the Beat It. Yeah. Like you had had there were full-on, full-fledged, like hard-hitting cats on the Beat It set, dancers, you know, gang members, etc. But when Mike came in, that it got shut down. Like everyone turned into a mark for Michael Jackson. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That story I tell all the time. Yeah. I was there.

So, yeah, I mean, you know, when, but okay, just for, just for the record, there was no smoking, no lasers. It's all in my damn head. Okay. That's all it was. There was no smoke. There was no laser light. Right. Right. Floating. But in my head, all that happened. It was full on.

But, but as we, as we start, you know, we did the rehearsal. I mean, you know, started rehearsing. And how we got, got, we there. We street dancers. So we all in the back of the studio lounging, you know, the, of the dance studio. And got just, you know, like looking at the, the, the, the jazz dance and contemporary dancers rehearsing. And Michael Peters walked back there and say, "What are you guys doing?" "Oh, well, we're just waiting on. Where you tell us? We going to come out and do the, do our stuff." He said, "This is your stuff." I said, "What?" We said, "What stuff?" He said, "You got, you guys got y'all part of the gang. You guys got to learn this choreography." And we was like, "Wait a minute." Oh, the struggle was real. Oh, we was back there struggling. Beat It. Beat It. Oh, and laughing at the same thing cuz we thinking like, this is like, this is not us. What are we doing? Not like us. Yes. Kendrick Lamar could have came out. Not like us. You damn good. Wap, wap, wap. Get out of here. Yeah.

But, but we learned it. Me, Sugar Pop, Robot Dane, uh, and Casper, Jerome Candidate. So, but because he had already knew Jerome because he had seen the Casper who taught him how to do the back. Hey, what up, Casper? You know, so they knew each other. And then we started rehearsing and we had to learn that part. And there it was. And then the day that the, uh, the gang members came, we were all downtown. We shot it downtown LA. in a big, uh, holding, uh, uh, warehouse where they, you know, the wardrobe and everything. So the meetup station and, uh, and, you know, the, they still rehearsing and stuff and cleaning up choreography. And then we, is a big yellow school bus drove into the warehouse. And we all looking like, what the, what the heck? Like, what, why they got a school bus coming up in here? And that door opened and off stepped. And that one looked like it was in slow motion. They all walking. You know, that gangster cool walk. We going like, and it's one after the next gang. So we, I perceive, I know a gang member, original, know a, a real one. I see one cuz I'm from the hood. So I'm going like, wait. Huh? Then another bus came in. The Mexican, uh, members came off that bus. So they all, and we all, they all looking at us. They all looking at the, the, the, the jazz with leotards on. And they looking like, what, you know, like, what is going on? And they posted up. They got their girlfriends with them, they posting. And they sitting, you know, looking around like, you know, like trying to figure out what's, you know, they, they know what I mean. We don't know why they there. Of course, they know why they there. And then the person who was coordinated, coordinating them went up to the production guy, said, "Oh, you got the, got the cigarettes." We going. I remember I'm hearing all this. And then, then next thing you know, they brought in a big box, I mean, a like a big box of of cartons of the 20 pack cigarettes. And they, and those gang members jump ran over there, trotted over there. It's currency, bro. It's currency. To. Yeah. It was like pigs to a feeding trough. And they was putting cigarettes all in the pants, down their pants, down their jacket. Uh, and, you know, and then went back and and posted up and chilled. What the heck? Until the limo came in. The limo drove in and out. Jumped Mr. MJ. And I never seen people go from gangsters to penny the fanboys real quick. I'm talking about they, I'm talking about even the girls, even some of they had a girlfriend, they looked and they, you know, that double take and they look. And the girl, all that screaming, "My god!" And they like, like ran, pushed away from their men cuz they was all, you know, posted up on them and posing. And the dudes took off like running. Mike, oh man, oh [ __ ] oh [ __ ]. I'm talking about I'm going like, "Oh, damn. Michael Jackson actually can stop a gang war if he wanted to." And they, they went up to him and he was cool. They saying they, uh, and again, we ain't in the, we ain't in the, ain't nobody pulling out pictures. They have a photographer there. They ask some photographers taking pictures, but ain't no, you know. Yeah. But, uh, they were, but after that, they was, I'm talking about they was all engaged and, you know, like, like asking, "Hey, man, how did y'all get this? Man, this is so cool." And that, that scene where Beat It, when we, you know, the, the garage thing open, you, yeah, all the re, I can go real, real. I tell people I watch, I go, "All the gang go real, real. They get to the dancers who faking like they us. Faking like we gaz. Real, fake, fake, fake, fake. Real, real, real, real." So, it was just funny because even, even the, the, the makeup people thought that, "Well, let's make the dancers look a little bit more menacing. Let's just put some Vaseline all over their face." That's what they rub Vaseline all over our face and make us shine more. Like, "What?" I was like, "Wait, why, why y'all doing this?" "Oh, we want to make it seem like, you know, wait, like is gangbangers is gang greasy looking shiny gang shiny." And, yeah. It's like, like, are they glistening? Like, what are we, what are we doing here? Wow.

So, but yeah, the scene, but they, but they was well-behaved, you know, they not like they were doing anything. Well, it's just interesting to see, you know, even the most, you know, folks get humbled in the face of, you know, the King of Pop. And it's just like everything gets thrown aside. All the hardcore slick talk gets thrown aside. Like you said, even the girlfriends are like, "Yo, move away." Oh my god. I can only begin to imagine, man. It was so cool. But it was real dope. I'm talking about, now I ain't talking about that part. I'm talking when you shooting downtown LA. We talking about in the, we talking about in the downtown crutches, the, the, the gutter. And we in, if you remember, you watch it, Beat It. There's an alley scene. We walking down the alley, man. They blaring that music, man. You people are in the, who actually residents who live there opening and said, "Cut that [ __ ] music down." Especially that [ __ ] you like some raw old, you know, Billy G like Beat It. You had heard that really like the mix between. Wow. All night.

But my favorite scene, my favorite thing, two favorite things about film doing that movie. And it ain't the dude at the end with the white boots. It ain't him. It is a homeless man walks into the on the set and asks Michael Jackson for his autograph. I'm standing right next to Michael. Asks Michael for his autograph. You know, he recognized Michael. Got so Michael got a pen. They gave him a paper. Michael, how Michael signs his autograph. It's like M and you know, the, the, the Hollywood and the and the and the homeless guy looked at the autograph, looked at Michael and said, "What is this? Some chicken scratch?" Michael fell out laughing. And this is way he signed. This how he signed. Even when I got autographed from me, this is his signature. How you sign most autographs look. Yeah. You don't do it like you're in fourth grade, you know, whatever they call it. He said it was so bold. Is this some chicken scratch? Yeah.

And, uh, but, but, uh, and then, and the second thing on the set of that set. And it weren't really like, like of the movie Breaking In, like in, you know, like, oh, other than that. But Michael would like, or a couple times he would, the security would come and get me, Robot Dane, and Sugar Pop. "Hey, Michael wants to see you guys at his trailer." Oh, okay. This is during a break, you know, when we not, you know. So we, they take us over to to where his the trailer is. And we walk over there and he's, he's in the window of his trailer looking, you know, say, "Hey guys." And we said, "Hey, what's, what's going on, Michael?" He said, "Could you guys dance for, dance with my friends? I told him how incredible you guys are." And then I'm look. So we looking at him. Then we turn as he point at his friends. And we going and we look at his friends. His friends are, uh, Elizabeth Taylor, Barbara Streisand, uh, uh, Quincy Jones, Terry Fisher, uh, uh, George Lucas. And we going, "Huh? Fight." You want us to dance, brother? No, no music. Me, Dane, Rob, Dane, and Sugar Pop take off dance and pop and boo on. And he's in his window giddy. Oh. Oh, I told you. He pointing at them. I told you guys they are incredible. Oh my god. Oh. And they looking. And then we finish dancing. We, you know, go up and shake. I'm shaking Elizabeth Taylor's hand. And Barbara's trying to, "You guys are so wonderful. Oh my god." We said, "You guys are great." And a couple other servants came the next day. I forgot who they were, but they called upon us. And the second day, I said, "What do we dancing monkeys?"

No, no, no, no. You've refined an art, man. And you are traveling the world still teaching people on the art that you've refined. I don't mean to have to end this, bro, but I have to dip. Listen, man. As the universe has aligned itself in so many different crazy ways from that bus trip to what you thought was Beverly Hills, which was East LA, that turned into the rest of your career. I, I find that [ __ ] so fascinating. Pop and Pete, man. I think I know you got to go, but say this. Yeah, we, uh, my journey as a leg individual, I was born in Fresno, from Fresno to Long Beach to the world. Yes, that is how I seen. And, you know, to go through the journey that I go went through. Like I said, I know you got to go because it's a, I got, I got so much Michael Jackson stories. Listen, you always have a home here. Like I said, I knew you before I even chopped it up with you, even though I didn't really know you. But now having chopped it up with you, man, we could talk for, believe me, there's going to be more a part one, part two, three. You always welcome back here as he's traveling the world, man. Teaching the world. Each one teach one. Shout out any social networking where can we catch up with you and follow up with what you are up to, my friend?

Catch me on, you know, on on TikTok, Pop and Pete. Uh, uh, I think town Pompeii, uh, on TikTok. Uh, PP and Pete on, um, the Gram. P O P I N double P O. It's Pop N P because the pop is in me. That's why I spell my name. Pop N P. So, and then, um, if you're still using Facebook, I'm on there. Pete, if you're still Popping Pete Solomon. Utilize all these platforms, man. All these links will be added in the description of this episode.

Pete, man, I cannot thank you enough, man. Seriously, you're, you're welcome back anytime and I'm looking forward to it. I, I don't mean to rush you out, but I got some [ __ ] I got lined up that I'm kind of tardy on.

Me too. I got to go use the bathroom. That's the [ __ ] I got to. Yeah. Well, hey, just to let everybody know in full disclosure, this cat double booked himself earlier today and so I had to wait for his tardy ass. But it was a pleasure, man. It was absolutely a pleasure. Pete, much love, brother.

My pleasure, bro. Can't wait to talk. Okay, bro. Take care. Yes. All right.