How to Turn Anxiety into Seductive Charm | Robert Greene

那些真正达到权力顶峰的人，比如埃隆·马斯克，或者史蒂夫·乔布斯，或者摇滚明星，或者政界人士，他们都很古怪，很奇怪，对吧？这是因为他们不害怕那些让他们与众不同的东西。那么，当你年轻的时候，当你四五岁的时候，你身上有什么奇怪的地方？你有点与世隔绝，你活在梦幻世界里。然后你进入学校，人们开始说，“哦，那很奇怪。”“与众不同”这个概念就带有了负面的含义。但是，如果你知道是什么让你与众不同，并且你拥抱它，利用它，那么力量的领域就在那里。[音乐]所以，大约两年前，我们做了一个节目，我研究了许多人类天性法则。而你最新的书，我不想说它是日历，但它是每日的，它是按天来阅读的。当然，作为一个奇怪的采访者，我大概两天就把它全部听完了，音频形式的。本来应该每天读一页，需要365天。我想我们没有那么多时间。不，我本来想说，我可以花一年时间来准备，但那将是一个非常缓慢且艰苦的过程。我会在节目的开头提到这一点，这次谈话会有点跳跃，因为这本书就是这样的。这本书就是这样的，对吧？是的，有些部分我觉得和前一天没什么关系，但也没办法。所以，这就是为什么节目会有点奇怪。这是给观众的公共服务公告。好的，我想先谈谈你为什么写这些书。因为我认为，我看了你在亚马逊和其他地方的一些负面评论，相信与否，有负面评论，至少有一两个。人们会说，“这个人是个反社会者，他正在制造更多的反社会者。”“这个人真的心怀邪恶，否则他为什么会创造出这个怪物，人们正在阅读它来学习如何伤害他人。”我知道这不是你写这些书的原因。嗯，它们显然不是邪恶的。根据我的观点，你知道，当我第一次在95年提出《48条权力法则》时，我并不是从一个有权势的立场写作的。在那之前，我从来没有任何权力。说实话，我一直是个失败者。我做过60多份不同的工作，我尝试过新闻业。是的，我数过，有一天我们数到了64份。然后我说，我知道我漏掉了一些东西，可能更多，大概80份，但我们数了64份。她评论说，因为她那时认识我，她说：“天哪，我认识你的这三年里，你换了这么多不同的工作。”我说：“嗯，你应该往前追溯。”所以，我从来没有处于任何权力地位，对吧？但我观察过，我是一个非常敏锐的观察者。我遇到过你能想象到的最糟糕的老板，你知道我们今天可能会称之为精神病老板。我什么 प्रकार 的都遇到过。我见过所有这些权力斗争在发生，我发现这个世界极其虚伪。这真的真的惹恼了我，几乎每个办公室里都发生着这样的事情。人们，或者说三个人在一起，政治就会接管，自负就会接管。拥有权力和影响力的人往往会尽其所能地利用它，对吧？他们利用他们的权力，他们可以恐吓，他们可以操纵，他们做所有这些事情。不是每个老板都这样，别误会我，但我不会对我的团队这样做，对吧？好的，我晚点和他们谈谈。是的，但是，你知道，我的经历就是这样，对吧？所以，但是这些书并没有描述那种情况。这些书描述权力，好像一切都是关于富有同情心，善解人意，做一个团队合作者，你知道，合作。这些就是管理和自助书籍所宣传的。它们说：“这不是我的真实情况，这不是工作的现实。”嗯，这太他妈的了。这真的惹恼了我，没有人写过关于权力游戏中真实情况的书，尤其是在我工作的好莱坞。哦，是的，但我曾在一家侦探社工作过，在巴黎的一家酒店工作过，为报纸、杂志工作过，你说的我都做过。我做过各种各样的工作，这就是我所见过的。这就是真相，而没有人真正想写一本关于它的书。所以我想揭开面纱，告诉人们，这就是权力世界里真正发生的事情，因为我曾是它的受害者。我曾因我的天真而受苦，我毕业后的自然天真，以为每个人都对想法和完成事情感兴趣。然后我经历了残酷的觉醒，不，人们对他们的自负和自我推销感兴趣。所以我想展示一下这个世界里真正发生的事情，并帮助像我这样天真的人处理这些权力游戏。所以我从那个角度写的。但是，其中存在一定程度的讽刺，这会欺骗人们，让他们发表那种评论。所以，当我谈到利用人们的信念需求来创造一种类似邪教的追随者时，人们会说：“罗伯特在教人们如何创造一个邪教。”没有人会真的用那一章来创造一个邪教。我告诉你的是，我们现在生活的世界，到处都是邪教。政治团体是邪教，各种组织都像邪教一样形成。这是我们21世纪的一部分。所以我向你展示，我正在睁开你的眼睛，让你看到当今世界的本质。当我谈到“总是让别人去做工作，但把功劳归于自己”时，你知道，现实地说，那些这样做的人，这在很多工作中都很常见，你知道，在好莱坞，我在这方面做得很好，看看这个播客就知道了。是的，是的，到目前为止还不错。是的，没错。所以，嗯，所以当我在好莱坞的时候，我会为剧本写所有的东西，你知道，一些对话，我的名字从来没有被写上去，从来没有，对吧？所以，这就是事情的性质。当政客们发表演讲时，他们从不写演讲稿，你永远不知道谁写的演讲稿，对吧？这就是世界的本质，我只是向你揭示它。而在那一章里，我描述了当别人对你这样做时，你该如何应对。我知道，自从那本书出来23年前，我收到了成千上万封读者来信。你谈论的是《48条性格法则》，因为那是邪恶的。这本书有那么老吗？是的，嗯，我知道它比我很多读者的年龄都大。是的，它是。所以，自1998年出版以来，我收到了成千上万封读者来信。偶尔会有人说，“我确定我的老板读了你的书，对我做了这个糟糕的举动。”我感到有点难过。但是98%的人说，“你知道，我没意识到我正在超越大师，第一条法则。”你的书让我认识到了这种现实，并拯救了我。所以，大多数读者来读我的书，那些真正的鲨鱼，不需要读这样的书，这已经是他们的天性了。这是他们的天性。那些需要它的人是像我这样的人，他们有点来自宇宙，天生有点天真，需要一些觉醒，需要学习权力法则，这样他们才能玩这个游戏。所以，你知道，很多权力游戏传统上都是老白人，至少在我的好莱坞经历中是这样。所以，你知道，我想打开大门，向大家展示权力游戏是如何运作的。这证实了我今天在这里所说的，对吧？among the first readers of the book, the ones who loved it the most, who gave it its kind of popularity were hip-hop artists and people in the african-american community because they had traditionally been locked out of the game of power and people like 50 would tell me i wrote a book with 50 cent would tell me later that you don't call him fitty, you call him 50. that's i don't want to sound like a fake. it's pretty that's pretty robert, yeah, right, brain, i don't even call him curse, i just say 55-0, whatever you want, right, i'm a nerd, he knows that, i know, yeah, i think as long as all the cards are on the table, it's fine, okay, anyway, um, he said, you know, he dealt crack on the streets of south side queens, he said, nothing prepared me for the music business, that was the most hardcore power games he'd ever seen, and the book, the 48 laws of power, really, really helped him navigate that world, so i think that kind of shows that that's really the kind of the essence of the book, it's sort of a handbook for those who've never had power, how to deal with this kind of environment, uh, yeah, rappers like rick ross do use your material and love it, i interviewed him a few weeks ago, he's pretty amazing, he's really smarter than i would have kind of expected, just based on the music, i mean, not that you can really assess someone's intelligence, but i figured anybody focused on this is not really going to be thinking about no, he's looking for chicken places to buy and looking for cars that are going to cause value, yeah, the highest order, really, we're going to be doing an event with him in december, oh really, ted, a live talk here in l.a, he was, yeah, he mentioned your stuff in his newest book and or on my show, i can't remember which one it was, but yeah, i heard your books are banned in prisons, and i remember writing you an email about this a long time ago, are they banned or is it just popular, both, both, um, it depends on the state and the particular prison, okay, so like the state of utah, i believe, correct, has banned it, the state of pennsylvania, i believe, has banned it, okay, um, certain states, um, i don't think like the art of seduction is banned, because nobody in prison is going to be, i hope, is reading, well, you never know, you never know, yeah, i hope not, but, um, i believe the war book and the power book are banned, right, yeah, and, um, that's be, and i've gotten a lot of emails from people in prison who said, you know, robert, thank you, this book has helped me, because if you think about it, i mean, i'm saying hollywood is bad, i'm saying the music business is bad, but imagine being in prison, yeah, that makes hollywood look like kindergarten, to be honest with you, right, i would imagine it does, i don't have that much experience in prison, um, that we know hollywood is, yeah, that i'm willing to talk about in public, hollywood is bad, uh, i've, you know, i'm not a movie star or anything like that, well, i guess it's worse for people who aren't, right, i suppose if you have power and leverage, maybe it's great, yeah, but, you know, in in prison, all gloves are off, and it's not just violence, it's all kinds of weird mind games going on to kind of create a hierarchy, i'm the dominant person in this block, etc., and so people would write me saying, you know, i was so confused, and people were, you know, i just didn't know what to do, or what who was where, and the wardens were, which side people were on, and your book really helped give me some clarity, and sometimes somebody would rate write and say, i didn't quite feel comfortable with this, i used your book to take over cell block a, then okay, i don't know about that, well, maybe maybe you need to do something good, who knows, but, um, the fact that they're writing you emails from prison though, should tell you that they're not following all the rules, because i'm not sure how allowed that is, yeah, i think a lot of these people wrote to me after they got out, that makes sense, you know, yeah, but, you know, a lot of people in prison, um, so like, i, the 50 had a, uh, 50, 50 had an assistant, uh, his name will come to me in a minute, because i want to give him a shout out, he's a great guy, um, anyway, he had been in prison for like 20 years, he was in that caught up in that new york law where if you had three drug offenses, yeah, you were put in prison, it was just ridiculous, because he was like, not a dealer or anything, yeah, it was so unfair, and anyway, um, it was before my book came out, right, so he can't say, but he told me, you know, what the kind of the life was like in prison, and he said that your book really described it, and he could understand why people would find it extremely helpful, because he was not the powerful person, he was kind of like this, this kind of small guy who was just sort of not used to that kind of environment, and it was extremely frightening, oh man, i, i can't even imagine, stay out of prison, stay out of prison, as the moral of the story, yeah, that's, uh, third time's the charm, uh, the book is designed to make you a radical realist, or many of your books are designed to make you a radical realist, and that for me, is, tell me what that means, and why it's important, yeah, well, it's really the kind of the goal of the daily laws in a weird way, um, but the idea for me is, we have to deal with so much illusion and [ __ ] and crap in our world, our, when we leave university, we're filled with all of these misconceptions about people, from our parents, from our peers, from just the atmosphere of being in school, what professors teach us, so we don't have a real grip on reality, and then when we enter the work world, we're usually kind of bitch-slapped by it, and sorry for the, no, all good, and you're the one who's going to get canceled, not me, that word is cancelable, everything is, yes, that one for sure, yeah, of course, no, okay, i don't know, i'm not the arb, if i knew what could get canceled, i'd have to say, you've got female dog slapped, yeah, um, it's even worse somehow, but go ahead, um, so suddenly reality is like, right in your face, and you don't know how to deal with it, and you make a wrong step here and there, you know, you, you get in, you take, you get involved in some kind of emotional drama, it kind of creates a wound that lasts forever, you end up going down this rabbit hole that you can't escape on into your late 20s, etc., and you started off on the wrong foot, so i, time, tell people, imagine the following scenario, you have all these illusions about yourself, right, you think you're probably greater than you are, you have a bit of grandiosity, you don't really know what you're good at, what you're bad at, what you were meant to do in life, what i call your life's task, so imagine that you could be, have this radical realism, where you understood who you were, what you're really good at, what your strengths are, what you're not good at, what you were meant to accomplish in life, you had real deep clear clarity about what you were destined to create in this world, that would be incredibly powerful and liberating for you, then imagine dealing with people in your life, your bosses, your peers, your children, etc., you're walking around, and you have no idea what's going on in their minds, people wear masks, they pretend to love you, they smile, "i love your screenplay, jordan, it's fantastic," while they're actually thinking, "god, that guy's the worst ride i've ever met," right, i'm not saying this personally, no, i mean, it's true, i would never, if i had a screenplay, it would be terrible, okay, so you have no idea what's going on in the minds of people, right, it's our nature, we're born actors, so imagine also, you have this radical realism, where you could see into them, you could actually see through the opaqueness of people, and understand what's going on, not completely, you have a better idea if they really do like you, if they really are interested in your ideas, if they are planning to help you or plan to sabotage you, think of all the mistakes you would avoid, and all the powerful forms of connection you could create with people, it would be awesome, and then finally, think about the world at large, so the world has what we call the zeitgeist, since you speak german, i'm going to use some german, spirit of the times, yeah, okay, so the top, we have a spirit of the times, right, and this thing is always changing, it's never static, right, so you walk through life, you don't really know where the world is headed, you don't realize that in two or three years, your career is going to be hitting a wall, you're going to be downsized, you're going to be out of work, you don't know, you know, what's the next step, what's the next move to make, and, and then also, you start a business, not realizing that that business is, is not, you know, going to be viable in six months, right, imagine finally, that you have that ability to see what's going on in the world, to see realistically the trends happening, so radical realism is the most powerful form of thinking that you can have, in my world, and it's not, it's not something that's depressing, it's not, people think of realism as kind of ugly and drab, they think fantasy is wonderful and beautiful, and reality is kind of, but actually, radical realism is very inspiring, it's very beautiful way of looking at the world, to sort of accept this, these, this is the world as it is, as opposed to how i want it to be or wish it to be, is actually a profoundly moving, and almost, i hate to use the word poetic, but, you know, to see the world, to see things as they are, is, is very, very powerful, and very inspiring, i find, so it's like a superpower, the way that you phrase it though, as well, right, because if we, no one can see the future, but if i have a conversation with my boss, and i say, "i think that went really well," he's going to support my ideas, but really, it's become so clear to somebody who's trained or read your work, for example, that what he's going to do is use this conversation against me, the first chance he gets, it would pay if i knew that, right, i would, i should already be looking for another job, based on what i know, and how that conversation went, but a lot of us, we get blindsided, and every friday, we give advice on our feedback friday episodes, people write in with problems, and there's a lot that can't be foreseen or foretold, so to speak, but there's a lot where i think, i've read this letter, and it's really clear from the details, that this person sees the writing on the wall, maybe they read your book, not quite sure, but they, they just go, "i don't, can't put my finger on it, but this happened before, and that happened before, and now with this happening, i'm pretty sure that i'm on the outs," and i say, "look, you don't know that, you don't know if that's true, but you should plan almost as if that were true," and you know, we give them a strategy for that, and it sure pays to be ready, especially if you're going to get let go from a job, or you're going to be forced to move, or you're dealing with something in a relationship, so yeah, it's almost like a superpower, there's so many notes that i have about, uh, allaying people's insecurities, and so the, the so-called dark side stuff that we kind of talked about in the beginning of the conversation, but maybe we actually flip the script a little bit, or change gears, and start, start with some positive career advice, uh, because it is tempting to stay with the dark side of the force, when we have conversations about power and influence, i think, and, and not a lot of people probably go with the positive stuff, when you're sitting in front of them, right, i don't know, i could be wrong, uh, you do mention in, in some of the daily laws, there's, uh, there are chapters about reconnecting with your childhood passions, i would love to talk about this, because a lot of people, i think the majority of people, like you said, go even go to school and through school, having no idea what they should do, and reconnecting with your childhood passion seems like a really good way to, to at least get started on the path of figuring that out, well, the first chapter in mastery was called, discover your life's task, and so the first month of the daily laws is about that, the month of january, because it's, it's really, if i had to say it, jordan, it's the most important thing in your life, right now, particularly if you're younger, you know, if you're in your 50s or 60s, it's getting a little bit late, i'm sorry to say, but it's never really too late, but if you're younger, man, that is the most important thing you can learn, i can't emphasize it enough, because i have studied throughout my years, and the thousands of books i've read, from my research, biographies of the most successful, famous, creative people, and i've done consulting with people on the highest level, so i've seen this firsthand, and i've done it in my research, and inevitably, these are people who understood at some point in life, that this is what i was destined to follow, this is a path for me, now, that my path might have been, most people, it's like a zigzag, you don't have a straight line, this is what i was meant to do, it's never like that, it wasn't for me, but you kind of have an idea, and it becomes clearer and clearer, and you find that path, and it leads to so much power, you become so creative, and so energized, because you enjoy your work, you learn faster, you're engaged emotionally with what you're doing, it is so important, and a lot of people who are successful, had a clear idea when they were five or six, some people discovered it at the age of 12 or 18, me, i really didn't discover until i was about 35, is this 60 jobs later, or 80 jobs later, probably 80 jobs later, when i, when i got to write the 48 laws of power, but anyway, so it's not easy, and a lot of people get confused, and why do you get confused? well, the, the psychologist abraham maslow, who studied a lot of children, for instance, he said that children, you'll maybe know this with your two-year-old, they have what he calls impulse voices, and these are voices that say, "i like this, i don't like that, i like, i like this kind of food, i hate this, i'm gonna spit it out, right, i like this person, i can't, i don't like that person," they're very clear, they know what they like, and what they don't like, it's so obvious to them, in an almost pre-verbal sense, binary, yeah, it's just, yeah, there's almost no lukewarm with my kid, anyway, he's either open-minded, or it's not happening, yeah, there's exactly, on and off, and that's it, that's exactly, so, you, everyone had that, because it's the nature of being an infant in this world, right, because it's natural, it's a voice that's naturally inside all of us, and then as you get older, you start listening to mr. harbinger and mrs. harbinger, telling you, "don't do this, jaden, do this, you know, this is what you should behave like, this, don't behave like that," and the kid starts getting a little confused, so i say, "well, my voice tells me to do this, but i'm told not to do that," and slowly, you go through a process where you're not hearing it anymore, you're hearing what teachers tell you, you're hearing what parents tell you, you're hearing what peers are telling you about what's cool, what's not cool, you're hearing what social media nowadays is telling you, i'm talking about like your career, what you were meant to do, and then you arrive, you're 18, 19 years old, and you haven't a clue, because you can't hear that voice anymore, and you're going to try this, that, the other, not based on things that are deep inside of you, but based on what other people have told you should do, or what they think is cool, and you're going to end up trapped, you're going to end up choosing a career path that seems seductive and interesting and lucrative, and five years down the line, you realize it doesn't really interest me, and you hit a wall, and you go, "[ __ ] man, what's going on with my life?" you start maybe drinking, i know, i'm giving a little exaggerated scenario, but you start drinking, i thought you were just narrating my exact life story, to continue, so far, you're spot on, addicted to online porn, you know, on and on and on and on, right, that's funny, okay, so, and then you're 30, and then it's starting to get a little late, yeah, right, okay, so the problem is, how do you clear away all of that noise, that white noise, that's drowning out your impulse voices, and actually hear what was your voice when you were two years old, right, and so it's a process, i've done it in consulting with people, trying to help them figure it out, people will say, "robert, i have no idea," so, you know, "i haven't a clue what i was meant to do in this world, right, you talk about my early childhood, i can't remember anything, okay, so it's not a lot of people, it's not obvious or easy, and i understand that, but there's, we go through a process, if i'm able to do that with them, you know, online or in person, sometimes, where we reconstruct some of the early memories of things that really excited them when they were a kid, and things that they hated, and a book that i always recommend to people, it's on the shelf somewhere, right behind you, i don't see it right now, called, the five frames of intelligence, by howard garner, a really good book, we'll link to that in the show notes, okay, the idea is, we normally associate intelligence with kind of book learning and intellectual learning, but he says there are five different kinds of intelligence, and each is equally valid and important, one of them will be obviously words and language, it was something that i was attracted to, some of it will be with figuring out patterns, leads to like a mathematician or somebody interested in statistics, another one's a little more abstract, i can't remember which one that is, leads to like music, um, then there's kinetic intelligence, athletes, yeah, it's all about your body, and that's a very high form of intelligence, we don't think of that way, but it is a form of intelligence, there's a social intelligence, where it's all about people, right, and he's makes the point that a child has one of those forms of intelligence that dominates, inevitably, some people might have a sub, another one that's kind of in the background, but one of them inevitably dominates them, right, and if you choose a career that's not really in alignment with what you're naturally gifted for, your brain was wired in a particular way, it's genetic, okay, right, and if you're not following that, forget it, you'll never, you'll never get anywhere, so we go through a process of trying to figure out, what is, just in the most general way, let's not get so specific about your actual career choice, what is that form of intelligence that you're inclined towards, you know, it's not difficult, were you really attracted to sports and movement? do you find you're most joyous when you're like dancing or running, and that's what gets you excited, and you think about that, okay, well, that's probably, in some ways, where your brain is wired, you know, is it words, and some, just the sound of words, that kind of obsess you and fascinate you, like it did when i was a kid, you should probably be involved in some form of writing, right, okay, so we go through that process, what is your frame of intelligence, we kind of determine that, and then we kind of reconstruct certain key moments in your childhood, where you did something, and it felt right, now, a lot of people don't have that, i maintain it, everybody has it, you just, you have to kind of dig, but you did something, and in the process of doing it, it felt like there was kind of a nat, an ease to it, as opposed to learning math, when you don't like math, there's no ease involved, right, for some people, that ease is in math, okay, let's talk about that, let's kind of put our finger on that for a little bit, on and on and on, and then as we get older, i like to look at what people hate, so when i was 23, i discovered that i hated working for other people, well, that's why i had 60 some different jobs, and that makes sense, you know, i don't like the political games, i don't like all the [ __ ], i don't like all the stuff, all the things you have to play and pretend, i'm an entrepreneur, it took me a long time to figure it out, because i kept, i never had a job more than 11 months in my entire life, it took me time, okay, i should be working for myself, because i don't like working for other people, so if we detect in this person that they don't like that, and that's a lot of people, i'm afraid of the world today, yeah, you should be an entrepreneur, you should be working for yourself, eventually, so that's part of the process that we go through, it's, it's more complex than that, but that gives you an idea of what it's like, i love this, because when i was a kid, i learned how to build out of like, little parts from radio shack, an fm radio transmitter, and it was kind of interesting, because i would solder these little things in, and my dad was a mechanical engineer, and he goes, "wow, i wonder if my kid's going to be an electrical engineer," and then when i built it, and it didn't work, it was frustrating, but someone helped me fix it, and then i could transmit my voice to the radio, probably like, you know, 50 feet away, and that was the part that was the most interesting, and i realized i didn't really care about making the thing as much as i cared about somehow being able to talk to my friends and things like that, so i wanted to, to turn the power up on this thing, and i learned that you could do that by, like, breaking federal law, and attaching a high gain antenna, and then, and then communicating with the russians, yes, yeah, accidentally communicating with the russians, yes, this is like an 80s disney movie or something like that, like, uh, cloak and dagger, um, but i wanted to be, i said, "i want to be able to talk to everyone in the neighborhood on their radios," and they were like, "that's super illegal, you can't do that," my mom sort of put the kibosh on that project, then i go through this whole path, and i'm good at studying, and i go through college, and i get good grades, and i decide, "i guess i should go to law school, because more school is better," so then i become a lawyer, but i already knew i didn't want to become a lawyer, and then i start the podcast in my second year of law school, and i end up on sirius xm satellite radio, and then i quit law, and i come back to this, and i didn't remember that when i was a kid, i wanted to be on the radio, wow, i only remembered it probably eight years plus after doing it, that's a perfect example, yeah, yeah, if i'd freaking listen to myself, i could have gone to broadcasting school, no, no, everything's for a reason, it was better that way, first of all, your law career taught you some interesting things that you're never gonna forget, that's true, there's some skill sets that were created then, and then if you had found your way to podcasting too early, it wouldn't have the same meaning to you now, you're so excited that you found the right thing, because you kind of hated law in law school, that it means much more, and you, you actually are more motivated to, to follow it through, like if i had been offered the, to write a book when i was 24, this does, as opposed to 35, 36, it would have never worked, i didn't have the experience, i didn't have the desperation, etc., that makes sense, i mean, i didn't even get into podcasting because i thought it would be fun to do a show, i got into podcasting because i was recording a lecture of a course that i was teaching, and i needed to put it online, wow, and podcasting was the only way to put it in like 80 different jobs, yeah, i mean, this was during law school, i was, i was teaching a networking class, and i kept giving, i said, "i'm giving them the same damn talk every week, i need to record it on my sony minidisc, minidisc player, take it, and then get it to my computer, make an mp3 file, and put it on the internet," but there was no soundcloud, there was no youtube, you know, so my friend said, "hey, there's podcasting, you can put these files online," and that was the birthday, what you were talking about, 2006, that was just the beginning of podcasting, i think we were one of the first 800 or first thousands, i cannot, i can only remember my first podcast was like an 08, and i was like, "whoa, what is this?" yeah, like a downloadable radio show, yeah, yeah, yeah, anyway, yeah, and here we, and here we are, so you're right, it, it sort of makes sense, because if someone said, "hey, you should start a podcast," i'd probably, i'd go, "well, i'm not going to be some guy who records stuff in his basement, that's dumb," and then i did that for a long time, and here we are, yeah, when do we, what do we do when we realize we've chosen the wrong career? like, if we just get up, and we realized, "look, i'm not just burned out, i'm not, for years, i'm finally gonna do something about it," what is that thing that we do? well, one thing, just to backtrack a minute here, one thing i left out, the reason why you want to follow this path isn't just because it's some kind of mystical destiny sort of idea, the human brain works best, we learn fastest, when we're emotionally engaged, when we're interested and excited by something, the brain opens up, we become like a sponge, because we want to learn, and our attention is much deeper, and so we learn faster, so if you choose the wrong career, for whatever reason, you know, like you go to law school, and it was, you're kind of half listening, as the professor is droning on, you're kind of half reading the books, you're not in involved in it, and so you're not learning fast enough, right, and if you don't learn fast enough, creativity, which is what we all want, is a function of the intensity of your knowledge, of your info, the information you have absorbed, the faster you absorb information, the more thoughts and associations you create in the brain, it starts going all the time, and ideas are coming to you, if you take five years to learn something, that stuff going on the brain won't happen, so that's why we want to do it, okay, so you're going to find out in your career, that you are not emotionally engaged, that isn't happening, the gears aren't connecting, you're tuning out, you're not paying attention, right, and you kind of realize that, okay, so that's, you have to be able to realize that, and not a lot of people are going through their 20s, for instance, because they're going after a big paycheck, they're unaware that they're actually not really attuned to what's going to, this, to what they're supposed to be learning, okay, but once you have that moment, it kind of depends on how old you are, so there's not like a single formula for what you should do, so if you're 24, and you realize you made the wrong choice, that's great, now we can go through a process, and you can make a fairly radical shift in your career decision, because you haven't wasted, i'm not saying wasted, that's too harsh a word, but you haven't spent 15 years in something not relevant to you, it's only been a couple years, all right, let's go through the process of figuring out what you should do, and let's kind of change your skill set, right, let's start heading in that, towards that direction of what you were intended to do, you can make a more radical shift, but if you're in your 30s, it's, i wouldn't recommend that, because you need to make a living, right, you have learned things, you have learned certain skills, so what i recommend is not a radical shift, but a more subtle shift, heading more in that direction, and that might include keeping the job that you have, but at night, going to school, or online learning some new skills, that you now can quit, your plan is to quit this job in two or three years, but you will have learned things that will allow you to, to quit and go on to this other path, or you figure out a way to kind of shift it, so i knew a woman, um, she, uh, alice, and hope winer, i don't know if you know her, she has a podcast, um, many people have, there are two point whatever million, i thought you, everyone knew each other, yeah, we all hang out, yeah, it's a really, really big cafe, anyway, she, like you, studied law, and then she realized that she wanted to be a writer, and so what she did is, she went into legal journalism, that was how she made a shift, you know, because that was, she could still make a living, she could become a writer, and then she learned true writing skills, and then she could, like, maybe write a novel, if she wanted to, at that point, kind of thing, so that's the kind of more gradual shift, if you're in your 40s, right, it's even more gradual that you have to do, but the thing is, you've, all your life, you've been accumulating experiences, you have to keep that in mind, so even when i was working in greece, because i landed on the island of crete, one summer, and i got very sick, and i ran out of money, and i was in the hospital, oh my gosh, and then i came out, and i had no money to get back to paris, wherever i was living, i had to go work in construction, you were literally stranded in crete, crete, like the, the isla, is that where the minotaur lives? is that the, yes, yeah, yes, wow, well, he doesn't live there anymore, but he was from there, right, it was, yeah, that's where he was from, yeah, that's a, that's a, and this is like, not, there's no internet at this point, you can't just be like, "hey, i'm somebody, wiring me is money," if, if i told you what year it was, you'd be, you'd be shocked, yeah, i don't want to make you feel, uh, yeah, yeah, we're talking, you know, prehistoric period, no, no internet, nothing, i mean, you could have, i could have made a phone call, and had money wired, sure, but i was embarrassed, i didn't want to have to involve my parents, i didn't even tell them i was in a hospital, oh wow, um, so i'm working in construction, and it was a really weird world, where the boss was greek, and all of the people working for him, doing the construction work, were like, australians and americans, in english, all blonde, blue-haired, and blue-eyed, blue-haired, blue eyes, you know, it was like the reverse of here, because we were all people who had been stranded, yeah, everyone got into the hospital, yeah, so i was like, ripping nails off of boards, etc., man, i hated it, it was the worst job, i know that i'm not destined for doing construction, so the long-winded point of the long-winded point of this this anecdote is that i learned, everything taught me what i'm good at, what i hate, i know i'm not good with my hands, that only made it clearer to me, etc., yeah, you went through a long process of elimination to get there, so the point is, you know, you're learning, don't just like say, "oh, i did this job, i, i got nothing out of it," you get something out of everything, and if you're in your 30s, for instance, combining your skill sets, combining writing with law is very powerful, because we live in a world where you have such access to information, that the best entrepreneurs are combining things that nobody ever thought of, exactly, and starting a kind of business that involves kind of very strange skill sets, but is so unique that it takes off, so never give up, never say that this was wasted time, nothing is wasted, i love the idea, the, the tip, for lack of a better word, of the instruction, that you can compare the moments that you did what others wanted you to do, versus what you felt, and the moments when you did what you wanted to do, especially if you can remember those as a kid, to bring out, to bring out the ideas, or, or at least an idea of what might be right for you, because if i look back, and my parents go, "oh my gosh, you bugged us, and you rode your bike to radio shack 500 times, and you bugged us for money to buy these extra pieces, and you wanted to take the antenna off the house that we used to get cable, and connect it to your device," you know, that was the stuff that was really lighting me up, and getting, later on, getting in trouble, messing with the phone system, and things like that, you know, people thought you're going to become an engineer, but really, i liked the communication element, it just didn't really occur to me, um, because i was too busy stealing long distance calls from mobile, you could have been a criminal too, i was probably, i was, i was just juvenile and didn't get caught, right, i did get caught once, but that's a different story, that we'll, uh, i'll have to bring that out on another show, but the advice, i think that you wrote about in the daily laws, i think you phrased it, always stick to what makes you strange and weird, and that's surprisingly really good advice, right, well, um, yeah, i mean, the people that are really kind of reach the apex of power, like an elon musk, or a steve jobs, or, or a rock star, people in politics, who we kind of hold as like icons, you can honestly see that there's nobody else like them, right, they're one of a kind, they're weird, they're strange, right, and it's because they're not afraid of what makes themselves, makes them different, so what happens when you're younger, when you're four or five, you know, something strange about you, you're kind of connected, you're in a dream world, and then you enter school, and people start saying, "oh, that's weird," and the, the idea of being different kind of gets a negative connotation, right, and you want to conform, you want to be part of the group, you want to, you can, you know, there's peer pressure, and so the idea of being different and strange kind of has a negative tint, although we might ostensibly say, "oh, it's good to be different and weird," we actually are afraid of it deep down inside, because it comes with criticism, it comes with people kind of making fun of us, etc., so the, your source of power in life is actually what makes you weird and strange, right, you know, it makes you different, so i make the point in mastering, in the daily laws, that there's never going to be another jordan harbinger in this world, your dna has never occurred before, and will never occur again, and your parents, and how they, their dna, and their genetic component, and how they raised you, will never be replicated, so you are one of a

天性善良，这是无可辩驳的，对吧？好的，所以你身上有某种非常与众不同的特质，而且很难用言语来形容，因为其中一部分是基因，一部分是早期教育，而正是这种让你与众不同的东西，是你想要去发挥的源泉。因为如果我们说，你知道，外面有20个乔丹·哈宾格，他们都有相同的想法，那里面就没有力量，对吧？你可以被其他19个做着同样事情的乔丹·哈宾格取代。但如果你是唯一一个想到这件事的人，如果你是唯一一个创造它的人，那就是终极的力量。现在，那是理想，很难达到，对吧？但你在多大程度上了解是什么让你与众不同，并去发挥它，去利用它，力量的领域就在那里。现在，我不想显得自以为是，所以我必须小心一点，但没关系，看，这是一个播客，你可以把它搞砸，就像，搞砸得再厉害，也比不上最伟大的。总之，总之，不，我只是在开玩笑，嗯，但为了谈谈我自己，请便，嗯，你知道，我，正如我所说，我的轨迹是，我经历了一次失败，到35、36岁时，我有点像个失败者，我尝试了各种各样的事情，然后有人问我是否有关于书籍的想法，我大概描述了这个过程，《每日法则》是我当时在意大利时，一位名叫曼纽尔·斯特尔福德的书籍包装师，我即兴构思了这个想法，最终变成了《权力的48法则》。这算是一次美好的偶然相遇，那是意大利威尼斯一个美好的日子，我做了一个非常棒的推介，对吧？所以当我创作这本书时，因为他非常兴奋，他说罗伯特，我付钱给你生活，然后你写完一半的书，我们再卖掉它。所以当我开始这个过程时，自然而然地，我的思绪就转向了市面上其他的书，当然，对吧？你知道，然后我就是觉得不舒服，我只是想，我想讲故事，我喜欢讲故事。当我第一次向这个人推销这个想法时，我给他讲了一个故事，我天生就是这样，我实际上在某些方面更像个小说家，我喜欢创造戏剧和故事。所以我就开始写故事，就像《权力的48法则》的小寓言一样，然后我想，我不仅要留下故事，还要能够解释它的意义。所以我写了它，这就是所谓的“故事的解读”，就像DVD上的导演剪辑版，他们讲述电影是如何制作的，有点，有点，甚至我现在做的事情也是。不，只是，不，不，嗯，故事的意义，因为你知道，作为一个非作家，我，我对那个不太熟悉。好吧，我不知道我在做什么，我只是，我只是在黑暗中摸索，长话短说，我基本上是在以一种随意的、混乱的方式创造我自己的东西，对吧？我遵循着一条属于我自己的、奇怪的道路，创造故事，解读它们，然后给你一些理论，然后有一些引语，这些引语以某种形状呈现，然后有一些旁边的东西，有童话和寓言的段落，你知道，你知道那些小盒子，侧边栏之类的，对吧？是的，是的，我们称它们为“侧边材料”，总之，我最终创作了这本书，你可以因为很多原因讨厌它，但你可以说，市面上没有其他东西像它一样。它看起来不像其他书，一页一页地看，它读起来也不像其他书，因为它的结构是前所未有的，你知道，这是我自己的想法，对吧？所以，它是独一无二的。然后出版商第一次拿到这本书时，他们很喜欢，给了我们预付款，在某个过程中，他们说，罗伯特，我觉得这本书有点太奇怪了，我们把它软化一点，让它更像其他书，所以那个关于故事和解读的部分，去掉它，只写一个故事，然后谈谈它，对，然后，幸运的是，我提到的那个荷兰人约斯特，他付钱给我，他支持我，我说，我不想改变它，它要么成功，要么失败，你知道，这是一本奇怪的书，但奇怪的东西会卖，这就是它强大的原因，对吧？所以我们坚持了下来，我们说，不，我们要按我们的方式来。所以故事的寓意是，如果我试图让它像其他书一样，我现在就不会在这里和你说话了，我的书就不会成功。所以，坚持那些让我与众不同的东西，那些让我遭受嘲笑的东西，实际上是让这本书如此成功的原因。总之，这一点非常重要，因为节目中还有另一位嘉宾，拉米特·塞西，他谈论金融方面的事情，他之前在播客中提到的一点是，我会把这句话说得有点糟，但大概意思是，市场和外面的人想让你变得普通，但你一旦变得普通，他们就会抛弃你，因为他们已经有了普通。所以你真的想成为 tutti frutti，或者至少是那不勒斯冰淇淋，对吧？是这样吗？是的，[笑声] 所以，我想，是的，我可能是错的，我可能不会，可能不会，听起来，我觉得 tutti frutti 会比，是的，是的，它不会有巧克力，是的，巧克力会少一些，是的，你说得对。好吧，我不知道我是否正确，我只是在猜测，但关键是，嘿，你必须抓住那些独特的角度，因为如果有人，我从采访和指导等方面都学到了很多，而且我有时会忽略建议，因为他们会说，你知道，如果你这样做，大多数记者都是这样做的，我想，哦，这很好，然后我就会这样做，然后我会说，这真的很无聊，我的节目现在听起来和其他采访者一样，正是如此，这是有原因的，因为它是一种公式化的做法，是的，我会收到很多反馈，嘿，只管提问，不要加任何故事，不要加任何色彩，只管提问。这曾经让我感到难过，但我意识到，这只是人们试图让我变得普通，一旦我变得普通，他们就会停止收听节目。那些同样的人会写信说，节目失去了一些你以前拥有的东西，我无法确切地说出是什么，我心想，我听了你的建议，问题就在这里，我听了你的建议，我应该像对待其他人一样忽略你。这本书是，你应该每天读一章，你有没有想过你要放什么进去，对吧？你有没有想过你要放什么进去2月29日？你有没有为那天要放什么而烦恼？我想，嗯，我考虑过，我不记得那天有什么了。这是采用黑客思维，是的，它每四年才会被读一次，所以我想，是的，说实话，乔丹，如果我说有什么不可告人的动机，那是在撒谎，但当时我确实考虑过，比如，我不想把一个非常普遍但每个人都需要阅读的强大想法放在2月29日，对吧？是的，不是说你不想读那个，但也许每四年读一次，对吧？这很有趣，我当时也这么想，我想，哦，我打赌这是他想到的，这不是很重要，我把它放进去，我把它放在所有重要的事情上，但它并不那么重要，对吧？是的，它是第365个最重要的，66个。三，哦，是的，366个最重要的概念，保持工匠精神，这是《精通》/《每日法则》的另一个概念，工作是唯一重要的，你写的东西和你的想法，就是培养对你工作的深刻不满。我既爱又恨这一点，因为当然，我们总是对自己的工作不满意，我们希望它变得更好，但这会不会让你在过程中感到痛苦，如果你对你创造的东西永远不满意，或者那是两回事吗？嗯，你知道，工匠们，如果我们必须说，你会惹上麻烦的，我告诉你，好吧，所以你就像在建造东西，一张桌子，或者任何东西，你知道，用木头做的东西，而且你没有像完美主义者那样的态度，桌子就会散架，对吧？或者它会是歪的，所以你学会了如何让东西对称，你看到了你创造的东西的缺点和瑕疵，你和木头本身打交道，你试图创造出尽可能完美的东西。大多数人在建造东西时犯的错误，首先，我希望你把自己想象成一个建造者，你真的在建造一栋房子，一张桌子，或者任何东西，所以这就是开始你自己的生意，写一本书，在你的办公室里做一个项目，所以把它想象成你用双手在建造东西，它必须有地基，它必须建立在坚实的基础上，它必须站立起来，它必须看起来，你知道，相当对称等等，所以你实际上就像一个工匠，好吧，所以使用那种心态，因为它是一种非常强大、非常人性化的心态，因为我们是天生的建造者，这就是让我们变得如此人性化和强大的原因，好吧，所以大多数人遇到的问题，相信我，我知道，当你写东西或做项目时，你没有距离感，你无法分析自己的作品，你认为你所做的一切都是金子，都是美好的，或者你认为你所做的一切都是糟糕的，或者可怕的，对吧？是的，所以你需要让别人来看，他们可以让你回到现实，说，这是有效的，这是无效的。但很多时候，你不能相信别人，对吧？首先，也许他们真的不知道，也许他们对这个主题不够了解，而且他们可能还有政治上的目的，或者别的什么。所以你必须成为自己的批评者，你必须能够看到自己创作中的缺陷和无效之处，对吧？而且有时，你知道，这很难做到，你倾向于忽略那些无效的东西。我知道当我写一章时，过一段时间我就会失去视角，因为我花了太长时间，所以一切对我来说似乎都很自然，很好，然后当我一个月后回来看看时，我想，不，那不行，那根本不行。所以，我内心的那个批评声音，说那不行，就是推动我做得更好，更好，更好，更好的原因。现在，你可以为此疯狂，你可以达到一个点，你永远无法完成你正在制作的任何东西，因为你总是在批评它。在某个时候，你必须说，它完成了，它完成了95%，我永远无法达到100%。好吧，那没关系，我理解，但你在多大程度上能够带着一定的距离来看待自己的作品，并说，这对我来说不行，这可以做得更好，这才是最终会让你做得更好的原因，对吧？所以很多人在这方面有困难，你知道，他们，我经常在读别人的书或手稿时遇到这种情况，它有点奏效，但天哪，它可以做得更好，你没有花时间，你没有经历我刚才描述的过程，你没有考虑别人会如何阅读它，外部的眼睛会如何阅读它，你没有考虑什么可能很无聊，你没有，你假设每个人都会对他们不感兴趣的东西感兴趣。所以花点时间，学会批评自己的作品，并不断改进它，这非常重要。这似乎有一个收益递减点，就这一点而言，例如，我听一个三年前，两年前的节目，我会想，好吧，有几个错失的机会。我以前听的时候会想，啊，太尴尬了，这太糟糕了，我为什么要发布这个？现在我听的时候会想，好吧，有几件事我可以改变或添加，或者，天哪，我们的音频质量比那时有了很大的提高。我记得我听说，我想是大卫·莱特曼，他曾经看他做的每一期节目的录像，直到凌晨三四点，在每期节目之后都狠狠地批评自己，把自己当成垃圾。他的节目是一周五天，我的意思是，花那么多时间告诉自己你工作很糟糕，并且因为每一个小机会或错失的机会而自责。好吧，这完全不是我在说的，好吧？是的，这很难。所以，在我完成一本书后，我再也不会读它了，我再也不会看它了，真的。我不知道，我没有任何欲望再看它了，事实上，它有点让我反感，就像，你知道，我创造了它，离开我，我不想再看它了，我得继续下一件事了。所以，事后分析没有意义。你生活中发生的事情，你与人的互动，进行那种事后分析是有意义的，去看看我本可以做些什么不同的事情，以避免这个问题，对吧？我强烈建议这样做。所以，如果你有一个让你陷入麻烦的播客，那就进行事后分析，看看你可能做了什么导致了它，这样你就可以吸取教训，这非常重要。但这与回去批评一个已经存在的播客不同，它已经出去了，你有什么价值？你只会像你说的，狠狠地批评自己。我的意思是，你可以建设性地看待它，并说，你知道，我可以做得更好，对吧？这取决于你做事的心态。所以你可以提升自己，但我的工作是，一旦书出版了，我就无能为力了，对吧？这是真的，它已经出去了，而且在写作过程中，我已经学到了我做得不够好的地方，以及我可以改进的地方。所以，我认为我们在这里谈论的精髓是，重点不是自我批评，重点不是让你对自己正在做的工作感到难过，因为那会适得其反。你必须热爱这项工作本身，并对它感到兴奋。关键在于，你能够在某些关键时刻与它保持一定的距离，你能够从远处看待它，并且能够看着屏幕上的乔丹·哈宾格说，他需要做得有点不同，就像从外面看一样，这是一项非常非常强大的技能。所以目标不是让你对自己如此挑剔，以至于你永远无法做任何事情。你需要对它有一定的天真。但如果你脑子里没有一个声音告诉你有些事情真的行不通，一个有点像局外人的声音，那么你永远无法从内部改进你的作品。是的，这是很多创作者挣扎的事情，因为就像你想要外部批评者或培养自己的批判性眼光一样，对许多人来说，很难做到而不自责，或者不赋予它某种意义。但我想这没有成效，我不知道，也许是因为我的方式，也许是因为我是犹太人，我总是批评自己，是的，你怎么能不这样做呢？你知道，这有点像被强加给我，但，当我写东西的时候，我从不对自己写的东西太投入，对吧？因为我知道那真的很危险。也许是因为这是我正在写的第八本书，但我从不对此投入太多，因为我知道那将是将来非常麻烦的事情。而且我总是知道，在我写完一些非常艰苦的东西之后，我回去看它，我说，这不行。是的，毫无疑问很痛苦，因为我们天生都有点懒惰，我们把它写完，我们完成了剧本，我们完成了项目，它结束了，我想继续前进，对吧？这是正常的，就像约翰尼·德普不看自己的电影一样，对吧？对，但我想那就是他，但我不知道，我不知道。我想他拒绝看自己的电影。有几个演员说，我永远不会看自己的。嗯，这和我不愿意读自己的书一样，对吧？非常相似，是的。但你不想急于求成，因为你知道事情总会变得更好，而你的天性就是匆忙，因为你想要产品出来，你想要所有的赞誉等等。但如果你培养了这个声音，如果你能够带着一定的距离来看待它，它最终会变成一个有趣的游戏，你觉得，我总能做得更好，更好，更好。改进某事并能够说，我的第一个版本有点弱，我真的加强了它，这是一种非常令人满意的感觉。现在，而不是过早地把它发出去，然后你有点怀疑，然后它就不太协调了，人们开始批评它。所以，你知道，自我破坏，这很好地衔接了我们关于自我破坏的部分，我很想深入探讨。这是我从《人性法则》中看到的，态度是，如果我们害怕，我们就看到每种情况中的消极面，我们不冒险，我们把错误归咎于他人。如果我们多疑或消极，我们就会让别人感受到同样的情绪，然后我们在家里和工作场所都会创造出这些结果。这里有很多不是你确切的措辞，我不认为，但意思是，我们可以几乎将自己的不安全感投射到别人身上，然后让它反弹回来，然后对我们来说，看起来是他们在制造问题。这对很多人来说是一个令人大开眼界的时刻，当他们意识到情况是这样的。好吧，我可以举一个非常简单的例子来说明。你在一个派对上，有人走过来，你以前没见过他们，或者你走过去，他们有点紧张，不安全，而且他们出很多汗，他们的眼睛一直在眨。你发现自己和他们在一起时非常紧张，对吧？是的，你有点，你开始感到有点不安全，也许是我引起了这种反应？随着我在他们面前感到不安全，我的说话也变得有点迟疑，不安全的人变得更加不安全，就像这个人没有真正和我互动一样，我周围是不是有什么奇怪的？然后它来来回回，来来回回，变得越来越糟。或者相反的情况发生，你走过去，他们非常有信心，他们非常安全，他们非常冷静，他们有一种平静的能量，这让你平静下来，然后接下来的谈话以一种非常自然、轻松的方式进行。然后那个人觉得你有点投入，他们参与得越来越多，越来越多。所以，关键是，我们人类在一种我们没有意识到的层面上运作，那就是非语言层面，对吧？所以我们捕捉到了，嗯，用70年代的术语来说，就是态度，振动，你懂我吗？是的，我明白了。我们以我们甚至没有意识到的方式从另一个人那里捕捉到这些。它影响着我们。所以你对生活的态度，你有一种态度，对吧？我称之为你看待世界的方式，那个镜头。那种态度可能很复杂，但通常有一个主要的组成部分。可能是焦虑，你对一切都感到焦虑，担心。可能是缺乏安全感，人们在奇怪地看着我，人们喜欢我吗，等等。我想我都有。到目前为止，没有，我希望没有。或者你的态度可以非常冒险，一切似乎都让我兴奋，我想去探索，我想去那里，你对事物非常开放，对吧？好的，所以当你有了那种态度，它就会传遍世界，人们会以一种我们甚至没有意识到的非语言方式，以那种动物的方式感受到它，他们会感觉到你身上的东西，它会让他们以某种方式做出反应。所以，如果你有那种焦虑的态度，你就会创造出各种各样的情况来满足你的焦虑。它变成了我在那一章中谈到的自我实现的预言。你会在你遇到的每一个角落都找到焦虑，对吧？因为你很紧张，你让别人也紧张，你本应该采取行动，你犹豫了，然后它就没有进展得很好，因为你犹豫了，这让你更紧张，等等。所以你必须明白，你正在用你的态度在自我破坏，对吧？关于人类心理的这个方面，已经写了一些很棒的书，对我来说，它们简直是令人震惊的，用另一个70年代的表达方式，抱歉，伙计，我们仍然使用那个，好吧？好的。像“皮格马利翁效应”这样的东西，我希望在接下来的20、30、40年里，人们能在科学上更认真地研究和解释它。但意思是，在像学校这样的研究中，如果老师认为学生们很好，很聪明，值得去耶鲁和哈佛，而且他们都很聪明，但从来没有说过什么，只是他们这么想，它就会产生一种效果，学生们工作得更好，成绩更好，他们更兴奋，这种态度对他们说话，他们能感觉到，对吧？所以，如果你走近某人，你已经预料到他们不太好，他们不会在生活中成功，这就会在他们身上产生那种感觉。所以你有能力通过你的态度让人们产生某种感觉，对吧？想想那种态度。所以，坏消息是，你天生就有一种态度，它有基因成分。我的孩子非常小心，比我小心多了，对吧？那是他或她，他，嗯，似乎是她，但那是，是的，我们说的是杰登，他是公园里最小心翼翼的婴儿，他非常，这是稳定的。我知道这和你说的不是完全一样，但它说，不，我的意思是，硬连线就在那里。好吧，经典的例子是内向或外向，提出这个概念的人是伟大的心理学家卡尔·荣格，他认为，人们天生就有内向或外向的倾向。当然，父母会对此产生影响，但那是非常根深蒂固的，那种态度。所以这是坏消息，对吧？你天生就是某种样子，如果你焦虑，你天生就有一种焦虑的态度。好消息是，你可以改变它，它是可塑的，它有一些，你可以处理边缘，你可以软化它，你可以让它变得更好。如果你焦虑，你不会突然变成一个开放的、喜欢冒险的探索型人物，对吧？但你可以变得不那么焦虑，你可以意识到它给你带来了问题，你可以努力改变这种态度，对吧？所以，第一件事是，你必须意识到你的人生态度是什么，以及它带来的问题，以及它如何感染你的关系。第二件事是，要意识到你如何采取小步骤来慢慢开始改变这种态度。所以，例如，我告诉那些天生非常焦虑的人，我理解这一点，因为我自己也有点这样。它不会让我瘫痪，但对一些人来说，它会让他们瘫痪。我建议的是，明天你做一件你不太舒服的事情，不要太激进，你不会突然跑到街上裸奔等等，对吧？你可以做一些你通常不会做的事情，稍微超出你的舒适区，和你通常做的事情有点不同。比如，走到办公室或社交活动中的陌生人面前，和他们交谈。通常，哇，我做不到。去做吧。你就会发现，探索那些你通常不会做但又不危险的边缘。希望那个人不会因为你走过去而杀了你，但试试这些事情，你会发现，我不需要那么焦虑，而且通过开放和想和这个陌生人交谈，他们开始以我从未体验过的方式和我交谈，这很令人兴奋，对吧？所以，你知道，你的态度就像你的艺术作品，它是你创造的东西，你天生就有它，但你可以改变它。这就是你拥有的力量。是的，你提到过，我想你之前在节目中也说过，这是一个自我实现的预言。这几乎就像，如果你期望某人让你失望，那么这种情况发生的几率就会更高。它不是形而上的，也不是什么魔法，它只是你创造了周围的环境，你创造了氛围，你创造了那种感觉，那是非常科学的。我书中有一个例子，我觉得非常奇怪，我觉得非常有趣，这是一个女人的故事，她的老板有点虐待她，总是批评她，她不知道如何反应，无论她如何反应，情况只会越来越糟。一位心理学家告诉她，当你上班时，把他当作一个很棒的人。我做不到。不，别听我的，就进去，在心里想，他其实是个很棒的人，他有一些问题和麻烦，但他其实是个很有趣的人，他很复杂。你的意思是，就这么做。她照做了，突然，他的反应出乎她的意料。他有点被她吓到了，因为他注意到她表现不同了。她在那里的表现也不同了。所以，我觉得这真的很有趣。她什么也没说，只是在想。这也不是对14岁的学生说的，而是对一个40岁的上司说的。他突然走上了另一条路，因为他察觉到了什么。你看起来难以置信，我只是觉得，我不是，这不是难以置信，实际上，我知道这会奏效，如果这是作为一种技巧的话。我知道如果有人带着完全不同的，嗯，用科学术语来说，那种氛围来找我，它会彻底改变我与他们的反应方式。就像我喜欢认为我，我们很多人都喜欢认为，哦，等等，我就是我，我知道百分之百，这会，这会产生影响。是的，是的，好的，所以我觉得这是一种完全同意的表情，这是错误的。是的，也许，也许你需要多读读你自己的书。但那样你就永远不想这样做了。不，我不想。你确实提到了要意识到我们自己的态度，并观察它，这似乎很有用。我认为你给出的理由之一是，我们是否会本能地把事情归咎于别人？我们受到挑战时如何反应？当人们不在身边时，我们如何评判和思考他们？这似乎是重新编程很多消极行为的好方法。如果我是那种说，男人，瑞安过来拍电影，他迟到了，那家伙，他的人生一团糟，对吧？你知道我们都认识那样的人，我们不想和他们在一起，他们很烦人，和他们一起工作。如果我们是那样的人，那就对我们有利，尽快，嗯，[音乐] 消除那些东西。我们如何观察自己的态度？这似乎比说起来容易。嗯，首先，你注意到，你有一个整体的基调或整体的情绪，对吧？所以，如果你是一个焦虑的人，这很明显，你不需要像夏洛克·福尔摩斯那样去，你知道，解读它，对吧？每当出现新的或新颖的事物时，你的第一反应是，哇，我很高兴，它是，哦不，我紧张，这让我不舒服。你知道你在一般情况下，在一种中立的情况下，你如何反应，对吧？所以，你被抛进了一个新颖的情境中，你发现自己身处一个陌生的城市，你的第一反应是打开，拿出你所有的衣服去探索，发现那里的一切，远离美国人，看看文化是什么，还是待在酒店房间里，看看，你知道，美国电视节目之类的？你知道，在你生活的某些模式中，你如何应对不同或新的事物，将极大地揭示你是一个内向的人，还是一个外向的人，你是否焦虑，你是否喜欢冒险，等等，对吧？所以，在这些关键时刻观察自己。我认为这并非火箭科学，我认为这很清楚。我知道，例如，我是一个内向的人。你知道，我的倾向是，我比较害羞，尽管我已经学会了克服这一点，对吧？我在社交互动中看到了这一点。所以，你在你的房间里，你在你，你隔离的地方，你可以认为你是拿破仑·波拿巴，你很棒，你很了不起，你很勇敢，但一旦你走出去，情况就完全不同了。你意识到你的弱点，你的局限性。所以，与人互动会百分之百地揭示你对生活的态度，因为你在房间里无法控制它，你可以是沃尔特·米蒂，你可以想象自己是任何东西，对吧？但当你和人们在一起时，你就会清楚地发现你是害羞的，或者你是外向的，你是想和人们互动。所以，发现你态度的关键是看看你和人们在一起时是什么样的，对吧？你如何互动。所以，你知道，有人走过来，就像我刚才说的那个场景，你的第一反应是，哦不，离我远点，还是，嗯，一个有趣的人，因为有人要认识？那些都是你态度的非常清晰的迹象。我的意思是，还有其他事情，比如你如何回应别人的批评，对吧？变得有防御性，在我的脑海里把他们贬低得一文不值，对吧？那是你的反应，是的，那是健康的吗？不。所以，另一种反应是，他们是对的，我是一个一文不值的虫子，天哪，我有多糟糕。好吧，这是另一种反应。或者第三种反应是，这里有些有趣的东西，我可以从中学习，也许有些是真的。你知道，也许你必须认真对待，你必须看看批评你的人，并判断他们是否有道理，他们是否没有政治目的。我记得我24岁的时候，我在纽约当记者，我认为自己是一个了不起的记者，24岁的纽约记者。一切都说得通，对吧？我写了一篇关于，这是一篇旅行杂志的文章，我当时在那里工作，或者这篇关于意大利阿马尔菲海岸的旅行文章，我认为这是自戈尔·维达尔以来最伟大的东西，我当时想，哇。然后编辑邀请我共进午餐，好吧，我被提拔了，是的，是的，对吧？然后在他喝了第三杯马提尼之后，他去了，罗伯特，你不是作家，你不是作家材料。那篇文章乱七八糟，你没有纪律，你的语言太混乱，你没有与观众建立联系，与读者建立联系。如果我是你，我不是这么刻薄地说的，我会去读法学院或商学院，然后离开写作。我的天哪，我为你感到尴尬，这已经是几十年后的事了，是的，很难听到。所以，我那天试图回忆这个人的名字，但我记不起来了。我能非常清楚地看到他，我脑海中有一个非常生动的画面。我的意思是，如果他在午餐时喝了三杯马提尼，他已经完了，所以没关系。我脑海中出现的画面就像一栋房子，外面看起来不错，但如果你看了阁楼和内部，你会发现木头都烂了，而且白蚁已经把它吃光了，东西马上就要掉下来了。这就是我脑海中浮现的关于这个男人内在的画面。但事后，我显然很痛苦，我想，这个[脏话]，他错了，对吧？但随着时间的推移，我处理了它，我想，不，他说的有道理。我真的不喜欢新闻业，因为我真的不喜欢，而且我真的不适合，我的语言对于这个类型来说有点奇怪，我写的东西有点太文学化了，对吧？也许我注定要成为一名小说家，或编剧，或写别的东西。所以他说的有道理，我离开了新闻业，我决定去欧洲旅行，然后我漫无目的地游荡，然后写一本小说，之类的。然后那最终失败了。好吧，是的，但他最终在建筑业工作，在，嗯，医院，真的，在，我的意思是，如果那个人需要，我之前开了一个黑色笑话，但听起来他需要三杯马提尼才能打破坏消息，他可能是一个真正的好人，因为他这样做了。他没有这样做，他是为了你。是的，是的，但我没有把他的建议放在心上，因为现在你是一个作家。所以，我想，因为我知道，我确实有一些东西，只是我选错了，你知道，类型，写关于阿马尔菲海岸的令人难以忍受的文章。让我们谈谈煽动者。我，我的意思是，我告诉人们这个节目会很混乱。煽动者，不幸的是，根据我的反馈星期五收件箱，全国一半的人都在为一个煽动者工作。从警察到白宫，在政治的各个层面都有煽动者，这取决于你问谁。所以，我认为这可能很有用，无论我们办公室里有一个，还是我们选他们当官。在你身边有一个煽动者时，要更加关注理性，以避免他们的情感拉力，这是你在本节开头说的。这非常深刻，但也暗示着，嗯，它确实暗示着煽动者利用情感拉力来，你会说，影响我们，还是控制我们？嗯，是的，我认为这很明显。我的意思是，你不需要说出来，我，这让我听起来不那么聪明，好吧，显而易见，船长，我只是在开玩笑，我只是在开玩笑，是的，是的，但这是真的，这是真的。我所做的只是重新表述了一下，人们会说，哇，乔丹，真的，他理解他看到的东西，哇，乔丹，你真的理解我，这真的很有趣。我真的读得很仔细。所以，是的，显而易见的是，煽动者靠他们对我们的情感拉力来生存。嗯，我的意思是，显而易见的是，他们不是通过理性来吸引我们，对吧？对，所以在《人性法则》中，我有一章关于非理性，它是第一章，我谈到我们人类的大脑中有某些非理性的偏见，其中一个显然是每个人都知道的确认偏见。但我谈到了确信偏见，那就是，如果有人说话如此确信，如此愤怒，如此情绪化，如此正义，我们就会认为这有什么真实之处。他们不会假装这些情绪，因此，他们所说的必然是真的。这就是为什么电视上的人能成为百万富翁。他们看起来越生气，他们就越真实，他们就能接触到更多的观众，因为我们有一种倾向，想要被煽动情绪，想要有人能引起他们的共鸣，我们想相信那些宣泄我们不一定敢于表达的愤怒的人。对，这是个好主意。我们在极端左翼和极端右翼的电视上都能看到这一点，因为那些节目里他们互相喊叫，他们只做这些，或者有人说，你能相信这些白痴在做这个，那个，那个吗？然后一群在家的人说，是的，我讨厌他们，他们是最坏的。是的，我的意思是，我认为真正这样做的人是塔克·卡尔森。我不会，你知道，在这里谈论政治，因为左翼也有人这样做，当然。说句公道话，你知道，克里斯·库莫也可能有点像那样，但塔克·卡尔森，他的嘲讽，他的鄙视，他的愤怒，他的刻薄，是人们喜欢的。这就是让他们收看的原因，他们认为他一定说的是实话，因为他背后有如此多的信念。所以，与一位教授站起来，以一种非常平静的姿态解释世界上真正发生的事情，我们就会想，嗯，什么书呆子，你知道，他一定有什么目的，因为他去了哈佛或者别的什么。他是精英主义者，他是精英主义者，正是如此，谢谢。所以，我们天生就被我们的情感所吸引，这是我们本性的一部分，因为我们本质上是情感动物。对，情感，给你一个非常简短的生理学课程，当你感到愤怒、沮丧或兴奋时，你的血液中会释放出非常强大的荷尔蒙或化学物质，而大脑皮层，额叶皮层，你的思考区域，那些只是微弱的电脉冲，远不如那些在你体内流动的荷尔蒙那么强大，让你的肾上腺素飙升，对吧？是的，我很少会对逻辑数学问题之类的东西感到兴奋。它永远不会让我兴奋，不得不做数学作业而不是看我想看的电影或节目，对吧？这会触发皮质醇或任何反应。所以，天性使然，我们天生就会关注我们的情绪，而我们的想法，是的，我们有点听它们，但当我们感觉到某事时，它会以如此多的身体参与进来，以至于我们，嗯，我们必须关注它。所以，我们天生就是情感生物，我们不是我们喜欢相信的那种理性思考的动物。而那些做市场营销和公关的人，他们知道我们是情感生物，他们知道如何吸引我们身上的动物。这是一种他们已经发展出来的艺术，他们已经磨练了。他们称之为“有效启发法”，人们根据情感购买商品，而不是基于理性决策。你是说我不需要升级相机和iPhone 13 Pro Max吗？你确定吗？嗯，你可能看到了一些广告，或者一些，是的，这可能不是一个理性的决定。不，完全不理性。所以，摆脱你是一个理性存在的想法，你非常基于情感，而政治人物，或者任何领域的人，或者你的老板，或者别的什么，如果他们总是情绪化，而且他们表达某事时充满信念、愤怒和正义感，你可以相信他们隐藏着什么。他们试图说服自己所说的话的真实性，他们试图欺骗自己所说的话是真的，但通过扮演那个角色，额外的愤怒等等。所以，骗子们从一开始就知道，你越觉得真诚，你越告诉人们相信你所卖的东西就像黄金一样，你知道，你有一个金矿等等，你卖的埃菲尔铁塔，人们就越有可能相信你。所以，我只是希望人们在这个世界上更加怀疑，当有人滔滔不绝地表达各种情绪时，我注意到在我们这个时代，社交媒体时代，你看到很多正义感，人们看到，我对我的事业深信不疑。愤怒，它给了我，你知道，说任何我想说的话的许可，我想生气，我想暴力，因为我在真理的一边。你现在经常看到这种情况。我希望你对这样的人非常怀疑，他们可能隐藏着什么，他们对这个话题感到非常不安全，他们可能在撒谎。你想要保持一定的距离，并能够用一定的理性和一定的超然来分析他们所说的话。是的，你说情感自我依赖于无知。所以，如果，我们，这些人的要求是我们不要停下来思考，不要有任何怀疑的骨头，而是说，是的，然后盲目地遵循你所声称的。正是如此。你说一旦我们意识到这一点，它就失去了吸引力。所以，意识，就像群体偏见，不安全感，自我，是最大的危险。我认为这是你或我注意到的，而不是告诉你该做什么的人的自我，而是可能说，也许我只是被煽动了，我错了。那是确认偏见，社会学家说，它决定了人类行为的95%。真的吗？嗯，我刚随便说的。你刚编造的。你知道吗？但，是的，这是一个巨大的，这是一个很大的比例。但它比你想象的要高得多，让我们这么说吧。所以，发生的是，如果你曾经相信过某件事，如果你曾经投票给某个人，对吧？然后证据来了，他们不是他们所说的那个人，他们是伪君子，他们是欺骗性的等等。你的倾向不是相信别人告诉你的话，而是加倍下注于你原来的态度，说告诉我这个的人有私心，他们有，你知道，他们是在搞政治，是他们的错，对吧？我的选择是正确的。确认偏见的原因是，你永远不想相信自己很愚蠢，你永远不想相信自己被骗了，有人欺骗了你，你不是理性的，你没有根据正确的分析做出决定。所以，你天生就有偏见，相信你已经相信的东西，相信你想要相信的东西。所以，你将寻找证实你已经相信的证据，相信我，它确实激励了很大一部分。

人们的行为，它的意思是它让你不愿改变你正在做的事情，因为改变你正在做的事情意味着改变你的思维方式，并承认你错了，你做了一些愚蠢的事情，或者你走错了方向。人类很难做到这一点。我认为你是对的。我的意思是，我们一直看到这种情况发生，当涉及到新闻、政治或任何类似的事情时，没有人愿意回头说，“是的，我做了那件事，那是错的。”而且会产生深远的后果，尤其是当这些后果对他们自己或他人产生深远影响时。我们如何平衡理性、谨慎、怀疑的需求与好奇心和开放接受新思想的好处呢？嗯，所以你可以太理性，你可以太谨慎，你可以对生活的态度太逻辑化。我使用的比喻是一匹马和骑马的人。所以我在说，马是你情感的自我，它是所有那些动物的能量，那些在你体内奔涌的荷尔蒙，让你兴奋或愤怒等等。而那匹马的骑手是你理性的自我，是你额叶皮层，是你通过理性过程来决定需要做什么的执行决策。好的，所以如果你曾经骑过马，我年轻的时候骑过，它比看起来要难得多。是的，如果你还记得的话。好吧，马是非常敏感的生物，它们能很快地捕捉到你的能量，对吧？它们能从你夹紧马镫的方式判断你是否紧张。它们非常非常敏感，好吗？所以，如果它们感觉到你没有控制它们，你很担心，你很害怕，你不知道如何控制这匹马，它们就会失控。它们会成为局面中的主导者，它们会去任何它们想去的地方，它们不会听你的，因为它们不认为你有能力。你不够严厉，对吧？嗯，你会发现它们会到处乱跑，它们会比你想要的跑得快得多，这可能非常危险。但是，如果你抓缰绳抓得太紧，如果你是那种过度控制的类型，你把马嚼子咬得太紧，你想确保它们只做你想要的事情，马就不会舒服，对吧？它不喜欢那样，因为马被驯服了，但它们有野性。对吧？所以它们要么会反抗，不一定会做你想让它们做的事，它们会走得很慢等等，而且你根本无法轻松地骑它们。它们会非常犹豫，它们会突然停下来，在你想要它们前进的时候去吃植物上的叶子等等。所以，要让这个比喻生动起来的完美平衡是，你想要抓住缰绳，但你也想让这匹动物拥有一些自己的力量，因为那匹马非常有力量。马是令人惊叹的强大生物。你想利用它们的能量，为自己的目的引导它们的能量，对吧？所以把你的情绪想象成那匹马，它们蕴含着巨大的能量和力量。如果你没有一定程度的情感能量支持，你就无法写书，无法创业，无法做任何事情。你必须感到兴奋，你必须感到有动力，你必须非常非常渴望某件事。如果你抓缰绳抓得太紧，试图过度控制，等等，你永远无法让任何事情起步，因为你没有任何能量支持。但是，如果你让它随心所欲地发展，那么什么都不会完成，因为你无法组织，你无法自律，你无法做出执行决定，比如我们必须做这个而不是那个。所以你想找到平衡，对吧？所以你不想太理性，太控制。你想在某些时候放手，让你的情绪引导你，受到启发，但又能保持一定的距离，知道你可以拉回来，你可以控制它。现在我忘了你最初的问题了。问题是如何平衡理性、谨慎和怀疑的需求与好奇心和开放接受新思想的好处？嗯，所以好奇心和开放性就是那匹马在探索事物，想要尝试新事物，对吧？所以，有好奇心和开放的想法是一种情感特质，对吧？你不是因为额叶皮层里有什么东西而感到好奇，而是有一种兴奋感让你对某事感到好奇，你感兴趣，有情感成分，对吧？你必须有时放下那种过于理性、过于控制的需求。所以生活中，你必须知道何时放手，何时放开控制，让事情发生，让事情来到你身边。如果你试图控制一切，那么事情就不会发生，你将没有惊喜的空间，没有意外的空间。如果你是一名科学家，一些最好的发现是你从未预料到或计划过的，它们只是偶然发生的。如果你已经评估了你认为正在发生的事情，你就不会对新信息持开放态度。所以平衡就在于我所说的，你知道，过于理性会给你带来问题，你将无法完成任何事情，你也无法从实际层面探索你的想法。你提到我们应该观察人们在别人面前的行为，他们如何互动，他们的情绪等等，并将这些与他们对你的行为进行比较。是否存在沮丧、微表情、愤怒、蔑视，然后问可能的原因是什么？所以，在处理这些事情时有很多实际操作。如果我看着别人是如何行事的，他们在我面前也是这样行事的吗？我们是在寻找，我们是在寻找隐藏的敌人吗？我尽量不在这里夸大其词，我们是在寻找隐藏的敌人吗？我们是在寻找那些会暴露他们真实面目的人吗？因为我们知道他们在和我们说话时会戴上面具，但可能不会和别人在一起。嗯，这有可能，但这并不是这里的重点。重点是能够获取关于面具背后真正发生的事情的信息。这可能是完全良性的，他们可能喜欢你，他们可能不像你认为的那样对你感兴趣，但这并不意味着他们会出去伤害你。这只意味着你认为他们对你的想法感到兴奋，但他们实际上并没有那么兴奋。所以我们都有这样的经历，在一个人面前，比如我们的妻子或同事或丈夫，我们表现得像某种方式，然后我们在另一个人面前，我们表现得完全不同，对吧？因为他们有不同的能量。所以我们说话和行动的方式，以及我们在老板面前的肢体语言，与我们和孩子，和两岁的孩子说话时，或者和年长的人说话时，是不同的。所以，当我们出现在不同的人面前时，我们一直在改变自己。对吧？所以当你走向某人时，他们正在回应你的能量，其中一部分来自你，你无法真正区分哪些是你，哪些是真正来自他们的。但是，如果你观察他们与其他人的互动，你就能获得更好的信息，获得更客观的信息。所以你用你来评判他们，他们是这样，那样等等。但是和另一个人在一起，他们表现得完全不同，这才是真实的自我。嗯，你真的不知道，但至少现在你意识到，他们对你的回应只是画面的一部分，对吧？所以你想观察人们在各种情况下的互动，它会给你更多关于他们脑子里真正发生的事情的线索。另一个实际操作是训练自己看穿人们的伪装。这有点非常相似。训练自己看穿他们的神话，寻找他们真实性格的迹象，或者他们性格的真实迹象。我们该怎么做？你在书中给出的例子是霍华德·休斯。他实际上是一个糟糕的商人，但大多数人都认为他是一个了不起的创造者。与此同时，根据莱昂纳多·迪卡普里奥的电影，他把瓶子尿在房间里，造了一架没有飞起来，或者至少没有好好飞起来的飞机。嗯，这个想法是，人们在生活中都有模式，对吧？而这些模式揭示了我所说的他们的性格。性格是一个人根深蒂固的东西。它是我们之前谈到的基因成分，它是他们早期的教育部分，它是他们内心深处的东西，他们无法控制。你有一个性格，我有一个性格，随着时间的推移，它会创造模式。我们在工作世界，在个人关系等方面都会陷入模式。你可以随着时间的推移看到这一点，它揭示了那个本质，那个核心，我们常常以更负面的方式来看待。所以，霍华德·休斯有这种模式，他会吸引人们进入这种商业冒险，因为他非常雄心勃勃，非常宏大，然后他不会兑现。他不会兑现的原因有很多。一个是他是一个疯狂的微观管理者，他必须监督那架飞机的每一个细节，但他不能，因为他只有一个人，他会被信息淹没，他会变得麻木，项目永远不会发生。他会被要求为国防部建造 200 架巨大的运输机，但他只建造了一架，你知道，鹅，那个东西，布鲁斯·鹅，我想是的，对吧？因为他被麻木了，但他必须控制一切等等。这延伸到了他制作电影，执导电影，他有同样的思维方式，每次都失败了。然而，人们并没有注意到这些失败，因为他们被霍华德·休斯的光环所吸引，这个冒险家，这个飞行员，这个会冒着生命危险做事情的飞行员，这是真的，他非常鲁莽地驾驶飞机等等。所以他们买下了霍华德·休斯的神话，他们没有看到现实是，这个人是一个糟糕的商人，他就是一个糟糕的商人，对吧？他，他，你知道，线索都在那里，然而他们却被这个非常圆滑、有魅力的男人的外表所迷惑。到最后变得很可笑，因为他有四五六次失败的经历，但直到 50 年代和 60 年代，他仍然能够说服人们资助他疯狂的项目。所以，总而言之，这个想法是停止关注人们的魅力，他们的风度，他们的伪装，他们初次见面时的兴奋程度，他们的简历，他们去了哈佛或耶鲁等等的事实。看看他们的性格，看看他们隐藏在下面的东西。所以，如果你看了霍华德·休斯的性格，你会看到一个深深缺乏安全感和深深控制欲的人，以至于他永远无法完成任何事情。如果你看到了这一点，你就永远不会签署他的任何一个项目，损失数百万美元，对吧？所以人们会给出这些迹象，他们会给出他们行为的迹象，他们会给出他们不是团队合作者的迹象。我喜欢判断一个人的性格是强还是弱。你想要一个性格强大的人作为亲密关系中的伴侣，作为商业伙伴，作为工作中的同事。一个性格强大的人可以接受批评，这是最重要的。一个内心强大的人可以接受批评并建设性地利用它。他们不会变得防御性。一个强大的人在压力下不会崩溃，然后突然变成一个爱抱怨的小孩。他们可以处理。他们有存在感。一个强大的人可以与他人合作。他们不受自我的支配。他们不必一切都按自己的方式来。一个软弱的性格则相反。所以你根据他们的魅力雇佣某人，然后发现当他们压力大的时候，他们会崩溃。你发现当你批评他们时，他们会变得抱怨和防御，他们无法学习。你发现他们无法作为一个团队合作，他们只想推进自己的议程。你太晚才发现这一点，因为他们已经在为你工作了。所以，在与人交往之前就判断他们。我的书里总是会提到，总会有迹象表明潜在的性格是什么。如果人们想要更多关于这方面的实际操作，显然可以在书中找到，我们会把所有书都链接到节目笔记中。我们做了一期节目，可能已经有两三年了，很难说，我也会链接到节目笔记中。那一期充满了嫉妒、羡慕、人性、控制和防御，再次强调，所有黑暗面的东西。嗯，是的。我将以最后一件事来结束。现在加密货币正在疯狂地发展，股市也高得离谱。很多时候，这是你的想法。很多时候，我们是在被动反应。我们被卷入当下。完美的例子是加密货币的上涨，经济。即使是明智的人也会受骗。哦，比特币创下历史新高，看看道琼斯指数有多高。我们需要把更多的钱投入到这些东西里。我们必须拉远距离，从更长远的角度来看待问题。但是我们怎么做到这一点呢？我们怎么能拉远距离，即使我们不想呢？这才是真正发生的事情，对吧？我觉得我想买更多那只正在上涨的股票。我觉得我需要登上比特币的火箭。我们的恐惧错失（FOMO）正在全面展开。我如何才能绕过它？因为当比特币是零，道琼斯指数亏损的时候，我说我不需要投资，这很容易。当我觉得我是唯一一个错失机会的人时，这真的很难。嗯，我写了整整一章关于这个，它叫做我们的短视。我描述了泡沫现象，经济泡沫。最初的泡沫恰如其分地命名为南海泡沫。我在《人性法则》中讲述了这个故事。这发生在 1710 年代的英国。它的想法是，当其他人都在买东西，而你没有，或者在做事情的时候，我们是一种病毒式生物。我们看着，我们是社会动物。我们非常关注其他人正在做什么，我们被卷入了羊群效应。如果其他人都在买东西，很兴奋，肯定有原因。我不想错过。对吧？所以，这才是许多庞氏骗局背后的原因。参与的人越多，它看起来就越真实和实质。所以南海泡沫是一种滑稽的事件，那个男人，它就像最初的庞氏骗局。艾萨克·牛顿爵士把他的毕生积蓄投入到南海泡沫中，他最终损失了所有的积蓄。英格兰国王在背后支持它，国王的兄弟，我不记得是哪个了。是的，很难说。我依稀记得你作品中的内容。是的，所以每个人都被最聪明的人和最愚蠢的人所吸引。所以，当你发现自己处于一种动态中时，这是人性的一部分。有郁金香狂热。我本来要说的，就像郁金香狂热一样，人们买郁金香的价格相当于黄金，或者别的什么。17 世纪。你有 19 世纪的铁路狂热。你有 90 年代的科技泡沫。你有 2000 年初的房地产泡沫。谁知道现在的泡沫是什么？也许是加密货币，我不知道。但是当你发现自己，而你被激励是因为别人在做某事时，你应该在脑子里亮起一个红灯，然后说，“哦不，我可能，我可能正在被这种人性中软弱的部分所影响。我被卷入了这种动态，我的社会本性告诉我，别人在做某事，它一定很棒，一定很有趣，我必须参与。不，那一刻你感觉到这一点，当这种情况发生时，退后一步。你想，这是你和马的舵手，你想稍微抓紧缰绳，因为你知道你的钱，很多钱可能会受到威胁。所以这是一个微妙的事情。我的意思是，谁知道一开始加密货币是真的还是假的。也许它是新的东西，它会。但当你听到人们说“这次不一样”时，“关于加密货币有什么新的东西”，你的“放屁”计必须飙升，因为这是每个骗子都用过的语言。这是不同的，这不像过去任何事情。金融规则正在被改写。你不用担心，因为这是全新的，不同的。那是百分之百的放屁。金融规则没有被改写。泡沫存在，而且已经存在了数百年，因为人性，因为心理学，而这就是把你卷入其中的原因。所以你想看看我们时代经典的泡沫，就是导致 08 年崩盘的那个。所有这些人都在参与这些复杂的房地产衍生品，所有我甚至记不起来的名字，那是我在华尔街做的事情，抵押贷款支持证券。好的，是的。我记得我在想，如果人们付不起抵押贷款会怎么样？我的合伙人说，房地产总是上涨的。这些人太多了，他们不会全部违约。好吧，房地产确实倾向于上涨，但这并不是房地产，这也不是与财产挂钩的，这与完全是金融欺诈的东西挂钩，它们只存在于纸面上。而世界上最聪明的人都被卷入了那个泡沫。你无法相信那些去过哈佛、耶鲁商学院的 CEO 的名字，他们都陷入了“这次不一样”的想法。我们创造了一种新的金融机制。旧规则，你可以把它们扔掉。那一刻你听到这句话，你就知道有问题了。所以，突然之间，经典的迹象，我们都经历过它们。如果你够老，我不知道那些年轻的人，如果他们没有，如果你 12 岁，也许没有。但如果你超过 12 岁，你就经历过那次崩盘，你知道真正发生了什么。那就是羊群效应和某种愚蠢，如果用词恰当的话，我们都容易犯的错误。当你发现自己情绪上依恋比特币，以至于有人稍微吹嘘一点怀疑的东西，你就变得情绪化，反应过度。“来吧，老古董，你这个恐龙，你不明白，这是新的东西。”你知道你正在喝葡萄酒，你正在喝醉，你遇到了麻烦。所以，不一定是没有什么可以依据的。比特币的比喻，仍然有创新，仍然有新的东西从中产生。它可能会改变世界。但它完全是全新的、不同的，不受所有事物都受到的法则约束的想法，我们不会发明任何机器，无论是在地球上还是在我们已知的宇宙中，不受重力约束。嗯，嗯，我在《人性》中给出的比喻是，人性如此强大，以至于它改变了我们创造的一切。它就像一种非个人的力量。所以，为了完成这个比喻，互联网在 90 年代出现，然后它开始解释 90 年代末，我们都在使用它，我们都非常兴奋。有一个论坛可以进行所有自由的交流。它就像狂野的西部，太令人兴奋了，它可能导致任何事情。慢慢地，是的，是的，好吧，慢慢地，它变成了出售最糟糕产品的场所。它变成了在线色情内容的场所。它变成了发泄愤怒和成为网络喷子的场所。它带来了人性，改变了我们曾经认为是一个解放的设备，将打开世界的东西，变成一种丑陋的、政治化的东西，成为中国用来监视人民、监视自己公民的工具，在这个国家也是如此，用来收集私人信息。所以人性，它黑暗的一面会占据主导。所以比特币可能一开始是一个令人难以置信的解放的东西，但你最好相信，那里的力量将接管它，它将以某种方式被扭曲和变形，就像互联网过去被扭曲一样。嗯，幸运的是，比特币是去中心化的，我将收到很多电子邮件，人们会说他错了，原因如下，我期待这些，这是一次很棒的谈话。是的，非常感谢。我只是说你可能是对的，但你认为自己如此正确的事实就是问题所在。只要能够审视自己，并在你大脑中最小的角落里考虑一下，它可能是一个泡沫，仅此而已。