A Biblical Process for Healing That Actually Works — 90% Success Rate - #151 Beatty Carmichael

Health is based on mental, physical, and spiritual. Now, our healthcare is mental and physical, and they've lost the spiritual. So, what we miss is if you have something that's persistent and consistent, you keep getting sick over and over and over and over and over again, or you have some sort of sickness, rheumatoid arthritis or allergy or asthma or something, and it's a persistent thing. In almost all cases, those persistent issues have spiritual roots of a sin somewhere. It could be generationally. It doesn't have to be yours.

So my first response is always just in case that maybe it's a spiritual route. So let's try the process. Let's ask God, is there a spiritual route to this thing I'm dealing with? Maybe you see it disappear. You've taken this into the world. What you have found is that people are healed at an astonishing 90% clip when going through this process. Yes, most Christians have been taught to pray for healing, but very few have actually seen it happen or have any idea that there's a scriptural process by which healing works.

Today's guest, Batty Carmichael, spent years wrestling with the same frustrations many of us feel. People praying for healing, desperate for breakthrough, but seeing almost nothing change. That search and God's prompting led him to a scripture-based discovery that's producing real consistent results. Not because of a rare gift, but because it follows the biblical mechanics that God laid out for healing.

In this conversation, you're going to hear stories of people healed instantly. But more importantly, you'll learn the simple biblical process behind those healings that anyone can use and that Batty has seen work at an astonishing 90% success rate. If you or someone you love has battled something that you can't shake, even if it's plagued you for years, or you've been wondering why your prayers for healing aren't working, then this episode may be one of the most impactful videos you could ever watch. Please meet Batty Carmichael. Welcome.

I'm so glad that you are here. Thank you, Stacy. I'm really excited about being here. The conversation is about the healing of physical and even mental and emotional maladies through biblically rooted spiritual means. And so that's what you do. And your route to be where you are right now is really interesting in itself to me. So why don't you take us back to how you got into the healing spiritual healing side of things to begin with to where you are now.

>> Yeah, it's a real interesting story. Uh I don't know if you know this part, but actually started almost 200 years ago and um I come from a line of seven generations of medical doctors, one after another after another. And not just a single doctor, but all the branches all the way up. And my generation, no one went into medicine. I went into business. And uh about 10 years ago, I grew up in a we were talking earlier, I grew up in a um a very conservative church. And looking backwards at it now, it was kind of a legalistic church, very black and white, pretty dogmatic. They believe this and this is absolute truth concept and part of that was there was no miraculous healings. I mean God can and sometimes does do miraculous healing or divine intervention healing but it's only if it's his will and we don't know his will. It definitely doesn't happen because one person prayed in faith and someone else doesn't. So I was taught for this was like 35 years that when you pray it's Lord heal this person if it be your will because you might actually have brought this sickness on him to teach him something. That's where I was 10 years ago.

I was watching a docu series on Netflix of all places and it was a trilogy series. A guy goes out with a camera and just videoing people who pray for people in the public spaces and they get healed. You know, people walking with a cane, no longer need it. Walking with crutches, no longer need it. In a wheelchair, get out and start walking. And I couldn't believe it. And I couldn't let it go. It just it consumed me. And I went through all three series. I started researching everything. And I felt that God was putting a burden in my heart to go out and and do this myself. But I didn't know it was God's will. And I knew enough about praying that to pray without believing is wasted effort. you know, you can't to expect it to happen, you have to have faith. And I did not know if it was God's will. So, I spent the next six months, I know this sounds crazy, but you come from a similar background, uh, trying to determine, is it really God's will that he wants people healed, right? I mean, it's like it seems like such a simple thing from our perspective now, but but that's really where I was. And I went to my church and they had no clue. So I had to go outside of the wall if that makes sense. And I found that there's a whole another world of Christianom outside the wall. And so I started to pursue the written the the books and conferences of people that professed to be going out and praying for people and seeing healing. And the evidence was clear. They were seeing healing. But I I did something maybe a little bit different. I had no interest in their opinion. I was reading their books and going to their seminars to see what scriptures they were basing their interpretation on. And then I would go back to the Bible and say, "God, show me." And I would start reading these scriptures and I go, "Oh my gosh, that's exactly what it said." I've been reading this for 30 years and I never saw that. because I was seeing it through the lens of how I was being taught at church as opposed to through the lens of the Holy Spirit. And it took six months to come to the absolute conclusion it was God's will to heal generally speaking, right? You have to, you know, what about the 95year-old who has cancer? Well, maybe it's his time to die. >> But what about the 20-year-old? God's will is to heal. Okay?

And I remember it was October 2016. I was at one of these seminars I was going to try to learn and uh the pastor up on stage. Okay, let's ask the Holy Spirit to come now and just touch everyone. And Holy Spirit, it was in a auditorium and you could just see and feel this sense of the Holy Spirit moving across the room. people you I mean it's almost like a if you've ever you I know you've been to a football stadium um but it's almost like the the wave people jump up and down you see this wave moving across the same thing was happening through this auditorium and I didn't feel anything fancy you know people were laughing crying people you know whatever it was with the Holy Spirit and I never had any of those emotional outbursts or feelings but the guy said if you if you feel your fingers tingling that's a gift of healing if If you feel something else, it's a gift of this. I said, "Well, my fingers are tingling a little bit. Maybe God's given me a gift of healing." So, at lunch break, I decided to go out and see. So, this was now I decided it was now time to start praying for people. I went to the gas station, went to a grocery store, went to Walmart, prayed for 18 people. anyone I could find that looked like they were in pain. They had a bandaged knee. They were on crutches. They were riding one of the electric scooters in Walmart. And a third, six of those 18 people got instantly healed from things like RSD. This lady was in a white blouse and she had on her right arm a um a black compression sleeve. And I knew enough, okay, it's probably in pain. So I said, "Hey, uh, looks like you're you got a compression sleeve. Are you in pain?" She says, "Yes, I have RSD." I said, "Oh, okay." Like I knew what it was. I had no idea. And uh, I said, "Can I pray for you?" She said, "Don't touch me." I said, "No, no worries. Uh, I'll just guide your husband to pray." So I guided the husband to pray. In Jesus' name, I command all the pain to leave. And then I said, "Okay, now test out." She the pain's gone. Oh my gosh. And she's touching it. She'll let her husband touch it. I find I come back later uh come home and I was telling my dad this. He's a doctor and he's always he's a scientist. Uh someone else was um she had degenerative disc in her neck and her back. She had arthritis. She was riding a scooter and had a nurse assistant type person walking with her to take the things off the shelf because she couldn't reach it and she couldn't even look up. Her head was focused in one position. To do that would excruciating pain. I pray for her and say, "How do you feel?" So all the pain's gone. Really? Well, stand up and do something you couldn't do. She stands up. She touches her toes. She moves her head all the way around. And I'm thinking, "Are you sure you were really in pain?" So I asked this lady, said, "How long you been working with her?" This nurse assistant. She said, "About two years." I said, "Is this normal?" She said, "No, I've never seen her do that before." So is this type of stuff. I go home and tell my dad these stories. Lady with arthritis heal. This lady with degenerative disc healed. This lady with RSD heal. I said, "What is RSD?" He said, "Well, it's a neurological disease that's incurable." And that was the thing that caught my dad. He said, "If that disappeared, that's a miracle." So that was my journey into this.

Um I knew enough to know that if Jesus had prayed for them, all 18 people would have been healed. And um uh and I only saw a third. So I would keep going back and say, "Well, what's wrong?" Not what's wrong, but how do you press in? Because I understood it was done by faith that Jesus healed. It says in Acts 10 that Jesus was anointed with a Holy Spirit and it was a Holy Spirit working through Jesus to heal him. So it wasn't Jesus by God, but is Jesus in the same role as we are man by faith. So I realized that there was something different and that my faith wasn't at the level to be where I wanted. So I started to press in and within about a year 90% of the people I was praying for were being instantly healed. whatever their issues were where uh I have a lot of people, how do you know they were healed? Did they go to the doctor? So, no, this is more of what I call a um practical healing uh uh where the symptoms disappear. We were talking before we recorded one of the guys I walked up to um he had glaucoma in his left eye. I think it was his left eye. I said, "Well, I didn't know anything about glaucoma." And I said, "What does it feel like? What are the symptoms?" He said, "Every time I open and close my eye, it feels like I've got grit, sand grit all in my eye and it's rough and it hurts. And then as far as visually," he said, "Imagine you park a car under a tree for two years and then you look out through the windshield. You know how dirty that would be?" I said, "Yeah." He said, "That's what my eye looks like." I said, "Okay, well, can I pray for you?" And I'd pray for him and said, "Check it out." And it was completely clear. No more grit. He could see perfectly clear. And I saw uh deaf ears healed, glaucoma, all kinds of sciatica, all kinds of arthritis, just joint pain, knee pain, anxiety, depression. Um uh one of my favorite ones, it was really funny. I um was at uh Chick-fil-A and I uh saw this big old dude, black dude, coming in on crutches and he was probably like 6'3, 300 lb, all muscle. He came in with his wife and his three teenage kids and his left knee is bandaged and he slides into the um uh into the booth there while his wife goes to order food. And I leaned over and said, "What happened to you?" He said, "I'm a tree cutter and I was cutting trees on the ground and I turned to leave and my foot got caught and he ripped all the ligaments in his left knee." >> I said, "Does it hurt?" He said, "Oh yeah." I mean, I said 0ero to 10. Um, what's the pain level? He said, "It's a 10." So, it must have been fairly recent. And and I always think on this because it's so funny. Here I'm this 155B white dude, bald old man. And here's this big old black guy and he doesn't know me from anyone. And I said, "Well, do you want God to heal it?" And he said what most people say. "Well, I know he can." I said, "Well, I didn't ask if you think he can. do you want him to? He said, "Well, yeah." I said, "Well, swing your knee out. Let me pray for it." And now he's kind of hooked. He didn't know what to do, so he kind of swings it out, but you could tell there's some um uh some caution, some not sure what's going on, skepticism, maybe. And so, I just put my hand on his knee and thank the Lord for loving this man. And I asked to heal the knee. I said, "In Jesus name, knee be healed." I said, "Okay, test it out." He said, 'What do you mean?' I said, 'Well, stand up and test it out.' And so he stands up, gets his crutches, and the first step he takes, he said,"Oh my god." I said, "What's up?" He said, "It's a four." I said, "Well, sit back down. That means you're going to walk out of here carrying your crutches." So, he sits back down a lot more eagerly. I'm looking over. His three teenage kids are watching, trying to say, "What's going on?" The wife is in line looking over and seeing what's happening. And so I prayed again. I said, "Now test it out." So he stands up. He holds his crutches up and doesn't use them at all. And he's walking normally. And I said, "Come on, man. Go test it all the way. Do a deep knee bend." He goes all the way down, all the way up, totally healed. So this is what I was seeing consistently. And that lasted for about six years. 90% everyone.

During the same time uh about the same time that um the 90% hit. By the way, uh it hit because of fasting. We can talk about that. Really powerful if you want to walk spirit in spiritual authority. But he also then started taking me into deliverance, the casting out of demons. And uh the first deliverance I did was one of these full-on manifestations. And so it was a, you know, like throw you me into the deep end and say good luck. And I learned a lot from it. But one of the interesting things that started happening is as I would cast the demons out, the symptoms that they were producing in that person, anxiety, depression, whether it's despair or pain or whatever it was, as soon as the demon would leave, the symptom would leave. And then as I'm out praying for people and God was was instantly healing them of whatever their symptoms were, I started to get a sense in my spirit that it was the same thing. That what I was seeing in deliverance casting demons out and people instantly being healed of whatever the problem was that demon was creating their life was the same thing I was seeing at Walmart. I used I would just go to Walmart because it was a target-rich place. And when I would pray for them, I sensed that it was the same thing. And then uh this was now about four years ago. It was actually May 2021 cuz I was going back through some notes. I I was back out at Walmart praying 90% of the people being healed. Went back out two weeks later and crickets. No one. maybe 10% at most at that time and it really startled me sort of like uh so I went to Auburn and there were at the time I was there Bo Jackson was playing so there was an uh you know playing football and baseball and ba golf and whatever and he's just top and everything he does imagine he goes back out the next day and he can't even hold a football he can't throw a ball he can't do anything that's what happened with me it was like this total shock what just happened? No one's getting healed. And I went back to the Lord and said,"Lord, what happened?" And God said, "I took away your gift of healing." I said, "Why? It's been helping so many people." He said, "Because now I want you to learn to do it by authority." And I instantly understood what he meant because the way you cast a demon out is through authority. you break its legal right to be in someone and then you cast it out. And so I went back to Walmart the next time I went and I led people through a simple prayer of repentance to break legal rights of whatever tormenting spirit there there may be. And I started to see the same 90% success rate in people being healed. But at that time I started to see more powerful healings faster things I'd never seen before. And over the years the Lord had me systematize it. In business my skill set Stacy is to take very complex um routines that you have to go through that had to be very precise and create standard operating procedures SOPs. So you could take a new employee who don't know what they're doing. They follow it step by step and it executes it perfectly. So I started it to I I started to see the pattern as I was guiding people through praying on their own for healing that there was this pattern formula formulating my mind and I started to systematize it out and that's how we got here today.

>> There's a lot packed into that, right? We got probably four episodes of stuff right in in into that right there. the impartation of the gift of healing in a service. Did you go into that service looking for the gift of healing? Um, so it was that wasn't the only service I'd gone to. I went to uh Voice of Healing. I went to any conference that was focused on healing. This happened to be a Todd White power and love conference. And I was pursuing where the Lord was leading. You know, I I I knew enough and I knew the Lord personally enough at such a at a deep enough level at that time that I could sense he's he's leading something. So, I was just following. And I'm I'm not sure if I was looking for anything specific. I wasn't. You know, some people say, "Oh, I want to pray for people for healing." So they start praying for people and they'll like I think Todd White said he prayed for 500 people before he before his first one got healed. I didn't do that. I'm I don't do things for uh how can I say this? I'm not a thrillseker. I'm I'm not a spiritual tourist. Um I'm very deliberate with what I do. And that's why I spent six months deliberately trying to figure out is it God's will? because if God is leading me to pray, I must know it's his will. And so when I went to that conference, I'm not sure if I was going there seeking for a gift. I didn't even think about a gift of healing. I never called it a gift of healing until several years later and when I realized, ah, I guess this must be that thing they call a gift of healing. It wasn't like on my radar. It just one of the things step by step by step, the Lord was leading me. And so

>> but you felt the thing happen though, right? You you felt the tingling the tingling in your fingers and they interpreted that you feel this. This is likely what that is. I'm assuming that's based on experience, right? >> I'm assuming so. Yeah. >> Yeah. Some when people feel that and suddenly they recognize that they've got this gift. A lot of people want the gift of healing, >> right? >> What does somebody need to do to get the gift of healing? This is a complete sidebar. I know we got a lot to cover here and I don't want to spend a lot of time here, but

>> I'm thankful I no longer have the gift of healing and I want to be sensitive with this because I go to a church that's focused on gifts. With the gift of healing, one of the challenges is look at me and how great I am. I can heal you. And there's a responsibility. I would go out initially because it was fun and amazing to see God do miracles, but then more and more out of the love and responsibility to help others. When he took my gift away, I was really concerned. But what I've learned now with doing the prayer freedom is it removes me from the process. So people no longer look at me as being great or special. >> He's the healer. >> He's the healer. I'm just guiding them. And >> if I could get my gift back, well, there are a lot of times I would love to have it. Um just seven days ago, I was in Spain visiting uh I don't know if you know the story. I may have mentioned it. My daughter works at a Christian ministry in Spain called Oasis Trails. It's a hostel along the El Camino de Santiago. It's the It's a spiritual pilgrimage trail. And uh one of the guys that came through there last year from Denmark loves your show and he said, "Oh, Batty, you need to check out A Stronger Faith and get on that show." What was interesting was so I was uh just over a week ago I was there at Oasis Trail visiting my daughter and this man uh was deaf in his left ear and mostly deaf in his right ear and every time someone would talk he would cup his hand over the ear and lean in and just try to hear it. Found out later his hearing aid was dead there and the Lord placed on my heart to pray for him and I'm thinking I wish I had the gift of healing just so I could just open those ears and the Lord connected us together and um and I I I apologized to him said I used to have this gift of healing but let's just see if there's let me just see if I can u pray for you on those ears and nothing happened and then the Lord prompted me just take him through the prayer of freedom So I started to take him through just a little an ad hoc process of asking the Lord, is there some spiritual route, a sin or an unforgiveness that's tied to his hearing? And what happened was like 10 years ago, there was a loud explosion. Someone wanted to do it maliciously against him and it blew out his eardrums. Uh he was a musician, so it stole his music and he was really depressed over it. And in 15 or 20 minutes of just guiding him through this, both of his ears perfectly restored. You could click in his left ear, he could hear it just as well as you click in the right ear. And he no longer had his hearing aid in. And what that did is if I had the gift of healing, look how great I am. And people would look to me now that I don't have it. and I can simply lead him through a process that God has already established for healing, then God gets more of the glory than me. And for me, I can pull out of the limelight and say, "God, you get the glory." So for someone who wants the gift of healing, I would really encourage them from where I am now is it's greater to lead someone through prayer for healing so God gets all the glory and that they learn how healing works. You give a man a fish, you'll feed him for a day. You teach him to fish, you'll feed him for a lifetime. And I think the greatest thing would be not to pursue the gift of healing, but pursue the Lord and be a healing agent. So the gift of healing is is giving them the fish, right? It's like, hey, you've suffered with this. The gift of healing is you're healed. You know, go and en enjoy your life. But what you've done, what God has led you into, you you say is let's not just heal. Let's understand what has occurred spiritually to create this in the first place. >> Yes. >> And remove the root. Right. So if you get healed, imagine weeding your garden. If you just cut the weeds down, the root remains and the re weed potentially likely grows back. When you weed, you have to pull the entire >> You have to keep doing it. Yeah. >> You have to pull the whole root out. You gota if you can get to the core of it and there's no seed or anything left remaining. Well, that's not going to grow back until another seed gets in there, I guess. Of course. But but that's what's interesting. And so what we want to do is have a conversation about what you've discovered around healing that's rooted in scripture. Because I've been in many faith circles, many churches, most churches that I have been in, there is a prayer list. Someone's in the hospital and we put them on a prayer list. We distribute the prayer list or we get on social media and praying for you, praying for complete healing and and our response to their illness or whatever it else it is that that they have is we're going to we're going to pray for you. So, I'm going to stay at home and I'm going to as I'm praying for other things in my day, I'm going to say, "And God, I I ask that you uh heal Bill fully of his cancer." You know, if it's your will, of course. So, we're going to throw that in there because that's a that's a good out for us, right? And >> it makes it sound spiritual. >> It does, right? and and and so I just in my experience don't see bill the bills of the world surviving cancer, right? Or whatever else it is. and and and what you've done here and what God has led you into is said has effectively said if you pay attention to what is spoken about in scripture around the consequences of sin then you will understand I've given you the keys of healing without giving you the gift of healing. >> Yes. And what you've done is organize that into a process that is understandable. You've gone and done the work digging through scripture and you've created this process called the prayer of freedom. You've mentioned this prayer of freedom. Basically, that is the process that you have discovered, God has shown you that's right there in scripture. And I don't think it's going to be a surprise to a lot of us that it's like we've got healing all wrong. >> Yeah. I do you see it that way? >> I I do. And um Lord keeps putting this story on mine. So I want to Can I read a uh something from the book? >> So I teach as a volunteer at an addiction recovery center >> and I give them my my book is the um the textbook. I give them space simply to do chapter 12, which is actually the worksheet and the prayer portion. And we're talking back on if someone wants the gift of healing, how do they get it? And I was saying that I'm not sure I would want it back. And I want to share why. I think this better articulates it. This is a woman named Katherine. And this is a thank you note she wrote me after going through this process. And as with a prayer of healing, I would pray for her addiction, drug addiction in this case, and maybe God would heal it. But there's a lot of other issues in her life that wouldn't be untouched. Not only that, she doesn't know how she got the addiction. She thinks it's simply because she went too far with something, but it's actually a spiritual issue. And because she don't know how she got it, she's more likely would then to get it again. But watch this. This is what she said. She said, 'I want to thank you for the prayer freedom. It has changed my life. Growing up, my relationship with my mom was really tough. She was abusive and she and my stepdad would drink and get into lots of fights. By the time I was in seventh grade, she said she didn't want anything to do with me and left. That's when life began spiraling downward. By 16 years old, I was having sex with lots of boys and started getting into drugs. That was just over 10 years ago. Before doing this prayer, I was addicted to heroin and fentinyl and meth. I had a lot of worry and stress and anxiety. On a scale of 1 to 10, they were probably an eight. I've had constant allergies and sinus headaches for years, migraines five out of seven days a week and a super heavy feeling like I was carrying carrying around an overweight backpack every day. Life has really been difficult with the gift of healing. I would only pray for one of those things because I don't she would have brought up everything. But the prayer of freedom and repenting changed everything. Literally everything is gone. No more sinus issues. All gone. No more headaches and migraines. All gone. No more heaviness. It's all gone. No more anxiety or stress or worries. Literally on a scale of 1 to 10, they've all gone to zero. Even my addictions have gone down to zero. I don't want drugs anymore. I have no urges for them anymore. And even the thought of any drug disgust me. It's all gone. So now that she's gone through the process, she understands that what's going on. She's not going to fall back into it by not having a gift of faith. I mean gift of um healing and magically miraculously healing her then she doesn't know why she had those issues and she would still be dealing with those issues coming back now that she's gone through and she's understanding the process that unrepentanted sin creates consequence. Repent of the sin and the consequence disappears. Now, when she's about to sin again, she's going to go, "Oops, nope. I'm not going to go back there again." And now there's going to be guard rails up that she understands there are these consequences and she knows how to get out of it if she gets into it again. So, that's why I am thankful I no longer have that gift of healing. Yeah, I get that. I've read your book. We were talking about the book. It It's called The Prayer of Freedom. And um no need to go and rush and look for that. All of this is going to be in the episode description. So we're going to give you all the resources that we're talking about here. I want you to kind of stay in the moment of what we're doing here. That story is really powerful. When we get sick, our first response to that is called the doctor. That's not unwise. Okay. If we're are Christians, it might be to reach out to people that can pray for us. If it's serious, we're probably trying to find somebody that may have a gift of healing. Right. >> Right. >> Definitely got to get on the church prayer list. And that is our response to most of the sickness that we have. Not only that, but if it's a diagnosis or we get a condition that even if it's a cold, we know the process of the cold and so we just do the things we're supposed to do effectively coming into agreement with the sickness. We care for the sickness. We go get in the bed, right? We do the things you're supposed to do when you accept >> a diagnosis as yours or whatever else it is. >> And it sounds like the process that you're talking about flips all of that upside down for the most part. How do you what do we what is the world especially the Christian world and the world in general but even the Christian what do we what don't we understand about the healing God has in store for us first off there is probably I I say about a 90% success rate with this and it's either because and this is what I actually think most of it is tied to not every not everything has a spiritual root. But if your issue has a spiritual root, using medicine or or psychology or physical therapy or anything like that isn't going to solve the problem because unless you get to the root, you don't solve the the issue. I remember my father-in-law, he's deceased now, but he was a internal medicine doc for 50 years. He would always tell his patients health care, health is based on mental, physical and spiritual and he would diagnose you that way. Now our health care is mental and physical and they've lost the spiritual and I think that's what's going on. So what we miss is if you have something that's persistent and consistent. you keep getting sick over and over and over and over and over again or you have some sort of sickness, rheumatoid arthritis or al allergy or asthma or something and it's a persistent thing. In almost all cases, those persistent issues I find have spiritual roots of a sin somewhere. It could be generationally. It doesn't have to be yours. If it's something that's acute, okay, you have an appendicitis, um, go to the doctor quickly, right? Uh, acute things are not always, in fact, in in fact many times they may not be have a spiritual root. I'll get a cold. That's not a spiritual issue. So, if it's not a spiritual root, the prayer of freedom doesn't help because it's only handling those things with the spiritual root. But it seems like in my perspective probably 90% of the things we deal with are. So my first response is always just in case that maybe it's a spiritual root. So let's try the process. Let's ask God is there a spiritual route to this thing I'm dealing with? And if anything comes to mind and you can process it that way then maybe you see it disappear. But if you are dealing with something persistent, one of the interesting things you mentioned, I want to uh expand on it. You're talking about a physical sickness at the beginning, a pain, a malady physical ailment like glaucoma or mental illness. This also manifests as constant relationship conflicts. You're bickering. You blow up at your spouse or your loved one. You don't know why. You don't want to, but you just they just make you so mad. That's usually a spiritual issue. That's a spirit of anger that's amplifying that anger and causing you to to just blow up at a moment's notice. Uh same thing with you if you keep losing your job. I remember one of the employees I hired a couple years back. I looked at her resume and every she had one job every year, one year duration. I said probably just bad employees, employers, probably a bad fit. I hired her and to the date one year from the time she signed up she was gone and after learning this I go that's a spiritual issue. There is a root somewhere there that's destroying her life. So that's what we need to look for is the the patterns and when we see a pattern of anything uh or persistency in almost all cases I find that there's a spiritual route.

>> Yeah. And I would say on things like, you know, a cold might not have a spiritual route, but I would say also that there is spiritual authority there that you can >> you can command that out. >> Yeah. I get a sinus infection. I go to the doctor because it's not it's rare. It's not I'm always getting a sinus infection. So it's so it's not persistent. But I've tried the prayer of freedom for me. Like this is one thing that's really interesting. I started to learn this with my gift of healing. I'd be out praying for people there, you know, uh, uh, tennis elbow being healed, back pains being healed, all kinds of stuff. I'd come home, wife, my wife has a tennis elbow. I'd pray for her. No healing. My, uh, son has a pain in his back that's been there for a while. Pray for him, no healing. And I thought, God, why are you healing others, but you're not healing my own family? And I came up with a number of theories. But what I've come to understand now, which is the most likely occurrence, is when I was praying with the gift of healing and God was healing them. It was a spiritual root issue. When I was praying for my family, there wasn't a spiritual root. It was a physical issue. And so the prayer of freedom doesn't work on simply a physical causation. It works on a spiritual causation.

>> Yeah. You got the prayer of freedom. And then we're going to get into the specifics of that and that's really what we're here to talk about. But I would say that >> I still >> I still say God doesn't want us to be sick. And I think that there >> he will create purpose in it, but I don't think he creates the sickness. And you'll God works all things together for good for those who love him called according to his purpose. But when I get and I've done this many times over the last year or two when when I feel the symptoms of a cold coming on, >> command it out. >> I do. And it happens. >> Um there have been many times that those things were coming on as a a guest was coming in and I know that I've got this cold that's going to really be disruptive to the things I >> I command it out. And I don't know if you would say, well, yeah, no, that's the power of the mind, you know, or >> No, that's a spiritual attack. I I'm totally >> right. You know, there's so you you have to look at I I look at the bigger circumstance. If something's happening and it's you're about to do ministry of some something in what God's called you to do and it's trying to interfere, then that's I see it almost always as spiritual attack. But if I'm just going about my day and something happens, that's I'm I'm you know the circumstances a little bit different there. But for you and what we do here, >> absolutely. >> Yeah. Hey, I mean, I have things. I I'm 57 now and so there's aches and pains that that come up or spring up and you know, you think is that a demonic attack? And it's like, no, that's because you hit your back on the thing the other day that you ran into because you weren't paying attention, right? That's just a thing that happens sometimes. Not everything. And there are people who would say, well, that that that also is spiritual. And I don't know. I I don't want to get into the the weeds of all of that stuff. I think I think we can take spiritual authority, not claim our illnesses, but but cast them out. I don't think God wants us laid up >> um sick and dying when we could be out proclaiming the kingdom. >> And and certainly we can proclaim the kingdom in that sickness and I get that. But um this is about healing and and God's intentions around that. And and so I don't want to just say, "Hey, look, the the prayer of freedom works on spiritual problems that you haven't recognized." And and the other things that don't fall into that category, you know, we got really no answers for. There is healing that God >> authority there. >> You do. That's right. >> Right. A different It's a different authority. What we're talking about here though is something that has either lingered uh and I'll let you describe it or whatever. And what the principle here is that there is sin that has occurred in your life that you have either been unaware of or that you were aware of and just sort of moved on from, swept it under the rug. I'm never going to talk about that again. >> Yep. >> And moved on with life and things are okay. Right. It's unrepented sin. Isn't that what we're talking about here? >> That's entirely. Can I share? Let me let me share this. This may help some. Um, deliverance is what opened my eyes to understanding this. The process of deliverance that I used was a four-step process. And the way it would work is if I were doing deliverance with you, then I would say you'll probably hear something in your mind as I'm interrogating to these spirits and just relay whatever comes to your mind. So I'd ask the Holy Spirit, Lord, bring up the first demon spirit that you want me to address. And you might say, this is actually what one of these guys said, um, a guy named Josh here in town. And uh he said, 'I hear the word Seth. I don't know if that's right. So now that's probably right. I said, Seth, is that you? Yes. So now Josh is relaying the communication. So step one is to identify. Step two is you interrogate. I said, Seth, what is your role? He said, "My role is the gatekeeper in the demonic world that lets other spirits in." I said, "What is your legal right?" Because you got to understand this, Stacy. There has to be a reason for that spirit to be able to inhabit a person. And that reason is a legal right. We can get into this. We see it in in Job a lot. And and uh and that reason is this um thing called a legal right. So I said, "What is your legal right?" Seth said uh Josh played with a Ouija board at 7 years old. And at that Josh said, "I did not I didn't want anything to do with that Ouija board." Josh knew exactly the incident. He said, "My sister was playing with a Ouija board and she communicated to me through it." He's watching that thing move around. So, he's unbeknownst to him, he's actually participating. That was the open door. So, that let Seth to come in and that's what started to destroy Josh's life. So then I went to se uh Josh and said, "Josh, uh I need you to repent of playing with a Ouija board at 7 years old." So Josh said, "I repent of playing with the Ouija board at 7 years old. Once you repent of the sin, it goes away." And then I go back to Seth and say, "Seth, do you have any further legal right?" He said, "No." So then you command him out. So what I started to see in deliverance is every single time their legal right that they gave me was an unrepented sin. And I thought ah this now makes sense when God started directing me into doing healing through authority. So when I talk to deliverance ministers, a lot of them do have that process of >> asking questions and getting responses to try to find legal right. Others say, "I don't believe in legal rights, so I just cast them out and they just got to go. >> Jesus has the authority." Right? >> And I would say that's >> that works too for those people. >> That's not untrue. >> Right. Absolutely not. But what you're doing by it seems to me by exploring and understanding the right that they had to be there. It's not that they have rights over over Jesus, right? They don't. >> They have rights over us. >> Yeah. Well, because of things that we willingly do that violate our alignment with the image of God. >> Yeah. >> Right. And so to explore that and to understand that kind of just like what we were talking about a few minutes ago, it's like it's a it's an opportunity for us to essentially be made aware of the sin confess. It's essentially confession of sin. Yeah. Right. It's like ah there's the source. That's what I did. And so it's an opportunity for us to say so go and sin no more. Right? And so what Jesus says is like, "Hey, look, go and sin no more." This is, he even tells the blind guy that once. It's like, "Hey, go sin no more so that nothing worse will happen to you." He literally says that in scripture. It's like, man, >> so you're telling me his blindness was associated with sin. I mean, that's what it implies there. And so when we say, "Hey, I don't even mess with legal rights. I don't even believe in that." I think that might be an error on our part in understanding the process of demonic oppression. They don't just come in sort of >> on their own without us opening the door to begin with in some way, the door being open to them. Hey, let me pause for just a moment to share something important with you. God continues to do remarkable things through this podcast.

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And it's interesting, Stacy, it's not just demonic oppression. So, as I've been doing this, one of the things that used to baffle me uh when I was doing deliverance is I could get some of the spirits to to uh respond so I could interrogate them. But there are other spirits I saw they were primarily um infirmity. I'll call them an infirmity spirit. And I could never get them almost never get them to respond.

>> When you say respond, are you saying that they >> they answered answered through the person that you're doing deliverance on? And I mean they they manifested and spoke through their mouth, >> right?

Uh well, sometimes they uh I've only had in the early stages only one that actually took over the person's body. She went into a trance. You could they were looking at me through her eyes and speaking to me through her mouth. I then learned that was horrible on her. So I would command them never to manifest, only speak to the mind. And so from then on it was much more um tame.

>> Oh, that's good.

>> Yeah. But what would happen is I would uh have, you know, call up the spirit. Uh the Lord would call them up. I would interrogate them. But then I would say, "Spirit of leg pain, identify yourself." And it'd be crickets. Nothing. Or spirit of migraines, ident. And there were certain things uh and I' recognized they were always an infirmity related issue. and I could rarely get a spirit to to uh respond. And I was trying to figure out why. And I started to recognize early on that there's more than just a demonic spirit.

What I've since identified is, and I think I'm fairly accurate. You see, we're we're making assumptions on data that we don't really have. It's not clear in the Bible because the Bible is about salvation. It's not about the spiritual warfare much. You have little bits and pieces. So, a lot of this is is testing, experimenting, and confirming. But I've uh identified what I think are like three categories of spirits. Uh you have an amplifying spirit. So, if I blow up in anger, I get a spiritual entity. And for people who are more on the u uh less religious and just kind of spiritual spectrum, they'll know it as a dark energy or a low vibration. I call it just a spirit. But like if I blow up in anger, I'm going to get this spiritual entity of anger. And all it's going to do is amplify anger in my life. And the more I give into it, the stronger the amplification becomes. If I'm looking at pornography, I'm gonna get a spirit of pornography and it's going to amplify my urge for that. If I start to get depressed, I can get a spirit of depression. In other words, it's a oneto-one type of spirit. You see this throughout scripture. Uh God uh talks about a spirit of wisdom. He gives a spirit of skill to the guy who does all the embroidery work in the uh in the tabernacle. You see a spirit of lying, a spirit of fear. So these spirits have a onetoone relationship.

Then you have what I'll call an infirmity spirit. And a lot of times I'm finding infirmity spirits are not demonic. They're not evil. They're just simply consequence. And uh and I can get into this more if you want, but I u but they are there simply because we violated God's standards someplace. And as soon as we repent, they'll disappear on their own. you don't have to command them out. I find this usually with those things that are detracting from one's quality of life without making any problem for anyone else. So, this would be things like a chronic pain all the time or sickness all the time or things of that sort. They're just taking away your quality of life.

And then you have a demonic spirit. And a demonic spirit is what Paul talks about in Ephesians 6:12. In the living Bible, it says we don't wrestle against people of flesh and blood, but against persons without a body. And a person without a body. You and I, we have a soul and a body. In very simplistic sense, the soul is our person. It's who we are. It's our mind, will, emotions, personality. Our body is just this thing in the earthly realm. So when we die, we still live. It's just our body is dead. In other words, we become a person without a body once we die. So a de a demon is a demonic spirit is a person without a body. I'm not saying it used to be a human. I'm just saying it's that concept. It has a mind, will and emotions but no body. But it's its focus is entirely evil. It can manifest in anger, anxiety, in pain, in sickness and outburst of violence. So you have those three things. So not everything is that demon.

The um one of the things that uh I'd like to lay down uh if we can is the scriptural process of what all this is based on showing where in scripture these things come into play. I wanted I'd love to share about what we see with Job and uh God and Satan as it ties into this because this will especially for those people who have read the Bible and are familiar with some of these, this may start to connect some dots and say, "Ah, this is now making a lot more sense." Because once I started seeing this in scripture, I go, "This is the pattern. It's been hidden in plain sight, but it's from Genesis to Revelation. we've just been missing it."

Okay, so uh first spot would be Deuteronomy 28:58-61. The Israelites are just about to go in the promised land. This later uh section of Deuteronomy is blessings and curses. If you follow God, he's going to bless you. Turn you away from God, he's going to curse you. And it says in this passage in Deuteronomy, he says, "If you turn away from the Lord your God and you don't revere his name," in other words, if you sin against him, it says he will send on you all the diseases and sicknesses of Egypt, all the disasters in this book and a lot more than it's not even written in this book. In other words, if you sin against God, sickness, chronic sickness that's going to cling to you, all kinds of disasters and everything else.

Then you move over to Psalm 32. This is a psalm of David and in paraphrase it basically says that when I refused to confess my sin my body wasted away, my bones achd and I had no strength left to even get out of bed. And then when I confessed my sin, God healed it all.

Then move to James 5 uh John 5. This is the uh passage where Jesus meets this lame man at the pool of Bethesda. He's been lame for 38 years. He can't get in the pool because no one's there to put him in the pool. And Jesus says, sort of like I said to that uh man at Chick-fil-A, "So, do you want to walk? Do you want to be healed?" And he said, "Well, no one can put me in the pool." And Jesus then says, "Stand up, take your your bed, and go." Then Jesus finds him in the temple and Jesus says, "Go and sin no more that nothing worse may happen to you." Indicating that his 38 years of being lame was tied to a sin. And it could get worse.

Then a lot of uh uh people believe that now that we're Christians and Jesus has paid the price for our sins and our sins have been forgiven. Right? When we believe in Jesus, our sins are forgiven past, present, and future. So if they're forgiven, why do I need to repent of them? This is kind of the big issue I struggled with and that I had wrestled with and a lot of people still do today. And we see that even Christians in the new covenant have the same issue of sin and consequence.

Two passages in particular. One is 1 Corinthians 11. Paul is speaking to the Corinthian church believers about communion in the Lord's supper. Back then they would just everyone come together and eat a meal together. That was their Lord's supper. And he was saying that you rich folks are doing it wrong because you're not discerning the body of Christ because there are a lot of poor people there. You're bringing your food and wine, they have nothing. You're feasting, getting fat, getting drunk, and they go hungry. And because of that, then you're creating disunityity. And Paul says because of that issue, that sin, he says that's why some of you are weak, others are sick, and others have already died. sin creating a consequence even for new covenant believers.

Then you go to James 5:14-16. This is where he's talking about healing. This is a healing verse in the New Testament. And it says, "If any of you are sick, let him call for the elders and they'll anoint him with oil and they'll pray over him." But it ends it with this. Says James 5:16 says, "Confess your sins dot dot dot and you shall be healed." So we see this pattern. Sin creates consequence. Confessing the sin reverses the consequence.

And this gets even clearer when we start to look at we look at um I'm trying to say think which one. I think I want to start here. My son Batty Jr. when he was 19 or 20 years old, uh God brought him into the heavenly courtroom and he said, 'I want to show you something and I want I want to I want to I want to give the mechanics of what's happening. Um, Revelation, I think it's 12:10 says that Satan is the accuser of the brethren and he accuses us before God. Question is, what can he what does he accuse us of? If we go back to Job 1, when Satan and God are talking about Job and God says, "Have you considered my servant Job, he is blameless and upright." Blameless means you can't blame him. And if Satan is the accuser and he accuses, then blameless means that Satan can't accuse him. And in fact, Satan says so himself, "Well, you only protect him. You've put a hedge around him. You won't let me attack him." We find out why a little bit more in this vision that my son had. Uh, and typically what I'm learning about visions a lot of times is you actually go there but you just see it in your mind's eye. But very real. My son went into the heavenly courtroom and as he's describing he says up on the right on the disease God the father and to his left was this demon spirit and the demon was accusing my son of sins. My son came to Christ at age five. All of my son's sins were forgiven for salvation. And as he was sharing that this demon is accusing him of sins, I said, "Well, hold on. I've been told that demons always lie and Satan is a liar and he only lies." Were those sins real? And Batty Jr. said, "Oh yeah." He said, "They lie to you and me. They don't lie to God. Every sin I was being accused of was a real sin. So this caused me to start to ponder, if our sins have been forgiven, how could he be accused of sin. And then the Lord whispered in his ear or something and and told my son, "Plead the blood of Jesus." So my son looked up at God the Father and said, "Father, I plead the blood of Jesus." and instantly the demons disappeared. And so what happens is when you plead the blood of Jesus over those sins, now that blood washes away the sins and they're gone. In other words, they're in present until we apply Jesus's blood. Repentance and confession is the appropriating of Jesus's blood for those specific sins. And what I'm starting to understand is while our salvation and eternal life is secure by believing in Jesus, our sins are forgiven for salvation in the earthly realm, they're still present for torment. And until we actually repent of them individually, we're still living under the same law of being under law but under grace. because it's the law of sin and consequence that gives these spirits a right to torment us. Jesus said in John 10:10 that uh the thief comes to steal, kill, and destroy, but I came that you might have abundant life. Most of us aren't living an abundant life. Katherine, that story I read, she'd been a Christian for years. She wasn't living an abundant life. She was tormented by addictions, by u uh sickness, by anxiety and depression. But she got the abundant life when she obeyed the command to repent and confess. And when she did, everything disappeared. And that's this that's the biblical background behind how all of this is working.

Well, I had come armed with questions that you just answered before I asked them, which is wonderful. I was going to say, well, what about the atonement? Right. the the atonement is is freeing us from the consequences of our sin by Jesus paying the price. And and your answer is yes from for our salvation. But but it is repentance that uh must occur to free us from the earthly consequences. Yes. >> Uh of torment around them. That's really good.

I was also going to say because everything that we do, there's always someone that talks about something not being scriptural and but that's not in the Bible and that sort of thing. A lot of times my response is kind of what you said earlier, >> so not everything is in the pages of the Bible. What you have to watch for are things that are contradictory to what is in in scripture and and >> I don't think there's any mention of giraffes right in scripture. >> I was being unbiblical over here because I was had my air conditioning on and listening to stuff on my cell phone. >> That's not in the Bible, but it's still true. >> Right. Exactly.

And and so what you said is is really good and and I think deliverance ministers say a lot of this as well because a lot of people say, you know, you can't be a a a born-again Christian and and have demonic oppression. That just that that's just not how that is or whatever. But if you have a conversation with deliverance ministers, I think they would say, I understand why that would be a theory of yours, but in practice, >> an experience. Yeah. an experience. I've seen it. I see it every day. It's that's just not true.

>> Let me I'd like to address that a little bit. Um, can a Christian be addicted to something? >> Absolutely. >> Can a Christian have depression all the time? >> Can a Christian have a sinful thought constantly? So what we have is we have so as as a Christian we are spirit, soul and body. In a very simplistic sense the spirit is the third heaven. The soul is in the second heaven and the body is in the first heaven. The first heaven is the earthly realm. The second heaven is a spiritual realm where demonic entities can exist and do exist. And the third heaven is where it's only holy. Okay. So our spirit is united with God's spirit and it is made perfect and it is pure and holy. But our soul where our mind is is in the second heaven or at least this spiritual realm. And if we can have a sinful thought, we can also have a demon that inhabits us. Because all a demon is is the essence of sin. You can have a demon that manifests anger. Anger is a sin. You can have a spirit that just simply amplifies anger in your life. That's all it does. Because it it's not in the spirit, it's in the soul.

>> And I've done a lot of deliverance sessions. 100% of them have been with Christians. >> That's right. That's who that's who demons are actually after. Right. >> And and addiction is a demon. Mhm. >> The way you free people from addiction or homosexuality or anger or whatever it is is you get the demon of that addiction or that issue out and then the issue disappears.

Such rich spiritual truths that I think God is I'm certain he is opening the eyes of people around the truths of of the mechanics even I mean we're going to talk a lot about the mechanics uh in this conversation and the mechanics matter >> yes very much >> none of it is a substitute for knowing God right that your salvation is tied to you knowing God and experiencing God. But God designed things to work in a particular way and it's revealed through scripture and in our experience, right? And um and what we're going to do here today is talk about details of the mechanics of the way he designed healing to work from the root to uh the remedy I guess so to speak. So the prayer of freedom is is the way that you've encapsulated the process that is culminated through prayer. Of course, can you describe? Yeah, that and what what's really going on in the prayer of freedom?

>> There's essentially three steps in it. Number one, God knows what's holding you back and why you have these issues. So step number one in a very simplistic sense, God, what is the source of these issues? Bring to my mind any sin I need to repent of or any person I need to forgive. By the way, unforgiveness for most people is probably 70% of all their issues just from unforgiveness or predominantly unforgiveness. I've seen those deaf ears that was unforgiveness. I've seen blind eyes open up. I've seen sciatica leave. I've seen back pain gone. I've seen uh football injuries healed. I' I've seen so many things just from unforgiveness that it's unbelievable. So, you ask the L, we're asking the Lord to remind me of whatever it is that's at the root of these issues. And it's always something that is sin. I want to put a caveat here. It's always something of sin, but it's not always something of your sin. Exodus, I think it's Exodus says that uh God will visit the iniquities of the fathers, which means mothers and fathers, to the third and fourth generation. So like addictions for example, uh most addictions, especially where I I teach, 80 to 90% of them are generational. M >> uh you uh my wife used to have panic attacks because her mom had panic attacks and her mom had so it's generational. So you have you have things coming down the line that isn't your sin that you committed. But when I die and I have an an object that's mine, my children inherited, it becomes theirs. They didn't buy it, but it's now theirs. Same thing with sin. I didn't commit it, but it's still mine because it's been inherited. You also have things like abominations which are uh heavier iniquities and witchcraft. So all of these are sin-based but and curses not not just witchcraft but curses as well. All of these are sin based. So when I say sin sometimes it's not yours sometimes it's generational.

Oh while on that I got to tell the story because this is really cool because I want to expand people's understanding of what we're dealing with. One of the ladies at the Addiction Recovery Center, her name is Ashley, uh on my book website that you'll put in the notes, uh there's a video of her telling this story. Um, and she was saying that she was um grossly abused, molested, and I think it was actually raped like at six or seven years old. And that became her life spiraling downward. She was always fearful of men. She had PTSD. She was on 700 milligram 400 milligrams of cerakquil a day just to calm her nerves. She was on booon zolaf sleep meds. By the time I she came to my class, she was just kind of all over the place. But she also had a one-year-old and a three-year-old daughter and both were already diagnosed with asthma. Their lungs were horrible. They were taking the u inhalers at a faster rate than the doctor was prescribing. It was that bad. Ashley said that when she went through the prayer of freedom, the next morning she woke up and everything was gone. She had no more fear. She could make it through the day. She went to the psychiatrist at their at the um center and she said, "If you're feeling really fine, you don't have to take any of these meds." She hadn't taken the meds since. But the other thing, this is the point I want to share. Her daughters no longer had asthma. When Ashley went through this process, whatever those sins were that were in Ashley's life that were impacting her daughters and with asthma, when Ashley got rid of the sin and closed those doors, the her daughter's asthma disappeared as well. They no longer went back to inhaler. They jumping up and down, running around like little active kids and no problem. So, there are a lot of things that we deal with that are actually coming down generationally. Anytime you see a pattern of uh early death, suicide, addictions, chronic pain, sickness, whatever it is, anytime you see patterns, you can almost always tell there's a spiritual root that's driving it.

So the first step in this process is asking the Lord to reveal what are these things I need to repent of, renounce or break. There are different ways to do do these things. Then the second step is to repent of those sins, renounce those agreements, break any unholy soul ties that may be there. That's breaking the legal rights. And the third step is then using the authority in Jesus. You command those things out. And that's how this whole process works. It's a straightforward process. there's some specificity that as you've seen already uh to make it truly highly successful but that's really the pattern.

So asthma an example that a child has this condition a parent identifies a generational thing does the takes the authority does the repentance the child is healed but she wasn't trying she wasn't doing it so whether she knew it was a generational thing or not it was an iniquity of some sort that either from coming down her line or something she committed but it was now impacting her children. So simply by doing the prayer of freedom on her behalf the children were healed. >> Right. So asthma is one thing. >> Yep. Childhood cancer is another. And and as we go through these things, you you think about broken limbs and vision and things that you know you're impaired with or whatever. Then there's I got friends who their wives spouses died of cancer early. >> Yeah. And I know they're not wouldn't say this, but I think there would be plenty of people and there are people who have lost children to cancer that I know plenty of them. I know some that are in that state right now that have the potential to take great offense at the suggestion that the condition exists. Not because we live in a fallen world and not because there's chemicals in our food and all that kind of stuff, but that it has come from sin. Mhm. >> potentially their sin as the root of this thing. Is that what we're saying here?

I'm saying it's possible. I don't have firsthand experience with cancer, but I can share two examples about this because, and keep in mind, an example doesn't mean it's absolute, right? Um, but there are things that we don't understand. I've seen type 2 diabetes disappear with this. Well, you say, "Well, I thought that was strictly kind of chemical and biological." Well, hers was spiritual. Okay. I remember um actually both these come from the same lady. Her name is Nancy. I've not met her, but she's um in this realm. And she was sharing a story years back. She was working at a church and a one of the lady, one of the members came up and said, "I've been diagnosed with cancer. Will you pray for me?" Nancy said, "Sure." And as she starts to pray, the Lord gives Nancy a word of knowledge. One of the supernatural gifts and said that Nancy uh this this woman needs to forgive her husband. So Nancy said, "Um uh how's your relationship with your husband? And this woman blows up, you know, and you know, we're in a nasty divorce. I don't want anything to do with him. Yeah. Ya. And Nancy said, 'Well, I hate to say it this way, but the Lord told me that until you forgive your husband, he can't heal you of cancer. And she stormed out, blew up, went out. and uh and then called Nancy back 6 months later and said, "Hey, I want to give you an update. I've forgiven my husband. We've reconciled. Our marriage is good." And then Nancy said, "Great. Since you've forgiven your husband, then now God can heal you. And in Jesus name, I declare you healed of cancer." She went back to the doctor the next day and there was no cancer. So that was a direct uh result her cancer was of the sin of unforgiveness. And then Nancy as she progressed uh both in faith and healing and walking in the spirit much more powerfully than she was then her adult daughter was diagnosed with cancer. This is many years later. And they tried praying and praying nothing. faith healers, more of other faith healers coming in, nothing. And then Nancy says she got a prayer team together and one of the members on a prayer team is a seer. For those who are not familiar, a seer is someone who can see in the spirit realm. And just like a gift, there are lots of different levels, types of seers. This particular one could actually see the demonic side of things. and she said,"I see 10 generations back a curse that was put on your bloodline that is the source of this cancer." So now that they could identify that curse, they were then able through prayer to reverse it and nullify it and her daughter was healed. So these start to show me that there is a high probability that even these things that we reject that it could be tied to sin might actually be tied to sin.

I I had the same thing happen. Um, a a good friend of ours and u uh from our church was also married to a pastor and she was diagnosed with cancer. She's about our age. She's deceased now from cancer. And they had their church and multiple churches praying for her. Thousands of people. And God never healed. Another pastor. I was when I was visiting a church, his wife was uh dying of some form of cancer and she died. And they both claim based on James, I think it's 1 John five, that if we pray according to God's will, he'll hear us. And if he hears us, then he'll do that which is his will. And so they prayed, "Please heal this person." And because they were not healed and they both died, they came to the conclusion that it was God's will for her to die. But yet I look through scripture and it's very clearly God's will is to heal all things equal, right? Generally speaking and I rejected that. But they like you were sharing rejected that there anything could be done tied to sin. And I started to take a deep dive into scripture. Um, I'm a Bible teacher by passion. And so I did a a a series called Infirmity in the Will of God and just really digging deep into the scripture of what does the scripture say about this? And what's interesting, Stacy, is at least 20 absolutely clear, highly direct, and maybe another 30 indirect references. I went through and said, I want to find everything that the Bible says about any form of sickness and what is the cause of that sickness. if it shows a cause. 100% of the time when I did that, every time there was a a sickness and a cause, the cause was always sin. Now, to also uh back up for just a moment, it does say things like the Jewish law, bear your excrement, wash your hands, because we can pick up sicknesses. So I'm not saying that every si every sickness is sinbased. The Bible is teaching spiritual truths. It's not trying to teach natural truths. So from a spiritual standpoint is only teaching the spiritual truth. But it became very evident that sin has a significant role in this. It also says that by his stripes we are healed. Then in first Peter by his stripes we were healed. Healed of what? healed of all sickness. And it says in James, "Confess your sins and you shall be healed." And so, we keep seeing all these references, sickness and sin, confession and healing. We see that uh we're supposed to have the abundant life. That's what God says. So, why don't I have it? Is this, oh, maybe I'm believing for it, and if I believe it enough, my life will be abundant. What I'm finding is walking by faith starts first with obedience. We see this with General Non, the Syrian general back in the time of Elisha. He has leprosy. Goes to Elisha. Elisha said, "Go dip in the Jordan seven times and you'll be healed." He refused to do it. His friend said, "Come on, just do it. It's so simple. Just see if it works." He did. He obeyed and he was healed. Every time you see man acting by faith is through obedience and that's the first thing he wants. So back to this, I'm sorry for a longer answer, but I want to give this bigger uh perspective that that I've been seeing. While if we pray according to God's will, he will hear us and do it. There may be a higher will that he has for us. And maybe that higher will is the primary message Jesus came preaching. Repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. And if the repentance is the umbrella will then all these other promises don't happen until we obey. We don't get the abundant life until we obey and repent and close out all of the legal rights from all the torments that have been happening to us.

I remember a friend of mine, he's a cousin. He was going through a nasty divorce. He was uh before the divorce, he was always uh in tight, his muscles were tight, he was always anxious, he had all kinds of um uh body sickness issues. He was always stressed, always depressed. He was on medication and I was leading him through this. I said, you know, go through this, you'll everything will be out of your life. Life will be so blessed. There's no issues. There's no junk in your life. you'll just be pinching yourself like this is so blessed. He said, 'Is that really possible? I said, 'Yeah, we've been living it like that for years. And I saw him again about a year later and he just gave me the biggest bear hug and he has no issues in his life. Everything gone. All the stress, all the anxiety, all the body sicknesses, all the tension in his body, everything's disappeared. He's now living the abundant life because what he's done is he's gone through and systematically repented of everything that the Lord's been bringing to his mind. And once you obey the higher command of repentance, then you get the promise of abundance. Does that make sense?

>> Yeah, it does. I I you know I'm thinking through so many things as you're describing this and it's it's powerful to hear you say that and and then like the prospects of what could be. >> Yeah. >> It's like how many of these things that we've just lived with for so long and haven't addressed we just feel like that's what we have or what we are or I don't want to deal with those things from back then. But there's also a part of me that that you know when you hear the repeat after me sinners prayer and those kinds of things that end Sunday services and and it's like and Lord forgive me of my sins and I repent and we we do the blanket repentance the blanket asking for forgiveness of our sins stepping into the atonement the finished work of Christ on the cross. How does that not do the trick, so to speak?

>> It does the trick for salvation. But in deliverance ministry, I can't simply say, "All right, everybody out. Go now in Jesus' name." Because I'm not speaking to anyone specifically. They say, "Well, he's not speaking to me." The other demon says, "He's not talking to me. If he was talking to me, he would call me out specifically." And when you're dealing with these things, uh, I can't I can only give you opinion which therefore I won't opinion as to why God makes it that it has to be specific to each sin. But what I can validate empirically with empirical data is when someone goes through and takes that worksheet and starts to making a list of sins and uh the worksheet that's in the book has about 18 different categories. So it makes it easy to kind of compartmentalize your thinking to really focus in. When you start making that list, what's happening is the picture that I get is this. This is the visual. Most people say, "Jesus, I confess I'm a sinner. Please come into my life. I commit my life to you." And things start to shift. You feel the spirit come in. You go, "Ah, I'm now a Christian." 20 years later, we've never really confessed on anything. And so for 20 plus years, because that confession wasn't taking a bath, that was just kind of like sprinkling some water on you. You're dirty. And now 20 years of sin being built up. So the visual is you, you know, all the grease, all the grime, all their dirt, you're filthy. You need to take a really strong long bath, shower, scrub, get it down to the skin, get all the grease off. Why? because every bit of grease that has accumulated over the years is sticking to you. You can't just say, "Well, I'll wash my hand and now you're clean." We have to clean it all. And that's what he wants. Jesus talks about his bride being pure, being a virgin. Only way you become a virgin uh spiritually is to get rid of all of those things that have unvinated you. M >> so what happens is God wants that perfect bride to be made brand new. He took it all away. What happens with us is we carry a lot of it in. Josh, the one I was talking about with the spirit named Seth. He was already a Christian. Playing with the Ouija board was before Christianity, but he never repented of that sin. He just said, "I repent of my sins." It was only until he repented of that sin specifically that it went away. My son in the heavenly courtroom, it was only when he applied the blood of Jesus over those sins that for which he'd been accused of did they disappear. Otherwise, they still remained. Why God does it that way, I don't know. I only have have opinions. But the fact that he does it that way is very clear.

>> Yeah. and your experience with the data you've collected over years of doing this, right? But, >> you know, so that brings up a whole other issue. We sin often. We have a a long, long history of sin, many of which we couldn't dredge up in our deepest memories. How do you confess each of these sins? I mean, which one is the source of the maladies that I have? Is it, you know, if I've had 25 sexual partners and in in my mind and I'm able to list those out, but the truth is there's been 35 and I can't even remember 10 of those. Yeah. >> How do you know? >> Or or or whatever else it is, you know? I don't know why I ever tried those drugs in the first place. Who is the person associated with that? And what day was that? How do you truly repent of all of these individual sins when we are constant perpetual sinners?

>> It's not your responsibility to remember them. It's only your responsibility to repent of them. It's God's responsibility to remind you of what he wants you to get free of. The Lord is a big boy and he will bring to your mind those things that he wants you to repent of. So don't bring it to your mind. That's okay. He may bring it to your mind down the road. But have you ever had a time, Stacy, when you've been praying and asking the Lord something? Or even not, you're just going someplace and all a sudden the Lord pops something in your mind. you know, I've got to handle that. I need to confess it. >> Well, that's how he does it. Except now we're saying, Lord, show me everyone I need to forgive that I haven't truly forgiven. He'll bring things to your mind. I mean, I had this happen. Okay? So, I walk in blamelessness, same as Job does because it's an attitude of the heart and a constant repentance. And I thought I'd gotten rid of everything. I love to exercise. I carry dumbbells and I uh pulled the ligaments in my right thumb to where I could not pick up this glass and it oh it would hurt. And I was so disappointed because I knew six weeks for it to heal before I could use it again. And all of my exercises primarily free weight type stuff. And so I'm out there walking one day and four days after I injured and I said, "Lord, I'm really disappointed because I really want to keep my my uh act weight activity up and I thought I need to go through the same process myself just in case." So I said, "Lord, if my pull ligaments is tied to a sin or an unforgiveness, bring it to my mind right now." And what flashed across my mind was someone I thought I'd already forgiven, my grandmother at age seven. She was down in their living room talking with my mom. I came down the stairs and I kept trying to interrupt because I wanted my mom's attention. My grandmother snapped at me and said, "Shut up, baby." And it hurt me. And so I forgave my grandmother. This was just um a few months back. And I woke up the next morning and my thumb was healed. I tried everything to make it hurt. I would squeeze things hard. I would grab something heavy and just hold on to it upside down like this, pulling it up with all the strength of my thumb, totally healed. And so he will keep bringing things to your mind long after you go through the prayer of freedom the initial time. Like my friend that I was sharing that um was going through that divorce, he actually went through the process multiple times because there was just so much junk in his life and every time God revealed more. So once you get the first layer off, you can keep digging in and the Lord will continue to reveal because what he wants and what this is really interesting. Let me ask you a question. Other than Jesus's deity, I I don't want to minimize that. But Jesus was fully man in his fully man state. What was the main difference between him and us? He was without sin. >> Yes. Right. He was sinless. >> That's right. >> Okay. Uh Paul says that when we are when we sin, we are accused of sin and we're breaking the law. Then he says we're no longer under law but under grace. Most people don't understand that because in Galatians 5 it says, "For all who are led by the spirit are no longer under law." Most people are led by the flesh. Because to be led by the spirit means basically two things. You're sensitive to the spirit's leading and you obey it. To disobey the spirit is to be following your flesh. So we have this understanding that not all now not all are being led by the spirit and therefore even though we're Christians we're still putting ourselves under law. This is where Paul says,"Do not submit your members to sin as instruments of sin, but submit your members to righteousness, to God as instruments of righteousness." He's contrasting sin with God. Sin is a noun. This is this was so surprising. In the book of in the New Testament, sin is used about 600 times. If I recall, 80% of the time, it's a noun. It's a person, place, or thing. Hebrews 12:1 says, uh, lay aside the sin that clings so tightly to you. In Romans, sin, Paul uses the word sin 47 times. 45 times, it's a noun. And he says, do not submit yourself to sin. Submit yourself to God. So that means we can submit to sin. When we submit ourselves to sin, let's say anger, then we become the slave of anger. The more we submit, we open up a door, a legal right for a spirit of anger to come in. And every time we submit to it, it gets stronger. And now we become a slave. This is what addiction is. When I become a slave to addiction, I can't stop because I've submitted to sin. Even though I'm supposed to be no longer under law, I've actually put myself under law voluntarily.

Back to Jesus and where I'm going on this. It is possible to walk in less and less sin. The less sin we walk in, the more righteousness we become. Jesus says that in Luke 6:40 that the disciple is not above the teacher, but when fully trained becomes like the teacher. He is saying when you're fully trained as a disciple, you can walk in complete blamelessness as he is. The only way to walk in blamelessness is to repent of the things that you're being accused of. Just like my son accused of sins, even though he's a believer, when you repent of those, they're off your record in the earthly realm and you become more and more blameless. And it is possible to walk in blamelessness like Job did. God says in Job 1 that uh uh Job was blameless and righteous. And because of that, Satan could not attack him because Satan's only authority to attack is to accuse of sin. And this is why Satan said, "He only loves you because you put a hedge around him and you won't let me attack him." This is where we get the u spiritual Christian context of a hedge of protection. Some people say, "I'm going to pray a hedge of protection around someone." That may be true, but it's not biblical. The only biblical evidence of a hedge of protection is a blameless life.

>> The hedge of protection was the be was Job's behavior. >> That's right. And it was his behavior tied to constant confession. We see this in Job 1:es 4 and 5. It says whenever his children would have a birthday, they'd all get together and they would feast. And then Job would sacrifice on behalf of each child in case they curse God in their heart. Sacrifice the shedding of blood >> to wash away that sin. Jesus has now shed his blood. We still have to confess to appropriate it. So, Satan acknowledges the hedge of protection around Job after God has identified him as blameless before him. So Job in his quest for a sinless life blameless before God brought about the hedge of protection from God that the enemy couldn't penetrate.

>> Right? Watch what happened in Job's life. He was the richest man. He had fields and flocks and servants and herds and everything was abundant because Satan could not attack. Then God gave Satan permission to attack. Not because of Job's sin, but it's what's called I I believe what I would call a test of faith. Well, probably not to delve into that too far right now. But when Satan is allowed to attack, what happened? His children are murdered. His flocks and assets are stolen. All of his servants are killed. Destruction. The thief comes to steal, kill, and destroy. The way you have the abundant life is you prevent them from being able to steal, kill, and destroy. And the only authority they have over you is your own sin. This is really interesting. Um, another to help understand this.

My son, he came to Christ at five years old. He had some difficult times in his early pre-teen years. And then in his senior year in high school, there was a revival in his heart. It was December of his high school year. He went from just being morose to on fire for Jesus, listening only Christian music, reading the Bible, everything.

It was at that point that he started having demonic visitations two and three times a week at night, usually like 2 and 3:00 in the morning. And they weren't just a manifestation in his mind. They were physical. Once or twice they actually picked him up and I think maybe threw him off the bed. They would always come and choke. You had an episode of someone that was talking about being choked. Okay, that seems to be a typical thing.

And he kept asking God, "Please stop it." And God always gave the same answer, "No." Why would God allow my son to be attacked and tormented by demons? For six months, they would come and he would finally get the voice out of being choked to say the word, "Jesus, Jesus." And they would leave. And it would happen again.

And finally, my son asked the right question. He was asking God to stop. That's the wrong question. So then he asked the Lord, "What can I do to stop them?" And then God told him, "Just ignore them." That night they came back. He said, "I woke up about 3:00 in the morning. At the foot of my bed is this shadowy figure over in the doorway. This little hoodie girl comes in without a head, you know, like you see in the horror movies, just a hoodie kind of floating across the floorway there." And he looked over and said, "Are you serious? Is that all you can do? That is so corny." He turned over and went back to sleep. That was the last time they ever visited him.

And what was happening, his own fear, perfect love cast out fear. Fear is a sin. It was his fear that gave them authority to attack. When he ignored it because now he obeyed God to ignore, they no longer had authority and they stopped. That's how our life is. We give the enemy authority, he'll attack us. We deny the authority by repenting of that sin or just not committing it at all. He doesn't have authority to attack.

You've done this for some time now. What I want to, I want to really hone in on people are people want healing. Yeah. And they want to understand healing and and so what I'd like to do is I'd like to understand in your experience what are common areas where the roots of some of these maladies exist that you? Great question. There are three, the three big ones. First is unforgiveness, second is sexual sin, and third is anything in the occult.

Okay. So, there's a lot of detail that can get in there. Get into some of the detail of what you see. I mean, I look in the book and and I think as you start the exercise part of this that you want people to go through in detail. This isn't a, this isn't a five-minute broadbrush thing. It's like a, you know, quick fix type thing. This is like, hey, let's roll up our sleeves here and let's really, really ask the Holy Spirit to take us into the places that we've just swept under the rug for years and years. Yeah. But there's various areas and some specificity that I saw in there that's like, oh, maybe that's something I need to consider in detail.

Yeah, specificity is the key. Um, when my dad was doing surgery, if he wasn't specific and precise, someone would die. Mhm. So specificity is the key. Let's talk, first, the biggest thing for most people is is unforgiveness, right? And it usually starts in early childhood because, um, and I give credit to, um, a friend of mine, Father Spotswood, for helping me understand this clarity because this solves so many problems for me in helping people get free. And that is as we're raising children, mom and dad represent God to that child because they are, mom and dad is his progenitor, creator for that child and is their life. So if mom and dad are in a biblical relationship, loving the Lord, operating in a biblical hierarchy, then we're guiding that child in a perfect environment to where they receive who God is. But anytime that relationship is out of balance, the father is absent, the mother is absent, there's conflict, the mom wears the pants and so are the dad. Anything that is out of, out of biblical balance, then that child is always going to start to have issues because the, the innate understanding, I can't, this is not conscious, this is all at a subconscious level, of who God is starts to get warped and that warpness changes the trajectory of how he perceives everything.

You could take a parent out of the picture. Like one friend of mine, her mom was sick for a number of years, staying in bed almost the whole time. So her dad said to her, "Katie, you're going to have to pick up your mom's roles." So she was mom to her two or three younger brothers. She did the laundry. She did the cooking. She did the cleaning. And she lost her childhood. And that has shifted her throughout the years and all of her male relationships have just been destroyed because she's too dominant. She's, uh, there's a deep bitterness because, an unfelt bitterness. So a lot of times we have to go back to simply what's going on in our early childhood. Did dad beat mom? Was he always drunk? Was she an addict? Whatever is going on? Because it creates unforgiveness. Unforgiveness and more. It, it creates the best way, the way that was described to me and and I'm dealing, I'm delving in an area that I understand, I can see the impact, but I don't know the mechanics, okay? I don't understand the physics behind this if you use it in a physical term. But the simple way to understand it is if I have a, a tall antenna like you see a radio, a TV antenna, they always have guide wires, right? And those guide wires is the reason it's perfectly straight. Everything is perfectly at the right tension and it's keeping it straight up and down. But if one of those guide wires is cut, now there's more tension on one side of the antenna than the other, the antenna gets warped. Mhm. You cut another one and it gets warped. And now you had this really crooked antenna that eventually just going to crumble. And all it was was it wasn't perfectly imbalanced. So this balance thing in early childhood, we go back and we forgive mom and dad for whatever these issues are. And so there is a, a root of, of unforgiveness, but it's not a known un. You know, a lot of times we know we're bitter at someone. Other times we, we have something in our life that we have to deal with, but we don't really realize that I was maybe holding unforgiveness, but maybe spiritually somewhere we are. When we start to address it through an unforgiveness, through, uh, breaking unholy soul ties and releasing judgments and things of that sort, then it's like you take these these, um, guidelines, guide wires, and tense them right back up to taking that little wobbly antenna and making it perfectly straight.

So, I want to get, I want to, I want to start giving people something to grab on to. Yeah. So, we've been talking concepts and ideas and and that sort of thing, but I want to sort of really begin to say, "Oh, here's what I do. These are the areas I need to be thinking along the lines of." I mean, I can think you got the broader areas there. Um, these are the kinds of prayers we're talking about that are going to be in the book when I get it and that sort of thing. But I want to, I want people to have a handle on the process and I really would love to be able to have some sort of a taste for them so that they could say, "Oh, I could do at least a portion of this right now, right?" And begin. I think they started the process. Yeah. You know. So, let me figure out where I want to get in that. So, you just talked about getting the wires for the antenna and getting the person back aligned, right? Yeah. And so, um, let me pick up still further on that. What a lot of times people will, and I see this most, things that are subtle, maybe your dad was in the military or your mom in the military and they were on deployment for six or 12 months. That gets you out of alignment and that has some impact. But the greatest impact that I usually find is when you have a more traumatic childhood somewhere, any sort of abuse to you or a loved one, any sort of, um, an early death or extreme sickness of a mom or a dad or anything like that, that is usually where most of the issues start. In fact, most addictions will come out of an early childhood experience. Traumatic. Yeah. Just, just like what I read, um, from, uh, that lady Katherine, her mother said she didn't want anything to do with her as a seventh grader. And that is what starts getting everything spiraled down. So starting in the early years is really key. Those are a key thing with that. Then you have, uh, general unforgiveness. So that's, I'll call it, you know, focus on mom and dad, grandparents. That is almost always tied to an unforgiveness. But things that sometimes we don't recognize as unforgiveness. Then you have what I call more general unforgiveness. Just people that have hurt us over the years. And a lot of times we just hold it in. We ignore it. Maybe it happened before we came to Jesus and now we feel fine, but we haven't addressed it. And because we haven't addressed it specifically, then it may still be lingering with us. You want something that people can do. The easiest and most impactful thing that anyone can do right now is to forgive that person that the Lord is bringing on their heart right now that they need to forgive. And I'd like to share how to forgive because sometimes someone has hurt you so deeply that the tendency is, I'll never forgive that person. I see this at the addiction recovery center all the time. Most of these people have been raped, molested, or prostituted, and all of them have been abused. Um, and so they have a lot of issues of people that they have claimed, "I'll never forgive that person." But the problem is, when you don't forgive them, all the torment is on you. It's not on the person. And you have to get to the point of forgiving. A lot of people have a misunderstanding of forgiveness that, um, if, let's just set an example. Dad at seven years old did something against you and it's really, really bad, criminally bad. And it was so bad that you've put it aside, you won't even think about it. You won't even engage with your father ever again. You won't forgive him. And you got all kinds of issues spiraling out of control in your life right now. And unbeknownst to you, it's actually because of that. That's the beginning of it all. And the reason you won't forgive him, Stacy, is because every time you think about him, you think of what he did. Every time you visualize him in your mind, all you can see is what he did. And for you to forgive him in your heart, it feels like you're accepting what he did to you. And you can't do that because it was much too bad. What you have to do for forgiveness is, forgiveness is not condoning and accepting what that person did. The way it was explained to me, which is really easy, imagine that you visualize, you look at your dad and he's wearing this black overcoat. Every time you see him, you see him in that black overcoat. And that overcoat is the coat of hurt. That thing that he did that hurt you. You have to take that overcoat off of him and hold it to the side and separate what he did from him. What he did hurt you, but that's not him. You're God's only commanding you to forgive him, not what he did. In fact, a lot of times we believe that when we forgive, we're supposed to release all desire for vengeance. And yet in Revelation, I think it's six, there's a, um, the saints are there, the ones who have been killed and murdered, and they're all clothed in white. There's no sin in heaven. And they're praying, "Oh Lord, Almighty God, how long before you avenge us for what they did to us?" So they're asking for vengeance, which is a holy thing. If someone has committed a sin, it's proper for them to be judged for that sin. If someone, like what happened, I was sharing this at the, when I first started teaching, there, a lady raised her hand and said, "How can I have compassion and forgive the four men who raped me?" I mean, that's a really valid question. You still have to forgive them, but you don't condone what they did. You can still forgive them and still desire vengeance for God to handle them for what they did to you. Forgiving them has nothing to do with removing what they did. So that's the first step. You remove it. Second step is sometimes you have to look at what were the circumstances that may have led up to it, only to help you have compassion because you and I, we have all done things that we regret and they're not the things that we would normally do. It's not my character to have done that, but I did it anyway and I regret it. If you look at your life of what kind of led up, you can see a series of events that one compiled to another and compiled to another. You know, like the tornadoes that came through years back, it was a perfect storm. Everything came together to have a devastating effect. Well, in our lives, we have the same thing happen. All kinds of things that can come together have a devastating effect and we do something we regret. I bet if you look back to the example with the dad, if you look at the dad, there's probably some things leading up to that event that he was out of control. And so now you can have compassion on him. The same way you recognize it happens to you happens to him. So once you take those into consideration, you can forgive your dad without accepting what he did. And once you forgive, it's a release because not only is it a spiritual mandate, but there is the biggest amount of torment that I see on an ongoing basis is tied to this unforgiveness as I shared. And once you forgive that person, you feel you cannot forgive. And it's a decision. It's a choice. It's simply saying, "God, I forgive so and so for what he did, and I release all judgments against him." There's this peace that comes over you. I remember I was doing a show with this lady, her name was Kim. On my website for my book, if anyone's interested in watching this, I have several live examples of leading people through this process and God healing them. This particular one woman, she had neuropathy in her legs for 15 years, extreme pain on a zero to 10, it was an eight. Prescription drugs. She stopped taking them because all she didn't want the side effects. I was leading her through this process. The Lord brought this person to mind. She for, I just led her into, "I forgive so and so and I release all judgments against this person." And she said, as soon as she did, all the neuropathy instantly disappeared. No more pain in her leg. She started to cry. And I said, "How long have you had neuropathy?" She said, "About 15 years." I said, "Do you see the correlation? The person hurt you 15 years ago. You held unforgiveness and you've been dealing with neuropathy, pain in your legs for 15 years. You forgive the person, the neuropathy leaves." So that would be something that someone could do right now. Everyone has someone they need to forgive. And all it is is a decision to say, "I forgive and release you." You don't have to forget what they did. You may never forget it. Forgiveness is not forgetting. Forgiveness is simply releasing. Sometimes people ask, "Do I have to call them up and forgive them directly?" No. Forgiveness is a sin. Unforgiveness is a sin and forgiveness is simply the equivalent of repenting of that sin and it's simply between you and God.

Yeah. It's not a reconciliation, reconciliation misconception as well. It's like, and you're not saying that it's okay. Right. A lot of times you feel like you're letting them off the hook. And one of the things I also find to be beneficial as it relates to how to forgive and what you said is really good. I like the deal with the coat and taking it off. Is I, I find it that it's less about the offense, forgiving the offense, and for me personally, it's more about having an understanding of the debt that the offense created. Yeah. And and so forgiveness is releasing the debt, right? That was incurred from the offense. Right? You're not forgiving the offense, you're forgiving the person, right? There's a big difference. They no longer owe you the things that the offense created. In other words, right? So, in other words, the, the, some of the examples you gave earlier with, um, the, the girl having to do the childhood mother chores or whatever. It's like, well, you owe me my childhood, right? That's right. Okay. That, that's that's the debt that I need to forgive. And and I think there's a good exercise that that says, "What do you really owe me for this?" Right? Is it my view of men? Is it my security? And when we understand what the debt is, it's like, okay, well, I decide that you no longer owe me these things. Thank you for sharing that. That's the first time I grasped what it really is. As I mentioned, a lot of this I'm going through. I understand the process, but sometimes I don't understand some of the other parts. When you're forgiving, you're forgiving the debt of what it cost you, right? You're now forgiving that debt and not holding it against them anymore. That's exactly what it is. Yeah. It's amazing. If somebody owed you a, a sum of money and and and you expecting that payment, you know, you, you kind of need that $400 or whatever else it might be, $5,000. And, um, you kind of, you live your life on pause until that because I got bills to pay. I got things to do. I need that money. The moment that you say, "You no longer owe that to me anymore." You, you, your life is able to continue. You, you're not counting on that to pay the bills and other things like that. It's just a thing people always talk about and and pastors talk about it a lot and it's really critical. Forgiveness is just absolutely essential in the Christian walk and and it's so much tied to what you're revealing a lot of our physical and mental ailments, emotional ailments as well. But we talk about the importance of forgiving, which is good. But we don't talk about understanding how to forgive because a lot of times people feel like, "I can't let them off the hook." You know, it's, and, and when you realize that it's simply eliminating the debt that it was, that was incurred, it changes things and it really gives you the power there. Yeah. Because the, the bank when they loan you the money for the house, they've got the power really at your house, right? Or with your house. And, um, and so if they choose to forgive that, they, they're controlling that. And, and that's something that I think is worth diving into on the unforgiveness piece. I remember this young woman came up to me at church, asked me to pray for her. I was on the prayer line. She said, "I have eczema." I said, "Oh, that's easy to get rid of. Let me just lead you. Lord, is there any sin or unforgiveness I need to repent of? That's tied to this." And she said, "Yeah, uh, I need to forgive my mom." Okay, so let me guide you to do it. She forgives her mom. All the eczema instantly gone. I mean, it's things like that all the time. So, so the process here then would be, let's sit down. Let's ask the Holy Spirit to reveal to us everyone I need to forgive and let's go back to childhood and let's go to, let's, let's go to, um, elementary school. Let's go to middle school. Let's go to high school. Let's go to college. Let's, oh gosh, college, you know, and or or whatever else is and and do a thorough inventory of the, the process truly is to to go through and and and gather that all together.

Yeah. So, the, the simple thing and I want to be, but I want to make sure because we got more things to. Yeah. Yeah. So, I want to be real sensitive. I don't want to allude to, how do I say this? I'm, I'm not trying to be self-serving. So sometimes we can think that we know just as much as a doctor. So we self-diagnose and self-prescribe on our own. And we end up missing out on a lot of what we could have received or we do something wrong. I want to be sensitive that this is something that, you can go through this and simply say, "Okay, now I forgive these people." There's more to it in in this process. Um, and this is, if you've seen the prayer portion, there's all, there's repenting, there's renouncing, there's, uh, breaking, there's commanding out, there's this and there's that because there's a lot of moving pieces in the holistic side of things. But in terms of something that is effective and most effective right now that someone can quickly do and say, "Wow." It would simply be, "Lord, bring to my mind without a whole lot of hard thinking. Bring to my mind anyone I need to forgive." Right? And then when you forgive, the simple process is, "I forgive them and I release all judgments against them." That's a, these are legal declarations because what's happening is we're in a courtroom in heaven and we're defending ourselves. There is a prosecuting attorney. If Satan is the, uh, the accuser of the brethren, that means he's the chief prosecutor and he has junior prosecutors that are prosecuting us. So, we have to defend ourselves and it's a legal process. The process is, "I forgive and I release all judgments against," and now, "God, whatever torment may be tied to that, remove it." That's the simple and wow, you'll see so much changes from that. So unforgiveness certainly is probably chief among them. What other areas?

Sexual sin. Huge.

Sexual sin. Absolutely. Um, get specific there because there's a lot of detail in that.

There, there's a lot of detail. The way torment works and legal rights work is usually it's a one-to-one. I blow up in anger, I open the door for for a spirit of anger to come in and it's a spirit of only anger. Spirit of lust can't come in because I get angry at something. And a spirit of depression can't come in because I get angry. It's only a spirit of anger. The problem with sexual sin is when I do any sexual activity outside of marriage, now I'm delving into a very dangerous area because, especially on the, this is primarily demonic activity. I'm not sure some other things transfer, but every, so you have a sexual partner, let's say this glass is this sexual partner. Every legal right that she has open in her life when I engage with sex with her, I inherit all of those legal rights just like that because it says when man and woman are joined together, the two become one, which means all of hers now becomes all of mine, all of mine becomes all of hers. So, if she's dealing with manic depression, if she's dealing with addiction, if she's dealing with violence and anger issues, if she's dealing with, uh, anxiety, and these are demonically controlled, okay, they're not all, but if anything that's a demonically controlled issue, then simply by the act of a one-night stand, I'm going to start receiving all of those things. The, the door is open whether they come over immediately or not. That is huge. And

Can you provide biblical reference for that?

Only inferred reference. Okay. Okay. Um, when a man and woman are joined together, God sees them as one. Then Paul says, "Do not give your body to a prostitute because you're become one with her and you don't want to make, you don't make her one with Christ." Okay? But empirical data of how this works, it's really, really clear. Here's an example that your audience can can latch on to. Have you ever had a sexual relationship with a partner who's no longer in your life right now, but they still seem to be controlling you? And almost everyone has had a bad relationship with someone, they're saying yes. The reason they're still controlling you is because not only is there's this conduit, this conduit is through what's called an unholy soul tie. That's my just a term. It's not in the Bible, but you see soul ties.

Soul ties a lot. And in church settings and that sort of thing. And I, I would like to know.

So, we'll get into that.

Where we come up with that term.

In scripture.

Yeah. So, uh, keep in mind a lot of these things because the Bible wasn't written as a deliverance manual, there are a lot of things that happen in deliverance ministry and others that are learned over time or is in other sources that isn't biblical. For example, let me share. When the Lord told me he took away my gift of healing and he now wanted me to learn healing through authority, that wasn't in the Bible, but the Lord revealed it to me nonetheless. Simply because it wasn't in the Bible doesn't mean it's non-existent and it's not true. Right? So, a lot of these things that we do and use may not be in the Bible, but there's been experiential testing with it that finds that this works every time. And therefore, there must be something there. Right. And again, not everything is in the Bible, right? Not everything is in the Bible. Even not everything spiritually. Right. Right. For sure. Okay. Back to.

Okay, so back to the sexual sin. You can have try to have safe sex to protect you from STD, but sexual sin is always going to give you STD. It's always going to give you sexually transmitted demon. There's no way around it because it is an aversion to God. It's one of the biggest sins. In fact, I think it's called the Jerusalem Council. I may be wrong on the name. Uh, you see this in Acts. All kinds of Gentiles were coming to Jesus. And the Jewish believers in Jerusalem would think saying, "We need to teach them part of this law that's been given to the Jews, but not the Gentiles because they have none of this history. None of the covenants, none of the laws, none of the faith that we've been given." This is Romans nine. So what do we tell them? So they boiled it down with the process of the holy prayer and they sent out a letter and these are only four things. Mhm. Abstain from food sacrificed to idols. Abstain, abstain from, um, uh, meat with blood in it. From eating an animal that's been strangled and sexual immorality, sexual immorality. Take the, the food and the blood, which is the primary parts of those other three. The next thing, the only thing that they said was sexual immorality. It is that big of an issue. So when, and I could tell you lots of stories, but that is big. It's the sexual activity and it's the unholy soul tie. And a lot of times you repent of the sin with the person, but you still have the issue. It's only when you break the unholy soul tie and command that spirit out that you can get it out.

What are things that you could list off that says this is where I see? These are the high-level things?

Yeah. Unforgiveness, sexual sin. Mhm. Uh, the occult. So if we don't get into like why, how does it work, the mechanics, then it's easy to go through them a little bit faster, right?

Okay. Yeah.

Uh, and for the listeners, don't understand the mechanics, just understand that it works. I don't have to understand how my gasoline engine works. I just put gas in it, keep the oil change, and it keeps running. Okay. Then you have things like, uh, word curses. Word curses or anytime someone's spoken some word over you that haunts you like, "You'll always be like your dad. You'll be just like your dad when you grow up," and all of a sudden you become just like your dad. Or, or a nickname that is effectively a word curse.

Yeah. Exactly. Um, uh, interesting on word curses. So the, the root of a word curse is something that you believe that is a sin. It gives a spirit a legal right to fulfill that. Here's the easiest way to explain it. One of the ladies that I worked with, uh, her name, uh, Francis, she's a missionary with Crew. She had been on the mission field for 50 years. She's 73 years old at this point. And she's in a wheelchair for 11 years. And I get involved. I find out that it's a spirit tied to a secret oath that she took in high school as part of Rainbow Girls. If anyone's familiar, you have Rainbow Girls, a subset of Eastern Star, which is part of Freemasonry. That oath was actually a witchcraft oath. It's, it was professing things that she didn't know actually carried power. And I know that was the source because when she repented of that, all of the pain left and she was instantly out of the wheelchair. So that was a legal right tied to the occult. Okay. Then three weeks later, she's back in the wheelchair and I go, "Oh my gosh, what happened?" This is my early stages of understanding this. I go, "Lord, what happened? I thought we got that spirit out. I thought we broke the legal right." And God said, "You did break the legal right, but another legal right opened up between the time you cast it out and the time it came back." And I said, "What is it?" He, and he placed in my heart what I thought it was. So I called Francis up. She was out of town. And I said, "I think I know what's going on, but let's test it. What's the pain level right now?" She said, "It's an eight." I said, "In Jesus name, I command you, spirit, to get out right now. All the pain, get out." And it went from an eight down to a three, but it wouldn't budge. When it doesn't budge, it's still holding on to a legal right. It has to be there. I said, "Francis, I think what's been going on is you've been in a wheelchair for 11 years. I bet you've created an identity of being in pain. God says you're healed. Your identity says you should still be in pain. Let's repent of that identity of being in pain because it's contrary to God's picture for you." So she said, "I repent of my identity of being in pain." I said, "Spirit, get out." And it was gone. So a word curse can be something that we simply believe about ourselves that maybe no one spoke over us, but because it's who we have been, we believe we are. Like addictions. One of the hardest things to free addiction is, "I've always been an addict. I'm an addict." And as soon as you believe that, you open the door for the spirit to keep you in an addict.

Well, that's one of the things that AA does. It makes you say that. "Hi, I'm Batty Carmichael and I am an alcoholic."

Yeah. That's right. So, it, it defeats that purpose. They do great, great work and I, I just, uh, I had somebody on not long ago that says, really, it doesn't free anyone. It just gives them a longer chain. And, um, but, but back to things like the occult, right? So specifics, I'm thinking about things like, what people are doing that may. Okay. Um, have you ever, ever played with a Ouija board? You're going to have a spirit for sure. Seance, tarot cards. Um, uh, even I've heard, uh, when you burn Harry Potter books. Have a friend who sees in the spirit. She said, friend was burning Harry Potter books and you could see the spells going up in the flames. So there's a lot, there's stuff there. Um, uh, if you're involved with Freemasonry, you have a family like a father or grandfather involved with Freemasons, chances are a lot of, uh, occult stuff there because it's the, the secrecy of are based on the cult. New age stuff, um, crystals, mediums, and psychics.

Absolutely. All of that opens up the door. Uh, even if you, you or even your grandfather used water witching to try to find water. Okay. Uh, that's divination that opens up a big door. So all of these type of things they can.

Having things in your home like that, dream catchers and?

Dream catchers for sure. Absolutely.

Buddhas and?

Yeah. If someone were to, um, uh, real interesting, um, there's a video on my website for my book and it has some testimony, but the last one, this guy had all kinds of issues in his life and dream catchers were one of those things that kept all the issues in his life. He got rid of the dream catchers and things disappeared. So they don't catch dreams, they catch demons.

Yeah. So, and people think, "Oh gosh, these are just harmless little things, items of decor in my home." And, um, oh, what's the harm? It's going and, and, and to a psychic just to see, you know, if they can do something, right, or whatever.

Can hurt you.

Yeah. And, um, and people think it's harmless. And people, the people that think it's harmless are often very likely to be living with maladies of some sort that they, you know, that's.

Just how it's been.

Yeah. It's just how it's been. And we're likely to be apathetic about it. And once you realize that's not how it should be because it's not abundant life that Jesus promised, there's probably something blocking that abundant life. Let me share one other thing. This is the cool thing, too. We were talking earlier about, um, uh, before we started, just growing in faith, walking in authority, maybe just, um, uh, having a closer relationship with God. One of the things that surprised me and, um, and almost every person I've asked about this, it always comes out. When someone goes through the prayer of freedom and they get all this garbage out of their life and all the demonic torment out of their life, their walk with the Lord instantly increases. I mean, like just blooms. Their desire to pray, their desire to read the Bible, digging in, scriptures coming to life, being able to really feel like they're praying and and hearing God speak. Once you get all of the blockages between you and God out of the way, it's like a whole new relationship. It says that sin blocks our relationship with God. So, when you get that sin out of the way by confessing it and now it's gone, then there's nothing blocking that relationship. You will find that your walk with the Lord is stronger, your faith is stronger, your authority is stronger, everything spiritually becomes stronger because now it's all gone. All the blockage.

Well, um, and that makes a lot of sense. If, if I think that the takeaway for me here is that a few things and, and there's things I just want to make sure that I, I can kind of express the medical community, the world looks at this and, and there's a lot of people. This is conversation is is for probably more for spiritually awakened people.

This latter part, the deep part is.

I, I think all of it is. I, it's not reserved for them.

Oh yes. But the conversation and the topic because the world says, "Oh my gosh, we're going into 2026 and you guys are talking like you're some sort of medieval superstitious word curse thing that that has anything to do with anything, you know, and, and, and, and it sounds like nonsense to the educated, you know, biologist, right?

Sounds like foolishness to the world.

That's right. And, and, and it's like you guys are just living in, in like a prehistoric stone age superstitious mentality that, that it's just, it, it's ridiculous to even consider what you're talking about. And that's why I say this is probably for the more spiritually mature in the sense that I've been that person that says, "Oh my gosh, are you kidding me? Spells coming up out of burning Harry Potter books? Get that. That's called smoke and that's what happens when you ignite it. It's combustion, right?" I was that, I was that person.

I was too.

And, and, and so I've lived my life and, and I have observed and have experienced that there, in fact, is a living eternal God and there is an enemy of God because I, I've experienced it. I just hadn't experienced and it sounded like stupid stuff. And so this conversation would probably be being met with just like, this is the most absurd thing I've ever heard to the worldly, right? But to spiritual people and, and so I, this conversation really is about that, right? It's like the point of what is being discussed here in the spiritual is that much of your menu of maladies, whatever they may be, emotional, mental, physical, there is a better than average chance that many of those aren't just, you know, a medical condition in the natural sense. That many of those are directly tied to sin in your life of some sort, ranging from curses being spoken of over you, as primitive as that sounds, all the way to complicit sin. And, uh, gosh, whatever the host of things could be. And what you've done is you've systematized that. You have written a book, um, called The Prayer of Freedom, I'm going to talk about in a second, where you have gone through scripture and gathered the mechanics of what you can do to get freedom from the sin in your life that is likely causing a lot of your problems. And what we've done in our past is we've committed sins. We've felt remorse for them. Wish we hadn't done them. Whatever it may be, but we've just moved on in life and we've just kind of kept going and we just don't talk about that stuff. It's the proverbial sweep it under the rug. You know, those people, you know, some of them are dead now, so we're just kind of, you know, that's all gone and in the past and I don't want to relive that stuff and I'm moving forward and, and, and that sort of thing. And the, the deal is, is what you're saying is it will behoove you. It will likely lead you into a life of abundance spiritually, physically, and in many other ways if you will go and ask the Holy Spirit to show you where they need to be confronted, um, expressed, right? Um, what's the word I'm looking for? Confessed. Confessing your sins and then the, the process of repentance from that and with that saying, if there is assignment with that, if there is a consequence, if there is a spirit of discipline around that, if God used that spirit of discipline to correct me, if I acknowledge that and say, "Let's remove the spirit of discipline," that you very well could get free from the maladies that are plaguing you.

Exactly.

And that's crazy to think about. It's just like, I got this, this chronic elbow problem. I, I can't straighten it out. Never been able to straighten it out. I'm good with that. I'm going to the doctor. They just say, "Hey, man. You got this. That's just how it's going to be." Are you telling me that it's worth the effort to go through and identify areas of sin in my life and then go through the process and see if that can get healed?

Yeah, it almost always will be healed.

And it almost always will be healed. You're telling me and have said this that as you do this process with other people, this isn't a theory of yours, right? This isn't a theory. You've taken this into the world and what you have found is that people are healed at an astonishing 90% clip when going through this process.

Let me share what I did. This is really interesting. As I was writing the book and and taking the worksheet and the prayer portion and then building the book around it, every time I prayed with people through this process, everything was gone. I mean, but I also carry much more spiritual authority than they did. I know that. So, I, I didn't know how much of what was happening was due to my authority versus what the process was. So, I was, I was teaching three classes at the time at the Addiction Recovery Center. So, I said, "I want to statistically measure this. In marketing, you measure everything. So, I wanted to measure this." So, I, I made a list. I call it an issue grid. You'll see an example of it in the book. And I had all my students in all three classes take that grid and make a list of everything that they were dealing with at that moment. The average person had probably 10 different things from addiction to sex or pornography, drugs, alcohol to anxiety, bipolar disorder, depression, COPD, uh, neuropathy, um, uh, arthritis, and just on and on and on. Darkness in their mind, heaviness, like they're carrying around this heavy backpack. I had each person grade on 0 to 10 the intensity right then that they were dealing with. Then I gave them the worksheet process with the prayer portion on it and I say, "Do this and in 30 days I'll come back." And they did it all on their own. For those people, there's a little bit more accountability, but for those people who went through it, I then gave them back their issue grid and say, "Now regrade everything that you hadn't graded in the past." 87% of those people, everything they had on their list went to zero. One or two, uh, a few exceptions, they still had maybe one or two things that still remained. Anxiety. It was at a seven. Now it's at a zero.

Always anxiety, depression.

My plantar fasciitis.

Zero.

It was at an eight. It had gone down to zero. Not because they got a new insole, but because the only variable here was the prayer of freedom process.

That's it. That, that thank you note I read from Katherine, that's not a unique thing. That's a standard response. In fact, I was on the way over here, I was thinking, "Do I have too many testimonies in the book?" You know, it's not like I search for testimonies, you know, handpicked because I actually had a testimony here. Let's put it in there. I've left so many testimonies of how the, how people have been impacted on the cutting table because there's just, I can't fit them. You know, it's, the standard response is what that lady did. It's all gone.

Yeah. So, we got people and that that write into us all the time that that jump into the comments section when we have an episode that's around healing and that sort of thing and they're like, "Please pray for me. I have A, B, C, and D. Please pray for me. Please, please pray for my son." They're lobbing these requests for prayer out to people that have this. It's almost like if I get enough people praying for me, maybe it'll actually happen, right? And, and the takeaway here is there is an opportunity for you to go find the root cause of A, B, C, and D through this process. Repent of the things that are causing it and see the healing take place without anybody praying for you. This is so much more effective than petition prayer. Petition is, "Lord, please heal this person." Lord's saying, "That person needs to forgive this person and repent of this sin and, you know, and these are the, the discipline is there because they've got this un." Scripture has told us and this, this is.

Another quick thing, real quick. But scripture has said, if you do these things, this is the stuff that's going to befall you. Yeah.

And then people will also say, well, wait a minute, that's Old Testament stuff. Old Testament, we we live in New Testament times, you know, Jesus paid for all that stuff. That's we've talked about this already, right? Right. He has for your salvation, right? It's not that we're living under the old law, in my view. It's that God says there is discipline. I will discipline, discipline you so that you are living in my image, aligned with me, in the way I designed it to work. Right. And so it's not like that's Old Testament, old law. This is New Testament, new law.

Yeah. This isn't the covenantal law. This is a foundational law on which the covenants still sit. If you go back to Job, Job predates Moses. Job is the oldest book in the in the uh Bible.

Right? And Satan could not attack him because he was blameless.

Yeah. It's it's not a, it's not a, it's not the covenant.

Yeah. It's not a trans, the transactional thing still applies.

Yes. That's the God. He's the same yesterday, today, and forever. If you sin, there will be physical, measurable consequences in your life. Batty Stacy.

Yes. If you do not sin, is your life going to be perfect? No. That's not what I'm saying. You're going to have trials and stuff like that, but with sin comes consequences. Jesus paid for those so that you can have eternal life. But the consequences are still in place in your life from a physical perspective. And that's what we're dealing with here. And so we don't, we don't get that, right? We don't think that our conditions, our addictions, our foot pain, our headaches, our sciatica, our arthritis, our glaucoma, is anything other than a medical condition because we live in a fallen world. We have, we don't think it has our sin or our ancestors' sin has anything to do with our physical condition. And the Bible teaches something different, is what you're saying. And it's very clear when you look and and and this is the principle that you're operating in. And when you are applying this process, that is the principle, 90% of the things are going away.

Yeah. What else are you going to say about that? It's like, why wouldn't you, why wouldn't you try it? The back problems that you've had. You keep having slip discs and all these other things. I had a friend that his back was curving. His right shoulder was three inches lower than his left, and he was constant pain. He had been in pain since early childhood. And, um, uh, and I led him through this, and he got back home. His back was perfectly straight. His wife said, "You've grown two inches," because he's now standing straight. All the pain's gone. Yeah. All kinds of things.

So there are people with the gift of healing that can be healed in Jesus' name, and they walk away. Take the brace off, like the guy in Chick-fil-A.

Yep. But everyone can confess. But everyone can confess. You can go through the process of the things that God brings to mind to you instead of just keeping them locked away in your sin box, your history box, the the former you box. Open the box. Get them out. Confess them. Repent of them. Break the the things that are associated with them spiritually and walk in the freedom.

And this is another really cool thing I've learned in doing this. You can actually do this on behalf of, like, that son, your child, or a spouse, or a parent. Because what we're dealing with, we're dealing with a legal process in the spiritual realm. That's why they're called legal rights. And just as in a court of law here, you can have an attorney represent you. Uh, in the Old Testament, you had the priest that represented the Israelites that would bring their sacrifice to God. So they were a mediator, bringing repentance to God essentially on behalf of someone else. And I see all the time when a child, like an adult child, will pray this process on behalf of a parent, and all kinds of issues in that parent's life just melt away. They do it on behalf of a child. Issues in that child's life disappear. Especially if someone is a parent and you have a really strained relationship, like with an adult child. Just, uh, few months back, uh, this was happening. Um, the child was 30, the dad was 60ish, and they would always butt heads and just blow up in fights. And I said, "Well, that's just a spiritual thing." You know, when did it begin? I guided him through this. He went through this on behalf of his adult son, and now their family gettogethers, they don't blow up anymore. He said, "Is, I mean, it just happened like that." So, there's a lot of additional stuff. I, I shared this in my book in the later chapters, but the, a lot that you can do to help a loved one start to get free, even if they won't or can't start to do this on their own.

And even if you don't know their sins that may have been the root, you you can take authority and say, you you you know enough of their issues that you can help some. You won't, it won't dis. But I remember, um, just earlier this week, I was talking to a lady, and she's gone through this book. She asked if she, you know, would this help her mom. I said, "Yeah, just pray it on her behalf." So, she made a list. Her mom was primarily an addict and things of that sort. She then got up with her mom. Her mom was always caustic, always saying, you know, the B-word, the N-word, and and complaining. And when she called her back, there was a noticeable change. She was more calm. Her mom drove out of, uh, from North Carolina to Birmingham to then, uh, her her the daughter drove to her mom and then walked her mom through this. But now, because her daughter had done the work ahead of time, there was this level of calmness in her life that was no, that had never been there. And now their mom was able to receive actually going through it, and they got everything else out. So it was kind of a two-step process.

I think of children with behavioral issues. I think of children with food allergies and, uh, things like that. Are you saying that a parent should, uh, go through this process and, uh, just on behalf of their child? I mean, gosh, if you think about, uh, a lot of times as a parent, especially young children.

Yeah, that's what I was going to. Mom and dad do this. You'll probably see a lot of that disappear because it could be generate the iniquity being visited down.

Right. A four-year-old.

Right. You know, having food allergies isn't because of the four-year-old's sin. It's likely because, if if it's a spiritual issue, something inside of the parent, something generational, either before the parent, or even something that the parent has engaged in. And so what you're saying is, when you do these things as a, you go through the complete process as a parent, don't be surprised if some of your children's issues vanish.

Right? I remember I was talking to a lady. She thought her son was miraculously healed. Then I explained this, and she thought, "Oh, now that explains it." Her adult son, uh, he was a teenager in high school, was had this really bad jaw pain, and it was so bad they were about to take him to the dentist. Mom and dad were separated because dad has had about 20 affairs in their 20 years of life. He's, uh, addicted to sex affairs. And he had made a list of every woman he'd been sleeping with and repented of that. And when I was sharing this concept, this understanding with her, she connected the dots. The day he repented on that list was the day the pain left her son's mouth.

Wow. And so there are a lot of things that the sins of the fathers are visited. You repent of those sins, and your children get healed. Well, the book is called The Prayer of Freedom, a step-by-step guide to freedom for mental health, chronic pain, and addictions. I have read this book, and I have, I have not gone through the process. We've got, you know, I, I got things, I got eye things, I've got, you know, we got a kid with allergies, I got another one that's had a, a series of stress fractures. Um, you know, who knows, right, if that's a just a, a thing because he's doing too much or what, but, um, I'm looking forward to going through the process in detail. But I would, I would say in, in looking at it as I read it and and saw some of the, the, the very specific activities in here, it, it's involved.

It, it is. And, and I would say, what's it worth to you, right? Is your, the, the struggles that your child have? Is it worth it to go through the process to create healing? Or do you just not have the time for that? Right? The thing, the, the struggle to walk that you have, you can't walk upright, or your leg, your foot's hurt, or, and it's been this way for, for years and years and years, or you've got just ongoing back pain. Is it worth it? Is it worth it to go through the process of of repentance, of breaking ties to to to potentially get free from these things? You know, I, I, I think of, I go back to childhood cancer, and, um, I know people that have had had children pass.

Yeah. And, um, and, and it's almost becoming a pattern in a couple of places that I know of specifically. And I would never be able to say, you know, this could potentially be rooted in in your sin as a parent, or the sins of generations before. There is a process that you can go through to surface these things and address them with the possibility.

That's it. The possibility.

The possibility. I'm not saying that, hey, you're to blame here. That's probably where that comes in. And it's like, why would we not overturn every stone possible to experience the abundant life God has for us? If he has outlined in scripture what robs us of the abundant life, and there's a thing that we can do about it, why would we not do that? I don't know, Batty. I, I, I, I think this is fantastic. And as I've read this and thought through it, prayed through it, and we've talked here, it's like, of course, of course, why haven't we done this? Why haven't we addressed healing from this perspective? We just say, "Y'all pray for me." We just say, "Hey, I'm going to go lay hands and and I hope God heals you." and and it happens sometimes, and that's beautiful and great, but so many times it doesn't. A lot of people don't believe it's God's will for people to be healed simply because they look around and nobody's getting healed. I mean, a very, very few, right? And, and the, and the person who sort of mocks all this is like, "Well, Batty, why don't you just go over to the hospital and just go free everybody?" Right? What do you say to stuff like that? These are these are things that irritate me about all this, and I'm sure you've heard them, and I want to hear how you.

Well, the people at the hospital will go through this. So here's interesting. Years back, this was six or seven years ago, a passing through pastor at a church I was visiting gave me a prophetic message. He says, "I see you're a teacher." I said, "Yes." And you do healing? I said, "Yes." He said, "God is going to give you revelation on healing to teach in a way that's never been taught. And I see you going to cancer hospitals." So, so far, everything's has been lining up. And, um, this is teaching on healing that's in a way that's never really been taught. It's not new. The Catholic Church has a healing mass, and it's all based on primarily on,

Repentance.

Confession.

Confession. Yes.

You have, uh, deliverance. It's all based on confession. And other people, you have a, other ministries that understand this, and they apply it. The ministers will apply it strategically. But no one's really said, "Well, it's so systematic, foundational, and the same thing works every time." Just make it a system, a systematic process because it's, it works. So I may be going to hospitals is where I'm going.

Well, no, I think that's good. Are you hopefully, or at least the book will, hopefully training people up. Hopefully other people experience this and then can begin to walk other people through this. U, this isn't processing spiritual things, but yet it is, right? And, and you think, okay, no, you're supposed to have faith, and this is a, this is a heart thing, not a process thing. And, um, can I address that?

I would, I would challenge that. Yeah, go ahead. Sure.

The greatest aspect of faith is obedience. And the greatest single command, repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. Even to Christians, Revelations 2 and 3, Jesus is writing to Christian churches. He keeps telling him over and over again, repent. There's something about that. And we're not obeying, which means we're not walking by faith. Faith in its most simplest form is obedience to what God says. We don't talk enough about repentance in the world and what it is and living free from sin. And we feel like we're, we're sinners, right? We tell ourselves we're sinners. Yes, we have sinned, but we are not called to be sinners.

Right? We're called to repent and go and sin no more, that it may go well with you. And, um, that's, that's the foundation of this book, this teaching, these principles, this healing at a 90% clip. What do you have to lose? Why not step into the process God outlines for us in scripture? Do you have a message that's not exactly what we've just talked about for however long we've been talking? Is there a, a broader message that you just want to feel like you got to express that maybe we haven't expressed yet?

There really isn't. It's such a simple message, but it's very complex internally. The process is real simple, but as we saw a moment ago, you can get really complex and understand the mechanics. Don't worry about the mechanics. The message is just to repent. Um, I think I may have shared this,

And not in the broad sense, but in the specific sense.

In a specific sense. I run a business that's been our livelihood. And the Lord told me, uh, to literally abandon the business and focus on this, because this is the message. The message is to set his people free. How do we heal our nation? It says, "If my people who are called by my name will return to me, repent, I will heal their land." How do you get people to repent? Well, make it something in it for them.

Why don't we believe God's word there? That's a promise of God.

Yeah.

If you will turn to me, I will heal you. Do we just not believe him? I think we've lost. I think the Western church over time has tried to simplify things and smooth it out and make it pretty, that we've gotten away from the real message and we focus on all these little doctrinal things and dig deep, and we forget the simplicity of the gospel.

Y, the simplicity is to make disciples. A disciple when fully trained is like the teacher. That's the goal. And to be fully trained, you must become blameless. Blameless means you can't be sinless. Therefore, you repent of the sin so that it's out of your way.

Yeah. And we've just been missing it.

The teacher was sinless.

Yeah.

That is, that's the objective. That is the standard.

That is the standard. It's not to live in sin and just keep asking for forgiveness. It's to repent. It's repentance isn't an apology for sin. Repentance is turning from the sin toward him. Yes. And that's what it is. Batty Carmichael, what a, what an awesome conversation. And I, you know, we prayed beforehand. We, I, we, we always do. And just our prayer together was, um, very powerful and, and good. And our prayer is that God opens the eyes of people, and that he brings millions of people into healing through what we did here today. And, um, we believe that we want, I, I want people when you experience healing, I want you to write us. I want you to tell us. I want you to go to the, the form on the website. I want you to comment in the, this episode's description on YouTube or Spotify or wherever you're watching from, and I want you to tell us about your healing. Um, those testimonies build the faith of people, and, um, and, and we want to know about it. That, that's, that's an important deal. The book, The Prayer of Freedom, um, the link to this and to your website, all in the episode description. So, go straight to the episode description. We'll put it at the top. You can't miss it.

Um, I, I personally recommend the book. And I, I have not gone through the process personally. And so I, I can't sit here and say, "Well, here's what's happened so far." That is a thing that our family will be doing, uh, very soon here.

And I encourage for anyone who just wants to really kind of see this in action. If you add the word book at the end of that title, the prayerfreedombook.com, that's the website that'll be down below. Um, there are several examples of live healings. I'm doing this on the show, and you can see the process, and it's really kind of cool. You're seeing people get rid of anxiety and depression. That lady with neuropathy, uh, someone who had a football injury 20 years ago, always in pain, and you see their expressions, and you know it's real, and it's like, this is really cool.

The lady with the asthma child and all that stuff, all those testimonies are there if anyone just wants to peruse and actually dig in deeper.

Yeah. I, I just, I think it's like, okay, let's do something about this. Let's, let's see what a life is like when we truly repent of the sins that have haunted us.

Yes.

Our whole lives. Instead of just laying them in the past, let's bring them back up. Not to experience the pain of them, but to to truly repent of them and officially lay them to bed and watch what happens as the consequences are dealt with biblically. I can tell you a life of abundance is possible. It's real, and it's really feels great.

That's amazing. Batty Carmichael, thank you so much for, for, for not just being here, but for doing the work to dive into the intricacies of how each of these things work and then putting it together in something, a package that we can digest and then apply. Uh, that's really, really amazing, and that's really, really obedient, and it's God wanting his people to be free, and I just thank you for being an agent of that, and I especially thank you for coming here and sharing all of that with us.

Well, thank you for having me over, Stacy. This has been wonderful.

If you or someone you love is dealing with a mental, emotional, or a physical burden that needs healing, revisit what Batty shared. Ask God to reveal the root and take the steps of repentance outlined in this conversation. And honestly, I personally recommend that you get his book, because the book guides you through the process in great detail with very specific prayers that I found to be extremely freeing. It's made a difference for me. We've included the link for the book in the episode description. If you go through this process, there will likely be healing, freedom, and a more abundant life waiting for you. And if you know someone who needs healing or feels stuck in certain areas of their life, share this episode with them. You may well be handing them the keys to a life that they didn't know they could have. Thanks for joining us today on A Stronger Faith. To get Batty's book, The Prayer of Freedom, we've included a link for it in our episode description. You'll also find links to his website and social media pages there as well. To recommend a guest for us, please visit a strongerfaith.org/cont and follow the instructions there. And to come alongside us in support of this work by becoming a donor, you can visit a strongerfaith.org/give for giving options. Until next time, we pray for your healing, your freedom, and for a stronger faith for you and those you love.