Transcription
Earlier this week, President Trump signed a bill compelling the Justice Department to make public 100,000 pages of records known as the Epstein files. And that day, our Jessica Moore sat down with Annie Farmer, an Epstein survivor who says she was just 16 years old when she was targeted by Epstein and his long-time girlfriend, Ghislaine Maxwell. Here's a look at their full conversation.
"This is such an honor for me. Thank you for taking the time. This has been like so much of your life. Is it even possible to describe the emotions you're feeling today?"
"It is a it's a mix of emotions, for sure. I think um we are incredibly proud of what has been accomplished, and especially because there were so many people that were naysayers, right? Um and we just in the last few months, what's happened has really been unbelievable. There were many of us that, you know, weren't even sure about coming to this press conference. We weren't clear a week ago, you know, what might be possible. And the fact that everything changed so quickly, and that yesterday we didn't only celebrate the victory in the House, but also in the Senate, and that Trump could sign this legislation today. I mean, I don't I don't think I never heard anyone say that was possible. So, we're proud, we're relieved, but it's also bittersweet, because there's people that aren't here to see this that we really wish could be, you know, um Virginia Giuffre it being, you know, very very prominent in this fight. It's it's very hard to celebrate without her. Um"
"Talk about the speed. It's such a great point. I mean, just a couple of weeks ago, there was this small group of Republican Congress people who said, "No, we're we're we're fighting for this." And yesterday, only one voted no. And then the Senate immediately voted to push it through. I mean, how how what do you how do you account for that?"
"I think we were loud enough that they they really wanted this to go away. Um and I think, you know, I'm really grateful, honestly, to the American people that called their Congress people, that made it clear where they stood on this issue, because I think that's the pressure that you made this possible."
"Do you believe that we will achieve transparency if all of the files are released?"
"You know, I I think that it's hard for a lot of us to trust in the government at this point because of everything that's happened in this case from the very beginning, you know, my sister, Maria Farmer, reporting this in 1996, um no follow-up, right? Um never any protections for being a whistleblower, and everything that happened with the sweetheart deal, you know, long list of failures um in this case. So, I I will believe it when I see it. I think that's many of us now, we feel very hopeful, and we feel like we're holding our breath a little bit to see what does it mean to get this release. What are they going to give us?"
"Are you concerned that the president did this 180 and is now saying, "Let's investigate certain parts of the files" that that may prohibit those files from being released?"
"Yeah, as soon as he announced that, I became concerned that that was a strategy. Um I think the timing of it, you know, it was just the summer that the DOJ said there's not enough evidence to continue to pursue any investigations of co-conspirators. So, um and then they worked so hard to make sure this didn't happen, and then suddenly they opened investigation and said it could happen. So, I think, you know, the timing of it all is quite suspicious, but um you know, I I think we can continue to apply pressure if if it doesn't if we don't get the transparency we're looking for."
"This is my last question on the president, but what did you make of him calling it a hoax? How did that make you feel?"
"Oh, it's I mean, it was it was very bothersome, but I, you know, what I said was, "If there's misinformation about this case, which I agree, there has been misinformation, then the best way to dispel that is to give us the facts, right? To give us the files." So, you know, I think it was you know, it was a way to try and dismiss us, but we weren't we weren't able to be dismissed."
"You have spoken publicly about your experience that started back when you were just 16 years old. Most of your life has been with this burden. What how has it shaped you, and how has advocating for so many survivors shaped you?"
"Yeah, I think, you know, when something happens early in your life, it can make a big, you know, a big impact in terms of your identity. I think it is um you know, I've been called to work with survivors in different contexts as an advocate or as a therapist, and I think that's been really rewarding work, um also just on the prevention side of things. And so, um you know, I think it's it's kind of hard to tease apart, honestly. When something happens so early, like we're how would your life be different if it hadn't happened? Um but right now, I think one of the things I'm grateful for is just the people that I have met because of this fight. Um incredible group of women that I've had the honor of working with, um and so, you know, I'm I'm really grateful for that part."
"You're a practicing psychologist. You help other survivors. Does it ever get to you personally when you're when you're hearing their stories, when you're helping them work through their trauma? Do you go back to what you went through? Is it ever like emotional on a personal level for you?"
"I mean, I think that, you know, I've I've done a lot of processing, right? Because that was such a long time ago. But I there were there have been times in the most recent years when the case was prominent, you know, where I have chosen to step back from doing types of work that were more, you know, trauma-focused because of that, just feeling like that would be that would be heavier, right? Um but um I also think that hearing so many stories from and from different individuals I've worked with has really, you know, strengthened my resolve to speak out about this issue, because I know how incredibly widespread it is. And I think, you know, that's something I hope this case has highlighted that, you know, this doesn't only happen um you know, doesn't only happen amongst powerful people. This is a this is an issue that, you know, I I think really affects almost everyone, whether it's someone individually in your family or someone you know, a friend, right? Both child sexual abuse, exploitation, um and other types of sexual violence. Like we all know and care about survivors. And so, how can we speak out more about this?"
"The bill as it passed prohibits withholding records for reputational or political sensitivity. That's key. What why is that provision important to you? That it won't protect people based on their reputation, based on who they are, what they do. Why is that such an important facet of this bill?"
"I think that is really key. We're already I mean, I just saw on one of the news screens upstairs that, you know, Larry Summers had resigned from a board. Um you know, we're seeing that the people that are in these files are in positions of power, right? In academia, in the media, in the government. And so, they should face scrutiny, and they should face consequences for being for enabling and being involved with Epstein and this group. Um so, yeah, I'm glad that they're not going to they're not going to, you know, get off of that way."
"Talk to me about Ghislaine Maxwell. She's obviously at this very cushy federal prison camp now. What are your thoughts on that? I'm assuming that because if correct me if I'm wrong, but you were abused by her as well."
"Yes, I was. Yeah, and I think that I'm I've felt like it's important to speak out about that since, you know, since everything that's transpired this summer with her getting this interview with Todd Blanche, and then very, you know, suddenly being transferred, that you you she was a participant in the abuse, right? And I think that Virginia um Robert Giuffre's book really speaks to that in terms of her very critical role and how cruel she was. Um and so, I, you know, I've been alarmed by what's happened in that case, by her transfer, hearing about her special treatment. I think it's another example of really what people are so disgusted with, which is people in power, there being a separate set of rules for them, right? And so, I hope that all the attention that this brings may means that she does not have her sentence commuted, and that she actually serves it like anyone else with that crime would serve it."
"Someone had asked me this question recently, and it's almost impossible to answer, but it did make me think. And you because you have such a great psychology background, knowing what you've been through over the last decades, if you could go back and tell your 16-year-old self something, what would it be?"
"I think that it would be that it's okay to talk about what happened, tell someone, and um that it's not it wasn't your fault, right? You didn't do anything wrong."
"It's great advice. Thank you so much."
"Oh, yeah. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it."