Blue Ribbon Committee (April 30, 2025)

K. Hereby call to order. Magandang magandang hapon. I'm sorry for the delay. Um, Ipasok ko na lang sa prayer yung aking ano, yung aking ah, opening statement, if I'm allowed, and sa ating mga kapatid na Muslim and other religions, please join us in prayer in your way.

Lord, Father God, as we pray for a country that seeks your kingdom and righteousness, we pray Lord that um, pag may nangyari katulad nitong pagbaksak ng tulay, um, it's just like the massive floodings that are happening. Um, uh, certain uh, um, outrageous things that happen to our country that are manmade and not uh, for twiituous events. We pray Lord that we will learn our lesson. We pray that you will reveal the truth. We know that the truth will set us free. We pray that you will uh, just uh, raise up uh, the right um, people, leaders, next generation in each and every department. Uh, as we do not see everything but you see everything. Give us the tools, mechanisms, technology uh, for our be able to investigate, correct and not to accuse people wrongly. Uh, all the investigative bodies, the PNP, the NBI, the Omuds office, ombudsman, the blue ribbon committee, we put on your feet and ask Lord for this in Jesus mighty name. Lead us Holy Spirit. Amen.

So we we ano, no, at the start of the hearing we expressed our outrage that something like this would happen. Siguro, huwag kang magsasawa, Mr. Secretary and DPWH family, na marami sa inyo, you spent your lifetime, dedicated your life to fixing the infrastructure of our country. Paulit-ulit ako na although naging accepted na na minsan mali ang pagkagawa nung kalye, so nalulubak, pero kayang tiisin or kayang ayusin ah, nung panahon ni Secretary Villar, bawal gumawa ng kalye na hindi kaliwat't kanan yung drainage, then naging isang side lang yung drainage, and then okay na rin kahit walang drainage. And of course it was a different Philippines, ‘di ba? Maybe half or 60, 70, 80 million Filipinos and much less infrastructure. So I accept when Secretary, ang interpretasyon ko sa sinabi ni Secretary last time, is outraged din sila pero iba lang ang manner na expressing it. No. But having said that, it's important to me that all departments have a protocol na pag may nangyari, sinong ipre-preventive suspension, sinong mag-iimbestiga, ano yung proseso na mabilis, ha? Ay, ay, hindi ako pabor doon sa 3 months, 6 months preventive suspension, because if you're found to not have been at fault, kawawa ka naman at yung pamilya mo na you're ridiculed at that time, no? Pero yung yung fre ka na may manipulations and to protect yourself, ‘di ba? I think 15 days is is about uh, affair, and we and we look no later on after the report and after the questions, or maybe sa last hearing ah, kung possible na nangyari to. So I do understand Mr. secretary na first time din naman, it's the first time that there's a collapse like this, ‘di ba, na not na na may question bakit nag-collapse, ‘di ba? Kasi for example, the great earthquake nung 90s, alam naman natin it was because of the earthquake, ‘di ba? So let me thank the DPW family for coming here in full force. Thank you sa mga taga Region 2 na nagbabalik-balik kayo dito for this ah, let's get to the point, and after the report we take a short 5 minutes break. Who wants to uh, just freshen up, then we'll go to urban engineers. Secretary, nung nag-break tayo last time, nag-adjourn, may pending question sa urban engineers. Nasan ang urban engineers today, sir? Yan. So ang pending question ho sa kanila. I appreciated their report; they found out parang 800 ah, na mga problema, whether you call it red flags, ganyan, but wala sa report what cost it, ‘di ba? And I think relevant yun kasi kung problema nung contractor, dapat sila nagbayad nung nung repair, kung hindi naman nila kasalanan, dapat gobyerno ang ano, pero wala nga sa report. So I'm not saying kulang, sir, I'm saying it's a good question. So kung nandiyan naman yung tao niyo, prepare na lang po after, no? So Mr. Secretary, I'll give you few minutes for your opening statement and kung sino po ang magbibigay nung ah, who did you assign and uh, if they are ready to give a report, we're all ears po. Thank you, Mr. Secretary.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and good afternoon to everybody present in this uh, hearing. Uh, Mr. Chairman, presing from the late, from the last Senate Blue Ribbon committee and the department's full commitment to this honorable committee's investigation on the causes of the collapse of the third span of the Kabagan Santa Maria Bridge, the DPW, through the special investigation committee which we created, has concluded its fact-finding investigation which was submitted to the honorable committee this morning for the information of the members of the committee. The said fact-finding investigation involved the gathering, collision, review and analysis of various documentation spanning from as early as 2012 up to 2024 and submitted to the DPW Special Investigation Committee by various DPW offices, including DPW regional office number two. From the submitted documentation, the DPW Special Investigation Committee submits that the Kabagan Santa Maria Bridge is the first of its kind locally and internationally due to its nontypical ARC support scheme which involves a suspended deck system. Unfortunately, there was no document submitted to the special investigation committee arriving at the design of the arc trust bridge. This unique design might have caused complications and contributed to the collapse of the bridge.

Um, Mr. Chairman, because of the uniqueness of this design for this particular bridge, it would need accurate detailing of connections, anchorages, elaborate construction methodology and provision of redundant members to reduce the risk of collapse of the suspended deck system. To further complicate the matter, the programs of work for the bridge provided for the construction of the complete span whereas the invitation of the bid only directed segmental construction. In 2014, contract for construction of the bridge was awarded to the contractor RD Interior Jr. Construction. During the construction of the superstructure and owing to the unique design of the bridge, the contractor was constrained to request the DPW to revise the connection of the bottom cords to the arc, considering that the specified connection was technically not doable. The proposed revision was approved for construction by engineers representing the design consultant and the joint venture of United Technologies Consolidated Partnership Consult International and Schema Engineers and Associates. Therefore, as earliest 2017, the concerned project engineer reported the effects of the completed bridge segments. The said project engineer periodically reported to the regional office; the regional office found effects on the completed segments of the bridge structure in the years 2018, 2019 and 2020. These reports were then forwarded to the central office for appropriate action. This prompted the procurement of a third-party consultant, joint venture of Urban Engineers, JF Associates, PTC Engineers Associates and Key Engineers to review the as-built design of the bridge. It should be noted that the third-party consultant was engaged to review as-built of the bridge and not the original design plans. The review, Mr. Chairman, resulted in the procurement of retrofitting works to address the observed effects.

From the above findings of the fact, from the above findings of fact, the DPW submits that severe overloading is the proximate cause of the collapse. While it has been established that the proximate cause of the collapse of the bridge is the passage of overloaded trucks. However, in principle, the bridge may have experienced failure in structural members. But the collapse should have noted; we have been informed that a day prior to the collapse, on February, or on February 26, 2025, the trucks loaded with cargo traversed the bridge. The following day, the very same trucks again traversed the bridge. When it collapsed, we have ascertained the gross vehicle weight of the truck to be at 89.63 met tons, which is well beyond the maximum allowable gross vehicle weight of 45 tons per Republic Act 8794. Thus, the overloading of trucks and the repeated passage induced fatigue in the bridge and may have caused the collapse. To ascertain the cause of the collapse, whether it be induced fatigue or overstress on the structural members, a technical analysis should be resorted to; however, the sensitive nature required appropriate and construction of the collapse. With this, while despite of heavy overloaded dump trucks clearly triggered the collapse of the bridge, the following observations which might be considered as red flags before the completion of the bridge may have affected its structural integrity: 1. Design scheme utilizing a suspended deck system instead of the convention AR bridge scheme; the or deck system is seated on the substructure of the bridge. 2. Introduction of segmental construction without corresponding construction stage analysis. 3. Revision of critical connection, connection details that do not satisfy the requirements for that particular joint. 4. Revision of erection procedures of the arc structure which does not meet the requirement of assembly in erection. AR, together with top cross braces, traverse beams and stringers as one assembly, and observed structural defects during construction, including sheared-off snap bolts on bottom cord and arc connection on at span 8. 5. Movement, tilting of pier 8 and pier A, and multiple occurrences of cracks on concrete arc.

From the foregoing discussions, Mr. Chairman, while DPW was able to ascertain the proximate and contributory causes of the collapse, the department is still unable to determine with certainty at this time which of the decisions relative to the design and construction methods actually led to the disaster. In the submitted report, the department provided recommendations that geared towards maintaining the actual cause of the collapse which involves a comprehensive study to be conducted by an independent consultant with experience in design and construction of projects with similar nature and with expertise in conduct of forensic investigation using state-of-the-art technologies to undertake the following tasks, namely: a. Number one, conduct of ocular and engineering inspection of the collapse span and the remaining spans of the bridge using advanced technologies. b. Interpret and analyze the results of the engineering inspection. c. Evaluate the structural integrity of the entire bridge and d. Provide recommendations whether the bridge may still be restored to its required design capacity per current design standards and specifications through the following: 1. Provision of corresponding engineering interventions that ensure compliance to the current design standards and specifications, or 2. Total replacement of the bridge structure and strengthening the structure. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Sir Secretary, let me start out uh, with what I appreciate kasi while we can all be emotional, we're really trying to find solutions. Ah, first and foremost, to ayusin yung bridge na yan dahil napakaimportante, or kung ire-replace, but two, huwag ng maulit to ever. And uh, I think we will agree naman, ba, that uh, sa criminology kasi it's really not the penalty but the certainty na mahuhuli ka. And I'll ask for your patience that at least in this hearing and next, there were a few very diligent people in DPW, like uh, like Engineer Lingan na he never ano, never let up. Pag tinignan mo yung sa documentation, parati at saka honestly, ang problema siyang hindi na-promote. Meron naman na pirm tinatanggap yung ano ni engineer pero siya na po-promote parati, tapos medyo malabo yung transition nung recommendation. I'll go to that. So, but let me first appreciate. Maganda po iyung summary nung report kasi basically ganun din yyung summary namin, no? Iyung mga problema, etc. But as we all know, uh, the problems and solutions are in the details. I also appreciate that uh, you are honest na you're getting to the proximate cause ah, but yung circumstances at ano talaga. I just want to emphasize that kasi kung hindi bumaksak onong tulay na to, hindi natin nahimay na even before the additional 400 million, the 275, 125, ang dami na palang problema. And even Engineerete in his testimony na nung sinplit yung contract, phase 1, 2, yung sinasabi niyang may bumuka because hindi dapat ganun yung construction. It raises uh, questions, ‘di ba, na for example, iyung designer, should he be part of designing phase one and two? Ah, kasi for me, secretary, ‘di ba, kung binid ng ganon, on one hand, kung mali ang pacing, may kasalanan ang DPWH. Pero on the other hand, kung nag-bid yung contractor, so kung alam mong mali, nag-bid ka ba, hindi ba kasama sa warranty mo? Ba? So there are, I just want to agree with you, there are a couple of questions, but uh, just three questions before we take a 5 minute break. No. Number one, secretary. So this is a preliminary report pa lang. So the committee you formed will continue? Ah, yes, yes, Mr. Chairman. Will they continue or will they pass it off to yung sinabi mong a someone na a designer na international or yung maganda reputation or magjo-joint sila or anong anong plano ng department? Sir, together with our committee, I think we are planning to engage a uh, a separate… Okay, so you'll engage, but you will continue. Yes. Okay. And it's headed by the committee. Yes. Is headed by, headed by Undersecretary Sharln Lapos. Okay. And she is the the woman behind you, ba? Thank you, ma’am, for your report. So she’s head of legal, ba? Tama ba? Yes. Okay. So ah, lawyer from anong law school? From San Beda. So congratulations sa mga taga ah, San Beda. Hindi pa pala tapos panahon iyun nung last administration. Tuloy-tuloy pa rin. No, I appreciate that in a short time ng ganito. But we'll go to that. The second, sir, you can answer technical, you can answer layman. What’s the difference between kasi babalik-balikan natin today, you can answer it or kung sino man ang ah, klaro magpaliwanag. The difference between repair and retrofitting.

Uh, repair to me is actually something that it's very obvious uh, the effect and uh, uh, that has been very obvious na defect, but retrofitting is something that probably would be an additional uh, intervention to uh, to strengthen or make the structure more rigid. So in in our language, see, tama ba ang repair, may nasira, aayusin mo, ang retrofit ah, kailangan i-upgrade or i-strengthen, so ire-retrofit mo. Okay? Ito dictionary meaning lang to ha. Repair: to restore by replacing a part or putting together what is torn or broken; to restore to a sound or healthy state; to make good. No, ang retrofit ah, kasi yung hindi ko makita kung meron sa DPW ng official meaning ng repair, pero ang retrofitting kasi meron eh, sa DPW Department Order 14 series of 2017: retrofitting, a grouping of types of work associated with strengthening, so you mention strengthening of existing structures to comply with the latest standards, usually with the aid of new technology or introduction of new features to old designs, ‘di ba? So tama ba ako, sexo? For example, Guadalupe Bridge, ‘di ba, since it was uh, ah hindi naman natin gigibain ah, but we’re going to strengthen it kasi matagal na and then at the same time, iba na yung bigat nung mga sasakyan, iba na yung traffic. So is is that considered yung gagawin niyo diyan? Is that considered retrofitting? Truly, your honor, I think the the work that we are contemplating for Guadalupe Bridge is to replace the two outer structures with new ones. Okay. So new one na. So but reconstruction po. Any other bridge, for example, it’s 10 years old, labas na sa warranty nung nung contractor. Wala naman naging problema, walang cracks, etc. But because we have heavier trucks and there’s new technology, ah yun yung retrofitting. Yes, sure. Okay. Pero yung halimbawa ah, ginagamit pa ah, pagka-turnover ng contractor pero ah, nagkaroon ng sira, nagkaproblema, nagka-cracks or ah, toos tinignan ng engineers, kailangan ng ah, ayusin yun, yung repair. Yes. Okay. And am I correct that usually pag repair uh, and it’s within the warranty uh, time, sagot dapat nung contractor yon? Ah, within 1 year uh, within one year warranty period and unless it’s a force majeure event, ‘di ba? Unless ah, yun nga, nag-earthquake, nag-tsunami, God forbid any of that, ba. But if nagkaroon ng problema at kailangan i-repair and not attributable to acts of God or to force majeure events, meaning kasalanan ng contractor, siya dapat magbabayad niyan. Yes, sir. Your okay, but retrofitting, especially if it’s new technology, new code, gobyerno magbabayad. Yes, sir. Ano kasi, wala naman sa terms nung nung original contract and bid. Yeah. Yes. Sige, klaruhin natin ‘yun because uh, today, aside from bakit bumaksak ‘yung tulay, I want to go to the uh, retrofitting/repair. Uh, let’s listen lang to urban uh, engineers before we take a 5 minute break. Secretary, with your permission. So basically, tama po ba? Ito po yung naging report niyo, no, sir? Ito yung report niyo, no? And you found ilan? What you call it? What you call it? So you found multiple failures. I mean, your words po. Gamitin niyo yung words niyo, ano yung findings niyo po in general. And then secondly, what cost it?

Okay. Uh, good afternoon uh, Mr. Chair, and sorry, sir, paki-introduce sarili mo. I’ll engineer Adam Abinales, Engineers. Okay. Um, basically, do sa aming ginawang engagement po namin doon sa Kabagan Santa Maria Bridge is based on the condition of the breeze na nagkaroon po siya ng ah, longitudinal displacement nung paggalaw ng peer number 8. Nung pumasok po kami, medyo buo na po yung tulay, but because of that induced in the displacement uh, we did the evaluation of that grease based on that uh, condition that you have the displacement, and because of that nagkaroon po ng mga additional demand stresses doon sa mga members. Sir, klaruhin ko lang ha. Nung in-engage kayo precisely to look at everything and find out kung may defect o wala. Uh, yes. Uh, yes po. But based on the uh, the reports that we received that na nagkaroon po siya ng displacement during construction. May report nga na may mga problema. Opo. But they said they needed an outside opinion kaya kayo kinuha. That’s correct. So in-evaluate po namin yun base po doon sa mga information. And your findings are this. Yes po. Uh, then we did the uh, modeling and analysis of that bridge, the entire bridge, and we found some members uh, in particular, iyung superstructure deck elements as well as the peer na medyo nagkaroon po ng overstressing, quote unquote. Ah, although sa kasi pagka ho na-exceed niya yung supposed to be yung yung sinasabi naming parang reference no, yung benchmark ah, ita-tag ng ifa-flag ng software na fail siya. But hindi naman po ibig sabihin non eh fail total na hindi na po safe structure. You only need to do… Anong causes ng failure? Ah, because hindi po siya nag-comply sa code requirements. Ay, hindi yun ang ano niyo. Hindi yun ang mandate niyo. Wala pang pinag-uusapan until hinire kayo. No one was talking about the code. Ah, ito nasa inyong terms of reference. The consultant shall perform evaluation and analysis of the following reported defects during the construction stage of phase 1 and 2 and extension to identify the possible causes of failure. You know, I’m I want to have a reasonable discussion, but I will hold you in contempt kung ganyan kayo ng ganyan. Nung last hearing, pinapasok niyo yan na code yan ang ano kayo, cause sinabi ko sa inyo, bringing up ko terms of ano niyo, hindi sunod-sunod yung mga failures, yung yung problema kaya kayo hinire, kaya kayo hinire hindi dahil sa code. Hindi kayo hinire dahil 2015 may bagong code. Hinire kayo dahil marami ng nakitang defects. ‘Di ba? O tama ba? Mali. Ah, sir, hindi tama. Mali. Bakit kayo hinire? Dahil sa code, to comply with the code o dahil may nakita ng… Effectival po yung as-built condition po ng asp… because because well, basically po dahil doon po sa… to… there are… may nakita ng defects, ba? May mga nakita pong defects. Bakit napakahirap sabihin non? Sinong pinoprotektahan natin? Tama po sir. Nakita pong defect… ibang… in the end. This will go to sino magbabayad eh, gobyerno o contractor eh. So hindi tayo pwedeng mag-umpisa ng malabo. Op. So huwag niyong sasabihin na kaya kayo hinire dahil sa may code. Ay, hindi naman po kumpleto kami ng dokumento eh. Kaya kayo hinire, may defects eh. Bakit napakahirap sabihin niyo na may defects at tinitignan niyo yung defect? Hindi po sir. Ah, actually naman po, may defects po talaga kami nakita doon sa sa base po doon sa PR. Let’s talk about the terms of reference. Opo. Kaya kayo hinire, sunod-sunod yung nakitang defects. That’s the reason why you were hired. Uh, ah, honor, nung pumasok po kami po, buo na po kasi yung tulay. Kaya nga sinisisi sa tulay… ang tinatanong ko lang umpisa, bakit kayo hinire o hinire kayo dahil may mga defects. Secretary, am I correct? ‘Di ba hinire sila kasi may nakitang defects. O, and that’s why Usek sa Dain said may conflict kung yung contractor magha-hire sa inyo kasi ang titignan niyo yung defects at gawa ng contractor. Kaya sabi ni Usek sa akin, department na lang ang mag-hire. Para nga independent ‘yung ibibigay niyo. Tama po ba? Tama po. Okay. So ang tanong ko lang, ano ‘yung causes of the defect? Ano ‘yung causes of the failures? Sa report niyo? Ito yung report niyo. So sabi niya, software etc. O, was it the design or was it the construction? Ah, ang sa tingin ko po sir… um, hindi sa tingin niyo, anong finding niyo sir? Hindi personal opinyon mo to. Kung ano ang… Pa ba dito, is it the design, is it the construction, or both? Pareho po, both po. So may problema sa design, may problema sa sa construction po. Construction. Okay, ano mga naging problema sa construction, more or less, ano yung major? Well, ah, number one, yun po yung nabanggit doon sa yung pagkaka-facing po nung ah, nung construction, nung gumalaw po yung span na peer number 8. So sir, so tama ‘yung design kung hindi pinacing. Opo. Pero dahil pinacing, ‘yun ‘yung bumuka problema na. Yes, sir. Okay. So ano ang recommendation sir nung kumpanya niyo? Uh, well, dahil na po buo na po ‘yung tulay nung i-model po namin siya ah, considering yung induced displacement doon sa P number 8. And uh, that’s why we have to strengthen or retrofit yung peers, lahat po ng pieces dahil po ah, nagkaroon na po siya ng uh, ng uh, increase in the demand because of that displacement. So Mr. Secretary, malinaw na at that point in time, even before the additional funds, there was a finding already that may problema both sa and saka sa construction. Malinaw yan, sir. I mean, shortcut na lang, you can submit whatever you you you want and we can have a technical working group but so that we can make at that that the right ano uh, conclusion. Sir, was it in your to look at the new bridge code and to recommend uh, whatever to to comply with the new bridge code? Uh, nung pong in-evaluate po namin yung tulay, dahil dalawa ho po kasi yung dinisenyo po siya originally based on the old code ah, yung LFD kung sa amin pong na terminology sa mga structural engineers, dahil lumabas na po yung DG, DGCS volume 5 na 2015, so… Ako na po sir, kailan kayo hinire? Ah, 2020 po. 2020. So limang taon na may bagong code. And I appreciate it sa recommendation niyo. May recommendation kayo to comply with that. Tama yun. Obligasyon niyo yon ah, proactive. Tama kayo doon. Pero hindi yun ang tanong ko. Yes, sir. Ang tanong ko sa niyo, may nakalagay ba doon na tungkol sa new bridge code? Meron o wala? Wala po. Wala. So yun ang dapat sagot. Yes, sir. Wala, pero very good kayo na sinama niyo dahil obligasyon niyo. Yes, sir. Pero kaya importante ‘yung wala kasi nga hindi ‘yun ‘yung reason kung bakit kayo hinire, ‘di ba? Kasi kung ‘yun yung reason eh, ibig sabihin pwedeng walang defect eh. Pero dahil tinitignan natin yung bagong bridge code, gagawin natin. Pero hinire kayo kasi nga sunod-sunod yung defects at tama naman na inyong ah, ni-recommend na meron ito. Yes, sir. Yeah. Mr. Secretary, just a 5 minute uh, break. Thank you very much.

Can I just advise everyone, no? As I said, you know, we don’t want to be emotional. This is a highly charged and emotional issue. Bumaksak yung tulay eh. But let’s let’s answer directly. I’ll give you all the time. I’ll let you explain. Pero huwag natin lituhin na ba’t kayo hinire? Repair ba to? Retrofit… so that we can get to the bottom of uh, of this. This is your chance by the way, ha. Pag pumunta to ng office of the ombudsman, panay papel lang yung explanation niyo dito. You can articulate, you can you can explain. So we just take a 5 minute break. We just suspend for 5 minutes. So K K K… Resume. Fernandez, why don’t you take a seat? Ah, tama ba? Lapus. Lapus, sorry. Usek Lapus. And then um, I apologize, the director general reminded me kanina, lahat po who’s here for the first time uh, I we have to take uh, you have to take the oath para lang on record lahat. Ah, sir, Engineer Analis, were you here last time? Ay, so nakapag-oath ka na? Ah, Director General Rudy Kimbo, those who are here for the first time, kindly stand and for the administration of both. Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth in this proceeding? Thank you. Thank you. You may take your seat. Sir Secretary, since we’re here to get to the bottom of it naman and to get to the truth, I’ll ask my questions. But afterwards, if you other Usex or Usekus wants to ask questions or to clarify anything, let’s do that. Para lang ah, walang nakabitin na question tapos sa media tayo mag-argue. So kung mag-a-argue tayo dito para ano, or not necessarily argue with each other but with some of the resource persons, no. So ma’am RD Malaluan, can I start with you? Ma’am, can you explain the circumstances that led to the retrofit tender? Why was this necessary? Or if you want to give an introduction, what was your role during this time? Ba, already from… of Region 2. From what date to what date? Afternoon, honorable members of the Senate Blue Ribbon Committee.

Especially to Senator Allan Peter Quetano. Ah, bale, I assume the uh, as OIC regional director of DPW region 2 in August 5, 2019. At that time, the construction of the Kabagantaar Bridge, Santa Mariaar Bridge, SP 1 to 12 were already physically completed. The scope of work, the the bridges' extension which is under phase 3, yun lang po yung aking ano, ah, during that time, it was awarded during that time and started on August 20, 2019 and completed on April 16, 2021 as part of my stint as regional director in that region. Let me just clarify that.

So when you became RD, so phase 3 na. PH. But you did receive reports nung mga problema sa phase 1 and two.

Yes po. Ah, actually po, several meetings.

That's okay. Tapos you can I'm not saying ano muna. I'm just saying you were aware of those defects ba. So uh, so take us through it. So what led you to um recommend and then uh ano 'yung circumstances towards the retrofit tender?

Ah, bale, several meetings po were conducted during my stint dahil nga po ah, hindi ma-determine ano iyung actual causes nung nung mga ah noted effects in the in the Arc Bridge. Kaya po ah, nag-ano po ako sa department, nag we nag-ano kami ng several meetings sa department po para nga to determine ano talaga yung real issues regarding this. Let me clarify that. Malinaw naman yyung what are the real issues. So malinaw na naman sa akin na you know there were defects.

Opo.

Okay. Ang hindi malinaw, hindi ma-pinpoint yung kung it is design flaws or or construction flaw. Kaya po ah, that was the yung time na yon naag agrehan po na we will outsource or the third party consultant for the review or assessment of the asbil condition of the bridge po under phase 1 and phase 2.

Okay. So the hiring of uh, urban engineers was not because of the bridge code. It was because of the defects.

Yes. 100%. Yes. Yes. Okay. So, ah, who was designated to prescribe the solutions to the defects and who will check that this prescriptive remedial measured will be carried out?

So, I'll take off from what you said. Sabi niyo nga pabalik ah, it's my words but correct me ha kung the essence or you can replace my words. So bale ang sinasabi mo ma'am, pabalikbalik nga, hindi malaman yung ano nag-cause, ano yung issue. So you hired you recommended na i-hire nga yung urban engineers. Am I correct? Okay. So after you hired them ah, and it was quite ano 'ba kasi nag-pandemic, tapos they were supposed to give it in ah Engineer Binales 4 months ba? Dapat yung original contract was for 4 months 'ba? Tama ba? 4 months but ah, humingi kayo ng extension.

Correct.

So sir, you submitted it within so bale on the 8 8 8 and a/ or 9th month na submit niyo na. So ma'am, after nila ma-submit, who was in charge nga to provide the solutions? Did their report show the defects but they did they also recommend some uh, some remedial measures?

May mga ni-recommend po sila pero at the time po kasi ang nag-contract sa kanila is the department po. Uh, and uh, we will just uh, furnish uh, the the copy of the report. And do nga po natin inano ang ating contractor to undertake the the the uh, the corrective measures. But ang sagot po ng ating contractor ng RDI, considering na part nung recommendations or ginawang plano for the corrections or ah remedial measures ay yung mga gagawin nila. Kaya ang ang ano po ng contractor is ah, ihintayin na 'yung kasi hindi na rin nila alam kung ano yung gagawin eh.

Yes. Hintayin ang ano po ma'am, final.

Yes. So, so after their final report which took 8 and 1/2 months, ah, sino nag-decide nga na mag-retrofit? Sino nag-recommend? Office niyo po?

Bale po dun sa recommendation po kasi doun sa ano sa dun sa ah sa report po ng third party consultant, nabanggit po doon yung upgrading nung ating mga ah components po kasi ang sinasabi nga po na merong merong dapat ayusin, okay, may dapat i-upgrad so because of the defects and the upgrading sa bridge code that led who to do what? Was it your office who who wrote the department na mag-retrofit?

Ah, bale po ah, also yung yung yung yung action na yun was based dun sa clam po nung ating mga tao kasi ah, after the nataon po kasi pandemic, ma'am, can you answer my question muna tapos you can you can explain. So after they gave their report at ikaw na nagsabi their report included certain defects that have to be uh, addressed, it also contained a recommendation to comply with the new bridge code.

Yes. New at that time. I mean relatively.

Tama. Am I correct?

Right. Yes po. So that report was given to the department. May kopya kayo?

Yes.

So whose task was it to uh, to take action from that report? Sa inyo bumaksak 'yun as RD?

Bale ah, we were furnished the copy of the report.

Yes ma'am. But yes or no? So, so nung may report na sino nga ho iyung ano yyung magde-decide at magre-recommend? Yung report ba yun diretso kay Secretary at si Secretary magsasabi kung anong gagawin o sa inyo napunta yung report?

Bale sa sa BOD po yung report.

Yes. So sinabmit sa Bureau of uh, Design then we will then the Bureau of Design met with you or wrote you?

I think we were we were furnish we were uh, your honor, we were parnish of the copy uh, of the whole report of the urban consultant.

Yes. Kasi kayo nag-request eh 'ba si RD Malaluan ang nag-request?

Yes sir. 'Di ba sabi mo ma'am kanina 'ba dahil hindi niyo na malaman yung source, yung issues kaya ni-request niyo.

Ay hindi po namin ni-request kundi ah, during the meetings in the central office yun na po ang naging ano agreement dahil nga

Okay. So regardless who suggested it, bec coming from your testimony ma'am na ang dami ng report, dami ng issues 'ba nasa opisina mo, may mga sulat, nag-meeting kayo dahil hindi niyo na alam yung punot dulo, yung ugat nung issues, nag-meeting ang kasunduan niyo is to hire urban engineers, okay ba to hire a third party a third party then later on it turned out to be

Obviously yung meeting niyo na yon, pagdating ng report kukunin niyo, susuriin niyo yung report kung susundin niyo o hindi. 'Di ba? So, who made that decision na susunduin niyo by retrofitting? Yun yun yung ang pinag-uusapan dito 'ba yung 225? Am I correct?

Ah, Yusek Clapus 233. But am I correct 'ba na because of yung kanilang report and then down the chain nirecommend na mag-retrofitting doun sa 200 uh plus? Tama po ba?

Ah yes your honor. Um, after the final design report was submitted um, based on the records we reviewed, region 2 forwarded to the central office cost estimate as submitted by consultant. 'Yun ma'am kayo nag-forward eh 'di ba? So ang sagot lang sa tanong ko kami 'yun sir. Tama ba? Hindi kasi sayang oras natin ma'am eh humahaba eh. O e ba't hindi niyo lang po sabihin kasi na kayo yun? Yun lang naman tanong ko eh na based doun sa report nila kayo ang nag-recommend 'ba ma'amting retrofitting plans ang consultant po at that time na ang

So sino kausap ng consultant? BOD, office ni Secretary, office ni Secabral o kayo?

Bale ang BOD po kasi ah, ang BOD ang nag-contract sa kanila. O, pero kayo ang sumusulat sa kanila at involve kayo 'ba?

Hindi po kami sumusulat sa kanila. Hindi kayo involved sa an sa sa ano po doun sa third party. Hindi ibig sabihin 'ba so meron na yung urban des may recommendation na sila.

Opo. That project was under your care ba? Ikaw ang responsible official doon. Ikaw ang RD eh.

Yes po. 'di ba? So the next step uh, fell on you.

Yes. So you were writing the different uh, ah offices 'ba? You wrote Pay Yabut. Ah, sorry ah, anong pangalan talaga ni Pay? Ah ni Usek na ngayon. Sorry, I've known him since he was RD kasi ng Metro Manila. So you wrote us uh, Yabot, you wrote uh uh na nag ang hindi mo lang sinulatan si ano eh o 'di ba?

Ah, letter from OIC RD Loreta Malaluan to Secretary Mark Villart, Usek Yabot, Usek Katelina Cabral and Attorney Eduardo Ramos. Mainly includes the cost estimate submitted by the consultant for the proposed attuned measure undertaking the proposed consultancy project ba made for the first time ah ayan ah urba ano undertaken and proposed consultancy service urban engineers, key engineers, PTC engineers, JF Cancho for the construction supervision. Tama ma'am 'ba o so ikaw nga yon po ' 'Di ba? Kasi lahat sila consultants, they have to report. If if I say may consultant ang Senate, kanino ba siya? Consultant ba siya ni Senator Jingoy o Senator Jade? Consultant ba ni 'ba? So consultant ng DPW pero sao nga binigay yung report sa kanilang 'ba?

Hindi bale pinurnish lang po kami, hindi kami ang talagang ah original na na sa amin binigay yung original cup.

Yes ma'am. Pero ikaw ang incharge kaya humingi ka ng meeting sa Sino kasama niyo yung sa meeting nung sinabing nag-decide kayo na kumuha ng consulta? Sinong mga ka-meeting mo non?

Actually si Usek ah Yabot.

Usek Yabot. Oh sino pa kahit kasama niyo non'n ko naman o but basically tama ba ako Usek Yabot that they basically came to you because 'yun nga hindi nila mangyari so ang decisyon niyo to get a third party consultant.

Yes sir. O but at any time did any of you take over the project from region 2?

Wala sir eh. O so tinutul in other words tinutulungan niyo siya na masolusyunan ung problema.

Yes sir. Sir may may I sir go please. I assume hindi kita nakilala kaagad diyan. Thank you sir. Thank you. Salamat sir. Tama ba? Matagal na kitang kilala.

Yes sir. 1998 sir. Sir ah Miay uh, I assume undersecretary ng Luzon Operation except NCR tsaka 4A by virtue of Department Order 113 series of 2018 dated August 2, 2018. Nung mag-report sir ako diyan ang daming reports na nababalitaan ko. But before that sir by Assam siya bilang USEC ng Luzon? Ilaro natin daming uh reports nung mga defects o problema in everything.

Well the status are in general the status primarily iyung defects. And the status showed problems and defects.

Yes sir. Plus the clamor of the LG used to open it. Well nakita ko naman sir talaga one of the engineering wonders has it's understandable.

Yes sir. 'Di ba I mean kung makita ko na 'yung trend gusto ko n gamitin.

Yes sir. Pero that doesn't mean papayagan ng DOT 'di ba?

Correct sir. Mm sir. So although I assume 2018 my first meeting I remember nung pinatawag ko na sir ng mga conod, regional directors, construction, etc. etc. That was November 12, 2019. Easily sir uh, nag-recommend ako to to hire independent third party consultant. Yes. And it's a good recommendation and there's no hidden questions here or hindi ako nanghuhuli as a lawyer. RD sinabi ko na sa inyo kanina yyung intensyon ko. Sinabi ko na na the secretary assured me preliminary yan. They will continue. Ah Lapus is here. Sinabi na ni Secretary ah exact words niya kanina. Ay sorry secretary hindi ko alam yung exact but nalaman niyo yung proximate cause pero susundan niyo pa rin ng ibang causes ba? Oh sorry.

Yeah. So they also get a third party to look into it ang sinabi ko, we will spend this afternoon finding out na after the original 800 paano napunta doun sa additional 400? At yun lang ma'am ang tinatanong ko RD pero nga parang hindi klaro. So after you went to Usek P and nag-meeting kayo may consultant na 'di ba? So bumalik sao iyung bola o and then you started writing them na kailangan nito. Okay. Sino gumawa noun nung 233 na program? Region ah planning. Sinong gumawa non?

Sir, ma'am paggamit ng mic. Ah bale yung estimate po came from the consultant.

Sir, from the consultant. Chineck mo muna bago mo i-forward. Ang pinorward po namin initially ay yung request para ma-include po sa regional budget proposal.

Okay. So ang question ko, chineck mo ba bago mo i-forward o hindi?

Chineck po natin.

Chineck niyo? Okay. So nandun ba yung epoxy injections?

Bale ang nangyari po kasi doon ah I think ma'am answerable naman ng yes or no. Then you can explain kasama ba doon yung epoxy injections yes or no? Yun pong naisama doon kasi eh yung ano na eh yung part na ng ah yung mga naging continuing na po kasi yung ano yung yung yung cracks na hindi nga mad hindi an program. So ma'am napakasimpleng tanong kasama ba o hindi?

Hindi ko hindi ko na matandaan.

Sir Bob kasama hindi ko na. Just tell me ma'am if you don't remember, may there's something about Senate investigations that make people don't remember but that doesn't mean that it's not true. Sometimes you don't remember. So you don't remember.

Hindi ko na puma. Can I refresh your memory?

Okay. May sulat ka pa sa ano 'ba sa contractor na i-implement na nila yung ano y 'yung ah epoxy injection. Naalala mo 'yun?

Opo. O and that was before ni-recommend yung retrofit. O and then contractor sumulat pa kayo 'ba na i saan po yung contractor sa sir sa RD Mr. Interior engineer no? Engineer ho ba architect sorry ah hindi so you're the contractor lang general manager. Sir, sumulat pa kayo 'ba kay RD na ah i-implement niyo ba 'yung ah epoxy injection samantalang kasama naman sa kontrata ng ah retrofit?

Tama. Hindi ko matandaan your honor pero nandito yung engineer ko. Your honor, can you put it on screen? But I'll read it to you ha. December 3, 2021, Mr. Ricardo Interior RD JR Construction or is it RDI?

No. RDI. Yes. Yes. Ah Bunton Highway to Guigarao City. Dear Mr. Interior, furnish is the finding of the third party consultant relative to the final report of project Kabagan Santa Maria Bridge, Kabagan, Isabela. Please take notice of the recommendation of item 4.1. 4.2.1 Immediate implementation for crack repair ceiling. In this regard, you are directed to comply with this recommendation as presented in item 4.1.1 Sealing the cracks using pressurized epoxy injection. Your truly Loreta Meso 4, regional director. So ma'am, do you This is slide 12 guys doun sa nag-o-operate ng ano slide 12 siya. So, do you remember after I read it, ma'am?

Yes po. Okay. Uh, sir Interior, did you remember this? I can show it to you. Pwedengpakita.

Yeah. Pakita mo lang sa kanya. So, do you remember? Or any of your staff, sir? Alam ko naman pagkakumpanya yung iba tumitingin. So, checkin niyo lang kung naalala niyung nakuha niyo yung sulat na. May receive naman eh. Ito ba yung ginawa? Doun muna sa ano sir, do you remember receiving that letter? Or at the least sir, if you don't remember, does the letter na lang namin sa record? Sige. But does it appear to be authentic? Tigan niyo yung stamp diyan. Mukha bang sa inyo? But anyway, ma'am, ikaw na-remember mo. Okay. Ah, slide 12 pwede niyo ipa ayan aan. Pwede niyo ipakita slide 13. Sumulat kayo sir pabalik. Ah kayo nakapirma. Loreta M. Malaluan regional director construction of Kabagan Sta. Maria Bridge and Kabagan Sta Maria Road, Isabela Province. Dear ma'am, dear madam, this refers to your letter this December 3, 2021 regarding the recommendation cited in third party consult report 4.2.1 Immediate implementation for crack repair by ceiling item 628 uh in parenthesises 3 epoxy injection on cracks structural epoxy which applies to the foregoing crack repair was already incorporated in the final contract drawing retrofitting plans submitted by the third party consultant. Hence it would be convenient and practical to wait for the outcome of the beiding process that is now being prepared. Moreover, it may be more appreciable to have the foregoing repair works to be undertaken by the presence of third party consultant which whose services shall be engaged directly to supervise the construction proposed. Thank you. Look forward to your favorable consideration and promp action on this matter. Ricardo Interior. So first question sa'yo, Mr. Interior, sir. Considering may clamor yung local government and consider ang dami ng nakitang problema sa project niyo, I'm not saying kayo may kayo ang may kasalanan pero marami na. Inutusan na kayo na magi-repair yung crack at injectionan. Ang sagot mo sa letter where you get ang sagot niyo sa letter uh we give you a copy mamaya para mahanap niyo. December 3 ang sagot niyo February 11. Tama ho ba yun? So siguro sir nagpasko na nag ah bonifacio day nag ah hindi niyo lang pinaabot ng Valentine's eh. February 11 eh. Kasi parang hinihintay namin your honor yung yung galing sa third party. Oy, ba't hindi niyo sinagot ng December 4 na hinihintay niyo sa third party?

Hindi ko alam sir. What time yung third what date ang third party ay nag-aano na? Iche-check namin yon. Nagche-check. Hindi na. Sino ho ba yung third party na yon? Kayo din sir. So hindi at February, December 2021 may recommendation na kayo?

Yes. Your honor. Ah dahil nga doun sa mga cracks na iyon we we recommended that uh i-epoxy injection yyung mga cracks.

Agree. So anong hinihintay niyong ma'am RD at sir? Anong hinihintay niyo sa third party? Sinabi na nila injectionan. Ang hinihintay niyo 'yung biding.

Hindi your honor. Hindi kasi na kami nafarnisan niyang kwan 'yung Hindi. Ito nakalagay sir oh dahil kasama na daw sa final contract drawing retrofitting. Hindi ba dapat hintay na lang yung biding? Yun ang tapos kayo nanalo sa biding na yon 'ba?

Yes sir. On. Okay, ma'am, sabi niyo ni-review niyo kapagka crack at defect, sino dapat magbayad? Goberno o contractor?

Depende po kung hindi ma'am, simpleng question. Nagkaroon ng crack, may finding sila na defect siya. O sino dapat magbayad? Hindi siya retrofit. Ang ay contractor.

Ang contractor. Pero anong ni-recommend niyo? Goberno magbayad?

Sir, when I requested the a budget for the retrofeiting, ang kino-consider po natin doon ay yung mga ah yun nga yung with regards dun sa upgrading dun sa

So sagutin ko ma'am.

Opo. Ang epoxy ah injection. Ito pressurized. Is that retrofitting or is it repair? It's more of

Ma'am, nanonood lahat ng engineer architect everyone knows the answer to that question. So please do not lie to this question. Is it repair or retrofit?

It's more of a repair. It's not more of a It is repair. It is repair. There's no question about it. It is repair. O yes or no? Sinama niyo sa BOQ yung epoxy ah injection.

Sir, yung Yes or no? Sinama niyo sa BOQ sa retrofeiting. Yes or no?

Bale sir, yun po kasing request ko ay hindi napondohan po nung Hindi. Hindi. Paano mo pa popondohan ang dapat gastusan ng contractor? Yun nga ang issue ma'am eh. Ang tanong ko lang simple, sinama niyo ba sa BOQ o hindi? Isinama? O, so next question ko. Kayo responsible, kayo RD. Dapat ba i-recommend ang dapat bayaran ng contractor na dapat gobyerno ang magbayad? Tama po ba yun? Kayo nag-recommend eh.

Bale ganito po yon. Ah ma'am sagutin niyo tanong ko. So ngayon pag may nakita ako sa new senate building na dapat contractor ang ah magbayad pag ako nag-recommend na gobyerno Senate magbayad hindi ba legitimate na tanungin ako ni Secretary. Senator Allen ikaw head ng accounts yang crack na yan ay nasa warranty pa. Dapat sila nagbayad. Bakit mo pinapapondohan sa DPWH?

Kami po nagpapapondo kami sa DPWH. So kailangan ko reviewhin yung new senate building. Ikaw ang counterpart sa tulay na to. Sao binigay hindi ni-recommend ng ah urban engineers kung sino magbabayad. Ang ni-recommend nila repair at retrofit. Hiniwalay niyo ba ma'am ang retrofit at saka ang repair? Hiniwalay niyo po ba o pinagsama niyo? O 'yun na lang sagutin niyo ma'am. Hiniwalay niyo ba pinagsama niyo?

Bale doun sa initial po natin na request yung 233 million po ay yun po yung binigay na ah cause of ng retrofitting ng consultant.

Ah yes ma'am. Kasi hindi naman nila alam kung ano babayaran ng gobyerno o hindi. Hindi naman nila trabaho yun eh. Ang trabaho nila kung ano ang repair at retrofitting. Ang trabaho ng RD gawin 'yung BOQ ihiwalay 'yung hindi dapat bayaran ng gobyerno at ilagay 'yung babayaran ng gobyerno. Kaya hindi sila tinatanong kayo po, pinagsama niyo ba o hiniwalay niyo 'yung repair at retrofitting?

Bale pinaghiwalay po natin yan.

Paano niyo hiniwalay? Eh kasama nga sa BOQ eh. O sige kunin po natin yung BOQ ngayon. O yung ah or inamin niyo na eh nandun yung ano eh yung epoxy injection eh hindi ba nakasama?

Hindi ko nga po matandaan kaya sinabi niyo na kanina kasama eh. Ito po yung BOQ. O number 21, epoxy injection 687,000. Anong date po ang BQ?

Contract of agreement to. May 24, 2023. Wala na po ako diyan. Hanggang October 2022 lang po.

Hindi ma'am pirmahan na to nung contract eh. Sa inyo nanggaling nga to eh. Kaya nga nung sumulat kayo sa kanila, sinabi niyo sa kanila na injection na nila. Sumulat sila pabalik. Sandali lang kasama na. Gusto din nila makalibre.

Hindi po. Ang sinasabi po ng contractor hindi ka sumagot sa kanila.

Oo sir. Hindi po. Ang sinasabi po ng contractor is kaya po ganon ay hinihintay nila yung engagement ng magsu-supervise po ng construction nung retrofitting. Ma'am, unang-una binasa ko na 'yung sulat nila. O ito sulat nila ha. Uulitin ko po ha. Ayan yung sinasabi mo yung last paragraph ay yung second to the last e pinipili niyo yung pabor sa inyo eh. Morever it would be more appreciate if the foreg will be undertaken with the presence of the third party. Yun ang binabanggit niyo. Binabanggit ko po nandun sa ibabaw oh. Item 6383 epoxy injection which applies to the forgoing crack repair pati siya agre siya repair was already incorporated in the final contract drawing retrofitting plans. Mismong ito lang na ebidensya na to na galing na sa kanya sir sinama niyo sir yung repair sa retrofitting. Ang retrofitting gobyerno dapat magbayad sir. Ang repair kayo dapat magbayad sir. Your honor. So kikita pa kayo sa repair kasi babayaran kayo tapos may tubo pa. Your honor kasi ni-recommend ho nung third party. Ni-recommend nila na i-injection.

Yes. Your honor. Wala silang kilalaman sa recommend kung sino magbabayad. Kasi your honor 'yung cause ho nung crack na 'yon ay dahil sa design flow po. Kaya

O'ag design flow po eh' 'yung designer ang hahabulin ng DPWH hindi ba pwede pong ganon? Your oh, Mr. Abinales, ang rinig ko sa inyo kanina it's because of both the design and construction. Do you stand by that testimony?

Yes sir. O so sir, you're interpreting and design and construction sila. Yung sinabing hinati kaya bumuka. Kayo nag-bid, umoo kayo. So the the smart thing to do was for you to hire the designer nung kinuha niyo yung phase one. Hindi niyo ginawa. So nung nagkaroon ng floss at saka ng defect cargo niyo yun.

Your honor. Kaya nga ho nagkaroon ng retrofeiting. Your honor. No hindi natin pinag-uusapan sir ang repeating eh. Pinag-uusapan natin repair. Repair sir, yung dating design kasi ni-review ng third party sir.

Yes. Sinabi niya it's both design and yung sa sinasabi niyang design kinati kasi hindi yung design per see. Hindi yung design per se. O kasi may dati hong design your honor tapos eh nire-redesign ho nung third party na ibig sabihin yung theesigning of the third party was all was after the first 800 million na may problema.

Sir, ito ma'am February 24, 2022. Sulat ni Heime Catolos Jr. In view of this, may we seek your legal opinion regarding the use of government funds in upgrading and retrofitting this particular project which is still within the liability period and not yet accepted by DPW. Mismong kasama po niyo had the smart enough to write attorney Herid Kevin de Leon, right of way division. Kasama niyo na mamaya makikita mo yung kaa agrees. Bale ah ito yan eh. When I wrote the department January 7, 2021 about the funding for the retroiting, ang premise po natin do is that uh one of the bridges that was selected with regards do sa assessment of the DPW dun sa uh yung major uh uh projects uh bridge projects Ah nag nagano po ng ng ng ito babasahin ko na lang po ah with uh with the implementation of the 215 DGS design guidelines, criteria and standards, the DPW to the Bureau of Design conducted an assessment of some major DPW projects that were designed. 'Wag niyo kabilituhin kasi wala namang question na may review at walang question na kailangan ng retrofit sa 2015. Pero sa kahaba-haba ng sulat niyo doun na lang sa dulo niyo binanggit yung 2015 eh. Lahat ng sulat niyo was the defects in the in the 800 million. Kaya ang question ko, ba't niyo pinagsama 'yung dalawa? Bakit mo hinalo ang dapat bayaran ng contractor sa dapat bayaran ng ah gobyerno? So nandito naman po pala si ano si Attorney de Leon. Sir, you you got this record, sir, this letter, correct?

Yes, sir. Ron. Oo. Ah anong naging impression mo dito sir? Ah uh with respect to that request your honor uh the main issue there was the usage of uh the 100 million release fund uh for the retrofitting of the project because uh ang na-request po una diyan initially yung 233 po na binabanggit po ni RD po yun na fully funded. Ang napunduhan po doon is 100 million but the name of that particular fund is not retrofitting but rather replacement of permanent weak bridge.

Yes. Pero that's why He Katulos, the chief planning and design and chairman ng Bach, nakita na niya na pinaghalo kasi yyung repair at saka yung ah retrofit. Nakita na niya eh. So regardless yung 100 fund kasi hindi pa nagkasya yung 230 plus nag-request ng additional. Hindi yun yung issue. Yung issue hindi pa nga nato-turnover eh. May nakita na ngang problema eh ba. So hindi to case ng prinito sa sariling mantika. Case to na prinito sa sariling mantika. Nag-complain dumagdag pa ng pondo. Siya pa rin

nanalo. Kikita pa siya sa sarili niyang ah dapat ginawa. Ba yung 233 may ano din yun may profit o hindi naman yun purely repair profit pa rin yun ba oh so sa dapat niyang ginawa yung epoxy ba binid niyo pa hindi lang niyo binayaran yung dapat binayaran nila kumita pa siya doon tapos bumaksak pa rin so hindi kayo nagtataka bakit tayo may outrage dito?

RD, pede pong magano na when I requested yung 233 million hindi po kasi napondohan yon ah meron po ah may sumulat po kasi si ano ah oo ma'am hindi issue kasi ko napondo ng hindi ang issue nga ba't niyo sinama yung repair anyway papasa ko kay ah Lapuson so ang tanong ko kay attorney ni Delon because you're here. Sir, member ka rin ng BAC? Yes po. O sa back hindi niyo tinignan kung ano doon ang repair at saka ano or hindi naman standard yun. Tinitignan niyo lang yung binigay sa inyo. Uh we just rely on the program of work uh that is um advertised. So are you an attorney engineer, attorney architect or attorney attorney. So panero kita. Ah but now nalinawan ka ba na pagka-repair contractor magbabayad non retropit gobyerno magbabayad non. Uh there was a discussion before your honor that the rule here uh if there is the effect definitely should be corrected by the contractor. Yes. I'm just saying pag nasa back ka nakalagay retrofit ibi-bid mo yung binigay sayo based on that. Yes sir. Or kasama ba sa back na DPW siguro makakasagot non ' ba. Sino dapat? It's clear to me that as RD should have checked it o after you kanino napunta yun?

Bale yun sa sumunod na pong ah regional director kasi ang participation ko lang po doun sa funding is nung nag-request nga lang nag-request nga po ako doun sa regional ano pa yun ah budget proposal po. Yes ma'am. Pero sa proposal niyo nga sinama niyo eh. But then ah hindi na po ako ang nag-program nung nung nung nung ah isinama nila sa biding. Saan nanggaling yung proposal mo? Bula hindi obviously yung amount na binigay mo nandun yung repair ' ba o. So huwag ka maghugas ng kamay binigay mo doun eh. So kahit na nag-final costing sila later nilagay mo na doun eh. Pero ang ano po natin at the time is ide-determine nga po which is kasi nga po kaya natin sinulatan ng contractor. You don't need to determine at the time. At that time you already knew which one was repair and which one was retrofit. You you never it was at the dulong stage. I will show the timeline nexting. Mr. Secretary from the start hanggang sa dulo pati mga sulat niyo kay Yusek Yabot Yusek Cabral it was only in what date they show? It was only sa dulo that you suddenly mentioned 2015. The the doun niyo lang binanggit yung ano yung retrofit dahil sa bridge code. Lahat ng sulat niyo ay pwede ko itambak ngayon. Lahat ng sulat niyo was about the defects. And even yung ah yung sa urban engineers kahit sinong engineer makikita doon kung ano yung repair at ano yung sandali lang may bagong bridge code ito i-retrofit natin. And even that may nakakalito doon at kailangan niyo pa rin mag-meeting ba. So hindi again secretary iniimbestigan niyo pa bakit bumaksak ba pero intimately related to eh. Bakit tayo pumayag na sunod-sunod na ganon? May I ask the questions yan just for the record. Who knew or did not know about the defects? What slides? Page 5, no? Page 5. Just so that we can put it on the record. Yep, you knew that was defects. You said na sa meetings ba sir. Maam Cabral did you know? Please use the mic. Sorry Mr. Cho. Hindi. Okay. Ah Mr. Attorney Deon, did you know that they were defects? Defects ha? Hindi yung retropit. Yes okay so you have usek you have attorney de leon you have malaluan sir onlyek cabral who did not know but everyone else knew that there were defects pero na-bid pa rin natin iyung repair.

So ang problema so sir siguro nakikita mo ngayon I mean kilala ko sif Cabral kilala ko si I know you more because nagmetro Manila RD ka but that's what my point kung pumutok to at involve sila kahit dumaan lang sa des nila kung prebrentive suspension natin ng 1 week 2 weeks ang tingin ng publiko hinahanap nila so wala naman so far akong nak wala so far Ha? Na-involve kayo na magawa nga 'to. Pero kung meron eh ma'am yung mga USEC little secretaries kayo ang dali niyong sinabit niyo naman lahat to be fair 'di ba? But kita niyo na point ko ngayon na the process ' ba should be as transparent as the findings. What do you want? Sir, bibilugin ko lang para may lead din si Usek Lapus at kayo no. to Chief Catolos and RD Malaluan. You knew that there were a lot of defects in the bridge yet you mention replacement bridge for 150 in 2022 budget proposal. Tama. You knew that there were a lot of defects in the bridge. Yet you mentioned replacement of bridge for 150 million in the 2022 budget proposal. Sa slide 3738 para mas malinaw po. So pakilinaw sa amin yun para maintindihan namin. Nandito ho ba si ano si Mr. Haime Catolos? Sir paki-explain nga to. Ano yan pino-post niyo? Magkano at anong basis niyo? Yung RBP po ng tunin to sir eh. Ah RBP to ma'am hindi ko masyadong makita kasi nung review po namin yung report ni Mr. binalo sir may mga kulang po na quantities po doon one one major uh activity is deconstruction ang trainway syempre both sides ang grainway doon at saka walang mga steel scaffoldings for the retrofitting of the project valid lahat ah kaya ko lang sinasabi yung epoxy injection kasi malinaw yun eh pag may binanggit akong iba, we can all argue ' ba Mr. secretary. Lalo kung mga ibang materials. We can argue if that's for the repair or retrofitting. But babalik tayo dun sa question. Nung ni-recommend niyo 'tong amount na 'to, tinitignan niyo ba diyan kung ano ng retrofitting 2022 budget to? Ibig sabihin insertion ba to o ano to or submission niyo through sa DBM? Was this in your chair one o wala? Submission to central officer. O pero kasama ba to sa chair one o hindi? Chair one sir. Chair one to kung chair one to e ah April o May pa lang nasa DBM na to. ' ba? Hindi kailan ba kayo nagsa-submit ng chair one niyo sa DBF? Opo. Normally historically o mga ganyan. O June o June 2021 pero o Yes sir. At ah hindi incomplete pa ho yun pagka sinasabit namin. So this could have been sa bycam actually. Ayun. Anyway, take a look at it. Ang point ko lang po is that you ask for the amount pero hindi nakahiwalay diyan kung ano ang ah repair at ano ang retrofitting. Hindi natin malalaman to Mr. Secretary kung hindi na na I mean I can say Senate and Congress is equally guilty. I can say you're equally guilty but with Php1 trillion you rely on the on the systems at iyung nasa ilalim to say which one is uh 'di ba? So if there's one blessing about this iyung tulay it's a lesson to us all now to look at the program eh kaya lang kaya doun ako nag-one d talaga ako don ko dinadala sa epoxy injection eh kasi walang magsasabing pangretrofitting yun hindi pang strengthen yun eh ' ba hindi pang enhance yun may mali nga kaya aayusin m ah rd malaluan at any point in time did you recommend na kasuhan yung gumawa nung design at singilin siya ma'am pakigamit 'yung mic pung designer po kung ano man kasi Kasi parating tinuturo ni Mr. Interior yung designer e. Sabi as far as his concern, it's a design flow. So hindi dapat daw siya magbayad. O so simple question lang. Kung DPW sinasabi dapat contractor, contractor sinasabi designer, anong ginawa niyo? Ang ginawa niyo, sige gobyerno na lang magbayad. Parang lugi ata ang taong bayan doon.

Bale at the time po kasi no at any time at anytime before bumaksak yung ano did any of you say na may design flaw dito singilin natin yung designer tulad po ng sabi ni ah ni ni ng consultant natin ni ano na at that time bot po dalawa hindi tayo we cannot tell ano doun ang naging diperensya ng design ano ang naging diperensya sige sundan ko logic niyo Ha? Pag sinabi niyo both yung designer at saka yung construction kung ako nasa inyo ' ba sisingilin ko ngayon yung contractor 'di ba? Tapos depensa na niya na sabihin hindi yung designer eh hindi eh. Sabi nung contractor hindi ah hintayin ko na yung bid doun ko na kukunin yung pang-injection ko. Umuo naman tayo. At alam niya eh may inside info siya eh na 'yung BOQ kasama 'yung injection. Nasa sulat niya eh. So ibig sabihin may inside info siya na isasama na. Sorry Mr. Interior, I don't know your company. So it might be some of your people. Ikaw nakapirma eh. So I mention your name here. Go ahead sir. Yes of course sir. And any meron din kaming nagawa na mga epoxy at our own expense your honor. Yung yung sa Islab your honor. Okay. So let me ask you sir. Are you saying the secretary is wrong na lahat ng epoxy injection is repair? There is no such thing as epoxy for retrofitting. Are you saying the secretary is wrong? Hindi. Hindi. Are you saying all the engineers I've talked to, all the architects I've talked to is wrong? So regardless kasi sir kung may ginawa ka na very good pero obligasyon mo iyon. Yes sir. Kasi may mali kayo eh. Sinasabi ko lang. Ang pinag-uusapan natin dito yung epoxy injection na isinama pa sa retrofeiting na kumita pa tuloy kayo. Oo. Mer so mali niyo na dapat kayo gumastos kumita pa kayo. Hindi. Ang galing naman nung negosyo niyo. Meron kaming ginawa your honor na without expens ho sa gobyerno. Hindi sir. Ito pinag-uusapan sir. Yung 800 million na original may kita kayo doon ' ba? Ano bang kita ngayon ng contractor? 10%. More or less ano bang allowed by law? 10. O assuming sir na you follow the law to the to the spirit and the the spirit and the letter of the law you followed sa 800 million kumita kayo ng more or less 80 million eh. So kasama sa inyong warranty 'yun. So kung may nasira do you repair it. So it doesn't give me any comfort kung sasabihin mo, "Sir, marami kaming ininjection." 'Di ba? Ang punto nasira dinagdagan pa ng 400 million, bumaksak pa rin. Tapos malalaman natin yung 400 million na pala na yon yung parte doon. Hindi ko alam now if it's Php1 or the whole 400 million. Hindi naman pala pang retrofit, pang-repair. Your honor. So may I ask you, sir, paano niyo alam na nasa final contract 'yung ano BOQ? Hindi namin alam yun e. Nasusulat niyo sir eh. Nahintay na lang dahil nandun eh. Paano niyo hindi alam? Yung sa kwan sir, yung sa Pumipirma ka ba sir na hindi mo alam? It's okay. I mean it's your corporate practice pero nasasulat niyo eh. Do you want your assistant to be the one to answer? It's okay with me, sir. Sige, paki-hot lang at saka identify yourself. Go ahead, sir. We're not we want to know the truth here. So kung ikaw makakapagpaliwanag mas mabuti. Your indulgence Mr. Secretary. W first please I'm a global of RDI construction. Do you swear to tell the truth the whole truth? Nothing but the truth in this proceeding. Thank you. Ah so sir, what will I call you sir? Mr. Mr. Balici po. Magno. Balici po. Mr. Mr. Magno. Magno. Yes sir. Sige paki-explain sir. Sa retrofitting po yung sinasabi niyo na kasama yung ah ah repair kasama po sa kwan ni engineer abenales yon kasama po sa sige sir liwanagin natin sir ha they were hired to see what the defects and what caused the defects so sa kanilang findings ito defects tapos sinabi nil by the way may bago ng cod so since may bagong code mas magandang i-retrofit niyo 'di 'Di ba 'yun ang trabaho nila? Yes. Tama. Hanggang doun tama pala yun, sir. Okay. Trabaho ng DPW ipaghiwalay ano yung repair at ano yung retrofit. Hindi naman trabaho ni Mr. Abinales sabihin na ito i-bid niyo, ito sagutin niyo. Hindi. Technical sila po eh. Hindi po sila accountant, hindi po sila consultant ng DPW sa biding. Hindi sila procurement entity consultant. They're an engineering consultant. Ba oh so ang trabaho ng DPW is sabihin sandali lang problema sa construction sagutin niyo 'to. So sir yung epoxy injection ba retropit yun or repair? Ah dahil nakisama sa kwan sa BOQ or let's say doon sa report ni Mr. Binales, we assume na yun ay hindi repair and it's convenient for you to assume because you will make money. No, no sir. No, no, no. Sinabi na dito eh na every single engineer, every single DPW officials will tell you there is no retrofitting na epoxy injection. E nilagay niyo eh. Wait lang sir kasi yung sinabi ni Mr. Abines, O sige sir, baliktarin ko yung tanong ha. Sabi ni Mr. Abinales, meron repair, merong retrofitting. Ikaw magsabi ano yung repair doon? Ah, ang sabi ni Mr. Abinales, merong ah yung construction na doon sa construction failure dahil doon sa facing p facing. Facing lang po kasi may phase 1 to 8 yung phase 1 to dahil sa facing bumuka. Yes. At dahil bumuka, sunod-sunod na 'yung depekto. 'Yun ang kwan ko, boss. Ah uh Mr. Go Ahad, sir. Ah secret eh your own ano O e sige sir, take a deep breath. Nagdi-discuss lang tayo. O tubig muna sir. Pakibigyan nga ng tubig. Okay lang. Okay lang kasi yun ang doon sa time ng ah September 9 2000 18 or 19 there was a presentation done by Mr. Binales tungkol sa retrofating works. So nagkaroon po ng ah presentation at nandon po kung ano yung cause ng ah failure ng ah bridge. At nandoon po doon sa pinapakita ninyo na 935 fails yun po ay dahil doon sa dalawang design pinagkumpara. Yung unang design na ginawa ni ni Mr. Canyete LFD and design na doon sa new code doon sa halos yung 935 nakita niyo po yun doon sa LFT sir sir yung new code retrofit yun kasi upgrade mo sir merong ah doon sa LFD na LFD na ginamit ni Mr. Yete doon sa design niya yun pa rin yung sinasabi ni kwan doon sa report n na yung design ni Canyete failed doon sa kwan doon sa LFD and it cost the cracks syempre sir kasi kung may failure na yung yung ah design and was it because of the design or sir because of the design nagsasabi sila sir tatapusin niyo ha is because of the design per or is it because pinas one and pace 2 rin so meaning sir kung hindi pinas one pinas 2 bubuka ba yun o hindi yung ah ba sinasabi niyo lahat ng problema nag-ugat nung pinuk ko pa rin sir kasi failure na yung kwan e yung you want to answer that ang papunta dito ikaw may kasalanan nung lahat Wait sir, may isa pa akong question sa inyo kasi lumayo tayo. Ang tanong ko lang naman kasi sa inyo hindi yung cost nung bridge. Paano niyo alam na kasama yung epoxy injection doun sa tinatapos na final contract? Nakakuha po kami ng kwan ng ah report. Hindi yung report ang sinasabi lang kailangan anong gawin? Yung final contract 'yun po yung ibi-bid. Hindi nakalagay sa sulat niyo na nakalagay sa report. Ang nakalagay sa sulat niyo total nandun sa ibi-bid out ng DPW. Bakit naming gagawin ngayon? Hintayin na natin yun. Kasi alam namin na galing sa yung pagka-defect ng ah yung cracks na yon galing sa design. To save time. Ma'am Attorney Yusek Lapus hindi ko na titingnan yung time. Kung nakalabas na yung bid documents non then baka natitan na. Kung hindi pa ibig sabihin may inside in po sila doon sa lalabas ' ba. We will digress ng konti uh Mr. Kanete just to give you an opportunity if you want it now or next hearing. Kasi ang topic ko ngayon bakit nahalo yung ah yung repair at saka yung ano. Wala pa namin sa topic today yung bakit bumaksak pero since parang lahat sila sao ngayon tumitingin. Do you want to answer that now or the next time? Parang lumalabas sila kahit na daw hindi splinit palpak daw 'yung design. Design flow eh. So tinagalog ko lang kasi iba yung obsolete, iba yung outdated, iba yung palpak. Yung obsolete ' ba ibig sabihin hindi mo na gagamitin m pero ayos siya when it was to be used. So example, wala ng gumagamit ng bunot ngayon. Baka meron pa pero alam ko wala na 'di ba? Kasi vacuum cleaner na at ah sorry yung floor polisher na ang ginagamit. So obsolot pero magagamit mo pa ang bunot kung gusto mo ba o so yung bunot more outdated than obsolete. Ba kasi you use the word obsolete. E your design is not obsolete. All the other bridges that existed before your design is still being used. It is that hindi na pwede kasi hindi na siya up to code but ang sinasabi nila ngayon all of their defects was because nag-ugat dun sa design niyo. Um okay thank you your honor. Um actually ano eh hindi ko kasi alam lahat ng detalye nung retrofit ah design no ni or yung sa independent check. Now third party pala third party now sinabi niya so pero ang mga nag-stand out sa mga statement niya is yung as built ibig sabihin i-check yung structure based on gumalaw na for doing that to that so anong finding sa asbil bill may mga problema ' ba sila 'yun na 'yung kay sa report niya pero ah design ko kasi is ano eh 12 na arco kumpleto ah so balansyado yun basta ano eh nandun siya tapos yung dulo-dulo noun abatment so may pipigil na lupa doun sa magkabilang dul so Hindi siya supposedly dapat pwedeng itulak. And yung pier 8 kaya naitulak yun dahil nasa gitna na siya ng ilog. Napakataas na nung pier napakadaling itulak nung ano nung pier flexible na yung yung yung poste. Tapos nag-crack. And binanggit naman ni ano e ni Mr. Interior before na yung cracks naman non are actually hindi ganon kaagrabe. Hindi nga siya alarming ano ano I mean it doesn't render the structure useless. But engineer hindi yun yung mga nababasa ko ha. Yung mga yung mga sulat kay RD ni yun ang ni Engineer Lingan. Ako na. Anyway, let's do it this way ha. I will invite the secretary throughek Lapus to make some questions. Isasabay ko sa questions ko sa inyo. Sagutin niyo na lang in writing para hindi tayo pabalik-balik ha. Para maka-close tayo. Dalawa na lang ang gusto kong But anyway, sir, kaya ko lang kita binigyan ng pagkakataon kasi nga 'yun ang direksyon dito eh. Direksyon ni ah Mr. Interior is that hindi dapat siya magbayad kasi designed ' ba. Nag-umpisa tayo dito eh. Kayo talaga sinisisip. Kaya lang napunta doon sa truck napunta sa but anyway ah and engineer si engineer lingan muna sir engineer ah unang-una i you know hindi pa tapos iyung imbestigasyon but I'd like to thank you so far sa what I've seen. Hindi mo tinantan kung ano nakita mo ay ah ni-report mo. Tama po ba? Thank you, chairman. Yes. Yes, chairman. May una kong tanong is may mga sulat ka on paper hindi sinagot ni RD Malaluan. Parang yung isa isang taon bago sagutin eh. So sinasagot ka ba verbally or by text kaya wala lang on record or pag sumusulat ka deadma? Ano anong simulan mo sa una mong sulat tapos anong nangyari po? May nangyari ba sa mga sulat mo o wala? Actually sir eh just just to document it. Ginagawa ko ng sulat but I discuss it to them sa mismo sa verbally because iisang office lang kami. I will I discuss it to them verbally. Pero ginagawa. So you were smart enough to document it paracumented sir. And from the start ano yung nakikita mong problema sa tulay? From the start sir kasi parang parang yung while while on progress yyung constructure na may mga nagka-crack up na defects. Po ay despite na nandun yung palagi nandun si designer on site to supervise it at sinusunod namin lahat yung mga mga approved plans nakaparoon pa rin ng problema na ganyan so I suspect na may design flow sir okay susundan kita ha na despite the fact na nandun yung designer at ginagawa may lumabas na defect okay so you suspected baka ka sa design yes sir so malayo pa wala pa yung earthquak Wala pa sir. Wala pa yung like like yung face yung span span 2 and 3 na nakaroon na ng defect nung nung nag-submit ng revise plan ang ang designer. It is an admission of na mali yung designer nila. Okay. But ang point ko po may defect na at the time. May Yes sir. And dalawa lang ang pwedeng cause nung defect at that time. Either construction or or design. Ni sir kasi at that time wala pa 'yung bagyo, wala pa 'yung earthquake ba? Okay. Kailan una mong narinig 'yung building code kailangan masunod? Inabot mo pa ba 'yun? Hindi na hindi ko maron sian parang wala h ako kasi ako mismo sa dokumento ah siguro se next hearing or padala ko sa inyo. Ang layo na sa timeline bago binanggit yung ano eh yung ah code eh. Oo 'yung code lahat ng ng So you still involved uh engineer nung humihingi na ng pondong pang-repair 'yung ano 'yung Hindi na sir wala na akong ano sir. Sir, you're retired na? Yes sir. Yes sir. Ba't kayo hindi na-promote? I don't know sir. I don't know. Wala wala kang padrino. Wala kang nagawang pabor. Hindi ka lang kilala. Hindi ka nag-apply. Ano ano? No, I mean I you know I love people in government and I think if they're one or two bad eggs, kawawa naman yung hindi ' ba. But reviewing the documents you did your job eh. So So sa tingin mo reflecting back, bakit ka hindi na-promote? Sir, nasa description ng head of office kasi yun sir. So anyway, baka it can just be sir a lesson to all of us. I mean our secretary from the ranks din po kayo 'di ba? From out of the great engineering school, Mapua all the way ba? Yes, sir. Nag-private pa ba kayo SEC or diretso ng DPWH? Diretso sa DPWH. My first careers with DPW. When you retired at you never knew that you will be secretary. No, but you know there may be many more like engineer here. Sir, do you want to add anything else? I cannot promote you but I can honor you. You want to add anything else? Thank you, sir. Thank you for for your acknowledgement of my accomplishment during the time. But I'm sorry po, hindi nakakain, hindi nasasakyan, hindi natitirahan yung papuri ko sayo. But I think uh you know ah it will be part of the report. Yeah, you can clap your hands. Usually hindi pero Oo. I I'm I'm praying hoping wala akong makitang masama pagtatapos ong hearing na ' kasi so far lahat nung sulat mo may isang sulat e. One year bago ka sagutin ni RD. But anyway, baka nga 'yun kasi baka nagkakausap naman kayo. Yes sir. Sir Koa, I also want to thank you but I want to read part of your report sir kasi ano saan yung sir? Can you introduce yourself sir? Ah sir I'm Mr. Benjamin Las audit leader of DPDU regional office number two uh when the projectagan Santa Maria Bridge was implemented from I we audited phase 1 hanggang phase 5 sir sir I want to read it pero I don't want to put words in your mouth. Kayo na magsabi sir from the start or kung in your own word sir anong naging findings o conclusion niyo sir ah firstly on the phase one and two ah we have we have some adverse finding on the implementation of the project uh as mentioned in our abidavit ah our report was uh came from the the technical audit findings came from our engineers from coa by the team of engineerabat and engineer Warner Alvarez then after phase 1 and 2 uh we proceeded to to audit phase 3 but on the phe 3 there was no adverse finding on the phase 4 that pertains to the repair and retrofitting we have another finding on And that finding was also incorporated and mentioned in our uh on the phase 5 we have uh we we requested an audit of phase 5 just lately after the bridge was has collapsed. So our request for audit for technical evaluation on our engineer are still pending in the regional office sir that's all sir sir correct niyo na lang ako. Let's just go through it. Last na naman po kayo. Ah what's 45 slide 45 no sir? Dito sa number three may slide ba sa likod nito? Kita niyo naman sir. Kita niyo naman yan. Review of QAU-RO reports dated August. I'll go to the bottom. Ah revealed that there were noted deficiencies attributed to the construction of the bridge and the recommendations were provided on the necessary rectification to be undertaken by the contractor. So very clear ha koa na nagsasabi nito. By the way, sino pong ano nagbabasa nung COA Report? Ito. Was it the RD or or the ano na R the or the RD? Okay. So, pero since 2023 na to ma'am, wala ka na doon. Okay. Okay. Ito ah. Relative there to inquiry with the QA-ROT members disclosed there was no subsequent reinspection validation conducted since no rectification were undertaken by the contractor. So may recommendation na to rectify they did not rectify sa ito sa kanan in a meeting with the contractor we sought the reason why the latter failed to comply with the recommendation set forth in QAU reports. The contractor opted not to comply with the said recommendation as it is it might complicate the final report of the third party consultants. The final report of the third were finally approved by the CEO which will be the basis for retrofitting.

Works to be bid for the implementation. So let me just give a quick comment here.

Tama, sir. ‘Di ba binasa ko lang naman eh.

Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

Mr. Secretary, in one sense, naintindihan ko yung contractor na sandali pag ni-repair ko ‘yan, baka iba sabihin nung third party. Pero ang hindi ko maintindihan nung nagsalita yung third party, ayaw din naman pala niyang gawin, i-bid na lang daw tapos yung mananalo sa bid ang gagawa. So parang hindi ko tuloy malaman ngayon kung bakit niya ayaw gawin. Ayaw lang niyang bayaran o ayaw niyang mag-complicate, ‘di ba. So just as a lesson for future projects naman po sir, hindi naman umaabot na may third party, ‘di ba. So most projects pag sinabi po ng RD or ng project manager, rectify, ire-rectify na.

Tama, sir. Oo. Okay. Yes, sir.

May comment ka doon sa binasa ko?

Yes, sir. That was the reply of the management to our uh finding, sir. Actually, ah the finding on phase 1 and 2, ah ang sabi po nila yun nga na gagawin na sa sa phase 4 sa retrofitting. That was also the finding of our engineers na parang madodoble. So we put that on our AOM, audit observation memorandum, uh but there was no reply to it by management so we opted to, after again reviewing our report, if there is a necessity for us to disallow that amount, we will disallow, but then our problem yet is the the amount of the Slavance supposed to be was not quantified.

Mm. So we we requested from our engineers to quantify the amount as our basis to issue the notice of this allowance. So sir, tama yung discussion namin kanina na dapat hiniwalay yung repair sa retrofit.

Yes. Yes, sir. Kasi hindi dapat sinama sa kontrata ng gobyerno ‘yung repair.

Yes. Yes, Your Honor. So tama sir, ‘yung nangyari, ayaw nilang gawin kasi hintayin daw third party. Pagdating naman ng third party, sinama naman nila lahat sa retrofit.

Yes, sir. You’re an Okay. So basahin ko lang po dito. But I I really thank you for that kasi malinaw talaga yung sa COA eh.

In March 2023, COA flagged phase 1 and 2 of the bridge and asked why no rectification made by the contractor. Ah sagot, yes, I read it na. No, specifically the audit query asked why no reports evidencing medial measures were submitted to the office of auditor to address the defects noted by PE Lingan, ‘di ba. So ang naging basis din niyo po, that’s why I’m congratulating Engineer Lingan kasi yung yung kanyang reports, dahil in writing, nalaman ng COA, ‘di ba sir kasi kung meetings lang nila, hindi mo naman malalaman eh.

Yes, partly. And of course, later on it was validated by your own uh COA engineer which proves the point that we should invest in technical people in COA, ‘di ba?

Yes, Your Honor.

Okay. Uh actually, Your Honor, every now and then during the implementation of the project uh we have a dialogue with the project engineer regarding the status of the project. Dito ako nababahala eh. But Region 2 answered that the cause of defects were not due to the faulty construction because it was implemented as per plans and specification. So anong ibig sabihin nito sir? Sinabi sa inyo nung Region 2 na hindi faulty ‘yung defects. ‘Yung defects are not due to faulty construction.

Galing po sa DPWH. Yes. So may conclusion na sila non. Wala namang sinubadmit sa amin na report about paki-check na lang sa records kung sino na ang nagsabi from DPWH.

Yes, you are. Kasi am I correct? RD Malaluan, ma’am, ah USE Cabral, USE ah Usek Pipo. Even in your investigation now, doon niyo pa lang tinignan eh. Was there any record that this early in 2023 na na it was a faulty construction, it was not faulty construction? Wala eh. So sino kaya? So sir, paki-check na lang kung pwede sir kasi I want to know why that DPWH official or whoever he is reported that it is not faulty construction kasi gumawa na siya ng conclusion. Ah kung kung alam niyo sir, sabihin niyo na ngayon para ano, yun ang maganda sa mga ka-a eh talagang sir, handa o sir, excuse me sir, ah that reply came from from management during the time of then regional director Reinaldo Councel. Okay, pero sino ho nagsabi non, DPWH or or yung kumpanya? Ah DPWH ang nagsabi, ang nagsabi, but I believe it came from the contractor.

O so that’s a bigger problem because the contractor will always say it’s somebody else. It’s just human nature, ‘di ba. Sinabi ng asawa ko, “Sino kumain nung pagkain dito?” Sasabihin ko agad, “Hindi ako.” I might be I might know. But it’s human nature, bigla ka din then sa kaka-aamin, ‘di ba. Uh I believe that it came from the contractor because every now every time that the they replied to us, management replied to us or everytime we issue an AOM, management always refer the matter to the contractor. Yes. And it doesn’t mean he’s lying. It could be his honest opinion na maganda gawa nila pero ah it’s the designer. That could be your honest opinion, sir. That’s why nga you need someone to say hindi. Pero if DPWH Region 2 already said it’s not faulty construction, they made a judgment na eh wala naman nagdemanda sa designer tapos sa tao kinos, ‘di ba?

Additionally, sir, the COA issued a quality assurance unit report in 2019. No, revealing that there were deficiencies attributable to the construction. But DPWH Region 2 replied that the reason why the contractor failed was it was because it might complicate the final report of consultants because the said report will be the basis of retrofitting.

Tama po ‘to sir, sir, the quality assurance unit report came from not froma but from DPWH. Yes. And doon pa lang sa 2019 report sinasabi nila that ah so sorry, the Region 2 replied that the reason why the contractor failed to comply was not because it was sorry, the COA quality assurance unit report sinubmit lang sa inyo yon, sinubmit lang po ang nagsubmit DPWH sir at ang nakalagay, The reason the contractor failed to comply because they’re waiting.

Yes. To comply with what, sir?

With the repairs. Yes, sir. So pinagtatanggol ng DPWH at that time bakit hindi nila ginagawa ‘yung repairs?

Opo. Again, Sec, I’m not prepared to make a judgment kasi nga may hinihintay naman. So I could go either way but ah nakikita niyo sir yung problema na ano, okay in July 2023 COA issued an audit observation memorandum reminding DPWH that based on the procurement law the contractor should assume full responsibility and be the one to undertake repair works for the deficiencies. Assistant RD Babaran replied to AOM saying that the retrofitting strengthening works are simultaneously being undertaken with the repair works. Is this correct? Tama ho ba sir?

Yes, sir. Sige. If you have to check the record sir, okay lang. Is assistant are the babaran around? Wala na. Ayan. Ma’am, ma’am. Tama ba po ‘to? Naalala niyo po ba ‘to, ma’am?

Oo. Pakiano lang, elaborate lang konti ma’am.

Sorry sir, kaya hindi na na-promote. Pinaalis pa sa upuan. Pasensya ka na sir. Thank you. Such a gentleman. Ma’am, elaborate lang kasi tatapusin na natin dito and I’m sure Yus Lapus will continue naman my question sa internal ano niyo no?

O ma’am, basically may November 10, 2023 letter niyo na nakalagay, due to innumerable defects to be repaired as per finding it requires time to finish the repairs work considering that retrofitting Strengthening works on the bridge are simultaneously undertaken, there with ntheless please be informed the contractor has initially started repairing noted defects. Ano ‘to ma’am?

Ah reply niyo kay auditor Lasam dito. Ito ma’am yung November.

Yes, sir. That’s my uh that’s our reply for their uh AOM dated July 17, 2023. Yes. So you’re saying that they were doing the repairs simultaneously with the retrofit.

Yes, sir. Pero nasama na sa kontrata nung retrofit ‘yung repairs eh.

Ah ganun. So technically you are not lying but actually they were not doing the repairs on their own volition. Tama ba ma’am?

Ay walang ano dito. Tama naman ‘to. But tama din ba ako? Um, I mean factual lang ‘yung sagot mo. But were they doing any repairs that hindi kasama sa ano kontrata ng retrofitting?

Yes, sir. There were, do they were doing repairs like for example meron po yung mga split post na during the time on nag-occur po siya nung after the effect of the earthquake. Nag-split post siya and then there were also cracks on the post na ni-repair, nire-repair din po nila and there was also and and yun ma’am, hindi kasama sa kontrata nung ito.

Hindi po sir. Hindi rin kasama sa additional 100 million o chinarge din nila eventually?

Ah hindi po. Ah wait, ganito po sir, before the before ‘yung kwan kasi the occurrence of the earthquake in 2022 there were there were already a cracks and then um ni-repair po naman nila but then after repairing the cracks po still nag-a-occur pa rin yung ah ah yung defects na yon. So ah duma instead na mag-stop na po sana, nagiging progressive po ‘yung cracks.

Okay. Thank you, ma’am. That that gave us sobrang linaw. So may cracks, ni-repair. Ang problema, sulpot ng sulpot. So possibly ang nakita nung COA hindi ‘yung original na repair but ‘yung other cracks.

Yes, sir. But but you agree ma’am that all of those subsequent cracks hindi retrofit iyon. Repair yun.

Meron. Ganito po sir. Ah for example meron po yung ano yung mga nauna pong cracks that should be that should have been repair. So ni-repair naman po nila. But after repairing po kasi nag-occur despite na despite po na ano na na-repair na po yung mga cracks, nagre-recurve po yung occurrence ng cracks. And was that because of design or po for construction?

Uh you don’t know. I think sir uh honestly, honestly you don’t know or it’s not within your purview? It’s it’s not within my purview sir kasi there there was already a question on on kung ano ba ‘yung ‘yung cause ng defects. Like for example in spanse 2 and 3 nag-curve na po yung mga cracks na iyon sa spanse 2 and 3. That was that’s more than enough ma’am. But I go back to my point, ‘di ba na you cannot determine sino magbabayad unless you determine ano ‘yung cause. Yun pong mga unang na crack sir that should that should have been uh prepared at the expense of the contractor because you determined that it was due to their construction.

Hindi hindi pa naman namin ma-determine sir na it was due to the construction but it occurred, no, simple lang ha, tatlo lang ‘yung cost, ‘di ba, may fortuitous event which in case depende sa nalagay sa kontrata, if the contrata says a fortuitous event, walang magbabayad, ‘di ba, okay, the other one is poor construction, pag poor construction yung contractor, ‘di ba, pag design flaw, hindi pa rin Republic of the Philippines. Dapat dapat demandahin ‘yung ‘yung designer or kung ia-advance ng gobyerno then ide-demandin mo ‘yung designer. Pero kung yung design tinanggap nung contractor, walang liability yung contractor. So if I designed if I got an architect and then kinuha ko ‘yung contractor and sinupervise, I paid the contractor his ano ba 1% or between 1 to 10%, I pray the contractor ah bumaksak yung isang floor, walang liability yung contractor, walang earthquake, walang tsunami, walang, ‘di ba? Kasi akala ko pag nag-bid ka, tinignan mo rin ‘yung ano ‘yung design. I do understand, bagong design, ibang design to. That’s why nga ba may ratings yung contractors kung triple A etc. kasi there are certain designs and certain amounts. Amount lang ba sir yung triple A o pati yung capability?

Capability din sir ba o yeah, capability, experience is not only the amount, that’s precisely why you get a certain level of contractors because ‘yung certain level either inexperienced or they don’t have the capability to to do that. Anyway, ma’am, sorry napa-ito lang naman yung ipapasagot ko sa inyo eh na na sumulat kayo pabalik sa COA na due to innumerable defects, innumerable means sobrang dami na, ‘di ba?

Oo. To be repaired as per findings. Kaninong findings per ma’am to as at this time the findings of the COA sir.

COA. Okay, it is it requires time to finish the repair works. Considering retrofitting strength on are simultaneously undertaken. So ma’am, I don’t know kung kaya nung technical working will endeavor but I think pareho tayo ng task. Ihiwalay kung ano yung ginawa nila on their own na repair at hindi chinarge. At ano yung chinarge pero repair versus pag hindi natin to ginawa magiging modus to sa ibang mga DPWH projects. So sir sa COA sir, do you want to add anything and again thank you for your work ha.

Ah no more this moment. Ah you’re not on. Sige I’ll I’ll just read your sa final report niyo September 5, 2024. Ah last paragraph. Prepared by Warner Alvarez, checked by Randolf Sumabat, reviewed by Pancio Pascal. It was noted that the previous reported defects like multiple cracks on various decks, lab arches and concrete railings, warp diagonal wind bracing and deteriorated premold fillers and the increasing gap of extension joints were corrected but as pay items in this contract. Yes. Tama sir no?

Yes, sir. Ronal. And tama ba ‘yung I’m not sure kasi kung layman’s language ‘to or may COA language. Yung sinabing but as pay items meaning may question nga. Ba’t niyo sinama sa pay to?

Yes, sir, Ronor. Parang nadoble na ah the the defects on the phase 1 and 2 was again included on phase 4 on the retrofitting. Yun ang finding po ng engineers namin. That’s why we issued an audit observation memorandum on that regard. Yanon. I won’t read na everything but meron ka dito, the project was 94.70% completed instead of 94.53 53 yan uh as submitted statement of work uh the quantity item of 416 is overstated, the total area verified is only 873 s m instead of 971 s m per statement of work accomplished with an overstated area of 100 s me amounting to almost Php1 million. So hindi na to design ba?

Yes, sir. Construction na to eh. That was the finding of our technical inspector which he is now present at this time. May we request that she’ll be will that he will explain. Yeah. Dahil nandiyan naman siya.

Mr. Secretary, 5 minutes will we will complete with this. No. Yeah. Go ahead please sir.

Ah engineer is I’ll call you right after. Engineer Sumabat, Honor. Sige. Engineer Sumabat. Thank you, sir. Good afternoon, Your Honor. Good afternoon. Yung findings po namin na yan ah parang overstated lang po dun sa sinubmit nila na na partial yung SWA na 94 94%. Yun lang po yung kwan na yan sir kasi nung sinukat namin yun po yung kulang na quantities. M pero ang sagot po nung nung engineer known sir e ang sabi eh sa phase 5 na raw yung iba na na retrofitting sir.

Oo. But sir, pagka bayad na yon hindi mo pwede ipasa doon.

Yes, sir. Kasi kumbaga yung phase 4 mo, kumita ka na nga doon sa repair nung isa, may phase 5 kikita ka na.

Yes, sir. ‘Di ba? But but the point I want to make is it seems small, ‘di ba? Php1 million compared to 1.2 billion se. Pero kung if we have 1,000 projects and 1 million each, that’s a billion, ‘di ba? So that’s why it’s very important the work you’re doing na talagang tinitignan niyo as to specs, no’no.

Yes. So sir, sa last na lang no’no. So pagka ganun na may findings kayo tapos na-verify ng ah DPWH, ang obligasyon nung department is kung may withholding pa hindi bayaran. Tama ba?

Yeah. Ah ‘di ba kasi COA does not have that power naman to you don’t ano eh file cases eh, ‘di ba? Tama ba auditor?

Ah yes sir, Ronor. It will be we will issue a notice of this allowance. Once we issued notice of this allowance, management will deduct from whatever is due. For example sir, may nakita siya na may tumali 1 million yung cost at hindi pa naman bayad. Yeah, they will they will or lahat ong pinag-uusapan natin by the time it gets to you, bayad na. Meron pa naman nare-retain. Hindi pa. Meron pang mga na-retain na na-claim ang contractor. So that will be the time that management will deduct. And when you say management sir, the responsible officer sa DPWH.

Yes, you’re okay. And obligasyon nila yun to make sure nga na kasi hindi naman perfect din yung science nung construction. It could happen na hindi sadya na may Tama po ba?

Yes sir, R. Pero hindi dapat bayaran yon kung less ang quantity na ginamit, ‘di ba.

Yes, sir. Oo. Thank you sir. Yeah. Ah I’ll I’ll recognize muna Usecis then I’ll recognize you uh sir interior.

Yes, sir. Uh I’m Raul Asis, former Undersecretary in charge of all the bureaus. So I’d like to just make a clarification sa mga plano during the stages of construction. You start with the original plan. This was prepared by the contractor, a consultant and approved by the department. That is used, the original plan is used actually for bidding purposes so that the contractors who would bid would have a basis, an intelligent basis for coming up with their own bid prices. Okay, after that the contractor should do a survey to come up with as-state plants. The as-plants becomes the guide for construction. Why do you do that? To suit actual field conditions which were not present during the time that it was serving due for the original. Couns the third yung as-built plants. So Engineer Adam Devaluation ang benchmark niya is the as-built plants. You do as-built plants because there could have been, more often than not, there are deviations made by the contractor whether approved or not by the department. Deviations from the as-state plants ba kaya lumalabas yung as-built plants, the as-built plants becomes one of the documents for final payment for so in this case Engineer Abinales was tasked no to find the cause of failure on the basis of the as-built plant so you could not say that is primarily due to a flaw design. That would be unfair because he did not. Ang benchmark niya is not the original plan but the plans which could have been uh which could have deviated in one way or another from the original plan. Okay. It would also be unfair if the consultant used the old the new the new code to evaluate it. It should have been evaluated against the code at the time of the original design. So ganun nangyari. So on that basis gumawa siya ng retrofitting plants. That is the fourth plan. Bumaksak yung tulay, it was a retrofitted plan and being able to pinpoint kung sino responsible becomes more complex no, you’re talking of the original, the state plants, ‘yung as-built plants and the retrofitted plants. Kung kung ang babasy pa ni Engineer Adam eh ‘yung current code ni More is some fair doon sa designer, ‘di ba? Ah nagkataon lang na nilagay yun kaya nagsama yung yung yung kasing epoxy against the original plan yun eh. Tapos itong retrofitting mo against yung as-built plans na. I just want to make that clarification kasi mahirap dito sabihin eh. Sino talaga yung may kasalanan? But to say it’s purely based on the design, unfair, no? Kasi hindi mo bine-benchmark yun eh. There was no way for you to benchmark your findings against the original plan or as the stake plan.

Thank you, Ronard. Well, first of all, sir, I’m grateful that you um made that statement. Ah malinaw po. Malinaw. At two questions lang, sir. Yung at-stake. At-stake ba? Tama. At-stake, ‘yung as-state um plans. Paano sir, pagka ‘yung nanalo ka na ng bid tapos nung sinurvey mo nga ‘yung on the ground malayo then you go back for more money or you so ah usually hindi ah kasi yung ah when you do an estimate ang standard yan, meron kang plus or 10% plus or minus 10% allowance so unless something happened to that ground that it was flooded or nagka-earthquake, it should be okay. Hindi kung force major pwedeng humingi ho ng dagdag.

Yes. Yes. But unless by force major you’re at at-stake. Stick at stick. And that is kung minsan kung walang pagbabago naman doon sa suit conditions, the original plan could be the as-plan.

Yes. And secondly ho, I’m not disagreeing. It’s not a question. I agree it’s very difficult to find out uh who was at fault. Ang point ko lang, you don’t add a 400 million kung meron ka ng nakita na 900 defects o grad without finding who’s at fault. And even if you have to para magamit yung bridge, ihiwalay mo yung repair sa retrofit ba. I mean, you’re not disputing that. I’m just clarifying that from our point of view. And then this I agree with you again na despite all of this, bumaksak pa rin. Go, go ahead sir if you wanna.

Wala ah. Yeah. Yun ang sinasabi before I ask Attorney Engineerales to answer in October 2023 you did ask ano ito, Engineer Abinales, construction supervision consultant instructed instructed PPM to include the as-stake plans and the retrofitting works of bottom chord span 124 and span 12 that we’re not including in the retrofitting and strengthening plans. But tama ho ba na ah as-built ‘yung naging basis niyo o tinignan niyo rin ‘yung original plans?

Ah hindi lang po yung as-built plans na tiningnan namin pati po yung original plans po. But did you do that on your own volition or sa terms nandoon?

Ah I have to I have to examine both documents po para makita ko lang po. Let’s examine kasi kung wala ‘yung original sa una then mistake ng DPWH and we should correct that in future kasi tama naman ‘yung sinabi ni engineer ni former Usek, ‘di ba na you have to but you actually looked at the original plan.

Exactly. At kaya niyo nakita yung sinabi niyong nung hinati bumuka.

Yes, sir. O I don’t know if you want to give an opinion there uh you kasi yun nga yung problema ko. Kung sasabihin nilang the plans were solid but nung phase 1 phase 2 and when you make it that way bubuka. Therefore, hindi daw kasalanan ni uh Engineer Canyete because he You want to explain that para if anyone Let’s close with that. Explain that then if anyone wants to comment hindi we will design ko ano ah monolithic or nakakabit yung arches sa pierce. So ano yun? So parang may frame ka 12 spans. Ah ang design ko 12 spans na 12 na arco tapos restrain siya sa dulo-dulo ng abatment. Ang ginawa nila is nag-phase one sila. Span eight spans lang. Span one up after span 8. Pagdating sa span 8, nasa gitna ka na ng ilog. Kasi yung first four spans nasa lupa eh. Nasa lupa. Buti na lang span 3 yung nag-collapse sa hindi sa tubig bumagsak kundi baka may namatay. Yung span 8 ah yung pier 8 na nag-aano ng nagdadala nung arch number 8. Ah okay pa siya nung kinonstruct yung pier, nilagay yung arco, nilagay yung steel floor system. Pero nung binuhusan na yung concrete deck kasi yung floor system bakal eh so magaan lang siya. Pagbuhos nung concrete deck nagano na nag na-transfer na yung load doon sa arko eh. ‘Yung arch number 8 walang kadugtong na archine kasi dapat kumpleto eh. So dapat pipigilan siya nung arch 9 nung ang arco kasi kapag nilagyan mo ng load bubuka ‘yun eh. Bubuka siya eh. Yung pier 8 nasa gitna ng ilog, napakataas na. Yun na yung pinakamataas kong columns. So slender na siya. Madali na siyang itulak. Mathematically ang slenderness is proportional to L cube cube ng ano ng height. So very slender talaga yun compared sa nasa pier one pier two on I think the contractor wants to comment muna sir, secretary muna.

Yes, sir. Just one comment lang. Engineer Canyete, in your detail engineering design did you prescribe a construction methodology for the entire structure? For the entire structure ang for the entire structure basically ang ano ko is ano did you did you put into your detail engineering design which is required in any detail engineering design a construction methodology so let let me answer. Yes. Okay. I was required to do a methodology and my focus with the methodology was uh ang methodology kasi is to aid the contractor eh sa construction. Ang focus ko is ano what’s the difficult part sa ano sa pag-construct ng nung complicated na tulay ko ang ano is yung yung steel na part hindi na so my methodology was focused on that I will adopt the question lang ni secretary for the record no so ang answer mo is yes pero doon naka-focus naka-focus ako sa kasi ang tanong niya did you so you did you yeah Oo. Pero ang focus mo doon Oo. Sa bakal. So meaning yung in-explain mo ngayon na dapat sabay-sabay wala doon yon.

Yeah. Oo. Okay. Ang question ko lang sir, just to follow your logic, dapat ba nandun yun if he didn’t assume naman na may phase 1, phase 2? Considering your honor that this is a very unique design. This is the first this is the first structure ever designed in the Philippines or anywhere else. We have been trying to look internationally whether this has been adopted. We have not found anything like this. Pero pag ganon sex, sino nag-yes sa design? Kasi when I ask halimbawa Yek, I said ang ganda naman ng San Juan Nico and and sabi nila yes pero iba ‘yung design. H kung yung ganda lang we can also do other na maganda design but was it a senator, a governor, a congressman, a mayor, a Usek o he said na o magandang design nito kunin natin or ano, wala, it’s more of sinong magde-design then yung design niya tali na tayo, I don’t really know, go Your Honor, pwede akong mag of course magtanong ng clarification na Mr. Chairman tapos I will ask just for your order. Gusto ko lang ma-clarify kung ano ibig sabihin ng unique kasi kung yung arts bridge na may mga cables or

Ano, or hangers yung Bamban Bridge sa MacArthur Highway? Matagal na yun eh. Yeah. But ano, engineer, ikaw din nagsabi nung unang hearing na medyo iba ang design, first in the Philippines. Naalin? Sabi niyo po nung first hearing, “ba medyo bago ang design. First time gagawin sa DPWH.” Ah, okay. Pero siguro yun nga ang gusto kong maliwanag sa kanila kung ano ibig sabihin ng unique. Bakit siya hindi? Kasi hindi siya conventional. Hindi siya convensional. Unique meaning wala silang iba pang ginawa na the same. Tama ba, sir?

Yes. Mayroon Bambam Bridge. DPWH din ‘yun eh.

Exactly the same design.

Hindi. Arco, arts system.

Yeah. Ano yung ibig sabihin nung ano? Bam Bridge is a basket type?

Yeah. But it’s still an arts na meron kang ano, basket, baskete. One single art. Hindi ito yung komplikado na multiple arts. Okay. So ano, sundan ko lang tanong: different system, may difference? Okay. Thank you, Secretary. I just—I sorry, I want to thank the Secretary for the clarification kung ano ibig sabihin nung—for that lang, bilugin lang natin Sec para umuwi tayong medyo ano.

So, assuming wala nga sa kanyang methodology yung tapos, hinati, ginawang Phase 1 and 2. Pag may nag-bid and then pag construct, nagkamali, may obligasyon din ba iyung contractor when he bid to know that or he’s just relying sa methodology nung designer? I don’t know. This is an honest question kasi nga ah, in our country, nagfe-phase one, two talaga tayo to maximize the funds in the in the year eh ‘ba kasi usually yung Phase 1 natin, yun kaya mo lang i-absorb that year ‘ba? So, but kasi hindi naman tayo multi-year budget eh. Well, we have a couple of multiyear pero hindi o—or we’ve never encountered kasi na 1 Phase 2 nagkaproblema kaya wala tayong rule. Do we have a rule regarding that? Wala, wala. Wala naman. R, paki-research na lang, companera kung meron nga o. No, kasi my assumption is—I see the point ‘ba? If it’s a different design, bago, and problema design. Pero kung sinasabi walang problema yung design, ang problema win 23 mo Phase 1, 2, 3—not win 23. Pinas 1, Pinas 2, Pinas 3. And when you do that, it affects the construction. So kung ako contractor, why didn’t you tell me? Pero on the other hand, kung ako DPWH, nag-bid ka eh.

Mm. Is it your—is it one point in time that you said eachan is a standalone, stand alone, unique—I mean, sorry, stand alone, simply supported, simply supported span that you can—you can do span anytime you want? Hindi siya sir ano—ano siya monolytic yung arts with the pier. So parang continuous frame siya.

Continuous frame siya. But check again ha para hindi na humaba yung discussion today at ipapasok ko sa inyo.

In March 2019, yung Bureau of Design quoting then engineer—ete was saying that as for analysis, computation of engineer—ete, the top column displayed PR will be reversed to -7 mm and C/D ratio will be 1.1 and considered safe. Tapos based on his conclusion and recommendation with a model completed structure, seismic loading, Pierre column is still safe for retrofitting and still safe and retrofitting not necessary. Quoting you, and then may sulat iyung company na you’re not speaking for them, then later on may sulat ka na hindi official iyung engagement mo kaya gumugulo. But I’m saying in the middle of it, meron nagco-quote sa’yo na hindi ganun yung problema. So medyo ang pinag-uusapan natin dito lahat are all hindsight eh ‘di ba?

Yes, your honor. And ano, I’m usually notified kapag may problema na and yun yung what happened sa Pier 8 yan ah, after several years na nagco-contract big. What point in time did you theorize or discover or—nung nakita ko na iyung Pier na ano yung ano yung nung tinulak na niya yung mali yung—na mali na—na ito’y pinas kaya bumuka, was that na nung—nung ini-inform na nila ako tapos pin—tapos pumunta ako doon tapos nakita ko, syempre itutulak niya—to, tinulak niya pero hindi—hindi siya alarming eh, but they were quoting you here na hindi nga kailangan ng retrofitting.

Oo. Kasi maliit lang yung cracks. Hindi naman siya alarming. Okay. So we’ll stop there because hindi naman natin matatapos ‘di ba? And kung hindi bumaksak—ah, is pantry your honor—yung bumaksak.

Yes. Yes. I’m—I’m talking in general. I’m not talking engineering terms. I’m talking ano ah, sanay ang Pilipinong mabaha. Sanay tayong malubak. Pero yung bumaksak ang building o bumaksak ang tulay is outrageous ‘ba? And we all agree that we—we should do something about it. So everyone, I honored and congratulated. Thank you very much. Uh uh uh Asis, thank you very much. I really—the word I was looking for: intervention. I appreciate your intervention. I’m not an engineer. Uh, but this has to be explained. So maybe when the other senators are available, investigation, maybe I ask if—if advantageous, let’s have a joint technical working group. Ibig sabihin hindi tayo pero yes, and the right questions and the right documents para yes, yes. Well, dear honor, I think my predicament is actually that I have uh—well uh—the President is awaiting actually how we can move forward naman ah, Secretary. Even yung 400 million eh wala naman akong naging problema non kung sinabing gagastos yung to ng gobyerno because 1, 2, 3 pero sisingilin natin to or hahabulin ‘ba? So meaning if you have a finding na—na hindi talaga pwede new const or retrofit whatever, I as chairman, I cannot speak for the members but as a subcommittee chair—no, the chairperson is really Senator Pia of the committee. I have no objections naman na kasi ang corruption is—ah, kinorrupt mo, hiningan mo, binawasan mo. Pero ang graft is iyung inefficiency. So pag hindi natin inayos iyan, we might not be guilty of corruption. Wala naman tayong hiningi sa lahat ng to in this investigation. But if we do not fix it or come up with a solution, that’s graft because we—we were inefficient. So on that point man, Secretary, I think aligned naman tayo with Malakanyang na come up with a solution. And if it’s—if the—the fastest is—nangyari na yun by the way sir, may isang administrasyon hindi ginagawa yung road like C6 kasi yung contractor butas-butas. So pag-over nung isang administrasyon inano na to, sinabi niya, “ed habulin na lang yun.” So I think you’re—you’re—you will have the proper legal advice. But finding who was—I’ll—I’ll really stop at this ‘ba. Ulit-ulitin ko yung findings natin sa criminology because it is in line with biblical principles. No, ang sabi sa criminology, it is not the uh amount of jail time or the gravity of the penalty. It is the certainty that if—that you will get caught and you will be punished. Which is the same if you read the book of—of Romans, it’s not enough that government promote good. They have to incentivize yung gumawa ng good and punish those who did bad. It works eh. It’s a—anong itatanim mo yan ang aanuhin mo. If those people who do bad get promoted, get rich, get uh become politicians, then they will do that ‘ba. So but anyway, thank you very much to the upper echelons and everyone from DPWH. Sa lahat ng nag-travel from uh Region 2 and pati yung mga retired, maraming salamat. And then yun nga sir, kung meron kayong napansin dito na gusto niyong sakitin, you can do it on writing no? So we will suspend the hearing and I’ll uh—I’ll probably not have a hearing muna. We can do the technical working group and wait for the other senators after the midterm election. So thank you very much. God bless you. Uh, the hearing is hereby suspended.