Transcription
If you want to understand what NPD is at its core, it's just like one day you decide after growing up so [ __ ] like with your past self being so [ __ ] worthless, ugly, cringy. No one wanted them. They had to sit there and watch other people laugh and have fun and date. You're just like, you know what? [ __ ] this. I don't want to be this person anymore. I'm going to totally be somebody else. It's over. Like, you know, there were there was a moment where I just decided like, I'm done. You know, I'm just going to be somebody else now. And I worked really hard at that. And I worked really hard to cover all of that [ __ ] up. And I thought to myself, if I become perfect, if I become somebody else completely, I will never have to worry again about feeling shame like I did about feeling like >> cuz how could somebody shame somebody? >> So, you essentially tried to like rebuild yourself or like rebrand, >> dare I say, yourself so that you had no connection. my past to any anyone who >> was kind of bullied or mocked or >> not just that like I think that well it's just there's more but like they were just the worst. I I genuinely believe they were just [ __ ] worthless and I still believe that. But the thing is um I do believe I succeeded in like um it [ __ ] up my identity but like I succeeded in like replacing myself in a way cuz I didn't want to be that person.
>> [ __ ] me up. So So is the person that you've replaced that old self with >> me right now? >> It's you right now. >> Yeah. But like you me right now >> keep going. Well, that's also complicated because I went through phases and [ __ ] and like what were you going to say? >> I was wondering if the you that you replaced the past you with feels to be the authentic you or you feel that that's like a hologram of the >> what the [ __ ] I am anymore. I'm going to be honest like as a sense of self I'm so totally [ __ ] Like I part of my ego death was realizing that like I'm so fragmented now. Like I don't know what I am inside internally anymore. there's no congruent there's no coherent sense of self in there. So, like that stresses me out. And like part of healing is like going back and repairing that [ __ ] and like growing cuz like um when I had my ego death, I was like ejected from my ego cuz that's the definition of that. And like that was psychedelics and I felt since I could no longer live in my ego state, I fell back into like the rest of the fragments that I was repressing and those were so underdeveloped. It was scary. Like I felt like I was suddenly viewing the world out of like a broken mirror and like it was I dissociated because I was so scared and like things didn't feel I almost like lost coherency if that makes sense. It was scary. And that was like right after that that was three years ago.
>> And the broken fragments that you fell back into that you're that you referenced were those like the fragments of the past self? Like what are those? What are those? >> I don't know. I'm still trying to figure it out. I don't know. Um, like I I've tried to map out my sense of self now and stuff like I have different pieces of me >> where I'm like I call my ego sometimes it's like I imagine it as like a the dictator like inside me and then there's like another piece of me that's like the observer which is the one I'm in right now like that self state where I'm like it's based on like um it's a piece of me that was super undeveloped that I think grew because I lived in it for a long time after my ego death because I couldn't get back into my like My ego was just >> and what would you define? You did you did give a picture of your ego death. But what is your ego? I that's I want can you likely identif the the place that I you put what you put energy into is what grows, right? So I put so much energy into self-presentation. I would copy celebrities because >> so the ego is the sort of covered self or the false self or it's the thing that is the external presentation. >> I've heard I don't think there's such a thing as a false self. I think that like I think that uh there's different like self states that people can get into and like for me ego is like what you your outside what you work on >> but like I worked on that so much that that was all I had. I didn't develop any of the inner >> I remember even being four years old and like my identity was already [ __ ] up. Like I would I would like look up at teachers and like I would be like I wish I were them because like they seem so strong and like like they had a personality and like powerful. And I'm still trying to understand why why I was already like that at age four. And like it just got worse from there. And like so my ego is like a cover up for those fragmented empty feelings. And it's like it's something that I feel like I had to develop where like you know how I mentioned like replacing the self. How do you do that, right? How does one even do that? Because like you're you know, you have to in order to be somebody else, you kind of have to just like [ __ ] like repress the old um traits or mannerisms of who you were and replace them. But what do you replace it with? Like for me, I I uh I became obsessed with like a celebrity when I was around 17 and I am still sometimes I still go back to her videos. It's less so. But I >> Who is would you say >> I'm never No, never say. >> No, not right now. Um but like I would like literally watch I remember I found her one day when I was >> to like fashion yourself after her. >> Yes. Because well cuz like the thing is if you can imagine like a child just sitting in their bedroom feeling worthless, ugly, disgusting and then they see this video of this girl and she seems perfect. Like she seems the definition of perfection. And from that moment like an obsession develops where like you want to be her like you want to be just like her because she's admired. She's loved and you want you want that, you know, you want that.
>> So, you think that that's what you need to have them. >> Well, of course. Well, it was true. Nobody loved my past self. Nobody [ __ ] admired them cuz they weren't good enough. They were never good enough. And I was determined to become good enough. And like in a lot of ways I have like um and that's the thing like I had to work for that though. And I'm always going to be bitter about that. It sounds like what you're saying is you didn't experience this is so pat sounding by the way. Love or acceptance of whatever is you. >> You mean my past self? >> Your past self. You the past Tessa for >> you didn't experience it. So you didn't have reflected back to you a sense of your youness that was loved. >> Rebby, do you want to know how you want to know how crazy I'm I [ __ ] changed my name and [ __ ] I I have no connection to them. >> So you don't Tessa was not the name you were given >> and I'm not and I'm not and I've never revealed that to people. But I [ __ ] abandoned that [ __ ] You have no idea >> about your last name. >> Well, I can't do anything about I'm asking. A girl's got to ask. >> No, no, I know. I'm sorry. I'm also on defense right now because I'm I'm I am opening up and I didn't realize how much I was opening up until like I realized it and then I'm like, "Oh, fuck." So now I'm defensive a bit. So I'm sorry. But um >> Okay. >> What was I? Oh, I don't like I don't actually. Yes, I did. And I don't usually tell people that, but I think it's a important part of my journey. Um, that is >> the fact that I so thoroughly abandoned that person. So, when you say like you doesn't register, >> I would wonder if as your journey continues in the healing or in the growth, however you want to frame >> where you're going. >> Yeah. um what's gonna happen to that past self and what you would want to do with it and what can happen to it to make the healing the most robust. >> That's true because I've been told so many things and some of them have pissed me off. Like a lot of therapists have told me you have to accept that child to heal. You have to forgive them. You have to have compassion. I'm like yeah never in a million years. Good luck. Um because like I don't know that's some deep [ __ ] but like um I don't know. I don't know what's going to happen.
>> I don't know. I just think >> it's it's an interesting thing to bring something to be open to >> because I I believe that that person's gone. I mean seriously like and I'll tell you why because um validation from other people is so important. People see what they see of you. And when you start repressing who you are or whoever you were, that that past version, and then you replace it with like traits, even if it's from a celebrity, people start validating that slowly. They say like, "Oh, you're showing me this and that is you." Because how would I know any better, right? That is you. That is you. And the past self goes unseen more and more. And this new version of yourself goes >> is addressed more and more as who you always have been, who you always were. And eventually that like self like if it's not like the past self if it's not seen, if it's not validated, if it's not like being like noticed, I think something [ __ ] happens. I think it dies. I think that like my worst moment during my ego death was realizing that emptiness that's there now. And like I don't think it's true emptiness. I think it's fragmented emptiness. Um but it was scary as [ __ ] And like I had to realize that what I had done and I didn't know what I was doing. I thought in my head that I would just become perfect and that I would live happily ever after and blissful like perfection and I would bless people with my presence and I would like go around and I would finally be free of shame and like free of pain and like that did not happen. My god, like I ended up so [ __ ] up. Like my identity was like so [ __ ]
>> because you thought that by separating yourself >> I would be fine. I thought I would do it. Now I'm here. And now I have a personality disorder and I'm here. And I didn't think that would happen. No, I thought I would just be okay. I thought I would be happy, live happily ever after. All the boys would want me and [ __ ] I don't know. [ __ ] Like I would just be fine and like I would just be perfect and I would just be happy. >> So that's what I thought was happening. And that was so far from the truth. >> When did you actively change your name? How long ago? >> It was a while ago. Um I don't like to go into that stuff, but yeah, it was it was a while ago. Like how I mean my parents my parents my parents do they call you by your new or old or >> they still try to go by the old name and that's why I don't like to go over there. I'm going to be honest. It's it's hard for me because every time they say it it's like they're seeing me as it's so bad. You have no idea the [ __ ] that I deal with is so bad that like if they say my old name and they look at me I feel immense shame so I have to leave cuz like I feel like I'm being seen as that person. It's so [ __ ] up. But like,
>> but there's also a piece of you, if I'm understanding what you just said a few minutes ago, that also >> Yeah. >> doesn't want that person to be dead or >> No, I want them to be dead. If they were not dead right now, I'd probably make sure they were. >> But I thought I heard you also say there was a >> I don't want to be empty, >> right? So, it sounds like >> that makes me sad. >> But also, by the way, I don't think they're dead if you're alive. If you >> I don't believe that. I think that like there's other pieces of you. Um I there's no way like you'd have no idea how I would feel if that was still like part of me. I would be disgusted with myself. That can't happen. >> But was your personality and the way you're sort of acting toward me, right? The rapport we have. >> Yeah. >> Uh that old self, would we have a very different rapport or is there still >> I think you would hate them because everyone else did. I think that they were not charming, not relatable, not anything. seems like it would be hard to recreate an entirely new demeanor. >> It's not when you have a [ __ ] up identity already at age 15. You're basically covering up already a very weak sense of self. It's already it's already over by that point. As I said, I was four years old and I had so many weird thoughts about like I remember a sense of like always being alone, like always feeling alone even at that age and I never really was able to connect with anyone anyway. It's like by the time that you're 17 or 15 or whenever and you choose to do that, you're already so your sense of self is already so messed up that it's it's easy to just it's easier than you would think and that's sad and like the emptiness does make me sad and like that I don't like and that's why I'm here if that if that's like I want to I want to heal. I'm done.
>> And it's were you did you feel empty back then too? >> No, it progressed. It progressed. Or do you think you were you weren't as aware of it? Or you think it's just the maturing process has made you more cognizant >> grounded? I don't think I was empty as empty back then though because >> I my past self had passions. And this is probably >> Oh, that's interesting. >> This is probably the sad part for me >> because I hate saying this about my own diagnosis because I like to look at the good and it and this what makes me feel special about it. But NPD sucks the life out of you. like >> Mhm. >> your >> the more that I focused on my outward presentation, the more I replaced things, the more I did, the more I lost like the passion for life, like the passion for anything, I'm still I still >> Do you have an understanding of why that might be like what it >> Because because whatever that person was that I was born as, even if I [ __ ] hate them, they had natural like wants and desires and [ __ ] and I think that died with them and like it left something there that was just empty. And I think that that was a sacrifice I didn't know I was gonna make. And um I regret it. I regret that part. Sorry. But um this is just hard to talk about, but um yeah, I regret that part. Um but I have hope because I insanely believe that NPD can be healed to a certain extent. I think that I'm gonna find a way to develop and to help my friends who have NPD develop an inner sense of self. Even if it's a new self, even if it's a new growth of something, I think that I have like the format. I'm starting to lay it out because I'm desperate to heal. You don't understand. Like I the worst thing that can happen to somebody like me is an ego death. And once you're done with that, you have to just live with everything that like has happened underneath. And no one wants to stay in that place. I can't explain the set of what I've been through to get here. But like and I'm mad that like I'm upset that this is what it took for me to be self-aware. I think that NPD in that respect is so like there's a reason not many narcissists are self-aware. It is so [ __ ] Like all the stuff that you have to go through to get to where I'm even at right now. I can't even explain. Like there was another choice I had to make because I figured out like like the only way I felt more grounded again and more safe was by connecting to others which is so hard for my right which is so hard for my ego like god
>> and it's hard for your ego because they inherently are going to insult you or >> connection real connection is the most terrifying thing in the world >> because why? Um because so many reasons. Uh first of all, you're God, you're opening up. Okay. It's like what if you open up and somebody doesn't admire you anymore? I would die. Like that's terrifying to me. >> But it's probably happened and you haven't died. >> Well, see, that's the thing. That's that's how you heal is you test those things. That's why I'm here right now. I I had so much stress before this trip because I was facing those thoughts. >> Yeah. >> And they were haunting me and I was like, "This is this is my NPD. this is not me like or this is my trauma cuz to me NPD is just CPTTSD with a defense. So it's all PTSD. All those raged attacks that narcs have it's like when I say narks people always assume like >> a narc I I I >> you guys are reappropriating that >> we're reappropriating that term. All those rage attacks that narcissists have are just PTSD responses but it's the fight response. It's the fight response, you know, like and people don't understand that, but like Yeah. Um, and there's also a thing where at a certain point in my childhood, I just shut off to people and, you know, because I kept opening like my past self would open up to my parents like some traumatic thing would happen at school or something and my past self would go home and there was no safe space there either. If you were to open up about your emotions, you would get criticized. You would get told like, "Why didn't you do this, this, or this?" or like, "You can handle it. Just be brave. Just go." like there was no like understanding, there was no empathy, there was no like safe space. And I don't my parents grew up, they had a hard life, so I'm not blaming them. And that's the only thing I'm going to say. My dad already apologized for this. So I'm very proud of him for that. But not having that, you start to shut off, wall off your emotions. You start to learn emotions are weak or you so you think. It makes you look pathetic. It makes you look vulnerable. It makes you look not strong. It makes you look not confident. I mean, I always tell people >> that like these defenses are there for a reason. Like >> a lot of therapists are like, "That's a toxic trait. That's a toxic trait. That's a toxic trait. Destroy it all." And I'm like, "Do you understand that this [ __ ] kept me alive? Like, I wouldn't have survived my childhood had I not done this. Agreed.
>> And and then it's like, >> "Agreed." >> Yeah. I think the way to healing, like as somebody who wants to be a psychologist, like is to address the person's core, heal the core, and then those defenses will like fall away on their own. Can I ask you what is your This is like a bigger question. What is like getting better? >> Not suffering. >> Look, look, >> not suffering. I just I I know that this doesn't seem like this on the outside to a lot of people, especially my fans, cuz like I try to be as positive as possible, but I can have like a good experience and then go home and suffer and nobody knows. And like I just fight so much [ __ ] every day and I'm tired of it. And like I got to the point where like cuz like when you become um Man, when you become self-aware, what that means is like as a as somebody with MPD, it means your dep your defenses have to break down. And once that happens, all the [ __ ] underneath comes up. It's it's what's hiding in [ __ ] And I'm dealing with that now. >> So, you're suffering more now than you used to suffer. >> Yep. A lot. Um, and sometimes I miss that. Like, I'm like I miss when I wasn't self-aware, but then I'm like, well, my relationships went to [ __ ] At least I can keep a healthy friendship. >> How did they go to [ __ ] when you were less aware? >> Well, because like you know there's cover-ups for this [ __ ] like grandiosity or anger, but those are both like volatile emotions and they are projected outwards. So other people take on your pain. So like it's a choice. You either take it's like it's like a choice. Either you take on the [ __ ] which is like enough to make you dysfunctional. It's [ __ ] up. or like other people take on your [ __ ] and you feel great, but then your relationships are like other people get bitter at you for dumping that on them. >> I see. And so now >> I try not to do that cuz I'm I'm done. I'm done with the toxicity and the I'm tired and like >> So Oh, keep going. >> No, no, you you >> No, finish what you're saying. Well, like I I've had the first like time of like having healthy friendships and like a healthy relationship and that's different for me and like I don't blame myself anymore. I went through this period where like my ego tried to spin it the other way which is like the other side of NPD. It's like either up here or down here and down here is like oh like a great person wouldn't experience what you're experiencing. If you were actually perfect you wouldn't go be going through these things. Like um that was a phase that I went through and then I realized that like it's just trauma. So, like I realized those thoughts were also delusional and I was able to like pull myself into a place where I was like, "Okay, these are just like this is what you're dealing with. You went through a lot of [ __ ] So, that's like that's understandable that you're like this. It's okay. It's not your fault." But then I was just tired of suffering at that point. So, I was like, "What can I do to like stop?" Cuz I can't I can't go back to the way it was before. I was self-aware. Like, I can't go back to like not It's blissful ignorance, you know? and I can't go back there. I can't unsee those things. So, it's like the only way is forward. But that's hard.