Episode 1: Michael Sartain, Founder of Men of Action

This podcast has been a long time coming. Um, I've had a lot of friends, a lot of acquaintances, a lot of guys who really wanted me to start this for a long time after seeing me in a lot of the content that you've seen with Mike San and Mo MOA. And I want this contest podcast to be a little bit different. I really want to focus on like what men can do to improve, what we can do as a society to improve ourselves, and really tackle some issues that a lot of people aren't tackling right now. And I've had a lot of inspirations. And a great thing about having a podcast is you get to interview people that you look up to and your mentors. So, of course, for the first episode, there was no better choice other than my mentor, Mike Stin, my former roommate. And yeah, Mike, how you doing, man? I am nervous. What is this place that we're in? Yeah, man, look, my side is blue. Look at this. It's so different. How is it being on the other side of the table? I've never done this before. This, this thing with the microphone, it's very, I, I get very nervous when I get on camera. Yeah. Is it, are you nervous being on the other side of the table? I was, um, I was looking at this the other day. Um, so I have a, a folder in my, on my YouTube, and it's called interviews, and it's, we're at to 550 interviews that I've done. Yeah, that's how crazy it is. I did one just this morning beforehand. Uh, yeah, no, it's good. When, when I'm on this side of the table, it's good. But like, it's hard sometimes when, because you, you're not going to do this because you know me long enough, they ask the same like super basic questions, and they're coming from a like a place of, um, I don't know, like bad dating advice, bad business advice, pickup advice, whatever. And you have to like, you have to establish that first, and you can't really have like an advanced conversation. So that, that happens sometimes.

All right, well, speaking of advanced conversations, the most important topic of the day, what happened to the Mavericks? Uh, they, uh, you know, listen, uh, if they had had some good games, I think they would have played like it was like all of their shooters went bad at the same time. That's, that's pretty much what happened. Boston was a better team. Nobody in Dallas is like looking at this like, oh, we got robbed. I think Boston was going to win the series no matter what. Boston has no weaknesses on defense. I really did not expect them to be that good. But I mean, I was super happy. I was there for game four, and we were outside cheering. It was so great. You guys understand, I'm a Mavericks fan. I'm not like a Lakers fan or a Celtics fan. We've won one championship in like 40-something years. We're just, I was so excited that they were there. How was game four? How was it in Dallas at that time? Bro, it was so much fun because we were just sitting there. I was sitting there with Alex Defire, and Dallas went up 48 points. They were up 48 on on Boston, and these guys hit, and then, uh, Tim Hardaway hadn't hit a three in like, he was like, oh for the month, and then all of a sudden Tim Hardaway hits five three-pointers in a row, and we're just screaming, like losing our mind, and go outside. Have you seen, if you guys look on YouTube, there's this one guy, he goes to away teams, he wears the away team jersey whenever the home team loses, and then he just talks [ __ ] to the people when they come out of the stadium, and then people want to fight. He has a following based off, yes, and he, he gets into physical fights. He's a blonde kid, and he wears these sunglasses. So he's like, um, he, he came to the Dallas thing, except we won, and it was just like outside, it was [ __ ] chaos. It wasn't as crazy as that Knicks game I went to. That was, those Knicks fans are just ready for violence all the time. It is time to go. I, I imagine the Celtics fans are the same way, but the Mavericks one was good. Which just, we have more space around the, the arena to like move around. But that was that Knicks one that I have never been so sure. So I went to see Knicks, um, uh, Knicks Pacers game five, and afterwards, I went outside. The Knicks won that game, and I've never been so sure that I was going to die and was having so much fun at the same time in my entire life. That was great. I love it. I love it.

All right, so one topic I really want to get into, man, because it's not something you don't talk about it as much publicly, but definitely more internally, you know, with like the guys that you coach, and obviously, you know, when we're in Panorama Towers, um, I actually want to tackle, you know, mindset a little bit, right? Like, I think a lot of people think you don't believe mindset is important at all. You don't really. But from knowing you, you know, you talk about present moment awareness, gratitude, and stuff like that. So specifically in the niche of men getting better with women, but also getting better as men and becoming better networkers, can you talk about the importance of mindset and what mindsets hold guys back versus what stories guys tell themselves that make them successful? Okay, so I believe in visualization. I don't believe in manif. That's the difference. And when I say manifestation, I understand that the correct way to do manifestation is to, is, is to have these thoughts and then apply work to it. That's not how most people do manifestation, right? North American 20th, 21st century manifestation is clinch your butthole and a [ __ ] Ferrari will pop out of thin air. That is the, that is what they taught in The Secret. If you, the thing is, people will say, well, no, that's not what The Secret said. If you meet anyone who believes in The Secret, that's how they act. They don't do anything to change their life. So what we teach is act. They were born rich. So, so what we teach is mindset, which leads to action, which is, which can also be visualization because there's psychological, there are psychological studies that show that visualization can be helpful. So I've said this before, and Kylie thinks I'm nuts for this, but I rehearse what I'm going to say on podcasts in the shower, and she thinks I'm talking to myself, which technically I am. But it's like, after listening to, uh, Michael Irvin, he would talk about seeing himself beat the guy off the line of scrimmage, and then he would beat the guy back to the sideline where he knew Troy Aikman was going to throw him the ball. He would visualize the success that he would have. And that's always what I've done before. Visualization is great. Now, when it comes to the thing you were asking me before, whenever I have, let's say, what are the, what are the main tropes we get in the, in the program? I'm too short, or I'm too old, or I'm too fat, or, uh, I just got it, and, uh, ethnicity, or my ethnicity, or whatever. And just attractiveness. So, so just say I'm an, I'm an Asian guy, I'm under six feet tall. What we'll do in the, in the program is we'll show him several other Asian people that are under six feet tall that are dating like blonde hair, blue-eyed white women. And the question I always ask them is like, what is the story he's not telling himself that you're telling yourself? If you ever met like a guy who's really good at sales, or a guy who's really good at women, and then, but they're like, they're better than they should be, they're punching way above their weight class. Why is it they tell themselves these stories that almost give them delusions of grandeur? Now, I'm not telling you to do that, but I'm telling you, if, what, what does that mean? That means if I tell myself the right stories, you can guys look up the placebo effect. I tell myself the right stories, I can actually make myself believe that I'm bigger, stronger, faster, smarter, more charismatic than I actually am. And then in some cases, I can actually become that person I'm pretending to be. But if I, but I could also tell myself, I could beat Mike Tyson in 1989, and I couldn't. You understand what I'm saying? There are a lot of people thought that, and they got their ass knocked out. Like, you can tell yourself whatever story, and then eventually physical reality comes into play. But when it comes to things like sales, or dating, being charismatic, pitching things, like, like Orin Clay's book, uh, Pitch Anything, if you tell yourself the right stories, or rather, don't tell yourself the wrong stories, the things that you can accomplish are amazing. They are absolutely mind-bending. But what I just said has nothing to do with woo-woo Joe Dispenza [ __ ]. What I just said has to do with actual psychological studies that show this, the placebo effect. If I'm around a bunch of successful people, I am more likely to become successful. And if I'm in a group of, like, let's say I'm in a couple, and there's a group of like five other couples I hang out with, when one of those couples get divorced, it's more likely that I'm going to get divorced. We are subject to the stimulus in our environment. And so what you can do is by telling yourself those stories, you change the stimulus that you receive on a regular basis. And if I keep telling myself I'm a badass, then I might start to believe it. Now, that's different from those, uh, aspirational quotes. What are those things where they keep, you look in the mirror, you say I'm good? People like affirmations. Affirmations. The thing is, there are studies that show that affirmations work, but they're very, very temporary. They're very temporary. So I think it's actually not as important the story that you continue to beat into your own head. I think what's more important is the story you stop telling yourself. You need to stop telling yourself the story that I'm going to post this and people give a [ __ ]. All of you who are watching this right now, no one gives a [ __ ] about you. I'm just, like, sorry. Like, you have four, you have 400 followers on Instagram, and you're sitting there bitching to me about some post that you're supposed to put up. No one gives a [ __ ]. 400. That doesn't mean 400 people. That's my biggest. That doesn't actually mean 400 people. That means like, at most 40, or maybe 80 people, if you're, if you're lucky, give a [ __ ] about what you're doing. And it's just like, it's so crazy to me how hard people just stress over this nonsense when no one. Now, I don't recommend doing this, but I know Tim Ferriss does this where like people lay down in the street to like show that, you know, to get over their, uh, anxiety. And then you see pickup artists, they'll like bark at women. Okay, maybe do this once, you know, start barking just to see that nobody actually cares. Don't keep doing it over and over again because it causes you to become uncalibrated. But it's just like, when you come to the realization that like, no one cares about what's going on with you, that's good and bad. If you're a man, no one woke up this morning being like, man, I hope Tristan gets a [ __ ] a hot girl today. No one woke up this morning like, man, I hope Tristan makes a million dollars today. No one did that. No one except maybe your mom and your best friend. Give a [ __ ] at all. But these people, they, they're so sure that I'm going to post this, and everyone at work is going to judge me, and my family's going to judge me, and they have their own [ __ ] problems and insecurities. In fact, they're more insecure. They're not willing to post. They're more insecure than you are. And when you come to that realization, you're like, man, I just don't understand. Like, I need to do things the, the right way in order for me to get ahead. And I'm like, did OJ Simpson do things the right way? How about that? Did [ __ ] Caitlyn Jenner do things the right way? Did, you know what I'm saying? I mean, look at the upcoming election. Did Biden or Trump do anything the right way? No. Like, like, did, like, again, these people didn't do things the right way. When you look at, when you consider a man as president of the United States, after all the things that he's done, even if you love him or hate him, consider some of the crazy. Like, we are considering electing a man to be president. And by the way, I do think he's better than Biden, just don't let me put that out right now. Um, that we are considering electing a man who tried to impress a reporter by showing her top secret documents so he could try to [ __ ]. Am I wrong? Tell me what part of that is not true. Right? That did happen. I, we are about to elect a man to become president who had his attorney pay off a prostitute to keep her mouth shut with [ __ ] campaign funds. Did that happen or not? Tell me what part of that isn't true. I, listen, I like Donald Trump, he's cool. But my point is, like, that did happen. And you're, I'm not trying to tell you that to criticize Trump. I'm trying to tell you that to criticize you. If he did that and got away with it, what the [ __ ] are you worried about? Why are you worried about the things that you post? It is so worthless. And for some reason, I don't know why this is, but it tends to be my Indian and German clients the most, especially the German clients. They, they come from this structured household. It's like, you talk too much, slap your hand, be quiet, sit in the corner, shut the [ __ ] up, stop talking, stop expressing yourself. And then they get older, and you're like, hey man, you know, post a funny meme. And like, I don't want to. I'm afraid of what people will say to me. And then the first woman, or the first [ __ ], their fat aunt, or whoever, who said something to them, were like, I can't believe you posted that. It's so, it's not like you to post something like that. The first one who does it, they [ __ ] collapse. They're like, Michael, I got to stop posting this. Women are complaining. And I'm like, but they still have sex with you, right? It's like, yeah, but, but they're complaining. I'm like, then stop [ __ ] listening to them. And, and, and by the way, the better looking the guy is, the more susceptible he is to the idea that women criticize his social media account. So he stops posting pictures with hot girls. So he stops, he stops taking chances. The more attractive a guy is, the harder it is. The richer the guy is, the harder it is. But when you have a dude who just has [ __ ] nothing to lose, he's like a [ __ ] 5'6" Filipino dude, and you tell him to post his crazy [ __ ], he'll do it. He doesn't give a [ __ ] because he has nothing to lose, and he gets more improvement than anyone else. I mean, when you're at rock bottom, you can only go up, right? Because he has no stupid stories to tell himself, and that's the reason why he [ __ ] crushes it. There's a one, one saying, um, if you ever met a firearms instructor, the easiest people to teach are like the soccer moms who've never shot a gun before because you can teach them correct technique. The hardest people to teach are guys who think they know how to shoot guns and have no idea what they're doing. Same thing when teaching a guy to shoot free throws. Like, a lot of times it's better. These guys who are at rock bottom, they don't even know what success tastes like. So when you teach them the right way, they just do it the right way. They don't mix in all their other [ __ ]. The worst kind of client, not worst kind of clients, but the clients I have that's so much problem with is when I teach them Social Circle, then they take everything I said and they just mix in their pickup [ __ ] with Social Circle. It's like, Social Circle plus. It's like, I'm using Michael's Social Circle techniques to get me around hotter girls so I can be creepier around hotter [ __ ] girls instead of listening to exactly what I tell them.

Yeah, dude, that's actually a good segue. And one of the topics I wanted to really elaborate on, and we talked about it, uh, while we were, uh, in the cold plunge, uh, yesterday. You talked about like, you know, the route that pickup went through. But there was actually like a phase of pickup where, hey, it started off with Mystery being really good, and then it went downhill from there. So, and a lot of people think, I mean, it should be obvious because you've had Mystery on the podcast, a lot of people think you outright hate all of pickup and everything that it's done. So elaborate on like, the, the life of pickup and like the phases that it went through. Like the 20th closest people in the world to me, Owen Cook and Mystery, are two of them. So I don't hate pickup or pickup artists. I just think the way it was taught like post 2010 was super inefficient because they started getting into direct game and spin around and in, in [ __ ]. Shout out to Bad Boy Insta [ __ ]. Like you spin the girl around, and I was like, this is such bad game because you're showing way too much intent, and you're actually, it, it's just very poor. Now, I want to say this really quick. It seems to be all the rage now for people who are in the manosphere who were red pill and aren't anymore to like [ __ ] on Rollo Tomasi. And it seems to be all the rage for all these pickup artists to talk [ __ ] about Mystery. You wouldn't exist. Every single PUA right now, you should thank Eric Von Markovik. The, I just saw on Chris Williamson the other day, they were talking about Neil Strauss, the world's number one pickup artist. He was never the world's number one pickup pickup artist. Mystery was always better than him. Okay? The idea, the [ __ ] idea that you literally have a space with which to make money, and you want to talk [ __ ] about Eric? You're a [ __ ] clown. None of you should talk [ __ ] about Eric. And the idea that any of you are sitting there with a microphone in front of you trying to talk about women are like this, and men are like this, and you have anything bad to say about Rollo Tomasi, you need to shut the [ __ ] up because you wouldn't have a place to speak. Even if you don't like him, I'm including Destiny in this. Even if you don't like him, this discussion on YouTube about intersexual dynamics came from so swap forum, the [ __ ] Rational Male, and then Rolo coming on in like 2015. He had a radio show before that. Rolo created the space. It would be the equivalent of Charles Oppenheimer and [ __ ] Erwin Schrödinger making fun of [ __ ] Isaac Newton because Isaac Newton didn't know about quantum mechanics. [ __ ] you, Isaac Newton was had very little to work with. He did the best he could, and the man was a genius. You stand on the shoulders of giants. The things that Mystery did were the best things that you could in '03. What Mystery taught was the best [ __ ] you could possibly learn. It was the world changing, which was what, which was hardcore, cold approach pickup, but indirect game. It was the best [ __ ] in the world. The problem is when 2011 happened, and then all of a sudden, uh, Instagram came out, it's just there was this massive software update to intersexual dynamics. And what I've been doing since then is teaching the software update. That's a software update for anybody who was involved. And that's why we have so many guys who like got married in our program and got divorced. And when they were single, they were doing pickup, Neil Strauss, you know, Mystery Method [ __ ]. And then they got married, and then once they got, once they got divorced, then they're coming back to me and they're like, I don't know what to do. What do I do on Instagram? I don't know what's going on. But like, none of you, any of us that we're talking right now, I am having a discussion right now about intersexual dynamics on YouTube. I am the first person on Earth to introduce [ __ ] Rollo Tomasi to Neil's to, uh, to Mystery. I'm the first. They, the both of them were on my show at the same time. The idea that the, you guys want to sit there and talk [ __ ]. You can disagree with them, but calling them an old man or [ __ ] stupid, you're a [ __ ] ungrateful piece of [ __ ]. Anybody who does that. And by the way, you guys have heard me say this before. I think I really wish that Mystery would get way more into social media. I do. Yeah. I think he'd be fantastically better if he did that. But I, you said you think he'd be the best in the world? I think if Mystery did what I did now, the thing is also Mystery, like, you know, he has a wife and kids, or he has kids now, like he's in a different place in his life. He's in his 50s. If Mystery, we went back and took '03 Mystery, put him today, and then taught him social media stuff, I think he'd be the best in the world. Yeah, I do. I absolutely do. The first time I met Mystery, he pulled a threesome with two strippers, and they were both really hot. The very first time I met him. Like the difference with Mystery and all these other guys is that Mystery had to prove everything he said. The guys now, they can sit there and pay girls to come on their social media and then make it look like they have social proof when they don't. They can go to countries where women make no money whatsoever, and they can pretend to have game and they can get away with it. Like Mystery couldn't do that. Mystery did not have that ability to do that. He had to. I've seen him, and the thing is, like, I can't do what he can do. None of us can. He's like the guy's like an actor. He can like pull [ __ ] out of his ass. Like he's memorized routines better than anyone I've ever seen. And when he does it, he's really good at it. Um, but I learned so much from watching him be able to emote in a certain way that still makes him look masculine and strong. So it's very different. Like it doesn't go direct. And, you know, Dan talks about the same thing. The big, the big, um, inflection point for me and my growth, and I still like love, but was when I started hanging out with guys who were just surrounded by women all the time, instead of guys who said they were. So Mystery didn't because he was always moving from city to city, couldn't have time to make a social circle, right? When I started going, like, you know, shout out to Max Smith and Rocky Garrett, these guys, they were with Armada Magazine back in Atlanta. These were the first guys that I ever saw that like they would go to a club and 70 girls would come with them, and their girlfriends were always tens, and their girlfriends were having threesomes with them and other tens. Those were the first guys I ever met that were like that. And when I saw that, I was like, okay, I need to pay attention to what they're doing and not so much to what like the theoretical pickup guys were. Because the second, third, and fourth derivatives of Mystery were significantly worse than Mystery. Right? And then when direct game came out, bro, it was [ __ ] terrible. It was really. And listen, I don't, I know some of you guys, like, shout out to Lucario, I love these guys, you know, Alan Roger, Curry Mode, one, all these guys. I get what you're saying. I understand why you're doing what you're doing. It's, and I shouldn't say terrible because that sounds really judgmental. What I mean to say is it's less efficient for really attractive women. Going direct works when you're 6'3", Australian, with a six-pack and a [ __ ] tattoo sleeve, and you drive a Bugatti. When you're like that, going direct, [ __ ], yeah. Go direct. For the rest, for the other 99% of you, going direct, all it does is, it only works for women who already like you. But going indirect, using men of action, or using [ __ ] social status, or social circle, that's for women who don't like you yet, and you're going to manufacture attraction with those women. 100%.

And you know, this is actually something I wanted to segue into because it's, it's a little hard to describe exactly what you do and teach, right? Like, there's always like, it's not like, hey, there's this one exact thing that you teach, whether that's like dating, whether that's networking, whether that's event throwing. You know, you know, and I hear that from people all the time, like, but, you know, as we have been talking, you know, off camera, there is one term that sums up all of it, right? Whether that's the dating aspect, being attractive, becoming a leader, putting on events. And a term that we talked about mutually over watching Suits is I think what you teach guys how to do is to be the guy who gets it. And I think if that sums up everything that you teach, it's that term. So talk about being the guy who gets it versus being the guy who doesn't get it. Yeah, that's the biggest problem a lot of guys face. Yeah. So, so the, the people, I'm not, I'm going to use club promoters as an example, and not because they're better people, but because they have so much social pressure on them all the time that they get very socially calibrated very quickly. The same thing I'm going to say about like door guys in Las Vegas. They quickly, if you guys have ever go to a nightclub in Las Vegas, and they turn you away, it's because you don't get it. And they quickly can tell when you're full of [ __ ]. Like, like, like club hosts at XS, they can quickly tell when you're full of [ __ ]. Like in two seconds, you think you're fooling them, you're not. You're [ __ ] New Balance shoe, you're not coming in. We just, we can look at you and tell you just don't get it. You're like, your little dad jokes, and you're like, [ __ ]. We know you don't get it. You're not coming in. The thing that I learned, uh, from watching those people who get it. So I'll give you the, the easy way to explain it. The easy way to explain it is to watch Californication and to watch Hank Moody. Hank Moody is a perfect example of a guy who gets it. The best example, the best example of all time on television is the contrast between Harvey Specter and Louis Litt. And they wrote him that way. Louis Litt doesn't get it. He's overly emotional. He acts very feminine. In fact, if you saw Louis Litt and didn't know that he was a heterosexual, you might assume he's a homosexual. Mike, he's such a nice guy. Yeah, he, because he's super [ __ ] nice. His morality is totally led by his emotions, and like, he, he will break his morality for his loyalty to his friends, and then he'll break his loyalty to his friends in basis of his own feelings. Like he has no control. There's no central, like ethos for him. But like, he, but he's also very competent at his job, which is rare for somebody like Louis Litt. If anything, he's a better lawyer than Harvey, for sure. But the thing is, people like Louis Litt don't really exist. People who are that emotionally like invested in everything they do don't become financial account, financial attorneys. He's way too unstable. Harvey is perfect in that he is always stoic, he always acts masculine, he always has the right answer, and he never lets anything affect him. And even when beautiful women are like, Harvey, I'm in love with you, he's like, I don't want, I don't know what to tell you. Like, I'm not going to lie to you. Harvey doesn't cheat on women. Like, he actually, infidelity is like the biggest faux pas for him, which is crazy for when you consider an attorney like that who makes $500,000 a year working in Manhattan. That guy's probably going to run through like 70 models a week, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. Um, but like, Harvey doesn't do that. And like, so Harvey is the perfect, the Harvey Louis Litt comparison is the perfect example of do I get it or do I not get it. So whenever I have people ask me, what does "get it" mean? Because it's so esoteric, I say, are you closer to Harvey or are you closer to Louis in your behavior? A girl stood you up, you're like, I can't believe you stood me up. I can't believe that's so, you're texting, I'm so IR, in capital letters, it's so irresponsible that you did that. There's no accountability. Are you closer to Louis? Are you closer to Harvey? Yeah, Harvey wouldn't give two [ __ ] if he got stood up because he'd have three other on the back burner. That's the difference. Harvey is about abundance, and Louis is about scarcity. Yeah. And so when you watch that, it's very clear because, because you're watching it through Mike, uh, through Mike Ross's spectrum, and Mike has both of them. In Mike, he gets overly emotional, he makes stupid decisions because of his emotions, but he's also can be stoic and extremely analytical like Harvey. And so you watch the two of them together, and you can kind of see, like, the, the dichotomy between the two. You want to be the guy who gets it. I personally think part of the reason why Suits got canceled, and I know it's partially because, you know, um, what's it, Patrick Adams didn't want to be on the show anymore, and the Megan Markle situation, but I also think because Harvey was such a strong masculine character, and he's white and male and rich, I think eventually they were going to get canceled. Like, that's like the idea of that guy being that masculine and that [ __ ] good with women was not an image that people wanted to see on television anymore. That's why you don't see The Sopranos anymore. This is why, like, like that type of image, even, even Breaking Bad, those type of images, you're not going to see them anymore. I know California, they could never bring it back. Oh my God. Not even California. About Hank Moody, who was who was an author, and the guy would basically, it was like the first couple seasons, he would walk into a room, he talked girl, blah, blah, and the next scene, he's just like, [ __ ] her. And like, it was like happened over and over again. And he would say the funniest [ __ ]. He always knew the right thing to say. He, if you guys want to know, I mean, I'll tell you right now, there's one ring on my finger, and I wear a black t-shirt. Why is that? It's because of [ __ ] Hank Moody. Hank Moody always dressed the same way every time. He always wore all black. He always, like, he was just this scoundrel who, like, every woman, every woman wanted to cheat on their husband with this guy. It was always the [ __ ] same thing with this guy. He never put in any effort. Women chased him. He never, he would occasionally chase women, but he knew how to flirt in a way that was like attractive. And if he ever did go direct, he was funny as [ __ ] and extremely calibrated. Uh, Hank Moody gets it because Hank Moody gets it. That's why that show got canceled. And actually now shows are going to actually not only not make shows like that, they're going to make shows showing the opposite, like, like Hitch, or like these shows where it's like the guy is super, super feminine, like is the nice guy, and he actually wins. And we know in reality that doesn't [ __ ] happen. So just so you know, like Hitch is a terrible. When we talk about media giving you the wrong example, Hitch is one of the greatest examples of that. It's funny because people call me Hitch. Whenever someone's like, oh, you're like Hitch, I'm like, no, I don't teach you how to be attractive to one woman. That's called stalking. Being attractive to one woman, that's called sexual harassment. Yeah. Being attractive to all women, and having the girl of your dreams pursue you, that's called game. Right? And the game, and by the way, game is real, whether or not you like it or not. If you don't want to play, Michael, I'm just tired of this thing where I have to show status all the time, and I just want to [ __ ] relax. You can do that, and it's fine. Like, no one, you don't have to play the game. Like, you don't have to believe in gravity. If someone pushes you off a balcony, you're still going to die. If you don't believe in game, it doesn't make any difference how good you feel about yourself or how noble you think you are because you're authentic to yourself. Women will still not be attracted to you because you're so, you're not concerned with the things that women are concerned with.

Yeah, this is another thing. This is one that gets me, and I see it just all the time where it's like, you know, guys will come up to me, they'll come up to you, and they'll be like, look, man, like, you know, I want to go to higher value parties, I want to be a better networker, I want to meet on girls, and everything like that. But they're like, ah, I don't like the gym stuff. I don't like the social media stuff. I don't want to go, oh, I don't want to go out to nightclubs, it's too loud. And I'm like, bro, like, just, so stay in your [ __ ] basement. Like, just like, stay that way forever. The world's not going to pull you out of it. For those, for those hyper-logical guys who, who say the things that you're saying, those objections, I want you to consider, we're going to use something super logical, free market economies. Do you understand? The guy that is going to have sex with the girl of your dreams, first of all, it won't be you. But the guy who's going to have sex with her, he is good in clubs. He is louder than you. He did go to the gym. He did make his business a priority. And when beautiful women come up to him, he doesn't stutter. Like, I have to present it like that because guys are like, oh, I just want to do this and then want to manufacture some incredible woman. I'm like, would you [ __ ]? You look in the mirror, bro. Like, you wouldn't [ __ ] you. So why do you think other women would? It's like, you have no empathy for the opposite sex. Like, like Patton said, the enemy gets a vote too. Like, you, this concept, one of the biggest problems is these men think, I'm just going to enter stimulus into the equation, and then women will automatically want to have sex with me. Like it's some robotic [ __ ]. Like it's like some code you're compiling or something like that. It doesn't work like that. What happens is she needs to look back at you and be like, this is a man worthy of me doing this thing that I don't want to do with a lot of men. Women are not as interested. I don't care what I would love to do a debate on this. Women are not, it doesn't not matter because of a [ __ ] patriarchy. It's genetic. Women are not interested in multiple sexual partners or sexual variety to the extent that men are. In fact, I was listening to William Costello, a couple days ago, he goes, so men are more interested in sexual variety than women. And then so the response by feminists is, no, we're interested in sexual too. And William's like, why? You don't have to be like men. The idea of being more masculine is being better is not true. It's just women not being interested. Let me tell you something. If you're a guy in your 20s, and women are not interested in sexual variety, it sucks for you because you're having to compete with guys who have more status than you. You're like, man, it sucks that women are so not interested in sexual variety. When you're married with kids, you want to know one of the greatest things that your wife can have? No interest in sexual variety. That's awesome. When you're married with kids. Not sexual variety is great when you're single and trying to meet a girl. Having no interest in sexual variety is bad. And that's the thing. You guys understand, these are features, not bugs. Women not being as interested in sexual variety as men is awesome. It's the reason we have a society because men are competing with other men for access to women. And do you know who the biggest victims of the patriarchy are? Men. It's men, unequivocally. Because, you know, I call this actually, and look, this is not to say we're forever watching this, that we don't believe like women go through a lot of things. Like, I, for example, believe sexual assault is underreported. I believe that men, women, uh, you know, have to deal with creepy men a lot in their life. But here's the thing. Something we do talk about, though, is, and I call, I kind of coined this term, it's called the patriarchy paradox. And we talked about it, uh, the other day, uh, on a podcast, where it was that the traits that make a man attractive, right, to women, the ones that they reward are one, the ones that they quote unquote complain about. But two, it's also the traits that lead to the quote unquote patriarchy that we're in. Like leadership, like dominance. Yeah. So, so if you, if you want to fuel the idea of a patriarchy, I think the majority of the world is a meritocracy, not a patriarchy. If you, if you don't believe me, like 60% of college graduates are, or college roles are, are female. Like, I, I believe 5% of psychologists under the age of 30 are male. 5%. I believe we live more in a meritocracy now than a patriarchy. I do. But there is obviously some patriarchal ideas. Like, for instance, I think it's 55 of the top of the Fortune 500 CEOs are female, something like that. Like at the highest levels, there is a pay wage gap. And at the highest levels, but women consistently sex with and choose that given and dominance. They show like strong masculine features, a strong jaw, broad shoulders, like all these things that basically lead to men being more aggressive and more assertive. If you have two genders, and one of them is being rewarded for being more aggressive and more assertive, of course that gender is going to be in more positions of power. But the reason why they're more aggressive and more assertive is because those are the same attributes that women reward and have rewarded with sex throughout the existence of Homo sapiens. And it's not just Homo sapiens, it's [ __ ] gorillas and lions and tigers as well. In any species of elephant, bull seals, in any species where men compete with other men for access to females, you're going to see women reward the bigger, stronger, more aggressive, more assertive male. So here's the thing, and I don't mean to say this to blame women. This is the last chapter of When Men Behave Badly by Dr. Buss. He talks about this. It's like, if women stop sleeping with men who are more narcissistic, more aggressive, more assertive, more physically dominant, and more muscular, muscular, if women stop sleeping with those men, then you would see this massive change in the way men look. And by the way, you do see it somewhat. Men now have less testosterone than they did 50 years ago because the nerdy guy with the glasses who becomes a tech billionaire, he is having more aded for now. Yeah, he's he's having more sex with more women. So you are seeing the guy with like myopia, for instance, is more prevalent in this in the, um, myopia is more prevalent in the population now than it like 300 years ago because of, because of corrective lenses, because more people can wear glasses and still be able to function. Whereas if you were severely myopic, the likelihood of you having children was very low five or 600 years ago. Now people, the, the myopia gene, because of LASIK, contact lenses, and glasses, more people are myopic because there's less selection pressure against that thing. Well, now there used to be selection pressure for a man against him being weak, physically weak, because the majority of our society was agrarian, meaning you had to milk the cows and till the soil. So you needed physical muscle mass in order to do that. And as we've gotten away from that type of society, the man who has less muscle mass, less aggressive, and less assertive, now he's able to have more children. So if you think, like, if you look at it, if there was a patriarchy, if you want to argue there was a patriarchy, was there more of a patriarchy in 1924 or 2024? It's not even a question. Obviously, in 1924, there were like, men could beat the [ __ ] out of their wife. Men could kill their spousal murder was legal in some state back in 1924. Do you guys understand? It was a patriarchy. It was far greater in the past than it is today. And so we, we've made strides to move forward, to to stop those things from happening, and that's great. But we keep.

And by the way, I'm not saying patriarchy is even good or bad. What I'm saying is that it is an inevitability. If you keep rewarding men for being aggressive and assertive, aggressive and assertive men are going to be born. And those aggressive and assertive men are going to take periods and places of responsibility and authority. And therefore, they are going to shape society. And the only people you can blame are the women who keep having sex with the aggressive and assertive men, right?

So why do you think that's offensive? Like, I don't care what anyone says, I'll say this on camera. Academia has an agenda, and it is very, very left-leaning. Which is fine, I'm pretty left-leaning too. But the point is that you saying that, you know, these traits that are attractive lead to a patriarchy, and saying that women have the responsibility for it, that's very offensive.

Yes. So why do you, why do you think that there's that dichotomy? Because people just don't want to hear that. Okay, so there is what? There's a normative description and then there's a, um, normative and prescriptive. What are the, the two ones? Uh, normative and descriptive. Those are the two. You guys can watch, uh, Gad Saad. He does a video about, uh, where he counters objections to evolutionary psychology, right? And he talks about the difference between normative and and descriptive. What we do, whenever you describe concepts in evolutionary psychology, those are, those are descriptive. Meaning, the fact that a man has, I believe, a median grip strength for a man puts him in the top two percentile of women. So grip strength is a massive dimorphic difference. In fact, the two big, two of the biggest dimorphic differences between men and women are men's, uh, desire for sexual variety and men's upper body strength. Those are the two biggest ones. Okay. Men's ability to throw objects, also massive. The difference between men and women being able to throw objects, which again, where does that come from? Hunting. It's a hunting adaptation. We can throw objects overhand. Apes cannot throw objects overhand. I don't know if you know this. They don't have the same ball and socket joint that Homo sapiens have. And we can't, they can't walk on two feet. Also, female Homo sapiens are the only females. They have an adaptive problem. The only two-legged females on Earth that have to walk upright. Maybe, maybe if you look at like marsupials, like kangaroos, maybe have to do this. But they have to walk upright while carrying, while gestating a child. That's why women have a 45-degree lumbar lordosis in the back of their spine. And that's the one that is best for being able to carry children while walking on all fours. Cats walk, walking on two legs, cats do it on all fours. These are adaptive solutions to evolutionary problems that people, that people have throughout history. And we found solutions to those problems.

What was the original question? Yeah, you know, it's like, why are you saying that there are these differences and these differences lead to the patriarchy? So what happens is, when you say, when you say descriptive, I'm describing how the world was. If you want to say normative, if you want to say the world should be more egalitarian in the future, I actually don't have a problem with that. Don't have a problem with that either. If we had replicators, if we could replicate and create infinite amounts of food, clothing, and shelter, I actually don't have a huge problem with socialism. I don't, I really don't. Now, you're going to take a motivation from a lot of people, motivation away from a lot of people. But I don't have a problem with it. The problem is, we don't live in a time with replicators and, you know, holodecks. This is not Star Trek. And so we have a finite amount of food. That food has to be produced. Like, you have to incentivize people to produce that food. You do it through, you do it with money. Okay. We live in a world where it's not like that. So we, we have to live in a certain level of reality. Making things make, like just waving our hand and saying a, a, a trans woman is a biological woman. When you say that, it's just, the problem is, it's not true. Yeah. And when you say that, now you erode science. And now, why do I even believe in gravity? And if you look, more and more people don't believe in gravity because of morons like Terrence Howard going on Joe Rogan or, you know, flat earthers. But how are you able to erode that? You're able to erode it by believing in stuff that isn't true. It's, there's nothing wrong if a man wants, culturally, if a man wants to call himself a woman. I don't have a problem with that because culturally, he has the right to do so. First Amendment of the United States Constitution, he has the right to do so. But if a man wants to then tell me, because he's transitioned to a woman, now he can have babies. And the fact that I say that he can't makes me a, you know, bigot or a misogynist. What's happened then is that now we're talking about things that aren't true. First off, my statement is based in fact, and there's no hatred involved. And second of all, what you're saying is objectively not true. So if we get to the point where your feelings make objective truths not be true anymore, then what is the point of the electromagnetic effect? What is the point of the strong or weak nuclear force? What is the point of gravity? What is the point of quantum mechanics? What is the point of relativity? These are objective truths. What do we, you know, need them for? Because nothing is objectively true. It's called postmodernist thinking. Yeah. And so when you, when you have that sort of belief, then things become problematic.

Now, here's the thing. When you explain to men and women, just people in general, in academia, that here is unassailable proof that men are more interested in sexual variety than women, what happens is, now your narrative, or your, you know, goal of trying to make the world egalitarian, I've put a wrench in your, in your works. I'm throwing a monkey wrench in there. Yeah. I don't mean, when I describe Homo sapiens, I don't mean to say that we always have to be like this, okay? The levels of male jealousy during the Pleistocene led to murder. I don't think that if you catch your girlfriend cheating on you, you should murder her and her boyfriend, her new boyfriend. That's bad. That's maladaptive for today's society. But I can't explain to you why cheating, why jealousy exists. It's because during the Pleistocene, the men who didn't, who were not fastidious about their wife, who their wife was sleeping with in their wife's pregnancy, ended up raising other men's children. Yeah, that's what happened. So the men who were fastidious about it, they ended up raising their own children and passing along their jealousy gene into the next generation. That's the way it worked. And you, and me, and everyone we've ever met are the result of an unbroken chain of replication, up an unbroken chain of two people getting together and having a child. So if you understand that concept, then what happens is, me explaining the dirty, nasty part about human, you know, I call those hairless murder. When, when I explain that we're hairless murder apes, that doesn't mean we always have to be hairless murder apes. You understand? Your ancestors and my ancestors' ancestors belonged to tribes. And when we saw people from other tribes, we had no choice. We had to go kill them. We didn't know if they were friend or foe. The safest thing for me to do is to kill these people from other tribes and then take the virgin and the young women and absorb them into our tribe. That is literally the most logical and safe thing for me to do during that time period. I had to, because they had, they had hunters, etcetera, whatever. Which, by the way, this is another, I'm off topic here, but it's one of the theories for why psychopathy exists. The one of the theories for the reason why there are psychopaths is because someone had to sneak into the other tribe in the middle of the night and bash people's heads in with a rock and not feel guilty about it. That's what, that's the adaptation for psychopathy. But like, what happens is, now I don't, my guilt, like my girlfriend could have cheated and then used a contraceptive and not got pregnant, but I'm still mad as, you know. I'm still mad. Why am I mad? That's not logical. She's not going to have a child with someone else. Why am I? Well, because it's an evolutionary adaptation through, you know, 200,000 years of Homo sapiens evolution, 3 million years of hominid evolution, 178 million years of, of mammalian evolution. That's where that evolutionary adaptation comes from. I'm explaining it. If I deny it, I can never get past it. Does that make sense? If I act as if that jealousy is not, is not a maladapted adaptation, but instead it's just male, you know, insecurity because of our weak ego, then because you are infantilizing men by doing that, what happens is, instead of these men figuring out a way to overcome their jealousy, or or maybe not overcome, but at least act in a rational manner when they're like, hey man, your girl cheated on you, take out your card and you charge it to the game. Next girl. If, when you can have that attitude, which my caveman ancestors did not have that attitude, they couldn't charge it to the game because there were only like three or four women that they could breed with, yeah, in their small 150-person tribe. So because I have this abundance, I can charge it to the game, go on the next one. That is a better adaptation, but it's not a natural adaptation. It's one that has to be learned. But I can't have that adaptation if I don't at least admit that jealousy comes from evolution. Yeah. If I deny that, I can never overcome it. Like, what you resist, persists. So when you resist that there are innate sex differences between men and women, we can never overcome them and become a better society. My solution is actually going to get us to an egalitarian society before the, you know, feminists and the, you know, women's gender studies courses as well. My will, my will actually get us there quicker because we can overcome these things when we accept that's why they exist, instead of doing what, you know, did and bled every single innate sex difference between men and women on, you know, patriarchy. Really? Is that why male chimps are more interested in casual sex than female chimps? Because of, you know, patriarchy? Is that the reason why? And let me ask you something else. If patriarchy was real, and like the necessity for, for, um, for casual sex, or the necessity for, for, uh, sexual variety was a function of patriarchy, why is 98% of pornography consumed by men? Even when you're in your house alone and no one can judge you, women are still not choosing sexual variety to the level of men. And by the way, it's not just straight men, it's gay men. Gay men consume far, like the ratio of gay men consuming pornography in comparison to lesbian women is 1 million to one. It's not even close. And so when you come to this, you say, okay, okay, Michael's right. Turns out sexual variety in men, like men wanting more sexual variety, not a function of patriarchy. It's not a function of culture. It's a function of genetics. And so now, because we know that's the case, now we can start to work through it as opposed to denying that it exists.

Yeah, it's funny. I'm glad we're talking about like evolution. I feel like living in Vegas, you get to see evolution just really play out. I'll, I'll die on the hill with this statement. The best degree in evolutionary psychology is not going to Harvard. It's not Dave Buss's lab at UT Austin. It is XS Nightclub. It is the greatest, like teacher of evolution is the nightclub. I always say life is a nightclub because you just see like that, that morphic sex differences, two, the way the setup works, how status works. And also something, you know, because I used to prom in Boston and stuff like that, I met a lot of girls who were really liberal. They didn't like the patriarchy. They didn't like, like men and women treated differently. I'm like, I mean, look, you could pay for the table at the club, yeah, and be like, well, I want to go clubbing. But I'm not only going to go if, like, Tris takes me. I'm like, okay. So I think that is the best learning mechanism of psychology because you get to really see it in the field in real time. So, uh, two great books. One's called The Intelligence Paradox, and the other one is called, uh, Why Beautiful People Have More Daughters by Satoshi Kanazawa. And Dr. Kanazawa and I have had some kind of, we've had some correspondence via email. And one of the things I told him, I was like, Dr. Kanazawa, absolutely the greatest evolutionary psychology experiment of all time called Las Vegas, Nevada. Maybe Dubai is like this now too. But it's like the girls with the big specific, the girls with the biggest boobs and the blondest hair are going up against the guys who have the highest status and the most money. And they're like, literally meeting at this apex, like tip of the spear. Just incredible, like high levels of male intersexual competition where dudes are, you know, one-upping each other. And like, you bought a $100,000 bottle, I'm going to buy $100,000, you know. And they go back and forth at each other. Like the, the level. Do you ever see hot women buy $100,000? Actually, in Vegas, they wouldn't let you buy $100,000 if a woman, if a woman came like with a group of girls, tried to buy alcohol, they wouldn't even let her do it. Uh, the funny thing is, like, what else do we have as far as intersexual competition? What is, what's the ultimate example? It's like UFC. It's like mixed martial arts. It's boxing. And that's, we, what else do we have? That's, we're the boxing capital of the world. We're the MMA UFC headquarters is next door to this building. We're the, we're the MMA capital of the world. Intersexual competition amongst men. Take this. One of the reasons why I got so into evolutionary psychology is because I live in Vegas. Because some things that he talks about from a theoretical framework, like say, for instance, mate choice copying. Dr. Buss talks about it. I see every day in real life with a man, like with men who've been with 2,000 women. Yeah, right? Like, again, I'm not saying that my experiences talking to Dan Bilzerian or my experiences in a nightclub are scientific. They are certainly anecdotal. My point is, what they are is they're three or four standard deviations away from the mean. And I'm seeing what the extreme examples look like. And in those extreme examples, when men have more and more and more status, there should be a point at which it breaks. And then the more status doesn't lead to more women. And it never, you know, happens.

23 women want to sue this guy pretending to be Lionel Messi. Did you see this? This one dude walks around looking like Lionel Messi, and he had sex with 23 women. And these women who want to sue him, these women who want to sue him knew full and, you know, well that he was married when they had sex with him. They knew Lionel Messi was married. So it's totally shared with. But they had sex with him to be Lionel Messi and wasn't actually Lionel Messi. It's like one of the craziest things that I've ever seen. These women were willing to have sex with a man who gave them no money, who did not give them children, who, you know, gave them no provisioning whatsoever. They slept with him for one reason: because of his perceived status. That is the only reason. And he's, he's short. The only reason that they slept with this dude. And then you see that, and then you look at all the studies from evolutionary psychologists, and you're like, oh, it is true. Yeah. I mean, it's just like, it's just so obvious. Like, again, I'm not saying the nightclub is a representation of the real world. No, but it's harder. It is, it is harder. But it's just like, why is it like, why do the hottest women get on stage? Why is the nightclub that has the best revenue not the one where the best DJ is? It's always where the hottest girls are. It's like, you can't explain these differences away on just society. It's the way humans interact and what proclivities that we have are. That's the biggest thing. By the way, when, when the top injury attorney in your city throws a charity party, the hottest girls are there compared to the other injury attorneys. When the hottest, when the biggest plastic surgeon in the city throws an event, the prettiest girls are there compared to the other plastic surgeons. Yeah. When, when the nightclub, it's like, when you watch these nightclubs, the hottest nightclub is always going to have the prettiest girls. It's always going to be like that. And you start to notice this correlation between higher status events and more attractive women. Right? You'll even notice that like the players in the NBA and the NFL that make more money have prettier wives. You're going to see the same thing with golfers, especially golfers, their wives are stunning. They're, you know, baseball players, a lot of them, they have stunning wives. And you start to see this. It's like, as you climb this, the status ladder. You saw that girl, what's her name? Um, the one that was supposed to have the baby with Mark Davis. Um, oh, Hayden Hopkins. Hayden. Hayden Hopkins. She's, and not having a baby with, with Mark Davis. She's having a baby with Joey Gallo, who's the center fielder for the, you know, Yankees. Yeah. Like, like when you see, when you go up to these higher levels of status, the defining method of that status is the more attractive women. So I want you to consider one more time. Let's go back to the patriarchy argument. If I'm a man and I live in a vacuum, I'm just a mid-tier level man, and I look and I consistently see men with higher status having prettier women, what is it going to motivate me to do? Seek higher status. Yes. And if I do so, and I get more higher status, and in doing so, I make more money and have more positions of responsibility and authority, of course there's a patriarchy. Of course there is. Like, that's essentially what's happened. Because I keep watching the most attractive men being rewarded with sex from the most, I'm sorry, the highest status men being rewarded with sex by the most attractive women. Yeah. How is that being rewarded with babies? They're having children with the most attractive women. Then of course, of course I'm going to try to do the same thing. And that's the problem. That's where we get back into this issue. It's like, because we do not admit that there are dimorphic differences between men and women, yeah, what do we end up in? We end up in, we live in la la land, in delusional land. And because of that, like, if, if trans people had not tried to shove some of these ideas down the throats of other people, I think they'd be far more accepted. In fact, there's a great, I've said this before, this is a really controversial take. I think homosexual men are going to leave the LGBT community. I think 100%. I think they are. Because homosexual men run for mayor. Homosexual men are accountants, lawyers, doctors, and often times are still masculine. Yeah. Homosexual men can act masculine. Homosexual men are looking at the rest of the LGBT community and like, why are you dragging us into this, you know? Homosexual men say, man, they're all just driving in the same car. Homosexual men become judges. Homosexual men are like the conservatives of the LGBT community. They are like, I truly, when I watch, because I have a lot of, I know a lot of guys who are gay, and when I see them, they're like, they don't want this. They don't want, if they ever have a daughter that they adopted, they don't want a man going into the bathroom with them either. That's, that's the crazy part about it. Yeah. Right? It's like, I've said this before, I think gay men are going to be like, why are you dragging us into this, you know? We don't want to be a part of it. But that's the problem. It's like, it's like they're the, now, 50 years ago for sure. But like the level of, I talked to Brad Lee about this. I was like, dude, if there was a gay, like, judge, if there was a gay guy who like said everything you believed economically and had the same level of morals, would you vote for him? He goes, 100%. I would vote for him. I don't give a, you know. Of course I would vote for him. Dude, are you kidding me? Dude, if I was ever throwing a massive party, and I, if I got the privilege to throw the Ignite party, if that ever comes back, I'm letting gay dudes in first. Yeah. So Ben said this is really funny. So perfect. William Costello talks about this. One other massive difference between men and women is that homophobia seems to be something that is way more prevalent in men than women. And it doesn't really make sense. Because for me, and I'm, and I'm not like this, I like gay men at a party because gay men at a party aren't competition to me. And they make the women feel more comfortable. I would, for me, a perfect party would be me, five of my buddies, like five other gay dudes, and like 30 girls. That would be an incredible, an incredible party. These other dudes, they're actually going to be like, they're going to be more responsible. And here's the other thing, the adaptation for asexuality. It's like, if I'm living in the Pleistocene and I have to go off and hunt with my son, do I want a 19-year-old strong, buck, horny male heterosexual male looking after my wife and daughter? Or do I want the gay man doing it? Because the gay man still has a man's frame. He still has a man's grip strength. He still has a man's skeletal muscular structure. He still has a man's testosterone. He's just not going to try to have sex with my daughter. Yeah. So like, to me, that's the adaptation for homosexuality. I don't know if it's the correct answer. What I do know is that homosexuality is not a paradox to me. I understand why it exists. And I have no animosity towards homosexuals whatsoever. You want to do that, that's totally fine. It's not even a choice. My heterosexuality is not a choice. So I'm not going to say that your homosexuality is a choice. Okay. This is not an issue. But where does homophobia come from? It's a paradox. Like, that's actually the, the issue is like, I don't get it, man. Like, gay dudes are the best wingmen on the planet. Hot women are the best wingmen. But gay, gay dudes are pretty, like, number two. Yeah, for sure. 100%.

Um, so talking about the, you know, patriarchy paradox and like what's accepted. I know something, you know, we talked about the other night while we were doing the cold plunge was, you know, we were talking about, right? And not to get conspiratorial, but you kind of gave an idea. If you were China, right? Right. Hold on. If you were China and you wanted to make society collapse and you wanted to push, you know, things into America that was going to, you know, take your enemy down, yeah, what would you push? Yeah. So I, again, I want to say this, I don't know that China's doing this. I'm not saying they're doing this. But it is awfully, you know, convenient. If I was a country and I wanted to weaken my enemy, but I could not do so militarily, but I had an app that was incredibly prevalent that existed in this other country, what I would do is, in my country, I would teach children mathematics, science, technology, and engineering, and how to be literate. In the other country, my enemy country, I would teach children to, like, 13-year-old girls to dance around in daisy dukes. And I would have women out there saying crazy, you know. I would promote the, you know, LGBT. Not again, I don't have anything wrong with people who are LGBT. The thing that I've noticed though, is if you have a heterosexual, heter looking woman with curves on on TikTok, 100% of the time, they're going to lose their account. I've never seen a gay, lesbian, bisexual, or trans person on TikTok. I have never seen one of them ever lose their account. You know, Kim Kardashian lost her account on TikTok. So, and I was saying is, if I wanted to, if I wanted to decline the fertility of my enemy and I wanted to hurt him financially, you know, and demonize masculinity. If I wanted to demonize masculinity, but I also, like, you'll notice Alex Jones is being ratioed on TikTok. Brad Lee is being ratioed on TikTok. So men who teach other men to make money are being ratioed. But little kids who are 13-year-olds dancing in daisy dukes are being promoted. If I'm not saying this is what's happening, but I'm saying if I was China and I wanted to demasculinize and like, uh, like, uh, what's it called, um, defang the United States, what I would do is I would promote, I would promote a lack of masculinity, a lack of fertility, and a lack of like, like financial upward mobility. I would, financial know-how. I would, I would de, I would ratio those concepts. And if you look on TikTok, that's exactly what they've done. Wait, and here's the other thing. And a lot of people don't want to deny this. Men are a lot more visual. And what's one of the most visual apps out there? It's TikTok. So with a lot of the sexual content, not complaining about it, but it is there. With women like doing all these dances, showing a lot of revealing clothing, that's going to attract a lot of men. But what does that lead men to? It leads them to overconsuming content. It leads them to pornography. It leads them to all the things that take their masculinity away. And now you see men who are addicted to pornography, they're inside. And these men are not a threat. These men don't have a chance. And look, if you were a country, you who, and if you didn't have the superior military power, I would want to take down the men of that country too. If I'm China and I have an inferior military, demasculinizing my enemies' men, like young men, would be my priority. Of course. If I could sit and dial and like lower the testosterone levels of all the men in the country that I'm going up against by making them watch, you know, levels of pornography and then causing them to like, like not go outside, to stay inside completely, to women. You think they're scared to talk to women? All these things. If I was going to do that, if I was going to demasculinize them, I mean, that seems like a great, you know, strategy to me. That's the only thing I'm saying. So I, listen, I like TikTok. I use TikTok for motivation. Whenever I'm looking for like funny videos to react to, I do. It's a really great way. So for instance, I was an accountant, a lawyer, if I was a doctor, and I was looking for ways to go viral on social media, I would go to TikTok first. TikTok, their indexing feature for different type of content is way better than Instagram. So I totally understand that. But Instagram is like, it's just, it's one of these things within TikTok. It's like on Instagram, what, what happens with hot girls? We're getting reported by like hyper, hyper conservative, like Muslim or super judgmental religious people. They would report your account and then it would get taken down. TikTok is just taking your account down because I honestly, I think if you promote heterosexuality, I think TikTok doesn't like you. Like, I just, that's what it feels like to me. Oh, here's the other thing. And this happened to you the other day. Is another thing that, uh, TikTok and Instagram for that matter, but less Instagram, more TikTok promotes is like these, it promotes pandering. So there's going to be these, you know, fat simp ass, you know, who are going to be like, hey, like, you know, Michael, you're, you're a misogynist. Like, no, you're too big for 46. And he's actually getting a lot of views on TikTok. So, so the funny thing is, YouTube doesn't give you a boost for pandering. YouTube will actually ratio it if you're too liberal or too conservative. But the difference is, like Instagram, if you, if you make, if you guys want to know a tip right now, make anti-red pill, anti-innate content, and you will go viral very quickly on Instagram. Instagram will artificially promote your content. Okay. Same thing on TikTok. If you make an anti-Andrew pill, I'm sorry, anti-Andrew Tate or anti-red pill content on, or even anti-conservative content on, uh, TikTok, TikTok gives you a boost. The algorithm actually boosts you. And I've seen a lot of guys trick the algorithm. Like, if you guys want to try this, I wish somebody would do this as an experiment. Start off and make like very pandering, super, super like women pandering, simpy content. Do that for a couple of months on TikTok. Watch how you have two, 300,000 followers. And then switch your content over to like red pill stuff. Watch what happens. Like you'll all of a sudden you'll be ratioed to nothing. But if you, the thing on YouTube, the thing with YouTube is, YouTube was heavily left-leaning until Rumble came out. When Rumble came out, then, then TikTok, or then YouTube came to the realization, because some of the biggest live streamers, like super chat, um, receivers on YouTube were red pill content creators, and they started flowing over to Rumble. But even YouTube, YouTube never went off the deep end. Look, they did. If, if you said anything about the election being stolen, they take your account out. Okay. Yeah, no, that's fair enough. But like, even when it was like on, at their peak of censorship, look, The Daily Wire still has 6 million subscribers. Like the way TikTok and Instagram do it is a different story. So the, the point is, The Daily Wire can exist, can exist on YouTube. The Daily Wire exists on TikTok, but they're going to get a lot of stuff taken down and they're going to be ratioed. Because The Daily Wire tells men, think for yourself, become, get in better shape, increase your testosterone levels, get married, and have multiple children, and get, do better financially. If that's what The Daily Wire says, those are all things. If I'm the, if I'm the enemy of your country, I don't want men doing those things. I don't want men having babies and making money, because what it does is it strengthens your country's economy and military and weakens me in comparison. So the best thing for me to do is promote a lack of fertility, a lack of masculinity, and a lack of financial freedom. That's what I want to promote. And again, that's why, like, there's no reason Alex Jones should have anywhere near as many, you know, uh, like engagement as me. That is crazy to me. Alex Jones should have a 100,000 times more engagement than I do. That is crazy. But it's why is it? It's because Alex Jones, who says nothing controversial whatsoever, what does he do? He's teaching men how to think for themselves and become financially independent. What does that do? That strengthens our economy. Entrepreneurship strengthens our economy. If I'm China, that's the last thing in the world I want. 100%.

And you know, to segue into one of the next topics that I do have is, so not only is to be masculine, is it offensive? Not only to admit that there's sex differences, is that offensive? The idea of men, and you would think it would be the opposite, but the idea of men making the effort to improve themselves, yeah, is also offensive to people and is also scary to a lot of people. Why do you think that it's, it's different? I don't know specifically in which terms you mean, but I think I'll tell you one thing that's interesting. It's like, it's like the, it's like the example you talk about. It's like, you know, women kind of get scared sometimes by like, you know, the things you teach guys in your program because it's like, hey, I wasn't attracted to this guy, but now he can do things, he posts on Instagram, he can speak a different way, and the idea that he has control over what he does that can make him more attractive to him, that that scares people. Yeah. So the status quo is the works like this. Rich or good-looking men get the prettiest girls. That has always been the status quo. If you were to teach something that disrupts that status quo, like, hey guys, here's a way to generate attraction through pre-selection or through social networking, if you're an attractive woman, you don't like that. And if you're an attractive man, you really don't like that. Could you imagine if I could teach guys who are mid-tier looking to get the girls that male strippers were getting? Who would be opposed to that? The male strippers. Does that make sense? Like the incredibly good dudes don't like the fact that I teach guys to be super funny because they want to win. They're used to winning. Every those guys are on our side to some degree, but like, it's definitely the opposite. For sure. But I'm saying, what it's, it's more the rich guys. Like I remember there's been several, oh dude, rich guys hate us. There's been several events that I've thrown where like I end up leaving with, like, I, I remember one particular instance where I went to a party and this guy had like this huge mansion, and I brought 20 girls with me. And the two hottest girls left with me. And he was furious. And I'm like, bro, I brought, I left 18 girls at the party. Why are you mad? And the reason why is because he's used to getting everything that he wanted. And he, he, he prays at the altar of looks and money. When you pray, like most, in fact, a lot of VIP hosts do this too. They pray at the altar of looks and money. Meaning like, the other thing that you'll notice is that a lot of VIP hosts here get really annoyed with guys who have good game. Because what'll happen is, yeah, of course, because the VIP, yeah, because the VIP. Because consider this, you're a VIP host. You sell a $15K minimum on on the dance floor at XS. And a guy walks up and like pulls the hottest girl from that dance floor table by just talking to her, and he paid no money. If I'm the VIP host, I'm, you know, furious. Because this guy with game comes up and pulls, he got your girl. And he pissed off, not your girl, he pissed off, he got your client's girl. You're that girl is supposed to be there for the client. And I've had VIP hosts sit me down and be like, bro, you cannot come up to my table and take girls like that. The VIP hosts do not like that. Because VIP hosts, what they do is they feed into the, the altar, they worship at the altar of looks and money. And so when you worship at the altar of looks and money, and Moa is not about looks and money at all, yeah, what happens is, like, you, when you do that, and you see someone like me who teaches short Indian men how to, you know, have generate massive amounts of attraction. By the way, when good-looking white guys see me teach short Indian men, they're like, holy, you know, how the, you know, did he do that? When they see that, when they figure out how to generate massive amounts of attraction, the status quo doesn't like you. Rich guys don't like you teaching less rich guys how to be good with women without being rich. Yeah. Okay. And then women, dude, that's been happening for several. Do you remember that, that time we, it was, uh, I think it was, it was Zook and on stage, Deadmau5. It was like us, like me, you, Kylie, Kendall, Lizzy, and there was like this Russian girl. And then she left that guy's table and they almost threw me out because of that. Yeah. So you, yeah. So that guy had a comp, and then the girl like started walking around with you, and they, he went to security and tried to get you kicked out. Yeah. I've had, I've been, first, first couple years I was here, no one does this to me now. But first couple years while I was here, I was probably kicked out of like 30, 40 tables because I would be there. And I'd be, and it wasn't even that I was trying to game the girls. It's just I was here. Here's what, what I used to do. This is a kind of, this is a little cheat code. I would go up to these like, I would go up to the busiest tables on like an industry night. And I'd take my jacket off. And I was in better shape than everybody there. Yeah. And I would say something like, hey guys, um, I'm going to go to Peppermill. I was always say, I'm going to go to Peppermill and I'm going to get an egg white omelet. It sounds so innocuous, doesn't it? But the girl is sitting there, and she's looking at the, the, the client. And he's like, come to my table, you know, come to my hotel room, do cocaine with me, hear some molly, let's, you know, let's, you know, have sex with with me. Like he's trying to drag her down this path of, let's go to Dress, let's go to the Rhino, let's stay out all night. And then I'm over here like, hey, what's going on guys? I'm going to go eat healthy. And the girls were like, save me. And then they, they would, and I would just walk off. I wouldn't even ask them to leave. Ask Recon about this. Edwin Recon will tell you the story. I would walk off. And Recon would be furious. Not, not Recon is not one of the guys I'm talking about, but he's like, he would have like a buddy of his who was rich. And the girls would just walk off with me. And they, the guys would be, you know, furious. Yeah, they'd be so mad that I did that. Why? That I did it? Because I understand concepts like friend-zoning women, pre-selection. I understand how to use social media to show higher status, access to scarce resources, relevancy, competency. I understand how to manufacture attraction through not breaking rapport, by getting people to comply. I understand how to generate attraction by investment. I understand these concepts and I teach it to people. And so it makes people unhappy. The other people that get unhappy by it, not unhappy because they don't actually believe it exists, are women. Really attractive women don't believe that what I do is real. In fact, really attractive women, for the most part, don't believe that self-help, male self-help is anything. They don't believe it's real. Real estate, yes. You'll see a lot of women at real estate conventions. Real estate, yes. But the idea of like, change your mindset and attract the woman of your dreams. Women are like, ha, that's funny. You teach that. Ha. They think it's silly. Because the idea, a woman, the concept, and by the way, as a man, I feel the same way. If a woman came up to me who was not attractive to me, and I've actually had this actual thing happened. Girl comes up to me and she goes, hey, just let you know, like, I was Miss Nevada back in 19, whatever the, you know, back in 20, whatever. And I was looking at her, I was like, oh, that's awesome, man. That's cool. You should put that on your resume. But she was saying it so that it'd be more attractive to her. And I was like, I'm not going to be, I can't become attracted to a woman I'm not attracted to. But when you explain it to women, because women can become attracted to men they're not attracted to when they get to know them, when they go from an unfamiliar environment to a familiar environment, most women don't even think that's real. The idea that the guy that that gave them their Chick-fil-A could one day drive a Lamborghini and like have, you know, muscles and they'd be attracted to them is so outside their reality, they don't believe it's real. They don't. They legit. My girl, the best example is my girlfriend saying things like, I would have dated you when you were 21. No, you would not have. You would never have dated me when I was 21. You wouldn't even have looked at me twice when I was 21. But in her mind, she believes that whatever she finds attractive about me now at 46 was always baked in. And she doesn't know. No, the ingredients were sprinkled in over the course of 25 years to make me like this. Yeah. But she didn't, she doesn't see that. Because often, and by the way, you can say that men do this too. Like when I hire a new sales associate, I hire you for your efficacy today. I don't hire you because of the stuff the struggles you went through in your past. And women don't generally date men because of the struggles that they went through in order to get to their eight-figure, you know, scalable business. They don't care about the stressful nights you had. Like Kylie does not give a, you know, about the two times I almost went bankrupt. She doesn't care. What she doesn't know, she doesn't like sit there and ask. She does. Because in her mind, I'm just attractive. I'm just, sprinkle fairy dust and then poof, attraction just appeared. She doesn't see all the work that went into me becoming me. I'm not blaming her for this, by the way. Yeah, it's just how the world works. Women in general see a finished product. And that's what they find attractive. So the concept of improving to that finished product makes no sense. When I look at my Lexus, I don't see the Lexus on the conveyor, on the assembly line with the door being put on. It would look so foreign and weird to me. I just see the finished product. And that's how women generally see men as the finished product. So me teaching men to become more attractive, it's not that they don't think it works. They don't even think male improvement is real. They don't even, they can't even conceptualize the idea that it's real. Getting richer is the one exception. That's only because that can apply to everyone. Like a woman can be great at real estate, and a man could be great at real estate. But you know what's funny? A lot of the things that, like they complain about, whether that's like, remember I told you about this clip I sent you the other day where, you know, shout out to our friend Jamie, she was reacting to Instagrams and she was like, you know, I can tell when I see a red pill Instagram. I can know immediately. And they always are posting with these really hot girls and they're like, trying to show that off. And I'm like, that's not most men. Yeah. Well, it's not that that's not most men. That's most. So most red pill people's Instagrams, that's most. So where Jamie got this wrong, those are Moa Instagrams or Cy Chala's Instagrams or Austin Dunham's Instagrams. Those are not red pill Instagrams. Most guys in red pill don't have an Instagram. They don't believe in Instagram. They don't believe in using social media. The problem is, she says that it looks try-hard. The problem is, like for her, for her, she goes, it looks desperate and try-hard. You wouldn't have noticed them though. My point, you would have never even. So number one, she wouldn't have noticed them. And number two, Texas Christian University does a study showing that women tend to find men more attractive when there's other women in the photos. And so from her, because she's so close, because she's actually seen the way the sausage is made, she's so close to it, she sees it and she goes, ah, because I can identify it cognitively now that.

I think it's needy in the reality situation is 99% of women won't see it the same way she does, okay? It's ridiculous, it's absurd. And the thing is, for in in her case, let's say Jamie had a really good-looking boyfriend who was taking pictures without his shirt on. Is that try-hard? That's not try-hard. But men taking pictures with other women? No. We can all, if you take it far enough, anything you do on social media is try-hard. Anything you do on social media comes off as needy. Like there's no, there's no reason for women to post that many photos in a [ __ ] bikini. There's nothing wrong with it. I love, we're all for that. I'm pro-bikini photos. There's no reason to do that that many times unless you want attention for it. So, is that try-hard? What part is, what part is not try-hard at that point?

The, the point of the fact of the matter is, those same men that she would complain are doing things that come off as needy and try-hard and desperate, if you asked those men, "Did you see a sizable and significant increase in the amount of attention you get from women?" The answer is unequivocally, unassailably yes. 100% yes, 100,000%. And the, the further thing that you said before, if they didn't have those photos, she wouldn't have even noticed them. 100%. Which proves the point. Which the point is that like, even the guys that she does notice, the guys who have women that are actually attractive on their Instagram, that is less than 1% of that. Of course, less than the idea that it's red pill or whatever. Again, you remember I told you before, anything you don't like is red pill. Anything you don't like causes school shootings. Anything, anything she doesn't like becomes red pill. Like Andrew Tate's not red pill, and most people in the red pill do not consider uh Pearl Davis to be red pill. But if Andrew Tate or Pearl Davis say something, it's immediately attributed to Red Pill, incredibly, especially if you don't agree with it. Yeah.

And you know, it's, it's interesting, like why a lot of people are against this stuff. But you know, we were, we were at Ban's house the other day, and we were actually sitting down, we were on the couch, and we talked about the fact that like, hey, even in the state it is is in now, where like men are like doing what, you know, women say is attractive, they're super beta, and then they're getting cheated on. It's like, not only is it like men losing their power, it's like neither side's happy, right? Cuz the women are happy cuz they don't have a man that they respect. It's a mal-adoption. Yeah, the women are not happy, but also the guys are also not happy. So no one's even winning. And it's like, when she gets that guy to settle down or commit with her, it's not even the guy that she wants. When in reality, and like, I, I appreciate that Dan teaches this, but you teach this, it's like the best thing for men is to become more attractive. To get better. The best thing for women is also for men to become better. And people don't see that.

So one of my favorite quotes from M. Carle is, "There's two ways to be unhappy." One way is to not get what you want. Yeah. The other way to be unhappy is to get what you want. Okay. Dan has talked about this before. If every meal was a five-star meal, eventually you stop, you stop appreciating it. One of the things is, once a, like every two weeks, I go eat at Wendy's. And the reason why is because when I was growing up, I would eat at Wendy's. And I just appreciate the fact I paid $16 for [ __ ] burger, fries, and a drink. That it's like, not really that good food. But like, I, I want to appreciate where I came from. And I don't need everything I eat to be like a Michelin star. No matter how rich I get, I want to be able to appreciate other things. Like the other thing is, like guys, they only date supermodels because they're super rich. Like, I want to be able to have conversations with women that are not that attractive, that are just normal. I love talking to women who are cardiologists, work at domestic abuse shelters. I met women that are in the military. I love having convers. I don't want to get to the point where I'm so [ __ ] shallow and unappreciative that I can't appreciate any of this stuff. So if you keep getting what you want over and over again, you keep becoming unhappy.

Society, if you were to actually look at the, the purpose of any kind of technology, what is it? It is to lessen human suffering. The horseback, the horse and buggy was to lessen human suffering as they crossed, um, as they went across North America. The, the Colt 45 was to lessen human suffering by protecting one tribe from another. Right? The, any, any of these, these things that you come up with, the part, the high-speed internet, satellite dishes, whatever it was, to end, it was to lessen human suffering. If all you do is lessen human suffering, then there's no obstacle overcome, which is really the key to happiness. Yeah, overcoming obstacles. So because we have fewer and fewer obstacles to overcome, like the biggest obstacle I have to overcome in my life right now is beating Spider-Man. To like, that is literally like, oh God, I got to get back in. I can't beat this one. Like that's the biggest, that's the biggest obstacle is to [ __ ] win at Elden Ring, which is really hard, by the way. If, if that's the biggest obstacle I have to overcome, then, then I start getting fewer and fewer dopamine hits from my accomplishments in my everyday life. There's so little suffering in it. Oh my God, it's 73 degrees and it's so hot. Can someone turn the AC down? Because I get weaker and weaker and weaker because of that. What happens is I get less and less happy. So to answer your question, the reason why people in general would be less happy is because there's fewer things to go up, up against.

Great. Well, the other thing is that going back to what I was originally asking is that the, like the best thing for men is for men to get better. But also the best thing for women is for also men to get. The best thing in the world for men is for men to be attractive and not creepy. And the best thing in the world for women is for men to be not attractive and not creepy. Yeah, absolutely. Cuz women like, women can't be creepy. If you've ever had a bisexual girlfriend, it's really hard when you have to explain to her like, you can just go up to that girl and grab her boob and she's not going to do anything. And you're like, she's like, what? What are you talking about? Go up to that girl and grab her boobs. She's not going to say, she's not going to get pissed. She's not, especially if she's really pretty. It's crazy. Like women, attractive women can't be creepy. Like no matter what. Dude, if you heard some of the things that my ex-girlfriends would say to me, like the text messages, and they were, it was a guy saying it to a woman, it would come off as the most creepy, sexually harassing, Mantic [ __ ] I've ever seen. "I just want to use your body for my BL." They would say this stuff. But because it's a woman saying it, it's never creepy, right? Yeah. It's.

But that's great. It's a d Mor difference between men and women. Women do not, women. Here's the, here's the dichotomy. Women are more calibrated than men. Women, by the time they're 22, have been approached by more men than I will be ever approached by anyone in my entire life. Women are more calibrated than men. Okay? And women don't have to be calibrated when they talk to men. Women can be totally autistic and [ __ ] Asperger's when they go talk to men. And if they're hot, dudes will do anything to go out with that girl. It is absolutely crazy. It also helps a dynamic with yourself. Like, I mean, I don't know if you ever talk about this, but I think I never understood the strip club thing. Like, after you get a lap dance once, I mean, it's pretty much, there's not really much special about it. But if you go to a strip club with Kendall Myers and Lizzie Costa, Myra, watch how much, how differently they treat you. You should always go to the strip club with female friends and watch how that flips the dynamic. If you are completely devoid of any validation from women or any sexual intercourse, the dopamine hit that you get from a woman grinding on you, I would, because I used to manage a strip club, yeah, that would be so great. It would be the equivalent of you and I actually having sex with a beautiful woman. Does that make sense? That's C. Because you live in such scarcity. Yeah. So that's the reason why strip clubs exist. Strip clubs exist because people can have feelings that are stronger than objective reality. And objective reality, they're not going home with you. Yeah. But your feeling is that they, your body feels like this beautiful woman might go home with you. That's. It's so crazy when you come to the realization again. I, if you go there with women, and you have already have pre-selection, they actually might. Would I do that at a nightclub before a strip club? Because a strip club, there's certainly, I'm saying, if I had to choose between going by myself versus going with women, go with women. To a course, I've definitely, like, I've been out one time, I went out with Combat Barbie to a strip club, and this girl like asked me for my number and wanted to go out with me afterwards because she saw me with this really hot girl, right? So, so for sure, that's, that's definitely happened before. What I would recommend though, is like, if you're going to go to, I, I know we weren't here to talk about stripper game, but what I would recommend is that the first thing you do is get them out of the stripper frame. And I always recommend, hey, here's a $30,000 bikini competition, we're throwing in an animal rescue event, hey, podcast, here's a podcast, come on, access, VASS. That's exactly right. That's what I would do if I was talking to a girl at a strip club. 100%. Get them out of that frame. 100%.

Something I want this podcast, and I think this is why, you know, you having you on here as the first guest was the perfect fit, is because I think a lot of people who are going to watch this, and because from your following and also other people who are going to come on here, is that I think when you watch, and not to put any hate, I love their podcast, I love whatever, I love Fresh Fit, and I love all red pill. Ro Tosi is one of my best friends. But I think what a lot of guys do who watch this content is there's a lot of [ __ ] blame being passed around. It's like, you watch this content and it's like, women are the problem. These hoes aren't loyal. The three fours aren't like this. And while some of that stuff is true, I think a lot of content does not put the onus and the responsibility on men. Listen, and it's only men watching us, so we have to put it on. Yeah, and we have to. But a lot of comps not doing that, right? So I think something, you know, I want you to illustrate on today on this podcast is that men need to start taking responsibility. Look, at the end of the day, it's men who are subscribing to our only fans. It's men who are addicted to porn. It's men who are giving these girls this free attention where these average girls think they're T. Right? Men are the problem with that. And I don't think a lot of people are really, really illustrating that. So talk more about that.

So, so the reason why I'm never going to have millions of subs on on my show is because I, I teach improvement. There's nothing more boring than improvement. Male improvement is a, I'm telling you firsthand, it's a very boring subject, okay? It, in general, it is. Now, if you're around guys who really know how to make money, which is a small group of people, like you're at a Taylor Welsh conference, or you're with Cole Gordon, or you're at the 10X conference, if you're around those people, which make up less than 1%, those people will absorb your content and love the [ __ ] out of you, right? Those people are great clients and they're great friends to have. But most people don't like the concept of improvement. I teach improvement. What, what happens on these other shows? The reason why they do so well is because they sort of teach victimization. Like men are a victim. And by the way, to a certain extent, they are. But women are victims also, to a certain extent. Um, the main thing is like, number one, if 80% of my, of my following is male, I'm only going to speak to men. Like, I'm not going to tell women how they can improve. I do give women one piece of advice: listen to a man, look, watch what a man does, and don't listen to what he says. You're probably going to do a lot better picking a partner. And also have one guy friend who's a complete [ __ ] and if you have the, your guy friend who's a [ __ ] who like hips you up to game, you'll do way better with women, way better with men, if you have that. And like having a really strong like father figure also helps. But not, not because he can be more discerning. But for the most part, my advice goes to men. And because my advice has to do with improvement and not shaming or judgment, my advice is less interesting on social media. There used to be a cheat code to get big on social media. You know what it was? It was man versus woman. If you could make man versus woman fight on camera, you could get big really quick. The best example would be Fresh and Fit or or would be Andrew Tate. Man versus woman fighting, man versus women conflicting was the way to do it. And they've really ratioed that down a lot. It doesn't work anywhere near to the same extent that it does. But like what I did was, hey man, here's the thing that you can improve to do better with women. That's [ __ ] boring.

I'm, we talked about self-help. So I, I work in the self-help community. That's what Men of Action is. The best part of self-help is what? The easiest thing to sell. Self-help was, what do you remember? Feelings. Mindset. Mindset, right? It costs me nothing to produce feelings in you. My, my markup on feelings is one is infinite. The cost of goods sold on me selling you a mindset or a feeling is zero. What do I sell? Actions. The worst thing in the world to sell in self-help is what I sell. Actions. Actions don't feel good. Actions look like work. Actions look like trouble. Actions take time. Actions require effort. So because I'm in the hard part of, of [ __ ] self out, now, as a result, though, my testimonials are 100x better than other people's, for sure. Because the guy who goes to the Tony, the Tony Robbins conference and he's like, yeah, I feel better, but goes back to his mom's basement. He's not a good testimonial. Two years from now, my guys are incredible testimonials because they went through, took action, and they got to the other end. So I'm all, again, I'm not, I'm not the guy trying to steer the Titanic away from the iceberg. I'm the guy leading people onto the lifeboats. I, and if you want to join, you can join. If you want to join, you can join. I'm the guy taking you to Seal Beach to become a SEAL, not to be a regular part of the Navy. I'm the guy telling you how to become a pararescue jumper, not to become a regular part of the Air Force. I'm the guy trying to make you a Green Beret, not to become a regular part of the Army. I am only looking for the, the few, the proudest, the [ __ ] bravest men to want to come and do what I do. What I teach. But here's the ultimate irony, is that as I teach you this, as the world becomes less like, as masculine boundaries become weaker, men's testosterone levels start to decrease. Yeah. And teaching any sort of like masculine intent becomes more and more, um, dissuaded. The guys who go through my course are going to look like [ __ ] superheroes. Yeah. And my kids are going to look like superheroes because my kids are going to say, "Yes, yes ma'am. No, ma'am." They're going to read a ton of [ __ ] books. They're going to be in great shape. They're going to have really, really good dietary habits. And when they get to college, all these other fat weirdos with purple hair are going to look at them and be like, "Those people are [ __ ] superheroes. Those are superheroes." My, I'm going to have a daughter who's a [ __ ] purple belt Jiu-Jitsu when she gets to college. They're going to be [ __ ]. My, my son is going to be a quarterback of the football team. They're going to be [ __ ] superheroes. Yeah. Compared to the rest of the population. So I'm like, Rolo's trying to create a movement. My's trying to create a movement. I'm just about the SEALs. I'm just about the Navy SEALs. I'm only about the best and the brightest. If you are brave enough to come and you are willing to take the, the level of, um, what's the word I'm looking for? Criticism that I'm willing to give you, bro. I yell on the calls. I make people cry. I make people cry. If you're willing to deal with that level, then you're going to do really, really well. If you, if you have a victim mentality, do not work with me. If you make a victim mentality, like it's not only that not working with me is a bad idea, you're going to get on the group calls, we're going to call you out for victim mentality, and no one's going to support you. No one. Because we're all, we, the guys in MOA are so, they, so clearly see victim mentalities. Quickly, they can quickly point them out. It's also the reason why they're really good at picking out red flags in their partners because they see the victim. Most red flags come from a victim mentality. When you think about it, most red flags. I have a victim mentality, therefore I need more validation, so I go have sex with multiple men. I need more validation, therefore I'm more likely to cheat because of my victim mentality. I have a victim mentality, therefore I have a bad attitude when you introduce me to your friends. I have a victim mentality, therefore I don't like the fact that you're so open and you have so many friends. So victim mentalities tend to lead to the insecurities that destroy and erode relationships. So, so whenever we see that victim mentality, we quickly point it out and be like, dude, girls don't want to be with you. And the other thing I want to say is, while I, improvement is my main, um, the main thing I teach, I also teach, uh, discernment without judgment. So like, it's not, "These hoes ain't loyal," like Chris Brown. It's, it's, "These hoes, they for everybody. Catch them all around. They at every party. They ain't going to be loyal." Not to anybody. But I still love these hoes. I still love these hoes. And that's the difference. It's like the way Whiz Khalifa and, uh, and, um, not Project Pat, um, Juicy Jay say it. That's the correct way to believe it. It's like, like again, I've said this a million times, if you have a 900 body count, I'd love to go to the club with you. I'd love to have you on my podcast. I'd love for us to be homies. I just don't want to date you. Yeah. I don't, I don't. I love you. Look, dude, I legitimately will tell you that if Elaine Foresy, Nicolette Shea, if she ever gets married, I will be on the front row at her [ __ ] wedding. Yeah. But she's also been one of the biggest porn stars in the world. And I probably wouldn't marry. Same thing with Savannah Stags. Same like, same thing. Like I love, I love Nara Ford. But if Nara Ford, like, Nara Ford is not someone I would want to marry. Does that make sense? I still love them. Yeah. And you want of the funny thing is, Savannah Stags, Nara Ford, and Nicollet Shay, they don't want to get married. I'm not even saying something. They don't even want to get married. On this exact table, they don't care what we say. They don't care what we say. They don't want to get married. They don't, they want to make money on OF. They don't want to get married. It's like, if, if it's like six women per every 1,000 is the rate at which people are getting married. The marriage, the one of the reasons, so the divorce rate leveled off, it didn't, it didn't keep increasing. And one of the reasons why is because the marriage rate just plummeted. Yeah, people aren't getting married. And so why is, so whenever you tell, whenever I tell a lot of these girls, it's like, "You understand how you'd be hard to date?" Their response is, "Yeah, but I don't want to date anyway. I want to [ __ ] whoever I want on my OnlyFans. I don't want to get married." Yeah. You know, I don't, I've already had a kid. I don't want to have another kid, blah, blah, blah. Whatever. Or if I have a kid, I don't need a man. And then the thing is, like, you know, when you, when you go to church, you read the Bible. When you have the prescription of like, "I want to be a bad independent [ __ ]," you don't have a, you don't have the Bible. You know what you have? You have Cardi B. You have Megan Thee Stallion. They're telling you, they're giving you a playbook on how to live your life. It's terrible advice, but it's, it's, it's the playbook on how to live your life. When you ask, when you survey women who work, 83% of women who work say that if they had the opportunity to have stayed home with the children instead of working, 83% of the time they said they would rather do that. Yeah. You don't see the same thing with men. 100%. You don't. It's so, it's just this Andrew Allwes, dude, Isabella James, God, she's amazing. She was an awesome person. I [ __ ] love Swedish Bella. They're all cool. They're all friends of mine. But I wouldn't want to marry them. Now, the difference is now, not specifically because they're like good friends. Hey, the biggest proponent of hoes is me. Yeah. The, I have no judgment. The, the, the other part is like, it would be different if it was like Kiley Myers or Caitlyn Ronin. They don't, they don't pose nude and they don't have sex on their, on their IG. That would be different. Someone like that. I know people think it's crazy because I'm really different from the red pill people. Yeah. I don't care if I have a girlfriend who's on OnlyFans showing bikini pictures and she's not nude. That doesn't really bother me. Yeah. Or Patreon. What I, what I, it's not an issue. I'm not saying it's bad. It's just not efficient. What I would not want to do is, as a performance coach, date a woman and then my clients go on her OF and watch her [ __ ] other men for [ __ ] $4.99. I can't do that. And it doesn't make me a misogynist or a bigot for feeling that way.

Yeah, dude, it's so funny. Uh, I'll die on this statement too. Like the best evolution psychologist I've ever known is Project. Yeah. The best evolutionary psychologist of all time is Willie D. Project Pat, Juicy Jay. Those are the greatest. On, yeah. Why do you think like the rappers, their advice is just so accurate, bro? It's just so accurate. Says, "Chase a chat, never chase a [ __ ]." Like it's the truth, bro. Hey, don't save them. They don't want to be saved. Like Willie D, you got to let a hoe be a hoe. The best advice I've ever heard are from rappers. Like they give the best advice. Like, don't. So you have, you have to rank it though. Like, what is the best lines of advice from all the rappers? Everything Future says, pretty much is the best. It's the best. It's like, if I, if she catch me cheating, I won't never tell her. Sorry. Like, like Future gives the best. He the most best. And then after that, I would say Project Pat. I think Project Pat gives a ton of great advice. It's funny because on the upside of side of it, you know, I love Cardi B. I love Megan Thee Stallion. But [ __ ] the, I cannot believe like how much I, it's like uncomfortable how good their music is, bro. Dude, Megan Thee Stallion is so good. Like I listen, I cannot stop listening to her [ __ ]. But her advice is [ __ ] terrible. It's just like, just [ __ ] them all and use their dick and just [ __ ] all of them and get their money and rob them. And I'm like, goddamn, man. This is what she's telling women to do. And it's like, it's so glorified. And like, her beats are awesome. She sounds like a female Project Pat. But like, she's trying to give the same advice to women that Project Pat was giving to men. But we're different. And it does work. Yeah. You understand what I'm saying? And it works if you're, it works if you're Cardi B. It works if you're Megan Thee Stallion. Because those girls, because they're rich and famous, they're going to get a guy, right? But for the, the average woman to do that stuff is a bad idea. For an average woman to say, "Hey, I'm going to try out OnlyFans." They end up making $20 like a month on [ __ ] OnlyFans. And there's videos of them like doing like crazy [ __ ] that's that's up there forever, dude. You know that that's never going away. Yeah. Was it worth it for $20 a month for you to do that? No. It's [ __ ] crazy. That's why I just think it's a bad idea. Yeah. Yeah. No, I, I totally understand that. And, um, you know, something we talk about is, you know, when you look at like more traditional people, something we talked about the apartment one time was like, you know, Mike, why does, why does Grandma warn you about them hoes? Yeah. It's so funny. Like, when you're young, and like, so one of the things I, I love about the, the play Romeo and Juliet is that even when you go back four, 500 years, William Shakespeare understood the impetuous of the impetuousness of youth. Yeah, right? The whole point of Romeo and Juliet was not to try to tell you how what how romantic this was. It was to illustrate the stupidity of you using your emotion in order to determine the person you want to spend the rest of your life with. Because in the end, they [ __ ] kill themselves. It was, it's a dark comedy. That's actually what Romeo and Juliet is. We just interpret it differently now because we live in the Hallmark generation where we all believe in like soulmates and true love. And that wasn't William Shakespeare's point of that. That whole play was not that Romeo and Juliet were true love and soulmates. It's that they were stupid. That was the whole point, right? The Montague and the Capulet, because they didn't want these kids to be together, they tried harder to be together, and then they ended up killing. How's that title? Grandma. So Grandma doesn't have all that [ __ ] testosterone and estrogen raging through her hormones. And Grandma's seen a lot. Like, if you guys want to listen to somebody, you guys ever had a grandma? Maybe this isn't something that's happened to you, but Grandma knows when granddaughter is pregnant before she does. Yeah. Grandma gives really good advice. Grandma's trying to protect the brand. Grandma's not thinking about sex. Grandma understands, I want to protect this family. So Grandma knows I need my daughter not to get pregnant at 16. Grandma knows when granddaughter is dating a guy who's a piece of [ __ ]. Grandma can see these things because she can look at them. So one of the problems is that Grandma will tell you that the girl you're dating, a, yeah. So this is the thing. Grandma. So when you have a girl, and girl is dating a good-looking guy, and girl asks her friend, "Hey, do you think I should keep dating this guy?" Her friend, who's also pre-menopausal, is going to look at the guy and be like, "Oh my God, he's hot." Like, they're both affected by the same attraction cues of the guy. So, like, do you understand what I'm saying? Like, if you saw a girl, and I was dating a girl, like, "Hey, what are you thinking?" "She's [ __ ] hot as [ __ ]." You're going to be like, "Damn, that girl's hot." Like, you're affected by her attraction cues the same way I am. So I shouldn't be going to you for advice. Sure. But Grandma isn't, Grandma is not affected. Grandma doesn't care that [ __ ] Tommy is a cute little boy. Grandma can see through that [ __ ]. Yeah. And that's why ladies, listen to Grandma. Grandma actually knows. Like, as young, impetuous people were like, "These old [ __ ] people don't know what they're talking about." No, they do. And not only do they do that, they understand long-term. The reason why relationships last for 70 years is because of respect, not because of love. It's because of respect. Grandma understands, I need to, I need to protect the dignity of my family. Yeah. Rather than worry about your 16-year-old hormones. And so that's why I say, listen to Grandma. Grandma, Grandma, Grandma always knows what's up. Grandma, Grandma gets it. Grandma absolutely grasped it. Um, cool, man. See a couple other topics I wanted to dive into is just like the crazy [ __ ] we see that's just like clear examples of evolution. You know, uh, one that we talked about the other day was the, uh, the Chris Brown situation. Can you believe these chicks are paying to get like a photo with Chris Brown with him grabbing their ass? Yeah. I can. And wait, did you see the story where a chick got broken up with by her fiance? Good on him, by the way. About that, that situation. I'm curious, who objects to that idea? Like the, it's not just that Chris Brown, she took a picture with Chris Brown. It's not just that Chris Brown grabbed her ass and simulated like a sexual act with your girlfriend. It's that your girlfriend paid him. That's the part that is so mind-numbing to me. The idea that she would think that she could do that and then it would be totally fine. If I saw my girlfriend sitting on some like male stripper lap while we were together, I just like, it's got. The thing is, it has to be done. You paid money to go to a male review and sit on another man's lap and then take a picture with him. Like that's. By the way, I wouldn't even care if a girl I was seeing went to a male review with her friends because it was like a bachelorette party. Don't take pictures with the male strippers, though. That's the problem. And it's just like, it's so crazy when I see that. When I see that kind of stuff, it's just, I, that one is just the most clear example. And these women are like, this business model that Chris Brown has, I bet I guarantee you is going to grant him a couple million. If he, if he only has to do 1,000 of those and he does 100 per show, he's going to get, he's going to get to a mill. So if he does 10 and he does 100, that's a million. It's over a thousand to get that photo with him. Wait, but let's go level deeper than that on the women's side, bro. He beat the [ __ ] out of Rihanna. Crazy. He beat the [ __ ] out of her. And they're still running to him. Yeah. You, you're having men, like if you don't believe that evolution is real and that women are attracted to dark triad traits, like they're literally paying him $1,200 to get picked up and have their asses grabbed by a woman beater. It's crazy when you consider this. And like then you sit there and like, "Hey man, I'm afraid to post this meme because my family's not going to like it." Chris Brown beat the, the B Jesus out of [ __ ] dude. Take a second. Stop this video. Look at the pictures of Rihanna after she got beat up by Chris Brown, and you will never look at him the same way. But why? They still come back to him over and over again because he, he expresses this level of sexuality. He's a bad boy. And it's like, and these women are paying him to have him grab their ass on these. It's crazy to me. It's crazy that you say that and then you're like, "Yeah, men and women are the same." No, we're not. Yeah. No, we're not. And look, we all knew they were going to get back together. That's a crazy dude got back together after Chris Brown beat the crap out of Rihanna. I made the joke one time, I was on a boot camp, this probably '07 or '08. I was like, "You know, they're getting back together." But and I was kidding. And then they got back together. Rihanna went back to Chris Brown after he beat the crap out of her. Like, what do you, and this woman is worth hundreds, this woman is like, I think a billionaire at this point. Yeah. It's just so crazy when you see that. Like, when you consider that Rihanna went back to Chris Brown, and to some people, Rihanna is considered one of the most beautiful women in the world. And then when you consider Elon Musk, who is one of the smartest humans who have ever lived on this planet, put his dick in Amber Heard. It is [ __ ] mind-numbing. A woman who [ __ ] on on on uh Johnny Depp's bed. He put his dick in this woman, bro. It's like, when you come to these realizations and then you're like, "Oh my God, it's so embar." Like, you can get away with anything. In fact, you want to know a really great way to get popular on social media right now? Get cucked by your girlfriend. Because apparently that's a h. If you're neon or [ __ ] like like Logan Paul, like getting, having your girlfriend embarrass you makes you look. Aiden Ross getting cheated on by his girl and then go public with it, that made him more. And then forgive her. And then forgive her. That makes, makes him more popular because that happened. Like, you understand? There's no good. Get cucked and support Russia. You will be a millionaire. There is no, there is no good guy status or bad guy status. When I was growing up, it was Reagan and Gorbachev. When I was growing up, there was Hulk Hogan and the Iron Sheik. There was good guys. There was the Autobots and the Decepticons. And now it's not like that. Now it's Breaking Bad, and he's the good guy, but he's also the bad guy. It's The Sopranos, he's the good guy, but he's also the bad guy. It's House M.D., he's the good guy, but he's also the bad guy. It's [ __ ] Ozark, he's the good guy, but he's also the bad guy. You know what I'm saying? It's, it's [ __ ] Jamie Lannister in Game of Thrones. He's the good guy. He was the bad guy, but then he becomes the good guy. Like, there is no, there's no good guy status or bad guy status anymore. It's only status. The number of people that I watched walked, I watched get OJ Simpson a selfie with him made me understand that this was true. It's just status. It makes no difference. The number of women who say, "Just 11,000 yards, dude." The, just 11,000, 11,000 yards in one game and four touchdowns. Uh, the, but like the number of women that I've seen come to me and say, "I would never sleep with Dan Bilzerian." Then he asks them out, and they immediately have sex with him. It's just, you come to this realization of how the world is. We are hairless murder apes, and we chase after [ __ ] status and shiny objects. That is actually the world that we live in. And the quicker you understand that, the more you can get through it. The more you can transcend it. But if you're an advertiser or a salesperson, and you don't understand the, the concepts of status, get ready for poverty, because that's where you're headed. 100%. Uh, hey, question, is there someone coming right after this or no? Okay, got it. All right, so got 20, 25 minutes. Um, all right, so Mike, something, you know, I really want to get into because I know, look, a lot of guys see your content, you know, they see the parties and like, obviously, you know, it's marketing, right? With the girls thing. But, you know, I, you know, we talk about being the guy who gets it. Being the guy who gets it is not just for, you know, meeting women, dating. It's also for networking, business, closing deals, everything like that. You know, elaborate more on how you have to teach guys how they can actually build an awesome network and actually create, create these networks that are going to get them to the next level.

Something, here's something I noticed about you. No offense, but there are people even before you had this podcast and like when you had like 10,000 followers, there were people you were friends with back in the day that you had no business being friends with. Like Baren, Brandon Carter, Greg Gallop, Ty Lopez. How about, how about Jim? How about Jim Jackson and Jeremy Piven? Yeah, exactly. So how do you use like these concepts that you teach, but also to build that elite network that's going to help you in life? Okay. Something Grant told me recently, the majority of our leads come from guys who want help with women, like how women and dating. But the guys who convert the best, do you remember which ones they were? Guys who want the guys' high-status networking. So the high-status networking, the reason why that works is because the high-status networking guys, you don't have to explain this concept to them. They already get it. The holistic man is attractive to women, not the man who just works on becoming attractive with women. One of the big problems that I see is the guy who gets the master's degree and he [ __ ] goes to the good university and he does all these things and he wears the polo button-up because his mommy told him that's what he needs to get a good girl, rather than get good with women. Yeah. He goes off and tries to become really wealthy and he goes off and tries to like move to a big city and get a great job so that he can get the girl, rather than just becoming good with women. And the real, the way to what the difference between those things, the, the reality of the way to become good with women is one, you can try to manipulate them, which I highly don't recommend because women are more calibrated than men. Or two, you get in better shape, read better books, become more charismatic, you start becoming a leader of your group, running charity events, you do things to become a better holistic man so that women find you attractive. Guys who understand high status networking, I don't have to explain that to them. Guys who just want help with dating, when I sit there, so if you go through Men of Action, here's how it goes, ready? Uh, chapter one is, is, uh, is social networking, right? Or it's, no, yeah, it's social networking. So we go over the concepts of like, uh, treat them all saying, make them talk about themselves, that kind of stuff. Chapter two, or phase two, is, uh, we used to call it entrepreneurship, but now it's called time management and efficiency. Pillar three is called, pillar three is called leadership. Pillar four is called mindset. Pillar five, finance. Pillar six is, um, high-status networking. Pillar seven is event planning. Pillar eight is evolutionary psychology. Pillar nine is critical thinking. And pillar 10 is winning mindset. Yeah. Okay. So what I'm telling you is 25% of my courses about women. Yeah. The other 75% of my course is you becoming this awesome dude that other people count on, find useful, build a scalable business. You're the, you're the person that everyone in your group finds their girlfriend through, finds their employees through, finds their employers through, finds their sponsors through, finds their locations through, finds their apartment through. You're the person that everyone gets their book recommendations from, that gets their movie recommendations, their TV recommendations, they all get it from you. You are the mid, you're the hub. Yeah. You're the social hub. That's what I teach you to become. And so guys don't grasp that part at first. But once you become the social hub, and now your birthday party becomes like the it event of the of the season. And not only do you get the girls there, every lawyer wants to be there, every business guy wants to be there. And you have a high status network. Point at that point, there's no more cold approach. There's no more dating. There's no more game. You're just getting chosen.

Here's the question that, like, and I, I had this, you know, I was wondering this too, you know, when I started like moving here and stuff like that. And tell me if you had the same thought. You know, it's like, okay, well, there's Aran, there's Jeremy Piven, there's all these like high-status guys, right? And then there's, there was you, right? How, with your, the things that you teach, how do you network with somebody who is just objectively higher value than you? Like, like, like Dan Bilzerian, just more famous, he just has more women than you, they're just richer than you. How do you even get yourself in those circles with people who are objectively better than you? There are autonomic responses that you get when you're around higher status people or really attractive women, and I don't have them anymore because I'm so used to being around them. So I treat them all the same. I don't change my inflection. That's number one. And number two, I'm always useful. Yeah. I'm always like, with Jeremy, he would do like, uh, comedy shows, and I would bring a bunch of girls to his comedy show. With Dan, if he wanted help with some sort of like business thing, I would introduce him to an expert in that, in that specific area, right? That's how I would do it. I would, I was constantly with Cole Gordon, I would introduce him possibly to clients. But whoever was with Ty Lopez, I would, I gave him a forum to do like a podcast. But the reason why I was useful to him is because I did more research on Ty Lopez than anybody else. So, and because I had known Ty for 10 years, our interview was better. Because I knew Dan for 10 years, our interview was better. And because I had read every book by David Buss, our interview was better. So that's why. So for me, what I would tell you is, if you want to network with people way out of your league, be, figure out a way to be useful to all of them. And you do so, you get invited to everything. So how do you teach that in your program though? Like, how do you teach guys who, you know, are are not objectively higher status to start networking with people who are higher status than them? Triple speed audiobooks, double podcasts. That's one of the ways. Like, just load, load up with as much information as you can. And the other thing is like, in the critical thinking section of the, of the, of Men of Action, like learn how to be able to anticipate and solve other people's problems. If you do, man, I swear I get called.

For advice from the most random people that you would guys you would never believe hit me up for advice. You would never guys with massive social media followings, guys who have eight-figure businesses will hit me up for advice on certain things. And the reason why is because they know whenever they're around Michael Stin, I have a solution or at least I can point you in the for Sol. Because I'm get your girlfriend, I'm the guy. Your boyfriend, I'm the guy. You get your employees and your employers through. I'm the you get your sponsors through. I'm the guy you get your book list through. Patrick B. David said something great in his book, "Your Next Five Moves." He said, "Book drop, don't name drop. Book drop, don't name drop." Okay, so that's the reason why because I am always useful and I'm always solving problems. The way I show love to my friends is solving problems for them. Sure. And so that, that's, that's my way of communicate. I don't say, "Hey bro, I love you." I say, "I solve your problem." It's like, "Trouble with your girl? Let me, let me explain to you how to deal with this." So we're going to write shorter text messages with her. We're going to be less reactive to it. And I'm going to teach you where we're going to go, where you're going to meet 10 other girls like her so she understands that that you're the scarce resource, she's not. And then when you get to that point, then he's like, "Oh man, thank you for." And I just, and I'm very, I talk to him exactly in the tit, the pitch and tone and tenor that I'm speaking right now. Yeah. Very calmly. I don't change it because they're high status, right? I don't use a bunch of verbal crutches. My eyes don't get big. My palms don't get sweaty. And because I've done that so many times, I know exactly. If I ever met Elon Musk, I know exactly what I'd ask him about. Yeah. Be like, "What are you going to do about the radiation shielding when you put that first group up on Mars? Are you going to put it underground, etcetera? Like, what in material physics is going to help you?" So I would ask him these questions. And in his mind, he'd be like, "Holy [ __ ] like this guy actually knows what he's talking about." That's what I would do because I studied astrophysics in college. So like, that, that's what I would do. Whenever I, whenever I talk to Dan, Dan, we shoot the [ __ ] or whatever, but I'm always trying to say like, "How can I provide value to my friends?" Yeah. And that raises your status in that person's. Your status is continual, right? Obviously from a third-person perspective, yes, Dan's higher status than us. But from, you have to see it from the person's perspective. From his perspective, we're helping him, we're solving this problem, we're introducing them to their whatever the thing is going to be. So your status raises in their eyes. And that's how you bridge that.

I got another thing for you. I have several friends that are worth several hundred million dollars. And whenever I hang out with them, one of the common issues that they have is they're not quite sure who's really their friend. Yeah. So I have a couple of friends of mine, like of my friends are worth over $100 million. Whenever I hang out with them, I never ask them for girls and I never ask them for money, ever. What I do though is every time I'm always introducing them to new people. And it usually takes a couple of years. But after a while, they're like, "Oh, Michael's actually my friend. He's just trying to solve problems for me. He never asks me for anything. I like, I love this guy." And that's why I become friends with so many of them. But what am I doing? What am I getting out of the relationship? And the answer is, they got $100 million. Somehow, I just want to learn. Just, just teach me what you did. Yeah. Teach me. That's all I'm asking for. And if I'm one of those people, I don't feel used because Michael's asking me a question. I actually feel privileged and I feel, I feel complimented. I feel like happy about the fact that he thought so highly of me that he was willing to ask me a question on how to make money or how to make this more successful.

100%. And I think what a lot of people overlook is like the skills needed to, you know, what you teach guys, right? Like to meet the women that they like, but also for you to meet those high-size guys are the same skills. Yeah. So when you get, when you get the highest level of sales, when you get the highest level of interpersonal communication, the highest level of intersexual dynamics, and the highest level of dating, they're the same skills. Great example. If you ever read or book, he eliminates neediness and avoids behavior. Those are exact, those are textbook words out of a dating, dating book. But it's the same thing. If you are meeting a higher value person and you do what most guys do, and they don't even realize it, right? Like, what do most people do when they go to a business conference? Right? They're like, there's always like this 10% of wealthy guys. A lot of people are trying to sell them, work with them. But if you meet them at a high-value event, you meet them at a cool place, you meet them at a party with a bunch of hot girls, he's going to [ __ ] treat you different. It's because your status is different, your frame is different. It's the same things that we've been talking about. Podcast. I'm giving away the end here. But if you get to the end of Men of Action, one of the things, the homework assignments I give you is to sneak into a place you're not supposed to get into. Oh yeah. And if you guys have ever been to a conference with me, I always go backstage even when I'm not supposed to go backstage. And when I see my friends back there, I, I hang out with them. I never ask them to take a picture with me. I just talk to them. And no one acts like it's weird that I'm back there ever. It's one of the weirdest things ever. I remember, uh, when I was in Dallas, West Watson came off the stage and I just walked backstage. I was like, "I'm here, Wes." And the security guard just let me go back there. And I came to talk to Wes, and he was so happy to [ __ ] see me. I got a picture of it. And then I get to the very back, and the guy throwing the conference, he was happy to see me. But I didn't have a wrist, I didn't have a lanyard that was letting me to go back there. What is it? I assume status. That's what happened. And I act normal in those situations. It's the reason why. And you treat them all, I treat them all the same. It's the reason why. Dude, we went to, me and, uh, me and Kylie went to see Russ the Soul on Saturday. And when we went there, you were, you were standing right behind me. Did we talk this weekend? Yeah. Dude, what did the security guard do when I walked in? Even acknowledge us. Like he just, like, "Yeah, come on by." He looked at me and he just didn't even, he just let me on stage. Like the hardest club to get into. And then I go, dude, we didn't even have Kylie. I didn't even have girls with me. And he was just like, "Yeah, go ahead." Yeah, just walk in. And then, and then we go to like multiple tables, we're just offering us alcohol, all the alcohol we wanted. And the reason why is because I don't look like I don't belong. I look like I'm supposed to be there. And it is this very, very subtle thing that you learn. And it goes back to one of the original things we talk about. It's Harvey Specter. Gets it. Lewis Litt does it. Harvey Specter, if you put him on stage at Coachella, looks like he's supposed to be there. Lewis Litt looks like he's on acid. That's the difference. It's like, how do you react whenever status is presented to you? Do you freak out or can you act normal?

100%. 100%. And like, you know, when it comes to like actually taking action, you know, a lot of guys just aren't taking action nowadays, right? That's the biggest thing holding men back. Like they're not going to the gym. They're not taking the action that they, they know they need to take. Something you talk about a lot is that, you know, the easiest way to not go to the gym tomorrow is to not go to the gym today. The easiest way to go to the gym tomorrow is go to the gym today. Yeah. You and premise of this show, premise of your program is take [ __ ] action. Absolutely. You have to. When we get guys on the call sometimes, and they're like, considering joining Men of Action, one of the problems is obviously it seems like a sales technique because we want you to join today or whatever. But it's not just that. The reason why we want you to join today is because this, like, like not my words, David Goin's words, your inner [ __ ] comes out when you sit there and you don't get, you jump on the call. You're sitting there talking to Tristan, you're talking to Tyler, and you make the decision to not join Men of Action. That's your inner [ __ ] talking. And your inner [ __ ] starts yelling at you more and more. Like, "Well, I'll talk to you guys on Monday." Well, your inner [ __ ] has had like the monopoly, monopolization of your psych, your psych. The inner [ __ ] has monopolized your psyche for the last four days. Yeah. So that, of course, your inner [ __ ] is going to win. People who take action, one of the, the advantages of taking action is that you don't ever listen to the inner [ __ ]. By the way, when I say [ __ ], I mean weak man. I am not trying to, it's not a pejorative towards women. I just mean like your inner men acting incredibly [ __ ] weak-minded. That's one of the things that happens. And it sounds like a sales technique for us, but it isn't. Our best clients just bought immediately because they were ready to take action. They, because like, here's the thing, when the guys are like, "I need to get more familiar with your program." No, you don't. You can took a look at my photos and see that every single thing I'm saying is the [ __ ] truth. You can see in two seconds, like, look who's been on my podcast. Like, I'm teaching course while networking. Whenever we get guys who immediately jump on, like right after we talk to them, those are the guys who take the most action. The guys who don't immediately jump on, they're like, "I need a couple days to think about it." Those are the ones who are like, "My inner [ __ ] is talking to me right now, and I'm letting my inner [ __ ] win again." It sounds like a sales. You notice the guys when they get on a call with your sales team, that the guys who take action, not, and not just like, you don't pressure them to take action, just so, cuz it's a sales technique. It's like, no, if it logically works, if it's something that's for them, and they trust you, what else is there? Even more than that, I provide more irrefutable visual evidence of the efficacy of my program than anyone in the history of the world. More than, [ __ ] Grant Cardone. I provide more irrefutable visual evidence that the things I tell you will come to fruition than anyone in the world. Yeah. Like, I know plenty of people love Tony Robbins. He's the king. We wouldn't even have the space if it wasn't for Tony. But I know plenty of people have taken Tony Robbins conferences and haven't done [ __ ] with their lives. I will show you two, 100 testimonials. If you come on my program and you don't do [ __ ] with your life, we will lambast you. We will [ __ ] give you hell, hell feedback if you were to do that. So that's the thing. I have more proof that my program works, more proof that my program works than anyone offering any program ever. Which means when you get to the point where you're on the call and you're still like, "I need to get more familiar with your brand." No, you don't. What's happened is your inner [ __ ] is taking over. That's the only thing that's going on. But the main point I'm trying to say about it is the easiest way to not go to the gym tomorrow is to not go to the gym today because your inner [ __ ] has already taken over. So it's really easy to take over the next day. So, but when you take action and go to the gym, you don't even give the inner [ __ ] a a chance to speak. Yeah. So you don't even listen to it the next day either. And, and the other thing is like, and really when I joined Men of Action, like something I really enjoyed is that nothing in what you teach, and look, a lot of the things other guys teach is theory. It's what they think works. It's what they, you know, what's what's worked for them. And there's no theory. It's just action. Cuz everything you do is based on ev psychology. Yeah. Sociology and human nature. So to be fair, everything I do is based on action. And then I do bring in theory to explain why it works. Yeah. Right. But it's based off of real world tried and true principles. And that's why it works. Initially, initially my anecdotal experience, but over the course of the last 25 years, 1600 clients that, well, well, the 1600 clients have came come in the last five years, um, but their experience as well. Right. Right. Right. And you've tested it with clients, you know, up to your like year 100K Mastermind, down to the guys, you know, who live all the way in [ __ ] India. It's been tried and tested everywhere. Yeah. 100K, if you're in 100K Mastermind, you better [ __ ] believe you're going to take action. Those people are going to take incredible action. Right. But you know, go back to, uh, what you said before, it's like the, the one of the reasons why I believe in the efficacy of evolutionary psychology so much is because empirically, well, empirically, everything I've experienced from the highest levels of success when it comes to business and when it comes to dating, everything I've seen is replicated in studies in evolutionary psychology. I've never seen a single thing that they for, I've never seen a single thing that I've seen published from them where I was like, "Yeah, that doesn't sound true." Not a single thing. But if you're a part of, if you're moonat, then you think that none of it is true. But it's just guys, men are more interested in casual sex than women. It's just true. It just is true. People are attuned to other people's status. It is true. It is just absolutely a fact that that's true. Men have more upper body strength than women. That just is true. And men prefer a certain hip to waist ratio, uh, in women. That is true. That hip to ratio happens to be the same hip to waist ratio that's the most fertile for women. That is true. And women are more interested in a man's ability to procure resources than the other way around. It just simply is true. And so, but, but it's not only that it's true, every single anecdotal experience I've had shows that it is true with a certain exceptions. I do know women that are in their 40s, there's always [ __ ] exceptions, that's how statistics work. I do know that there are women that are in their 40s that want to date like 20-year-old men. I've seen that before. I'm not saying that's not the case, but that's the exception. It's not the rule. Yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, to end off the podcast, I think we need to leave it with this, right? Like there's people who are watching this content, especially men, you know, who, you know, they're playing the victim game. They don't feel like they have any hope. And yes, the divide is getting like more, like the Bueran said it, it's like fewer and fewer guys are getting most of the women, most of the money, whatever it is. But something I think you emphasize a lot doesn't get enough credit for is the fact that look, not everyone needs to believe everything we say, but just take it for yourself and implement in your life and just win. They don't have to believe it. You can know that, implement in your life, and just get the girl, get the job, get the business, whatever it is. And something you to leave off with, man, is you say, look, the divide has never been greater, but it's never been easier to get into the top percent of men. Yeah. Yeah. When you are literally being told to do the wrong thing, like society is telling you to do the wrong thing, then doing the right thing becomes way more effective than, than it should be. It shouldn't be this effective. Like you show a moderate level of like maintaining any kind of masculine boundaries, and like the attraction I get from women is outrageous. And it shouldn't be that much. Here's the reason why, cuz they haven't seen it. No one's showed it to them before. They've never seen it before. Yeah. You see these, there's these studies that show like women who live in like New York, that are liberal, progressive, liberal women, they, they can't date liberal men. They, so they're starting to, they're starting to, they're starting to date conservative men because conservative men actually like show some levels of leadership in masculinity. It's so funny. It's like that, that we've gotten to the point where that happens. It is in general, it is more attractive to a men to have masculine traits. And in general, it's less attractive for a woman to have masculine traits. In general, there are certainly masculine traits in women. Like I've seen female track stars that I'm like, that woman is very attractive. I'm not saying all the time, but in general, that's the way it works. In general. One of my more, uh, by the way, for the PC people in [ __ ], general, we're not speaking in absolute. We're talking about the middle of the standard deviation, the mean. In general. In general. For instance, then this is one of my takes. I believe because women have more options after a breakup than men do. Women consistently throughout the relationship, especially if they're on social media, have more options than men. Then I believe that it's more important for a man, for a woman to be slightly more into her boyfriend than the other way around. Because women already have the leverage point of being able to leave and have having tons of options. If she has more options and he's also into her more than the other way around, she's got two leverage points. And it's more likely that she's going to lead. So that's just what I just stated was my opinion. And I thought it was controversial. Every time I've asked a woman about this, they're like, "Yeah, you're right. That is how it is." They're like, "Yeah, I've never." Cory, totally agreed with me. She's like, "Yeah, I should be more into him than the other way around, or else I'm going to leave and I'm going to walk all over him." Yeah. And honestly, the women who've tested to pre-selection more than anyone is women. Every single time. Yes. And the women, the people who are most misogynistic are dude, I have never heard anyone more judgmental, calling women [ __ ] and [ __ ] more than women. I is not a man. I have no judgment whatsoever. Dude, we're not. Look, here's, here's the thing. I am never going to [ __ ] shame. Yes. I'm not going to date them, but I'm never going to shame them. They're great. The most [ __ ] shaming comes from women. Yes. And, and also in evolutionary psychology, they talk about it as an adaptation. It's called degradation. You degrade other women, uh, based on because what it does is it makes them a less viable partner and it gives you a better chance. Whereas men don't do it nearly to the same. They [ __ ] chain, basically. That's what it is. And the thing is like, uh, um, William Costello and Alex Daty made a video about two weeks ago about their debunking the debunking of evolutionary psychology by moonats. Fantastic video. Highly recommend everyone watch it. But one of the things that Alex Datk said that I totally agree with, he's like, "I don't need ovulatory shift to be correct. I don't care. I don't, like, if ovulatory shift isn't real, it doesn't affect me at all." Yeah. And the other thing is like, when we talk about men being more interested in casual sex and sexual variety than women, like, do you want to know who would be pro women being in favor of sexual variety? When I was 22 years old, me [ __ ]. Do you know how awesome if all of a sudden you could flip a switch and it was like, you're a single man, it's like women are interested in sexual variety. Do you think I would be opposed to that? No. I'm just saying for women wearing or not wearing whatever the [ __ ] they want. The reason why we say men are more interested in casual sex is because it's true. Not because we want it to be true. That's the issue. And a lot of people have so much, so many problems with that because of emotionalism. It needs to feel right. The difference, one of the big differences between me and my is like, I, myON says things specifically, they're true. But he also says them to be bombastic. And then he also puts in his own personal opinion, which is not necessarily based in science. My, my opinions aren't based in science always. But when he does so, he does so in a way that doesn't like, he doesn't care about your feelings. My goes one step further and like, often he intends on hurting your feelings. Yeah. I try not to do that. And because of that, you know, that's why he's got two million subs and I've got 150,000. Yeah. You know.

Awesome, dude. Well, look, this is [ __ ] awesome. Great first episode, man. Any last words for the viewers? Uh, nothing. Hey, listen, like I said before, if you want to, uh, get into a situation where you want to improve your dating life, you want to improve your leadership, your networking, your communication, please hit me up on Instagram. I'll put you on our free, uh, school group. There's 4,300 members in there right now. We'll give you 200 video testimonials, at least 50 Instagram testimonials. We'll give you, uh, the free course, the first four steps of MOA. And then we'll also give you the book list for free. You'll get all of that, plus you'll get a ton of feedback from a bunch of other people. And if you guys are like, "I want to skip that [ __ ] and just jump in," go to mentoring.com, set up a demo, and we'll see you soon. And, uh, one last thing, man, you know, here's how I want to end these podcasts from now on. If there's one message or inkling of knowledge you want to leave to the guys watching, what would it be? Speed of imp, speed of implementation, suspension of disbelief. Find someone who knows something, find someone who knows something and is better than you at that thing. With anything, with anything, and totally and completely humble yourself to listen and follow directions to what they say. Speed of implementation, suspension of disbelief, and finding mentors. Awesome. Thanks, Mike. Awesome, man.