Transcription
The foods that are meant to be high in saturated fats, i.e., red meat, um, less than 2% of that product is actually saturated fat. Olive oil does not belong in human diets. Are there some nutrition facts that the elites don't want you to [Music] know?
Hi, I'm Dr. Eric Westman, and welcome to my channel where I review and debunk nutritional information online. Well, who are the elites anyway, and do they have information that they want to keep from you for various reasons? Kent Carnivore believes so. And let's go through his comments, and be sure to wait till the end where I give you my final thoughts.
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So, always consider the source. In this video, Kent Carnivore is going to be interviewing Richard Smith, who I have to say, is is pretty well-versed in the mechanisms of how things work. And so they're going to make the case that there are these myths about the diet, and there are reasons why people don't want you to know for sure. So, this is a pretty deep dive into what keto does, and and I think it's a very interesting video to watch.
Fruits and vegetables contain antioxidants. False. And the reason for this, we believe that fruits and vegetables contain antioxidants because they elicit an activation of glutathione, which is the body's master antioxidant. But it does this via a pathway called the Nrf2 pathway. Now, what happens from fruits and vegetables is this glutathione will rise, which is what scientists are seeing, and this is why they believe that it's an antioxidant response. But then glutathione will drop incredibly quickly and remain and end up below baseline. Now, this isn't a true hormetic response. Other things that activate this Nrf2 pathway are things like lead, mercury, arsenic, tobacco smoke, cyanide. And a quick Google search will will show you this. These compounds elicit the same pathway as your fruits and vegetables elicit. You cannot argue one is beneficial when the other is clearly not beneficial.
All we need to do is lower our fruits and vegetables. Compounds that are high in carbohydrate, we become ketogenic. When we increase ketones within the body, particularly via beta-hydroxybutyrate, this has an antioxidant effect on glutathione. Glutathione will become elevated. So, if you want a true hormetic response, we can elicit this via a ketogenic lifestyle. It does not come via fruits and vegetables.
And just to circle back really quickly, this activation of of the Nrf2 pathway, it can be beneficial in the short term, which is how medications work. It's there to address a problem in that time and space. But what we need to do is look at the root cause. That medication doesn't address the root cause. So, when we consume said vegetable, said fruit, it elicits this response via the Nrf2 pathway. Overexpression of this pathway will elicit the activation of another pathway called NF-kB (Nuclear Factor Kappa B). Nuclear Factor Kappa B increases inflammatory cytokines and interleukins, which cause havoc within the body. All you need to do is search NF-kB and you will see that the arms that come off the pathway, that come off this pathway, all elicit this inflammatory response. And this comes via the Nrf2 pathway, which comes from your fruits and vegetables. So, fruits and vegetables are not antioxidants, they are pro-oxidants.
Well, so that might be a bit of a shock, especially if you're not following a keto diet yet. It's true that, well, I wish fruits and vegetables, that that phrase would be separated out. So that there are fruits and there are vegetables. And even among the vegetables, there are the starchy ones, then there are the not-so-starchy ones. So, the ones that don't raise the blood glucose are the non-starchy vegetables. And of course, not the fruit, or very small amounts of fruit won't raise the blood sugar much. But so looking at the mechanistic details, you know, back in the 1980s and '90s when I was in training, the inflammatory response and the interleukins was being discovered. And now, what's happened since that time, 20, 30 years later, we have drug treatment for these things. Everything is an inflammatory problem, right? And and so it is the mechanism of the day, and we want to reduce inflammation. And looking at the fruits and vegetables as pro-inflammatory kinds of foods, I have to agree. So, that if you want to have an anti-inflammatory effect, you don't have to take an anti-inflammatory pill. Just reduce the fruits and vegetables, which are the pro-inflammatory sorts of food stuffs that we typically consume. Of course, sugar in the drinks being another one that you want to reduce. And then the vegetables, of course, I teach to have the non-starchy ones, not the the starchy ones, for the lack of blood sugar and insulin elevation. But that was a pretty deep dive into the inflammatory cascade, which really, if students, med students, and grad students are taught this, it should then be pretty clear that the food you want to eat are the ones that don't cause the inflammation.
We need to limit the amount of animal proteins in our diet for optimal kidney function. Again, false. Protein builds, and this is how we heal and repair the body via something called protein synthesis. And this comes from the DNA. When we consume animal proteins, animal proteins are broken down into amino acids. And the body will then take photocopies of our DNA, in simple terms. They'll send this photocopy to the ribosome, where the ribosome will read the codons on the DNA. So, these little nucleotides which come in in packs of three, collectively they call codons, signal the attraction of a certain amino acid, and then the next one to another amino acid, and and so on and so forth. And this will build a chain called a peptide, which will eventually become a protein. This protein then goes on to heal and build every single cell in your body, whether it's nerve cells, brain, eyes, heart, liver, kidney, so on and so forth. And you can see where I'm going with this. Every time we consume animal proteins, we break them down into amino acids and reconstitute them into human proteins. This process occurs countless amounts of times throughout the day, and without it, we would not be alive. We cannot live without dietary protein. And there is not one paper that conclusively shows that protein consumption damages the kidneys. In fact, it's actually quite the opposite. I've recently worked with someone who suffered with advanced polycystic kidney disease, which is meant to be degenerative. This person came to see me roughly two years ago. We put them on a carnivore-based lifestyle, high protein, and now this advanced polycystic kidney disease has stopped dead in its tracks, and kidney function has actually increased. How can this possibly be if protein is damage to the body? Protein heals and repairs every cell in the body, in particular, and including the kidneys.
Yeah, so Richard Smith, the key, I I like him for several reasons. That he taught basic biochemistry there, how amino acids from proteins are used to make proteins. That's basic biochemistry. And then that he's treating people in the real world with real problems. There was a recent paper with, uh, keto diet focus on polycystic kidney disease. For years, I've been talking about polycystic ovarian syndrome, and we have a paper on that years ago, a proof-of-concept paper, where people with PCOS, polycystic ovarian syndrome, got better. A couple of them actually got pregnant, and they they were wanting to get pregnant. PCOS is a cause of infertility that often even the IVF, in vitro fertilization treatments don't work on. But PCOS, uh, you know, so you have a ovarian cyst, polycystic kidney disease, a totally different type of disease, except there are these cysts. And so there may be that similarity of cystic growth that occurs. I know a couple of anecdotes, meaning they're not, not allowed clinical signal, but at least a little clinical signal of things like lipomas and other cysts on the body going away or or going down on a keto diet. So, I I like that bringing in that anecdote of kidney function actually improving.
Well, I have a little other background there. There is a prejudice against protein in the food about kidney function that comes from the old teaching that protein raises the glomerular filtration rate in the short run, and if you have a high GFR, or glomerular filtration rate, GFR, that leads to kidney trouble over a long period of time. So, it was a theoretical issue that really didn't pan out. But there are a lot of discriminatory, prejudging sorts of ideas about this dietary pattern from doctors, and kidney disease is one of them. People will tell me, the doctors told them it will cause kidney disease. Well, first, it's not a high-protein diet if you do it right. It's really high-fat and adequate protein. So, there you don't even have the high-protein and kidney issue because it's not high-protein. But most people won't listen to that. There are two papers now, one from our group, our, uh, clinical series looking at kidney function at the Duke CL clinic, and it didn't deteriorate over time. In fact, there are clinical audits from David Unwin's group in the UK looking at kidney, kidney function as well, no deterioration. I've had people even on dialysis lose weight, so they have no kidney function. I haven't seen the miraculous return of kidney function. I haven't seen that. But I have seen kidney function get better if diabetes was the cause. So, if diabetes is causing a reversible kidney malfunction, and you reverse the diabetes, the kidney function can actually get better. In fact, let me know down below if you've had that kind of experience of a reversal of kidney dysfunction or malfunction or insufficiency.
It's called turmeric helps detoxify the body. I love it. False. And again, coming back to the point that we just made, turmeric is a pro-oxidant, it's not an antioxidant. Now, think back to when someone has told us to consume turmeric as an antioxidant. They also tell us to consume it with black pepper. And the reason is that it's meant to increase the absorption within the body. And this isn't entirely true. What it actually does, the piperine in the black pepper actually blocks phase two detoxification in the liver by blocking an enzyme called UDP-glucuronosyltransferase. Now, what happens is we consume a toxin, i.e., turmeric. The liver tries to remove it from the body. Why is your body trying to remove a compound that is meant to be beneficial? It's removing this compound because it's detrimental to the body. Adding in this black pepper and piperine and blocking this enzyme doesn't increase the absorption. It prevents your body from detoxing a toxin. It's preventing the liver from carrying out phase two detoxification when we consume this compound. And we see this elicitation and elevation of glutathione, it's short-lived. The reason that it's being elevated comes back to this phase two detoxification or glucuronidation is to remove it from your body, not to not to absorb it for an antioxidant benefit. This is a pro-oxidant. There is no benefit long-term in consuming compounds like turmeric for antioxidant benefits. Again, it is a toxin to the body, and beyond medicinal purposes, it should not be consumed long-term. There are other ways to combat the said benefits of consuming turmeric.
Well, I don't promote the use of turmeric. I guess this is why, you know, I have a higher level of evidence required. In fact, I want to be sure that certain things don't harm people with a keto lifestyle. They're drugs that might work well if you're not eating a keto lifestyle, if for you're eating carbs, and then we assume that they'll work really well for someone who's not eating carbs, and I'm not really impressed. I don't recommend turmeric, and this is one reason why.
Saturated fat and cholesterol are essential. The brain is made of saturated fats. The the myelin sheath, which is how we send signals to the body, is made of cholesterol. And I would argue that the consumption of saturated fats is more beneficial than any other. And that said, if we look at the foods that are meant to be high in saturated fats, i.e., red meat, less than 2% of of that product is actually saturated fats out of the 7% of the fat that's in there. The predominant is still non-saturated fats. Yet, the saturated fats are the demons. They're the ones that become demonized within within society. Now, what happens is when cholesterol is released and it drops off its lipid cargo, it travels back to the liver. But if it comes across some damage, then it will heal and repair that damage. But these these particles can become oxidized and glycated. Oxidized via seed oils or vegetable oils, and they can become glycated via the overconsumption of carbohydrate or glucose, because all carbs break down into sugar, by the way. This increases glucose in the blood because carbs is sugar, and this causes glycation. And think of glycation as things becoming sticky. So, these cells become sticky within the body. It causes glycation and oxidative stress. Now, when it does this, it damages a receptor on the LDL particle called the ApoB-100 receptor. This receptor is the access card back to the liver for the body to recycle and send the particle back on its way. But when it's damaged, the liver can't read this particle. So, now it ends up in circulation. It continues to circulate within the blood, still trying to carry out its job. And what happens eventually is it will travel into the into the subendothelial space where there are cells there called macrophages. Now, these macrophages have something called a scavenger receptor. This scavenger receptor recognizes the damaged LDL particle. It allows it access where the liver did not. So, it opens its doors and says, "Come in, you're welcome." And it crams in these damaged LDL particles, and this macrophage will grow into a foam cell, and the foam cell becomes an atherosclerotic plaque. So, cholesterol is part of this process. But what's caused it? Excessive carbohydrate and vegetable oils, not saturated fats, not saturated fat.
Well, I didn't have a chance to break into that description. Did get a word in edgewise. I think that's the current alternative view, that it's oxidized, the oxidized cholesterol, and it's not the cholesterol and the saturated fat, and it's inflammation. And you know, this is the alternative explanation of how the foam cells get started, how the atherosclerotic plaque begins. If you have atherosclerotic plaque in your coronaries, that's called heart disease, coronary heart disease. If you have atherosclerotic plaque in your carotid, in your neck arteries, that may lead to a stroke. You might get it in the aorta, you have an aneurysm there. So, this is an important time to talk about, you know, how are your arteries? What do the pipes look like? And most doctors of my era have not been trained to look. We we just kind of assume that if you don't have symptoms, everything's fine. And the idea here, though, that process is not from saturated fat in the food, it's not from cholesterol in the food, and that's spot on. It's as if we need to teach a whole new cohort of folks this story and of the mechanism, and not the food being the cause. Because removing the carbs is one of the answers for this problem, not removing the saturated fat.
When I was in training and learned that if you go on a low-fat diet, the liver just makes more cholesterol and more fat, more s, you know, I kind of smelled a rat, meaning it seemed like something just didn't jive. If that's the biology and physiology, why would we teach such a thing? And it was one-size-fits-all kind of, uh, diet at the time. Fortunately, now we understand that it's more complicated than that. And if you look at it population-wide, most people, if everyone had to do one diet, most people would do great if there was a carb-free diet instead of the other way, which is if everyone does a a a high-carb, low-fat diet. Actually, you know, two-thirds of folks don't do well. So, I think there are enough genetic variability, genes, differences, so that many different diets can be healthy. But some people really do need a lower-carb or keto diet in order to heal the diseases that we're talking about.
Olive oil does not belong in human diets. So, look, olive oil is is a mixed bag. And the reason I say this is that oils can become oxidized. Olive oil is healthier than vegetable oils. But if we look at oxidation rates, and in fact, there's a very good study which looks at cardiac events in groups of people who already suffer or have suffered with cardiac issues. And what they did is they split people into three groups: a group that consumed high saturated fats, like lard, the other which was olive oil, and another which were vegetable oils. The most people died in the vegetable oil group. Less people died in the olive oil group, but still more than in the lard group. And I think it was, I think it was lard. I may be wrong, but it was some form of saturated fat. And what this means is that olive oil becomes less oxidized than vegetable oils, but it can still become oxidized. Even omega-3s can become oxidized over time. So, when we look at omega-3 supplements, for example, they can become oxidized. So, most oils will oxidize over time. So, olive oil is is one of these answers that's sort of in between. I think it's more beneficial and healthier than vegetable oils, but it's not as healthy as our saturated fats like butter, tallow, lard, and ghee. And in fact, I would argue, in order for me, I think at the bottom, we've got butter, but still super healthy. Above this, we've got ghee, which is clarified butter. And then, you know, I'd come into maybe lard, potentially, although there is an argument to swap these around based on various factors. And then the top for me would be tallow. This is highly nutrient-dense and ideal for cooking. If I eat out and all they have to cook in is olive oil, then I'm happy. But I don't cook in it myself. Uh, I would prefer some of the s- red fats, a fat that is hard at room temperature. Personally, I don't even cook in in fats themselves. I tend to cook in the fat from the meat itself. So, if I'm cooking meats, there's plenty of fatty meats. If I'm cooking steak, I eat chuck steak, which is incredibly fatty. Olive oil, I don't buy it anymore. I'm not against it, but if for me, because of it, its ability to oxidize, it will sit somewhere in the middle.
Well, so the keto pro is trained in the internet keto, the the combination of many different factors, the the Paleo, the Primal movement, the super clean eating, the idea that you can be perfect and take the biochemistry and make it into a perfect diet. And, uh, you know, while that's great in theory, there are a lot of things that we think are perfect that don't actually hold true when you come to clinical trials or even following lots of people over time. And sometimes the pursuit of perfection makes it impossible for some people over time, or they get distracted. They say, "If I can't do it all, then I can't do any of it." So, I'm, you know, kind of a naysayer or or just a skeptic, a little bit about the importance of avoiding certain types of oils because you don't get much if you eat a low-carb keto diet. And the avoidance of these things means that you couldn't eat out at the restaurant with friends and family, or even fast food places. So, that means you have to do everything on your own at home. And therefore, it's not going to be accessible to most of my patients. So, anyway, there's a saying that perfection is not what we're trying to get to, it's progress. And sure, if you're able to do all of this stuff, would you probably be better off? We think so. But, you know, show me a randomized trial that would be the ideal of human being given all of these different bits of advice, or or let's say, just the lazy, you know, kind of lazy dirty keto that I'm more in the preference of because it's more sustainable. And compare that to the super clean, no vegetable oils, no olive oil, you know, because it can be oxidized. And, you know, so I'm always asking, well, what's the magnitude of that effect? If there is an effect, even if it's statistical, what is the magnitude? What is the the how large is the effect, is another way to say it. And so, but he's got the the right issues, uh, the right training. And I like to give a relative emphasis on what's the most important thing to do. Keep the carb super low, and then worry about these other things if you can, and maybe you'll get more benefit. I really don't know. There isn't sufficient amounts of vitamin C in animal products. Fallacy.
So, when we done testing on vitamin C, there's an asterisk next to vitamin C. And this is because it was presumed to be zero, which means that until recently, they never tested. They just assumed that there was no vitamin C in animal proteins. Let's take a step back and look at citrus fruits, very high in vitamin C. Do you know what's higher in vitamin C than citrus fruits? Kale. Kale contains more vitamin C per 100 grams than even citrus fruits. Yet, our ability to absorb most of that vitamin C is negated by another compound found within the kale called flavonoids. Flavonoids directly inhibit the body's ability to utilize the vitamin C found within. So, even though kale contains lots of vitamin C, our bodies can't access it. Also, when you cook the kale, this vitamin C is diminished by a considerable amount, making even less available for bioavailability. Or the availability for the body to absorb and utilize. Vitamin C is used via a number of transporters within the body. But one of the transporters is a transporter called GLUT4, and this is a shared transporter that is shared with glucose. So, because two of these compounds are competing for absorption through one transporter, the more glucose that we consume, i.e., carbohydrate, because again, just to reiterate, carbohydrate we consume in the diet breaks down into glucose. When we've got more glucose in circulation, this competes for the absorption of vitamin C. Therefore, a requirement for vitamin C goes up.
I like the SC. This is well-known. So, the amount of vitamins you need actually is conditional. It's conditional upon the type of diet you're following. And it turns out the more carbohydrate you eat, the more vitamin C you need. And yet, you know, most doctors learn about vitamin C now from companies saying, "Where would you get vitamin C if you didn't have orange juice?" I remember I was at a meeting where the one of the lead dietician researchers in Canada got up and kind of begrudgingly admitted that the Inuit, who lived in, you know, in the Arctic and for many centuries never had any carbs, you know, pretty much for much of the year. And she begrudgingly said, "Yes, there's vitamin C in the meat and in the, the organ meats and in the skin of the seals and other animals." So, and then at the end of the meeting, she said, "Of course, I want you to follow the food guide pyramid." You know, anyway. So, that knowledge has been there. And and that this is the current understanding is that because they compete, the vitamin C looks a lot like glucose, actually. And they use a, at least one receptor that is the same. And so if you want to get more glucose in, you have to compete, and you have to have more vitamin C to get through the glucose if it's being used for that receptor, is being used for glucose. A lot more research I would like to see on vitamin C. And in the carnivore space, there are some anecdotes of scurvy happening, which is a vitamin C deficiency. And I'm skeptical of the anecdotes because, you know, I want proof of the anecdote, not just assuming. And so I'm not sure that these people really had scurvy. They might have thought, well, you know, they're worried, they they pull the trigger on the diagnosis a little too fast because, you know, that diet's so terrible. But actually, there's a process of rechallenging and and measuring things to be sure that an anecdote is actually a consequence of the diet or of the the drug. So, that idea, though, that vitamin C should be sufficient if you don't eat the fruit, and all I I agree with that. So, this is why people on a carb lifestyle are looking for more vitamin C. Now, let's turn this around the other way. If we reduce the amount of glucose in our diet, our requirement for dietary vitamin C decreases. And in fact, it decreases so much that the amount found in red meat is more than enough not just to sustain life, but allow life to thrive.
I've been ketogenic and carnivore for well over a decade. Much of this, I've I've eaten nothing but animal proteins. I'm still yet to suffer with scurvy. Now, to put this into perspective, an average 12-ounce steak will contain around 12 milligrams of highly bioavailable vitamin C. Organ meats like beef liver contain 24 to 25 milligrams per 100 grams, which is way more than we need. I'm not saying that you need to consume beef liver or lamb liver every day, but a little sliver, this much, every few days will supply the body with all of the vitamin C that it requires.
Thank you very much for clearing up all these, uh, statements that I find a lot of people are still confused about. I think this isn't common knowledge at all. Richard knows far more than I do. Please go over and subscribe because, seriously, I've learned so much from you, mate, and look forward to seeing you again in the future. Brilliant. And thank you, Lee. Absolute pleasure as always, my friend. Thank you. No worries. You bet.
Well, I like this discussion, and the mechanisms that he talks about are solid. And so there's an alternate view of how the body works. Well, it's a different metabolism, and it's not carb-centric, meaning the glucose and is the primary fuel source anymore. You you burn what you eat. And so if you don't eat the carbs, you burn the the fats and some proteins. But protein is mainly for our body's structure and function. So, you you eat what we're made of, which is protein, and then you can run your body on fat or carbs. It's your choice. A lot of people are finding their health is better off if they're running their body on fat. And ketones are a byproduct of that fat burning. That's why it's known as a keto diet. But really, it's a fat-burning diet. But can you imagine if you are about my age, you know, 20 years ago, if I said high-fat diet, I had a stutter in my voice because it was, you know, so taboo. So, even today, it's hard to talk about a diet being high-fat. But so that's why it's called keto. That's why. So, a keto diet is actually a fat-burning diet. Carnivore is a subtype of a low-carb keto kind of diet. And a lot of people find benefit by eliminating factors that seem to be the the problem, whether it's food additives, whether it's the carbs themselves, whether it's the ultra-processing that's going on. I don't know for sure, but a lot of people find their health is better off when they remove those things.
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