Shout out to US Arc and all US Arc members. If you don't know what US Arc is, don't be ashamed. Just go ahead and click the third link in the description below. See what US Arc is all about, okay? You never know when legislations are going to hit your backyard. So, that's why it's very important to consider becoming a US Arc member today. These numbers really do matter, and they look at it for consideration when it comes to battling legislation.

So, first and foremost, thank you, Phil Goss. Thank you to anybody out there who partners up and volunteers with US Ark organization. Thank you for anyone out there who's a US Arc member. And if you can't become a US Arc member today, please talk about it on your platforms. Let your neighbors know. Let all your pet stores know what US Arc is here for. And it's here to fight for our animal rights. Thank you to every US Arc member and US Arc supporter out there.

T-minus 30 seconds. [Music] T-minus 20 seconds. 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 Z. Trap Talk Reptile Network, the coolest reptile network in the world. Episode 649. Chad Foot, CF snakes in the building finally. I'm really stoked for tonight's guest. I'm not going to lie with you guys, man. But man, I'm your boy MJ. What is good? Happy Thursday. You know, these Thursday nights feel like a Friday already. Good way to get your weekend started right here on Trap Talk with MJ.

But uh, yeah, man. This is your first time tapping in. If you're into the ball python game or reptile world or just coming in or whatever, man. Been around, this is the place to be. Lot lots to learn. Okay. Um, why I'm excited for tonight's guest. I've uh, yeah, we're going to get into so much tonight. And so you guys are in for a treat. If this is your first time watching, if you uh like to listen to all these episodes on the audio platforms like Buzz Sprout, Apple Podcast, Spotify, please do, okay? And don't forget to rate, review, and subscribe on all those major audio platforms as well.

Just want to remind you guys that Trap Talk is seven days a week, Monday through Sunday. So, any day of the week, you could get a new episode right here on the Trap Talk Reptile Network. So, I got to say, thank you for all the love and support. Any of these episodes you listen to, thank you so much. Really means a lot. Now, if you want more behind the scenes, you want to get more of an exclusive look of what I have going on, then please come join the Trap Talk Patreon family; you can do that by clicking the very first link in the description below. As soon as you join the Trap Talk Patreon family, connect you to a Discord with an awesome Instagram group chat. People from all over the world. So, thank you so much for all the love and support.

And yeah, man, shout out to people who are here in the live chats tonight. Uh, it's going to be good. Telling you right now, shout out to Joey in the building. What's up, Joey? Trap Talk Patreon member in the building. PJ's Creations. Amanda, one of the halves of PJ's Creation. Trap Talk Patreon member all day every day. Big E, Top G in the building. Verina Reptiles, Trap Talk Patreon member. And of course, Monday nights, it's the main guy right there, bro. Gotta check him out on Monday nights. Don't Don't sleep on on Big E. Dylan D's Balls and Exotics, my OG homie right here, the Nuts. What's up, Dylan? Thanks for being here. Another Patreon member, my boy Shane.

Dude, I want to just, you know, listen, if you if you're in the reptile hobby and you just keep God, welcome. This is an awesome place. It's fun. But if you're here for the breeding side of things, man, it feels good to get some of this breeding stuff under your belt. And my boy Shane experienced his very first boa litter today. Um, from a female that I used to own. So, that feels and she did she produced for me as well, but she gave way better results for my boy Shane. Me and my boy Shane did a better job getting her ready for breeding. So, he he did it, man. Go give him a follow right now on Instagram, Above All Scales. And uh, he already I believe he posted a story. I don't know. He shared it with all the Patreon members, all the all the trappers. But either way, go give him a follow. Congratulations, Shane, on your very first boa con boa constrictor litter.

All right. What what quite quite the accomplishment right now. Hey, listen. Hatching out anything or producing anything is is next level. It's it's awesome to create life, but when it's a live litter, something like that, it's just it's a whole another experience for sure. So, I'm glad you got a taste of that, Shane. Uh, shout out to my boy Shane. Shout out to Eric's Moore Factory in the building. Shout out to my homie Nick the Reptile PBLO. Uh, Trap Talk Patri remember member all day every day. 219 Reptiles in the building. What's up, dude? Uh, 319 Reptiles in the building. What is cracking? Uh, Matt B in the building. What's up, Matt Trap Talk Pat? Remember the homie Willie B Exotics in the building. Uh, listen, I appreciate all the love. Everyone in the chats, we're going to get things uh cracking here in just a minute.

I do want to say if you are in the chats tonight, if you think tonight's episode's worthy of any of a super chat, don't be shy. Drop a super chat, especially if you want to get an important question or an important topic um out of the way for tonight. Um, then make sure you drop that, man. I won't miss it. Um, now, I do want to say shout out to tonight's sponsors. You can find all my sponsors' information and all the links to their platforms and websites in the description below. But tonight's sponsors, one of them being Mark Bailey over at Mark Bailey Reptiles. Head over to Morph Market, type in Mark Bailey Reptiles. Go follow this man's work right now. Be ready for some amazing heat to be posted by Mark Bailey. uh, we're at that point where um, you know, he is I think at the end of his breeding season. So now we're going to be hopefully seeing some crazy heat posted from Mark Bailey. So for now guys, head over to this morph market like I said, see what he has available currently and just be ready for that to be updated because Mark Bailey don't play. One of the best in the game for sure. My my favorite ball python breeder hands down in the game. So thank you so much Mark Bailey over at Mark Bailey Reptiles.

Also tonight's episode is brought to you by Rice Reptile. Shout out to the Rice family. If you head over to their YouTube channel, please subscribe. They put about three videos out a week and they're killing it. They're also displaying and spotlighting some of the nicest ball python projects currently in the game. So, shout out to Billy, shout out to Don um who are just doing big things and of course their daughter uh Channing who's also slaying it with her company as well. So, you can find all the links to the Rice family's uh platforms in the description below, Rice Reptiles, and head over to their website as well, rice reptiles.net. And of course, if you have ball python sheds, make sure you are turning them in to the best. That's RGI, baby. Rare genetic Inc. All right. Shout out to Ben, shout out to Sean. Also, go check them out on YouTube. Subscribe to their YouTube channel, okay? Because they're constantly putting out updates and putting out different episodes uh to inform you guys of what's happening right now with the uh amazing world of uh genetic shed testing. So, again, cutting edge, next level stuff. Head over to their Instagram as well. Go give them a follow. Thank you so much, Sean and Ben over at RGI.

And if you want to talk about cutting edge, if you're just coming into the ball python game, make sure you are organized. You are standing away from all the laziness that is currently, you know, being displayed in the ball python game, man. Look next level and look organized with clutch. All right. Uh, this organization app just really helps you get ahead of the game. Okay? And it also kind of taps you in with a whole another group of organized individuals who want to take all this ball python stuff to the next level. So if you definitely want to look professional, this is the way to start for sure. Thank you so much. uh, the entire Clutch team and you can also find all Clutch's information in the description below.

And yeah, shout out to all my sponsors and yeah, shout out to everyone in the chats. I'm excited. Listen, I got to tell you a quick story. Um, well, as you guys know, you know, obviously I've gone to a lot of Tinley's. All right, but Tinley's are like definitely a special place to me. Just like Tinley is like it's a special place for anyone. I feel like if you're in this game and you make it to a Tinley, you have Tinley stories that stick with you forever. Um, I I remember meeting Chad. I think it was 2022 or it could have been 2023. I feel like after a while you just forget. But a few years ago, I met Chad in the lobby um through Mark Bailey. U Mark Bailey is like, "You need to bring this guy on your show." He's like, "I just don't know if you would do your show because he's kind of like does his own thing." And anytime I get told that, I'm like, "Okay, well, I'm going to go after this dude if that's the kind of dude he is." And so, um, but yeah, and then I kept seeing Chad at more Tinley's and shows and I was like, "Yo, I need to get you on my show." And he was like, "We'll we'll make it happen. We'll make it happen." Then I finally came across his Instagram account. And then I was like, "Holy shit." So CF Snakes on Instagram. You can also find that link in the description below. Give him a follow.

But um, yeah, enough is enough. I was able to just get this organized, get it ready. He was actually supposed to come on last week because I thought Winston was going to pull a little lame ass move and and uh not come through, but he did come through. uh, like two days before he hit me up saying, "No, no, I could do it. I could do it." So, I was like, "Fuck, dude." Winston. So, that was a great episode. Make sure you go check out that uh episode last Thursday night with Winston. But yeah, man. We got Chad Foots tonight. It's going down. So, you guys are in for a [ __ ] treat. You're going to be mad stories being told tonight. Okay. A lot of information because Chad goes back to the day. I don't really know how far back he does, but I know he's an OG for sure. He's been around been around the block, especially if you are referred from Mark Bailey to by Mark, somebody like Mark Bailey. Like, come on, dude. You've been around the block. So, you guys are in for a [ __ ] treat. Let's go. Episode 649. Do what you got to do to get your mind right. Do what you got to do. Stay hydrated. Okay. Chad Fuks, CF snakes on this beautiful Thursday night coming at you right now. Let's go.

Good. You ready for do more in the future Trap Talk podcasts? Yes. Only only Trap Talk exclusive. Exclusive only. So stop calling us. Rub the spot. Get the pop. When I come up with the love it or not, I'm hot from the spot. Get the pop. When I come up the spot, get the club when I come up the spot. Get the club. When I come up the spot, get the club when I come up. Everybody, we do it. Everybody, we do it. Do it. Do it. Do it. Get the pop when I come up with the spot. Get the club when I come up with the spot. Get the pop when I come up with the club. And we're live. Episode 649. Chad, you made it, buddy. You made it. Thank you so much for having me on and staying persistent, dude. I'm so happy you're here. And like I said, man, it's uh I do you remember the year we met? What tiny that was? Was that 2022? I think it was right after COVID. The first year opened up after COVID. Yeah. So that was 2021, actually. Then was it 21 they closed and 22 it opened? Maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Bananas. Yeah. And obviously Tinley's the stopping ground of yours, right? Like if I'm correct, if I'm wrong, you've been around the block for a minute, right, Chad?

Yeah, I uh I've been keeping snakes since 1980. [ __ ] 1980. How old are you? Five. And then I started breeding in 87 in uh seventh grade. How old are you, Chad? I just turned 50. Wow. You don't look that old. Wait. Well, I guess 50. Okay. So So you're I'm getting up there. So you you're pretty young uh right off the bat. So you were in in the uh 85 you were how old? Uh you were 85 I would have been 10. 10 10 years old. Okay. Um and you know something about reptiles like from what I remember in the late 80s early 90s. Um definitely like a third world type feeling like you didn't really know too many people keeping reptiles. It wasn't a regular thing. It's definitely become a lot lot more normalized now. But like for you being 10 years old, who was influencing you to keep reptiles? Was it just being outside and finding them or Yep. And then and then in high school? No. Yeah. It must have been eighth grade or ninth grade, I found the Wisconsin Herb Society. Oh, cool. They had been around long before that, but I had just discovered it. And then I went to their monthly meetings and talked to other people that were interested and got some tips on how to incubate and breed and trial and error and just I was never allowed to keep more than three animals in the house. My mom is still terrified of snakes to this day. Yeah. Then uh after high school, I went up to W Stevens Point and the dorm room was day geckos, veiled chameleons, and leopard geckos underneath my bunk bed, bearded dragons underneath my desk, and my closet was a rack of uh gray banded king snakes, the king snakes, corn snakes. Wow. Snoop else. So before you had all that stuff, you already knew about it. like you had already had, you know, research and like it's kind of it's something you knew you wanted before you were able to get to that point, right?

Yeah. I knew I didn't never know I was going to make a living at it, per se, but uh I always was going to keep these critters. Um and just trying to find as many books and buy as many books as I could back in the day. Yeah. I'm um I mean I don't have like a Bob Ashley library, but I've got several bookcases full of books from over the years that I've collected. I mean I was that was your guys' internet in a sense back then. That's how you guys [ __ ] figure [ __ ] out. Um even though there was I mean trial and error. Yeah. Right. and try mainly trial and error because you know stuff in a book I feel like is so like okay like you can only really understand so much with what they're saying and and really even to today Chad I always say like I don't care who your mentors are if you've never experienced it firsthand like that's how you really get an an an idea like you know what to do in certain situations no matter what it is if it's a [ __ ] snake stuck in an egg or snake that doesn't eat or you got mites or some [ __ ] like you know a lot of the stuff comes firsthand you know I agree and And what may work for me may not work for you based on your environment, your situation, your temperatures. Yeah. Your altitude. But I think also just always trying to learn from the animals helps too. When it came to growing your collection, it it was mainly colubrids. That was like the the start of everything. Um, you know, that was like the meat potatoes for the from from the beginning.

Yeah, I've always been a colubrid lover. Okay. I did get my first ball python I think in '92. 92. And then I spent my first money on a ball python. I bought a pair from VPI Dave and Tracy Barker in 95. I bought a pair of head albinos. Wow. For 4500 or 5,000. Holy [ __ ] And you're only like you're only like 20 years old then, right? Yeah. Holy cow. Okay. And then I bought my first big colubrid which was the albino Nelson eye from uh Don Wilson of Seven Generations. I think those were 4,000 a pair. I bought those I think in 96. So you buying that buying those kind of snakes in your 20s in that time of [ __ ] you know in that era the 90s that was it was all priceless. That's big money right there. I mean the shows were still going. I mean uh the Daytona show was down in Orlando. Is that where you sold a lot of your snakes? Was that Daytona and like in shows vending? Is that where you got a lot of the um stuff? No, I did a lot of trades back in those days. And Daytona I never vented when it was Orlando. I'd fly down Friday night after work and I was breeding leopard geckos and oh I think what was the king greyb lot of Mexicanana back then. Um and pferia no pferia came later lady that was in the early 2000s. But I would put them in my socks on my carry-on, hop on the send it through the X-ray machine and it would go in the luggage compartment above your seat and that's how it would fly back and forth with all the animals. This was prior 911. Yeah. Obviously, it's crazy how lax things was before 911 and like how people were just traveling with whatever the [ __ ] they wanted to travel with. Really? And most of the shipping was done through Delta back then. I mean, we still I mean, we did use UPS a little bit. I did a little bit, but it was mostly Delta. Delta Dash. I still I It's not called Delta Dash no more, but man, I Delta's reliable, man. I think I was uh Gary and uh Gary and who somebody else I think Marshall, they were giving me [ __ ] for using Delta like like who the [ __ ] uses Delta and and and for me it was it made sense for the bigger snakes like if I had I think back then I had the retakes and stuff like that. But I never had an issue. never had a layover like [ __ ] uh go bad or like it was it was really straight [ __ ] forward process every time I used Delta. So never Yeah, I don't think I've they may have missed a connecting flight one or two times, but they always never had a a DOA or anything like that with Delta. And I you know with Venomous you got to send it that way too. At least with the Hila Monsters and the Beed. So yeah, I will say there there was one time I forgot this. It was Pennsylvania. I forgot the name. Oh, I guess there's two different Pixsburg EP I'm sorry, Pixsburg airports in Pennsylvania or something like that. I don't I can't remember, but I sent it to the wrong airport and I was [ __ ] pissed and I was like and it was one of my lace monitors and I have never shipped a lace monitor before. So, I was already really nervous about it and so poor Mac Dre ended up like being held for like two days at some [ __ ] airport. It made it though. He made it. Yeah, he made it. So, but yeah, um you know, with that with that being said on the shipping side of things, I mean, we're we're so much going on I feel like, you know, in today's day, like not only with the market, but like I'm sure you're paying attention to like the shipping wars and all that [ __ ] that's happening right now. Are you Chad? Yeah, there's a lot going on it seems like. And for somebody who's been around as long as you, like what do you what do you do? What do you how do you feel when you see something like that? Like I mean, are you just ignoring it and just [ __ ] use what you want to use or like are you loyal to a certain company? I'm just curious where you're at, you know, being the person both. I I was lucky in that I got connected with uh with an account through through a friend of mine in Colorado and a

Direct FedEx account. So, oh, there you go. I've always been able to use that for a good rate, and um, yeah, you know, I've used Ship Your Reptiles and Redline both. Um, and then, of course, the other account and Morph Market. I've tried using his shipping account too. Have you—did you ever use UPS uh before like FedEx got to where it was at? Because I know UPS was an option at some point that people only had, I think, or can you fill me in on that? I—that was all I was using for a while after 9/11 was UPS. And uh, I could ship walking into the counter without an account. I could ship a box out to you in California there for 17 bucks.

Wow. But I, you know, I got the rolls of tape, so it said overnight, and I would put all the red tape all over the boxes and yeah. They never asked questions. I mean, obviously you got to write on there. I think it's now more prevalent, but back 20 years ago, 25 years ago, I don't think a lot of people were aware of the Lacy Act rules. So writing, I would just write it in a pen or a marker, the quantity and the name. I'm not gonna say any names, but there's a—there's a guy who's been doing this since the 80s. Um, and really only is known for one species. Um, I don't want to say too much because people will connect dots, but when he—he'll sell a [ __ ] $7,000 animal and ship it in an unlabeled brown box, like—like no—like you almost have no idea what's in it, in a sense. And only because like I guess that's what they did back in the day, right? Like they didn't want nobody to know what was in that [ __ ] box. Like it was like just send it, you know? And so I remember seeing the box. I'm like, "What the fuck?" I was like, "What did he send you?" Like it's just a brown box. Like no holes, no nothing. And I was like, and you know, and mind you, that whatever process that that person does is work.

So yeah, I, you know, I'd heard stories back in the day if you labeled it live snake or live reptile, um, sometimes they would disappear. Yeah, or something. And that was with both FedEx and and UPS. I had heard stories of that. Yeah. Now I think it's—it's all regulated now. Yeah. It's cameras everywhere. Like it's just you'd be an idiot to try to do something nowadays, you know? Right. Um, the coding they got—they know where that package is at any given time. So I don't think enough people really kind of uh touch on this enough. Um, going back to you being in the mid-90s [ __ ] spending thousands of dollars on a ball python. That was an era where ball pythons weren't that easy to figure out. Correct me if I'm wrong. Like weren't people like [ __ ] struggling breeding them back then?

I don't know if there was necessarily struggling, but most of the animals coming in at that time were a lot of imports. Yeah. And so getting them lacimated, I—I think again, I don't know. I didn't deal with a lot of balls back then. Um, I know in '98 I flew out to California Super Bowl weekend, took another redeye Friday after work and picked up my first albino ball python, and again it went in my shorts and I came back Sunday. Um, well, what that albino cost, that visual in '98? 7,500.

God damn, dude. And that was an—that was an imperfect animal. I think they were going for 10 for perfect animals back then if you could get one. I couldn't get one. So, it had a kink or something—or something was wrong with it. Uh, it had a kink in its spine. It was a male, but it was high up on the spine and that—and it still bred for you. Well, that's a—then in '98 at—in Orlando uh at the National Reptile Breeders Expo, I bought a ghost hypo ball from Doug Beard for 3,000. And all those adult head albino—no, the head albinos were now up to size. And I picked up some new uh thermostats from a very well-known breeder that brought them in. And I was duck hunting on the Mississippi River over Thanksgiving, and I came home and cooked.

Soon as you walked in, you could smell death. Oh, that's terrible. I—I know that feeling unfortunately. It sucks, dude. I—I—I forget when I—so, I moved into this house about a little over two years ago, and I—so, the old house that I had, like that room was so warm where I—the whole rack system that I had would never—I never heated it up. It was just ambient heat. And so when I got into this new room, Chad, it was so cold. I was like, "Oh my god." So I quickly just grabbed like—I—I remember back then I had a tub full of [ __ ] thermostats. And I remember just picking whatever [ __ ] not even thinking about it. I was like, "Let me just pick the—hurry up and pick a thermostat." I picked one out and then plug it in, and then the same thing overnight something woke me up. I could smell something, and I'm like, "What the [ __ ] is that?" And—and then it was like—back—it was like that movie back [ __ ] what's that movie? The Backdraft or something like that? The fire—back something like that. Yeah. I was just like, "Oh my god." And my whole rack got to like 160. Um, and luckily like only one level—they all died, and—and even then I was [ __ ] mortified. I was so—oh man, I was eating up, dude. I was so [ __ ]

It sucks. I mean, because I was using the herp stats. Um, sorry, not herp stats. I was using Helix's back then. Yeah, Helix is great. And I—yeah, I still have some to this day. I still trust them. But I—back then to get the night drop, you had the—the black box. You had to plug the phone cord into the little blue thing. You adjust it with a little screwdriver. And this new one had the night drop all built in. So I grabbed two of them. And of course, one failed on. And it—it—my racks were made by a—a furniture cabinet maker. Mhm. But they were made out of melamine. And it melted—I think it—it cooked 18 of the 20 snakes in the rack. It was a 2 by 10, and all the higher-end animals perished. I was going to say—I mean, those—I'm assuming the animal we're talking about here—you had a bunch of other high-end stuff in that same—a lot of just a normal—lot of normals which was even back then—that's—that's those were worth good money back then. Those were—yeah, for captive bred. Yeah. Adult females. And listen, like obviously you're no—you're like—you're not the only story out there. This is why it's like, man, I—I dread that day. This is why I like being home so much. Even though it's kind of like I got to get out of the house, but man, I just—I fear that happening someday where [ __ ] hits the fan and I'm just not home for it, you know? Um, it's like—it's like every keeper's fear. I feel like it's—it's—it's [ __ ] it sits in the back of your head. It's always back there floating around. I, you know, I do like these—these new herp stats. Yeah, because then it'll ding you if something goes high—low, whatever you set your alarm for. And I also—my HVAC system in the building here is also set up to send me alarms if something goes high or low. So, which is helpful. Your Wi-Fi—go ahead, Chad. What'd you say?

I was gonna say if your Wi-Fi is down, then it won't—it won't notify you. Yeah, that's the thing. So, um, but you know, bouncing back from something like that, Chad, what was that like? Like, how hard was that? Like, you know, because not a lot of people could recover from that. Two—two things. Um, one, I felt like getting rid of everything. Yeah, it was crushing for me. And then two, it taught me never to buy the animals just for the money. Buy the animals that you really enjoy. Yeah. And if they happen to be expensive, they happen to be expensive. But don't buy them for the money. Just for the money. Yeah. So, it was a, you know, it's a lesson. I—I still abide by it to this day. I only work with animals I really—whether they're morphs or species, I have to really like them. Otherwise, I don't want to work with them. And this was '98. This was '98. So, when something like that happened to that rack, that—that furniture style rack system that you had, what did you upgrade to next? Or did you just get the same replacement, or what did you get?

The rack was fine. Oh, the rack was fine. I thought it melted. The tub—the tubs melted. Oh [ __ ] Okay. So, the tub—so, the racks. Okay. Because I was like, "Yeah, it was—it was the 28-cord tubs, and probably 60% of the tub was melted on the bottom. Luckily, it didn't start a fire." No [ __ ] Yeah. Like I'm saying, it just could have been worse. Um, even though 18 snakes is—like me, losing a whole row sucked, but I'm like, dude, that—that rack system that was 160 had 50 snakes in there. So, like—could have been 50 [ __ ] all gone. You know what I mean? But I will say, go ahead.

I was gonna say that's—that's the pros and cons with having a lot of animals per rack. I had—I forgot—I forgot a couple months after that incident, I had a couple more snakes die. I think—I think it had an effect on them. I really do. Oh, I'm sure it did. Yeah. And I don't—I don't set every level on its own thermostat, but I do break up just a couple levels per thermostat or per—per probe now. Yeah. Just to try to even it out. And you know, obviously these—these nightmare type things that we talk about—like some people get lucky. They don't, you know, knock on wood. I mean, they don't—they don't have such luck or such an experience, but I almost feel like you're almost better knowing that this—how easy it is for it to happen and like almost keeping you on edge. That way you're, you know, it sucks to be like that, but you just [ __ ]

Dude, it's—I mean, think about it—like you got—I got all my whole life's working here, you know? Like— well, yeah. And you think about it, you want—I was just—again, I was talking to somebody today for a couple hours and it just came up and just all the—knock on wood—all the natural disasters that are seen more prevalent now—the floods. Yeah. The fires, the tornadoes, the hurricanes. Yeah. And people are getting a lot of damage to their collections too, but also their homes. Yeah, dude. Like you know—my—my big thing is like you know Texas, right? Like Texas, as big as a state that is, and how many reptile keepers are there. Like they have rollout blackout things where [ __ ] they can't do [ __ ] about it, and—and then all of a sudden they get crazy freezing weather, which never happened in Texas. And now, you know, are bursting and everything's shutting down and then it just—just compounding mess. And that's why also too like, you know, and I got away with this mainly because obviously where I live, I luckily—San Diego kind of a good place for reptiles for the most part. I don't have any—like I never really had—I think maybe twice I ever had to pull out a generator ever out of the eight years that I've been keeping. So I've been—I've been getting lucky with it. But holy [ __ ] man. You got some people out there where—where they live like if power goes out they're [ __ ] You know what I'm saying? If—if they don't have like a backup plan and you—you know, as you know, Chad, if you own a facility and if you need a [ __ ] backup generator—40,000—like for a legit one and all this [ __ ] like that's where coin really comes out of your pocket is how much you put into your facility that's going to save everything from—from dying—it should—it's those—it's those contingencies with contingencies on the contingencies—the backup plan to the backup plan—yeah, and—and you—and like—like I said—currents long term and you know if you're in here just [ __ ] you know, I guess just entry level just trying to have just a handful of animals—you never have to worry about something like that or even—you—you might even do sometimes, but like if you want to take it to the level of having your own room and you have rack systems and [ __ ] like that, well then you have to consider all the other elements that could go down, especially if you live in an area where you have real seasons. Like I said, I'm in San Diego—we don't have—we don't have real seasons here—like it's—it's [ __ ] awesome—you—it's expensive, but we don't [ __ ] ever have to worry. We don't have to worry about [ __ ]

Some people like—like where Mark Bailey lives and—and where you live. I mean, it gets freezing where you're at, right, Chad? Like, you deal with crazy snow. Yeah. I'm only about five and a half, six hours from Mark. Yeah. He's a little bit further north of me. A little bit west. So, it gets maybe colder where he's at, maybe. Maybe a little bit. I mean, I—I mean, we're—we're—we're the same temperature today. Yeah. And so, 64 today. Where you live now? How far is that from where—where you grew up? About five miles. Oh, wow. So, you're basically in your same—I haven't—I haven't gone—I haven't traveled far. No, I like the area. I like the seasons. I love—I love Wisconsin. Fall—I love for hunting and fishing and spring—I like for hunting and fishing and the weather and then I like the winter. Uh, summer is my least favorite time of year. I just—I don't like the heat. See, I—I—I rather deal—well, I [ __ ] hate the heat, too. But, man, the cold does something to me, man. The cold really shuts me down. Like, I almost can't even function if I'm too cold. But if you're out doing stuff, you're not really cold. I guess you're right. You know, even ice fishing, toss a football or some frisbees or horseshoes or something. But, you know, when you're like raised in areas that normally don't get that cold, you can't handle—like it takes—you got to get acclimated to it.

I agree. Yeah. But I will tell you one thing. I'm—I'm like very proud of this. Even though I got to prove myself, but I was able to [ __ ] really get down the—the—the coal plunge. I was able to [ __ ] do it for like five minutes. You did that once? 39-degree weather or—I'm sorry, 39-degree water. And it was great. Honestly, like it was [ __ ] I remember the first time I did it, I lasted 20 seconds and it was like—and it was like way too much. And then I saw my wife did it and she did it for like three minutes, and I was like, "What the fuck?" And I felt like a complete [ __ ] And so I was like, "Dude, the next time I do it, I'm not—there's no way my wife could do it longer than I can." And so next time around, and I will tell you, it was like peak [ __ ] summertime in Miami. It was so hot. I was so sticky where I'm like, I would have jumped in anything cold. I didn't give a [ __ ] Um, but I—I—I did it. And I was, you know, kind of proud of myself that I could put myself in cold water like that. That's one thing I've never done. I think they call it the polar plunge here in Lake Michigan. Yeah. [ __ ] That's colder than 40 degrees. That's like negatives, isn't it? It depends on the winter. I mean, sometimes the lake will freeze almost all the way across. Sometimes it's just out in the bay in the breakers in the areas, but I—it's—it's chilly.

Let's talk about how you approach your breeding season being so many years deep in at this point. Like I'm pretty sure there are times during the year where you're not breeding at all. Like are you pretty seasonal when it comes to your stuff, Chad? Um, yeah. I'm still learning and still doing stuff. I—so I have not broomated a colubrid I think since 2009, and um, again, we get mountain kings to go—we get the alternate—we all get all the mechmex to go—um, and I don't know—I don't really remember how that came about. I just—I don't touch a thermostat. I don't touch a light cycle. It's usually 13 on, 11 off. Sometimes it might be 12 on, 12 off, but I really don't mess with the cycles, and the temps stay the same, but usually around November, a lot of the animals will shut down on their own, but I just reduce their food intake. And so they might get fed once or twice a month. Uh, and then usually sometimes, again, depending on the schedule when I get going on it. Sometime between February and April, I'll start feeding them regularly, one or two times a week, and then that triggers them, and then I do the introductions. So that you limit the food when? In—in the winter, like—so November. Yeah, basically—no—for the clubs. Yeah, usually from November to somewhere between February and April, and then you feed—then you pair—or do you pair then feed? Uh, I feed heavily for about a week, week and a half, and then you—and then you—and I also—I also feed small meals. Yeah. Right. So I give two or three prey items per feeding. Yeah. Larger one. And—and like you know, man, it took me a while to figure out like the whole smaller prey, more frequent thing because all it is is a trigger in their head to—for them to realize like, well, there's a reason why I'm getting this much food is because the food's going to stop—like it's going to—like—and—and you almost have to—they almost tell themselves—they almost have to get ready for something which kicks them into that cycling stage, right? And—and it's almost like a feast or famine. Yeah. Right. You know, chow on it—food's available—go. Let's reproduce, right? Again, I have no scientific data or anything like that behind it. It's just how I do things, and it seems to work. I—I'm a huge believer that the, you know, I know there's multiple different methods of cycling, but the number one cycling is the food for sure. Like that's—you—you get anything to go with the food, I think. I think so. Especially with the balls. Yeah. Oh, for sure. Yeah. Well, yeah, because Justin, uh, shout out to Justin, but he doesn't change a [ __ ] thing in his room all year round. Weatherwise, it's 80° ambient 24 [ __ ] 7 in his room. 365, you know what I'm saying? Um, and—and—and it's all about just the food intake for—for ball pythons. And I think there's other species like what we were mentioning that you could get away with. Um, but I—I mean like I—I think it all comes down to food no matter what species it is. Like sure—other—other cycling will help and it—it doesn't hurt, but that food—that food cycling is the number one. I feel like personally, I think that's the trigger for sure. And again, it doesn't hurt to broomate. And I—I might go back to it just to get a few months of less work time, but that—honestly, that's what got me out of colubrids was I was so convinced that I needed to keep them that much cooler than everything else. And I was like, I don't have a [ __ ] the means for a colubrid room. Like I remember telling myself like, how am I gonna—how am I going to pull this off and—and—and keep them at—in the 60s or whatever I had to do? Like it—it really like—um—discouraged me from—from going into the projects that I had cuz I—I was keeping over 10 different species of colubrids at one point or boega actually. I had a bunch of boega. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I, you know, um, I keep the colubrid room pretty cool. Um, it's usually 68 to 70 ambient.

And then the heat tapes the hot spots are somewhere between 78 and 80.

Okay, hold on. Somebody say that one more time. Say that one more time, John. I'm sorry. I I didn't I missed. So, my ambient temperatures for the clubid rooms are 7 uh 68 to 70. 68 to 70 all all during the day, too.

Yeah. I don't like heat. So, right now we're in the ballroom and I'm very uncomfortable and it's 70 78 degrees in here, dude. I I keep my room pretty warm, too, because I don't I don't [ __ ] with heat. I don't I rather just control everything in the room personally just because risks and everything else, right? But like I forget how warm it gets in my room. So when I like when my wife comes in here to talk to me, she'll just look like she'll start getting nauseous. She's like, "I gotta get the [ __ ] out of this room." And I'm like, "Why?" She's like, "It's so [ __ ] hot in here." I'm like I'm like, "It's 80. It's 80 and a half degrees in here." Like she's like, "It's [ __ ] humid." I'm like, "I work in here. I'm in here all the time, dude. So I I don't like working in this room. Uh, personally, it's just too warm for me. But the AC is set to turn on at 80. And if I do it lower than that, then the thermostats, the the racks are working over time to heat back up. So, it's just this is where the sweet spot is for me.

You use herp stats, you said, right? Or what are you using now? What are you using? I use almost all herp stats. I do have a few helixes still, too. Do do you take advantage of the max power percentage?

Um, I I just like became obsessed with that over the last few months because one of my biggest things with the emeralds was whenever I turn on basking, it was 100% [ __ ] full go. Like whenever that panel would turn on and if I were to get a temp gun, it would be like 150 right on the panel. Like it would just be so hot and I hated that because I would dry them out. And then I found out that there's a a max percentage wattage or something that you could put that you could set on the herbs hat and I sent it to 50%. And now when that thing turns on, I can literally touch it and it's it's it's warm, but it's not [ __ ] scorching.

I've not toyed with that uh feature yet.

No. Well, because like for instance, like you wouldn't have to worry about those working so hard. You know what I'm saying? Because it's only going to turn on to a certain percentage of percentage, right? And I I have it set up so you can see how hard it's working in any given time. And it's usually a zero. I mean, once in a while it might spike to like 20 25%.

Yes. But I think once everything gets heated up and warmed up, there's really not much to really raise it up that much.

Yeah. So warm, you basically have that heat almost where the ambience at already. So it's already almost in a sense just where it needs to be is what you're saying, right? I mean, the hot spots for these guys are anywhere from the high 80s to maybe mid 90s depending on the rack. And you know, I don't know. I just uh and again I just you you'll watch the animals. So if you open a bunch of tubs in a rack and they're always on the hot end, I'll bump it up and if they're always on the front end, I'll turn it down a little bit. But I will say though, one of the things that Mark Bailey put me on to this um you know because he obviously he doesn't ultrasound or maybe you do Mark, I'm sorry, but Mark's all like for the most part I feel like my Mark's so trained with the eye where he he could just see and I remember um asking him a couple years ago like you know I had this girl because I don't want ultrasound. I need to I feel like just to have that under my belt. But I remember having this girl out like she's been getting locked and he's like yeah I don't know. He's like when we when we pulled that tub open she was on the heat. Um, and if she's still eating and she's on the heat, she ain't [ __ ] you know, they're when they're building, uh, they're on the cool side. They're not on the at all. And they're, you know, they're belly up and they're they're wrapping in the bowl and stuff like that. Contorted positions and everything. And so, and that's another reason why I was like once Mark taught me that hack, I was like [ __ ] you know, another reason why I don't need an ultrasound. Even though I feel like, again, this is an excuse for me not to buy one. uh because it does, you know, when you have crucial males and you don't want to waste locks, it's important to have an ultrasound. But for me, I just I like just to [ __ ] backyard [ __ ] breeder it and just, you know,

Well, you know, I agree. I never wanted to get one and I got one and I never used it. Now we use it once a month just to see where the females are at. And then we've got all these different colored clips. So we've got green, we've got orange, we got blue, we got black, and we got pink.

Yeah. And it just lets us know what stages. So I can quickly glance around the room and say, "All right, I got to get a male there. Male's in there. He's got to come out. She's ready to go. Get her some food. Pound her with food. She's building." Blah, blah, blah. And it just makes it easier for me sight visual wise to see where everything is, but the ultrasound helps me get there.

Is your ball python season right in tune with your colubrate season? Like everything's pretty much together? Is it separate? How's that work? It's asked backwards this year. We just got clutch 33 this morning. Um, and we've only got like 26 or 27 club clutches so far this year. Last year we only had 34 ball clutches total. And I think we tried to pair 72 females this year on the balls. I think we're going to hit somewhere between 55 and 60 clutches, which is it's not bad.

Well, for me that's too many. That's a lot.

Yeah. I mean, it's a lot.

Yeah, for sure. But I mean the ratio ratio wise is good. like as far as your your percentage of what went is not bad.

Yeah, that that that that wise is good, but that's still going to be a lot of babies for us though.

Yeah, go ahead. And then the colubrids really all the pitchopus went early this year. Um fact, I just had I just pulled a bullsnake. It was her second clutch already the season. Um the garders are late. I just we just had our first letter of garders last night.

Nice. And um I don't have a single Honduran. I don't have a I I think I have one corn snake clutch on the ground. Um, no sinnoloans, no hog noose yet.

How are those doing? How are those doing for you sales-wise compared to ball pythons? Every this last year has been really strong for us. Um, but I think we actually started advertising on morph market too. So that's that's been a big help.

So you weren't before?

Not really. And how are you getting by? Like, how are you able to survive? I I think Mark's the only guy I know who doesn't have Instagram, doesn't [ __ ] use it, and doesn't need it, I guess. And God bless him. I think that's amazing. But how how are you how are we were were you kind of on the same tip like Mark for a while, just not really entertaining the social media side of things.

And yeah, I just I think I just joined in um I think it was a year year and a half ago, but I'm trying to post I don't think I had posted from Daytona until earlier this year. And now I'm trying to post at least Monday through Friday every morning if I if I can.

Makes sense because I'm trying to stay vigilant to that because like I said when Mark put me on to you years back um I was like well he's doesn't really have a social media like what the [ __ ] I know I got your number but never saw you on any social media really. And then I started [ __ ] seeing you and I was like dude what the [ __ ] I was seeing cool stories of you walking in your room every day and I'm like all right dude you're coming on my show now. Like you enough is enough.

I I prefer to talk on the phone versus email or text.

Yeah, but what about what about this? This is going great. How do you feel right now? Because Okay, let's take a time out and let's I was nervous as Let's explain the beaver skin next to you. Why do you have the beaver skin next to you? Is that is that for because you're that nervous? Can you explain why you have that next to you? Just it's just a beaver pelt. Is it your lucky beaver belt? Like why?

Yeah, I guess it could be. I just I feel I don't know if I feel more secure with it, but I like having it there. I love it. Um No, I'm This is great. I mean, so but you feel good right now. See, like it's it's not it's not I'm comfortable now.

Yes. Okay, good. Good. I was nervous coming on. I just I don't know why. I just You asked me four different times what you should wear. I'm like, god damn it, Chad. Are you kidding right now or like what's going on?

Well, I wasn't sure how you wanted me to dress.

No, you're good. All right, let's get back to things. So, okay. Um, so your ball python season is a little bit of 180 right now compared to what it normally is, but as of right now with the production side of things, obviously the market's a weird place right now. Um, we can't say it's the same for everybody because not everyone's having issues selling snakes. Some people are are doing work out there and doing great. Where are you at with your ball python sales? Are you are they down? Are they up? Are they stagnant? Where are they at?

We're up 620% January through April 30th of this year over last year.

Up 620%. And that has to do with the advertising.

Yeah. 100%. It's got to be with So, well, the show the shows have been better this year, too. I mean, I do a couple Wisconsin local shows. Um, Tinley. Uh, but I'm only I only attend the March Tinley. I I did the first two years when it was just the fall show, but then I gave up the fall show just to continue my duck hunting up in Canada.

Oh, so you don't even go to the You don't even attend Tinley fall shows.

I haven't been there since 2003.

Oh, so you I only see at the March shows, huh? And then Daytona and St. Louis. So you really take the hunting thing as like a that's like your life. Like that's part of what it's like, you know, like breeding. Like it's a hobby of yours that you [ __ ] love.

Another passion. Nice. Is there a certain thing other than duck you like to hunt? Almost anything you can or like what what's your um waterfall?

Waterfall specifically duck is definitely my my favorite. Um but we were up in uh Kodiak Island, Alaska in October, November of 23. And I was able to harvest a a brown bear.

Wow. Um but I've been up to Northwest Territories caribou. I've been to China and Mongolia duck hunting. Um, North Dakota, Maine, Arkansas, China, Mongolia.

Wait, you duck hunted in China is what you said?

Well, we didn't actually hunt China, but we had to carry our firearms, and that was Yeah, that was that was a tricky scenario. We had to do a little bribing to the uh military, the Chinese military to have them release our firearms.

Whoa. Who are you with? you have do you had a Chinese homie with you or like

No, we had we had we had two interpreters with us and a uh a broker a Chinese broker. Um but that was only so far as through Beijing and and then once we left that and got into hope and up into Mongolia then it was just uh we had the state the the the federal biologist with of Mongolia with us. We were this the third, fourth, and fifth westerners to go to Mongolia after they had opened up uh the harvest. The two ornithologists from the Tokyo Museum were the first two Westerners to get into Mongolian harvest birds.

Wow. What year was this?

2001.

Damn. 2001. Holy [ __ ] It was in May of 2001. So, prior to 911.

Whoa. And I'm sure this was something you wanted to do like for a while. Like that was like a huge goal of for you guys.

Well, I ironically we were supposed to go to Russia to hunt lake by call because I really wanted to harvest a by call teal, but uh with all the uh turmoil at that time, that didn't didn't pan out. So, we had to cancel.

And so, what happened to all the ducks you killed in China? Where do they go?

Well, we didn't actually kill any in China. It was actually all Mongolia.

Mongolia. Okay. What happened to all those ducks you killed? Were you able to bring

We skinned them all there and sent them in through San Francisco into the broker and now they're all been taxed. sent them to Joe Ziggler over in Michigan and did all diarama mounts. So we brought 27 birds back.

So the the game for your for the most part that you hunt isn't for the eating. It's just for the

Oh, no. It is. I just like I some I mean I hand paint all my own decoys.

That's neat. I just I just like being out in the marsh seeing the sunrise and I'm a water hunter, not a field hunter. I mean I I will field hunt, but I prefer being on the water.

All right, we're going to get wild right now. And only because, you know, I don't know. I might get flagged on this on YouTube, but I don't give a [ __ ] because this story from what I remember hearing at Tinley was epic. Why don't you tell me what you do with the dead cat in the jar? Like, tell tell me tell me the uh tell us tell us that. Tell us that's just bait for coyote hunting.

Walk Yeah, but walk us through the process. Like, I want I want I want people to hear it the way

I don't I don't like feral cats.

Okay, so preface it with that.

Yeah, I don't like feral cats either. They [ __ ] up a lot. So that's first and foremost great. We see over a billion animals a year in North America alone.

Okay. So you get you get a feral cat. What do you do with it?

We can shoot it.

Okay. Then you stuff it into a jar. Glass jar preferably. And then you take it out into a field and you let it ferment for a few days. And then you sit back and then you you break the jar with a 22 or something and then you do some calls and that that smell attracts the coyotes.

How quick are you seeing coyotes after that thing pops open?

Uh huh. Sometimes you don't see them at all.

Really? So, okay. So, I I know they're there at night because the cameras will pick them up.

Yeah. Sometimes. And I do use e-collar, electric collar, electronic callers, too. So, what is that? How Okay. How does electronic callers work on a

It's just like a Mine has got speed. It's a tube. Basically a tube with two speakers, but they're adjustable so you can adjust the speakers.

Yeah. And then I have a remote control and that's got I don't know a thousand different animal calls. I mean, it's got an elephant trumpeting in this.

What?

Yeah. So, you basically tell scares them the [ __ ] away. Like basically, well, no, you use you like I'll use a rabbit distress call or I'll use a a coyote pup distress.

Pull them in.

Got it. Oh [ __ ] And then you set it far enough away from you and then you can control with a remote and you can adjust the volume. And are you ever like black ops [ __ ] camouflage out there at night hunting these [ __ ] Do you ever you ever do that?

I I haven't done that. Um good friend of mine's got the full uh what are they called though? They're um air rifles.

Okay. The air guns they kill those could kill those could kill a coyote and air gun. You can kill an elephant with these things.

These new calibers really?

Yeah. They come up to 50 cal.

Holy [ __ ] An air gun.

Well, it's an air rifle.

Yeah. Yeah. It's all compressed air.

Oh my lord. Um but he's got he's got the thermal imaging scope on it. He's got the night scope on it. So, we've gone out and uh we haven't we have not harvested one yet at night. But here in Wisconsin, coyotes are are open season 247 365 day or night.

You're mostly you're mostly seeing these [ __ ] in the peak of summertime or when you when do they mostly come out?

I'll see them early in the morning. Most of the ones I've shot around here have been 7 7:30 in the morning.

Yeah. Or I have shot them at night with a flashlight.

Wow. But yeah, that's epic. All right, get back to snakes. Um, so ball pythons, man. Like when did you kind of started seeing the, you know, connections with uh, you know, your your passion with wanting to work with ball pythons? Um, and and did you ever kind of see it getting to the point where it's at today?

No, I never saw it being where it is today. Um, I've always enjoyed the genetic side of things, but I do I I am I don't want to call myself a purist, but I don't believe in hybridizing. Not that I don't believe in. I will never keep a hybridized animal other than a ball python.

Well, no, no. I mean, like a corn snake, king snake, cross, or

Oh, my bad. My bad. Okay. I keep I work with 46 species. So, I've got a bunch of Most of those are colubrids, but we do have some geckos and some turtles and tortoise. So, no. No. And lizard, right? So, no. No.

And designer green sheep pythons for sure.

Ever for you.

No. What?

No designer green tree pythons ever for you?

Oh, I don't know. I used to keep condro and um I just had a ruse. Oh, but what what are your thoughts of like for instance the subspecies crossing back into

Well, that's that's an interesting that's a great question because I'm just learned about all the different localities being like separate species or subspecies.

Yeah. Well, because I was on this whole like [ __ ] hybrids until Ryan Young pulled me aside and told me, "Hey, you know that designer that we're looking at?" And we're at Billsteagle's place and he's like, "That's a [ __ ] that's a mut." He's like, "That's a hybrid." I'm like, "No, it's not. It's a green tree python." He's like, "That's not the same species. It's a subspecies." And he broke it down on how it all is. And he's like, "That that designer is a super mut." I was like, "What the I was like, "But I love it. What do you mean?" You know what I mean? And so, um, because like for instance, if you show me a if you show me a [ __ ] a a what is that? Ball python condro hybrid. Oh my god. What a what a freak show that is. But I I I want to break the screen when I look at something like that. But then it's in a sense the same [ __ ] thing as the designer condro that I love. According to Ryan, that's what he told me. So I guess and and I guess I look at it from from how I've always looked at it. A condro was a condro. You just had the different localities, right? You know, back then they weren't known as subspecies or different subspecies. I guess that's how I view it. But no, I don't have an issue with that either. I mean, but you look at the creamsicle corns, it's an emrii to a a corn. I mean, they've been around for as long as I've been breeding for the most part. The creamsicle corns were one of the first corns I ever had.

Yeah. It turned out to be a an emrii corn cross.

Has your production the the level of production that you have with the ball pythons, has it been about the same throughout this whole time or has it just increased throughout the years?

Oh gosh, no. Um,

I didn't keep ball pythons for a long time. Uh, I had them, but but they weren't with me. What do you mean? Well, I had uh Tim Bailey and I have some projects together and and Jeff Deanius, um Phil Bartozak and I had some projects together, and that's cool. Kevin and I, but I I've got severe allergies to rodents, and when we were running the rodent business, I we had balls at the shop, but I didn't have them at home. Um, and then when I when I built this building, then then they all came in.

So, this is by last year was my biggest production ever for for python ball python eggs, clutches, and that was at 34. And this year, you're you're going to beat that this year.

Yeah, we we we've got 33 on the ground. And um, he's counting 21 that have already had their pre-aglayed. Wow. And then and then another another 10 that have ovulated but haven't shed yet.

And even to this day, you only van the March Tinley or do is there other shows you van? Daytona. Oh, Daytona. That's right. Okay, Daytona. Um and then uh the NBC in St. Louis. Oh, you do St. Louis. NBC. Cool. And that's that's pretty much the only national shows I do know. There's rumors, and again, I don't know how serious this is, but there's rumors that Chewy might buy out uh NRBC or might be the new owners of uh NBC shows. How do you feel about that?

Really? Yeah. What do you feel about that? Well, I asked Brian for extra tables. I've been asking him for years, and I said, "How does Chewy come in here and get an end end cap while I get all my only table?" I said, "Can I have one of their tables?" He's like, "Yeah, I'm just going to kick out our sponsor." I think, you know, look look look with morph market changing hands. Yeah. I think it's it's become better. It's part of life, you know, and um look at mergers and acquisitions in any any industry. Yeah. Sometimes it's most of the time it's better, sometimes it's not. I think I think Tinley has got such a good following. I think Bob and Brian have done very well with that show. I don't think it should change much as long as Chewy doesn't try to reinvent the wheel with it.

Yeah. And again, I don't know how much of this is actual like for reals or is this just [ __ ] rumors being spread? I like I don't want anyone to take this I haven't heard that, so I don't know. Yeah. Um it's like Yeah. It's you know Brian Potter and Bob Ashley have been in the game for [ __ ] decades. You know what I'm saying? So something something at some point will change. You know, I don't think they're We're all getting older, too. Maybe they don't want to do the workload anymore. I don't know. Oh, time to move it on. Could be. Yeah.

Um, so, okay. So, other than Daytona and the couple NBC shows you do, are you you're betting that Morph Market's going to be good as far as getting a lot of the productions that you don't need to hold back um find homes for? It has been. It has been very good this year. And then of course just the contacts for moving animals as well that we've developed over the years.

So as of right now, as of right now, ball python wise, what are the bread and butter projects that you're working with? Like what what are the the foundation projects? So the only things that we're focusing on are VPI, eanthic, desert ghost, clown, nice, ultral. Nice. I have one aanthic g-stripe female that we just had some babies hatch from and she's just a dinker project. And then uh some monsoon stuff.

Oo, you're into monsoon. Well, I don't have any visuals yet, but we've got we we produced some triple heads last year. Um, and we just had a clutch laid. Actually, we've had two clutches laid that should hopefully produces some some visual clowns double head DG monsoon this year and then there's a third female due to lay here on the 17th.

Let me ask you a question Chad. Those mon those het monsoons, those are 100% het monsoons, right? Yeah. How how much visually are the hets influenced by that monsoon? Do you feel like do you feel like I'm terrible at picking stuff out, but I will say that when we did hatch them last year being in the clowns and and the non-clowns, they definitely stood out even to me and I don't have a good eye for picking the minute little details out. Are you I I'm sure you're pretty com I mean you're pretty aware of incomplete dominant and recessive, right? Like the two differences. Um, do you have a feeling like that monsoon could could possibly be an incomplete dominant, not a recessive?

Well, the interesting thing is it's the same ratios, right, in breeding, right? I mean, um, I don't know. You look at all the different markers with pides or even time. I mean, I think there's a lot. I think I think I can't Here's the thing. I don't work with every recessive, so I can't tell you what the rest are, but I got to tell you how many times I've produced a 100% het clown that had that [ __ ] head stamp just like a clown does, you know? Like, like little markers where I'm like, "Holy shit." Like, you were this close to becoming a clown and I don't know how you're not, but you're for sure 100%. Right. Um, but that doesn't really make it an incomplete dominant because of that, right? So, because it's not consistent. It broke up on you. It doesn't work. It but that you know that Yeah. That that that doesn't necessarily mean it's an incomplete dominant just because it has that head stamp marker uh you know showing that it's a head. Right. Yeah. Right. And even looking at the monsoons, I mean, not all of the head monsoons and we had them genetically tested. Yeah. Um just to confirm it all, but we every every hat that we had visually picked out did test as positive. And everything that we thought was not a hat did come back as negative. And again, it wasn't a huge scale. It was only maybe 15 animals, right? But we were able to pick out I mean, it's a smaller sample, but we were able to identify all that.

So all the all the recessive morphs that you just named off could in a sense look great all into all together. Is that your goal? Like are a lot of these projects meant to go into each other or you you you isolating some of them from not being into each other? I'm not I'm not a huge fan yet of the Ultral and the VPI. Okay. But I think adding some of the other genes in there might make it more appealing. Just to me I'm just again this is just personal preference. But um like with that Aanthic G-stripe I would like to see an Aantic G-stripe clown desert ghost. Exantic G-stripe clown desert ghost. Oh yeah. Again, double visual double hit to double visual double hit. It's still going to be a one and 16. And hitting those odds is difficult.

Yeah. Well, definitely. Especially like the the more you the more the more you have at play, the harder it's going to become, you know, hitting. I feel like for sure. Right. And like one thing we did this year is we were not going to produce any triple or quadruple heads. We had to at least have a visual double head or a double visual head or a double visual double head. Yeah. Just because we wanted to really not get into those crazy odds.

Hey Chad, let me ask you a question. Does your laptop Is it plugged in? Do you have a charger? Yes. Okay. Do me a favor. We're going to go to commercial break. Sign off and come right back in. You're lagging pretty bad right now. It's not It's not the worst, but just I'm We're going to go to commercial breaks. We have about four minutes. So just sign out and come right back in. Okay. and it should reset whatever lag issue it happens. Okay, so all right guys, we're going to we're going to cut to commercial break. Hang hang in there. Be right back.

Sorry for the interruption, folks. But a quick word from our sponsors. You know, longevity is one of the biggest things I strive for when it comes to thinking about being a part of the reptile industry. That's why I'm very proud about today's sponsor, Mark Bailey over at Mark Bailey Reptiles. 40 plus years full-time reptile keeper enthusiast. this guy. You can catch all his amazing ball python projects on Morph Market. So, make sure you head over to Morph Market and that's Mark Bailey Reptiles on Morph Market. See what he has available currently. And I got to tell you one thing, he's one of the biggest and most respected ball python breeders we have today in the ball python game. So, shout out to Mark Bailey over at Mark Bailey Reptiles. Thank you for all the support. And again, make sure you head over to his account on Morph Market. See what he has available. Thank you so much, Mark Bailey over at Mark Bailey Reptiles.

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All right, welcome back guys. Get the likes up and we are going to get back to Chad here. What's up, Chad? Is this better? Way better. 110%. Wonder what the hell happened? It happens. It's just a connection thing after a while, but we're we're solid now. So, you know, I was just going to touch back, you know, when when Ben and Sean came out with the um, you know, that uh, Desert Ghost ABCDE EF thing. Oh, yeah. That was crazy. It was, but I also took the stance and looked at it like, look, this is breeding how I always bred it. It is what it is. Yeah. And I think I think it it still is what it is, right? I mean, we can't control it. So, I just look at it and go for it and try to hit the visuals. And if they hit, they hit. If they don't, keep trying. And you know, and and I'm kind of glad, you know, I don't want to have to beat a dead horse on that whole monsoon topic, but like, you know, at the end of the day, like, let's say it is an incomplete dominant. What the [ __ ] is that going to change? Nothing. Like, that's my point. It cool gene. Like, it's a gene that no matter what the [ __ ] it is, you're going to want to work that [ __ ] gene.

Yeah. You you do headtohead, you get one and four. You do a visual to a head, you get one and two. you do a kodom to kodom, you get a super one and four. I mean, it's still you still got to you still are trying to all achieve the same end result. Yeah. And so, you know, with the recesses being where they're at in your projects, you know, I feel like no recessive projects could really hit any kind of its potential without the right incomplete dominance. So, what what are the what are your choice ingredients when it comes to the incomplete dominant side of things, Chad?

So, we're working with um chocolate. Yeah. Uh, no chocolate Wookie. Oh, let me pause you, Chad. Hold on. And you're nonbiased to this. Like you you don't really know that the backstory with this uh also this other little banter. Chocolate Wookie being the same. Do you feel like that's accurate? I didn't know that. I don't know. Or because you don't know because you don't notice it, right? You're not They look they they look similar, but I think they also look different. Yeah. Same. Yeah. I mean, but Yeah. So, so, so do you have Wookie going into chocolate or you are you keeping them separate? I'm keeping them separate right now. Yeah. Um, but we only started producing last year was our first year really producing. We hit some super chocolates last year. Those are amazing. I love We haven't hit We haven't hit super Wookies yet. Yeah. So, that that'll be this coming in 20 late 25 into 26. And a few months ago, I was asking like, why do we see so many super chocolate stuff, but we don't see a lot of super Wookie stuff. I had a DM I had some DMs in my Instagram um shortly after that episode with some super Wookie stuff. It just has not hit like super chocolate for whatever reason. It was It looked cool, don't get me wrong, but like super chocolates are like they stop you in your tracks, dude. You're like, "Holy shit." Like that's they are neat. They're [ __ ] nice, you know? I do like super chocolate stuff.

Do you follow Prague Morphs from uh Prague? They're it's a couple out of Europe. Do you follow them at all, Chad? I I don't think so. They're probably one of my favorites when it comes to like the super chocolate combos. Uh they just because they have it going in puzzle and other [ __ ] like that, but it's from like the Czech Republic. Yeah. Okay. Yep. Um but man, I'm just just so excited about Super Chocolate stuff, you know? I'll have to look them up. No, I don't follow them. Um, yellow belly, uh, red stripe, black pastel, leopard. How do you like sunset? Um, I don't work with it. I mean, it's dropped a lot in price. I mean, will it will that price make you want to get back into it? Get it? Here's here's the thing, right? Like I said earlier, um I work with what I like and and I can only have so many animals and I only want so many animals and there's so many things I want to do with just the DG, the Ultral, the Clown and Yeanthic and the Monsoon right now that I'm already producing more animals than I can hold back. Yeah. Should try to get to those end combo results. So to bring in another one is just too much. And again, like I said, I like the G-stripe, but I have one female. It's so easy to say, "I like this. I like that."

So, we have a little bit of hypo, too. We have a few hypo DGs. I think everyone needs a little bit of hypo nowadays, man. Like, how can you How can you work 2025 ball python projects without hypo? I don't I'm going to ask you something. Are you good at IDing stuff? I'm all right. I I think I think so. I'm no expert. I got a right eye, I think. Even though it's itchy. You think this is a hypod ultram? Mind you, you're showing me through a [ __ ] computer, okay? So, it's going to be All right, fine. Try your best. Let me see. So, okay. Tell me the pairing and show us the snake triple hat. Hold on. Hypo DG Ultraml. And I think this is I don't know. This has got to be close to egg number 55 or 60 out of all the clutches we've had. But we haven't produced one that looks like this yet. That looks like [ __ ] like the quality does, but I I I Does that head look white? That I want to say it. It is hypo. I could just just by telling how light the head is. Show show again the quality looks good. Um yeah. Okay. So, trip say that one more time what the pairing was. Hypo ultraml DG. Oh my god, that's nice, bro. That I think that is hypo. I again I I don't know. I'm just I'm staring through a [ __ ] computer, so it's hard because here's a here's a here's a hypo DG for comparison. Yeah, that's hypo, bro. That has if that has I think that's the that's the ultra mo. I think this is ultra mel, too. So, I think this is the triple. Yeah, for sure. I would be confident. Obviously, shed testing is where you want to go no matter what. Right. Right. We'll send them out, dude. Epic. So, that was an old potentially an ultramale DG hypo. Yeah. I don't I don't think it's got spot nose in it, but Yes. Yes. Nice. [ __ ] yeah. Damn.

So, you already got triples of that going. one. I mean, maybe. That's nice. So, okay. So, let's talk about a snake like that. What What's the What's the uh the end goal? Not really end goal, but what's the move once that snake becomes um Wait, did you sex it yet? Is it a male or female? I I didn't. Oh, let's find out. Wonder what the sexes will be. I'm guessing male. Oh, male. That's That's perfect. Get the feeding. Oh, it bit me. All right, you got bit. Now we'll put that into uh some clown projects, I think. So, you'd want clown to be in the mix, dude. Exantic. Exantic and that would be nuts, probably. But you're not an exantic Ultramo guy. Not not yet. I I like them, but I don't love them yet. Yeah. Is there a recessive that you currently don't have in the mix that you were looking to add? Like anything out there that you can't get your uh that you can't stop thinking about a single gene recessive. Yeah. Or even a project maybe like I mean yes the aanthic DG clown. I thought you have all that already. Well I haven't hit one yet. I started the project in 2018. Oh wow. Okay. We did just hit some misantic DGs. 66 heck clown. Do you have any do you have any shot at that this year? Are you have any do do you have anything paired up where you could hit that? Yeah, we've got we've got a few clutches in the a couple clutches in the incubator right now. Well, what what's uh what are those pairings? It was uh clown doublehead male pastelanthic doublehead male and then the females were um all the females are normal triple heads. Wow. So um one in 32 odds long shots.

What do you think of Mark Bailey hitting DG Exantic? I don't want to talk about it. Wait, what? I don't want to talk about it. Backto back years, this [ __ ] hits it off a triple hat to triple hat. Five eggs. Five eggs. Five egg clutches. Pretty boss. That's That's pretty awesome. Um, so, okay, but for instance, like you know, you get a DGantic clown. Um, for you, like what is what is the right thing to go in that in that case? Like once you have that snake, what's the next direction? I

I just want to look at it for a while. I think I'd like to put Monsoon into that and maybe G-Stripe. You like G-stripe that much, huh? I just like what it does with clown, and I like, I like the anthic g-stripe, but I think the DG needs to be in with the ean because the anthic anthic DG to me is always how an anthic should look, if that makes sense.

Like, if you look at all the other anthristic oranthic animals, especially like the sand boas, it's just nice and black and white, and it looks clean, right? The DG cleans it up so much. You would say very clean. Like even the ones you just showed right now, even the one without Ultramel was like, "Holy [ __ ] it looked like it looked like someone sketched it. It didn't even look real. Looked like someone drew it, right? I mean, uh, this girl I think is phenomenal looking. Shout out to everyone tapping in. Appreciate you guys. It's a great episode." And she just had her pre-agate shed two days ago. Oh yeah. Look at that. Oh, that's beautiful. Just a hypo DG. Oh, yeah. There you go. That's what I'm saying, man. Like, and this is this is from that same triple heads. So, she proved out to be not had ultramel.

Okay. Where'd she come from? As far as like where'd you get her from or did you produce her? We prod Well, we produced her. So, uh, my was it my female? My female to Jeff Namanius's male from Gateway City Reptiles, and we produced triple heads. Hang on. You're good. We produced the triple heads in 2019.

Nice. Okay. So, we produced uh Ultramel DGs, the Hypo DGs, the hypo ultras, but we have not hit the triple yet. So, we're hoping this year that well, maybe that one will be it, and maybe this girl will be producing something closer, too. At least double visuals. So, the shots at the shots at the DG Exanti Clown stuff, you already have those eggs in the incubator, or they're about to lay. They're they're cooking. They're already cooking. I have I have one clutch left. No, two two females left to lay. Three females have laid. So, you have four shots. Five. Five shots. [ __ ] yeah. Oh, you're hitting it, bro. I have a good feeling you're Well, the first one we didn't hit it out of nine eggs. Well, I have a good feeling you're hitting it for sure. I hope. I don't miss. If I have that, we didn't hit it last year either. I think trap talk for whatever reason brings breeders a lot of good luck. And and then also, I just have I have a good way of seeing the future. I don't know what it is, but I just I have a stat I statistically have a history of predicting the future. And I'm telling you right now, dude, I see an exantic DG clown visual in your future this year. I really do.

Well, if we hit it, I'll call you, and then we can show it on on this. Yeah, the podcast. All right, cool. Um Okay, cool, man.

So now with that being said, you know, for as long as you've been doing things, Chad, do you always want to keep the volume uh as far as like the amount of species you have, or do you feel like at some point you're going to start either weaning off some of the projects? Like, do you feel like you're at a good spot with everything, or as you get older, are you noticing that maybe some things may not be here in the next few years? Oh, that's a good question. I there's a lot of species I would still like to get. Nice. and get get back into species that I used to breed that I no longer have anymore. Some of the pferacas, maybe some of the filadrifus. Um I see myself weeding back on the quantity of some of the species. U maybe just going back to like trios or 2.3 groups of them. Yeah. Just having larger groups of that stuff. Um, but I I just I really enjoy the different varieties and and I'm going back to more I'm trying to get a lot more wild type but locality animals now in the collection, kind of away from the morphs on on the colubrate side.

Right. Um, are you a one-man show, dude, or do you have help? Like what's what's going on with the Yeah, Evan Evan Cole said from uh Right on Reptiles helps me, and we partner. He's he's got most of the Ultramel stuff here. Oh, is he not far from you? Does he live by you? Yeah, he's 20 15 minutes away. And does he have stuff at his place, too, or is it all at your house? All here. That's cool. Yeah, he Yeah, he's been a he's been a big help, and we're we It's fun having him because we we talk about throwing ideas of what I want to pair, what he wants to pair, and then all of a sudden it's like, it doesn't make sense to do that pairing. Let's do this instead. and it's like the light bulb goes off by talking every day on this stuff on how to pair stuff. So, it's really helpful for both of us. I'm trying again, like I said, we did not breed for any triple or quadruple heads this year. They all had to be visuals head visuals double head visuals triple head double visuals hat double visuals double head. So, so if it is a head, it's already some sort of a visual is what you're saying for sure.

Yes. Yes. Right. That's that's that's part of the stepping stones, right? Like that should be anyone's goal. Well, I think I think if you put the time in I don't I don't again I don't know I can't speak for everybody but hitting these triples even hitting doubles from double hat one and 16. I I look at this this again the anthic DG clown I mean starting with triple hats I mean you could breed for a decade at an average of six eggs a clutch and never hit it. Yeah. I mean, next year we're going to have all double visual males going hat and then we'll have visual and double visual hat girls going. So, we should hit it next year for sure. But it's just it's but regard like you said if you're not on a timeline and it you know it's just it's going to happen. It's just a matter of time and luck the luck does have something to do with it I think at some point you know but you know you need the numbers man like if you got if you got more stuff going for you then there your chances go way up you know it's well and I think the numbers too right and I don't want a lot of animals um it's just it's a lot to take care of day in and day out and it's not just the balls it's it's all the colubrids it's it's the rodents it's the turtles it's the geckos it's everything that you got to take take care of clubbirds are messy, dude.

Well, they like to poop. They like to eat, though, too. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Fast metabolisms. They [ __ ] quick. Mhm. I mean, I'm excited about this clutch of African house snakes we just got earlier this week, or was it yesterday? Um, it's potentially quad-head house snakes, which I don't think have been produced yet. So, it's blue-eyed, T-negative albino, T-positive albino, and hypo. Those house snakes have been really taking off in the last like I would say like this year they've been getting more popular big time. I feel like the house snakes we sold a lot of them at Tinley this year. They they are a neat little snake.

Yeah, they are. That's what I'm saying. They're they're not too much to deal with. Like it's and they're not boring either. They're really neat looking cool snakes, you know? They just And they're super chill as adults. As babies they're flighty, but as adults, I mean, they're they'll literally sit in your hand. I've had one sit in my hand for probably an hour straight and not move. Remind me house snakes are the ones that have that Burmese looking face, right? They have like a Burmese type like like lipping like am I right? The head almost looks like a little like a mini Burmese.

Well, yeah, I would I was going to say like a children's or a spotted or something like that. Antrees python of some sort. I can't remember because I remember the first time I ever heard or even seen a house snake was at Garrett Hardle's facility, and he just jumped big time into the house snakes, and this was like four years ago, and he just kept pulling all these house snakes out, and I'm pretty sure that's when he showed me like the cool [ __ ] uniqueness of the face being like almost looks like a like a like a toy Burmese like it they're like a little mini python. Yeah. And their coils whether it's live or frozen it is a perfect spring coil. I mean those coils every time every every animal just it's they're just a neat little animal.

So would you encourage somebody like you know obviously it's all about the youth in this hobby man that's our future but like if someone's pretty excited to be a part of this and they want the growth. How much do you encourage diversity? Chad, do you feel like that should be something someone should pay attention to picking up on right off the bat or should they put a few years into one species and then grow from there? Like what do you what do you recommend from all your experience? I always had multiple species as soon as I was able to. I just But I like I like reptiles everything. So I just I couldn't be satisfied with just one species. And again, having multiple species, at least for me, you've got to create different habitats for them in different zones. So you learn. Again, it's trial and error a lot of times. Not so much today because the internet, but back in the day it was [ __ ] I kept it too warm. I cooked it. Yeah. Or again, too warm. I kept it at 84 degrees. All the always getting infertile eggs. Yeah. So I try to keep most of my colubrid males, all my colubrid males are on the bottom shelves, and they really don't ever hit above 80 degrees of any species. But like it's like it's like you said though, right? Like if you're keeping multiple species that all have different husbandry needs, that's kind of what makes you the keeper that you you want to be, right? Because you're your your motor's ticking non-stop and and you're learning. And you're learning. Yeah. And like you said, you even I love that you said this not too long ago that you're learning even to this day. Somebody who's been doing it since the 80s, dude. And today you're still [ __ ] learning. And that's why I'm obsessed being a part of a hobby like this because the learning never [ __ ] stops. Like, you know, like it just doesn't it shouldn't stop. If you're doing it right, it never stops. You know, my my dad has has instilled on this and it was not always in good moments, but he always said, "If you're not green and growing, then you're ripe and rotten." And I don't want to work with ripe and rotten people because they know it all.

Right. Yeah. So, keep an open mind and just make things better, make things different. Even if you can increase your percentages just by 1% a year in terms of fertility or hatch rate or whatever it may be, birth rate. Yeah. Just it's like these garter snakes now. I mean, we're keeping them good. And we had we're going to have four females on the checkered side go this year. And um the first litter was a perfect 13. H no, sorry. She did have two slugs, but she had 13 good ones. And I think uh two years ago, her mom, it was like half and half. So, we tweaked it just a little bit, and it's it's coming up in terms of healthy babies. Yeah. I try to I try to encourage any kind of like promoting any kind of progress you have in this game. Like, you know, somebody sends me a picture of a green tree python that's slugged out, I'm like, "Dude, like that's huge." like she she at least passed all those eggs and like that that you're getting close like to just to even see that is something that you should you know that's something you're going to document and that's something that you experience and that I don't I don't look at that as bad at all you know you're a step in the right direction right exactly and Eugene Bet also capitalized on that on a episode we had not too long ago how like he would just commend and like pat people on the back for just having like you know just to get the eggs like that's [ __ ] that's amazing like that's that's great work, you know, and and you should be proud of that. And so I try to let people know that, too. Like don't get too hard on yourself. Like some people don't even get to that point. They don't even get to see eggs. You know what I'm saying, right? And I think with as many people now keeping these critters and and with social media and stuff, there's a lot of eggs being seen all over the place all the time. Yeah. But again, 20, 30 years ago, it was it was an accomplishment to hit those eggs. And it still is, like you're saying, to this day. I still get excited when you open the tub and you see them coiled around a clutch of eggs.

Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, if you're in this for the right reason, how can you not get excited? Like, you know, it's that it's that rejuvenation all over again. And we get to go through these cycles every single year. Oh, they're locked up. Oh, she's grabbed. Oh, she had her pre-aglay shed. Oh, she dropped the clutch. Ooh, the eggs are almost about to hatch. Oh, they're pipped. Oh, they're out. Yeah. Oh, they shed. Now we can start feeding them. And then the cycle just starts all over again. So it's all over again. And and I think like people like around our age, they don't get this much excitement normally like on a day-to-day like we get like that's why I'm like [ __ ] I love doing this [ __ ] You know what I'm saying? Because regardless if it's a ball python or whatever the [ __ ] a crested gecko, I love digging. Even though the crested geckos are my feeder geckos, I still get excited digging up eggs and it's so cool. Like I'm like, "Oh, look, three more eggs to put in the [ __ ] little, you know, however I hatch them." But I love it. It's I mean I mean again the simple garter snakes, right? But it's just so cool seeing those little live odd babies in there, dude. Those are getting [ __ ] popular, too, man. Um my buddy uh Trenton um I forget the name of his brand, but Oh, Trent from North Carolina. Yes, dude. His garter game is like on point. And he he's got he's got a stellar collection. I was really like I was looking at him like, "Dude, you might be on to something with these, bro, because these are [ __ ] neat, you know?" And another really cool snake. Yeah. a little little on the flighty, but like you know it's not going to harm you. You're not going to get you know you don't you don't have to worry about you know I guess getting injured in a sense which no and certain species are definitely more chill than than other species.

Yeah. I mean I think the Cali red-sideds are probably some of the most [ __ ] that I've ever worked with. Yeah. And the Florida blues, the wanderings and the um the checks are some of the most chill. Even the eastern black necks are pretty chill but they're small. Yeah. You do a lot of herping in your area, Chad? I used to. I have not been out this year. I I meant to get out and it just time frame just never No, we we can get about 30 minutes west of us and we can catch uh eastern hogs, eastern milks, smooth green snakes, um ribbon snakes, garter snakes, butlers, red bellies, and and um decay snakes. So, would you say you're about to approach the busiest time of your year year with everything hatching and like you're you're you're almost at the peak? I would say in about another three weeks it's going to be Yeah. stuff's going to be getting busy.

So, why don't you walk us through a day today for you? Like, you know, what time you normally like to wake up, hit the building, what time are you closing the lights off, and calling it a day? So, I usually get up about quarter to 7. Um, I started eating different now. So, I have a I make I I never used to eat breakfast. So, now I have a breakfast every morning. Nice. And then I take my daughter to school. How old's your daughter? What's that? How old's your daughter? She's 15. Wow. 52. What's that? Only got about another year left of taking her to school and then it'll be no more one-on-one time. Your only child? Yes. 15 years old though, man. I mean, that's Oh, man. I can't imagine that. Um Yeah. and she's she's hatched a few leopard geckos on her own and she taking care of the chahouas and the leuches. So that's kind of her projects. She's with it. Oh, she loves and she knows a lot of the Latin names of all the colubrids. Dude, that's epic. I feel like I'm going to be very like if my if my son is able to just start naming uh you know the actual you know scientific name species before he's in high school or I'll be so happy. Well, I'm sure he will long before then. Yeah. Um, so you know, but so how much how closely is your daughter working with you? Like is that like something that you guys have a certain day of the week that you guys work together or she just come in when She just comes in. Um, so typically I'll get in I'll get into the into the building here about uh just before 8:00 in the morning. Okay. And then I usually leave here about 3 to go pick her up. And then I'm back in here from usually 3:30 to about 5:30 or 6. Then I go in, spend some family time, and then I'm usually back out here about 8:39, 9, and then I'm usually sometimes I'm here till 2 in the morning, sometimes I'm out of here by 10:30. Just depends. Mhm. Yeah. And then so she'll come out randomly when she wants. I mean, uh, one of the bullsnakes is hers. Um, so she's she takes care of him and she pulls them out and holds them while she's taking care of the geckos or the turtles. And then she also does all the cleaning of the tubs. That's awesome. F10s them and then hydrogen peroxides them all. And she gets paid for that. So because I don't like doing that as much anymore. Yeah. Right. And you know, obviously paying a 15-year-old, that's that's uh motivation for that 15-year-old for sure. When you know 15-year-old could use some money, you know, and Well, and it's it's part of the keeping, right? Yeah. Exactly. It's not the most enjoyable part, but it is part of it. And so she's learned from the ground up. Yeah. I mean, I I've been struggling with wanting help and I attempted to try to get help and it just I'm such a [ __ ] like I have things the way I want it where, you know, and it's nothing against the person that I'm bringing on, but obviously there's like a learning curve and I just can't deal with like, dude, you forgot this whole [ __ ] row of snakes. Like, how the [ __ ] how did you forget that? And and it might not be on purpose, but maybe the person's working too fast. But me, like I if I just I don't have it in me to be like, "Oh, it's okay. Give them another shot." Like if that happens, I go, "All right, see you later. You're done." Well, I think I think too, like like with Evan and I, we both have such a vested interest in this. Yeah. That it it you know, we'll crank the tunes, we put the sheets up, we work side by side. you know, he'll clean this rack, I'll clean this rack, we'll move the thing down, we'll clean that rack, I'll clean that rack, we'll switch over and we each do a rack and we're always side by side again just scheming, going over stuff and it just it makes it fly so fast and yet we're both focused on everything because as we're pulling animals out, all right, let's start planning about this one or this one. Oh, we could put this one to this one. No, that doesn't make sense. And it's just I think if you find the right person, it could be a benefit for you. Yeah. I just don't It's just But I get what you're saying too because I

I'm I'm very OCD on that type of stuff, and I get I get nitpicky if if a little turd is missed. The only person to shed skin, the only person to ever watch over my collection and never [ __ ] not one thing up. Like I'm talking about everything is literally perfect.

The way I would do it is is when my wife is in charge. She's the one she's the only one that because I'll never forget the first time I had her in charge when um, obviously before we had kids, and she had the [ __ ] time to do it. But if I took off on a trip, she'd like she would like the day the night before I would leave, she'd like take me to your room, and she would have a clipboard with notes, and she would walk around, and I would tell her everything to do, and she would put sticky notes everywhere. And anyone else that would look after my room and I would tell them what to do never [ __ ] did that. They're just going, okay. You know what I mean? Got it. And so that's why I'm just like, god damn it. Like I already know where my help's at. And it's my wife. Like dude, my wife, I feel like we would make quite the [ __ ] dynamic duo.

But the thing is, my wife has a good job, and she gets paid. She gets paid very well. So, it's like, Oh, I was going to say, does she have time and does she enjoy? Oh, [ __ ] no, dude. She's busy as [ __ ] Um, she's she's but she's she's great. Amazing mom. Holds it down, but her work is pretty demanding. Um, and you know, she she she does good at her job, you know what I mean? Um, I would have to I would have to be able to pay her well over six figures to [ __ ] have her come do pull her away to have Are you kidding me? I don't have that right now. That's It's nuts. Um, but it's a goal of mine someday. Like I know if like let's say my wife didn't have a really good job, and dude and like let's say her her helping me was what what needed to happen, man. I feel like everything would explode for me in a good way. Um, just because you know there's there just like you should know at this point, right Chad? There's things that we're good at, then there's things that we could use some help with, right? And so my wife like, you know, every eyes dotted, every [ __ ] tees crossed, like that's that's what she's good at, you know. Me [ __ ]

Well, and I would say don't be afraid to ask for help. Yeah, I know. No, and Chad, she always asks like how she could help. And and it's really me like I'm the one that always doesn't include her on certain things, but I definitely know like especially right now with 70 goddamn Condro eggs [ __ ] cooking. I'm going to need help feeding these babies for sure. Like on to her patience. I'm going to need her her style. Like I'm going to need her for sure really closely. It's going to be fun times.

When was the first clutch due to hatch? Uh, I think June, I'm sorry, July 8th. July 8th is the the first Well, those are I got two clutches due that day. I got three and a half weeks. Yeah, I got two clutches due in the same day, and then two days after that, the third clutch is due, and then a week after that, the fourth clutch is due. Holy fifth and then the fifth one about three 13 days after that one. So, I got five clutches cooking in the incubator right now. That's going to be a busy month. Yeah, but I'm I'm ready, man. This I kind of I signed up I signed up for this [ __ ] you know? Bring it on. All right. Yeah, exactly.

Um, all right. I got a wrap-up topic uh before we end tonight's episode. Uh, and mainly I saved it for a reason because I feel like this has been a huge part of your knowledge of being a keeper. And I feel like this is also another thing people don't realize how important this is if you want to do this for the long term. Um, you know, producing your own food, you know, your own rodents. Um, when when did you visit the whole breeding rodents thing and and when did that become like uh uh something like where you were making income off of it?

Well, uh I think it was 2011. I had worked for my dad all through school, high school. Well, at the end of high school, through college and then after college and uh what, Chad? I'm curious. What were you doing with your dad? I was in corporate sales. Oh, wow. Okay. No, we were we were the uh third oldest Kaneka Monulta copier dealer in the country. Whoa. My grandfather had started it back in '64. And so Xerox came to him with an offer and he was going to accept it, but then he asked if I wanted to buy the company. And it wasn't going to work. I mean, I I loved working for him. I learned a lot of stuff, but it just I would have had to finance it through him. So he would have still had say on every decision and where I saw I wanted to take the company where he was going it just we didn't see eye to eye so I said sell it go retire and so a friend of mine and I we started the rodent business and we built that up for two and a half years we didn't pay ourselves a nickel every all we just lived off our savings and put everything into the company and we sold that in 2021 and we were producing 70,000 rats and mice a month. Holy [ __ ] Missouri was coming up to meet with us every year. We were getting a semi-loaded Missouri every month. We had nine employees and um we never had website. We never had any advertising. It was all word of mouth. And we still were turning people away. We couldn't produce enough for everybody. And I loved it. I loved the interaction with the customers. But I've got severe allergies. So I have to wear a full bodysuit, hairet, respirator, all that happy [ __ ] and um building we the closest we could get a place that the municipality would allow us to do this was 45 minutes away and in winter sometimes with a snowstorm it would take me over two hours one way and those turned into just long days and it's if and people that know that breed rodents it is it is a day and night commitment.

Well, I mean I mean obviously there's levels to it, but I feel like Yeah, if you want to take it to that point of production, it is [ __ ] non-stop. It's 247. Yeah, we had a we had a 10,000 square foot building that we bought. Oh my god. And that's what we're And we built three separate rat rooms and then a mouse room and then a shipping area and then pallets and I liked it. Um but just the the amount of time commitment was just it was too much after eight years. So, we sold that in March of 21. And I have a little room in here now. It's a little 10 by 25 ft room. And we produce enough rodents just to feed the uh the balls. I still buy all frozen for all the colubrids. I go through about 25 30,000 mice a year for those guys. Yeah. And um it's nice having your own. And we have we have one rack of mice. We have three racks of rats. And we have four bins of ASFs. a guest. We we feed twice a week all of our animals. Again, small meals. And I'll tell you one thing we've had this year, we've had probably probably 13 or 14 clutches now of females that have dropped eggs in less than a year from when they last dropped their last clutch last year. Oh, so they're they're they're going earlier. Yeah. The one girl, one of those triple heads for the hypo DG Ultrael. Yeah. She laid July 19th last year. She laid May 17th this year. So, she laid two clutches in 10 months. You know, it's funny because you talk to people where things are going a lot later. Wait, what do you mean? So, you talk to certain people and some people say that their season is going a lot later versus earlier, you know. Yeah. I you know, the colubrids are going later for us this year. the balls are just I don't know why it's it's they they went a lot earlier because last year our season was from April through September where this year we had an early clutch in February but then all the rest of the clutches have been April May and now into June and most of them are going to be laid by the end of July except for the stuff that we're still breeding that might come later. Yeah. And then we've got some girls that are coming online that we might you know breed for later in the year. And you know, like if the food Go ahead. I think the food I was going to say I love having the availability of the rodent. So we clean we clean the rodents Mondays and Thursdays and we feed Mondays and Thursdays. And for the most part because you know obviously I'm revisiting breeding my own rodents. It's been about three months now or maybe a little bit longer. And and you know it's at first it was kind of like I was dreading it just because you know how it is. It's like [ __ ] like it's it's it's a weekly thing that you can't miss. It's a commitment. But once you start pulling all the babies and you you start seeing the production flow out, it's kind of like, okay, it's worth it because now I feel great. Now I have all these different sizes um for whatever [ __ ] like whatever I want. And now and and one of my biggest struggles cuz for the for the last I don't know how many years I've been getting my food dropped off to me once a week. Um you know, I can't feed throughout the week. Like I I only get to feed that once a week and then I have to wait for the next ones the following week. And there's just there's certain snakes or especially with ball pythons that you're growing up where you got to hit them a couple times a week. You know what I'm saying? And so and I feel like that's been my biggest uh drawback with getting my holdbacks to grow quickly is I'm I was just feeding them once a week. Um and and obviously like you know different sizes. They just weren't you know every week I was getting rodents. They weren't always consistently the same size rodents. They were [ __ ] fluctuating. And like then I realized like this small rat is the size of a goddamn rat pup. What is this? and and and mind you, just because of the way things are out there right now. It's just kind of weird. Well, and that's that's a big complaint we hear, too. Um we do supply rodents to just literally a couple people when we have the surplus and um we always again same it was same with when we had the other rodent business because we weighed every single rodent. So, it was consistency. Yeah. And that's what I think that's what our customers enjoyed is that there was no deviation. And you hear so many times, I ordered pups or I ordered smalls and I got wings. I ordered wis and I got basically fuzzies. It's just so all over the board. And again, it takes time though to weigh all those out. Yeah. Yeah, it does. But we were working with the Milwaukee School of Engineering, just a a private college here, and we had tried to get a uh basically got a chute system. So you could weigh the animal and then you could shoot throw it down the chute. And it would also have a uh a clicker for a counter. And once you hit a certain number, you could peg it. And this was for live live feed, you know, live animals. Oh, that's cool. Damn. You get little rat shoots like little Yeah. And then it just had an infrared. Well, we didn't have it fully yet, but it was it was somewhat in design, but that's how what we were thinking just to speed things along. Damn. I think if we would have pursued that, we could have used it for the Frozen as well, and it would have just sped up all that, too. And what year was it when you decided to just to, you know, fall back on the whole mass production side of things and just breathe for yourself? We sold that we sold that business in March March of 2021. Wow. That's like that's that's right during COVID. Um and and and so with the peak of everything, what did you was that a smart move or how do you feel overall about that? For me, it was again I miss I miss the customers. Mhm. Um but I I don't miss the time. Yeah. Especially the drive time. The drive time was okay though because I'd always be making phone calls. Yeah. Right. Except for early in the morning. You know, if it was a snowstorm, I'd be on the road by 4:00 or 4:30 in the morning. Yeah. Because we wanted to get down there early so we could get out and make it home. But I don't know. Yeah. It's it was the right move for me and for the family. Yeah. Yeah, cuz I was missing a lot of that time with her and her sports activities I couldn't make. And now now I coach her high school trap shooting team. Um, that's awesome. I'm able to make all her soccer games and it's just it's much nicer now. Yeah, I'm the flexibility of time. I'm like I'm pretty stubborn with like I like the way I do things and I hate changing it. But with having kids now, I have no choice. Like I'm like how you said there's mo like okay you're in there in the morning and then you're then you leave then you go back and then you leave. Like I I I like to be in here and then I like to be done at a certain time and never step foot in here again. But the way things are it's just not going to work. I'm gonna have no choice but to like come back in here and finish [ __ ] Right. And there's certain days that you know I just say screw it. I can wait till tomorrow if it's not absolutely pressing. Yeah. Um, you know, we've been trying to post a bunch of animals to Morph Market for the last two weeks and we were going to do it tomorrow and we were gonna do it last Friday because Friday is kind of our catchup day, but uh we're not going to get it done tomorrow either, I don't think. Just Yeah, we'll get there. It's such man man there's so many things like you know obviously number one take care of the animal make sure they're good but when that's all said and done when all the rodents are all said and done guess what's next taking [ __ ] pictures posting them on the internet and you know engaging in [ __ ] inquiries it's just dude it's there's no days off bro there really isn't there there really there really isn't like and I love it don't get me wrong I'm not complaining but there are legit no days off you know we're we're we're we're simple animal animal farmers is what we are. Yeah. And and you look at any farmer in this country, there are no days off. No. But you have to love it. I love it though. That's what I'm saying. Like like for instance, it's as much as it sounds like, oh wow, that's pretty [ __ ] demanding. I I don't want no other life. I love it. I like I I'm obsessed with these animals and you know, it's not work if you're No. Right. But it's also like the teeth that like the work part is interacting with customers and like like selling and showing taking the pictures and you know selling the bellies and like okay you want to see the [ __ ] grandparents here's the grandparents like what the [ __ ] like what else do you want you know it's like but you have to do it especially nowadays like you know you got to do the extra stuff to get the sale nowadays. Well especially especially with the condos I mean oh yeah people love that lineage. I mean that lineage is critical. Well, yeah, but that see the thing with the le that's just that's part of the condro game is like you got to have the lineage. You got to have the documents because if you don't have any of that stuff, good luck trying to sell a condo nowadays. Like sure, people get into condos for the lineage. They want that [ __ ] they want that chart or they want some sort of documentation on where the babies came from. And that's why I love the condro game. Um but like you know, for instance, because you you have that pedigree. Yeah, the pedigree, right? And it's just it's again that's another element to this particular species.

Yeah. Before we get off the rodent talk, I I'm curious, you know, do there was a there was a time and place where people were very adamant about ASF being the best diet for a ball python. Way better than rats. What do you have to say to that? This is my take. I have no scientific data on it, but I have raised multiple siblings, same feeding schedule, and some grow quicker and some don't grow as quick on the same diet. So, I say, again, I've got we got we've got a lot of a lot of 23s and early 24s that are starting to breed right now. And and those are on ASFs or those on rats? Rats. And there some some of this I mean, this is just a yellowbelly DG clown female. God, that's nice. She will be a year old on the 26th of next month. God damn, that's a big year, dude. That's one year right there. She's a She's 10 and a half months old and she's she's 1,700 gram. What the [ __ ] And she's not fat. No, she's perfect. No, dude. She doesn't look fat at all. 1700 grams at one year. Well, she'll be a year uh the 26th of July. This is what I'm talking about. I'm I'm not feeding right at all. Like at all at all. Holy [ __ ] God, I'm so glad I produced my own rats now. It's It's [ __ ] on for sure. Godamn. This girl is a pastel enti leopard DG headanthic. She will be a year old August 1st. Look at Dude, what the I am doing it so wrong. If I pull out here, she's 19 she's 192 grams. What the [ __ ] is happening? I can't believe this. And again, she's not fat. Bro, this is crazy. I could literally pull out a DG clown I produced not even barely a year ago and they're half that size, if not even half that size. Like they're like 700 600 grand. My point on that is is what the [ __ ] I think you should feed whatever works for you. I need to feed more. Smaller but more. I feel like I I I think the small meals is key. Yeah. Because fe, you know, feeding for these things is stressful. Yeah. And it takes a lot out of them. Like especially a big ass meal and then you want and then you want to feed it another one a week later. That that can't be that can't be right, you know. And again, we feed Mondays and Thursdays, but she's usually getting a wean or a very small mat. Yeah, dude. I'm And we we feed most I mean, that's wild, bro. This is a DGazanthic clown. Is that a male? It's a male. Nice. Damn. He's He's 692 grams. How old? I got him in January. Oh, he's barely six months. Yeah, dude. That's That [ __ ] could breed right now if you wanted him to. Oh. Oh, he is already. Oh, what the [ __ ] So, but this is strictly a mouse diet for him. That's because that's what he that's what he prefers. No, that's what I prefer to feed him. Oh, you prefer Oh, okay. Well, tell me more about that. So, you're noticing that the mice on the the mice is getting them up to size quicker or what's the meaning behind Okay. There's there's so many things I'm still learning, but I just feel like the equivalent size mouse is much more mature, much more nutrient. the organs are fully developed, the calcium in the bones versus a rat pup, which fat, more fatty and like baby fatty. The pups are going to be more fatty. Yep. Um, so what we've been doing now, all of our 24s, we got on to rats as soon as we could. Now they're all back on the mice. Um, and we're feeding mice now as long as we possibly can and then we'll switch

them to rats. But they'll eat they'll eat anything. I mean I mean granted, we have a few picky eaters where we have to toss an ASF2 to once in a while, but and even sometimes they refuse those, and then you just put a hide box in or something, and then they'll go right back on the rats.

How many of your breeder males turn off food a year? Like, do all of them usually turn off or only some or none?

No. Mo most of ours do not turn off.

Yeah, same here. Most of ours feed throughout the season.

Yeah. And again, we feed almost Go ahead. Go ahead. No, no, go ahead. We feed almost all of our adult males mice. We keep almost all of our adult males on mice. And I feel like that kind of diet will always keep them on food because it's not heavy. It's

Yeah. And we keep our males Well, I mean, this guy's a little chunky, but we try to keep our males pretty thin. Same with the colubrids. Almost like they look like they're wild caught. And again, Don Solderberg told me this years ago

Oh, did I lose you?

I'm here.

Okay.

Yeah. Don Solderberg told me this. Oh my gosh. It had to be in the early 2000s, but he says if you keep your male males lean and mean, they're more eager to breed.

Yeah, but I've had some big male I've had some big males be some of my best breeders.

Not ball pythons. I'm talking colubrids.

Oh. Oh. Oh. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. Right. Right. Okay. Yeah, that could be true. You're talking clubs.

Yeah. Yeah. Um and we Yeah. We don't have any giant. I think I've got a DG Krypton that I got from the Bells in 2017 or 2018. He's probably the biggest male we have in the collection at maybe 1,600 grams.

Damn.

But most of our males are somewhere between 700 and 900 950 grams is where we try to keep them.

Wow. Again, it works for us. It doesn't work for everybody, but it works for us.

Yeah. Well, I want that kind of stuff working for me. And and I feel like now that I breed my own rats, I'm good. I'm I'm I can't wait to start implementing this. It's going to be great. It's it's just adds another element of the keeping.

Yeah, for sure.

of of keeping these critters. It just makes it another like you said, you you can only if you get your weekly rodent delivery, you obviously have to feed everything that you can't keep alive on food pups and and smaller.

Mhm.

But if you want to keep a couple extra, you order a couple extra, you can feed that day, put them in a cage, give them some food and water, and you can feed three, four days later again.

Yeah. [ __ ] a, man.

Well, listen, great episode, Chad. Um, I feel like you're definitely going to have to make a return. We definitely need a part two because I know we could keep talking, but uh, yeah, these two hours went by quickly, my man.

Yeah, and I'd like to have Evan on, too, if we can.

Yeah, let's do it.

Yeah, we'll line that up next time. Um, save Evan for the trap. Don't don't go anywhere else. You say save that guy for here.

Okay. Okay. All right. Um but listen, before we let you go, Chad, you're not done. You got hot seat questions, buddy.

Okay. Oh [ __ ] Yes, guys. Hot seat question part of the episode. You guys know what time it is. Get the likes up. Chad, the way these hot seat questions work, buddy. Rapid fire. The quicker the better.

Okay. Just just just give me the answer. Ready?

Yeah. All right. Here we go. Hot seat questions for Chad. Fuks coming in hot. You ready, Chad?

I think so.

All right, here we go. Uh, wait, where they Why do I keep losing? Where the hell do they go? One second. Oh, here we go. All right, here we go. Frozen Thod or live?

Frozen Thod.

A cut or no cut? What? A cut or no cut? Would you cut?

No cut.

No cut. All right. Respect. Uh, red condro or yellow condro?

Red.

Uh, yay imports or boo imports?

both depending on the species. It's it's it's a yes or no. Like if you were to if it was up to you to legalize importation exportation, would you do yes or no on that?

Oh, importation or export like if we want to ship over. Yeah. Not wild caught animals. Anything. Any animal we like whatever comes in comes out. Like like would you open up the gates where we could get whatever we want? Yes or no?

Yes.

Okay. Uh, to spray or mist a ball python or to never spray and mist a ball python.

Spray and mist.

Yay sports or boo sports.

I don't know what either of those are.

Sports. You don't know what sports are. I know what sports are, but I don't sports or boo sports. Like, do you like them or do you not like them, Chad?

Oh. Oh. Oh, that went over my head. Uh, yes.

Okay. What's your favorite sport, Chad?

Right now, I I'm a huge Formula One fanatic. I' I've watched every race. I I I've not missed a race since 1996, dude.

Yeah, Marshall Mendes is all about the the the F1, the formula [ __ ] That shit's sick. Um, okay. Uh, here we go. Steak or fish?

Fish.

A steak. Not both. Okay. One animal you love to hunt that you never hunt before?

Elk.

Oh, really? Where would you go for that?

Uh, I've been applying I think I've got I don't know. I've been applying to Wyoming, Montana, Colorado, Idaho, Utah. So, you need you need to apply for something like that and you have to I'm just building points. I've just been building points over the last six, seven years.

Wow. Okay. Uh, Yay alcohol or boo alcohol?

Oh, for me, yes.

Okay. What's your favorite alcohol beverage?

Like I'm strictly a beer drinker.

Okay. What type of beer?

I like IPAs.

All right, there you go. I miss IPAs. Um, what's your what's your favorite IPA?

Probably Naked Threesome.

Okay. Is that a double or Indian? What kind of IPA is that?

It's like a citrusy kind of.

Oh, yeah. Citrus ones are my favorite, man. Um, it's from a local It's from like a local brewery here. Raised grain. The thing is with IPAs, like I I could get to the point where I could drink like six of them in a night and that's when you get really fat. Like those IPAs, bro, they they pack weight on you. big time. And and and those last ones, you can't even think straight. But dude, for whatever reason, I never have a hangover on IPAs. Like I I wake up feeling great. No matter how shitfaced I got off them the night before, I don't get hangovers off IPAs. I It happens every time I drink now. But I only I only drink at the shows pretty much.

Yeah. I I don't drink at home anymore.

Oh, nice. That might be a thing for me, too. Hopefully. Maybe not. I don't know. I haven't drank. It's today. Well, no. It's been over 30 days since I've had a sip of alcohol.

And good for you.

Thanks. Yeah. And I I was drinking every day for like the last [ __ ] five months. Ever since January, ever since I hurt my knee, basically, I've been drinking every [ __ ] day. So, I'm just happy to kind of break that.

Oh, that's good. Very, congratulations. Keep that up.

Appreciate that. All right. Here we go. Little word association. Say the first thing to come to mind. You ready, Chad?

Okay.

milk

utters

substrate

aspenship

FedEx shipping

FedEx Ship Center

least favorite

incomplete dominant

probably anything that creates the white snake

what like the uh Mojave complex.

Oh, got you. Okay. Okay. Okay. What's your favorite incomplete dominant?

I'm really liking the darker jeans, the blackheads, the chocolates, the wookies. I like the red stripes. I like the combos, too, of a lot of that stuff.

All right, last but not least, first thing to come to mind. Can't cheat. You ready?

Coolest reptile network in the world.

Trap Talk Radio.

There. I love how you said radio, but I'll take it, dude. Chad, you [ __ ] did it, buddy. It's over. Good job. Is it not Trap Talk Radio? What is it? It's Trap Talk Reptile Network, but I'll I'll take it. It's fine. Listen, it's all good. I'll take it, buddy. Uh, great episode. I hope you I hope you had a good time. I had a good time talking to you.

I did. Thanks for the questions. Thanks for leading me along.

Yeah, of course, man. And I can't wait to have you back on, but why don't you go ahead and just throw it out there. Where can people follow you at? People want to, you know, reach out to you for whatever reason. What? Go and drop all the uh plug. You can call me on the cell, text me on the cell. Um, or I'm on Instagram now. I try to post every day. Okay, I'll put the links in description. And Morph Market.

And Morph Market. Okay. Yeah, definitely. Don't go to the website. I haven't updated my website since 2014. So, if they people do want to see what you have, Morph Markets to to go to is what you're saying.

Yes.

All right. Cool. Guys, go check them out. My website is I don't know if I'll ever update it. Okay. All right, guys. Go give him a follow. CF snakes on IG and go check out his morph market. But give it up. It's a wrap for Chad Fuks, ladies and gentlemen.

Thanks, MJ. Appreciate it. Thanks, Chad. Hey, have a good night, buddy.

Thank you so much. You, too. Thank you. Bye.

Great episode, guys. Appreciate anyone who tapped in. This was a special one, man. Chad's a great guy. Really cool that he uh finally came on to Trap Talk and uh got to, you know, get to know more about Chad CF Snakes on IG. Go give him a follow, okay? Great guy. And again, thanks for everyone who tapped in. Before you guys leave, this is your first time watching. Hit that like button, hit that subscribe button, hit that notification bell. By doing those things and selecting all, you'll be reminded of every single podcast released at the Trap Talk Reptile Network. Seven days a week, Monday through Sunday, you can find a brand new episode right here, okay? All major audio platforms. So, if you're not somebody who likes to visually listen to these episodes, go listen to them on all audio platforms, Buzz Sprout, Apple Podcast, Spotify, and of course, man, for that exclusive content, get more behind the scenes, you want early releases to all Morph Market vlogs, come join the Trap Talk Patreon family, click the very first link in description below, and come connect to the Discord and the amazing Instagram group chat, man. But great time tonight before you guys go check out the sponsors and enjoy the rest of your weekend.

Sorry for the interruption, folks, but a quick word from our sponsors. You know, longevity is one of the biggest things I strive for when it comes to thinking about being a part of the reptile industry. That's why I'm very proud about today's sponsor, Mark Bailey over at Mark Bailey Reptiles. 40 plus years full-time reptile keeper enthusiast. This guy, you can catch all his amazing ball python projects on Morph Market. So, make sure you head over to Morph Market and that's Mark Bailey Reptiles on Morph Market. See what he has available currently. And I got to tell you one thing, he's one of the biggest and most respected ball python breeders we have today in the ball python game. So, shout out to Mark Bailey over at Mark Bailey Reptiles. Thank you for all the support. And again, make sure you head over to his account on Morph Market. See what he has available. Thank you so much, Mark Bailey over at Mark Bailey Reptiles.

If you want to be organized, if you want to be cutting edge in the ball python game, then you don't want to miss this. Shout out to today's sponsor and that's Clutch. Number one Ball Python organization app in the game. No better place to start off than by using this app. Clutch is an organization app that helps you organize all your Ball Python projects. It also helps your peers and your fellow community members look at what you possibly have coming for the upcoming Ball Python season, what you have currently available on Morph Market. It's so awesome to be ahead of the game by using organization app like Clutch. Thank you so much the entire Clutch team, amazing team over at Clutch. If I were you, I would head over to Clutch's Instagram account. And I would also head over to their website. Try it out. See how it works for you. But especially if you're just now coming into this before you build your reptile collection, I would do it organized and I would do it with Clutch. Thank you, Clutch, for being so amazing. Excited to hear what Clutch has to bring in the near future.

If you're in the ball python game in 2025, you know what you should be doing with your sheds, and that's turning them in to get them tested. That's right. No more POS hatets, no more 66% heads. We can find out directly through today's sponsor, and that sponsor is Rare Genetic, Inc. Thank you so much, Ben and Sean over at rare genetic inc. Head over to their website, rargeneticinc.com, and head over to their YouTube channel and make sure you subscribe to their YouTube channel. They put out a video every Wednesday to update you guys on new current events over at rgi. But I got to tell you right now, very excited to continue my partnership over at Rare Genetic, Inc. Head over to their Instagram account. Make sure you follow them on Instagram, subscribe, hit that notification bell on their YouTube channel. That way you're current on new announcements and anything that they got to update you with. Again, thank you so much Rare Genetic Inc. RGI. You guys are the best student in the game.

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Ball Python Breeding History Lessons With Chad Fuchs Of CF Snakes | Trap Talk W/ MJ Live

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